Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

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tj
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by tj »

I have some bitter feelings towards Vanguard since they flew me out hter ebut didn't offer me the job, but I still invest there, I've had no issues with their customer service.
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tooluser
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by tooluser »

Welcome to the modern world. No organization cares about you or if you take your business or donations elsewhere. When you are disappointed, you should make an assessment as to whether to move your business elsewhere. If you think you should, do so. If not, don't. They don't care whether you do or don't. They will try a little harder if you are a Whale. Ignore their marketing and make your own decision. That is all.
dave1054
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by dave1054 »

sport wrote: Wed Apr 28, 2021 1:21 pm
gwe67 wrote: Wed Apr 28, 2021 1:07 pm I've never really understood the allegiance here to Vanguard...
Vanguard will not try to take advantage of me if I lose my mental acuity. Vanguard will not try to take advantage of my spouse nor my heirs. They have no expensive products to sell and their employees do not work on commission. In other words, I trust Vanguard more than the other companies.

I can just envision the following conversation at other brokers: Mrs. Sport, I am so sorry to learn of your loss. Please know that we are always here to help you with your investments. We have a portfolio management team ready to help you for only 1.5% per year. We have some proprietary funds that are particularly suitable for your situation and we are experts at timing the market. May I transfer you to our licensed insurance specialist to help you set up your new portfolio? Don't worry, we will take care of everything for you. :evil:
Sport. Brilliant comment. This is exactly why I will continue to stay with Vanguard after 30 plus years.
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LilyFleur
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by LilyFleur »

wander wrote: Thu Apr 29, 2021 8:06 pm Yeah, I wish you luck to move your asset somewhere that serves you better. I am fed up with Vanguard but I am lazy.
There will always be competitors who are willing to help you move your money and make it super easy for you.

I am surprised at how many people on this forum expect to have to do all the leg work when moving money, especially decent amounts of it, from one institution to another.
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LilyFleur
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by LilyFleur »

ronocnikral wrote: Thu Apr 29, 2021 8:50 pm
ClevrChico wrote: Wed Apr 28, 2021 8:15 am For what it's worth, my 401k is with Merrill Lynch. They have no ability to electronically message them for support. It's 100% phone only. It's takes five minutes in a phone tree to reach a rep. Once you do reach a rep, they are very helpful, by I cringe every time I call having to go through the process.

I would love it to be with Vanguard instead.
Merrill is nothing short of hot trash. I had a 401k and restricted shares with them (not to mention the lowest fund fee of 1%). The highlight of getting laid off was transferring my assets out of Merrill lynch.
Some companies do not offer online chat nor the ability to save a chat. I like having that option in case something doesn't go smoothly or as expected or if they don't honor what they told you. It's much harder to prove from a phone call than a chat transcript.
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ResearchMed
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by ResearchMed »

LilyFleur wrote: Thu Apr 29, 2021 9:32 pm
ronocnikral wrote: Thu Apr 29, 2021 8:50 pm
ClevrChico wrote: Wed Apr 28, 2021 8:15 am For what it's worth, my 401k is with Merrill Lynch. They have no ability to electronically message them for support. It's 100% phone only. It's takes five minutes in a phone tree to reach a rep. Once you do reach a rep, they are very helpful, by I cringe every time I call having to go through the process.

I would love it to be with Vanguard instead.
Merrill is nothing short of hot trash. I had a 401k and restricted shares with them (not to mention the lowest fund fee of 1%). The highlight of getting laid off was transferring my assets out of Merrill lynch.
Some companies do not offer online chat nor the ability to save a chat. I like having that option in case something doesn't go smoothly or as expected or if they don't honor what they told you. It's much harder to prove from a phone call than a chat transcript.
When I'm in the midst of an online chat where documenting the content might matter (or provide info that I'll want to refer to again, etc.), I frequently take a screen save and just keep pasting those onto a Word doc, or perhaps make a pdf, depending upon if it's easy to capture that intact.
Sometimes there's a place at the end to print a copy, but that isn't always clear at the start. :annoyed

RM
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wander
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by wander »

LilyFleur wrote: Thu Apr 29, 2021 9:29 pm
wander wrote: Thu Apr 29, 2021 8:06 pm Yeah, I wish you luck to move your asset somewhere that serves you better. I am fed up with Vanguard but I am lazy.
There will always be competitors who are willing to help you move your money and make it super easy for you.

I am surprised at how many people on this forum expect to have to do all the leg work when moving money, especially decent amounts of it, from one institution to another.
What I mean is I don't care if VG customer sucks. I come to invest at VG and it does the job well.
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tooluser
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by tooluser »

wander wrote: Thu Apr 29, 2021 9:41 pm
LilyFleur wrote: Thu Apr 29, 2021 9:29 pm
wander wrote: Thu Apr 29, 2021 8:06 pm Yeah, I wish you luck to move your asset somewhere that serves you better. I am fed up with Vanguard but I am lazy.
There will always be competitors who are willing to help you move your money and make it super easy for you.

I am surprised at how many people on this forum expect to have to do all the leg work when moving money, especially decent amounts of it, from one institution to another.
What I mean is I don't care if VG customer sucks. I come to invest at VG and it does the job well.
I had one big name company make it difficult to move more money to them. So instead I moved my money out to their biggest competitor. Go figure. :confused
drzzzzz
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by drzzzzz »

dave1054 wrote: Thu Apr 29, 2021 9:08 pm
sport wrote: Wed Apr 28, 2021 1:21 pm
gwe67 wrote: Wed Apr 28, 2021 1:07 pm I've never really understood the allegiance here to Vanguard...
Vanguard will not try to take advantage of me if I lose my mental acuity. Vanguard will not try to take advantage of my spouse nor my heirs. They have no expensive products to sell and their employees do not work on commission. In other words, I trust Vanguard more than the other companies.

I can just envision the following conversation at other brokers: Mrs. Sport, I am so sorry to learn of your loss. Please know that we are always here to help you with your investments. We have a portfolio management team ready to help you for only 1.5% per year. We have some proprietary funds that are particularly suitable for your situation and we are experts at timing the market. May I transfer you to our licensed insurance specialist to help you set up your new portfolio? Don't worry, we will take care of everything for you. :evil:
Sport. Brilliant comment. This is exactly why I will continue to stay with Vanguard after 30 plus years.
I find these comments amusing since we don't get any calls, emails, or online ads from Fidelity or TDameritrade about trying to sell us anything, but everytime I sign onto my Vanguard accouunt there is a message that I should be using Vanguard PAS (personal advisory service).
Colorado13
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by Colorado13 »

Other than long wait times, which are the norm for every organization that I call, I don't recall receiving poor customer service from Vanguard. I only contact them infrequently however. Some day I may transition elsewhere if I receive a substantial bonus for doing so, but if I leave, it will only be because of the bonus that I could earn. Otherwise I'm satisfied with Vanguard.
relativeratio
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by relativeratio »

ronocnikral wrote: Thu Apr 29, 2021 8:50 pm
ClevrChico wrote: Wed Apr 28, 2021 8:15 am For what it's worth, my 401k is with Merrill Lynch. They have no ability to electronically message them for support. It's 100% phone only. It's takes five minutes in a phone tree to reach a rep. Once you do reach a rep, they are very helpful, by I cringe every time I call having to go through the process.

I would love it to be with Vanguard instead.
Merrill is nothing short of hot trash. I had a 401k and restricted shares with them (not to mention the lowest fund fee of 1%). The highlight of getting laid off was transferring my assets out of Merrill lynch.
I know exactly how you feel. When I left my job, I transferred as much as I could to Vanguard from Merrill.
AlwaysLearningMore
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by AlwaysLearningMore »

relativeratio wrote: Wed Apr 28, 2021 12:00 am
Monsterflockster wrote: Tue Apr 27, 2021 11:06 pm Does anyone have good customer service now days?
My experience with Vanguard customer service has always been outstanding. They have consistently gone "above and beyond" over the years. You should talk to a manager if your dealing with a less then helpful representative.
+1
Have had many accounts there over the years (taxable, office-based retirement plans when VG offered them directly, 529's, IRA's, rollover IRA's, commercial entity accounts) and have never been dissatisfied.
Retirement is best when you have a lot to live on, and a lot to live for.
makingmistakes
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by makingmistakes »

Colorado13 wrote: Fri Apr 30, 2021 8:58 am Other than long wait times, which are the norm for every organization that I call, I don't recall receiving poor customer service from Vanguard. I only contact them infrequently however. Some day I may transition elsewhere if I receive a substantial bonus for doing so, but if I leave, it will only be because of the bonus that I could earn. Otherwise I'm satisfied with Vanguard.
My 401k is with Fidelity and I had to call today to speak to a representative. 49 minutes waiting ... no option for a call back. Guy was super nice though and took care of my issue 😳
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Cheez-It Guy
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by Cheez-It Guy »

Thanks for equal time!
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grobertj
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by grobertj »

I have all my investment with Vanguard except my Emergency Fund which I keep in an Ally Savings account. When I first started with VG, they were fantastic. I had a Flagship Rep who would call me to ask if I needed his help. Now, when I call my Rep he's never available, and I have to make an appointment. I usually just talk to whomever answers the phone. I have 2 major gripes. First, any question you ask, they try to guide you to the PAS program. I have no interest in that. Second, and related, they never want to give an opinion. It's like they're afraid of getting sued. That why I value this forum, because opinions are free and varied. For just the mechanical part of managing funds, Vanguard is easy for me.
The only constant is CHANGE!!
PCFV
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by PCFV »

Been with Vanguard my whole life. I will not transfer out because I do not think the service at Fidelity or T Rowe Price would be any better and I do not like the idea of switching to ETF's or having all my money in a Brokerage account - Funds in a Mutual Fund Company and individual stocks/ETF's in a brokerage account. If you are a plain vanilla investor like myself, Vanguard works - until you need to do something more complex.

This Company is nothing like it use to be when Jack was around. He wouldn't put up with this nonsense. For example, a portfolio Analysis tool that they tinker with every few months, is inaccurate and advises you to put 50% of your money in International stocks and Bonds. Firstly, I thought they weren't in the "advice" business and secondly, what callous and ill thought out advice as the 10 year returns are a 1/3 of the Domestic market. Thirdly, Jack detested International investments and owned none. Besides, the world has changed and most of our domestic investments have International exposure.


They should listen to their own advice and don't give advice - that and get some Flagship reps that are older than 30.
grok87
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by grok87 »

PCFV wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 9:31 am Been with Vanguard my whole life. I will not transfer out because I do not think the service at Fidelity or T Rowe Price would be any better and I do not like the idea of switching to ETF's or having all my money in a Brokerage account - Funds in a Mutual Fund Company and individual stocks/ETF's in a brokerage account. If you are a plain vanilla investor like myself, Vanguard works - until you need to do something more complex.

This Company is nothing like it use to be when Jack was around. He wouldn't put up with this nonsense. For example, a portfolio Analysis tool that they tinker with every few months, is inaccurate and advises you to put 50% of your money in International stocks and Bonds. Firstly, I thought they weren't in the "advice" business and secondly, what callous and ill thought out advice as the 10 year returns are a 1/3 of the Domestic market. Thirdly, Jack detested International investments and owned none. Besides, the world has changed and most of our domestic investments have International exposure.


They should listen to their own advice and don't give advice - that and get some Flagship reps that are older than 30.
i think us vanguard mutual fund account customers are going to be forced onto the vanguard brokerage platform eventually/(soon?). vanguard keeps messaging me about it
RIP Mr. Bogle.
Mr.BB
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by Mr.BB »

ResearchMed wrote: Thu Apr 29, 2021 9:39 pm
LilyFleur wrote: Thu Apr 29, 2021 9:32 pm
ronocnikral wrote: Thu Apr 29, 2021 8:50 pm
ClevrChico wrote: Wed Apr 28, 2021 8:15 am For what it's worth, my 401k is with Merrill Lynch. They have no ability to electronically message them for support. It's 100% phone only. It's takes five minutes in a phone tree to reach a rep. Once you do reach a rep, they are very helpful, by I cringe every time I call having to go through the process.

I would love it to be with Vanguard instead.
Merrill is nothing short of hot trash. I had a 401k and restricted shares with them (not to mention the lowest fund fee of 1%). The highlight of getting laid off was transferring my assets out of Merrill lynch.
Some companies do not offer online chat nor the ability to save a chat. I like having that option in case something doesn't go smoothly or as expected or if they don't honor what they told you. It's much harder to prove from a phone call than a chat transcript.
When I'm in the midst of an online chat where documenting the content might matter (or provide info that I'll want to refer to again, etc.), I frequently take a screen save and just keep pasting those onto a Word doc, or perhaps make a pdf, depending upon if it's easy to capture that intact.
Sometimes there's a place at the end to print a copy, but that isn't always clear at the start. :annoyed

RM
+1
I do the exact same thing.
"We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act, but a habit."
rustymutt
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by rustymutt »

Imagine opening up your balances home page expecting to see your $1,000,000.00 and some odd change, and it shows $23,456,000.00 instead of.
That's what happened to me Thursday morning. So I call and went through all the hoops to have an agent tell me she sees it now. On hold and off the tech support she went handing me off to him. By this time it was corrected. After logging out and back in the issue was resolved, however no explanation was offered.

Something in management is wrong at Vanguard. I expected an reason to this and got nothing out of them. Service has gone at Vanguard. I never get my rep when calling anymore, just a clerk who knows very little, or isn't saying.

:confused
Even educators need education. And some can be hard headed to the point of needing time out.
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Cheez-It Guy
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by Cheez-It Guy »

grok87 wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 9:43 am i think us vanguard mutual fund account customers are going to be forced onto the vanguard brokerage platform eventually/(soon?). vanguard keeps messaging me about it
It's really not a big deal at all. Curious what's stopping you from going ahead with it. What are your specific concerns?
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Cheez-It Guy
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by Cheez-It Guy »

rustymutt wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 9:47 am Imagine opening up your balances home page expecting to see your $1,000,000.00 and some odd change, and it shows $23,456,000.00 instead of.
That's what happened to me Thursday morning. So I call and went through all the hoops to have an agent tell me she sees it now. On hold and off the tech support she went handing me off to him. By this time it was corrected. After logging out and back in the issue was resolved, however no explanation was offered.

Something in management is wrong at Vanguard. I expected an reason to this and got nothing out of them. Service has gone at Vanguard. I never get my rep when calling anymore, just a clerk who knows very little, or isn't saying.

:confused
Thankfully, other organizations don't make such errors:

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/13/busi ... chwab.html

Could have tried the same thing as the funds recipient in that case!
Monsterflockster
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by Monsterflockster »

bengal22 wrote: Wed Apr 28, 2021 3:59 pm
Monsterflockster wrote: Tue Apr 27, 2021 11:06 pm Does anyone have good customer service now days?
Jersey Mike. Chick Filet. It can be done.
I bet you are waiting longer for that chicken sandwich than this guy was on hold at vanguard though.
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ruralavalon
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by ruralavalon »

Cheez-It Guy wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 9:52 am
grok87 wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 9:43 am i think us vanguard mutual fund account customers are going to be forced onto the vanguard brokerage platform eventually/(soon?). vanguard keeps messaging me about it
It's really not a big deal at all. Curious what's stopping you from going ahead with it. What are your specific concerns?
I delayed a long time because I wanted them fix any bugs before I changed platforms.

Late last year we switched to the brokerage platform, it was not a big deal, I have experienced no problems.
"Everything should be as simple as it is, but not simpler." - Albert Einstein | Wiki article link:Getting Started
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Cheez-It Guy
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by Cheez-It Guy »

Now I think it works the opposite way with any new bugs. The brokerage platform gets resource priority, and the legacy mutual fund platform lags. There is still a lot of misinformation floating around among the subset of Vanguard clients who have slept on this, as numerous other threads make clear.
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ruralavalon
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by ruralavalon »

Financial Planning (8/28/2021), "Vanguard reigning champ in J.D. Power's self-directed investor satisfaction survey; Wells Fargo and Merrill Edge lag", link.

"With website issues, trade processing and execution failures, and account statement errors leading the way, problems have impacted 11% of all do-it-yourself investors and 12% of those who seek additional guidance.

As a result, customer satisfaction scores fell across the board for every company ranked."
"Everything should be as simple as it is, but not simpler." - Albert Einstein | Wiki article link:Getting Started
grok87
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by grok87 »

Cheez-It Guy wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 9:52 am
grok87 wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 9:43 am i think us vanguard mutual fund account customers are going to be forced onto the vanguard brokerage platform eventually/(soon?). vanguard keeps messaging me about it
It's really not a big deal at all. Curious what's stopping you from going ahead with it. What are your specific concerns?
mostly on the tax statement stuff. i like it now that i can see each account separately. on my fidelity brokerage tax statement i have to dig into things myself if i want to split stuff out by fund./ i guess i'm talking about dividends, capital gains, etc.
RIP Mr. Bogle.
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LilyFleur
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by LilyFleur »

grok87 wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 1:16 pm
Cheez-It Guy wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 9:52 am
grok87 wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 9:43 am i think us vanguard mutual fund account customers are going to be forced onto the vanguard brokerage platform eventually/(soon?). vanguard keeps messaging me about it
It's really not a big deal at all. Curious what's stopping you from going ahead with it. What are your specific concerns?
mostly on the tax statement stuff. i like it now that i can see each account separately. on my fidelity brokerage tax statement i have to dig into things myself if i want to split stuff out by fund./ i guess i'm talking about dividends, capital gains, etc.
The Schwab website has a tab called "history" and you can specify fund/dividends.
On the main "positions" view, you can see the current market value and cost basis for each investment you own and whether or not you are reinvesting dividends. In my own portfolio spreadsheet, I have a column that shows the capital gains by fund for my brokerage account. Other people could do it in their heads while looking at the website, but that's not me, and I like being able to see, at a glance, the capital gains by fund/equity and the total capital gains for my brokerage account. But of course those are not actual capital gains for that year's taxes.
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Cheez-It Guy
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by Cheez-It Guy »

grok87 wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 1:16 pm
Cheez-It Guy wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 9:52 am
grok87 wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 9:43 am i think us vanguard mutual fund account customers are going to be forced onto the vanguard brokerage platform eventually/(soon?). vanguard keeps messaging me about it
It's really not a big deal at all. Curious what's stopping you from going ahead with it. What are your specific concerns?
mostly on the tax statement stuff. i like it now that i can see each account separately. on my fidelity brokerage tax statement i have to dig into things myself if i want to split stuff out by fund./ i guess i'm talking about dividends, capital gains, etc.
Does this help?

https://personal.vanguard.com/pdf/1099C ... 012021.pdf

I've not noticed any issues with the tax forms. I've been on the Vanguard Brokerage platform for years. Dividends and capital gains are also available by account as paid throughout the year. Any specific concern?
grok87
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by grok87 »

LilyFleur wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 1:23 pm
grok87 wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 1:16 pm
Cheez-It Guy wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 9:52 am
grok87 wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 9:43 am i think us vanguard mutual fund account customers are going to be forced onto the vanguard brokerage platform eventually/(soon?). vanguard keeps messaging me about it
It's really not a big deal at all. Curious what's stopping you from going ahead with it. What are your specific concerns?
mostly on the tax statement stuff. i like it now that i can see each account separately. on my fidelity brokerage tax statement i have to dig into things myself if i want to split stuff out by fund./ i guess i'm talking about dividends, capital gains, etc.
The Schwab website has a tab called "history" and you can specify fund/dividends.
On the main "positions" view, you can see the current market value and cost basis for each investment you own and whether or not you are reinvesting dividends. In my own portfolio spreadsheet, I have a column that shows the capital gains by fund for my brokerage account. Other people could do it in their heads while looking at the website, but that's not me, and I like being able to see, at a glance, the capital gains by fund/equity and the total capital gains for my brokerage account. But of course those are not actual capital gains for that year's taxes.
thanks, fidelity is similar
RIP Mr. Bogle.
grok87
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by grok87 »

Cheez-It Guy wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 1:50 pm
grok87 wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 1:16 pm
Cheez-It Guy wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 9:52 am
grok87 wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 9:43 am i think us vanguard mutual fund account customers are going to be forced onto the vanguard brokerage platform eventually/(soon?). vanguard keeps messaging me about it
It's really not a big deal at all. Curious what's stopping you from going ahead with it. What are your specific concerns?
mostly on the tax statement stuff. i like it now that i can see each account separately. on my fidelity brokerage tax statement i have to dig into things myself if i want to split stuff out by fund./ i guess i'm talking about dividends, capital gains, etc.
Does this help?

https://personal.vanguard.com/pdf/1099C ... 012021.pdf

I've not noticed any issues with the tax forms. I've been on the Vanguard Brokerage platform for years. Dividends and capital gains are also available by account as paid throughout the year. Any specific concern?
it's not really an issue, just a preference.
i can dig into the per fund detail on fidelity.com for my fidelity brokerage statement as well. but i like not having to for my vanguard mutual fund holdings. having just done my taxes, they are complicated enough just using the issued tax forms without having to do additional research. (i know i'm griping...)
it annoys me for example that i need to calculate myself the percentage of the vanguard intermediated treasury index fund dividends that is actually treasury interest and hence exempt from state taxes. if i remember correctly the number was something like 99.6%.
why can't vanguard or fidelity or whoever calculate the dollar figure for me.
the more calculations and research i have to do myself the more chance there is i am going to screw it up, especially as i get older.
i'm trying to simplify my accounts, especially the taxable ones, which is one reason i'm following this thread.
cheers,
grok
RIP Mr. Bogle.
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Cheez-It Guy
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by Cheez-It Guy »

I guess I need to look at what my old tax forms were like to understand what you are talking about. I just import to TurboTax and use the Vanguard US Government Obligations support document.
EHEngineer
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by EHEngineer »

grok87 wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 9:43 am
PCFV wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 9:31 am Been with Vanguard my whole life. I will not transfer out because I do not think the service at Fidelity or T Rowe Price would be any better and I do not like the idea of switching to ETF's or having all my money in a Brokerage account - Funds in a Mutual Fund Company and individual stocks/ETF's in a brokerage account. If you are a plain vanilla investor like myself, Vanguard works - until you need to do something more complex.

This Company is nothing like it use to be when Jack was around. He wouldn't put up with this nonsense. For example, a portfolio Analysis tool that they tinker with every few months, is inaccurate and advises you to put 50% of your money in International stocks and Bonds. Firstly, I thought they weren't in the "advice" business and secondly, what callous and ill thought out advice as the 10 year returns are a 1/3 of the Domestic market. Thirdly, Jack detested International investments and owned none. Besides, the world has changed and most of our domestic investments have International exposure.


They should listen to their own advice and don't give advice - that and get some Flagship reps that are older than 30.
i think us vanguard mutual fund account customers are going to be forced onto the vanguard brokerage platform eventually/(soon?). vanguard keeps messaging me about it
I spoke to vanguard recently and was told Dec 2022 is final deadline.

FYI - When I "upgraded" an account from mutual fund to brokerage it merged my mutual fund account assets with another existing brokerage account. It was a pain to un-merge the assets and all their spec-id tax lots. I recommend calling them when you "upgrade" to make sure the result will be acceptable.
Or, you can ... decline to let me, a stranger on the Internet, egg you on to an exercise in time-wasting, and you could say "I'm probably OK and I don't care about it that much." -Nisiprius
grok87
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by grok87 »

Cheez-It Guy wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 3:27 pm I guess I need to look at what my old tax forms were like to understand what you are talking about. I just import to TurboTax and use the Vanguard US Government Obligations support document.
i also use turbotax and i also use the Vanguard US Government Obligations support document.

so sorry for all these questions, but i am finding it helpful.

how do you figure out what your say Vanguard treasury fund dividends are? do you have to research it on vanguard.com since the treasury fund dividends are part of the total dividends on the vanguard 1099? then once you have the Vanguard treasury fund dividends you have to multiply it by the 99.6% and then enter that into turbotax yourself in the appropriate place.

i don't have to research the treasury fund dividends. vanguard prints them directly for me on my 1099. because i own the treasury fund as a separate mutual fund account.
cheers,
grok
RIP Mr. Bogle.
grok87
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by grok87 »

EHEngineer wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 3:33 pm
grok87 wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 9:43 am
PCFV wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 9:31 am Been with Vanguard my whole life. I will not transfer out because I do not think the service at Fidelity or T Rowe Price would be any better and I do not like the idea of switching to ETF's or having all my money in a Brokerage account - Funds in a Mutual Fund Company and individual stocks/ETF's in a brokerage account. If you are a plain vanilla investor like myself, Vanguard works - until you need to do something more complex.

This Company is nothing like it use to be when Jack was around. He wouldn't put up with this nonsense. For example, a portfolio Analysis tool that they tinker with every few months, is inaccurate and advises you to put 50% of your money in International stocks and Bonds. Firstly, I thought they weren't in the "advice" business and secondly, what callous and ill thought out advice as the 10 year returns are a 1/3 of the Domestic market. Thirdly, Jack detested International investments and owned none. Besides, the world has changed and most of our domestic investments have International exposure.


They should listen to their own advice and don't give advice - that and get some Flagship reps that are older than 30.
i think us vanguard mutual fund account customers are going to be forced onto the vanguard brokerage platform eventually/(soon?). vanguard keeps messaging me about it
I spoke to vanguard recently and was told Dec 2022 is final deadline.

FYI - When I "upgraded" an account from mutual fund to brokerage it merged my mutual fund account assets with another existing brokerage account. It was a pain to un-merge the assets and all their spec-id tax lots. I recommend calling them when you "upgrade" to make sure the result will be acceptable.
thanks for making that call. that's really useful information. looks like i can get another two tax years out of the existing system.

luckily i do not have an exisiting vanguard taxable brokerage account, just mutual fund accounts.
cheers,
grok
RIP Mr. Bogle.
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Cheez-It Guy
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by Cheez-It Guy »

grok87 wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 3:36 pm
Cheez-It Guy wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 3:27 pm I guess I need to look at what my old tax forms were like to understand what you are talking about. I just import to TurboTax and use the Vanguard US Government Obligations support document.
i also use turbotax and i also use the Vanguard US Government Obligations support document.

so sorry for all these questions, but i am finding it helpful.

how do you figure out what your say Vanguard treasury fund dividends are? do you have to research it on vanguard.com since the treasury fund dividends are part of the total dividends on the vanguard 1099? then once you have the Vanguard treasury fund dividends you have to multiply it by the 99.6% and then enter that into turbotax yourself in the appropriate place.

i don't have to research the treasury fund dividends. vanguard prints them directly for me on my 1099. because i own the treasury fund as a separate mutual fund account.
cheers,
grok
The consolidated 1099 of the new-format Vanguard Brokerage Account DOES list dividends by individual fund as well as totaled per fund and the grand total. The automatic import into TurboTax brings in the grand total as a single line item for simplicity, but all the backup is there. Then TurboTax asks you whether any of these dividends were for US Government Obligations, and you just input the total dollar amount that applies. This DOES require one multiplication of a percentage for each applicable fund held, and then a summation, but this is trivial in Excel, and there's no scavenger hunt to find the needed information. It's all there. If you choose, you can easily get it from the Tax Center section of the Vanguard website rather than your 1099, but I tend to use the 1099. It's pretty simple for me because of a small number of funds and an even smaller number that have income classified as USGO.
grok87
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by grok87 »

Cheez-It Guy wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 3:50 pm
grok87 wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 3:36 pm
Cheez-It Guy wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 3:27 pm I guess I need to look at what my old tax forms were like to understand what you are talking about. I just import to TurboTax and use the Vanguard US Government Obligations support document.
i also use turbotax and i also use the Vanguard US Government Obligations support document.

so sorry for all these questions, but i am finding it helpful.

how do you figure out what your say Vanguard treasury fund dividends are? do you have to research it on vanguard.com since the treasury fund dividends are part of the total dividends on the vanguard 1099? then once you have the Vanguard treasury fund dividends you have to multiply it by the 99.6% and then enter that into turbotax yourself in the appropriate place.

i don't have to research the treasury fund dividends. vanguard prints them directly for me on my 1099. because i own the treasury fund as a separate mutual fund account.
cheers,
grok
The consolidated 1099 of the new-format Vanguard Brokerage Account DOES list dividends by individual fund as well as totaled per fund and the grand total. The automatic import into TurboTax brings in the grand total as a single line item for simplicity, but all the backup is there. Then TurboTax asks you whether any of these dividends were for US Government Obligations, and you just input the total dollar amount that applies. This DOES require one multiplication of a percentage for each applicable fund held, and then a summation, but this is trivial in Excel, and there's no scavenger hunt to find the needed information. It's all there. If you choose, you can easily get it from the Tax Center section of the Vanguard website rather than your 1099, but I tend to use the 1099. It's pretty simple for me because of a small number of funds and an even smaller number that have income classified as USGO.
thank you Cheez-It Guy for the very helpful detailed answer. you may have just sold me on converting to the vanguard brokerage account.

it sounds like vanguard's 1099 reporting is superior to fidelity. with fidelity, if i held mutual funds, i would have to go on a scavenger hunt as you put it to get the "by mututal fund" split of the dividends. In practice the only mutual fund i own there is the core account which is the way i have finessed the issue.
cheers,
grok
RIP Mr. Bogle.
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Cheez-It Guy
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by Cheez-It Guy »

Happy to help.
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Toons
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by Toons »

Monsterflockster wrote: Tue Apr 27, 2021 11:06 pm Does anyone have good customer service now days?
Amazon for Me
Excellent for years.
No complaints with Vanguard either
Recently completed a brokerage transfer in kind
Smooth As Silk
:wink:
"One does not accumulate but eliminate. It is not daily increase but daily decrease. The height of cultivation always runs to simplicity" –Bruce Lee
New Providence
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by New Providence »

Monsterflockster wrote: Tue Apr 27, 2021 11:06 pm Does anyone have good customer service now days?
That's a good question. I bought COINBASE stock, but the customer service reviews are terrible.
happypediatrician
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by happypediatrician »

Monsterflockster wrote: Tue Apr 27, 2021 11:06 pm Does anyone have good customer service now days?
I have found them helpful. Just started my investing <1 year ago. Called to open a SEP-IRA, was given the advice to do a solo 401k instead (did know that was an option), now I have a solo K with VG and am very pleased with them, other then the fact that they still won't allow a Mega back door ROTH roll over.
Kids are not little adults
grok87
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by grok87 »

Toons wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 5:06 pm
Monsterflockster wrote: Tue Apr 27, 2021 11:06 pm Does anyone have good customer service now days?
Amazon for Me
Excellent for years.
No complaints with Vanguard either
Recently completed a brokerage transfer in kind
Smooth As Silk
:wink:
if you don't mind my asking, was the brokerage transfer in kind for a taxable account or IRA account?
RIP Mr. Bogle.
bacon4retirement
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by bacon4retirement »

RickBoglehead wrote: Wed Apr 28, 2021 12:40 pm So of the people that complain that Vanguard's service is poor, how many of you have sent a written complaint to them, at least via your account's messaging system?
Is there a Vanguard messaging system? When I attempted to contact Vanguard, the only option appeared to be calling during business hours.
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Cheez-It Guy
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by Cheez-It Guy »

bacon4retirement wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 10:18 pm
RickBoglehead wrote: Wed Apr 28, 2021 12:40 pm So of the people that complain that Vanguard's service is poor, how many of you have sent a written complaint to them, at least via your account's messaging system?
Is there a Vanguard messaging system? When I attempted to contact Vanguard, the only option appeared to be calling during business hours.
Yes. You log in to your account. Select one of the drop-downs for Message Center, and send a Secure Message. Typically receive some kind of reply within a few business days.
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reisner
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by reisner »

OP here. Thanks for all your replies that have taught me a great deal. I'm moving slowly on a possible transfer--a lot going on in my life. I just want to emphasize that my bad experience with VG customer service was not a single instance but a series, stretching from November to May. (The transfer of shares to the Audubon Society has not yet shown up in my holdings.) It involved filling out the same form two or three times; approximately ten phone calls to VG, each requiring a considerable hold time, with that damned tune playing and no indication of what the waiting time would be and no call-back option; three phone calls to the Audubon's broker, who picked up immediately; numerous emails to him and to the Audubon's donation officer; a snail mail to Vanguard; obviously bored VG agents as well as engaged and engaging ones; a fluctuation in the donation amount upward; and much frustration. Luckily I am persistent, but I was growing testy on the phone with the last three agents unlucky enough to catch my call.
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Toons
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by Toons »

grok87 wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 5:54 pm
Toons wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 5:06 pm
Monsterflockster wrote: Tue Apr 27, 2021 11:06 pm Does anyone have good customer service now days?
Amazon for Me
Excellent for years.
No complaints with Vanguard either
Recently completed a brokerage transfer in kind
Smooth As Silk
:wink:
if you don't mind my asking, was the brokerage transfer in kind for a taxable account or IRA account?
Taxable Account grok
All electronic no mailings or papers to sign.
6 days.
One mutual fund and One individual stock
:mrgreen:
"One does not accumulate but eliminate. It is not daily increase but daily decrease. The height of cultivation always runs to simplicity" –Bruce Lee
JackoC
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by JackoC »

Seasonal wrote: Wed Apr 28, 2021 1:28 pm
ResearchMed wrote: Wed Apr 28, 2021 12:23 pm
Seasonal wrote: Wed Apr 28, 2021 11:29 am Every time I see one of these threads, I wonder how common problems might be and how Vanguard compares to other brokerages and note that they do very well on the JD Powers surveys, for example, https://www.jdpower.com/business/press- ... tion-study They come out solidly on top in the latest version.
Perhaps a bit of a self-selection bias in a study like this...?

Those who "stay" with a vendor, especially when there's no monopoly, are likely to be more satisfied than those who leave.
Posting about customer service might also have a bit of selection bias? People tend to post about negative experiences and on a heavily Vanguard board I'd expect the posts to skew heavily towards Vanguard.

Why would there be more selection bias at Vanguard than at all of the firms that scored lower? The waters would seem equally muddy everywhere.
I agree, don't see why selection bias would be any more true of the winners than losers in a survey like that. As to 'heavily Vanguard board', Vanguard is sort of implied by the name Bogle (though everyone knows they didn't part on best terms) so the name of the forum tends to imply Vanguard. And I guess a complete survey might show Vanguard's market share among board members higher than that among all investors. Then again there are many threads starting with complaints about Vanguard, though usually a goodly % of responses say 'no problem here'.

Also as has been mentioned in innumerable threads, Vanguard's tiers of service, and non-advertised aspects and changes, make it a bit murky to know if one's own anecdotal experience is really comparable to the people complaining.

Recently Vanguard screwed up a bit with us. I noticed our rep's name disappeared from the web page when we log in. I figured OK, maybe they were eliminating personal reps altogether (but as typical were not announcing it). So I sent a message about doing a gift transfer (send pdf of the forms one each for wife/me to each kid, then we voice verify, easier than going to bank for signature guarantee) 'to whom it may concern'. Nobody answered for 2 days. But, it turned out (or they said anyway) they were just changing reps and the ball got dropped. The new rep got it done, after another day's delay when 'the system rejected it' at first. Some years that annual gift xfer is the only time I have contact with a human at Vanguard (I print and mail form for share xfers to Fidelity Charitable). Although last year I enlisted them to get IRA money out of CIT Bank. That bank just didn't seem to want to let go of the money after a CD matured. Merrill failed (I also have IRA w/ them to qualify for best CC deal with BOA, and an opening bonus). Vanguard got it done on the second try. Having a specific person to talk to in those situations does help, though again I don't know where that comes out for people who don't have a person to talk to at Vanguard. Also somebody said they are working at 11AM on Monday which of course many people are. But I'm not, and would generally not 'work' on stuff like that outside of business hours so lack of Vang service late night and weekend has been of no consequence in any situation I've actually encountered, wasn't actually back when I was working either.

It also seems some evaluations of brokers are in terms of 'the place to have all your money' but I would not do that regardless of how much I liked a place. I can trade any time relevant markets are open on IBKR (taxable account which serves as standby source of liquidity via low rate margin borrowing, plus tail hedging with equity index options where I want the expected losses to be tax deductible) or TD Ameritrade (IRA used for futures and other trading). Although neither of them are fun to deal with on 'issues' either IME. IBKR once made a serious mistake on an IRA transfer which caused me hassle with the IRS, then insisted it was either TD's (the other end of the transfer) or my fault when it was obviously theirs. I did an ETF trade on Vanguard recently for the first time in years and noticed their trading platform is less pathetic than it used to be though still not competitive with TD (Thinkorswim) or IBKR's Trader Work Station. But again, even if I don't always get 'excellent customer service' with Vang, they aren't even the worst place I put up with, let alone worst in the market. :happy
Last edited by JackoC on Sun May 02, 2021 5:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Mr.BB
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by Mr.BB »

This post reminds me of my all time favorite salesman joke.
There was this salesman, a good guy, he wanted his company to make money and he wanted his customers to happy and satisfied with his product.
He dies suddenly one day and finds himself at the gates of heaven. An angel comes out and says "Hmmm, I'm not sure what to do." The salesman said "you could let me in." The angel replied "we just don't get many salesman up here, how about we try something. You can spend a day in heaven and a day in hell, and then you choose where you want to spend eternity."
The salesman thought this was fair, so starts out by taking the elevator down to hell, he gets out and starts walking around. Rolling green hills, honey suckle smell in the air, he sees a bunch of his friends and coworkers with beautiful women on their arms. He plays the best round of golf he ever played, meets the devil; turns out to be a really nice guy and gives him a Cuban cigar. He has crab and lobster for his meals and anything he wants to drink.

The next day the salesman spends a day in heaven. He relaxes on a cloud playing his harp, takes a nap and has a very nice day. At the end of the day the angel comes by and asks him where he wants to spend eternity? The salesman tells him "I had very nice time here, but I had a great time in hell; that's where I want to spend eternity." So the salesman takes the elevator back down to hell and steps out as the elevator closes forever behind him.

As the salesman walks around he can't believe it. There is a nasty, pungent smell in the air. He sees his buddies in filthy rags eating some crud; it is an awful place. Eventually he runs into the devil. He says, "yesterday when I was here it was wonderful and I had such a great time and now it is so different and bad; I don't understand?" It's simple says the devil..."Yesterday you were a prospect, today you are a client."
"We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act, but a habit."
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TimeRunner
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by TimeRunner »

Mr.BB wrote: Sun May 02, 2021 4:58 pm This post reminds me of my all time favorite salesman joke.
For you, a beer! :beer
One cannot enlighten the unconscious.
grok87
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by grok87 »

Toons wrote: Sun May 02, 2021 4:04 pm
grok87 wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 5:54 pm
Toons wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 5:06 pm
Monsterflockster wrote: Tue Apr 27, 2021 11:06 pm Does anyone have good customer service now days?
Amazon for Me
Excellent for years.
No complaints with Vanguard either
Recently completed a brokerage transfer in kind
Smooth As Silk
:wink:
if you don't mind my asking, was the brokerage transfer in kind for a taxable account or IRA account?
Taxable Account grok
All electronic no mailings or papers to sign.
6 days.
One mutual fund and One individual stock
:mrgreen:
thanks Toons.
RIP Mr. Bogle.
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Toons
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Re: Wish I could quit Vanguard for poor customer service

Post by Toons »

grok87 wrote: Sun May 02, 2021 5:37 pm
Toons wrote: Sun May 02, 2021 4:04 pm
grok87 wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 5:54 pm
Toons wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 5:06 pm
Monsterflockster wrote: Tue Apr 27, 2021 11:06 pm Does anyone have good customer service now days?
Amazon for Me
Excellent for years.
No complaints with Vanguard either
Recently completed a brokerage transfer in kind
Smooth As Silk
:wink:

if you don't mind my asking, was the brokerage transfer in kind for a taxable account or IRA account?
Taxable Account grok
All electronic no mailings or papers to sign.
6 days.
One mutual fund and One individual stock
:mrgreen:
thanks Toons.

My Pleasure
:mrgreen:
"One does not accumulate but eliminate. It is not daily increase but daily decrease. The height of cultivation always runs to simplicity" –Bruce Lee
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