new roof

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Topic Author
brandy
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new roof

Post by brandy » Mon Apr 29, 2019 9:54 pm

It's time for a new roof. I'm seriously considering a “cool” roof. Have any of you had experience with the cool roofs on your house?
I'm in southern Arizona. I just got a quote for the roof only: regular shingles, Owens Corning, $8100, cool roof, $9450. Then there's the addition of any needed plywood, and one facia board, about 12' long needs replaced, and some scraping and painting of others, which will be extra.

GAF cool shingles $10800. Difference of $1350, which might take care of plywood and facia work, don't know yet.
Anyone have experience with cool shingles?
Also, he's not lcensed, and agreed to sign an independent contractor agreement. Maybe not important: he was about 40 minutes late for the estimate, and on the phone, about 6:30 pm, slurring words...Important?

Info re cool shingles: https://www.iko.com/na/blog/guide-to-re ... ool-roofs/
Cool roofs are designed to lower the temperature of your home in summer months, making you more comfortable and potentially reducing your energy bill. Cool roofs achieve this by reflecting some of the infrared (IR) light from the sun. In today’s market, a cool roof is defined by the reflectivity and emissivity requirements set by either Title 24 from the California Energy Commission or by the Energy Star program...

...These asphalt shingles are manufactured with colored granules that contain special pigments that reflect IR light. As with standard asphalt shingles, there is a variety of colors available to complement the appearance of any home.

What are your thoughts? I do not expect to sell this house. I am working to get a couple more estimates.

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Sandtrap
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Re: new roof

Post by Sandtrap » Mon Apr 29, 2019 9:57 pm

How about a tile roof?
Durable. Permanent. Cool.
(also in arizona)

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unclescrooge
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Re: new roof

Post by unclescrooge » Mon Apr 29, 2019 10:00 pm

I have GAF cool roof that was installed within part 2 years.

I would get 3 quotes and only use a licensed and certified roofer. If it is installed incorrectly it will not last long and manufacturer will not honor any warranties.

I got 3 quotes between $12k and $13k and a 4th quote for $60k. :shock:

Topic Author
brandy
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Re: new roof

Post by brandy » Mon Apr 29, 2019 10:30 pm

Good point--never thought about that. Thanks. :happy

SrGrumpy
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Re: new roof

Post by SrGrumpy » Mon Apr 29, 2019 11:55 pm

Also, he's not licensed,

Stop right there.

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Sandtrap
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Re: new roof

Post by Sandtrap » Tue Apr 30, 2019 12:05 am

unclescrooge wrote:
Mon Apr 29, 2019 10:00 pm
I have GAF cool roof that was installed within part 2 years.

I would get 3 quotes and only use a licensed and certified roofer. If it is installed incorrectly it will not last long and manufacturer will not honor any warranties.

I got 3 quotes between $12k and $13k and a 4th quote for $60k. :shock:
+1
licensed, bonded, insured, roofer.
3 estimates.
Time to completion.
Completion date.
Progress payments. (pay no more than the work that has been done).
Warranty

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lthenderson
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Re: new roof

Post by lthenderson » Tue Apr 30, 2019 9:54 am

brandy wrote:
Mon Apr 29, 2019 9:54 pm
What are your thoughts? I do not expect to sell this house. I am working to get a couple more estimates.
The biggest bang for your buck would be improving the insulation underneath your roof. The amount of insulation is a lot bigger factor in the energy efficiency of your home than the roofing material.

caffeperfavore
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Re: new roof

Post by caffeperfavore » Tue Apr 30, 2019 10:07 am

brandy wrote:
Mon Apr 29, 2019 9:54 pm
Also, he's not lcensed, and agreed to sign an independent contractor agreement. Maybe not important: he was about 40 minutes late for the estimate, and on the phone, about 6:30 pm, slurring words...Important?
I hope the last bit was a joke, but either way, run from this dude.

Anyone who does work on your home should be bonded and insured; otherwise you are at risk for liability when one of his guys falls off the roof. If your state requires licensing, then that too.

dalbright
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Re: new roof

Post by dalbright » Tue Apr 30, 2019 10:19 am

I am personally re-roofing my house myself right now. The duration shingles are a much better product compared to GAF and others at the moment due to the sure nail strip. They hold far better than nailing direct to shingle. As long as you like the color of the cool roof products there's nothing wrong with them and you might save a little due to your location but in the midwest I found that it was a wash since the heat retained helped some in the winter as well to offset. As noted, insulation is more important. You may get some tax credits with them installed through a certified installer as well. I would most definitely hired a licensed contractor that is preferably certified in whatever brand you choose. Also it is important to know what underlayment(s) they choose to use as well as 4 or 6 nails per shingle, if they plan on installing all new flashing or re-using whats there etc. as these are all bid factors and can impact the life of your roof. I'm using hot dipped galvanized nails as they are far better quality than the electroplated ones found in stores which rust quickly, but I am not familiar with your climate as much. Also, every company has had lawsuits on their shingles so don't let someone sway you with that part.

Topic Author
brandy
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Re: new roof

Post by brandy » Tue Apr 30, 2019 1:49 pm

Sandtrap wrote:
Mon Apr 29, 2019 9:57 pm
How about a tile roof? Durable. Permanent. Cool. (also in arizona)
Never thought of tile, it's not appropriate for my subdivision.
unclescrooge wrote:
Mon Apr 29, 2019 10:00 pm
I have GAF cool roof that was installed within part 2 years. I would get 3 quotes and only use a licensed and certified roofer. If it is installed incorrectly it will not last long and manufacturer will not honor any warranties. I got 3 quotes between $12k and $13k and a 4th quote for $60k. :shock:
That 60K is a big difference for sure!
lthenderson wrote:
Tue Apr 30, 2019 9:54 am
The biggest bang for your buck would be improving the insulation underneath your roof. The amount of insulation is a lot bigger factor in the energy efficiency of your home than the roofing material.
My roof is near/at the end of it's useful life. I had planned to replace it this year, hoped to hold off till next. It's time to do it now.
caffeperfavore wrote:
Tue Apr 30, 2019 10:07 am
I hope the last bit was a joke, but either way, run from this dude. Anyone who does work on your home should be bonded and insured; otherwise you are at risk for liability when one of his guys falls off the roof. If your state requires licensing, then that too.
I knew two men who did fall off roofs. One is in a wheelchair for the rest of his life. I can't afford that. Thanks for the nudge.
dalbright wrote:
Tue Apr 30, 2019 10:19 am
I am personally re-roofing my house myself right now. The duration shingles are a much better product compared to GAF and others at the moment due to the sure nail strip. They hold far better than nailing direct to shingle.
I looked at the owens corning last night. A man is coming next week, they use OC. I'll get a quote for both the duration and the Oak Ridge. I expect I'll use the Oak Ridge. The Shasta (white) is energy star. I like that OC has the technical info on their pdf.
dalbright wrote:
Tue Apr 30, 2019 10:19 am
As long as you like the color of the cool roof products there's nothing wrong with them and you might save a little due to your location but in the midwest I found that it was a wash since the heat retained helped some in the winter as well to offset.
I did wonder about that, but here it's probably not a problem. We have sun most of the time, winter daytime temps generally in 50's--60's.
dalbright wrote:
Tue Apr 30, 2019 10:19 am
As noted, insulation is more important. You may get some tax credits with them installed through a certified installer as well. I would most definitely hired a licensed contractor that is preferably certified in whatever brand you choose. Also it is important to know what underlayment(s) they choose to use as well as 4 or 6 nails per shingle, if they plan on installing all new flashing or re-using whats there etc. as these are all bid factors and can impact the life of your roof. I'm using hot dipped galvanized nails as they are far better quality than the electroplated ones found in stores which rust quickly, but I am not familiar with your climate as much. Also, every company has had lawsuits on their shingles so don't let someone sway you with that part.
What underlayment should they use? And thanks for this additional info re flashing. I'm so glad I asked.
I have some facia to be replaced, other that needs scraped and painted.

dalbright
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Re: new roof

Post by dalbright » Tue Apr 30, 2019 1:57 pm

Grace ice and water shield is the gold standard ice and water shield for the lower portion of the roof edge for a minimum of 3' in our area. How high you choose to go up beyond that is more dictated by your climate, house shape, past problems, etc. I'd shy away from anyone that uses 15-30lb felt as that person is probably skimping out on other parts of the roof too, and they should at least be using some sort of synthetic underlayment. The shingles in general don't leak...its poor install that does.

barnaclebob
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Re: new roof

Post by barnaclebob » Tue Apr 30, 2019 2:06 pm

brandy wrote:
Mon Apr 29, 2019 9:54 pm
Also, he's not lcensed, and agreed to sign an independent contractor agreement. Maybe not important: he was about 40 minutes late for the estimate, and on the phone, about 6:30 pm, slurring words...Important?
Jebus, find someone else. Roofs are not something to mess around with unlicensed people just due to the fall hazard.

fru-gal
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Re: new roof

Post by fru-gal » Tue Apr 30, 2019 4:22 pm

Not licensed, under the influence of something, run run run away from that person.

Your town building department may be helpful about roof characteristics.

DesertDiva
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Re: new roof

Post by DesertDiva » Tue Apr 30, 2019 4:53 pm

lthenderson wrote:
Tue Apr 30, 2019 9:54 am
brandy wrote:
Mon Apr 29, 2019 9:54 pm
What are your thoughts? I do not expect to sell this house. I am working to get a couple more estimates.
The biggest bang for your buck would be improving the insulation underneath your roof. The amount of insulation is a lot bigger factor in the energy efficiency of your home than the roofing material.
OP is in Southern Arizona. Roofs have a much shorter lifespan than in the midwest due to extreme heat.
♫ Stocks go up ♫ Stocks go down ♫ Stocks go up ♫ Stocks go down ♫

Topic Author
brandy
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Re: new roof

Post by brandy » Tue Apr 30, 2019 6:55 pm

I just got off the phone with an Owens-Corning rep. I think she helped me decide on product, even contractor.
If I understood everything correctly,
Their warranty is on the product, and includes product installed by not licensed people.
I do agree though, that unlicensed is not the way to go, due to potential for a fall. I will check AZ law regarding independent contractors and their responsibility, if not for the roof, for other things.
“OP is in Southern Arizona. Roofs have a much shorter lifespan than in the midwest due to extreme heat.”
These OC shingles life expectancy is about 50 years. She also said that due to me being in southern AZ, maybe 30 is more realistic. So dalbright, in the midwest, installing his own roof, those shingles have the warranty, and should last ~50 years. The warranty is transferable which is nice.
I have an appointment next week with one of OC preferred contractors. They can offer an extended warranty for $xx. She made a point to tell me that if ALL OC products are used, all are covered in case of need.
We talked about the different shingles, and right now, I expect to be using OAK RIDGE Shasta White. The numbers are a bit better than the others, and the price is a bit less. If 4 nails aare used, they're warrantied for 110 mph winds. If 6 nails are used, the warranty is for 130 mph winds.
Just thinking of the price is scary...
I really appreciate your guidance.

k3vb0t
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Re: new roof

Post by k3vb0t » Tue Apr 30, 2019 7:26 pm

Sounds like you’ve already figured out using a non-licensed roofer is a bad, bad, bad idea.

Finding good tradespeople of any variety is difficult but worthwhile process. You want the company that’s been in business for a while, can provide references, who shows up on time, and tries to earn your business.

Obviously that guy isn’t any of those things and is a no go. But I mention it as just because one of the product companies recommends someone doesn’t mean you have to go with that company. You’re spending thousands of dollars. Take the time to hire the right person/company.

Topic Author
brandy
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Re: new roof

Post by brandy » Tue Apr 30, 2019 7:45 pm

Thanks, I will. I have called several roofing companies, some more than once, and got no answer. I am sure they are still in business. I talked to one that said they'd call me back in 6-8 weeks to schedule an appointment.
I have two estimate appointments next week. Would like at least one more, maybe two...

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unclescrooge
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Re: new roof

Post by unclescrooge » Tue Apr 30, 2019 7:50 pm

brandy wrote:
Tue Apr 30, 2019 6:55 pm
. If 4 nails aare used, they're warrantied for 110 mph winds. If 6 nails are used, the warranty is for 130 mph winds.
Aren't these wind levels for cat 3 hurricanes and above?
Is this something you would need?

k3vb0t
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Re: new roof

Post by k3vb0t » Tue Apr 30, 2019 7:53 pm

brandy wrote:
Tue Apr 30, 2019 7:45 pm
Thanks, I will. I have called several roofing companies, some more than once, and got no answer. I am sure they are still in business. I talked to one that said they'd call me back in 6-8 weeks to schedule an appointment.
I have two estimate appointments next week. Would like at least one more, maybe two...
Being busy could be an indicator of being known for good work. Good tradespeople stay busy because they are good. And return calls. And show up on time. And get to charge a premium for not being knuckleheads. Not answering calls/returning calls is a no go for me.

Topic Author
brandy
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Re: new roof

Post by brandy » Tue Apr 30, 2019 8:09 pm

"Being busy could be an indicator of being known for good work. Good tradespeople stay busy because they are good. And return calls. And show up on time. And get to charge a premium for not being knuckleheads. Not answering calls/returning calls is a no go for me."

A rep of one big co. did not answer the phone in several calls, did not have an answering machine that picked up after 8 rings. One did not return my left message a few days ago. A year or so ago I called them for a repair and was not able to get help.
Oddly, there doesn't seem to be a lot of roof contractors here.
The CO of the rep coming Tues has at least one complaint and one resolved/settled case.

For the warranty, the rate is 110mph. If I want coverage to 130 mph, 6 nails have to be used, so I would guess, a higher cost.

littlebird
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Re: new roof

Post by littlebird » Tue Apr 30, 2019 8:36 pm

I see that only the “shasta white” color gets the “Energy Star” certification. I don’t know what your neighborhood is like, but if it’s the slightest bit upscale and you’re committed to the “shasta white”, I’d definitely go for the architectural shingles. The flat shingles in “shasta white” are, well, not upscale looking at all. Nearly everyone in our huge senior community who had that type of roof has replaced it with a different color, usually a blend, or an architectural style shingle or both.

SrGrumpy
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Re: new roof

Post by SrGrumpy » Tue Apr 30, 2019 8:52 pm

brandy wrote:
Tue Apr 30, 2019 8:09 pm

A rep of one big co. did not answer the phone in several calls, did not have an answering machine that picked up after 8 rings. One did not return my left message a few days ago. A year or so ago I called them for a repair and was not able to get help.
I'm having difficulty getting roofing contractors in SoCal to return emails, too. The No. 1 guy on Yelp has failed to answer 2 emails seeking quotes. Guess booming economy + social media aren't necessarily good for consumers.

k3vb0t
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Re: new roof

Post by k3vb0t » Tue Apr 30, 2019 9:16 pm

brandy wrote:
Tue Apr 30, 2019 8:09 pm
"Being busy could be an indicator of being known for good work. Good tradespeople stay busy because they are good. And return calls. And show up on time. And get to charge a premium for not being knuckleheads. Not answering calls/returning calls is a no go for me."

A rep of one big co. did not answer the phone in several calls, did not have an answering machine that picked up after 8 rings. One did not return my left message a few days ago. A year or so ago I called them for a repair and was not able to get help.
Oddly, there doesn't seem to be a lot of roof contractors here.
The CO of the rep coming Tues has at least one complaint and one resolved/settled case.

For the warranty, the rate is 110mph. If I want coverage to 130 mph, 6 nails have to be used, so I would guess, a higher cost.
That's why I said could. :)

phxjcc
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Re: new roof

Post by phxjcc » Tue Apr 30, 2019 9:25 pm

I just did a new roof in the Palm Springs area.

Went with foam and the insulating factor has to be experienced to be believed. Was 102* and I walked over to check if the AC was on.

You have to resurface every 5 years, but otherwise a lifetime roof.

If you have a flat roof, highly recommended.

Topic Author
brandy
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Re: new roof

Post by brandy » Fri May 17, 2019 7:39 pm

I think I have my roofer, he's licensed, bonded, insured. There is facia work to be done.
Which gets done first?

CobraKai
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Re: new roof

Post by CobraKai » Fri May 17, 2019 8:38 pm

k3vb0t wrote:
Tue Apr 30, 2019 7:53 pm
brandy wrote:
Tue Apr 30, 2019 7:45 pm
Thanks, I will. I have called several roofing companies, some more than once, and got no answer. I am sure they are still in business. I talked to one that said they'd call me back in 6-8 weeks to schedule an appointment.
I have two estimate appointments next week. Would like at least one more, maybe two...
Being busy could be an indicator of being known for good work. Good tradespeople stay busy because they are good. And return calls. And show up on time. And get to charge a premium for not being knuckleheads. Not answering calls/returning calls is a no go for me.

So a no call/no show is a dealbreaker? Had this happen to me today for a tree removal estimate. Or not returning your call after several days?

Topic Author
brandy
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Re: new roof

Post by brandy » Fri May 17, 2019 11:13 pm

"So a no call/no show is a deal breaker? Had this happen to me today for a tree removal estimate. Or not returning your call after several days?"

It's a deal breaker for me. If you can't get a hold of them, you can't get a hold of them. I called several times, let the phone ring. No way to leave a message. I did call a couple of times another day and let it ring beyond 8 times, no response...
Last edited by brandy on Fri May 17, 2019 11:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Topic Author
brandy
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Re: new roof

Post by brandy » Fri May 17, 2019 11:18 pm

On that facia thing, painting the underside of the eaves never occurred to me. It all actually looks like it's in good shape, is it IMPERATIVE to have that done now? Still waiting for estimates.
Then two fellows want to repair one section of facia, one wants to replace it. It's the end of the patio roof which is not being done by the roofers. HE said they'd use prybars and separate that board from the whatever it's nailed to and just replace it.
Decisions, decisions...

scifilover
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Re: new roof

Post by scifilover » Sun May 19, 2019 8:41 am

The Arizona Registrar of Contractors has an on-line search tool that allows you to search for and verify the license status of any person. In Arizona, there are many people who claim to be licensed but who are not. It is illegal to operate as a contractor in Arizona without a license.

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HueyLD
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Re: new roof

Post by HueyLD » Sun May 19, 2019 12:19 pm

brandy wrote:
Tue Apr 30, 2019 7:45 pm
Thanks, I will. I have called several roofing companies, some more than once, and got no answer. I am sure they are still in business. I talked to one that said they'd call me back in 6-8 weeks to schedule an appointment.
I have two estimate appointments next week. Would like at least one more, maybe two...
The roofers are very busy this time of the year. It appears that a lot of people want to get roofing problems fixed before the monsoon season.

I think you should take that into consideration. Some highly rated roofing companies already have work scheduled all the way to the end of September. However, it is important that they return your calls/emails to let you know that they cannot take any more customers until after September.

Turbo29
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Re: new roof

Post by Turbo29 » Sun May 19, 2019 1:15 pm

HueyLD wrote:
Sun May 19, 2019 12:19 pm
brandy wrote:
Tue Apr 30, 2019 7:45 pm
Thanks, I will. I have called several roofing companies, some more than once, and got no answer. I am sure they are still in business. I talked to one that said they'd call me back in 6-8 weeks to schedule an appointment.
I have two estimate appointments next week. Would like at least one more, maybe two...
The roofers are very busy this time of the year. It appears that a lot of people want to get roofing problems fixed before the monsoon season.

I think you should take that into consideration. Some highly rated roofing companies already have work scheduled all the way to the end of September. However, it is important that they return your calls/emails to let you know that they cannot take any more customers until after September.
Several large roofing companies that used to advertise on TV and radio are not at the moment here in AZ. That indicates to me that they don't need to advertise because they have all the business that they can handle.

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HueyLD
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Re: new roof

Post by HueyLD » Sun May 19, 2019 1:42 pm

lthenderson wrote:
Tue Apr 30, 2019 9:54 am
brandy wrote:
Mon Apr 29, 2019 9:54 pm
What are your thoughts? I do not expect to sell this house. I am working to get a couple more estimates.
The biggest bang for your buck would be improving the insulation underneath your roof. The amount of insulation is a lot bigger factor in the energy efficiency of your home than the roofing material.
Yes, indeed. The higher the number for roofing felt, the better the protection is.

Any experienced insurance agent in SoAZ will tell you that the leading cause of roof leak in the blistering heat and sun in AZ is the crumbling of the roofing paper (felt) underneath the tiles. And in order to replace roofing felt, all tiles have to be removed. So, it is extremely labor intensive.

It is highly recommended that you use paper rated as high as your budget allows. The builder grades of 15# and 30# are not suited for the SoAZ climate.

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unclescrooge
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Re: new roof

Post by unclescrooge » Sun May 19, 2019 10:51 pm

SrGrumpy wrote:
Tue Apr 30, 2019 8:52 pm
brandy wrote:
Tue Apr 30, 2019 8:09 pm

A rep of one big co. did not answer the phone in several calls, did not have an answering machine that picked up after 8 rings. One did not return my left message a few days ago. A year or so ago I called them for a repair and was not able to get help.
I'm having difficulty getting roofing contractors in SoCal to return emails, too. The No. 1 guy on Yelp has failed to answer 2 emails seeking quotes. Guess booming economy + social media aren't necessarily good for consumers.
I have a fantastic roofer if you're interested.

SrGrumpy
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Re: new roof

Post by SrGrumpy » Sun May 19, 2019 10:57 pm

Sure, thanks!

SlowlySaving
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Re: new roof

Post by SlowlySaving » Sun May 19, 2019 11:44 pm

FYI
I had shingles blowing off my house within six years of purchasing this new house. The roof was a 25 year roof, after living in it for 20 years I put a claim into my insurance with the help of an Insurance Claim Specialist and the insurance company paid for a whole new roof! I only had to pay for the deductible. If you have a defective roof, see if you could do the same.

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