Subaru Forester - ready to buy

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MeansNotEnd
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Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by MeansNotEnd » Wed Sep 12, 2018 4:59 pm

My 2003 Honda Pilot with 270,000 miles is steadily leaking oil and signalling its transmission is going again. While I have a distance auto club towing benefit, I want the vehicle replaced this year, or better yet, this month.

Our pattern has been to buy year old leased or dealer vehicles and hold for 10-15 years. After too much Consumer Report/Edmunds research and test drives, I eliminated the CR-V, RAV4, Outback, and CrossTrek and decided the Subaru Forester best meets my visibility, cargo and reliability needs. I want the EyeSight and Blind Spot safety features.

There are few available used 2017 or 2018 Foresters with those safety features and their offered prices are high. The new 2018s available with the safety features are the the high end Limited and Touring packages with leather seats and are costly.

The 2019 features and improvements look sweet to me but violate our family value of never buying new ... but evolving is good right?

1) If I can wait till November, logic says any remaining new 2018 Forester Limited and Touring trim vehicles should discount right?
2) If I go for the 2019, I know that Costco, Amica and Consumer Reports have buying services. Do I have to sign in and "commit" or can I compare multiple services? The sales person told me they would match any price I brought in, I think encouraging me to not "assign" my purchase to them so they had to pay Costco a $300 fee.

Any advice appreciated.

Jack FFR1846
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by Jack FFR1846 » Wed Sep 12, 2018 7:06 pm

I would not count on the buying services saving you anything. They're good for people too scared to negotiate. I bought my Wrangler in '14.....ordered even....for about $1600 under the Tru Car lowest price.

I have never followed Foresters, so don't know how their prices hold up. I know that WRX, STi, Impreza, and Crosstrek, used prices often exceed new with year old cars with cars up to 5 years old being in my opinion overpriced, so it makes no sense to look for used in my view. Legacys do drop. You can look around various dealers. The websites don't price the same. Some dealers don't give sale price, some do, some include the msrp and discount with lots of info. Be sure to get the dealer's bogus doc fee first. They all use it for profit (that's actually all it is) and so you don't want to be fooled with a web price $300 lower than everyone, only to find that their doc fee is $400 higher than everyone else.
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livesoft
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by livesoft » Wed Sep 12, 2018 7:12 pm

I've never had a service do as well as jus negotiating and buying for myself. Sure, use a service if you must, but I'd expect a service to get me right to 15% off a Subaru MSRP because that's what a seeming good deal on a Surbaru appears to be. Subaru at least doesn't high this stuff to my knowledge anymore.
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Finridge
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by Finridge » Wed Sep 12, 2018 7:17 pm

MeansNotEnd wrote:
Wed Sep 12, 2018 4:59 pm
My 2003 Honda Pilot with 270,000 miles is steadily leaking oil and signalling its transmission is going again. While I have a distance auto club towing benefit, I want the vehicle replaced this year, or better yet, this month.

Our pattern has been to buy year old leased or dealer vehicles and hold for 10-15 years. After too much Consumer Report/Edmunds research and test drives, I eliminated the CR-V, RAV4, Outback, and CrossTrek and decided the Subaru Forester best meets my visibility, cargo and reliability needs. I want the EyeSight and Blind Spot safety features.

There are few available used 2017 or 2018 Foresters with those safety features and their offered prices are high. The new 2018s available with the safety features are the the high end Limited and Touring packages with leather seats and are costly.

The 2019 features and improvements look sweet to me but violate our family value of never buying new ... but evolving is good right?

1) If I can wait till November, logic says any remaining new 2018 Forester Limited and Touring trim vehicles should discount right?
2) If I go for the 2019, I know that Costco, Amica and Consumer Reports have buying services. Do I have to sign in and "commit" or can I compare multiple services? The sales person told me they would match any price I brought in, I think encouraging me to not "assign" my purchase to them so they had to pay Costco a $300 fee.

Any advice appreciated.
1. As soon as thee 2019 models become available, it is likely that the prices of remaining 2018 models will be priced lower.

2. My experience with the Costco and AAA buying services is that you do not need to "commit". They do (or did when I sued the service) require you to physically go to a dealership to get the price. But then, you can say, "Thanks!" Let me think about it." Then, go and comparison shop. We did this with multiple makes/models. Which car buying service had the best price varied by make/model.

If I can ask you, what were the deciding factors in choosing the Forester over the CR-V and RAV4? We are also planning on buying a car during the next several months, and looking closely at these three.

Finridge
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by Finridge » Wed Sep 12, 2018 7:23 pm

Also, the last time I bought a car, I checked the car buying services, and also negotiated. At least at that time, and in my location, the car buying services were competitive with the best prices I was able to negotiate. And for the model I ended up choosing, the car buying service price was marginally better than the lowest price I was able to negotiate.

The next time I buy a car, I will start with the car buying services and find what the best price I can get through them is. Then I will try to get a better price using the techniques others have described here--contacting multiple dealers and asking them to provide their best "out the door" price.

ThankYouJack
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by ThankYouJack » Wed Sep 12, 2018 7:28 pm

Buying used won't save you much over 10-15 years. IMO, might as well buy new.

Reach out to a number of dealers directly. I got my Subaru for under invoice - had to drive 800 miles for it, but the savings of thousands of dollars was worth it.

MeansNotEnd
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by MeansNotEnd » Wed Sep 12, 2018 7:48 pm

[/quote]
If I can ask you, what were the deciding factors in choosing the Forester over the CR-V and RAV4? We are also planning on buying a car during the next several months, and looking closely at these three.
[/quote]

Cargo capacity, ability to go on rough roads, and reliability were similar enough on all the models I considered. Also I could sleep in any of them with a pad and front seats tilted forward. However, when test driving, the RAV4 blind spot/visibility seemed limited and I did not like the CR-V controls. Also I was spooked by the gasoline in the oil issue some have encountered in cold weather.

The Forester has great all round visibility and I enjoyed driving it. The 2019 improvements include more and flatter cargo space, safety features standard, and Android Auto which I would like. Hoping we end up going for the new one but old, cheap habits are hard to override ...

TallBoy29er
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by TallBoy29er » Wed Sep 12, 2018 8:31 pm

2019's are hitting many lots this week. 4 lots in Atlanta got them today. I would aim for a nice, new, 2018. I expect, based on your admirable frugality, that you'll be keeping the car for many years. As a poster above stated, getting a 1 year old Forester won't save you that much. And the piece of mind of having the full history of the car is worth something.

This is coming from someone who is gaining years, and has owned exactly 1 new vehicle ever. And he still uses it after 9 years, and is hoping for 10 more. :D

montanagirl
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by montanagirl » Wed Sep 12, 2018 8:40 pm

FYI I saw a Forester hit hard on the drivers side in a terrible accident, it flipped and rolled but the driver seemed to be fine.

This was two weeks ago. Had to be some awesome side air bags!

Austintatious
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by Austintatious » Wed Sep 12, 2018 9:02 pm

i drove a 2018 Forester at the dealer in Austin a few months ago and I was quite favorably impressed with the comfortable ride, zippy acceleration and excellent vision all around. It imparts a feeling of roominess.

Golf maniac
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by Golf maniac » Wed Sep 12, 2018 9:33 pm

I would send emails to dealers (internet sales) within a few hundred miles and ask for their best OTD price. Then play them off of each other. At the end tell the dealer with the best price you will go with them if they will deliver to your home. That way they bring it to you with all the paperwork and you don’t get dragged through the finance dept. This has worked for me in the past and makes delivery very quick and easy.

The only possible issue is as year end close outs begin you choice of colors or options can be limited based on the popularity of the particular model and inventory in the area.

helloeveryone
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by helloeveryone » Wed Sep 12, 2018 9:39 pm

montanagirl wrote:
Wed Sep 12, 2018 8:40 pm
FYI I saw a Forester hit hard on the drivers side in a terrible accident, it flipped and rolled but the driver seemed to be fine.

This was two weeks ago. Had to be some awesome side air bags!
I ran across this website which outlines safety ratings for various cars. The forester scored well.

https://www.iihs.org/iihs/ratings/vehic ... r-suv/2018

helloeveryone
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by helloeveryone » Wed Sep 12, 2018 9:40 pm

helloeveryone wrote:
Wed Sep 12, 2018 9:39 pm
montanagirl wrote:
Wed Sep 12, 2018 8:40 pm
FYI I saw a Forester hit hard on the drivers side in a terrible accident, it flipped and rolled but the driver seemed to be fine.

This was two weeks ago. Had to be some awesome side air bags!
I ran across this website which outlines safety ratings for various cars. The forester was a 2018 top safety pick.

https://www.iihs.org/iihs/ratings/vehic ... r-suv/2018

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TimeRunner
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by TimeRunner » Wed Sep 12, 2018 9:41 pm

Leather seats are awesome - don't make that a screen-out element. :idea:
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Marylander1
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by Marylander1 » Wed Sep 12, 2018 9:50 pm

We bought a new 2018 Forester 3 weeks ago to replace our 2004 CR-V. We evaluated the CR-V, RAV-4, Forester, and Audi Q5.

In our impression, in the years since 2006 Honda has crippled the CR-V with bad design--it now has poor visibility all around, particularly terrible front visibility for tall drivers, and a general sense of claustrophobia as the dashboard and center console have bloated outward. They replaced the full-size spare tire with a tiny donut. The RAV-4 had lousy visibility and simply too small. The Forester feels like what the CR-V should have become.

We were going to get a used Forester but the used prices were too high. Using linear mileage depreciation, it cost only about $1000 extra to get a brand-new Forester with full warranty. (And depreciation is far sharper than linear the first year.)
MeansNotEnd wrote:
Wed Sep 12, 2018 4:59 pm
The new 2018s available with the safety features are the the high end Limited and Touring packages with leather seats and are costly.
For us, the sweet spot was the Forester "Black Edition". From the features you list, it appears the Black Edition also meets your needs, but you seem to have excluded it by looking only for Limited and Touring packages; all Black Editions made since December include Eyesight and Blind Spot detection. We don't care about black wheels, but did want Eyesight, Adaptive Cruise Control, and associated safety features and X-Mode. We're delighted it doesn't include a rear power lift gate (which we've found annoying and slow, and prone to breakage according to friends), built-in navigation system (which are far worse than Google Maps and require expensive map updates), keyless ignition, or the pricey engine that wants super-expensive gasoline.

Three weeks in, we adore the Forester. Adaptive cruise control is a delight on semi-congested freeways. We like the huge roof opening on nice days. We took it on vacation along a partially-washed out muddy mountain road, where X-Mode was very nice and we needed all its ground clearance. We prefer the Forester to the Q5, and wouldn't swap it for free despite +$15k sticker price. The Forester spare is narrow but full-diameter.

For pricing, I tried the Subaru VIP Program, Costco, Consumer Reports, and my own negotiation among 5 dealers. My own efforts got me very slightly under the other pricing.

Marylander1

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Watty
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by Watty » Wed Sep 12, 2018 10:53 pm

A couple of things;

1) Be sure to carefully compare the 2018 specs to the 2019 specs since there may be differences in details, especially if they have upgraded the safety features and sound systems. For example an older model might have Eyesight 1.0 and the 2019 might have Eyesight 2.0

2) Here is a link to an ongoing thread about how to buy a car over the internet.

viewtopic.php?t=124638

I did something similar when I bought a Toyota in January and I outlined it here.

viewtopic.php?t=239526

3) When looking at used cars keep in mind that they may be about ready for new tires so be sure to budget for that.

Don't feel bad about buying new, there have been lots of threads which came to the conclusion that cars like Hondas and Toyotas don't depreciate enough to make buying a late model car worthwhile so buying new makes sense. I would assume that a Forester would be similar.

MeansNotEnd
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by MeansNotEnd » Thu Sep 13, 2018 12:07 am

TimeRunner wrote:
Wed Sep 12, 2018 9:41 pm
Leather seats are awesome
I agree! Just trying to convince myself I only need the safety necessities.

MeansNotEnd
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by MeansNotEnd » Thu Sep 13, 2018 12:38 am

Marylander1 wrote:
Wed Sep 12, 2018 9:50 pm
For us, the sweet spot was the Forester "Black Edition". From the features you list, it appears the Black Edition also meets your needs, but you seem to have excluded it by looking only for Limited and Touring packages; all Black Editions made since December include Eyesight and Blind Spot detection. We don't care about black wheels, but did want Eyesight, Adaptive Cruise Control, and associated safety features and X-Mode. We're delighted it doesn't include a rear power lift gate (which we've found annoying and slow, and prone to breakage according to friends), built-in navigation system (which are far worse than Google Maps and require expensive map updates), keyless ignition, or the pricey engine that wants super-expensive gasoline.
Marylander1
I align with all your criteria (in addition I would like Android Auto but not a deal breaker). A little embarrassed as I did not know there was a 2018 Black Edition. It wasn't on my 2018 Forrester Spec Sheet and is not an trim search option on cars.com. Tried Consumer Report's link to TrueCar service and saw the trim option but don't see inventory in the Northwest. Will expand my search and make calls in the morning. Thanks.

I am a fan girl of the public radio podcast Make Me Smart from Marketplace. As I read the information and opinions posted, all I can think of is their tag line "Because none of us is as smart as all of us." Thanks so much for your help tonight. I am going to strongly recommend amending our family tradition as I want and it makes sense to buy a new Subaru.

Nate79
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by Nate79 » Thu Sep 13, 2018 9:54 am

Watty wrote:
Wed Sep 12, 2018 10:53 pm
A couple of things;

1) Be sure to carefully compare the 2018 specs to the 2019 specs since there may be differences in details, especially if they have upgraded the safety features and sound systems. For example an older model might have Eyesight 1.0 and the 2019 might have Eyesight 2.0

2) Here is a link to an ongoing thread about how to buy a car over the internet.

viewtopic.php?t=124638

I did something similar when I bought a Toyota in January and I outlined it here.

viewtopic.php?t=239526

3) When looking at used cars keep in mind that they may be about ready for new tires so be sure to budget for that.

Don't feel bad about buying new, there have been lots of threads which came to the conclusion that cars like Hondas and Toyotas don't depreciate enough to make buying a late model car worthwhile so buying new makes sense. I would assume that a Forester would be similar.
-
As far as I can find the second generation Eyesight by Subaru was started in about 2013 and rolled out into models 2015-2017.

https://www.cars.com/articles/subaru-ex ... 700145788/

So I think it is safe to say if looking at 2018+ models have second gen design.

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SevenBridgesRoad
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by SevenBridgesRoad » Thu Sep 13, 2018 10:06 am

We looked hard at both the Forrester and the Outback. My wife and I kayak at least once a week during the summer, so the roof rack was important. The Outback comes with a slick rack system. And, the Outback is not quite as tall and makes it easier for us to load the 43 pound kayaks. So that made the difference for our specific usage all other things being about equal. We bought new (2018) and got the most advanced version of Eyesight, important for safety we felt. And we got the 6 cylinder. But either car, you're going to be happy.
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MeansNotEnd
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by MeansNotEnd » Thu Sep 13, 2018 10:30 am

My husband and son made the ease of loading case for the Outback but too many years in a minivan and then the Pilot have made me more comfortable seat.ed higher.

I paddleboard using an inflatable which I can lift easily. If I am bringing our second solid board, we have a pulley system in the garage that enables me to load it on my own. With satellite radio likely no longer will be able to lay the boards on the roof and we'll have to get a cradle system. Will have to figure out all the Yakima adjustments in the new year.

CULater
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by CULater » Thu Sep 13, 2018 11:11 am

I'm a believer in due diligence on any vehicle purchase and one of the websites I check is Carcomplaints.com. At least with respect to the 2017 Forester, there seem to be several complaints about the CVT transmission, such as this one:
2017 Subaru Limited has issues almost always from a dead stop at low acceleration. It is like the CVT cannot make up its mind what gear to be in. It shutters & jerks & I absolutely hate it. Especially going up a hill from a slow speed or a complete stop, it jerks like crazy. When I turn a corner & then press the gas a little to pick up some speed it jerks. Making a turn from a stop & trying to slow & then give a little more gas it starts to jerk. Took to the dealer & they did the software update. It got about 70-80% better for almost a week. Then it got at least as bad or maybe worse than before the update. I took it back 2 1/2 weeks later.
https://www.carcomplaints.com/Subaru/Forester/2017/


You might want to check Carcomplaints.com and the Subaru owners website to see what comes up that you can doublecheck during test drives.
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obgraham
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by obgraham » Thu Sep 13, 2018 12:04 pm

We bought a 2017 Forester, and like it a lot. As snowbirds, we needed another vehicle for the winter place, so decided to trade our high miles Pilot out for a second Forester, this one a neatly identical 2018. As with others, we found the price of a slightly used model too high compared to just buying new.

They are great cars. Roomy, great visibility, and easy entry/exit for us geezers.

Contrary to most here, we prefer the low end models. No fancy cruise, automatic warnings, or nav systems. A lot harder to find those on dealer lots.

Ninnie
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by Ninnie » Thu Sep 13, 2018 12:05 pm

We test drove the 2018 Forester and have decided to wait for the 2019 model. It depends on if the new model improvements matter to you. To us, they do.

Specifically 2019 is supposed to be quieter and has CarPlay, both were sticking points for us.

Marylander1
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by Marylander1 » Thu Sep 13, 2018 4:14 pm

obgraham wrote:
Thu Sep 13, 2018 12:04 pm
Contrary to most here, we prefer the low end models. No fancy cruise, automatic warnings, or nav systems. A lot harder to find those on dealer lots.
Before writing my response above, I did a quick check of local inventory. Curiously, I saw a surge of low-end Foresters, especially with manual transmissions. Since the 2019 models are all automatic CVTs, anyone who wants a new stickshift Forester has precious few weeks before they're gone, likely forever.

Marylander1

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tennisplyr
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by tennisplyr » Thu Sep 13, 2018 6:08 pm

Daughter just got a '18 Outback and loves it. I drove it and liked the feel...very roomy on the inside. Like the ad says, 98% of Subarus sold in last 10 years are still on the road.
Those who move forward with a happy spirit will find that things always work out.

obgraham
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by obgraham » Thu Sep 13, 2018 7:29 pm

Marylander1 wrote:
Thu Sep 13, 2018 4:14 pm
obgraham wrote:
Thu Sep 13, 2018 12:04 pm
Contrary to most here, we prefer the low end models. No fancy cruise, automatic warnings, or nav systems. A lot harder to find those on dealer lots.
Before writing my response above, I did a quick check of local inventory. Curiously, I saw a surge of low-end Foresters, especially with manual transmissions. Since the 2019 models are all automatic CVTs, anyone who wants a new stickshift Forester has precious few weeks before they're gone, likely forever.

Marylander1
I imagine that varies with the dealer and the region. My dealer for this recent purchase had 35 Foresters on the lot. Zero with manual transmission. 3 standard non-Premium models.

banook
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by banook » Thu Sep 13, 2018 8:04 pm

My 2003 Honda Pilot with 270,000 miles is steadily leaking oil and signalling its transmission is going again. While I have a distance auto club towing benefit, I want the vehicle replaced this year, or better yet, this month.

Our pattern has been to buy year old leased or dealer vehicles and hold for 10-15 years. After too much Consumer Report/Edmunds research and test drives, I eliminated the CR-V, RAV4, Outback, and CrossTrek and decided the Subaru Forester best meets my visibility, cargo and reliability needs. I want the EyeSight and Blind Spot safety features.
My parents owned a 2003 CR-V that saved their life after being hit by a train (rural area, no whistle/signal, lots of bushes) - they walked away with slight seatbelt bruising (CR-V was written off, and they got the exact same car). Since 2011 they've owned only 2 Subarus (Outbacks - and graduated to EyeSight last year having more disposal income and wanting safety on snowy rural roads). My own car is a 2016 Forester without EyeSight (one above base with CVT). All have been great cars with exceptional service and no issues. I have driven a couple of manual Foresters and think that if you live in a rural area with hills and snow - manual is helpful (and cheaper); however, the CVT is great for MPG.

I agree with an earlier post that Honda CR-Vs have lagged since 2006.

8track
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by 8track » Fri Sep 14, 2018 12:36 am

The 2019 Subaru Forester is a major model refresh from the 2018 and older Foresters. Historically reliability problems are said to be much more likely in the first year of a major update like this one, especially with Subarus. Something to think about when choosing when and which Subaru model to buy.

Joylush
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by Joylush » Fri Sep 14, 2018 2:09 pm

I have 2018 Forester Turbo model (discontinued for 2019). Love it! If you have any plans of traveling through mountain areas it's a dream!

theplayer11
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by theplayer11 » Fri Sep 14, 2018 2:24 pm

SevenBridgesRoad wrote:
Thu Sep 13, 2018 10:06 am
We looked hard at both the Forrester and the Outback. My wife and I kayak at least once a week during the summer, so the roof rack was important. The Outback comes with a slick rack system. And, the Outback is not quite as tall and makes it easier for us to load the 43 pound kayaks. So that made the difference for our specific usage all other things being about equal. We bought new (2018) and got the most advanced version of Eyesight, important for safety we felt. And we got the 6 cylinder. But either car, you're going to be happy.
Did you drive the 4Cyl? I would like to get some feedback on the power difference between the 6 cyl vs the 4. I've always drove a 6 cyl so the thought or "downgrading" isn't appealing to me. But to get the 6 Cyl, you need a more loaded model and that gets pricey.

tomd37
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by tomd37 » Fri Sep 14, 2018 2:37 pm

I look forward to a reply to theplayer11 question just above as I have the same question and am interested in the new Outback.
Tom D.

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RootSki
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by RootSki » Fri Sep 14, 2018 3:39 pm

I've said this before and I'll say it again...

I really wish Subaru would expand the use of a turbo charged 4 cylinder engine across their line.

Until then, I'm not interested.

clemrick
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by clemrick » Sat Sep 15, 2018 9:01 am

Our 2012 Forester was the first brand new car for us. We usually get 5 year cars and drive them into the ground, but when our 1990 Trooper with 350,000 miles was on its last legs, we decided to get a Forester. Subarus keep their value and it didn't make sense to buy used. We also like simple cars with manual transmissions. In 2012, they were saying that 2014 was going to be last year for manuals and the 2013 were coming out, but had all kinds of controls on the steering wheel we didn't want so defaulted into a 2012 and love our car.

The only caution would be to check if they have solved the oil problem. We had our short block replaced last November (recall) because of the oil it used. She still drinks a bit, but not as much as she used to. (If you spend any time on Subaru owner sites you will find that Subaru owners tend to name their cars. Mine is Camille.)

ncbill
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by ncbill » Sat Sep 15, 2018 10:33 am

Ninnie wrote:
Thu Sep 13, 2018 12:05 pm
We test drove the 2018 Forester and have decided to wait for the 2019 model. It depends on if the new model improvements matter to you. To us, they do.

Specifically 2019 is supposed to be quieter and has CarPlay, both were sticking points for us.
Plus LED headlights and EyeSight standard.

I have a relative waiting for the 2019 for the above since they always buy the base model.

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tennisplyr
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by tennisplyr » Sun Sep 16, 2018 9:49 am

tomd37 wrote:
Fri Sep 14, 2018 2:37 pm
I look forward to a reply to theplayer11 question just above as I have the same question and am interested in the new Outback.
My daughter's new Outback which I drove has 4 cyclinders and is plenty peppy for my taste.
Those who move forward with a happy spirit will find that things always work out.

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SevenBridgesRoad
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by SevenBridgesRoad » Sun Sep 16, 2018 10:40 am

theplayer11 wrote:
Fri Sep 14, 2018 2:24 pm
SevenBridgesRoad wrote:
Thu Sep 13, 2018 10:06 am
We looked hard at both the Forrester and the Outback. My wife and I kayak at least once a week during the summer, so the roof rack was important. The Outback comes with a slick rack system. And, the Outback is not quite as tall and makes it easier for us to load the 43 pound kayaks. So that made the difference for our specific usage all other things being about equal. We bought new (2018) and got the most advanced version of Eyesight, important for safety we felt. And we got the 6 cylinder. But either car, you're going to be happy.
Did you drive the 4Cyl? I would like to get some feedback on the power difference between the 6 cyl vs the 4. I've always drove a 6 cyl so the thought or "downgrading" isn't appealing to me. But to get the 6 Cyl, you need a more loaded model and that gets pricey.
Yes, we drove both the 4 and the 6. Noticeable difference when accelerating onto the highway. We live at 4,000 feet and frequent the mountain roads nearby (lots of going up, sometimes need to pass the logging trucks, etc)...the extra power really helps. The Motor Trend review article on the 4-cyl. is titled "Safe, Slow and Spacious". 'Nuff said. Stats: 4-cyl horsepower 175, the 6-cyl HP 256. Acceleration: 4-cyl 0-60 in 9.4 secs, the 6-cyl in 6.9 seconds. Not even close. Trade off of course is less fuel efficiency and more expensive purchase price. Everyone has to stack up their requirements and the trade offs in a priority order and make the best choice for them.
There are stars in the Southern sky | And if ever you decide | You should go | There is a taste of time sweetened honey | Down the Seven Bridges Road

Marylander1
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by Marylander1 » Sun Sep 16, 2018 10:53 am

SevenBridgesRoad wrote:
Sun Sep 16, 2018 10:40 am
Stats: 4-cyl horsepower 175, the 6-cyl HP 256. Acceleration: 4-cyl 0-60 in 9.4 secs, the 6-cyl in 6.9 seconds. Not even close. Trade off of course is less fuel efficiency and more expensive purchase price.
Since this is Bogleheads, it seems reasonable to consider miles per dollar as operating costs, not miles per gallon. Since the 6-cylinder burns more expensive fuel, the increase in operating costs is considerably larger than implied by MPG alone.

Marylander1

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SevenBridgesRoad
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by SevenBridgesRoad » Sun Sep 16, 2018 11:05 am

Marylander1 wrote:
Sun Sep 16, 2018 10:53 am
SevenBridgesRoad wrote:
Sun Sep 16, 2018 10:40 am
Stats: 4-cyl horsepower 175, the 6-cyl HP 256. Acceleration: 4-cyl 0-60 in 9.4 secs, the 6-cyl in 6.9 seconds. Not even close. Trade off of course is less fuel efficiency and more expensive purchase price.
Since this is Bogleheads, it seems reasonable to consider miles per dollar as operating costs, not miles per gallon. Since the 6-cylinder burns more expensive fuel, the increase in operating costs is considerably larger than implied by MPG alone.

Marylander1
From the Subaru website: for both engines, they specify the same fuel: unleaded gasoline at 87 octane. The 6-cyl does not require more expensive fuel.
There are stars in the Southern sky | And if ever you decide | You should go | There is a taste of time sweetened honey | Down the Seven Bridges Road

Marylander1
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by Marylander1 » Sun Sep 16, 2018 12:29 pm

SevenBridgesRoad wrote:
Sun Sep 16, 2018 11:05 am
From the Subaru website: for both engines, they specify the same fuel: unleaded gasoline at 87 octane. The 6-cyl does not require more expensive fuel.
Thanks for the correction. I was inadvertently referring to the Forester, for which the Turbo model does recommend high-octane gas. From my owners manual:
Turbo models: The engine is designed to operate at maximum performance using unleaded gasoline with an octane rating of 93 AKI (98 RON) or higher. Unleaded gasoline with an octane rating of 91 AKI (95 RON) or higher may be used with no detriment to engine durability or driveability. However, you may notice a slight decrease in maximum engine performance while using 91 AKI (95 RON) fuel.

Regular unleaded gasoline with an octane rating of 87 AKI (90 RON) or higher may also be used. Using regular unleaded gasoline will not be detrimental to engine durability, nor will it affect your warranty coverage. However, depending on your driving habits and conditions, you may notice a decrease in maximum engine performance, fuel economy or slight engine vibration or knocking. If you experience any of these conditions while using a lower octane rated fuel, you may want to return to using 91 AKI (95 RON) octane rated fuel as soon as possible. Additionally, if your vehicle knocks heavily or
persistently, or if you are driving with heavy loads such as when towing a trailer, the use of 91 AKI (95 RON) or higher grade unleaded gasoline is required.
Marylander1

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SevenBridgesRoad
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by SevenBridgesRoad » Sun Sep 16, 2018 2:12 pm

Marylander1 wrote:
Sun Sep 16, 2018 12:29 pm
SevenBridgesRoad wrote:
Sun Sep 16, 2018 11:05 am
From the Subaru website: for both engines, they specify the same fuel: unleaded gasoline at 87 octane. The 6-cyl does not require more expensive fuel.
Thanks for the correction. I was inadvertently referring to the Forester, for which the Turbo model does recommend high-octane gas. From my owners manual:
Turbo models: The engine is designed to operate at maximum performance using unleaded gasoline with an octane rating of 93 AKI (98 RON) or higher. Unleaded gasoline with an octane rating of 91 AKI (95 RON) or higher may be used with no detriment to engine durability or driveability. However, you may notice a slight decrease in maximum engine performance while using 91 AKI (95 RON) fuel.

Regular unleaded gasoline with an octane rating of 87 AKI (90 RON) or higher may also be used. Using regular unleaded gasoline will not be detrimental to engine durability, nor will it affect your warranty coverage. However, depending on your driving habits and conditions, you may notice a decrease in maximum engine performance, fuel economy or slight engine vibration or knocking. If you experience any of these conditions while using a lower octane rated fuel, you may want to return to using 91 AKI (95 RON) octane rated fuel as soon as possible. Additionally, if your vehicle knocks heavily or
persistently, or if you are driving with heavy loads such as when towing a trailer, the use of 91 AKI (95 RON) or higher grade unleaded gasoline is required.
Marylander1
Got it, makes sense. And you are right, based on the details in the manual, there may be certain conditions where higher octane works better. We are at some altitude here and driving on mountain roads and the 89 is working fine. But as it says, individual driving habits and conditions can change things.
There are stars in the Southern sky | And if ever you decide | You should go | There is a taste of time sweetened honey | Down the Seven Bridges Road

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whr19606
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by whr19606 » Mon Sep 17, 2018 2:15 pm

We just got a 2018 Forester Premium in August. It had the cold weather package (we wanted heated cloth seats), and the full safety package (Eyesight, Adaptive Cruise Control, Blind Spot Alert, and Rear Cross-Traffic Alert). Total sticker price was $28,805. Since we are tired of buying tires, batteries, and misc. repairs, we are leasing it. The lease includes oil changes, so we will only pay state inspection fees for the next (3) years. We put $3,000 down and our monthly payments, including taxes, are $290. We are very happy with the car (it's our 3rd Subaru), it is quiet, smooth, and comfortable, and we love the safety features.

MeansNotEnd
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by MeansNotEnd » Mon Sep 17, 2018 5:15 pm

whr19606 wrote:
Mon Sep 17, 2018 2:15 pm
We just got a 2018 Forester Premium.
Right behind you! While the Premium "black edition" is no longer available in my area, there are 10 Premiums MSRP $29,608 with eyesight, blind spot, and cloth seats. Can add leather seats for under $1000 after market if we really want.

Starting the uncomfortable process of negotiating. TrueCar is about $2,000 off list, going in to view Costco's paperwork at dealer, then figuring out next steps. Easiest savings - staying in state 100 miles south is $450 less sales tax then 75 miles north.

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SevenBridgesRoad
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Re: Subaru Forester - ready to buy

Post by SevenBridgesRoad » Mon Sep 17, 2018 11:10 pm

Congrats! Well done.
There are stars in the Southern sky | And if ever you decide | You should go | There is a taste of time sweetened honey | Down the Seven Bridges Road

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