Vanguard statements dropped estimated yield and annual income [also cost basis]

[MakesCents]

Bogleheads -

Who does not download, print, save monthly statements but rather selects the transaction report feature on Vanguard’s website and runs 1 simple report for the year with all transactions?

Much less space.

Best.
Tony

I did just look at what you suggest - and it does give you a transaction history (as long as the data is good) - however, it also gives a disclaimer right up top, which gives me pause to switch to that method of tracking investments:

Create custom transaction history report
This report should not be used for tax reporting purposes. Refer to your Vanguard tax forms when filing tax returns.

So I regard Statements along with Confirmations a more reasonable way to track and be able to prove your investments. But that's just me.
Best regards,
MakesCents

[MakesCents]

Why not just use the Vanguard website for this information? What's so special about the monthly statements?

About basis: Statements tend to get filed away for periods longer than things are kept in customer facing web sites. Web sites tend to be more transient. Over long periods of time, there can be reasons to change custodians, perhaps leaving some history behind, not necessarily recognized until you need it. Even when keeping statements, an occasional statement gets lost or misfiled, so having key info like basis reported regularly can come in hand.

About estimated yield and annual income: it can be convenient to have custodian estimates, but they are only estimates. Having to pull together my own just adds to cost of financial management, in either my time or that of another service provider (e.g., tax guy). And may make it less likely that one gets around to refining tax plans as often as might be advantageous.

ncdcpa,
Well said and Totally Agree!
MakesCents

[Historical]

The points made about the utility (or lack thereof) of estimated income and cost are well-taken. Monthly statements are not of much use for tax purposes, except when showing a transaction.

However, when I receive the monthly statements I like to scan them to get a general sense of how my portfolio is doing. With the cost showing it's easier to think about both performance and taxes. Similarly, the estimated income (which I've found to be reasonable) is helpful with planning.

Without that information the statement sits in isolation, like a balloon in the middle of a cloud.

I could dig out the information, but why should I take the time when it's all readily available to Vanguard on it's computers.

When Vanguard talks about "streamlining" it looks like a euphemism for dumping costs onto clients. If VG really wants to streamline and cut costs, they should get rid of the people who come up with ways to reduce service quality.

[jebmke]

The points made about the utility (or lack thereof) of estimated income and cost are well-taken. Monthly statements are not of much use for tax purposes, except when showing a transaction.

However, when I receive the monthly statements I like to scan them to get a general sense of how my portfolio is doing. With the cost showing it's easier to think about both performance and taxes. Similarly, the estimated income (which I've found to be reasonable) is helpful with planning.

Without that information the statement sits in isolation, like a balloon in the middle of a cloud.

I could dig out the information, but why should I take the time when it's all readily available to Vanguard on it's computers.

When Vanguard talks about "streamlining" it looks like a euphemism for dumping costs onto clients. If VG really wants to streamline and cut costs, they should get rid of the people who come up with ways to reduce service quality.

I suppose one issue is that what you think is needed on the statement may be different than what I need on the statement. Multiply that times a large number and you have a situation where the custodian can't please everyone. I realize taken to an extreme, that viewpoint could result in a statement that was a blank sheet of paper. So they have to draw the line somewhere.

If Vanguard issued a statement that only had share counts, I would have a hard time arguing that that was not enough for me. The value on day X, which is now history, isn't much use to me. The cost detail is only useful to me in the context of my tax return, now or in the future. As a qualifier, I should note that for more than 20 years, the bulk of our assets appeared only once a year on a statement issued in the March-ish timeframe with an as-of date of December 31 of the prior year. So we flew blind for many years. I don't recommend the practice.

Obviously others have different needs but I think that illustrates my point.

Edit: what I do think would be helpful is a more user-friendly report generating tool on their website. While the current "tools" are adequate for me, I will admit that they are a bit crude and not easy for the casual data user.

[MakesCents]

The points made about the utility (or lack thereof) of estimated income and cost are well-taken. Monthly statements are not of much use for tax purposes, except when showing a transaction.

However, when I receive the monthly statements I like to scan them to get a general sense of how my portfolio is doing. With the cost showing it's easier to think about both performance and taxes. Similarly, the estimated income (which I've found to be reasonable) is helpful with planning.

Without that information the statement sits in isolation, like a balloon in the middle of a cloud.

I could dig out the information, but why should I take the time when it's all readily available to Vanguard on it's computers.

When Vanguard talks about "streamlining" it looks like a euphemism for dumping costs onto clients. If VG really wants to streamline and cut costs, they should get rid of the people who come up with ways to reduce service quality.

I hope that Vanguard gets requests from Their Shareholders to Not Dumb Down the statements making them useless.
They have the data, they certainly have the previous format of PDF reports, which We already have to Download and get on our own: Why not Provide it to the shareholders? To Simplify? Ha.
If information on the statement isn't of concern to you, It still should be included, you can simply gaze through and not bother paying attention to it.

This honestly, looks like the lack of transparency that I had at work with a few 401ks. Just performance, but Not Basis or Historical Data.
It does not give the data that investors need to make informed decisions. I thought VG was about Transparancy and Knowledge.
I switched to them because of that.

MakeCents

[michage]

Vanguard also dropped average price/share and total cost which gives you an idea of your capital gains if you decide to sell and also how well your stock/fund is doing compared to the price you paid. Is there an easy way to get this information in printed form for your whole portfolio--i.e. is there some way to put together a statement online that includes this information in a printable format? Dropping it out makes the statement pretty useless now. Is a Fidelity statement better?

Yes. Now both Fidelity and Merrill Lynch statements are much more useful. I used estimated yield in planning.

[ssel]

Same scanner, same settings, same magnification as close as I can get it. The typeface for "Vanguard Voyager Select Services®" looks different to me. Tighter spaces between the letters--a bit too tight in my opinion. And there's a barcode....

Either way, it's definitely a conspiracy.

And now look at those same words at the top of your October statement. The plot thickens...

[Historical]

Follow up. About 10 days ago I telephoned Vanguard to voice a complaint. After the usual overlong wait I spoke to an agent who had difficulty understanding my concerns.

Once he figured it out he said they had not received any notice about statement changes and he would look into it. He promised he would personally get back to me within a few hours. That's the last I heard.

[osmalfa]

To summarize on VG dropping cost basis information from statements, no one seems to have been bothered by cost base information being included in statements, and at least some are bothered by it being dropped.

If VG did this to try to save money, it would seem that they are looking for loose change in between the sofa cushions. Perhaps to really save some money, they should just dump monthly statements altogether, and while they're at it, just get rid of their website and call centers, and just have all you penny-pinching geniuses send them trade and redemption requests by carrier pigeon.

Buh-bye.

[MakesCents]

Follow up. About 10 days ago I telephoned Vanguard to voice a complaint. After the usual overlong wait I spoke to an agent who had difficulty understanding my concerns.

Once he figured it out he said they had not received any notice about statement changes and he would look into it. He promised he would personally get back to me within a few hours. That's the last I heard.

Thanks for trying!
I remember years ago, in a company sponsered 401k plan (a finance Tech supplier) shift-changed at a whim to different brokerages (multiple times) and locked employees out prior to letting us know of the change. Directing our previously invested funds into new ones.
. Very little on their statements Always.
Probably lost money, but it is what it is.

Statements were
Just How you are doing right now.

I honestly didn't know if what I put in was UP or DOWN.

I know some don't remember the old days, but actually tracking things is important to your financial health.
Some seem so concerned over Fisher Investments, yet, In VG some seem to not be concerned over basic important information that is relevant.

MakesCents
edited to make it clear on 401k changes, and non transparency

[MakesCents]

To summarize on VG dropping cost basis information from statements, no one seems to have been bothered by cost base information being included in statements, and at least some are bothered by it being dropped.

If VG did this to try to save money, it would seem that they are looking for loose change in between the sofa cushions. Perhaps to really save some money, they should just dump monthly statements altogether, and while they're at it, just get rid of their website and call centers, and just have all you penny-pinching geniuses send them trade and redemption requests by carrier pigeon.

Buh-bye.

It is ironic and sad.
Agree wholeheartly.

[Clarky]

Much ado about nothing. Data is on the website. The information on the statements were not reliable.

[MakesCents]

Much ado about nothing. Data is on the website. The information on the statements were not reliable.

Sorry, Umm
If the 'informaton' on the statements were not reliable, why would the website be more so? Doesn't it report the same thing?
If it doesn't, there's a problem with cost basis across the board.

Statements are what I use to prove, keep track of and judge things.

I'm not talking about estimated yields - because, yes that is an estimation.

Cost basis is um, a super important part of investing? So if the statements aren't accurate and the website results is well, iffy...
What solid concrete information do we have to go by?

I think you might just be voicing about the estimated yields? For me, I want solid statements and confirmations of trades and activity from the brokerage - not just years of some random screen shots of of a website.


Sent with due respect - but these are life savings that we all track. Same as a bank. It's important. Webpages can be maliputated, it's the internet age.
I just want real statements that I have to back up my investments and yes, paid for with hard earned dollars.
MakesCents

[prd1982]

Cost basis is um, a super important part of investing?

I’m not sure it is. I don’t look at the statements (I use Quicken). I assume the missing field was the cost basis of all the shares. There is a big difference between all the shares down 10%, vs half the shares down 30% and half up 10%. So you really need to look at the web to see if you want to sell.

I suspect part of the reason for dropping this is to eliminate questions from folks who don’t understand cost basis.

[MakesCents]

prd1982

I also use Quicken.
But many do not.
Using Quicken is certainly an extra step, as would be keeping your own spreadsheets. I suspect neither is the norm these days.

For proof, downloading statements and confirmations from the brokerage is insurance against any questions from the IRS on basis and history.
I do not think a self generated quicken report or excel spreadsheet would hold much water with them. And just a webpage screenshot is also not something I'd put out as 'hard data' for them to consider.

I can't speculate on the 'whys' of missing data fields on an official brokerage statement.
They certainly have the data and it was part of the statements before. If it was of no concern to the reader, they could ignore it.
It's been said before.

There are some that see it as really important and some that could care less - I suspect the folks who could care less apparently didn't insist it be removed.

Think I'm done with this issue - it will be what it will be.
Best regards and happy tracking

MakesCents

[Clarky]

Much ado about nothing. Data is on the website. The information on the statements were not reliable.

Yes, I was referring to the estimated yield primarily. But the cost basis wasn’t detailed enough anyway, at least as I recall it. I’d have to go back and look at a pre-change statement.