Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

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mpnret
Posts: 688
Joined: Sun May 20, 2018 9:16 am

Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by mpnret »

Eno Deb wrote: Mon May 13, 2024 9:58 pm
TravellingTechOnFire wrote: Mon May 13, 2024 5:12 pm
Eno Deb wrote: Sun May 12, 2024 8:25 pm
TravellingTechOnFire wrote: Sun May 12, 2024 8:14 pmSo we agree they can charge plenty overnight.
No, we don't agree. Charging from a 120V outlet is at best a stopgap. I speak from experience.
OK, then it seems you aren't basing this on the OP's needs. OP stated he drive 150 miles/week. A Tesla has ~300 miles of range, and he can charge 40-60 miles/night on level 1.
Charging 60 miles on L1 would take about 20 hours. Long night.
Only takes me about 8 hours for 60 miles. Model 3, L1
ThankYouJack
Posts: 5892
Joined: Wed Oct 08, 2014 7:27 pm

Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by ThankYouJack »

mpnret wrote: Mon May 13, 2024 11:52 pm
Eno Deb wrote: Mon May 13, 2024 9:58 pm
TravellingTechOnFire wrote: Mon May 13, 2024 5:12 pm
Eno Deb wrote: Sun May 12, 2024 8:25 pm
TravellingTechOnFire wrote: Sun May 12, 2024 8:14 pmSo we agree they can charge plenty overnight.
No, we don't agree. Charging from a 120V outlet is at best a stopgap. I speak from experience.
OK, then it seems you aren't basing this on the OP's needs. OP stated he drive 150 miles/week. A Tesla has ~300 miles of range, and he can charge 40-60 miles/night on level 1.
Charging 60 miles on L1 would take about 20 hours. Long night.
Only takes me about 8 hours for 60 miles. Model 3, L1
I get about 5.5 mi/hr with my MY so only takes me about 11 hours. And I'm using a 5-15 adapter charging at 12amps to boot. I could get the 6-15 adapter (just $35) and cut the time significantly but haven't found the need.
TravellingTechOnFire
Posts: 451
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Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by TravellingTechOnFire »

Eno Deb wrote: Mon May 13, 2024 9:58 pm
TravellingTechOnFire wrote: Mon May 13, 2024 5:12 pm
Eno Deb wrote: Sun May 12, 2024 8:25 pm
TravellingTechOnFire wrote: Sun May 12, 2024 8:14 pmSo we agree they can charge plenty overnight.
No, we don't agree. Charging from a 120V outlet is at best a stopgap. I speak from experience.
OK, then it seems you aren't basing this on the OP's needs. OP stated he drive 150 miles/week. A Tesla has ~300 miles of range, and he can charge 40-60 miles/night on level 1.
Charging 60 miles on L1 would take about 20 hours. Long night.
Here's some math for you.

3-4 mi/kWh is typical for Tesla M3 or MY. L1 charging on the low side of 1200 watts(10 amps x 110volts). This assumes some charging loss, low voltage, etc. So again, conservative. 1.2kW x 12 hours = 14kW. At the low rate of 3 mi/kWh, thats 42 miles of range. With more typical efficiency of 4 mi/kWh, thats 56 miles of range. I've been using 40-60 miles/night which is pretty accurate. If you are trying to win an argument on the internet, it's not working.

Do you have factual, useful input that can help the OP or contribute to the discussion productively?
ThankYouJack
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Joined: Wed Oct 08, 2014 7:27 pm

Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by ThankYouJack »

zie wrote: Mon May 13, 2024 2:31 pm
ThankYouJack wrote: Mon May 13, 2024 8:54 am
zie wrote: Mon May 13, 2024 8:21 am
110V charging works, but like you mentioned, you want a fair bit of downtime between large uses of the vehicle and be in a mild climate(in cold climates it's possible all the 110V electricity is being used up just trying to keep the battery warm, so no charging can occur).
How cold? It gets down to the teens (or lower) where I am and charging on my 110v works fine. My car is kept in my garage, maybe it wouldn't work as well if I charged outside in the teens.
Unfortunately I don't have any study or anything to point to, so I don't know at what point the temps really play havoc on charging.
I wonder if a lot of it is overhyped in the news and on social media as I've never had any issues charging @ 12a. Assuming one's garage is above freezing temps, I'm guessing it would be fine.
Eno Deb
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Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by Eno Deb »

TravellingTechOnFire wrote: Tue May 14, 2024 7:07 amHere's some math for you.

3-4 mi/kWh is typical for Tesla M3 or MY. L1 charging on the low side of 1200 watts(10 amps x 110volts). This assumes some charging loss, low voltage, etc. So again, conservative. 1.2kW x 12 hours = 14kW. At the low rate of 3 mi/kWh, thats 42 miles of range. With more typical efficiency of 4 mi/kWh, thats 56 miles of range. I've been using 40-60 miles/night which is pretty accurate. If you are trying to win an argument on the internet, it's not working.

Do you have factual, useful input that can help the OP or contribute to the discussion productively?
https://shop.tesla.com/product/gen-2-nema-adapters

I'm starting to think you've never actually used a Tesla.
dsmclone
Posts: 671
Joined: Fri Oct 25, 2013 8:50 am

Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by dsmclone »

I've learned to take zero advice on EV's from people that have never owned an EV. Before buying an EV, reddit non EV owners got me all concerned about things that I shouldn't worry about and not worry about things that I should be worry about. After a year of owning one, it usually only takes a couple of sentences before I can tell if the person has actually owned an EV.

Just like I wouldn't take advice on buying an RV from a person that's only owned a minivan.
ilovemoney72688
Posts: 5
Joined: Sun Apr 23, 2023 3:14 pm

Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by ilovemoney72688 »

I strongly encourage you to check out a lightly used Model 3 if you don't qualify for the tax credit. Some amazing deals out there compared to MSRP. I found a 2023 Model 3 RWD near me for $30K with 13K miles and I don't doubt that would be hard to beat. If you go down to 2021 or 2022 you can cut off another $5-10K.
Normchad
Posts: 5931
Joined: Thu Mar 03, 2011 6:20 am

Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by Normchad »

dsmclone wrote: Tue May 14, 2024 8:31 am I've learned to take zero advice on EV's from people that have never owned an EV. Before buying an EV, reddit non EV owners got me all concerned about things that I shouldn't worry about and not worry about things that I should be worry about. After a year of owning one, it usually only takes a couple of sentences before I can tell if the person has actually owned an EV.

Just like I wouldn't take advice on buying an RV from a person that's only owned a minivan.
+1.
FubaruSorester
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Location: Fort Collins, CO

Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by FubaruSorester »

I think it ultimately depends on your driving needs. If you need something that is for all intents and purposes a "commuter" vehicle the Tesla makes a lot of sense. However, if you plan on doing trips that would require multiple charges the Honda or another sedan would probably be better.
Tundrama
Posts: 252
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Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by Tundrama »

shriram wrote: Sun May 12, 2024 5:51 pm Hi,

We have been a long term Honda users (10+ years) and in the market to replace our current car (Honda Civic). We are currently considering following options,

* Honda Accord EX (MSRP: $31K)
* Honda Sports Hybrid (MSRP: $34K)
* Tesla Model 3 (MSRP: $39K)

Here are some pros and cons that we have thought about,

* While Honda Accord EX has lower upfront cost, we still need to pay for gas (which is expensive in California). We will typically drive the car for about 150 miles a week (rough estimate).
* We won't be able to benefit from federal tax break on Tesla (due to income restriction). So any savings for buying Tesla will come from not having to pay for gas. We won't be able to charge the car at home (as we need electric panel upgrade for ~$8K + no solar at home). But our employers do provide free electric charging stations.
* The cost of auto insurance is expected to be - Honda Accord EX <= Honda Sports Hybrid < Tesla Model 3
* The cost of auto maintenance is expected to be - Honda Accord EX <= Honda Sports Hybrid < Tesla Model 3
* Although we have excellent credit rating, we will likely pay cash for the car. Here are the auto loan rates for reference,
** Honda accord: 3.9% for 36 months
** Tesla Model 3: 6.5% for 36 months
* The trade-in value for the current car is ~ 8K (based on KBB as well as CARMAX quote).
* We plan to hold on to the car for long time (at least 10 years).


What we like about Honda Accord?

* Well known brand (for reliable cars)
* The car tends to not depreciate quickly.

What we don't like about Honda Accord?

* Nothing specific, we have been pretty satisfied with our previous Honda cars.


What we like about Tesla Model 3?

* Electric car (something new to try out)
* Powerful car (nice acceleration)
* Don't have to pay for the gas on regular basis.

What we don't like about Tesla Model 3?

* Higher maintenance/insurance cost.
* Faster depreciation (at least compared with Honda Accord)
* Completely different way to operate the car (e.g. everything is controlled via the touchscreen display)

Here are the questions that we have

* Any thoughts about Accord EX vs Sports Hybrid ? Are there any limitations in the Accord Hybrid model that we should be aware of (and favor EX model instead) ?
* Given the cost difference between Accord Sports Hybrid and Tesla Model 3 is not much, would it make sense to go for a Hybrid car at this point ? Or should we go for electric car at this point ?
* Are there any other electric cars that you would recommend ? Our budget is ~$40K max (just the MSRP).
…my son smokes the best tasting ribs we’ve ever eaten. Because of this, his in laws, wife and me, etc., always request he smoke his ribs for any event. You’d think we’d get sick of them…birthdays, Mother’s Day, New Years, you name it….ribs, ribs, ribs.

Honda Accord EX = my son’s smoked ribs.

I know nothing about the Tesla. However, the Honda Accord is typically only replaced due to boredom of color, haha.
dsmclone
Posts: 671
Joined: Fri Oct 25, 2013 8:50 am

Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by dsmclone »

Tundrama wrote: Tue May 14, 2024 10:20 am
shriram wrote: Sun May 12, 2024 5:51 pm Hi,

We have been a long term Honda users (10+ years) and in the market to replace our current car (Honda Civic). We are currently considering following options,

* Honda Accord EX (MSRP: $31K)
* Honda Sports Hybrid (MSRP: $34K)
* Tesla Model 3 (MSRP: $39K)

Here are some pros and cons that we have thought about,

* While Honda Accord EX has lower upfront cost, we still need to pay for gas (which is expensive in California). We will typically drive the car for about 150 miles a week (rough estimate).
* We won't be able to benefit from federal tax break on Tesla (due to income restriction). So any savings for buying Tesla will come from not having to pay for gas. We won't be able to charge the car at home (as we need electric panel upgrade for ~$8K + no solar at home). But our employers do provide free electric charging stations.
* The cost of auto insurance is expected to be - Honda Accord EX <= Honda Sports Hybrid < Tesla Model 3
* The cost of auto maintenance is expected to be - Honda Accord EX <= Honda Sports Hybrid < Tesla Model 3
* Although we have excellent credit rating, we will likely pay cash for the car. Here are the auto loan rates for reference,
** Honda accord: 3.9% for 36 months
** Tesla Model 3: 6.5% for 36 months
* The trade-in value for the current car is ~ 8K (based on KBB as well as CARMAX quote).
* We plan to hold on to the car for long time (at least 10 years).


What we like about Honda Accord?

* Well known brand (for reliable cars)
* The car tends to not depreciate quickly.

What we don't like about Honda Accord?

* Nothing specific, we have been pretty satisfied with our previous Honda cars.


What we like about Tesla Model 3?

* Electric car (something new to try out)
* Powerful car (nice acceleration)
* Don't have to pay for the gas on regular basis.

What we don't like about Tesla Model 3?

* Higher maintenance/insurance cost.
* Faster depreciation (at least compared with Honda Accord)
* Completely different way to operate the car (e.g. everything is controlled via the touchscreen display)

Here are the questions that we have

* Any thoughts about Accord EX vs Sports Hybrid ? Are there any limitations in the Accord Hybrid model that we should be aware of (and favor EX model instead) ?
* Given the cost difference between Accord Sports Hybrid and Tesla Model 3 is not much, would it make sense to go for a Hybrid car at this point ? Or should we go for electric car at this point ?
* Are there any other electric cars that you would recommend ? Our budget is ~$40K max (just the MSRP).
…my son smokes the best tasting ribs we’ve ever eaten. Because of this, his in laws, wife and me, etc., always request he smoke his ribs for any event. You’d think we’d get sick of them…birthdays, Mother’s Day, New Years, you name it….ribs, ribs, ribs.

Honda Accord EX = my son’s smoked ribs.

I know nothing about the Tesla. However, the Honda Accord is typically only replaced due to boredom of color, haha.
That's a good analogy and if I had only had ribs in my life, then having ribs again would be the answer. Fortunately for me, I tried brisket, and now ribs just seem kind of blah
cmr79
Posts: 1441
Joined: Mon Dec 02, 2013 3:25 pm

Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by cmr79 »

Eno Deb wrote: Mon May 13, 2024 9:58 pm
TravellingTechOnFire wrote: Mon May 13, 2024 5:12 pm
Eno Deb wrote: Sun May 12, 2024 8:25 pm
TravellingTechOnFire wrote: Sun May 12, 2024 8:14 pmSo we agree they can charge plenty overnight.
No, we don't agree. Charging from a 120V outlet is at best a stopgap. I speak from experience.
OK, then it seems you aren't basing this on the OP's needs. OP stated he drive 150 miles/week. A Tesla has ~300 miles of range, and he can charge 40-60 miles/night on level 1.
Charging 60 miles on L1 would take about 20 hours. Long night.
Or 10 hours, if you use Tesla's estimates of 6 miles per hour on a 5-15 120V/15A outlet, which others who have posted above seem to corroborate.
https://www.tesla.com/support/charging/mobile-connector

For a vehicle that gets 4-5 miles per kWh to add under 3 miles per hour of charging while drawing 1.4 kW from the wall, about 50% of the electricity would have to do something other than charge the battery. Certainly possible in a very cold climate if charging a cold battery outdoors, but also certainly not typical.
cmr79
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Joined: Mon Dec 02, 2013 3:25 pm

Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by cmr79 »

Eno Deb wrote: Tue May 14, 2024 7:59 am
TravellingTechOnFire wrote: Tue May 14, 2024 7:07 amHere's some math for you.

3-4 mi/kWh is typical for Tesla M3 or MY. L1 charging on the low side of 1200 watts(10 amps x 110volts). This assumes some charging loss, low voltage, etc. So again, conservative. 1.2kW x 12 hours = 14kW. At the low rate of 3 mi/kWh, thats 42 miles of range. With more typical efficiency of 4 mi/kWh, thats 56 miles of range. I've been using 40-60 miles/night which is pretty accurate. If you are trying to win an argument on the internet, it's not working.

Do you have factual, useful input that can help the OP or contribute to the discussion productively?
https://shop.tesla.com/product/gen-2-nema-adapters

I'm starting to think you've never actually used a Tesla.
I think this is another example of Tesla's poor marketing practices trying to push people to install a wall connector, as it says explicitly on this page, given that these estimates conflict with their own technical specs that I posted above.
billaster
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Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by billaster »

cmr79 wrote: Tue May 14, 2024 10:56 am Or 10 hours, if you use Tesla's estimates of 6 miles per hour on a 5-15 120V/15A outlet, which others who have posted above seem to corroborate.
https://www.tesla.com/support/charging/mobile-connector
Well, those numbers are rather, optimistic, shall we say, which is typical of Tesla. They assume both 100% charging efficiency and 4.2 miles per kwh which is higher than the EPA test ratings. I suppose it depends on ideal weather and your driving habits if you can routinely get 4.2 miles per kwh.
mpnret
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Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by mpnret »

billaster wrote: Tue May 14, 2024 11:27 am
cmr79 wrote: Tue May 14, 2024 10:56 am Or 10 hours, if you use Tesla's estimates of 6 miles per hour on a 5-15 120V/15A outlet, which others who have posted above seem to corroborate.
https://www.tesla.com/support/charging/mobile-connector
Well, those numbers are rather, optimistic, shall we say, which is typical of Tesla. They assume both 100% charging efficiency and 4.2 miles per kwh which is higher than the EPA test ratings. I suppose it depends on ideal weather and your driving habits if you can routinely get 4.2 miles per kwh.
Doesn't sound optimistic to me. I was getting 6 miles per hour before switching to a 120V/20A outlet which provides 8 miles per hour.
cmr79
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Joined: Mon Dec 02, 2013 3:25 pm

Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by cmr79 »

billaster wrote: Tue May 14, 2024 11:27 am
cmr79 wrote: Tue May 14, 2024 10:56 am Or 10 hours, if you use Tesla's estimates of 6 miles per hour on a 5-15 120V/15A outlet, which others who have posted above seem to corroborate.
https://www.tesla.com/support/charging/mobile-connector
Well, those numbers are rather, optimistic, shall we say, which is typical of Tesla. They assume both 100% charging efficiency and 4.2 miles per kwh which is higher than the EPA test ratings. I suppose it depends on ideal weather and your driving habits if you can routinely get 4.2 miles per kwh.
On third party 70 mph highway range tests, the Model 3 RWD gets around 4.5 miles/kWh and the Model 3 LR gets 4.3 miles/kWh. I've seen charging efficiency data for level 1 (least efficient) of 75-90% for Teslas, though I'm sure that doesn't apply to subzero outdoor temps on a cold battery. In any case, 75% charging efficiency on level 1 at 4.3 miles per kWh vehicle efficiency would still mean 4.6 miles added per hour charging. My significantly less efficient non-Tesla EV on a converted ICE platform adds more than 3 miles per charging hour, so I'm pretty sure one of the most efficient EVs on a dedicated platform will do better.

Drive like a maniac, of course, and the potential efficiency numbers will never apply to you regardless of whether you're in an EV, ICE or hybrid.
Eno Deb
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Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by Eno Deb »

mpnret wrote: Tue May 14, 2024 11:44 amDoesn't sound optimistic to me. I was getting 6 miles per hour before switching to a 120V/20A outlet which provides 8 miles per hour.
Did you actually measure this or just relied on what the app displays? I did some measurements when I only had L1 and 3 miles/hour was pretty much what I was getting (in mild northern CA weather). L1 charging is inefficient to start with (just the AC/DC conversion costs around 20%), and in a Tesla you have the onboard computer and thermal management pump always running while charging, which probably consume a couple hundred watts or so. If you have low or high temperatures, more power may be required to heat/cool the battery.

Another aspect that people forget is that you may not have 12 hours to charge unless you want to pay extortionist peak rates to your electric company. For example, with PG&E's EV plan, the off-peak period starts at midnight, so if you want to leave at 8am you only have 8 hours, otherwise you pay something like $0.60/kWh. And of course you always want some reserve for spontaneous trips other than your commute without having to constantly think about charging.
cmr79
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Joined: Mon Dec 02, 2013 3:25 pm

Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by cmr79 »

Eno Deb wrote: Tue May 14, 2024 1:36 pm
mpnret wrote: Tue May 14, 2024 11:44 amDoesn't sound optimistic to me. I was getting 6 miles per hour before switching to a 120V/20A outlet which provides 8 miles per hour.
Did you actually measure this or just relied on what the app displays? I did some measurements when I only had L1 and 3 miles/hour was pretty much what I was getting (in mild northern CA weather). L1 charging is inefficient to start with (just the AC/DC conversion costs around 20%), and in a Tesla you have the onboard computer and thermal management pump always running while charging, which probably consume a couple hundred watts or so. If you have low or high temperatures, more power may be required to heat/cool the battery.

Another aspect that people forget is that you may not have 12 hours to charge unless you want to pay extortionist peak rates to your electric company. For example, with PG&E's EV plan, the off-peak period starts at midnight, so if you want to leave at 8am you only have 8 hours, otherwise you pay something like $0.60/kWh. And of course you always want some reserve for spontaneous trips other than your commute without having to constantly think about charging.
If they plug in for 10 hours and get 60 additional miles on the display, why would they need to know anything else (assuming the estimated mileage is reasonably accurate for their driving style, of course)?

Arguing that charging with level 1 might not allow electricity rate arbitrage as effectively is certainly valid, but it's a far cry from claiming that it can't work particularly for someone for whom installing level 2 charging might require an expensive service upgrade. The $8k that OP quoted as cost buys a lot of kWh even at peak rates.
Joe3zz
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Joined: Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:54 am

Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by Joe3zz »

Dual Tesla household-as others here say, don’t do it if you can’t install level 2 charging at home. The $8 would be a deal breaker.
Joe3zz
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Joined: Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:54 am

Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by Joe3zz »

Dual Tesla household-as others here say, don’t do it if you can’t install level 2 charging at home. The $8 would be a deal breaker.
mark_in_denver
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Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by mark_in_denver »

If you got to leave somewhere but your EV is trickle charging, that's an issue. Just get one of the Accords, you can't go wrong. You would be spending a whole thousand bucks a year for gas, is that's really something to worry about?
KyleAAA
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Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by KyleAAA »

My take is Tesla has a lot of cool tech but they tend not to be particularly good at being cars that are pleasant to drive. The interiors on even their high end models border on outright bad IMO. The acceleration sure is fun, though. I don't think range or charging concerns hold much validity for the majority of people living near a major city.
teCh0010
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Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by teCh0010 »

KyleAAA wrote: Tue May 14, 2024 4:58 pm My take is Tesla has a lot of cool tech but they tend not to be particularly good at being cars that are pleasant to drive. The interiors on even their high end models border on outright bad IMO. The acceleration sure is fun, though. I don't think range or charging concerns hold much validity for the majority of people living near a major city.
I have a 23 Model 3. It’s pretty fun to drive. The interior isn’t Volvo level, but it is on par with a Honda EXL.

The 2014 Model S I had the interior was terrible, it is significantly improved since those days.
User avatar
StewedCarrot
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Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by StewedCarrot »

dsmclone wrote: Tue May 14, 2024 8:31 am I've learned to take zero advice on EV's from people that have never owned an EV. Before buying an EV, reddit non EV owners got me all concerned about things that I shouldn't worry about and not worry about things that I should be worry about. After a year of owning one, it usually only takes a couple of sentences before I can tell if the person has actually owned an EV.

Just like I wouldn't take advice on buying an RV from a person that's only owned a minivan.
This OP. This.
KyleAAA
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Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by KyleAAA »

teCh0010 wrote: Tue May 14, 2024 5:12 pm
KyleAAA wrote: Tue May 14, 2024 4:58 pm My take is Tesla has a lot of cool tech but they tend not to be particularly good at being cars that are pleasant to drive. The interiors on even their high end models border on outright bad IMO. The acceleration sure is fun, though. I don't think range or charging concerns hold much validity for the majority of people living near a major city.
I have a 23 Model 3. It’s pretty fun to drive. The interior isn’t Volvo level, but it is on par with a Honda EXL.

The 2014 Model S I had the interior was terrible, it is significantly improved since those days.

Improved, yes. But still inferior to the interiors of cars costing half as much. IMO Tesla has a big advantage in range and the supercharger network. They've fallen behind in almost everything else. Especially the S.
dsmclone
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Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by dsmclone »

KyleAAA wrote: Tue May 14, 2024 5:58 pm
teCh0010 wrote: Tue May 14, 2024 5:12 pm
KyleAAA wrote: Tue May 14, 2024 4:58 pm My take is Tesla has a lot of cool tech but they tend not to be particularly good at being cars that are pleasant to drive. The interiors on even their high end models border on outright bad IMO. The acceleration sure is fun, though. I don't think range or charging concerns hold much validity for the majority of people living near a major city.
I have a 23 Model 3. It’s pretty fun to drive. The interior isn’t Volvo level, but it is on par with a Honda EXL.

The 2014 Model S I had the interior was terrible, it is significantly improved since those days.

Improved, yes. But still inferior to the interiors of cars costing half as much. IMO Tesla has a big advantage in range and the supercharger network. They've fallen behind in almost everything else. Especially the S.
I think a lot of people think the Tesla interior is inferior because it's different.
My buddy just bought a 2024 Honda CRV Touring, which is similarly priced to a Model Y. It's a nice interior, not luxurious but nice. Now lets compare the two.

Seats-The seats in the Tesla are some of the best I've ever sat in and I've owned a lot of luxury cars. I've had ones with better adjustability, but they still didn't feel as good. Also, what Tesla uses for material is incredibly durable. With my other vehicles, I always played the game of constantly cleaning/treating them with Lexol but they would always wear on the entry side, some a lot worse than others. I'm not getting that with the WHITE fake leather in the Tesla. Also, to clean them all you use is baby wipes. I'm assuming the CRV seats will hold up the same as every other Honda/Acura that I've owned in the past. Neither has cooled seats but the new Model 3 does so I'm guessing the next Model Y will as well.

Climate Control-In both cars, you set it to the temp you want and it adjusts accordingly. The tesla kind of hides the vents by just blending them into the dash, I prefer this design. The CRV is going with some honeycomb look. This is more of a matter of taste. If you want to change the temp on the tesla you hit and up/down arrow on the screen.

Music/Sound-Not close, the tesla has a great sound system

Display-The Tesla has a 15.4" screen and the CRV has a 9" screen

Both have wireless phone chargers

CRV has both Android Auto and Android Auto wireless capability. The Tesla software is a lot better/robust but a lot more complex for most users.

The CRV has a gear shifter. Apparently this is a big deal to a lot of people. Not sure why....Maybe they feel like they are playing GT8 when they shift it from D to S? Luxury cars are getting rid of the shifter so, I'm guessing this is the future. For the tesla you user the right stalk. Up is reverse and down is drive. This same stalk is used for other purposes once you're actually driving.

Buttons/knobs-If you consider buttons/knobs to be a luxury item, you're going to hate the Tesla. The CRV for sure has a lot more buttons to push.

Heated seats and steering wheel. Both have them. I don't believe the CRV has rear heated though, the Model Y does. Another big thing for those that live in siberia, the heated seats/steering wheel are freaky quick to get warm. I would say within 15 seconds, I can feel the heat, which was shocking to me.

The CRV has nice push button start. In the tesla you don't need to push a start button, it's always ready. Same for when you're done. Just put it in park and walk away. I like the door handles on the CRV better.

Moonroof-The CRV has a small one that opens. The Tesla has a gigantic one that doesn't open

Instrument cluster-This is probably the biggest controversy. The CRV has one in front of the steering wheel, the Tesla has the same info on it's massive screen to your right. You get used to it on the Tesla but my preference would be for an HUD that just showed the speed and nothing else. The CRV doesn't have HUD but you can configure the cluster to your liking, which is nice.

USB's-They both have a bunch. Not an issue for either.

Dog Mode-Tesla has it, others don't.

Glove Box-In typical Tesla fashion, you have to go to the display to open the glove box. Or say "open glovebox". This brings me to another point, you can do about anything through voice. Change temp, open hood/trunk, drive to ***, seat heaters, enter bio defense mode, etc.

The Model S, yes it needs to be updated.
Pdxnative
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Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by Pdxnative »

mark_in_denver wrote: Tue May 14, 2024 4:44 pm If you got to leave somewhere but your EV is trickle charging, that's an issue. Just get one of the Accords, you can't go wrong. You would be spending a whole thousand bucks a year for gas, is that's really something to worry about?
Why is it an issue? OP drives 150 miles per week. Level 1 charging every night would mean the battery never has less than 200+ miles of range even at its lowest point.

Plenty of people rely on level 1 charging with no issues. Driving 20 miles per day means level one will recharge the car completely while the OP is sleeping, even under the most restrictive time of use rate plan. Level 2 with that driving pattern would be a nice luxury but is not necessary.

Public charging, if needed, is not the hellscape non-EV owners make it out to be either. I have a lot of experience with public charging in various regions and if things were as bad as the internet says I would have encountered some of these problems. I haven’t.
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Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by teCh0010 »

dsmclone wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 10:37 am
KyleAAA wrote: Tue May 14, 2024 5:58 pm
teCh0010 wrote: Tue May 14, 2024 5:12 pm
KyleAAA wrote: Tue May 14, 2024 4:58 pm My take is Tesla has a lot of cool tech but they tend not to be particularly good at being cars that are pleasant to drive. The interiors on even their high end models border on outright bad IMO. The acceleration sure is fun, though. I don't think range or charging concerns hold much validity for the majority of people living near a major city.
I have a 23 Model 3. It’s pretty fun to drive. The interior isn’t Volvo level, but it is on par with a Honda EXL.

The 2014 Model S I had the interior was terrible, it is significantly improved since those days.

Improved, yes. But still inferior to the interiors of cars costing half as much. IMO Tesla has a big advantage in range and the supercharger network. They've fallen behind in almost everything else. Especially the S.
I think a lot of people think the Tesla interior is inferior because it's different.
My buddy just bought a 2024 Honda CRV Touring, which is similarly priced to a Model Y. It's a nice interior, not luxurious but nice. Now lets compare the two.

Seats-The seats in the Tesla are some of the best I've ever sat in and I've owned a lot of luxury cars. I've had ones with better adjustability, but they still didn't feel as good. Also, what Tesla uses for material is incredibly durable. With my other vehicles, I always played the game of constantly cleaning/treating them with Lexol but they would always wear on the entry side, some a lot worse than others. I'm not getting that with the WHITE fake leather in the Tesla. Also, to clean them all you use is baby wipes. I'm assuming the CRV seats will hold up the same as every other Honda/Acura that I've owned in the past. Neither has cooled seats but the new Model 3 does so I'm guessing the next Model Y will as well.

Climate Control-In both cars, you set it to the temp you want and it adjusts accordingly. The tesla kind of hides the vents by just blending them into the dash, I prefer this design. The CRV is going with some honeycomb look. This is more of a matter of taste. If you want to change the temp on the tesla you hit and up/down arrow on the screen.

Music/Sound-Not close, the tesla has a great sound system

Display-The Tesla has a 15.4" screen and the CRV has a 9" screen

Both have wireless phone chargers

CRV has both Android Auto and Android Auto wireless capability. The Tesla software is a lot better/robust but a lot more complex for most users.

The CRV has a gear shifter. Apparently this is a big deal to a lot of people. Not sure why....Maybe they feel like they are playing GT8 when they shift it from D to S? Luxury cars are getting rid of the shifter so, I'm guessing this is the future. For the tesla you user the right stalk. Up is reverse and down is drive. This same stalk is used for other purposes once you're actually driving.

Buttons/knobs-If you consider buttons/knobs to be a luxury item, you're going to hate the Tesla. The CRV for sure has a lot more buttons to push.

Heated seats and steering wheel. Both have them. I don't believe the CRV has rear heated though, the Model Y does. Another big thing for those that live in siberia, the heated seats/steering wheel are freaky quick to get warm. I would say within 15 seconds, I can feel the heat, which was shocking to me.

The CRV has nice push button start. In the tesla you don't need to push a start button, it's always ready. Same for when you're done. Just put it in park and walk away. I like the door handles on the CRV better.

Moonroof-The CRV has a small one that opens. The Tesla has a gigantic one that doesn't open

Instrument cluster-This is probably the biggest controversy. The CRV has one in front of the steering wheel, the Tesla has the same info on it's massive screen to your right. You get used to it on the Tesla but my preference would be for an HUD that just showed the speed and nothing else. The CRV doesn't have HUD but you can configure the cluster to your liking, which is nice.

USB's-They both have a bunch. Not an issue for either.

Dog Mode-Tesla has it, others don't.

Glove Box-In typical Tesla fashion, you have to go to the display to open the glove box. Or say "open glovebox". This brings me to another point, you can do about anything through voice. Change temp, open hood/trunk, drive to ***, seat heaters, enter bio defense mode, etc.

The Model S, yes it needs to be updated.
They make aftermarket HUDs for the Y/3 but I got used to the center screen in a weekend and it became a non issue.
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Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by vfinx »

I actually find that my impression of Teslas has become stale, since it was based on test drives from their sales centers a few years ago. Having recently ridden in newer models, I found things have improved a lot. It no longer feels like a tin can from a noise perspective, the suspension was much more comfortable, and the interior felt nice. Hitched a ride in a 3-month-old Model Y just a few days ago, and it was quite pleasant. Normally I dread having to ride in any Tesla. Really hoping I can try a Model 3 Highland sometime.

I was not able to consider a 3/Y for our recent EV purchase since the primary driver considers a birds eye view and HUD must-haves, but were it not for that, I definitely would have short-listed it. I think the lack of periodic major visual refreshes harms Tesla in this regard. If you hop into a Uber of a 2018 Tesla it will leave a terrible and inaccurate impression.
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Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by KyleAAA »

dsmclone wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 10:37 am I think a lot of people think the Tesla interior is inferior because it's different.
Maybe some people think it's inferior because it's different. I don't. I think it's inferior because it is, in fact, inferior. I am not basing this on older models, but on the newest models coming out of the factory within the last 6 months. If you prefer it, that's fine. But IMO it doesn't hold a candle to similarly priced competitors. And that's the 3. The S and Y are both much worse at this point. Maybe the rumored 2025 refresh of the Y will remedy this, but as of now it's a dealbreaker for me.
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Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by cmr79 »

KyleAAA wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 1:15 pm
dsmclone wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 10:37 am I think a lot of people think the Tesla interior is inferior because it's different.
Maybe some people think it's inferior because it's different. I don't. I think it's inferior because it is, in fact, inferior. I am not basing this on older models, but on the newest models coming out of the factory within the last 6 months. If you prefer it, that's fine. But IMO it doesn't hold a candle to similarly priced competitors. And that's the 3. The S and Y are both much worse at this point. Maybe the rumored 2025 refresh of the Y will remedy this, but as of now it's a dealbreaker for me.
Speaking as someone who purchased a different EV over a Tesla primarily because we perceived the interior quality to overall be better on the non-Tesla, I personally don't disagree with the general gist of your opinion. I think you are hyperbolizing this beyond reason, though. With the tax credits, a vehicle would be <$20k to be half the cost of a Model Y or Model 3. I would take either Tesla 100% of the time over a Nissan Versa.
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Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by KyleAAA »

cmr79 wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 2:32 pm
KyleAAA wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 1:15 pm
dsmclone wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 10:37 am I think a lot of people think the Tesla interior is inferior because it's different.
Maybe some people think it's inferior because it's different. I don't. I think it's inferior because it is, in fact, inferior. I am not basing this on older models, but on the newest models coming out of the factory within the last 6 months. If you prefer it, that's fine. But IMO it doesn't hold a candle to similarly priced competitors. And that's the 3. The S and Y are both much worse at this point. Maybe the rumored 2025 refresh of the Y will remedy this, but as of now it's a dealbreaker for me.
Speaking as someone who purchased a different EV over a Tesla primarily because we perceived the interior quality to overall be better on the non-Tesla, I personally don't disagree with the general gist of your opinion. I think you are hyperbolizing this beyond reason, though. With the tax credits, a vehicle would be <$20k to be half the cost of a Model Y or Model 3. I would take either Tesla 100% of the time over a Nissan Versa.
Sure, but over a used top trim Mazda3? Nah. The Mazda interior is dramatically better. If you absolutely want to buy electric and range is your top criteria, choose Tesla. Otherwise, you very well may make a different choice and the interior is a big reason why. I don't think taking the tax credit into account is a valid apples to apples comparison. That the government is separately incentivizing you to buy electric for policy reasons isn't relevant.
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Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by cmr79 »

KyleAAA wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 4:20 pm
cmr79 wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 2:32 pm
KyleAAA wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 1:15 pm
dsmclone wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 10:37 am I think a lot of people think the Tesla interior is inferior because it's different.
Maybe some people think it's inferior because it's different. I don't. I think it's inferior because it is, in fact, inferior. I am not basing this on older models, but on the newest models coming out of the factory within the last 6 months. If you prefer it, that's fine. But IMO it doesn't hold a candle to similarly priced competitors. And that's the 3. The S and Y are both much worse at this point. Maybe the rumored 2025 refresh of the Y will remedy this, but as of now it's a dealbreaker for me.
Speaking as someone who purchased a different EV over a Tesla primarily because we perceived the interior quality to overall be better on the non-Tesla, I personally don't disagree with the general gist of your opinion. I think you are hyperbolizing this beyond reason, though. With the tax credits, a vehicle would be <$20k to be half the cost of a Model Y or Model 3. I would take either Tesla 100% of the time over a Nissan Versa.
Sure, but over a used top trim Mazda3? Nah. The Mazda interior is dramatically better. If you absolutely want to buy electric and range is your top criteria, choose Tesla. Otherwise, you very well may make a different choice and the interior is a big reason why. I don't think taking the tax credit into account is a valid apples to apples comparison. That the government is separately incentivizing you to buy electric for policy reasons isn't relevant.
You might as well attach "in my opinion" to all of your statements, because they are just that: your personal opinions. Note again that I indeed did make a different choice based on perceived interior quality of the Tesla, so I don't disagree with you that there are other vehicles whose interiors and fit/finish are preferable based on my own values in a vehicle, but you seem to be bending over backwards to make subjective impressions into objective facts.

The actual price people pay--regardless of the reason for any incentives to exist--cannot be reasonably ignored when actionable comparing the two vehicles that OP is considering. If EV vs ICE was the only or even a major determining factor, there wouldn't be much of a question between OP's options...so presumably it isn't a primary factor for them.

It's been several years since I've driven a Mazda3, incidentally, but the new one I rented for a week about 20 years ago was easily the worst car I've ever spent that much time in, so I find that particular example...curious. Maybe that particular one was a lemon, though.

Apples to apples, I would say that I don't think the Model S/X interiors scale vs the Model 3/Y the way that other brands scale, say like a Lexus RX vs a Toyota RAV4. But the experience of driving a Model Y is so different than driving a RAV4 that, even though they might be reasonable competitors that people could cross shop, whether one finds the MY or the RAV4 to be preferable in most aspects is going to be subjective and personal, not objective and generalizable. And someone could reasonably object to my comments of the Model S/X vs Model 3/Y above by pointing out that the interior on a $120k Porsche 911 isn't all that different from the interior on a $240k 911 Turbo S, and that in each case you are paying a 2X premium for the vehicle performance, not what is inside the cabin. But again, that stuff only matters if you value it.
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Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by TravellingTechOnFire »

KyleAAA wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 1:15 pm
dsmclone wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 10:37 am I think a lot of people think the Tesla interior is inferior because it's different.
Maybe some people think it's inferior because it's different. I don't. I think it's inferior because it is, in fact, inferior. I am not basing this on older models, but on the newest models coming out of the factory within the last 6 months. If you prefer it, that's fine. But IMO it doesn't hold a candle to similarly priced competitors. And that's the 3. The S and Y are both much worse at this point. Maybe the rumored 2025 refresh of the Y will remedy this, but as of now it's a dealbreaker for me.
Opinions vary. Inferiority is 100% your opinion and nowhere close to a fact. Wife and I prefer the simplicity of Tesla's interior compared to the ridiculously extreme number of buttons, knobs, switches, dials, and levers plastering every inch of the interior. I was driving our Kia recently and waited in the car while my wife ran into the store. Glancing around at the overwhelming and ridiculous plethora of buttons, knobs, and switches, I ended up counting somewhere north of 80! 80!!!! How in the world did anyone even imagine to figure out how to make that many different things to push, pull, twist, turn, etc. I think it takes experiencing something better to realize how absurd it is. For some, different automatically = bad as they are reluctant to accept change and are just stuck in there (antiquated) ways.

Our Tesla works flawlessly and more easily and user friendly than cars with 80+ buttons.

If you prefer more buttons knobs switches dials levers than the cockpit of a commercial aircraft, you are welcome to it. No thanks.

For those that prefer to push a button, here are the controls easily accessible with the push of a single button on a Tesla:
Wipers
Wiper speed
Wiper wash
Horn
Seat heaters for both seats.
Temperature.
Volume
Station
Turn signals

Probably more but I don't dwell on it because everything I need or use is easily accessible with one button push or, often easier, a voice command. Such as "navigate to (point of interest)" and it just works, flawlessly. Our Kia is like a horse and buggy in comparison.
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Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by KyleAAA »

cmr79 wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 4:44 pm You might as well attach "in my opinion" to all of your statements, because they are just that: your personal opinions.
Why? You think I'm stating it as objective fact and not my educated opinion? Why would you think that given I explicitly said the opposite?
cmr79 wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 4:44 pm The actual price people pay--regardless of the reason for any incentives to exist--cannot be reasonably ignored when actionable comparing the two vehicles that OP is considering.
It can and should. A $40k car is a $40k car even if the government separately decides to give you a tax rebate. I expect a $40k to look, drive, and feel like a $40k car. I don't expect it to look, drive, and feel like a $30k car just because I got a $10k tax credit. I judge it as a $40k car.
cmr79 wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 4:44 pm It's been several years since I've driven a Mazda3, incidentally, but the new one I rented for a week about 20 years ago was easily the worst car I've ever spent that much time in, so I find that particular example...curious. Maybe that particular one was a lemon, though.
I specified the upper trim. Your rental was almost certainly the budget base trim.
cmr79 wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 4:44 pm whether one finds the MY or the RAV4 to be preferable in most aspects is going to be subjective and personal, not objective and generalizable.
Yes, obviously. That's why I literally and directly stated as much above. Not sure why you think I was saying otherwise.
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Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by vfinx »

KyleAAA wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 6:53 pm
cmr79 wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 4:44 pm You might as well attach "in my opinion" to all of your statements, because they are just that: your personal opinions.
Why? You think I'm stating it as objective fact and not my educated opinion? Why would you think that given I explicitly said the opposite?
cmr79 wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 4:44 pm The actual price people pay--regardless of the reason for any incentives to exist--cannot be reasonably ignored when actionable comparing the two vehicles that OP is considering.
It can and should. A $40k car is a $40k car even if the government separately decides to give you a tax rebate. I expect a $40k to look, drive, and feel like a $40k car. I don't expect it to look, drive, and feel like a $30k car just because I got a $10k tax credit. I judge it as a $40k car.
cmr79 wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 4:44 pm It's been several years since I've driven a Mazda3, incidentally, but the new one I rented for a week about 20 years ago was easily the worst car I've ever spent that much time in, so I find that particular example...curious. Maybe that particular one was a lemon, though.
I specified the upper trim. Your rental was almost certainly the budget base trim.
cmr79 wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 4:44 pm whether one finds the MY or the RAV4 to be preferable in most aspects is going to be subjective and personal, not objective and generalizable.
Yes, obviously. That's why I literally and directly stated as much above. Not sure why you think I was saying otherwise.
I think I get you. The phrase "I think it's inferior because it is, in fact, inferior." was interpreted to be an attempted objective statement of fact. But you were trying to emphatically state an opinion. FWIW though, I made the same mistake on first read.
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Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by cmr79 »

KyleAAA wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 6:53 pm
cmr79 wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 4:44 pm You might as well attach "in my opinion" to all of your statements, because they are just that: your personal opinions.
Why? You think I'm stating it as objective fact and not my educated opinion? Why would you think that given I explicitly said the opposite?
cmr79 wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 4:44 pm The actual price people pay--regardless of the reason for any incentives to exist--cannot be reasonably ignored when actionable comparing the two vehicles that OP is considering.
It can and should. A $40k car is a $40k car even if the government separately decides to give you a tax rebate. I expect a $40k to look, drive, and feel like a $40k car. I don't expect it to look, drive, and feel like a $30k car just because I got a $10k tax credit. I judge it as a $40k car.
cmr79 wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 4:44 pm It's been several years since I've driven a Mazda3, incidentally, but the new one I rented for a week about 20 years ago was easily the worst car I've ever spent that much time in, so I find that particular example...curious. Maybe that particular one was a lemon, though.
I specified the upper trim. Your rental was almost certainly the budget base trim.
cmr79 wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 4:44 pm whether one finds the MY or the RAV4 to be preferable in most aspects is going to be subjective and personal, not objective and generalizable.
Yes, obviously. That's why I literally and directly stated as much above. Not sure why you think I was saying otherwise.
I'm not sure how anyone could interpret statements like "I think it's inferior because it is, in fact, inferior" other than a suggestion that you are justifying that your opinion is, in actuality, objective truth. If you have me--someone who largely agrees with the original point you are making, consider that your approach to convincing others might be off. And if you aren't trying to convince others like OP who might have different opinions than you, why post in the first place?
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Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by DIYtrixie »

Normchad wrote: Tue May 14, 2024 9:47 am
dsmclone wrote: Tue May 14, 2024 8:31 am I've learned to take zero advice on EV's from people that have never owned an EV. Before buying an EV, reddit non EV owners got me all concerned about things that I shouldn't worry about and not worry about things that I should be worry about. After a year of owning one, it usually only takes a couple of sentences before I can tell if the person has actually owned an EV.

Just like I wouldn't take advice on buying an RV from a person that's only owned a minivan.
+1.
+2!
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Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by KyleAAA »

cmr79 wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 7:38 pm I'm not sure how anyone could interpret statements like "I think it's inferior because it is, in fact, inferior" other than a suggestion that you are justifying that your opinion is, in actuality, objective truth.
A lesson on reading the entire passage in context before assigning meaning is probably in order.

Why would you think I'm attempting to convince others? What would be the point of that?
cmr79 wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 7:38 pm And if you aren't trying to convince others like OP who might have different opinions than you, why post in the first place?
Same reason as you: simply because I can.
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Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by cmr79 »

KyleAAA wrote: Thu May 16, 2024 11:58 am
cmr79 wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 7:38 pm I'm not sure how anyone could interpret statements like "I think it's inferior because it is, in fact, inferior" other than a suggestion that you are justifying that your opinion is, in actuality, objective truth.
A lesson on reading the entire passage in context before assigning meaning is probably in order.

Why would you think I'm attempting to convince others? What would be the point of that?
cmr79 wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 7:38 pm And if you aren't trying to convince others like OP who might have different opinions than you, why post in the first place?
Same reason as you: simply because I can.
Well, can't debate logic like that.
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Re: Honda Accord vs Tesla model 3

Post by enad »

If it were me, I'd go with a hybrid (you get the best of both worlds). Never have to worry about finding a charging station or waiting to charge, something like the Prius but perhaps Honda has a nice one too
What Goes Up Must come down -- David Clayton-Thomas (1968), BST
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