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HappyRetiree wrote: ↑Fri Nov 17, 2023 10:21 pm
The medicare website quotes a price for a Pittsburgh zip code for 2024 with Mutual of Omaha at 263.00 for an 81 male non-smoker. I thought that you were supposed to be able to go by the medicare website but I really don't know much about it. My husband has Mutual of Omaha Plan G but he is younger and in a different state. They are always sending info for cancer insurance and extra hospital insurance, maybe these could be included in your dad's policy?? Just trying to think of why it would be higher than the medicare website.
The Medicare website only gives you the rates for open plans.
Closed plans are not priced because you can't buy them anymore. Existing policyholders can still renew.
In fact, this is exactly how Mutual of Omaha is taking advantage of the market structure. There is no such thing as Mutual of Omaha Plan G. Instead, there's Mutual of Omaha Plan G offered after 2020, Mutual of Omaha Plan G offered between 2014 and 2019, and so on. They're different plans from different companies. That's why the price is different.
When you get rates on Medicare.gov for Pennsylvania, it says Mutual of Omaha (United of Omaha Life Insurance). This is the open Mutual of Omaha Plan G. You don't see what's happening to the rates for the closed Mutual of Omaha Plan Gs.
jim779 wrote: ↑Fri Nov 17, 2023 11:58 pm
I talked to my Dad about it and he might like to try the AARP G plan. I would like to get him a paper application if I could to see how bad the underwriting is. But I don;t know if they will even send a paper application.
The AARP Medigap plan is offered by UnitedHealthcare. UHC is known to be a good actor in the Medigap industry. It does not behave like Mutual of Omaha.
If your father cannot pass medical underwriting, does he still have his once-in-a-lifetime trial right? If the Mutual of Omaha plan is closed and he has never been on Medicare Advantage, he can switch to Advantage and then to a different Medigap plan A, B, C, or F within 12 months without medical underwriting.
The trial right is only available once in a lifetime, and Plan G is not available, so it should be saved for when you really need it. If you can pass medical underwriting for Plan G and get a good price, then you should not waste your trial right.
I called in today and asked for a paper application from United Health. The guy I talked to was ultra aggravating and it took forever for such a simple request but they said they would send one out in 7 to 10 days.
My Dad might make it through underwriting.....hopefully!
jim779 wrote: ↑Sat Nov 18, 2023 10:04 pm
Thanks Talzara
My Dad has only Been on the G plan from MOO.
I called in today and asked for a paper application from United Health. The guy I talked to was ultra aggravating and it took forever for such a simple request but they said they would send one out in 7 to 10 days.
My Dad might make it through underwriting.....hopefully!
May I ask why you won't just use the online application? You will have your answer in 10 minutes. Also keep in mind that open enrollment ends on December 7. He may have an easier time switching during open enrollment.
jim779 wrote: ↑Fri Nov 17, 2023 11:58 pm
I talked to my Dad about it and he might like to try the AARP G plan. I would like to get him a paper application if I could to see how bad the underwriting is. But I don;t know if they will even send a paper application.
The AARP Medigap plan is offered by UnitedHealthcare. UHC is known to be a good actor in the Medigap industry. It does not behave like Mutual of Omaha.
If your father cannot pass medical underwriting, does he still have his once-in-a-lifetime trial right? If the Mutual of Omaha plan is closed and he has never been on Medicare Advantage, he can switch to Advantage and then to a different Medigap plan A, B, C, or F within 12 months without medical underwriting.
The trial right is only available once in a lifetime, and Plan G is not available, so it should be saved for when you really need it. If you can pass medical underwriting for Plan G and get a good price, then you should not waste your trial right.
Why A,B,C or F? Does C and F only apply to people who turned 65 before 2020? Are they replaced with other letters for those who turned 65 after 2020 ?
jim779 wrote: ↑Fri Nov 17, 2023 11:58 pm
I talked to my Dad about it and he might like to try the AARP G plan. I would like to get him a paper application if I could to see how bad the underwriting is. But I don;t know if they will even send a paper application.
The AARP Medigap plan is offered by UnitedHealthcare. UHC is known to be a good actor in the Medigap industry. It does not behave like Mutual of Omaha.
If your father cannot pass medical underwriting, does he still have his once-in-a-lifetime trial right? If the Mutual of Omaha plan is closed and he has never been on Medicare Advantage, he can switch to Advantage and then to a different Medigap plan A, B, C, or F within 12 months without medical underwriting.
The trial right is only available once in a lifetime, and Plan G is not available, so it should be saved for when you really need it. If you can pass medical underwriting for Plan G and get a good price, then you should not waste your trial right.
Why A,B,C or F? Does C and F only apply to people who turned 65 before 2020? Are they replaced with other letters for those who turned 65 after 2020 ?
Yes, C and F are only open now to those who could have gotten in at the time and that is if your 65th birthday occurred before January 1, 2020.
jim779 wrote: ↑Fri Nov 17, 2023 11:58 pm
I talked to my Dad about it and he might like to try the AARP G plan. I would like to get him a paper application if I could to see how bad the underwriting is. But I don;t know if they will even send a paper application.
The AARP Medigap plan is offered by UnitedHealthcare. UHC is known to be a good actor in the Medigap industry. It does not behave like Mutual of Omaha.
If your father cannot pass medical underwriting, does he still have his once-in-a-lifetime trial right? If the Mutual of Omaha plan is closed and he has never been on Medicare Advantage, he can switch to Advantage and then to a different Medigap plan A, B, C, or F within 12 months without medical underwriting.
The trial right is only available once in a lifetime, and Plan G is not available, so it should be saved for when you really need it. If you can pass medical underwriting for Plan G and get a good price, then you should not waste your trial right.
Why A,B,C or F? Does C and F only apply to people who turned 65 before 2020? Are they replaced with other letters for those who turned 65 after 2020 ?
Yes, C and F are only open now to those who could have gotten in at the time and that is if your 65th birthday occurred before January 1, 2020.
Yes, C and F became D and G.
Those who were on Medicare due to disability before January 1, 2020 are also eligible for Parts C and F.
Plans C and F cover the $226 ($240 in 2024) Part B deductible, while D and G do not.
It looks like G is usually a better deal than F, even taking into account having to pay the Part B deductible with G.
Some people are concerned that F is essentially a closed pool now and as the F pool ages, it will get sicker, with higher medical expenses, and then with higher premiums. Many people who can pass underwriting will then leave, leaving an even sicker pool pushing premiums even higher.
Last edited by ModifiedDuration on Tue Nov 21, 2023 10:38 am, edited 1 time in total.
jim779 wrote: ↑Fri Nov 17, 2023 11:58 pm
I talked to my Dad about it and he might like to try the AARP G plan. I would like to get him a paper application if I could to see how bad the underwriting is. But I don;t know if they will even send a paper application.
The AARP Medigap plan is offered by UnitedHealthcare. UHC is known to be a good actor in the Medigap industry. It does not behave like Mutual of Omaha.
If your father cannot pass medical underwriting, does he still have his once-in-a-lifetime trial right? If the Mutual of Omaha plan is closed and he has never been on Medicare Advantage, he can switch to Advantage and then to a different Medigap plan A, B, C, or F within 12 months without medical underwriting.
The trial right is only available once in a lifetime, and Plan G is not available, so it should be saved for when you really need it. If you can pass medical underwriting for Plan G and get a good price, then you should not waste your trial right.
Why A,B,C or F? Does C and F only apply to people who turned 65 before 2020? Are they replaced with other letters for those who turned 65 after 2020 ?
Yes, C and F are only open now to those who could have gotten in at the time and that is if your 65th birthday occurred before January 1, 2020.
Yes, C and F became D and G.
Those who were on Medicare due to disability before January 1, 2020 are also eligible for Parts C and F.
Plans C and F cover the $226 ($240 in 2024) Part B deductible, while D and G do not.
It looks like G is usually a better deal than F.
Some people are concerned that F is essentially a closed pool now and as the F pool ages, it will get sicker, with higher medical expenses, and then with higher premiums. Many people who can pass underwriting will then leave, leaving an even sicker pool pushing premiums even higher.
I wonder why a lot of insurers don't even bother to offer Plan D. It looks like it's the same as G except it does not cover excess charges.
The AARP Medigap plan is offered by UnitedHealthcare. UHC is known to be a good actor in the Medigap industry. It does not behave like Mutual of Omaha.
If your father cannot pass medical underwriting, does he still have his once-in-a-lifetime trial right? If the Mutual of Omaha plan is closed and he has never been on Medicare Advantage, he can switch to Advantage and then to a different Medigap plan A, B, C, or F within 12 months without medical underwriting.
The trial right is only available once in a lifetime, and Plan G is not available, so it should be saved for when you really need it. If you can pass medical underwriting for Plan G and get a good price, then you should not waste your trial right.
Why A,B,C or F? Does C and F only apply to people who turned 65 before 2020? Are they replaced with other letters for those who turned 65 after 2020 ?
Yes, C and F are only open now to those who could have gotten in at the time and that is if your 65th birthday occurred before January 1, 2020.
Yes, C and F became D and G.
Those who were on Medicare due to disability before January 1, 2020 are also eligible for Parts C and F.
Plans C and F cover the $226 ($240 in 2024) Part B deductible, while D and G do not.
It looks like G is usually a better deal than F.
Some people are concerned that F is essentially a closed pool now and as the F pool ages, it will get sicker, with higher medical expenses, and then with higher premiums. Many people who can pass underwriting will then leave, leaving an even sicker pool pushing premiums even higher.
I wonder why a lot of insurers don't even bother to offer Plan D. It looks like it's the same as G except it does not cover excess charges.
I have also wondered that.
Especially if your state is one of the states that does even allow Excess Charges. Than D might also be better than N because of no copays.
I did a cursory look in my zip code (no Excess Charges) and it looked like D premiums did compare favorably to G and N.
tj wrote: ↑Mon Nov 20, 2023 10:34 pm
Why A,B,C or F? Does C and F only apply to people who turned 65 before 2020? Are they replaced with other letters for those who turned 65 after 2020 ?
The law says that the trial right can be used to switch back to your previous Medigap plan, or if it is no longer open, to any Plan A, B, C, or F that is still open. Your plan has to be closed before you can use the trial right to escape to a different plan.
Medicare has interpreted the law to mean A, B, C, D, F, G, K, and L. You cannot use the trial right to switch to M or N.
If your former Medigap policy isn’t available, you can buy Medigap Plan A, B, C*, D*, F*, G*, K, or L that’s sold in your state by any insurance company.
* Note: Plans C and F are no longer available to people new to Medicare on or after January 1, 2020. However, if you were eligible for Medicare before January 1, 2020 but not yet enrolled, you may be able to buy Plan C or Plan F. People new to Medicare on or after January 1, 2020 have the right to buy Plans D and G instead of Plans C and F.
Does anyone know if they base the medical underwriting on age?
What I mean is do they take into consideration that someone is 80 years old and compare them to other 80 year olds?
My Dad has mild kidney disease. He is on no medication for it and he just gets checked once a year. But it looks like that is a concern when it comes to underwriting. For being 81 I think he is in good health. A lot of the people that are his age that are still living are way worse off.
jim779 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 11:02 pm
Does anyone know if they base the medical underwriting on age?
What I mean is do they take into consideration that someone is 80 years old and compare them to other 80 year olds?
My Dad has mild kidney disease. He is on no medication for it and he just gets checked once a year. But it looks like that is a concern when it comes to underwriting. For being 81 I think he is in good health. A lot of the people that are his age that are still living are way worse off.
What does he have to lose by going through the underwriting process?
I went through this trail and the earlier consensus was that MOO was dishonest in the way they price and sell their plan G. But I am not seeing anything that shows them "close" and open accounts/companies (in other words not seeing this “closed block of business / closed risk pool”).
Has there been any further insights into this practice (MOO or any other Gap offering insurance company)? Thanks
Also, a question on the Loss Ratio - if the ratio is close to 100 (as in claims divided by premium is close 1) is a good thing right? This (in my mind) points to a low overhead, no?
I see MOO's Plan G has this loss ratio: National=83.3, SC=102.71 - does this mean their premiums are not covering the claims? If yes, this doesn't augue well for the premiums
rgs wrote: ↑Mon Sep 30, 2024 8:55 pm
I went through this trail and the earlier consensus was that MOO was dishonest in the way they price and sell their plan G. But I am not seeing anything that shows them "close" and open accounts/companies (in other words not seeing this “closed block of business / closed risk pool”).
Has there been any further insights into this practice (MOO or any other Gap offering insurance company)? Thanks
How are you not seeing it?
You think Mutual of Omaha, Omaha Life, United of Omaha, United World Life and whatever other names they use aren't evidence of what they do?
rgs wrote: ↑Mon Sep 30, 2024 8:55 pm
I went through this trail and the earlier consensus was that MOO was dishonest in the way they price and sell their plan G. But I am not seeing anything that shows them "close" and open accounts/companies (in other words not seeing this “closed block of business / closed risk pool”).
Has there been any further insights into this practice (MOO or any other Gap offering insurance company)? Thanks
How are you not seeing it?
You think Mutual of Omaha, Omaha Life, United of Omaha, United World Life and whatever other names they use aren't evidence of what they do?
Umm... I assumed they are all different legal entities rolling up to a parent company.
rgs wrote: ↑Mon Sep 30, 2024 8:55 pm
I went through this trail and the earlier consensus was that MOO was dishonest in the way they price and sell their plan G. But I am not seeing anything that shows them "close" and open accounts/companies (in other words not seeing this “closed block of business / closed risk pool”).
Has there been any further insights into this practice (MOO or any other Gap offering insurance company)? Thanks
How are you not seeing it?
You think Mutual of Omaha, Omaha Life, United of Omaha, United World Life and whatever other names they use aren't evidence of what they do?
Umm... I assumed they are all different legal entities rolling up to a parent company.
They are exactly that....but, that's how they close one set of business and then open another under a new subsidiary.
rgs wrote: ↑Mon Sep 30, 2024 8:55 pm
I went through this trail and the earlier consensus was that MOO was dishonest in the way they price and sell their plan G. But I am not seeing anything that shows them "close" and open accounts/companies (in other words not seeing this “closed block of business / closed risk pool”).
twh wrote: ↑Mon Sep 30, 2024 9:18 pm
They are exactly that....but, that's how they close one set of business and then open another under a new subsidiary.
You can see it happening by looking at the number of covered lives in one state over 20 years. Don't look at premiums.
All of a sudden, the number of covered lives will start decreasing for the largest subsidiary, and one of the smaller subsidiaries will start growing. After about 5 years, the second subsidiary has become the largest subsidiary. Then the second subsidiary starts shrinking all of a sudden, and a third subsidiary starts growing.
Mutual of Omaha uses four companies in rotation, so the cycle repeats after about 20 years.
rgs wrote: ↑Mon Sep 30, 2024 8:55 pm
I went through this trail and the earlier consensus was that MOO was dishonest in the way they price and sell their plan G. But I am not seeing anything that shows them "close" and open accounts/companies (in other words not seeing this “closed block of business / closed risk pool”).
twh wrote: ↑Mon Sep 30, 2024 9:18 pm
They are exactly that....but, that's how they close one set of business and then open another under a new subsidiary.
You can see it happening by looking at the number of covered lives in one state over 20 years. Don't look at premiums.
All of a sudden, the number of covered lives will start decreasing for the largest subsidiary, and one of the smaller subsidiaries will start growing. After about 5 years, the second subsidiary has become the largest subsidiary. Then the second subsidiary starts shrinking all of a sudden, and a third subsidiary starts growing.
Mutual of Omaha uses four companies in rotation, so the cycle repeats after about 20 years.
Wow, thank you. This is great information, now I am guessing there are other players with a similar playbook (I recall someone mentioned both Cigna & Aetna). Do they do it this brazenly as well?
So what carriers DO NOT do what MOO does? It’s unclear to me that AARP/UHC is truly community rated because of their disappearing discount.
As someone going on Medicare in early 2025, I want the best Plan G for the LONG HAUL. I’m willing to pay more at age 65 for a better record of price stability. Suggestions? I’m in Pennsylvania.
5,749,712 people. About 41% of all supplement holders are in a closed Medigap Plan ... Plan F. No new younger members, closed by law, not an insurance carrier.
orlandoman wrote: ↑Tue Oct 01, 2024 6:49 pm
Closed Medigap Pools In Perspective ...
5,749,712 people. About 41% of all supplement holders are in a closed Medigap Plan ... Plan F. No new younger members, closed by law, not an insurance carrier.
orlandoman wrote: ↑Tue Oct 01, 2024 6:49 pm
Closed Medigap Pools In Perspective ...
5,749,712 people. About 41% of all supplement holders are in a closed Medigap Plan ... Plan F. No new younger members, closed by law, not an insurance carrier.
Would these folks currently in "F" be allowed to switch to other plans without underwriting if they want to?
No, medical underwriting would be required, except for the few states that allow changes each year/birthday. But, nothing specific because it's Plan F.
Leesbro63 wrote: ↑Tue Oct 01, 2024 4:13 pm
So what carriers DO NOT do what MOO does? It’s unclear to me that AARP/UHC is truly community rated because of their disappearing discount.
As someone going on Medicare in early 2025, I want the best Plan G for the LONG HAUL. I’m willing to pay more at age 65 for a better record of price stability. Suggestions? I’m in Pennsylvania.
Leesbro63 wrote: ↑Tue Oct 01, 2024 4:13 pm
So what carriers DO NOT do what MOO does? It’s unclear to me that AARP/UHC is truly community rated because of their disappearing discount.
As someone going on Medicare in early 2025, I want the best Plan G for the LONG HAUL. I’m willing to pay more at age 65 for a better record of price stability. Suggestions? I’m in Pennsylvania.
USAA and State Farm haven't done it.
And would you know if USAA offer their Medigap plans to non-service members?
Any thoughts on Transamerica Plan G (yes, they seem to be offering it in SC), they are "Issued Age" - so any increase in premium will be due to inflation (and they have averaged 3.9% over the past 4 years [2019 - 2024])?
Leesbro63 wrote: ↑Tue Oct 01, 2024 4:13 pm
So what carriers DO NOT do what MOO does? It’s unclear to me that AARP/UHC is truly community rated because of their disappearing discount.
As someone going on Medicare in early 2025, I want the best Plan G for the LONG HAUL. I’m willing to pay more at age 65 for a better record of price stability. Suggestions? I’m in Pennsylvania.
USAA and State Farm haven't done it.
And would you know if USAA offer their Medigap plans to non-service members?
Any thoughts on Transamerica Plan G (yes, they seem to be offering it in SC), they are "Issued Age" - so any increase in premium will be due to inflation (and they have averaged 3.9% over the past 4 years [2019 - 2024])?
2023 new enrollees: Plan G - 53.2%; Plan N - 39.5%
Plan G rate increases 2023-2024:
- greater than 1,000,000 policyholders, 0%-18%
- 400,000 to 1,000,000 policyholders, 7.5%-20%
- 200,000 to 400,000 policyholders, 7.5%-12%
2023 new enrollees: Plan G - 53.2%; Plan N - 39.5%
Plan G rate increases 2023-2024:
- greater than 1,000,000 policyholders, 0%-18%
- 400,000 to 1,000,000 policyholders, 7.5%-20%
- 200,000 to 400,000 policyholders, 7.5%-12%
As someone coming on Medicare in early 2025, it's STILL not clear to me how to pick a Plan G supplement that is best for the LONG TERM, even if the age 65 premium is higher than other plans. There has to be a simple answer. I THINK the answer is UHC/AARP, but it's not totally clear.
Also related to this is the whole "Medicare Agent" thing. This seems to be a cottage industry of small individual advisors, with a small staff. Yeah, I get it that they get paid from "the system" and me, the Medicare enrollee won't pay more to use them. But it's not clear if there's really added value.
2023 new enrollees: Plan G - 53.2%; Plan N - 39.5%
Plan G rate increases 2023-2024:
- greater than 1,000,000 policyholders, 0%-18%
- 400,000 to 1,000,000 policyholders, 7.5%-20%
- 200,000 to 400,000 policyholders, 7.5%-12%
As someone coming on Medicare in early 2025, it's STILL not clear to me how to pick a Plan G supplement that is best for the LONG TERM, even if the age 65 premium is higher than other plans. There has to be a simple answer. I THINK the answer is UHC/AARP, but it's not totally clear.
A simple answer for Medicare pricing? I can hear Don Quixote singing "The Impossible Dream."
In short, those UHC/AARP "discounts" vanish after a couple of years. If they were guaranteed to be the cheapest plan year after year after year, everyone would choose them. In my state, I compared them with Blue Cross, and went with the latter because BC has a huge presence in my state. The first-year costs were almost the same. The 2025 premiums haven't been announced yet as far as I know.
The bottom line is that we are all going to pay more, every year, regardless of which provider we choose. There is no way to predict what your premium will be in the future.
2023 new enrollees: Plan G - 53.2%; Plan N - 39.5%
Plan G rate increases 2023-2024:
- greater than 1,000,000 policyholders, 0%-18%
- 400,000 to 1,000,000 policyholders, 7.5%-20%
- 200,000 to 400,000 policyholders, 7.5%-12%
As someone coming on Medicare in early 2025, it's STILL not clear to me how to pick a Plan G supplement that is best for the LONG TERM, even if the age 65 premium is higher than other plans. There has to be a simple answer. I THINK the answer is UHC/AARP, but it's not totally clear.
Also related to this is the whole "Medicare Agent" thing. This seems to be a cottage industry of small individual advisors, with a small staff. Yeah, I get it that they get paid from "the system" and me, the Medicare enrollee won't pay more to use them. But it's not clear if there's really added value.
No, there is no simple answer. Roll the dice...or move somewhere where you are allowed to change. Don't pick an insurer that blatantly takes advantage of consumers like Mutual of Omaha.
Leesbro63 wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 7:48 am
As someone coming on Medicare in early 2025, it's STILL not clear to me how to pick a Plan G supplement that is best for the LONG TERM, even if the age 65 premium is higher than other plans. There has to be a simple answer. I THINK the answer is UHC/AARP, but it's not totally clear.
Also related to this is the whole "Medicare Agent" thing. This seems to be a cottage industry of small individual advisors, with a small staff. Yeah, I get it that they get paid from "the system" and me, the Medicare enrollee won't pay more to use them. But it's not clear if there's really added value.
I am in the same boat as you and my thoughts are still evolving. My thinking so far on this (file this under FWIW),
I would like to go with either community or issue age pricing BUT in my state, there is one offering of each for Plans G & N. AARP UHC offers the community plan and Transamerica offers the Issue age.
I am not as inclined toward UHC since I see their community plan as a backdoor age attained plan. I got the price increases history from my state SHIP and UHC has had an average of 7.7% increase in the last 4-5 years. At that rate, my premium at age 85 will be $668
I do like the Transamerica plan, not quite sure if they are still offering it or how one goes about getting in touch with them. According to my state DOI they are active in this market. When I search the web, not finding much
I am also thinking of the "new entrants" to this market, companies that are here for the last 3-7 years as I see that as less of a risk of them start the "dead pooling"
For good measure, I also considering Plans N and HD G (my observations above are for Plan G). I don't want to overthink this BUT I feel original Medicare will cover 80% of the expenses regardless of the supplemental plan (anyone, please feel free to correct me) and I don't want to overly twist myself over how to fill this 20% gap
Trying to determine if I should go with G and sign up for the potential larger premium increases down the road (and not to mention the dead pool issue, and this looks (at least) to me as a more of a Plan G issue) or pay the co-pay for the office visits (based on my reading the "excess charge" appears to be bit of a moot issue) and go with Plan N with lesser premium and less of a hike (than G) or Go with Plan HD G, get most benefits of G but pay the $2800 deductibles and benefit from a much smaller premium and hikes. An important point to note that few others have pointed out in this forum, the HD G deductible (which will likely increase over time) is set by Medicare and not by the insurance companies (unlike the premiums)
I am a few months away from needing to make a decision, so like you I am trying to get a head start and navigate this complex world.
Far as the "Medicare agent" thing, my view is that all of the agents will have vested interest in trying to maximize their commissions (but I am not implying that they will steer you toward the wrong plan but this is possible with certain agents). Again FWIW, Fidelity also appears to offer Medicare counseling and I am hoping that their agents are not sales commission incentivized and I will likely talk to them at some point.
2023 new enrollees: Plan G - 53.2%; Plan N - 39.5%
Plan G rate increases 2023-2024:
- greater than 1,000,000 policyholders, 0%-18%
- 400,000 to 1,000,000 policyholders, 7.5%-20%
- 200,000 to 400,000 policyholders, 7.5%-12%
As someone coming on Medicare in early 2025, it's STILL not clear to me how to pick a Plan G supplement that is best for the LONG TERM, even if the age 65 premium is higher than other plans. There has to be a simple answer. I THINK the answer is UHC/AARP, but it's not totally clear.
Also related to this is the whole "Medicare Agent" thing. This seems to be a cottage industry of small individual advisors, with a small staff. Yeah, I get it that they get paid from "the system" and me, the Medicare enrollee won't pay more to use them. But it's not clear if there's really added value.
No, there is no simple answer. Roll the dice...or move somewhere where you are allowed to change. Don't pick an insurer that blatantly takes advantage of consumers like Mutual of Omaha.
That's sort of what I'm asking. Who are those insurers?
Leesbro63 wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 7:48 am
As someone coming on Medicare in early 2025, it's STILL not clear to me how to pick a Plan G supplement that is best for the LONG TERM, even if the age 65 premium is higher than other plans. There has to be a simple answer. I THINK the answer is UHC/AARP, but it's not totally clear.
Also related to this is the whole "Medicare Agent" thing. This seems to be a cottage industry of small individual advisors, with a small staff. Yeah, I get it that they get paid from "the system" and me, the Medicare enrollee won't pay more to use them. But it's not clear if there's really added value.
I am in the same boat as you and my thoughts are still evolving. My thinking so far on this (file this under FWIW),
I would like to go with either community or issue age pricing BUT in my state, there is one offering of each for Plans G & N. AARP UHC offers the community plan and Transamerica offers the Issue age.
I am not as inclined toward UHC since I see their community plan as a backdoor age attained plan. I got the price increases history from my state SHIP and UHC has had an average of 7.7% increase in the last 4-5 years. At that rate, my premium at age 85 will be $668
I do like the Transamerica plan, not quite sure if they are still offering it or how one goes about getting in touch with them. According to my state DOI they are active in this market. When I search the web, not finding much
I am also thinking of the "new entrants" to this market, companies that are here for the last 3-7 years as I see that as less of a risk of them start the "dead pooling"
For good measure, I also considering Plans N and HD G (my observations above are for Plan G). I don't want to overthink this BUT I feel original Medicare will cover 80% of the expenses regardless of the supplemental plan (anyone, please feel free to correct me) and I don't want to overly twist myself over how to fill this 20% gap
Trying to determine if I should go with G and sign up for the potential larger premium increases down the road (and not to mention the dead pool issue, and this looks (at least) to me as a more of a Plan G issue) or pay the co-pay for the office visits (based on my reading the "excess charge" appears to be bit of a moot issue) and go with Plan N with lesser premium and less of a hike (than G) or Go with Plan HD G, get most benefits of G but pay the $2800 deductibles and benefit from a much smaller premium and hikes. An important point to note that few others have pointed out in this forum, the HD G deductible (which will likely increase over time) is set by Medicare and not by the insurance companies (unlike the premiums)
I am a few months away from needing to make a decision, so like you I am trying to get a head start and navigate this complex world.
Far as the "Medicare agent" thing, my view is that all of the agents will have vested interest in trying to maximize their commissions (but I am not implying that they will steer you toward the wrong plan but this is possible with certain agents). Again FWIW, Fidelity also appears to offer Medicare counseling and I am hoping that their agents are not sales commission incentivized and I will likely talk to them at some point.
Thank you for this reply. It's good to connect with someone in a similar situation. Feel free to private message me if you want to compare notes more extensively.
Fidelity Brokerage offers Medicare counseling???? Wow. Now that's something I'm interested in...I am a Fido customer.
I dunno about Plans N and Plan HD G. I am usually very value conscious, but I think healthcare I'd feel better buying an all-you-can-eat Plan G.
Leesbro63 wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 9:32 am
Thank you for this reply. It's good to connect with someone in a similar situation. Feel free to private message me if you want to compare notes more extensively.
Fidelity Brokerage offers Medicare counseling???? Wow. Now that's something I'm interested in...I am a Fido customer.
I dunno about Plans N and Plan HD G. I am usually very value conscious, but I think healthcare I'd feel better buying an all-you-can-eat Plan G.
Leesbro63 wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 9:32 am
Thank you for this reply. It's good to connect with someone in a similar situation. Feel free to private message me if you want to compare notes more extensively.
Fidelity Brokerage offers Medicare counseling???? Wow. Now that's something I'm interested in...I am a Fido customer.
I dunno about Plans N and Plan HD G. I am usually very value conscious, but I think healthcare I'd feel better buying an all-you-can-eat Plan G.
jim779 wrote: ↑Sat Oct 05, 2024 8:26 am
When I called MOO they flat out told me that the G plan my Dad has is closed and the price you see online is for new customers on the new plan G.
So yes they definitely close pools.
I didn't even think this would be legal to do this.
Some of the State Insurance Commissioners are very strict on playing the closed pool game, some are not.
Leesbro63 wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 9:32 am
Thank you for this reply. It's good to connect with someone in a similar situation. Feel free to private message me if you want to compare notes more extensively.
Fidelity Brokerage offers Medicare counseling???? Wow. Now that's something I'm interested in...I am a Fido customer.
I dunno about Plans N and Plan HD G. I am usually very value conscious, but I think healthcare I'd feel better buying an all-you-can-eat Plan G.
Addendum:
Just spoke to Fidelity and they just work with 4 carriers in my state and I think all 4 indulge in this "dead pooling"
Cigna
Humana
MOO
UHC
UHC has 2 plans in my state and I suspect that this is the "dead pooling"
AARP Medicare Supplement Insurance Plans, Insured By United Healthcare Insurance Company Of America with a premium of $140.75 and
AARP Medicare Supplement Plans, Insured By Unitedhealthcare with a premium of $156.14
In my State Cigna and MOO are the worst offenders of "dead pooling"; MOO seems to roll out a new pool about every 4 years or so. UHC began offering a 2nd plan in my State about 5 years ago at a lower cost which does not include some of the extras their flagship plan offers. This is not dead pooling; both UHC pools are very active. UHC represents about 40% of all Medigap Supplemental insurance sold in my State.
Got it...you might want to run though the online one, just yourself, with his details to see what the outcome is going to be.