If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Discuss all general (i.e. non-personal) investing questions and issues, investing news, and theory.
JBEB
Posts: 21
Joined: Thu Oct 03, 2019 6:45 pm

Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by JBEB » Sun Nov 10, 2019 5:26 pm

Sports cards

Stormbringer
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Joined: Sun Jun 14, 2015 7:07 am

Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by Stormbringer » Sun Nov 10, 2019 5:39 pm

BPT - Prudhoe Bay Royalty Trust.

It has a dividend yield of about 30%.
"Compound interest is the most powerful force in the universe." - Albert Einstein

Lou354
Posts: 630
Joined: Sun Apr 03, 2016 10:51 pm

Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by Lou354 » Sun Nov 10, 2019 5:53 pm

bgf wrote:
Sat Nov 09, 2019 10:28 pm
Carpenterant wrote:
Sat Nov 09, 2019 10:23 pm
I really think the illegal drug market offers everything within your parameters. It does expose you to some risk.
is there an award for post of the day?
If there is, I would think that suggestions of lawbreaking would be ineligible. :wink:

CurlyDave
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by CurlyDave » Sun Nov 10, 2019 6:02 pm

Gold prospecting.

Most prospectors are complete cheapskates. Get a good metal detector, and you will be far ahead of them.

wootwoot
Posts: 397
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by wootwoot » Sun Nov 10, 2019 6:16 pm

Crypto

Rwsawbones
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by Rwsawbones » Sun Nov 10, 2019 7:42 pm

I know my ideas do break the rule regarding being held in brokerage accounts but you might consider an ETF or mutual fund of international real estate investment trusts. A second place to look is a donor advised charitable trust which FIDO and others have. You could put several years of contributions in at once. The tax advantages depend on the sums involved. If itemized deductions including the funding of the donor advised charitable trust exceed the standard deduction you will be in the black. You can go back to standard deduction in subsequent years depending on the math. Another benefit is that you get to deduct the current value of securities held more than 1 year. So if you paid say $10 per share for donated security and it’s value is $100 you get to deduct the full $100
H

lazyday
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by lazyday » Sun Nov 10, 2019 8:31 pm

EE bonds are weird enough that maybe we could call it an alternative. Meets all of the requirements, and they’re super exciting. Look, over 400 posts: viewtopic.php?t=217081

Iridium
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by Iridium » Sun Nov 10, 2019 8:32 pm

bgf wrote:
Sun Nov 10, 2019 7:34 am
this is interesting, and personally id enjoy owning letters and first editions more than most paintings. is forgery/fraud not rampant? especially when buying online? do you have any experience with this? what authentication process is relied on?
Signature forgery is rampant, but the books themselves seem to be rarely outright counterfeit. There are a few things to watch out for: non-first edition books passed off as first (generally easy to detect for the books themselves as guides exist for how publishers mark the book - I think sticking a second edition dust jacket on a genuine fist edition book is the trickier problem) and restored books passed off as non-restored. This may be particular to the collectible book markets I have heard of (largely early 19th century literature).

Unlike collectible cards or comic books, it seems uncommon to get books graded and slabbed. At the top end of the market, it is all about the reputation of the book seller. The top books are pretty much never sold peer to peer, a book seller or auction house would always be part of the transaction, even if done online. It seems that the book sellers, having been around it for so long, can pretty much instantly tell when something is 'off' about a book.

Technically, there are book appraisers if you want to get an authentication done, but nobody has really figured out how to make them involved in the transaction: since the books aren't slabbed there is no way to know whether the appraisal offered is for the book the seller actually ships. Conversely, if the buyer takes a book to an appraiser to be authenticated, there is no way to know whether the buyer shipped the book actually received from the seller. I suppose something could be setup with an escrow firm handling the book and sending it for appraisal, but by the time you pay for the escrow agent, the appraiser, and 3 extra steps of registered mail shipments, it is easier just to let the book sellers have their markup.
eleventhstreet wrote:
Sat Nov 09, 2019 9:45 pm
Fractional ownership of horse racing team - I have no idea what this means but I like it. Its in first place. Sounds exotic. And google tells me its a real thing.
If you want an investment that can sink an infinite amount of time into, but probably wouldn't suffer too much if you ignored, horses seem to be a winner. Even if you only own 1/8th of a horse, you will still need a full horsemen's license, which is like an all access pass at race tracks (race tracks are nice to owners because they need good horses to run more than owners need tracks to race horses at, and even if you only own part of a horse now, whose to say you won't see a horse you really like in a claiming race, so horsemen license holders are allowed to be a lot closer even to horses they do not own than a possible gambler looking to drug a horse).

Best I can tell, the most likely outcome is that you will lose money. But the very top horses that are good enough for stud make insane amounts for their owners.

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dogagility
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by dogagility » Sun Nov 10, 2019 9:15 pm

Random Musings wrote:
Sat Nov 09, 2019 9:39 pm
Velvet Undergound Albums
I'm waiting for my man. $26 in my hand.
Taking "risk" since 1995.

countmein
Posts: 476
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by countmein » Sun Nov 10, 2019 9:33 pm

gemstones

heirloom seeds

latesaver
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by latesaver » Sun Nov 10, 2019 9:34 pm

eleventhstreet wrote:
Sat Nov 09, 2019 9:22 pm
So I need to put 2.5% of my money in alternative assets. It is very important for my financial health because I'm bored and if I don't do this I may end up doing something even more financially destructive like buy a boat.

So I want to take a poll, if you had to pick an alternative asset to invest in which of the following would you pick with the expectation of having the best risk-adjusted return.

Rules:
1. Not outrageously expensive. I agree it would be super cool to start my own space exploration company like Richard Branson or Elon Musk and I will probably go down that route once I hear back from the Nigerian prince I gave $2,000 to.
2. Nothing you can hold in your brokerage account. Binary options is an alternative asset but who wants to spend more time on their brokerage account.
3. Avoid hobbies unless you genuinely felt it would give your best shot at high risk adjusted return. If you say "Beer is my alternative asset hur dur" Im going to hit you with a beer stein
4. Real Estate has to be exotic in some way. Either its located in a foreign country or its in some way unusual.
Tribal consumer lending

Scooter57
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by Scooter57 » Sun Nov 10, 2019 9:47 pm

Cruise small town yard sales for undiscovered treasures and collector items that are highly prized on eBay and sell them on eBay. There are collector communities for the oddest cult items--things most people never think of looking up online.

Write and indie publish a series of novels on Amazon.

Write investing articles for web sites that pay on clicks

aristotelian
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by aristotelian » Sun Nov 10, 2019 10:00 pm

eleventhstreet wrote:
Sat Nov 09, 2019 9:45 pm

Come on guys how many times do we get to discuss something unique and intellectually stimulating like this. If I have to read another post about the merits of VTIAX vs VGTSX I might go insane

Qualifying answers thus far are :
Fractional ownership of horse racing team - I have no idea what this means but I like it. Its in first place. Sounds exotic. And google tells me its a real thing.
Art
Antiques
Undeveloped land

Ill throw some of my own suggestions in the mix:
Precious metals other than gold and silver. Google tells me Rhodium is expensive, I don't know what it does but someone sells it online.
Glad you liked the horse racing idea. Definitely on my bucket list of things to do once I have some serious play money.

A serious answer would be opportunity zone investing. High risk but major tax advantages if you have a lot of gains in your taxable account.

Topic Author
eleventhstreet
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by eleventhstreet » Sun Nov 10, 2019 10:11 pm

aristotelian wrote:
Sun Nov 10, 2019 10:00 pm
eleventhstreet wrote:
Sat Nov 09, 2019 9:45 pm

Come on guys how many times do we get to discuss something unique and intellectually stimulating like this. If I have to read another post about the merits of VTIAX vs VGTSX I might go insane

Qualifying answers thus far are :
Fractional ownership of horse racing team - I have no idea what this means but I like it. Its in first place. Sounds exotic. And google tells me its a real thing.
Art
Antiques
Undeveloped land

Ill throw some of my own suggestions in the mix:
Precious metals other than gold and silver. Google tells me Rhodium is expensive, I don't know what it does but someone sells it online.
Glad you liked the horse racing idea. Definitely on my bucket list of things to do once I have some serious play money.

A serious answer would be opportunity zone investing. High risk but major tax advantages if you have a lot of gains in your taxable account.

I actually looked a lot at opportunity zone funds. Its super exciting because in a way the government is rewarding you for doing something unusual. Normally you should “keep it simple stupid”. I think the thing that I didn’t like it is the barriers to entry are high so you need to hand my your money to bankers and then the realization that a bunch of bankers would be laughing with my money to the bank. At least if I lose my money to crypto, horses, or gold it’s not like I just handed it to some Wall Street bankers. I just poured it into a zerosum game where all participants are doomed to failure but a lucky few make it big.
That being said, if I ever ran into an opportunity to easily invest in an opportunity zone I’d be tempted,

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CABob
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by CABob » Sun Nov 10, 2019 10:15 pm

countmein wrote:
Sun Nov 10, 2019 9:33 pm
heirloom seeds
Tulip bulbs?
Bob

DrGoguma
Posts: 2
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by DrGoguma » Sun Nov 10, 2019 10:26 pm

Can't you sell your life insurance? So invest the money in life extension perhaps to keep laddering up, maybe.

aristotelian
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by aristotelian » Sun Nov 10, 2019 10:34 pm

eleventhstreet wrote:
Sun Nov 10, 2019 10:11 pm
aristotelian wrote:
Sun Nov 10, 2019 10:00 pm


Glad you liked the horse racing idea. Definitely on my bucket list of things to do once I have some serious play money.

A serious answer would be opportunity zone investing. High risk but major tax advantages if you have a lot of gains in your taxable account.

I actually looked a lot at opportunity zone funds. Its super exciting because in a way the government is rewarding you for doing something unusual. Normally you should “keep it simple stupid”. I think the thing that I didn’t like it is the barriers to entry are high so you need to hand my your money to bankers and then the realization that a bunch of bankers would be laughing with my money to the bank. At least if I lose my money to crypto, horses, or gold it’s not like I just handed it to some Wall Street bankers. I just poured it into a zerosum game where all participants are doomed to failure but a lucky few make it big.
That being said, if I ever ran into an opportunity to easily invest in an opportunity zone I’d be tempted,
Fundrise has a new platform for opportunity zone stuff. I haven't gotten any further than signing up for their emails but it looks interesting.
https://fundrise.com/opportunity-fund

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BenfromToronto
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Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada

Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by BenfromToronto » Mon Nov 11, 2019 1:48 am

bgf wrote:
Sun Nov 10, 2019 7:34 am
BenfromToronto wrote:
Sun Nov 10, 2019 3:31 am
If you are ready to pay $50K+ or more, you can buy the most expensive papers or books you can imagine (the equivalent of a Rembrandt or Picasso that would be worth $10M+).
For instance, for $60K, today (November 10), you can buy on line a 1937 handwritten letter sent by Albert Einstein to his son discussing Freud and Shakspeare
(https://www.abebooks.com/servlet/Search ... n&sortby=1).
These books and papers can be bought on the internet; you pay by credit card and your purchase arrives via courier a few days later; it can be stored in any safe (the ease beats the monkey or the race horse).
this is interesting, and personally id enjoy owning letters and first editions more than most paintings. is forgery/fraud not rampant? especially when buying online? do you have any experience with this? what authentication process is relied on?
Yes, I have done this on a limited basis, more for pleasure than for profit.
With a buy and hold strategy and a focus on owning a few items of high interest, it has been reasonably profitable (better than bonds would have been, not as good as stocks; collectibles are traditionally considered an edge against inflation).

Re. forgery, when you buy something for a few thousands $, it would not be profitable to create a fake book from the 1800's (for autographs, I don't know).
When you buy a great (and expensive) book or letter, it has a provenance (similar to famous paintings): it is known when it was sold by whom to whom and you know who owned it before you.
For instance, I own a famous book that was in the library of John Winant in the 1940s (he was the US ambassador to the UK during WW2).
Every time this book is sold, it can be traced.
Letters from famous people (e.g.. Darwin, Einstein) have been catalogued and their content has been published.
Becoming rich slowly is simple --earn, save, invest following a Bogleheads philosophy-- but it is not easy.

traveler901
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by traveler901 » Mon Nov 11, 2019 3:17 am

Wine.

Valuethinker
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by Valuethinker » Mon Nov 11, 2019 3:27 am

BenfromToronto wrote:
Mon Nov 11, 2019 1:48 am
bgf wrote:
Sun Nov 10, 2019 7:34 am
BenfromToronto wrote:
Sun Nov 10, 2019 3:31 am
If you are ready to pay $50K+ or more, you can buy the most expensive papers or books you can imagine (the equivalent of a Rembrandt or Picasso that would be worth $10M+).
For instance, for $60K, today (November 10), you can buy on line a 1937 handwritten letter sent by Albert Einstein to his son discussing Freud and Shakspeare
(https://www.abebooks.com/servlet/Search ... n&sortby=1).
These books and papers can be bought on the internet; you pay by credit card and your purchase arrives via courier a few days later; it can be stored in any safe (the ease beats the monkey or the race horse).
this is interesting, and personally id enjoy owning letters and first editions more than most paintings. is forgery/fraud not rampant? especially when buying online? do you have any experience with this? what authentication process is relied on?
Yes, I have done this on a limited basis, more for pleasure than for profit.
With a buy and hold strategy and a focus on owning a few items of high interest, it has been reasonably profitable (better than bonds would have been, not as good as stocks; collectibles are traditionally considered an edge against inflation).

Re. forgery, when you buy something for a few thousands $, it would not be profitable to create a fake book from the 1800's (for autographs, I don't know).
When you buy a great (and expensive) book or letter, it has a provenance (similar to famous paintings): it is known when it was sold by whom to whom and you know who owned it before you.
For instance, I own a famous book that was in the library of John Winant in the 1940s (he was the US ambassador to the UK during WW2).
Every time this book is sold, it can be traced.
Letters from famous people (e.g.. Darwin, Einstein) have been catalogued and their content has been published.
(Hugh) Anson-Cartwright used to be the dealer in Toronto that everyone had heard of.

james22
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by james22 » Mon Nov 11, 2019 3:53 am

Marina slip.

Can offset the depreciation of your boat.

austin757
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by austin757 » Mon Nov 11, 2019 7:04 am

Antique airplanes/ warbirds. Appreciation over the years has been close to the S&P. Plus I’m an airplane guy and flying them is a blast. It’s also nice to preserve history and then pass it along to a new owner down the road.

Schlabba
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by Schlabba » Mon Nov 11, 2019 7:40 am

bloom2708 wrote:
Mon Nov 11, 2019 7:33 am
Focus internally.

Health, wellness, fitness.

Example: switch to a whole food, plant based lifestyle.

Spend all your free energy on positive change for yourself.
Whats the expected ROI on eating plants?
IWDA: MSCI World | EMIM: MSCI Emerging Markets | AGGH: Global Aggregate Bond Hedged to €

fourwheelcycle
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by fourwheelcycle » Mon Nov 11, 2019 7:40 am

james22 wrote:
Mon Nov 11, 2019 3:53 am
Marina slip.
When we built our house for a total cost of about $65K in 1977 we had a small centerboard sailboat. We trailered it to a nearby (half hour drive) lake with very limited public access. The lake is beautiful and well known in our region. I realized public access would become more restricted in the future and I considered buying an unimproved lakefront lot for the sole purpose of building a small boat slip. I found a perfect lot, about the same one acre size as our new house lot, with about 150 feet of lake frontage. The price, in 1977, was $65K, which I thought was way too much money to tie up in a boat slip. Today our home is worth about $550K and the same lake front lot would be worth about $2M.

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Carlos Danger
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by Carlos Danger » Mon Nov 11, 2019 9:46 am

Legos.
  • Light-weight
    Not fragile
    Boxes have full-color artwork so they display nicely
    Easy to sell
    Easy to recognize and pick sets that will increase in value
    If your portfolio does well enough you never need or want to sell any, they're something that would be enjoyable for your grandchildren to have passed down to them
Although 2.5% would be a bit much and take up too much space. I just buy a couple of sets a year when I see something that's really interesting and I know is going to be a set that will have huge increases in value over time. I missed out on buying a really cool fisherman's warf set at the beginning of this year that I thought would be a good one. Darn thing has already doubled in price from it's retail price.

bloom2708
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by bloom2708 » Mon Nov 11, 2019 11:36 am

Schlabba wrote:
Mon Nov 11, 2019 7:40 am
bloom2708 wrote:
Mon Nov 11, 2019 7:33 am
Focus internally.

Health, wellness, fitness.

Example: switch to a whole food, plant based lifestyle.

Spend all your free energy on positive change for yourself.
Whats the expected ROI on eating plants?
Not focusing everything on money and not dying. Avoiding massive healthcare bills in 50s, 60s, 70s.
"People want confirmation, not advice" Unknown | "We are here to provoke thoughtfulness, not agree with you" Unknown | Four words. Whole food, plant based. Bing it.

Topic Author
eleventhstreet
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Joined: Tue Jul 23, 2019 10:54 pm

Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by eleventhstreet » Mon Nov 11, 2019 12:17 pm

bloom2708 wrote:
Mon Nov 11, 2019 11:36 am
Schlabba wrote:
Mon Nov 11, 2019 7:40 am
bloom2708 wrote:
Mon Nov 11, 2019 7:33 am
Focus internally.

Health, wellness, fitness.

Example: switch to a whole food, plant based lifestyle.

Spend all your free energy on positive change for yourself.
Whats the expected ROI on eating plants?
Not focusing everything on money and not dying. Avoiding massive healthcare bills in 50s, 60s, 70s.
I disagree. Living to be old is very unprofitable. Especially once you pass 80s your personal expense will invariably exceed your earnings.
Tobacco use has actually been shown to save money for society in that sense.
Which brings me to another idea, hoarding flavored Juul pods

Glockenspiel
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by Glockenspiel » Mon Nov 11, 2019 12:50 pm

Buy Property Tax lien certificates. Easy way to start accumulating property. About as risky as it can get. Small chance at making a billion dollars though. :D

james22
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by james22 » Tue Nov 12, 2019 12:28 am

fourwheelcycle wrote:
Mon Nov 11, 2019 7:40 am
james22 wrote:
Mon Nov 11, 2019 3:53 am
Marina slip.
When we built our house for a total cost of about $65K in 1977 we had a small centerboard sailboat. We trailered it to a nearby (half hour drive) lake with very limited public access. The lake is beautiful and well known in our region. I realized public access would become more restricted in the future and I considered buying an unimproved lakefront lot for the sole purpose of building a small boat slip. I found a perfect lot, about the same one acre size as our new house lot, with about 150 feet of lake frontage. The price, in 1977, was $65K, which I thought was way too much money to tie up in a boat slip. Today our home is worth about $550K and the same lake front lot would be worth about $2M.
Ouch.

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White Coat Investor
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Location: Greatest Snow On Earth

Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by White Coat Investor » Tue Nov 12, 2019 12:31 am

eleventhstreet wrote:
Sat Nov 09, 2019 9:22 pm
So I need to put 2.5% of my money in alternative assets. It is very important for my financial health because I'm bored and if I don't do this I may end up doing something even more financially destructive like buy a boat.

So I want to take a poll, if you had to pick an alternative asset to invest in which of the following would you pick with the expectation of having the best risk-adjusted return.

Rules:
1. Not outrageously expensive. I agree it would be super cool to start my own space exploration company like Richard Branson or Elon Musk and I will probably go down that route once I hear back from the Nigerian prince I gave $2,000 to.
2. Nothing you can hold in your brokerage account. Binary options is an alternative asset but who wants to spend more time on their brokerage account.
3. Avoid hobbies unless you genuinely felt it would give your best shot at high risk adjusted return. If you say "Beer is my alternative asset hur dur" Im going to hit you with a beer stein
4. Real Estate has to be exotic in some way. Either its located in a foreign country or its in some way unusual.
Buy websites. Often sold at a price where you can earn back your investment in just 9 months. A real wild west kind of frontier investment.
1) Invest you must 2) Time is your friend 3) Impulse is your enemy | 4) Basic arithmetic works 5) Stick to simplicity 6) Stay the course

rj49
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by rj49 » Tue Nov 12, 2019 12:45 am

I'd choose something like Fundrise, which is real estate but diversified across the US in apartment and retail development, with some flipping in high-demand areas like DC and LA. You get to follow new development projects in their various sub-funds and get updates and share in the gains when they pay off. You also get income from underlying rents and capital gains, depending on the kind of portfolio you pick--I get 6-8% in an income portfolio. It would help deal with restless urges to buy and sell, since they limit withdrawals during the first several years and reserve the right to stop redemptions during a recession, so people aren't buying and selling like publicly-traded REITs. It's like being a real estate developer, landlord, or house flipper without all the headaches and time demands.

dziuniek
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by dziuniek » Tue Nov 12, 2019 1:17 pm

How about investing in one of those axe-throwing start-up places I'm starting to see?

ncbill
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by ncbill » Tue Nov 12, 2019 1:48 pm

Gold or silver bullion.

Hold it physically in the form of recognized (e.g. for gold Eagle, Maple Leaf, Kruggerand) bullion coins as a pure speculative play.

And you can play with it like you're a pirate ("pieces of eight, arrrr!")

Jebediah
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by Jebediah » Tue Nov 12, 2019 1:54 pm

White Coat Investor wrote:
Tue Nov 12, 2019 12:31 am

Buy websites. Often sold at a price where you can earn back your investment in just 9 months. A real wild west kind of frontier investment.
This is interesting. Can you elaborate a little? Examples?

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White Coat Investor
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by White Coat Investor » Tue Nov 12, 2019 3:25 pm

Jebediah wrote:
Tue Nov 12, 2019 1:54 pm
White Coat Investor wrote:
Tue Nov 12, 2019 12:31 am

Buy websites. Often sold at a price where you can earn back your investment in just 9 months. A real wild west kind of frontier investment.
This is interesting. Can you elaborate a little? Examples?
I've written posts about it in the past but am not allowed to link to them per forum rules. But yea, you buy a website that generates cash like you would buy a real estate property or the shares of a business.
1) Invest you must 2) Time is your friend 3) Impulse is your enemy | 4) Basic arithmetic works 5) Stick to simplicity 6) Stay the course

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LilyFleur
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by LilyFleur » Tue Nov 12, 2019 3:34 pm

Start creating art. Take classes in exotic locations. Try to sell your art.

Topic Author
eleventhstreet
Posts: 22
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by eleventhstreet » Tue Nov 12, 2019 7:11 pm

rj49 wrote:
Tue Nov 12, 2019 12:45 am
I'd choose something like Fundrise, which is real estate but diversified across the US in apartment and retail development, with some flipping in high-demand areas like DC and LA. You get to follow new development projects in their various sub-funds and get updates and share in the gains when they pay off. You also get income from underlying rents and capital gains, depending on the kind of portfolio you pick--I get 6-8% in an income portfolio. It would help deal with restless urges to buy and sell, since they limit withdrawals during the first several years and reserve the right to stop redemptions during a recession, so people aren't buying and selling like publicly-traded REITs. It's like being a real estate developer, landlord, or house flipper without all the headaches and time demands.
I really like the idea of this but can’t seem to figure out how its substantially different a reit. I feel like they probably just lose money by letting people customize their investment but that’s the selling point

DualCitizen
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Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by DualCitizen » Wed Nov 13, 2019 4:37 am

Most people are treating your question as a joke, but I think it deserves a serious answer.

Stocks and bonds is great but I think it’s prudent, if for nothing but your ability to sleep at night, to invest at least 20% of your assets in alternative assets. You want assets that most importantly won’t go to zero. It’s more important that they simply don’t go to zero than that they grow at some predictable rate. They also don’t need to be very liquid. Again, they should just not go to zero.

Good examples are:

Rental or commercial real estate or farm land
Gold
Bitcoin

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HomerJ
Posts: 13347
Joined: Fri Jun 06, 2008 12:50 pm

Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by HomerJ » Wed Nov 13, 2019 1:00 pm

DualCitizen wrote:
Wed Nov 13, 2019 4:37 am
Most people are treating your question as a joke, but I think it deserves a serious answer.

Stocks and bonds is great but I think it’s prudent, if for nothing but your ability to sleep at night, to invest at least 20% of your assets in alternative assets. You want assets that most importantly won’t go to zero. It’s more important that they simply don’t go to zero than that they grow at some predictable rate. They also don’t need to be very liquid. Again, they should just not go to zero.

Good examples are:

Rental or commercial real estate or farm land
Gold
Bitcoin
Bitcoin could absolutely go to zero.

It may not be likely, but bitcoin is not in the same category as physical real estate or land.
The J stands for Jay

Schlabba
Posts: 154
Joined: Sat May 11, 2019 9:14 am

Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by Schlabba » Wed Nov 13, 2019 1:20 pm

DualCitizen wrote:
Wed Nov 13, 2019 4:37 am
Most people are treating your question as a joke, but I think it deserves a serious answer.

Stocks and bonds is great but I think it’s prudent, if for nothing but your ability to sleep at night, to invest at least 20% of your assets in alternative assets. You want assets that most importantly won’t go to zero. It’s more important that they simply don’t go to zero than that they grow at some predictable rate. They also don’t need to be very liquid. Again, they should just not go to zero.

Good examples are:

Rental or commercial real estate or farm land
Gold
Bitcoin
Your real estate suggestion isn't exotic enough. If you would keep some alpacas on that farm land we're in business.

I think the question is almost as weird as people who think they need "multi streams of income". We, on this forum, have an amazing way to build wealth. Why would you want something else that follows some arbitrary rules?
IWDA: MSCI World | EMIM: MSCI Emerging Markets | AGGH: Global Aggregate Bond Hedged to €

logos
Posts: 24
Joined: Tue Dec 10, 2013 3:47 am

Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by logos » Wed Nov 13, 2019 1:44 pm

Easy.

Buy machine guns. The way the law works no one can manufacture any more machineguns for civilians in the US, so the machine guns on the registry in May of 1986 are all there is or likely will ever be. Values have skyrocketed since 1986.

flaccidsteele
Posts: 19
Joined: Sun Jul 28, 2019 9:42 pm

Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by flaccidsteele » Wed Nov 13, 2019 2:00 pm

Dottie57 wrote:
Sat Nov 09, 2019 9:30 pm
If you can’t stop doing financially destructive actions, get a job. 60 hrs a week. Hopefully that would stop any urges.
+ 100

GibsonL6s
Posts: 296
Joined: Tue Aug 29, 2017 12:17 pm

Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by GibsonL6s » Wed Nov 13, 2019 2:07 pm

Why not just pick stocks with 2.5% of your portfolio, technically it is an alternative to what we do here although not an alternative asset class. Previously I had some fun picking closed end funds trading at wider than normal discounts and holding them until the discounts narrowed while collecting the income. I got bored with it, because it was such a small amount it didn't move the needle, so I just spend the time now playing racquetball and the guitar, much more fun :happy

retired@50
Posts: 485
Joined: Tue Oct 01, 2019 2:36 pm

Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by retired@50 » Wed Nov 13, 2019 2:58 pm

Buy some goats and tend to your flock. You can rent them out to eat up the grass on hillsides where it's too steep to mow, or you can rent them to people performing goat yoga.

Regards,

columbia
Posts: 1948
Joined: Tue Aug 27, 2013 5:30 am

Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by columbia » Wed Nov 13, 2019 3:04 pm

One can buy into fine art through companies like Masterworks.
I in no way endorse said company.

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billthecat
Posts: 427
Joined: Tue Jan 24, 2017 2:50 pm

Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by billthecat » Wed Nov 13, 2019 3:05 pm

Angel investing to fund microbusinesses in your local community? To help people get started?
We cannot direct the winds but we can adjust our sails.

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FelixTheCat
Posts: 1660
Joined: Sat Sep 24, 2011 12:39 am

Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by FelixTheCat » Wed Nov 13, 2019 3:06 pm

I picked Fundrise to invest in real estate that is usually not targeted by the REIT mutual funds. I selected the Balanced Investing (Growth and Income) as my portfolio. It's fun reading the regular updates on the real estate projects.

To make sure you're aware: Fundrise warns you this is a minimum 5 year commitment.
Felix is a wonderful, wonderful cat.

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nedsaid
Posts: 12668
Joined: Fri Nov 23, 2012 12:33 pm

Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by nedsaid » Wed Nov 13, 2019 7:51 pm

Glockenspiel wrote:
Mon Nov 11, 2019 12:50 pm
Buy Property Tax lien certificates. Easy way to start accumulating property. About as risky as it can get. Small chance at making a billion dollars though. :D
Thank you. I was thinking of this and you beat me to it. Very foggy memory recalls that my Great Great Grandfather John purchased farms by picking up the taxes, sort of a tax lien certificate strategy. He set up his six sons each with a farm. Many years later, I think one farm was still in the family. Not sure if that is still the case.
A fool and his money are good for business.

Cantrip
Posts: 58
Joined: Fri Oct 16, 2015 7:21 am

Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by Cantrip » Thu Nov 14, 2019 3:49 am

I considered buying shares of farmland. Has low volatility, generates income, and historically has gone up every year in price. Go to acretrader.com to learn more. Also viewtopic.php?f=1&t=282606&p=4651578#p4651578

JBTX
Posts: 5508
Joined: Wed Jul 26, 2017 12:46 pm

Re: If you were forced to pick an alternative asset...

Post by JBTX » Thu Nov 14, 2019 5:02 am

Cantrip wrote:
Thu Nov 14, 2019 3:49 am
I considered buying shares of farmland. Has low volatility, generates income, and historically has gone up every year in price. Go to acretrader.com to learn more. Also viewtopic.php?f=1&t=282606&p=4651578#p4651578
The idea has some appeal, but before 2007 people said homes never went down in value either. A lot of outside investment has poured into farmland. Prices in some areas have increased by multiples. When Schiller was asked what the next bubble could be, he replied "I don't know....maybe farmland?".

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