tenancy by entirety for bank account?

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scorcher31
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tenancy by entirety for bank account?

Post by scorcher31 »

I know tenancy by entirety can be used for a married couple's homes in some states as well as brokerage accounts. I was wondering if it can be used in bank accounts as well? I would like to have a large emergency fund in a high yield savings account such as ally, synchrony, etc to gain the best interest I can for it. Unfortunately, when I tried signing up on the website it lets you select a joint account option, but doesn't let pick me tenancy by entirety or state that account is being held as husband and wife anywhere. There doesn't seem to be any section to write this in. Is this even possible? Any thoughts would be appreciated!
Iorek
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Re: tenancy by entirety for bank account?

Post by Iorek »

You should be able to do elect joint tenants with right of survivorship (not as tenants in common) which for most purposes is the same as tenants by the entirety. I think TBE has some additional protections againt creditors of one spouse but I also think it's only available for real property.
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scorcher31
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Re: tenancy by entirety for bank account?

Post by scorcher31 »

I am interested in it for creditor, specifically lawsuit protection, which is why I was interested in tenancy by entirety. I know it works on houses in my state, I know brokerage accounts also offer it (I guess stocks are considered property). I know Florida banks offer it, but I don't live in Florida. I didn't know if it could be done on regular bank accounts as well.
Iorek
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Re: tenancy by entirety for bank account?

Post by Iorek »

It depends both on state law and on the institution. Not sure if it's worth researching state law or local banks (small enough that they don't have to worry about cross-state conpliance but large enough to want to offer different forms of ownership)?
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dm200
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Re: tenancy by entirety for bank account?

Post by dm200 »

As far as I know (and understand), this is governed by applicable state law. I work with accounts like this, and I believe bank accounts can only be titled as defined in applicable state law. In this state, "tenancy by the eitirety" is not one of the defined ownership options. I suspect that is the case in other states, but research this for your state.

I also believe that, unless required by state law, a bank or credit union does not have to offer or allow all ownership types.
dardeninvestor
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Re: tenancy by entirety for bank account?

Post by dardeninvestor »

An an update to this post:

Has anyone found a Tenancy By The Entirety structure at one of the high yield savings banks?

For example, Amex Savings has ours as JTWROS which is not the same thing. They were flabbergasted when I asked them to make it TBE. So I will likely switch if I can find a similar rate with an institution that offers it.
skepticalobserver
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Re: tenancy by entirety for bank account?

Post by skepticalobserver »

Whether TBE is permitted for financial assets is a matter of state law. In my experience of those jurisdictions that allow TBE there’s been no problem with the brokers, specifically Fidelity, Schwab and TD Ameritrade. On the other hand, when I attempt to title TBE at the banks I get the “what are you talking about” look. Of course, nearly every residential property owned by spouses in common law jurisdictions are either titled TBE or, if not, it’s implied. My banks, for whatever reason, want no part of TBE for checking, CDs, savings, etc. Maybe online banks permit it.

Note that a brokered CD in a TBE account should be eligible for TBE creditor protection
dardeninvestor
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Re: tenancy by entirety for bank account?

Post by dardeninvestor »

In Virginia it’s permitted with banks. With Schwab it was literally as simple as signing a form. So that happened instantly.

Do you think I’d just have to write a letter to the bank and see? It’s actually not even clear to me on my Amex statement how these joint accounts are structured.
bsteiner
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Re: tenancy by entirety for bank account?

Post by bsteiner »

Some states allow tenancy by the entirety for personal property.

However, even if you have an account as tenants by the entirety, after one spouse dies, it will no longer be tenants by the entirety. It will belong to the surviving spouse.

If asset protection is important, the first step is to have sufficient liability insurance coverage.

They should also make sure that any expected inheritances come to them in trust rather than outright.

They should maximize retirement contributions and benefits, and if they're in a state where Roth IRAs are protected, they should consider Roth conversions.

There are some people for whom liability insurance may not be sufficient. They may be concerned about something that has a small chance of occurring but which would result in a large loss if it were to occur. For those people, we create trusts in asset protection jurisdictions such as Alaska, Delaware, Nevada or South Dakota, in which they're a beneficiary; or if they live in another state that's an asset protection jurisdiction, then possibly in that state. Before that was possible, we created these trusts in offshore jurisdictions that allowed this.
skepticalobserver
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Re: tenancy by entirety for bank account?

Post by skepticalobserver »

dardeninvestor wrote: Sun Apr 05, 2020 4:25 pm Do you think I’d just have to write a letter to the bank and see?
Call the bank.

I’d familiarize yourself with how TBE works. As noted above liability insurance should be the first line of defense (and will pay for defense costs). In some professions, like medicine, where the stakes are high and premiums enormous, TBE is an inexpensive start.

For most people an umbrella policy with TBE should be sufficient.
dardeninvestor
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Re: tenancy by entirety for bank account?

Post by dardeninvestor »

skepticalobserver wrote: Sun Apr 05, 2020 5:21 pm
dardeninvestor wrote: Sun Apr 05, 2020 4:25 pm Do you think I’d just have to write a letter to the bank and see?
Call the bank.

I’d familiarize yourself with how TBE works. As noted above liability insurance should be the first line of defense (and will pay for defense costs). In some professions, like medicine, where the stakes are high and premiums enormous, TBE is an inexpensive start.

For most people an umbrella policy with TBE should be sufficient.
Exactly. Dual physicians worried about corona and trying to plan for worst. Had an umbrella. Real estate and checking/brokerage with Schwab were a breeze getting squared away. Of all the things, online savings accounts appear to be the hiccup! The customer service at Amex Personal Savings literally had no idea what I was talking about when I called asking about TBE.

Worst case scenario I guess I move the emergency account over to a treasury money market at Schwab but hate to lose FDIC.
TheNightsToCome
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Re: tenancy by entirety for bank account?

Post by TheNightsToCome »

Fifth Third Bank allowed me to title our accounts as TBE.
dardeninvestor
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Re: tenancy by entirety for bank account?

Post by dardeninvestor »

TheNightsToCome wrote: Sun Apr 05, 2020 6:13 pm Fifth Third Bank allowed me to title our accounts as TBE.
At a high yield savings rate like Amex or Marcus?
TheNightsToCome
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Re: tenancy by entirety for bank account?

Post by TheNightsToCome »

dardeninvestor wrote: Sun Apr 05, 2020 6:18 pm
TheNightsToCome wrote: Sun Apr 05, 2020 6:13 pm Fifth Third Bank allowed me to title our accounts as TBE.
At a high yield savings rate like Amex or Marcus?
No. Interest rate is low (pitiful, actually).
dardeninvestor
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Re: tenancy by entirety for bank account?

Post by dardeninvestor »

That's the issue. Unfortunately, I think this will be a limitation of these high yield online savings accounts. Limited experience on their part about how to run a bread & better commercial account.
OCDinvestor
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Re: tenancy by entirety for bank account?

Post by OCDinvestor »

Bumping an old thread.

I live in a state that allows TBE joint bank and investment accounts. Has anyone had success making their Ally account TBE?

I’ve done it with Vanguard. Looking to do this for our joint Ally acct.
OCDinvestor
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Re: tenancy by entirety for bank account?

Post by OCDinvestor »

OCDinvestor wrote: Sat Apr 03, 2021 11:21 pm Bumping an old thread.

I live in a state that allows TBE joint bank and investment accounts. Has anyone had success making their Ally account TBE?

I’ve done it with Vanguard. Looking to do this for our joint Ally acct.
Bump? Bueller? Anyone make successfully make Ally Tenants by Entirety?
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