Job Offer

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BV3273
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Job Offer

Post by BV3273 »

Hello,

I have a job offer on the table 86k base & 75k variable. Benefits are and territory size (I am in sales) equivalent to what I have now. I’ve made 175k in my last few years at my current company. My current manager is a micromanager and the culture has been weird since we were purchased by a larger company last year. It seems to be a lateral move which worries me a bit. I’ve been with my current company for 3 years. I’m super conflicted and have no one to really talk to about it. I’m asking for a higher base later today and a sign on bonus since I have stock vesting in a few months.

Thank you!
Keenobserver
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Re: Job Offer

Post by Keenobserver »

You mention the micro management at your current employer. How much does that bother you? A lateral move in $ may not necessarily be a lateral move in quality of life/ stress/job satisfaction. I have always been willing to take a pay cut for better quality of life/ job satisfacion and dont regret any of my decisions. I would have regretted staying. Never made sense for me to spend most of your awake hours in a place that makes you miserable. Life is too precious and short for that. So dont only think about the $$
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Stinky
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Re: Job Offer

Post by Stinky »

BV3273 wrote: Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:03 am I’m asking for a higher base later today and a sign on bonus since I have stock vesting in a few months.
Let's see how they come back to you later today on salary/bonus. If the new employer makes a material improvement in their offer, I'd strongly consider taking it.

If they don't - are there other positions that you could be looking at? I'd hate to take a lateral move for a better quality of work/life, when there might be another employer who will also improve your work/life with a little more money.
It's a GREAT day to be alive - Travis Tritt
Topic Author
BV3273
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Re: Job Offer

Post by BV3273 »

Update:

Just talked to the manager. Salary is on the higher side so no room for more money there. He is working to see if they can match my options at $34k as a sign on bonus.
rich126
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Re: Job Offer

Post by rich126 »

Good luck. You can always ask and hopefully no one will get upset.

I've done lateral moves, sometimes due to the differing markets or other reasons.

How well do you know the new company? Do you have a strong belief the management will be better?
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cheese_breath
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Re: Job Offer

Post by cheese_breath »

BV3273 wrote: Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:26 am Update:

... Salary is on the higher side so no room for more money there...
Does that mean there's no room for raises for some time?
The surest way to know the future is when it becomes the past.
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BV3273
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Re: Job Offer

Post by BV3273 »

cheese_breath wrote: Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:28 pm
BV3273 wrote: Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:26 am Update:

... Salary is on the higher side so no room for more money there...
Does that mean there's no room for raises for some time?
Probably after the my annual reviews.
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BV3273
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Re: Job Offer

Post by BV3273 »

rich126 wrote: Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:22 pm Good luck. You can always ask and hopefully no one will get upset.

I've done lateral moves, sometimes due to the differing markets or other reasons.

How well do you know the new company? Do you have a strong belief the management will be better?
I used to sell against them in a previous job at a large life science company. They are part of a larger conglomerate so I could always move divisions down the line.
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SmileyFace
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Re: Job Offer

Post by SmileyFace »

BV3273 wrote: Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:38 pm
cheese_breath wrote: Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:28 pm
BV3273 wrote: Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:26 am Update:

... Salary is on the higher side so no room for more money there...
Does that mean there's no room for raises for some time?
Probably after the my annual reviews.
"Salary is on the higher side" is what I always tell new hires - makes them feel like they are being paid well and stops them from negotiating for more :)
Mr.Chlorine
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Re: Job Offer

Post by Mr.Chlorine »

An 8% decrease is too much for me, especially if there is no sign on bonus and 75k is variable. I would look for an internal lateral move or an external promotion until your stock vests. After that, you have more flexibility to take external offers in this range.

***Assuming you can handle another couple months in current role.
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BV3273
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Re: Job Offer

Post by BV3273 »

Update:

They can do 30k on stock, but I need to get back to them by tomorrow am.
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BV3273
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Re: Job Offer

Post by BV3273 »

Mr.Chlorine wrote: Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:50 pm An 8% decrease is too much for me, especially if there is no sign on bonus and 75k is variable. I would look for an internal lateral move or an external promotion until your stock vests. After that, you have more flexibility to take external offers in this range.

***Assuming you can handle another couple months in current role.
Right now in my current job my base is 72.5k and the rest is variable.
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8foot7
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Re: Job Offer

Post by 8foot7 »

This sounds unfortunately like a pay cut both on an ongoing basis and on a one-time basis (since they won't match your options). I think I would search for other opportunities.
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Stinky
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Re: Job Offer

Post by Stinky »

8foot7 wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:52 am This sounds unfortunately like a pay cut both on an ongoing basis and on a one-time basis (since they won't match your options). I think I would search for other opportunities.
Agreed.
It's a GREAT day to be alive - Travis Tritt
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BV3273
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Re: Job Offer

Post by BV3273 »

This sucks. I’m so torn.
anon3838
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Re: Job Offer

Post by anon3838 »

In my experience, cultural and “management” issues are hard to turn around.

It’s likely that what you’re noticing at the current place will only get worse over time.

I earned more in the toxic environment but I was so emotionally exhausted by the end of the day that I had no energy for life.

I guess it would depend on your confidence level that the current concerns might be addressed effectively.
absolute zero
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Re: Job Offer

Post by absolute zero »

Sorry to hear that you’re torn, OP. I have had moments like this - where I need to make a major career decision somewhat quickly (eg in the next week), and yet I’m literally still trying to make up my mind less than an hour before making the phone call.

Kind of crazy how a major decision can come down to the line like that. Maybe I’m just indecisive. Regardless, just reminding you that others have been there before.
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8foot7
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Re: Job Offer

Post by 8foot7 »

BV3273 wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 8:52 am This sucks. I’m so torn.
I think you're right to look elsewhere but if you asked for a one-time match to 34k because you're leaving money on the table by joining them and they argued with you over 4k even though your total package is less, is that a good sign?

Sorry you're going through this but there is greener grass just around the corner.
bampf
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Re: Job Offer

Post by bampf »

8foot7 wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 9:05 am
BV3273 wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 8:52 am This sucks. I’m so torn.
I think you're right to look elsewhere but if you asked for a one-time match to 34k because you're leaving money on the table by joining them and they argued with you over 4k even though your total package is less, is that a good sign?

Sorry you're going through this but there is greener grass just around the corner.
This. 4K is literally a nothing burger to them if you are a sales force. If they chump change you up front I guarantee that they will chump change you later.
Jags4186
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Re: Job Offer

Post by Jags4186 »

BV3273 wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 8:52 am This sucks. I’m so torn.
OP,

If your current job is safe I would encourage you to pass on this offer. You're making a lateral move in sales. Expect to have to work the same amount in order to make the same amount. That doesn't sound like a QOL difference to me. You never know the culture of a place until you are there so the QOL argument only works if there is a tangible benefit on the table (work from home vs office, much shorter commute, etc.)

I will give you my own story. I worked for family owned company for 10 years in a variety of roles eventually ending up in sales. While I liked the job I reported to the son of the owner and knew I would never be able to advance. I ended up making a lateral move to a larger company for a slight bump in compensation and a promise of advancement opportunities. Two years in, at the cusp of making that advancement opportunity happen, the whole management team had been swapped out. I survived the subsequent cull and reorg, but am basically in the same situation I was in before -- a dead end position with no prospects to advance (every new opportunity has been filled from outside the org.). I'm also in an industry highly affected by COVID so there are few prospects to leave. I guess, my point is, leaving may not leave you any better off. In my situation, my resume looks like I advanced quickly at Company A and then completely stalled at Company B.

I've lamented about my situation on anther thread here and the general response has been I'm a fool :|

Don't switch for switching's sake.
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BV3273
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Re: Job Offer

Post by BV3273 »

8foot7 wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 9:05 am
BV3273 wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 8:52 am This sucks. I’m so torn.
I think you're right to look elsewhere but if you asked for a one-time match to 34k because you're leaving money on the table by joining them and they argued with you over 4k even though your total package is less, is that a good sign?

Sorry you're going through this but there is greener grass just around the corner.
They didn’t really argue. They just said that’s the best they can do.
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BV3273
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Re: Job Offer

Post by BV3273 »

absolute zero wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 9:03 am Sorry to hear that you’re torn, OP. I have had moments like this - where I need to make a major career decision somewhat quickly (eg in the next week), and yet I’m literally still trying to make up my mind less than an hour before making the phone call.

Kind of crazy how a major decision can come down to the line like that. Maybe I’m just indecisive. Regardless, just reminding you that others have been there before.
I appreciate your encouragement.
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BV3273
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Re: Job Offer

Post by BV3273 »

anon3838 wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 8:59 am In my experience, cultural and “management” issues are hard to turn around.

It’s likely that what you’re noticing at the current place will only get worse over time.

I earned more in the toxic environment but I was so emotionally exhausted by the end of the day that I had no energy for life.

I guess it would depend on your confidence level that the current concerns might be addressed effectively.
And that’s my greatest fear. They will continue to push us harder and harder with a diminished comp plan. Every October for the last 2 years we went through radical changes. First was the addition of products that were saturated in the marketplace and had significant market share losses and last year a division merge, 20% cut of the sales force, and realigned territories.
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tainted-meat
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Re: Job Offer

Post by tainted-meat »

Not sure if it's too late to respond... but here's my 2 cents being in sales at the same company for over a decade after progressing from other roles:

At the current company, you know how to make money. At the new company, it may take some time before you know how to make the big $$.

If it's truly a lateral, I don't think it's a great move as you may not make the big $$ immediately like you are right now.

People come into the company I work at with successful sales experience, but they don't know how to navigate the organization and many end up quitting because of this.

I'd pass on this opportunity. Good luck!
mayday23
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Re: Job Offer

Post by mayday23 »

Grass isn't always greener. I'd pass on this lateral move, wait for my options to vest and cashout, then tell the next employer you have $40k in stock and you'd like them to make you whole.
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cheese_breath
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Re: Job Offer

Post by cheese_breath »

mayday23 wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 9:54 am Grass isn't always greener....
A little off topic, but somehow an All in the Family episode just came to mind. Archie was sitting in the bar with another guy, and the guy started eyeing a younger woman. Archie says, "What are you doing. You're a married man." The guy makes a remark about grass being greener on the other side of the fence. And Archie says, "Edith's green enough for me." Sometimes it's the same with job offers.
The surest way to know the future is when it becomes the past.
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BV3273
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Re: Job Offer

Post by BV3273 »

cheese_breath wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 10:09 am
mayday23 wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 9:54 am Grass isn't always greener....
A little off topic, but somehow an All in the Family episode just came to mind. Archie was sitting in the bar with another guy, and the guy started eyeing a younger woman. Archie says, "What are you doing. You're a married man." The guy makes a remark about grass being greener on the other side of the fence. And Archie says, "Edith's green enough for me." Sometimes it's the same with job offers.
Ha
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BV3273
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Re: Job Offer

Post by BV3273 »

tainted-meat wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 9:38 am Not sure if it's too late to respond... but here's my 2 cents being in sales at the same company for over a decade after progressing from other roles:

At the current company, you know how to make money. At the new company, it may take some time before you know how to make the big $$.

If it's truly a lateral, I don't think it's a great move as you may not make the big $$ immediately like you are right now.

People come into the company I work at with successful sales experience, but they don't know how to navigate the organization and many end up quitting because of this.

I'd pass on this opportunity. Good luck!
Still haven’t decided yet. My friends in the new job industry think the comp plan is great. I used to work in the same field but in a different territory.
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