Michelin Pilot Sport AS4 vs. CrossClimate 2? (CO Front Range - safety, comfort, noise)
Michelin Pilot Sport AS4 vs. CrossClimate 2? (CO Front Range - safety, comfort, noise)
Can anyone give me a real world comparison of these two tires, specifically on a Tesla in the Colorado front range?
I liked the CC2s on my last SUV, but my Tesla is a different beast. It could benefit from a better and quieter ride, which I am not sure the CC2s will give me.
I watched a TyreReviews video. The Pilot Sport A/S 4 did excellent in dry/wet conditions and okay on snow/ice. The CC2 did okay on dry, but great on snow/ice. I think it was the Euro-spec CC2 they tested, which is different than what we get here, if that matters.
We get snow on the front range, but it gets salted/plowed and melts quickly due to the abundant sunshine. It also routinely gets into the upper 40s and even 50s in winter. I do go to the mountains to ski, but we have another SUV with snows if needed.
Given my climate, would the AS4 be a better tire? Severe snow performance of the CC2 would be nice, but not at the expense of dry performance and comfort, which I'd get from an ultra performance all season like the AS4. I decided against a dedicated winter tire based on my other thread, as it seems a bit much for the conditions I drive in.
Or if there's a better tire I haven't looked at, I'm open to suggestions!
I liked the CC2s on my last SUV, but my Tesla is a different beast. It could benefit from a better and quieter ride, which I am not sure the CC2s will give me.
I watched a TyreReviews video. The Pilot Sport A/S 4 did excellent in dry/wet conditions and okay on snow/ice. The CC2 did okay on dry, but great on snow/ice. I think it was the Euro-spec CC2 they tested, which is different than what we get here, if that matters.
We get snow on the front range, but it gets salted/plowed and melts quickly due to the abundant sunshine. It also routinely gets into the upper 40s and even 50s in winter. I do go to the mountains to ski, but we have another SUV with snows if needed.
Given my climate, would the AS4 be a better tire? Severe snow performance of the CC2 would be nice, but not at the expense of dry performance and comfort, which I'd get from an ultra performance all season like the AS4. I decided against a dedicated winter tire based on my other thread, as it seems a bit much for the conditions I drive in.
Or if there's a better tire I haven't looked at, I'm open to suggestions!
Re: Michelin Pilot Sport AS4 vs. CrossClimate 2? (CO Front Range - safety, comfort, noise)
The Michelin tire in the subject line caught my eye, but it turns out I only have experience with the Michelin Pilot Sport A/S 3+. So I really don't know how that tire compares with the Michelin under your consideration. So FWIW, here's my take on the A/S 3+, and I'll leave it to you to see if it's comparable to the A/S 4. (Here's one guy's take: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uahMiTQY_rw)
The ride is definitely nice. I had been running Cooper (all-season) tires, which I bought twice, that handled really well, but by the time the tread wore down a little they were extremely harsh. I felt every little crack in the road. The A/S 3+ tires felt much softer and were much quieter. But the handling was still excellent. The tire compound feels like it grips the road better than any other tire I've run on. And they handle great on both wet and dry pavement. (I run at 38 PSI front, 37 PSI rear.) Snow traction is good, but that's with an AWD Subaru. So from a performance standpoint, these tires have been outstanding.
The one trade-off that I found is that they increased my fuel consumption markedly. I'm talking about somewhere in the 10% - 15% range more fuel consumption. Consumer Reports had given them relatively poorer marks in "rolling resistance," but I didn't really take much stock in that measure. Well, it turns out they were right, and the A/S 3+ tires really impacted my mileage. I was hoping that effect would diminish after the tread wore down a little, but even after 25k miles, no such luck. I ruled out any mechanical issues because I maintain a fuel log, and the mileage decrease coincided exactly with the tire replacement. Nothing else changed. What that would mean for energy use in a Tesla, I don't know.
Overall, it's a trade-off I'd gladly make again, as the tires have been really nice in all other respects.
The ride is definitely nice. I had been running Cooper (all-season) tires, which I bought twice, that handled really well, but by the time the tread wore down a little they were extremely harsh. I felt every little crack in the road. The A/S 3+ tires felt much softer and were much quieter. But the handling was still excellent. The tire compound feels like it grips the road better than any other tire I've run on. And they handle great on both wet and dry pavement. (I run at 38 PSI front, 37 PSI rear.) Snow traction is good, but that's with an AWD Subaru. So from a performance standpoint, these tires have been outstanding.
The one trade-off that I found is that they increased my fuel consumption markedly. I'm talking about somewhere in the 10% - 15% range more fuel consumption. Consumer Reports had given them relatively poorer marks in "rolling resistance," but I didn't really take much stock in that measure. Well, it turns out they were right, and the A/S 3+ tires really impacted my mileage. I was hoping that effect would diminish after the tread wore down a little, but even after 25k miles, no such luck. I ruled out any mechanical issues because I maintain a fuel log, and the mileage decrease coincided exactly with the tire replacement. Nothing else changed. What that would mean for energy use in a Tesla, I don't know.
Overall, it's a trade-off I'd gladly make again, as the tires have been really nice in all other respects.
Last edited by iceport on Wed Oct 30, 2024 9:27 am, edited 1 time in total.
"Discipline matters more than allocation.” |—| "In finance, if you’re certain of anything, you’re out of your mind." ─William Bernstein
Re: Michelin Pilot Sport AS4 vs. CrossClimate 2? (CO Front Range - safety, comfort, noise)
We were in the same situation a few years ago. Have not tried the CrossClimate, but we are almost finished with a set of AS4 on our 2019 Tesla Model 3 performance.
They are solid performing in snow/ice, quiet and handle very well on dry pavement. They also have a rim guard which I appreciate. Ours are almost finished with about 50k miles on them (we haven't babied them at all).
Would highly recommend unless you need top-end snow/ice performance.
They are solid performing in snow/ice, quiet and handle very well on dry pavement. They also have a rim guard which I appreciate. Ours are almost finished with about 50k miles on them (we haven't babied them at all).
Would highly recommend unless you need top-end snow/ice performance.
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Re: Michelin Pilot Sport AS4 vs. CrossClimate 2? (CO Front Range - safety, comfort, noise)
No experience with the tires you mention or a Tesla.
I replaced the factory "low profile looks cool" rims and tires on my Honda Passport AWD Elite when it was new several years ago.
These tires:
Regular profile Michelin Defender
https://www.michelinman.com/auto/tires/ ... er-ltx-m-s
worked out very well, nicer ride, quieter, and very solid feeling in AWD on ice, black ice, snow.
I ordered a higher profile rim and tire combination that would fit just right in the front fenders on full lock, etc.
It took a lot of online research and data from the Honda Forums to figure out what would work best as far as rim/tire combination for that specific car.
So, also realize that changing the rim/tire combination can make a difference as well.
j
I replaced the factory "low profile looks cool" rims and tires on my Honda Passport AWD Elite when it was new several years ago.
These tires:
Regular profile Michelin Defender
https://www.michelinman.com/auto/tires/ ... er-ltx-m-s
worked out very well, nicer ride, quieter, and very solid feeling in AWD on ice, black ice, snow.
I ordered a higher profile rim and tire combination that would fit just right in the front fenders on full lock, etc.
It took a lot of online research and data from the Honda Forums to figure out what would work best as far as rim/tire combination for that specific car.
So, also realize that changing the rim/tire combination can make a difference as well.
j
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Re: Michelin Pilot Sport AS4 vs. CrossClimate 2? (CO Front Range - safety, comfort, noise)
I have cross climate 2 on the Town Car. Performance on snow/ice is quite good, although they are a "decently winter capable wet/dry road tire" not a "winter tire" and certainly not "studded snow tire" or "chains."
Versus the old tires (kinda cheap and balding) I haven't noticed a difference in noise, although Town Cars are quiet to start with. Ride quality is slightly better, although again, Town Car ride quality is excellent to start with.
Versus the old tires (kinda cheap and balding) I haven't noticed a difference in noise, although Town Cars are quiet to start with. Ride quality is slightly better, although again, Town Car ride quality is excellent to start with.
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Re: Michelin Pilot Sport AS4 vs. CrossClimate 2? (CO Front Range - safety, comfort, noise)
I switched from AS4 to DWS06+ and there was a noticable improvement to comfort and noise. Not on a Tesla though.
Re: Michelin Pilot Sport AS4 vs. CrossClimate 2? (CO Front Range - safety, comfort, noise)
AS4, unless you actually live in the mountains and drive on low-traffic snow-covered roads like dirt roads. When I lived in the front range driving on any substantial cover of snow was very rare.
Re: Michelin Pilot Sport AS4 vs. CrossClimate 2? (CO Front Range - safety, comfort, noise)
Honestly, I think the A/S 4 would be a great fit for your Tesla, especially with the kind of weather you get in the Colorado front range. I had a similar experience with my last car where I prioritized dry and wet performance over severe snow handling since it usually melts fast around here. The A/S 4 is really comfortable and grips well in most conditions, which is perfect for everyday driving. Plus, since you’ve got another SUV for the heavy snow days, it sounds like a smart way to go. If you're open to alternatives, the Michelin CrossClimate 2 is worth checking out too—I've heard good things about its balance between comfort and winter performance!
Re: Michelin Pilot Sport AS4 vs. CrossClimate 2? (CO Front Range - safety, comfort, noise)
I've had older versions of both and did not love the CrossClimate. My impression was that they didn't really provide much additional traction but did wear down fast.
Not relevant to your vehicle but seemingly in contrast to that experience, I've been happy with BFG A/T KO2s on our SUV. The KO2s are snow rated and a good match for occasional snowy conditions while also able to withstand the heat found a lower elevation.
Not relevant to your vehicle but seemingly in contrast to that experience, I've been happy with BFG A/T KO2s on our SUV. The KO2s are snow rated and a good match for occasional snowy conditions while also able to withstand the heat found a lower elevation.
Re: Michelin Pilot Sport AS4 vs. CrossClimate 2? (CO Front Range - safety, comfort, noise)
I have no experience with the A/S 4. However, I did put CC2 on my Tesla, and I highly recommend them.
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Re: Michelin Pilot Sport AS4 vs. CrossClimate 2? (CO Front Range - safety, comfort, noise)
I replaced the factory tires on my 2023 Tesla M3 with Michelin CC2 after a lot of research. I recommend them. Had them put on my daughter's car too. Drove in the snow a few times and could barely tell I was on snow. They perform close enough on wet and dry to the best high performance all season tires that the improved snow traction and safety is worth it(for me). Very good, long tread life.
*Slightly* noisier than the OEM EV tires but you would almost have to hear them back to back to notice. Passengers, including my wife, don't notice at all. Will buy again.
*Slightly* noisier than the OEM EV tires but you would almost have to hear them back to back to notice. Passengers, including my wife, don't notice at all. Will buy again.
Re: Michelin Pilot Sport AS4 vs. CrossClimate 2? (CO Front Range - safety, comfort, noise)
I’ve put CC2s on three cars. I swear by them here in PA.
Re: Michelin Pilot Sport AS4 vs. CrossClimate 2? (CO Front Range - safety, comfort, noise)
Moving to a rim that allows for a taller sidewall will give you a better ride. Low profile rims are popular because of the looks, but they affect ride characteristics.LAMTA wrote: ↑Wed Oct 30, 2024 8:27 am Can anyone give me a real world comparison of these two tires, specifically on a Tesla in the Colorado front range?
I liked the CC2s on my last SUV, but my Tesla is a different beast. It could benefit from a better and quieter ride, which I am not sure the CC2s will give me.
I watched a TyreReviews video. The Pilot Sport A/S 4 did excellent in dry/wet conditions and okay on snow/ice. The CC2 did okay on dry, but great on snow/ice. I think it was the Euro-spec CC2 they tested, which is different than what we get here, if that matters.
We get snow on the front range, but it gets salted/plowed and melts quickly due to the abundant sunshine. It also routinely gets into the upper 40s and even 50s in winter. I do go to the mountains to ski, but we have another SUV with snows if needed.
Given my climate, would the AS4 be a better tire? Severe snow performance of the CC2 would be nice, but not at the expense of dry performance and comfort, which I'd get from an ultra performance all season like the AS4. I decided against a dedicated winter tire based on my other thread, as it seems a bit much for the conditions I drive in.
Or if there's a better tire I haven't looked at, I'm open to suggestions!
Re: Michelin Pilot Sport AS4 vs. CrossClimate 2? (CO Front Range - safety, comfort, noise)
I purposely got the 19" wheels and not the larger ones. I don't think Tesla offers anything with a taller sidewall?kevinf wrote: ↑Thu Oct 31, 2024 6:31 pmMoving to a rim that allows for a taller sidewall will give you a better ride. Low profile rims are popular because of the looks, but they affect ride characteristics.LAMTA wrote: ↑Wed Oct 30, 2024 8:27 am Can anyone give me a real world comparison of these two tires, specifically on a Tesla in the Colorado front range?
I liked the CC2s on my last SUV, but my Tesla is a different beast. It could benefit from a better and quieter ride, which I am not sure the CC2s will give me.
I watched a TyreReviews video. The Pilot Sport A/S 4 did excellent in dry/wet conditions and okay on snow/ice. The CC2 did okay on dry, but great on snow/ice. I think it was the Euro-spec CC2 they tested, which is different than what we get here, if that matters.
We get snow on the front range, but it gets salted/plowed and melts quickly due to the abundant sunshine. It also routinely gets into the upper 40s and even 50s in winter. I do go to the mountains to ski, but we have another SUV with snows if needed.
Given my climate, would the AS4 be a better tire? Severe snow performance of the CC2 would be nice, but not at the expense of dry performance and comfort, which I'd get from an ultra performance all season like the AS4. I decided against a dedicated winter tire based on my other thread, as it seems a bit much for the conditions I drive in.
Or if there's a better tire I haven't looked at, I'm open to suggestions!
I'm deciding between the Conti ExtremeContact or Pilot AS4. Both seem very highly rated and I think will be better suited to our climate than something as heavy duty as the CC2.
Re: Michelin Pilot Sport AS4 vs. CrossClimate 2? (CO Front Range - safety, comfort, noise)
18" is smallest size on model 3.
19" is official smallest size on model y, but you can fit most 18s which will still clear the standard brakes.
19" is official smallest size on model y, but you can fit most 18s which will still clear the standard brakes.
Re: Michelin Pilot Sport AS4 vs. CrossClimate 2? (CO Front Range - safety, comfort, noise)
I'm not a pro, but I'm pretty sure the low profile is for the purpose of better handling, particularly hard cornering. And there are huge trade-offs: both tires and wheels are more susceptible to damage, and the ride is much harsher. I doubt they'd be as common if it were just a matter of aesthetics. It all comes down to personal driving preferences and needs, as almost everything related to tire design involves trade-offs. About the only thing I miss about the taller, narrower designs more common in the old days is way better handling in the snow and less hydroplaning in the rain. But I tend to prefer a stiffer, more responsive sidewall, which is a shorter sidewall. (And even then I bump up the tire pressure significantly from the stock doorjamb recommendation for even better handling — and mileage.)kevinf wrote: ↑Thu Oct 31, 2024 6:31 pmMoving to a rim that allows for a taller sidewall will give you a better ride. Low profile rims are popular because of the looks, but they affect ride characteristics.LAMTA wrote: ↑Wed Oct 30, 2024 8:27 am Can anyone give me a real world comparison of these two tires, specifically on a Tesla in the Colorado front range?
I liked the CC2s on my last SUV, but my Tesla is a different beast. It could benefit from a better and quieter ride, which I am not sure the CC2s will give me.
I watched a TyreReviews video. The Pilot Sport A/S 4 did excellent in dry/wet conditions and okay on snow/ice. The CC2 did okay on dry, but great on snow/ice. I think it was the Euro-spec CC2 they tested, which is different than what we get here, if that matters.
We get snow on the front range, but it gets salted/plowed and melts quickly due to the abundant sunshine. It also routinely gets into the upper 40s and even 50s in winter. I do go to the mountains to ski, but we have another SUV with snows if needed.
Given my climate, would the AS4 be a better tire? Severe snow performance of the CC2 would be nice, but not at the expense of dry performance and comfort, which I'd get from an ultra performance all season like the AS4. I decided against a dedicated winter tire based on my other thread, as it seems a bit much for the conditions I drive in.
Or if there's a better tire I haven't looked at, I'm open to suggestions!
"Discipline matters more than allocation.” |—| "In finance, if you’re certain of anything, you’re out of your mind." ─William Bernstein
Re: Michelin Pilot Sport AS4 vs. CrossClimate 2? (CO Front Range - safety, comfort, noise)
The amount of people that actually take their vehicles to the track and also DON'T have ultra-high performance wheel sets to swap on is incredibly low. So for the majority of road vehicles with low-pro tires they are all downsides save for the looks.iceport wrote: ↑Fri Nov 01, 2024 9:02 amI'm not a pro, but I'm pretty sure the low profile is for the purpose of better handling, particularly hard cornering. And there are huge trade-offs: both tires and wheels are more susceptible to damage, and the ride is much harsher. I doubt they'd be as common if it were just a matter of aesthetics. It all comes down to personal driving preferences and needs, as almost everything related to tire design involves trade-offs. About the only thing I miss about the taller, narrower designs more common in the old days is way better handling in the snow and less hydroplaning in the rain. But I tend to prefer a stiffer, more responsive sidewall, which is a shorter sidewall. (And even then I bump up the tire pressure significantly from the stock doorjamb recommendation for even better handling — and mileage.)
Re: Michelin Pilot Sport AS4 vs. CrossClimate 2? (CO Front Range - safety, comfort, noise)
Well that's not true at all. I have never taken a car to the track, but I benefit every day from the better handling of low profile tires pumped up to a high air pressure — and I willingly trade off the harsher ride. Do I need better handling? Absolutely not. It just makes driving more fun for me.kevinf wrote: ↑Fri Nov 01, 2024 11:38 amThe amount of people that actually take their vehicles to the track and also DON'T have ultra-high performance wheel sets to swap on is incredibly low. So for the majority of road vehicles with low-pro tires they are all downsides save for the looks.iceport wrote: ↑Fri Nov 01, 2024 9:02 am
I'm not a pro, but I'm pretty sure the low profile is for the purpose of better handling, particularly hard cornering. And there are huge trade-offs: both tires and wheels are more susceptible to damage, and the ride is much harsher. I doubt they'd be as common if it were just a matter of aesthetics. It all comes down to personal driving preferences and needs, as almost everything related to tire design involves trade-offs. About the only thing I miss about the taller, narrower designs more common in the old days is way better handling in the snow and less hydroplaning in the rain. But I tend to prefer a stiffer, more responsive sidewall, which is a shorter sidewall. (And even then I bump up the tire pressure significantly from the stock doorjamb recommendation for even better handling — and mileage.)
"Discipline matters more than allocation.” |—| "In finance, if you’re certain of anything, you’re out of your mind." ─William Bernstein
Re: Michelin Pilot Sport AS4 vs. CrossClimate 2? (CO Front Range - safety, comfort, noise)
Sounds like you're not in the majority then. I end up pulling the minority out of their wrecked vehicles eventually.
Last edited by kevinf on Fri Nov 01, 2024 2:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Michelin Pilot Sport AS4 vs. CrossClimate 2? (CO Front Range - safety, comfort, noise)
For a specific answer to noise/energy consumption data, I would look up videos from the Out of Spec group and consider posting this question as a comment on one you find most nearly relevant. They do extensive reviews of EVs and are based in Colorado.
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Re: Michelin Pilot Sport AS4 vs. CrossClimate 2? (CO Front Range - safety, comfort, noise)
I have AS4s on my GTI and CC2 on my (wife's) Subaru Crosstrek. Also lived for a while in the Front Range -- good bit of driving in Boulder where the roads are treated more "naturally" (typical of Boulder) with sand instead of salt.
I really like the AS4s on my GTI (FWD) but I am quite happy to have the CC2s on the Subaru (AWD). If I had to choose one I would pick the CC2 because of conditions encountered driving on I70/93 with snow. Just driving around town the AS4s were less confidence inspiring but sufficient (chalk this also a bit up to FWD). So for you it would depend on what kind of driving you do -- i.e. drive up in the mountains with snow often.
I didn't see in the thread -- is your Tesla RWD or AWD? That might sway me -- AS4 probably fine with AWD but I would be less comfortable in certain situations with RWD.
As for noise.. the Subaru is getting up in age and is quite loud so I don't think I can offer a fair eval of the CC2 in this regard. The AS4s are smooth and quiet in my GTI.
Don't think you can really go wrong here. Bottom line: I would go AS4 if you mostly drive in snow only around town and the CC2 if you get up into the mountains often with snow (I70 can be nerve wracking in tough conditions).
I really like the AS4s on my GTI (FWD) but I am quite happy to have the CC2s on the Subaru (AWD). If I had to choose one I would pick the CC2 because of conditions encountered driving on I70/93 with snow. Just driving around town the AS4s were less confidence inspiring but sufficient (chalk this also a bit up to FWD). So for you it would depend on what kind of driving you do -- i.e. drive up in the mountains with snow often.
I didn't see in the thread -- is your Tesla RWD or AWD? That might sway me -- AS4 probably fine with AWD but I would be less comfortable in certain situations with RWD.
As for noise.. the Subaru is getting up in age and is quite loud so I don't think I can offer a fair eval of the CC2 in this regard. The AS4s are smooth and quiet in my GTI.
Don't think you can really go wrong here. Bottom line: I would go AS4 if you mostly drive in snow only around town and the CC2 if you get up into the mountains often with snow (I70 can be nerve wracking in tough conditions).