Purchasing MYGAs (multi year guaranteed annuities) - mega thread

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Re: Purchasing MYGAs (multi year guaranteed annuities) - mega thread

Post by indexfundfan »

fsrph wrote: Fri Jul 09, 2021 12:34 pm As mentioned above, I applied for Sagicor 5 year MYGA thru Blueprint. Blueprint notified me my application was complete and was sent to Sagicor before the end of June (for the 3% rate). Said the policy should be issued shortly. I haven't heard a thing from Blueprint or Sagicor since then. This is my first MYGA, some questions. Is this wait normal? Who will contact me next, Sagicor? I didn't plan to fund the policy till the end of July, so I can wait. Am I supposed to send the money before I see the policy? That doesn't seem right. Thanks.

Francis
For all the policies I have bought, the insurer will only issue the policy after the money was paid. How did you tell Blueprint you will fund the policy?

You may be able to ask them to send you a sample copy of the policy. I haven't this requested before.
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Re: Purchasing MYGAs (multi year guaranteed annuities) - mega thread

Post by Stinky »

fsrph wrote: Fri Jul 09, 2021 12:34 pm As mentioned above, I applied for Sagicor 5 year MYGA thru Blueprint. Blueprint notified me my application was complete and was sent to Sagicor before the end of June (for the 3% rate). Said the policy should be issued shortly. I haven't heard a thing from Blueprint or Sagicor since then. This is my first MYGA, some questions. Is this wait normal? Who will contact me next, Sagicor? I didn't plan to fund the policy till the end of July, so I can wait. Am I supposed to send the money before I see the policy? That doesn't seem right. Thanks.

Francis
If I were you, I’d give Blueprint a call or send them a message. They’re the agent and your primary point of contact at this stage of the process.

On the one hand, I wouldn’t expect that a policy would be issued until your money is received and processed. Sagicor wouldn’t know what date to put on the policy until your money is received.

On the other hand, I’ve never applied for a policy with “deferred funding”, as I have always submitted authorizations to fund at time of application. So I have no relevant experience on your question.

Let us know what you find out. I’m interested.
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Re: Purchasing MYGAs (multi year guaranteed annuities) - mega thread

Post by fsrph »

indexfundfan wrote: Fri Jul 09, 2021 12:51 pm
fsrph wrote: Fri Jul 09, 2021 12:34 pm As mentioned above, I applied for Sagicor 5 year MYGA thru Blueprint. Blueprint notified me my application was complete and was sent to Sagicor before the end of June (for the 3% rate). Said the policy should be issued shortly. I haven't heard a thing from Blueprint or Sagicor since then. This is my first MYGA, some questions. Is this wait normal? Who will contact me next, Sagicor? I didn't plan to fund the policy till the end of July, so I can wait. Am I supposed to send the money before I see the policy? That doesn't seem right. Thanks.

Francis
For all the policies I have bought, the insurer will only issue the policy after the money was paid. How did you tell Blueprint you will fund the policy?

You may be able to ask them to send you a sample copy of the policy. I haven't this requested before.
I told Blueprint I'd fund the policy with a CD that matures in late July. They said that's fine as I have 60 days to fund. I'm new to buying MYGA's, please bear with my questions. So, I'm supposed to send Sagicor a check for 100k with no written documentation that I'm receiving the 3% rate? Maybe that's how it does work. Blueprint did send me a shipping label for the check.

Francis
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Re: Purchasing MYGAs (multi year guaranteed annuities) - mega thread

Post by HueyLD »

Fsrph said: “ I told Blueprint I'd fund the policy with a CD that matures in late July. They said that's fine as I have 60 days to fund. I'm new to buying MYGA's, please bear with my questions. So, I'm supposed to send Sagicor a check for 100k with no written documentation that I'm receiving the 3% rate? Maybe that's how it does work. Blueprint did send me a shipping label for the check.”

You will print the page one of your MYGA application which you should have a copy. Enclose the check with that page.
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Re: Purchasing MYGAs (multi year guaranteed annuities) - mega thread

Post by indexfundfan »

fsrph wrote: Fri Jul 09, 2021 1:37 pm I told Blueprint I'd fund the policy with a CD that matures in late July. They said that's fine as I have 60 days to fund. I'm new to buying MYGA's, please bear with my questions. So, I'm supposed to send Sagicor a check for 100k with no written documentation that I'm receiving the 3% rate? Maybe that's how it does work. Blueprint did send me a shipping label for the check.

Francis
For me, I wrote my name and the MYGA details (5yr 3% etc) on the check. For some policies, Blueprint can provide a reference number.
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Re: Purchasing MYGAs (multi year guaranteed annuities) - mega thread

Post by Stinky »

HueyLD wrote: Fri Jul 09, 2021 1:42 pm Fsrph said: “ I told Blueprint I'd fund the policy with a CD that matures in late July. They said that's fine as I have 60 days to fund. I'm new to buying MYGA's, please bear with my questions. So, I'm supposed to send Sagicor a check for 100k with no written documentation that I'm receiving the 3% rate? Maybe that's how it does work. Blueprint did send me a shipping label for the check.”

You will print the page one of your MYGA application which you should have a copy. Enclose the check with that page.
And, in the unlikely event that the policy is not issued as you expected, you have a “free look” period of 30 days after you receive the policy to get a full refund.

But I really doubt that there will be any problem.
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Re: Purchasing MYGAs (multi year guaranteed annuities) - mega thread

Post by fsrph »

Stinky wrote: Fri Jul 09, 2021 12:53 pm
fsrph wrote: Fri Jul 09, 2021 12:34 pm As mentioned above, I applied for Sagicor 5 year MYGA thru Blueprint. Blueprint notified me my application was complete and was sent to Sagicor before the end of June (for the 3% rate). Said the policy should be issued shortly. I haven't heard a thing from Blueprint or Sagicor since then. This is my first MYGA, some questions. Is this wait normal? Who will contact me next, Sagicor? I didn't plan to fund the policy till the end of July, so I can wait. Am I supposed to send the money before I see the policy? That doesn't seem right. Thanks.

Francis
If I were you, I’d give Blueprint a call or send them a message. They’re the agent and your primary point of contact at this stage of the process.

On the one hand, I wouldn’t expect that a policy would be issued until your money is received and processed. Sagicor wouldn’t know what date to put on the policy until your money is received.

On the other hand, I’ve never applied for a policy with “deferred funding”, as I have always submitted authorizations to fund at time of application. So I have no relevant experience on your question.

Let us know what you find out. I’m interested.
I emailed Blueprint with my issues and here's their reply. Policy won't be issued until funds are received. I have 60 days to fund. As far as written documentation of my Blueprint application it is not available online but rep will email me a PDF copy. So I'll wait till my CD matures in late July, print a copy of my application, and mail the check to Sagicor.

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Re: Purchasing MYGAs (multi year guaranteed annuities) - mega thread

Post by Stinky »

fsrph wrote: Mon Jul 12, 2021 9:20 am
Stinky wrote: Fri Jul 09, 2021 12:53 pm
fsrph wrote: Fri Jul 09, 2021 12:34 pm As mentioned above, I applied for Sagicor 5 year MYGA thru Blueprint. Blueprint notified me my application was complete and was sent to Sagicor before the end of June (for the 3% rate). Said the policy should be issued shortly. I haven't heard a thing from Blueprint or Sagicor since then. This is my first MYGA, some questions. Is this wait normal? Who will contact me next, Sagicor? I didn't plan to fund the policy till the end of July, so I can wait. Am I supposed to send the money before I see the policy? That doesn't seem right. Thanks.

Francis
If I were you, I’d give Blueprint a call or send them a message. They’re the agent and your primary point of contact at this stage of the process.

On the one hand, I wouldn’t expect that a policy would be issued until your money is received and processed. Sagicor wouldn’t know what date to put on the policy until your money is received.

On the other hand, I’ve never applied for a policy with “deferred funding”, as I have always submitted authorizations to fund at time of application. So I have no relevant experience on your question.

Let us know what you find out. I’m interested.
I emailed Blueprint with my issues and here's their reply. Policy won't be issued until funds are received. I have 60 days to fund. As far as written documentation of my Blueprint application it is not available online but rep will email me a PDF copy. So I'll wait till my CD matures in late July, print a copy of my application, and mail the check to Sagicor.

Francis
That’s what I’d thought they’d say.

Thanks for sharing.
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Re: Purchasing MYGAs (multi year guaranteed annuities) - mega thread

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I’ll be making a presentation on MYGAs at the next Birmingham Boglehead meeting on Zoom. Sunday, August 8, 4pm Central time.

All are welcome to join the meeting. To get login information, send an email to birminghambogleheads@gmail.com, or private message me.

I’ll bump this message a time or two before the meeting date.
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Re: Purchasing MYGAs (multi year guaranteed annuities) - mega thread

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Thank you Mr. Stinky. Look forward to your presentation.
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Re: Purchasing MYGAs (multi year guaranteed annuities) - mega thread

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FINAL BUMP

I’ll be making a presentation on MYGAs at the next Birmingham Boglehead meeting on Zoom. Sunday, August 8, 4pm Central time.

All are welcome to join the meeting. To get login information, send an email to birminghambogleheads@gmail.com, or private message me.
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Re: Purchasing MYGAs (multi year guaranteed annuities) - mega thread

Post by DDubya »

I thought I might add to this thread by sharing my experience with Blueprint. I bought 2 MYGA in my tIRA. I applied on July 12, and the 2 policies were funded August 2, exactly 3 weeks.
Blueprint service was fine. They sent email several times along the way and the rep was knowledgeable and helpful.
Actually, the funding could have been quicker but for an oversight by Vanguard. My instructions were to transfer the money on or after July 20. Vanguard tried before that date and found there was not enough money in my settlement fund (I was using funds from CDs maturing on July 20). This led Vanguard to put a hold on processing until I called them to restart.
I am pleased with my Blueprint experience and am confident I will purchase additional MYGA using them.
Thanks to Stinky and the others who have contributed to this thread.
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Re: Purchasing MYGAs (multi year guaranteed annuities) - mega thread

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DDubya wrote: Wed Aug 04, 2021 12:12 pm I thought I might add to this thread by sharing my experience with Blueprint. I bought 2 MYGA in my tIRA. I applied on July 12, and the 2 policies were funded August 2, exactly 3 weeks.
Blueprint service was fine. They sent email several times along the way and the rep was knowledgeable and helpful.
Actually, the funding could have been quicker but for an oversight by Vanguard. My instructions were to transfer the money on or after July 20. Vanguard tried before that date and found there was not enough money in my settlement fund (I was using funds from CDs maturing on July 20). This led Vanguard to put a hold on processing until I called them to restart.
I am pleased with my Blueprint experience and am confident I will purchase additional MYGA using them.
Thanks to Stinky and the others who have contributed to this thread.
I’m glad that you had a good experience in purchasing MYGAs through Blueprint Income.

The Blueprint agency was acquired by Mass Mutual earlier this year. To date, I haven’t seen any changes in Blueprint’s offerings or quality of service. I hope that MM allows Blueprint to continue to operate semi-autonomously.
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Re: Purchasing MYGAs (multi year guaranteed annuities) - mega thread

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Stinky wrote: Mon Aug 02, 2021 6:18 am FINAL BUMP

I’ll be making a presentation on MYGAs at the next Birmingham Boglehead meeting on Zoom. Sunday, August 8, 4pm Central time.

All are welcome to join the meeting. To get login information, send an email to birminghambogleheads@gmail.com, or private message me.
Thanks for the update! For anyone that cannot join the meeting, any idea if your presentation will be available on the Bogleheads YouTube channel that LadyGeek just posted about?
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Re: Purchasing MYGAs (multi year guaranteed annuities) - mega thread

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HomeStretch wrote: Mon Aug 09, 2021 10:39 am
Stinky wrote: Mon Aug 02, 2021 6:18 am FINAL BUMP

I’ll be making a presentation on MYGAs at the next Birmingham Boglehead meeting on Zoom. Sunday, August 8, 4pm Central time.

All are welcome to join the meeting. To get login information, send an email to birminghambogleheads@gmail.com, or private message me.
Thanks for the update! For anyone that cannot join the meeting, any idea if your presentation will be available on the Bogleheads YouTube channel that LadyGeek just posted about?
Sorry, but this presentation wasn't recorded.

However, I've offered to make the presentation to other Boglehead groups. Maybe one of them will pick up on my offer and record the presentation for YouTube.
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Re: Purchasing MYGAs (multi year guaranteed annuities) - mega thread

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Stinky wrote: Sat Jun 05, 2021 10:21 am Sagicor has what appears to be a "limited time" special rate on its 3-year and 5-year MYGAs. The 3-year is paying 2.30% and the 5-year is paying 3.00%.

That 3.00% rate on the 5-year product is the highest rate available for a duration of less than 10 years for a company rated A- or higher by AM Best.

Based on communications I've received, it appears that this "special" rate expires on 6/30/21. And I've heard from a couple of annuity agents that those Sagicor products are "hot sellers" right now.
Sagicor ran their rate special at 3.00% on the five-year for the month of June. They then reduced the rate to 2.75% about July 1.

It looks like they’re cutting the rate again. The Blueprint website says that they’re going to 2.45% effective 8/18.

Congratulations to those of you who pounced on the 3.00% rate in June.
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Re: Purchasing MYGAs (multi year guaranteed annuities) - mega thread

Post by tj »

Do any of these companies allow one to buy the MYGA with a credit card? That could juice the yield to some extent.
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Re: Purchasing MYGAs (multi year guaranteed annuities) - mega thread

Post by fsrph »

I received the contract for my Sagicor 5 yr/3% MYGA yesterday. I spotted something I didn't like on the first page.

Effective date - 8/2/2021
Maturity date - 8/2/2060
Initial rate guarantee period - 5 years
Initial surrender charge period - 5 years
Subsequent surrender charge periods - The initial surrender charge period will be followed by one subsequent 5 year charge period. Surrender charges will not apply beginning of contract year 11.


Is this maturity date of 2060 correct? Why isn't it 5 years? Also, the documents show a table of surrender charges that do not drop to 0% until year 11. Year 5 shows a 5% surrender charge. Can anyone please let me know if this is correct. All I wanted was a 5 year MYGA and do what I want with the money, penalty free, after 5 years.

I plan on calling the the company but closed on weekend. Should I call Sagicor or Blueprint?

Francis
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Re: Purchasing MYGAs (multi year guaranteed annuities) - mega thread

Post by Hebell »

It can continue to roll over so to speak, for up to that many years. I had exactly the same concern within an annuity I bought through Stan the annuity man. Yes you have a 5-year myga, but as it matures it can keep being reinvested for up to a much longer period of time, in your case up til 2060. It does mean though, as you approach that five-year deadline, you need to let them know you don't want to reinvest.
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Re: Purchasing MYGAs (multi year guaranteed annuities) - mega thread

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fsrph wrote: Sat Aug 21, 2021 9:45 am I received the contract for my Sagicor 5 yr/3% MYGA yesterday. I spotted something I didn't like on the first page.

Effective date - 8/2/2021
Maturity date - 8/2/2060
Initial rate guarantee period - 5 years
Initial surrender charge period - 5 years
Subsequent surrender charge periods - The initial surrender charge period will be followed by one subsequent 5 year charge period. Surrender charges will not apply beginning of contract year 11.

Is this maturity date of 2060 correct? Why isn't it 5 years? Also, the documents show a table of surrender charges that do not drop to 0% until year 11. Year 5 shows a 5% surrender charge. Can anyone please let me know if this is correct. All I wanted was a 5 year MYGA and do what I want with the money, penalty free, after 5 years.

I plan on calling the the company but closed on weekend. Should I call Sagicor or Blueprint?

Francis
I also have the Sagicor 3.00% 5 year contract. (My wording may vary slightly from yours, due to state variations.)

I agree that showing a maturity date of 2060 is confusing. That's when the annuity itself would mature - probably the anniversary date after your 100th birthday.

The important language is in the section "Penalty Free Window(s) Period", on the Contract Data Page. My paragraph says:

You will have 30 days from the beginning of contract year 6, and 30 days at the beginning of each Subsequent Surrender Period that follows, to withdraw some of or all of the Accumulation Value, during which no Surrender Charge will be deducted prior to You Receiving your proceeds. You will be given 45 days’ notice before {the/each} Penalty Free Window Period begins.

This is the language that makes my funds available to me, without penalty, at the end of 5 years. If I do nothing during that 30 day period, the annuity will continue in force.

Feel free to call either Blueprint or Sagicor next week, if that will give you further confidence. I expect that you'll get substantially the same answer from them.
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Re: Purchasing MYGAs (multi year guaranteed annuities) - mega thread

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fsrph wrote: Sat Aug 21, 2021 9:45 am I received the contract for my Sagicor 5 yr/3% MYGA yesterday. I spotted something I didn't like on the first page.

Effective date - 8/2/2021
Maturity date - 8/2/2060
Initial rate guarantee period - 5 years
Initial surrender charge period - 5 years
Subsequent surrender charge periods - The initial surrender charge period will be followed by one subsequent 5 year charge period. Surrender charges will not apply beginning of contract year 11.


Is this maturity date of 2060 correct? Why isn't it 5 years? Also, the documents show a table of surrender charges that do not drop to 0% until year 11. Year 5 shows a 5% surrender charge. Can anyone please let me know if this is correct. All I wanted was a 5 year MYGA and do what I want with the money, penalty free, after 5 years.

I plan on calling the the company but closed on weekend. Should I call Sagicor or Blueprint?

Francis
(1) The maturity date is the absolute last day that you must annuitize your MYGA. It is typically set to your 100th birthday and I don’t think you need to worry about that eventuality.

(2) You can certainly have penalty free withdrawal at the end of the initial guarantee period of 8/2/2026. However, if you renew the MYGA then, a new five year period of surrender charges will kick in.

See explanation here https://www.sagicor.com/-/media/USA-Ass ... 2033514271
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Re: Purchasing MYGAs (multi year guaranteed annuities) - mega thread

Post by fsrph »

Thanks everyone for the great advice. Stinky, I see the exact language on my contract data page as you posted. I feel better seeing that. This is my first MYGA and I was trying to make sure everything is correct.

Francis
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Re: Purchasing MYGAs (multi year guaranteed annuities) - mega thread

Post by indexfundfan »

I purchased another MYGA from Gainbridge when my PSECU CD matured. Everything was done online.

9/8 Application submitted. Bank account verified.
9/9 Application pending.
9/10 Money deducted from bank account. Policy active.

5yr MYGA 3.00% APY
AM Best B++
Surrender charges, in years 1,2,3,4,5 are 3%,3%,3%,2%,1% plus market value adjustment.
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indexfundfan wrote: Fri Sep 10, 2021 11:19 am I purchased another MYGA from Gainbridge when my PSECU CD matured. Everything was done online.

9/8 Application submitted. Bank account verified.
9/9 Application pending.
9/10 Money deducted from bank account. Policy active.

5yr MYGA 3.00% APY
AM Best B++
Surrender charges, in years 1,2,3,4,5 are 3%,3%,3%,2%,1% plus market value adjustment.
I personally think that the Gainbridge product, underwritten by Guggenheim Life, is an excellent value.

Very competitive interest rate, low surrender charges, and lighting fast turnaround.

I’ve purchased from Gainbridge.
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Post by gjlynch17 »

FYI, AM Best has recently placed Guggenheim Life and Annuity Company under review. I am not sure it will result in any change its B++ rating but it is something worth following.

https://news.ambest.com/presscontent.as ... fnum=31092

"AM Best has placed under review with developing implications the Financial Strength Rating of B++ (Good) and the Long-Term Issuer Credit Rating of “bbb+” (Good) of Guggenheim Life and Annuity Company (GLAC) (Wilmington, DE).

The Credit Rating (rating) actions reflect GLAC’s decline in surplus and weakening in its risk-adjusted capital position during the first half of 2021, driven in large part by the payment of stockholder dividends to its ultimate parent, Sammons Enterprises, Inc. GLAC’s management is working on a capital plan to increase its capital and surplus and strengthen its risk-adjusted capital position."
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Re: Purchasing MYGAs (multi year guaranteed annuities) - mega thread

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gjlynch17 wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 9:50 am FYI, AM Best has recently placed Guggenheim Life and Annuity Company under review. I am not sure it will result in any change its B++ rating but it is something worth following.

https://news.ambest.com/presscontent.as ... fnum=31092

"AM Best has placed under review with developing implications the Financial Strength Rating of B++ (Good) and the Long-Term Issuer Credit Rating of “bbb+” (Good) of Guggenheim Life and Annuity Company (GLAC) (Wilmington, DE).

The Credit Rating (rating) actions reflect GLAC’s decline in surplus and weakening in its risk-adjusted capital position during the first half of 2021, driven in large part by the payment of stockholder dividends to its ultimate parent, Sammons Enterprises, Inc. GLAC’s management is working on a capital plan to increase its capital and surplus and strengthen its risk-adjusted capital position."
Thanks. Good to know.
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Re: Purchasing MYGAs (multi year guaranteed annuities) - mega thread

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gjlynch17 wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 9:50 am FYI, AM Best has recently placed Guggenheim Life and Annuity Company under review. I am not sure it will result in any change its B++ rating but it is something worth following.

https://news.ambest.com/presscontent.as ... fnum=31092

"AM Best has placed under review with developing implications the Financial Strength Rating of B++ (Good) and the Long-Term Issuer Credit Rating of “bbb+” (Good) of Guggenheim Life and Annuity Company (GLAC) (Wilmington, DE).

The Credit Rating (rating) actions reflect GLAC’s decline in surplus and weakening in its risk-adjusted capital position during the first half of 2021, driven in large part by the payment of stockholder dividends to its ultimate parent, Sammons Enterprises, Inc. GLAC’s management is working on a capital plan to increase its capital and surplus and strengthen its risk-adjusted capital position."
Thank you very much for posting this.

Given that GLAC’s capital position has declined, Best could have taken much more severe action. They could have downgraded the company. They could have placed the rating “under review with negative implications”.

Instead, they put the rating under review with “developing” implications. That language suggests to me that Best currently has an expectation that the capital situation will be resolved in a positive way, which would allow Best to affirm the rating.

There’s no guarantee that the rating will be affirmed. The company could be downgraded. But, based on the language here, I don’t expect it.

“Under review” situations take a while to get resolved. I wouldn’t be surprised if we don’t hear again from Best for 3-6 months.

Please keep us posted as you hear of Best actions on companies in the MYGA space. I appreciate the news updates.
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Post by HueyLD »

I am somewhat bothered by the cause of declining capital. If making dividend payment to its parent company could weaken its risk adjusted capital position to such a level that triggered the credit review, something else might be going on.

Anyway, it will be interesting to see how the insurance company gets its capital back to an acceptable level on a risk adjusted basis. I want to see what they actually do, not just what they say they will do.
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Post by gjlynch17 »

Stinky wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 10:39 am
Given that GLAC’s capital position has declined, Best could have taken much more severe action. They could have downgraded the company. They could have placed the rating “under review with negative implications”.

Instead, they put the rating under review with “developing” implications. That language suggests to me that Best currently has an expectation that the capital situation will be resolved in a positive way, which would allow Best to affirm the rating.

There’s no guarantee that the rating will be affirmed. The company could be downgraded. But, based on the language here, I don’t expect it.

“Under review” situations take a while to get resolved. I wouldn’t be surprised if we don’t hear again from Best for 3-6 months.
Stinky, thanks for your analysis. It is nice to have your perspective from working in the insurance industry.

Reading between the lines of the press release, GLAC appears to have a planned transaction for an infusion of capital and its B++ rating is contingent upon closing of that transaction. I am looking at purchasing several MYGAs in the next 4-6 months and like Guggenheim's rates so I will be following developments with interests.
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Stinky
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Re: Purchasing MYGAs (multi year guaranteed annuities) - mega thread

Post by Stinky »

There was a discussion in another thread about guaranty fund limits. The discussion starts with the following post and continues for several posts after it.

viewtopic.php?p=6235097#p6235097

I suggest that anyone who is considering purchasing a MYGA (or other annuity or cash value life insurance product) carefully review the coverage limits and other provisions of their state life and health insurance guaranty fund.

This review is especially important for folks who plan to purchase MYGAs that are, in aggregate, in excess of the coverage limits of their guaranty fund. The laws of many states are less than crystal clear about whether the coverage limits apply to a person’s exposure to a particular insurer, or a person’s exposure to all insurers.

One way for a person to get greater confidence in guaranty fund coverage is to directly ask their state guaranty fund. I have contacted my state guaranty fund, and I encourage others to contact theirs. Contact information is on the guaranty fund's website.
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