Vanguard Advising

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oinkyboinky
Posts: 133
Joined: Thu Apr 16, 2015 2:14 pm

Vanguard Advising

Post by oinkyboinky » Fri Feb 14, 2020 8:01 pm

What's everyone's opinion here on Vanguard's advising service?

Who should use it? Is it worth it?

I ask because it'd be nice to have someone to talk to about ALL of my assets (which they confirmed that they would do), and then only get charged .3% per year, only on the funds in Vanguard (as opposed to AXA, where you get charged 1% on EVERYTHING under management).

https://investor.vanguard.com/advice/personal-advisor

retired@50
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Joined: Tue Oct 01, 2019 2:36 pm

Re: Vanguard Advising

Post by retired@50 » Fri Feb 14, 2020 8:33 pm

I think it beats many, if not all, of the alternatives. Think of Raymond James, Edward Jones, etc. Setting up a portfolio can be easy * IF * you understand exactly what you need and want. As we here on Bogleheads know, that isn't everyone. Many investors who rely on advisers don't have this level of understanding, or a desire to attain that understanding. For this group of investors, it's a fair service at a fair price in my opinion.

Regards,
Boggle - a game from Parker Brothers. Bogle - investor, founder of Vanguard.

lexor
Posts: 597
Joined: Thu Feb 27, 2014 10:32 am

Re: Vanguard Advising

Post by lexor » Fri Feb 14, 2020 9:54 pm

oinkyboinky wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 8:01 pm
What's everyone's opinion here on Vanguard's advising service?

Who should use it? Is it worth it?

I ask because it'd be nice to have someone to talk to about ALL of my assets (which they confirmed that they would do), and then only get charged .3% per year, only on the funds in Vanguard (as opposed to AXA, where you get charged 1% on EVERYTHING under management).

https://investor.vanguard.com/advice/personal-advisor
If you want someone to talk to I'd suggest looking at a flat fee advisor like PlanVision since PAS will cost even an average investor hundreds of thousands over their investment timeframe.

See Cost Matters 2020
“The miracle of compounding returns is overwhelmed by the tyranny of compounding costs.” -Mr. John C. Bogle

retired@50
Posts: 1358
Joined: Tue Oct 01, 2019 2:36 pm

Re: Vanguard Advising

Post by retired@50 » Sat Feb 15, 2020 12:39 am

lexor wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 9:54 pm
since PAS will cost even an average investor hundreds of thousands over their investment timeframe.
I think you're assuming facts not in evidence. How on earth can you know it will cost "hundreds of thousands"? No dollar amount or time horizon has even been mentioned?

Regards,
Boggle - a game from Parker Brothers. Bogle - investor, founder of Vanguard.

lexor
Posts: 597
Joined: Thu Feb 27, 2014 10:32 am

Re: Vanguard Advising

Post by lexor » Sat Feb 15, 2020 12:53 am

retired@50 wrote:
Sat Feb 15, 2020 12:39 am
lexor wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 9:54 pm
since PAS will cost even an average investor hundreds of thousands over their investment timeframe.
I think you're assuming facts not in evidence. How on earth can you know it will cost "hundreds of thousands"? No dollar amount or time horizon has even been mentioned?

Regards,
I said an average investor. I'm assuming an average investor needs at least a million for retirement. I guess I threw the word average around lightly since many people under-save, but surely the average Boglehead
“The miracle of compounding returns is overwhelmed by the tyranny of compounding costs.” -Mr. John C. Bogle

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Wiggums
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Re: Vanguard Advising

Post by Wiggums » Sat Feb 15, 2020 5:35 am

oinkyboinky wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 8:01 pm
What's everyone's opinion here on Vanguard's advising service?

Who should use it? Is it worth it?

I ask because it'd be nice to have someone to talk to about ALL of my assets (which they confirmed that they would do), and then only get charged .3% per year, only on the funds in Vanguard (as opposed to AXA, where you get charged 1% on EVERYTHING under management).

https://investor.vanguard.com/advice/personal-advisor
An annual 1% AUM is usually followed by putting you into expense funds with higher ER and sometimes a front end load fee. That is too costly even if they are good.

Vanguard will put you into something like 3-4 funds, low cost funds. You can cancel PAS when you feel comfortable doing it yourself. You can also select a TDF or fund of funds which would also be cheaper. Any of these choices are reasonable choices.

What kind of help are you looking for?

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Nate79
Posts: 5434
Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2016 6:24 pm
Location: Delaware

Re: Vanguard Advising

Post by Nate79 » Sat Feb 15, 2020 9:06 am

oinkyboinky wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 8:01 pm
What's everyone's opinion here on Vanguard's advising service?

Who should use it? Is it worth it?

I ask because it'd be nice to have someone to talk to about ALL of my assets (which they confirmed that they would do), and then only get charged .3% per year, only on the funds in Vanguard (as opposed to AXA, where you get charged 1% on EVERYTHING under management).

https://investor.vanguard.com/advice/personal-advisor
There are a lot of threads on Vanguard's PAS service.

retired@50
Posts: 1358
Joined: Tue Oct 01, 2019 2:36 pm

Re: Vanguard Advising

Post by retired@50 » Sat Feb 15, 2020 11:31 am

lexor wrote:
Sat Feb 15, 2020 12:53 am
retired@50 wrote:
Sat Feb 15, 2020 12:39 am
lexor wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 9:54 pm
since PAS will cost even an average investor hundreds of thousands over their investment timeframe.
I think you're assuming facts not in evidence. How on earth can you know it will cost "hundreds of thousands"? No dollar amount or time horizon has even been mentioned?

Regards,
I said an average investor. I'm assuming an average investor needs at least a million for retirement. I guess I threw the word average around lightly since many people under-save, but surely the average Boglehead
I'm afraid the state of the world isn't quite as rosy as your assumptions. See link.

https://www.thestreet.com/retirement/av ... s-14881067

Regards,
Boggle - a game from Parker Brothers. Bogle - investor, founder of Vanguard.

dbr
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Joined: Sun Mar 04, 2007 9:50 am

Re: Vanguard Advising

Post by dbr » Sat Feb 15, 2020 12:50 pm

One single advantage of VPAS is that you will certainly be invested in low cost, diversified, tax efficient funds, which puts you miles ahead of most other choices. I couldn't say how true this would be of whatever investments are not at Vanguard, however. I imagine, but do not know for sure, that you will also not be sold inappropriate insurance and annuity products. That does not mean there are no other advisory programs that accomplish the same ends, including coming here for advice and doing it yourself. I would not expect VPAS to provide estate and inheritance advice and tax planning and tax preparation assistance beyond some rudimentary considerations.

zlandar
Posts: 256
Joined: Wed Apr 10, 2019 8:51 am

Re: Vanguard Advising

Post by zlandar » Sat Feb 15, 2020 1:03 pm

I don't think you need it. I do not like AUM (assets under management) fees. Is it that much harder to manage a $10k vs a $10 million account?

mhalley
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Joined: Tue Nov 20, 2007 6:02 am

Re: Vanguard Advising

Post by mhalley » Sat Feb 15, 2020 2:26 pm

I think PAS is ok for people who have absolutely have zero interest in finance. I have instructed my wife to us this if I get hit by a bus.
I don’t think most people should pay the money. A better choice would be to buy the appropriate target date fund or life strategy fund. I don’t think my wife would be able to stay the course without some hand holding which is why I haven’t done this, plus there are tons of cap gains in the taxable accounts.
Another option would be to sign up for PAS and go through the process. Learn what vanguard recommends, then cancel it after the first quarter and manage it yourself going forward.

dbr
Posts: 31533
Joined: Sun Mar 04, 2007 9:50 am

Re: Vanguard Advising

Post by dbr » Sat Feb 15, 2020 2:35 pm

mhalley wrote:
Sat Feb 15, 2020 2:26 pm
I think PAS is ok for people who have absolutely have zero interest in finance. I have instructed my wife to us this if I get hit by a bus.
I don’t think most people should pay the money. A better choice would be to buy the appropriate target date fund or life strategy fund. I don’t think my wife would be able to stay the course without some hand holding which is why I haven’t done this, plus there are tons of cap gains in the taxable accounts.
Another option would be to sign up for PAS and go through the process. Learn what vanguard recommends, then cancel it after the first quarter and manage it yourself going forward.
I agree that trying VPAS for awhile to see what they come up with might be helpful. I also don't like to see even 0.3% siphoned off without a good reason for it.

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