Refinance Mega Thread

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BrandonBogle
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Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2013 11:19 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by BrandonBogle » Fri Jul 31, 2020 4:25 pm

chavie wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 4:15 pm
Now, it occurred to me, that I might want to cash out some money and asked for 10k cash out refresh. I was shocked they increased the points from 250 to $2500 for just 10k cash-out.
Only option I have is to get another competing LE so they can match it.
My recommendation would NOT be to do a cash-out refi. Especially if you were only wanting around 10k, do a rate-and-term refi, choose to have an escrow, finance all closing costs, and ask your loan officer to set the loan amount so you have $1,950 coming to you at closing. $2k is the limit for it to remain a rate-and-term refi. Depending on how high your escrow funding needs to be, these could indirectly put several thousand in your pocket.

In my case, I have $2,500 being collected for property taxes due in Sept, $2,500 being collected for taxes and insurance escrow funding, and taking out $1,950, plus $1,200 in closing costs, effectively giving me around $8k in cash out while still classifying this as a rate-and-term refi. Now, in my case lender credits are providing most of that, but it is still cash indirectly (by not having to pay such bills) in my pocket because of the refi.

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NORDO
Posts: 137
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by NORDO » Fri Jul 31, 2020 4:27 pm

Shikoku wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 3:03 pm
NORDO wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 9:25 am
Shikoku wrote:
Thu Jul 30, 2020 3:59 pm
NORDO wrote:
Thu Jul 30, 2020 1:39 pm
Loan Cabin came back (after a little pestering - 4 days after initial application) with a LE this morning.

30 year, 2.500%, $268K, 79% LTV, no escrow ... $1,000 lender credit yields $1,900 total cost.

I expect I can lower the cost by $500 to $1000 using the local title agency from our last refinance late last year; they're working on an estimate right now.
NORDO, That is an excellent deal. Do you mind to provide a breakdown of the Loan Cabin closing costs for different sections? This will be helpful as I am looking forward to hearing from them. Thank you for sharing.
Loan Cabin - $268K, 30 year, 2.500%, no escrow

A = $0
B = $460
C = $1740 ($1350 using local title agency we've used previously)

D (A+B+C) = $2200 ($1810 w/local title)

E = $200
F = $400

G = $0
H = $0

I (E+F+G+H) = $600

J = $1915 after $1000 lender credit ($1410 w/local title)

---------------------------------

Coincidentally our current local bank saw I was shopping rates (they must have alerts set up on our credit reports) and called me; the banker asked me to send them the LE so they could match.

They're coming in even lower, at ~$1000 total. I'm waiting on their official LE to verify but that's what he just emailed me.

I already sent my LC estimate to Better; I'll send the local bank one over as soon as I receive it, too. If they agree to match, then I'll net +$1000 to +$1500 with the AMEX credit. Not complaints here, that's for sure.
Thank you, NORDO. Is $460 in Section B for appraisal?
Yep, $460 is appraisal.

---------

Local lender (current mortgage holder) did come back to me after I sent them the LC LE - and they're even cheaper. Total cost is $1300.

I've now sent the local LE to Better, LC, and WM. Let the games begin! 8-)

mtwhmemn
Posts: 226
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2018 12:07 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by mtwhmemn » Fri Jul 31, 2020 4:31 pm

BrandonBogle wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 4:20 pm
mtwhmemn wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 4:10 pm
Forgive me if I've missed it but can't find the process of getting the $2500 AMEX credit after just closing today with Better.com. Does Better contact me for my AMEX account number or what? When? Thanks.

Also, for those interested in my numbers...

I'm in NC and owed $188k on a $275k home. (I was in a 30 at 3.875 I got last year this time.)

I just closed on a 20 at 3% and I'm netting a gain of around $600, so not a no cost refi but a gain of around $600 after I get the $2500 in AMEX credit. (I'm not counting escrowed taxes and insurance money that I paid or will get back on current loan.)

Thanks.
Contact your closing expert ASAP! The last 5 digits of your Amex were supposed to be collected before closing, after you have reviewed the initial closing disclosures.
Thanks. I left them a message and sent them an email.

topcatin
Posts: 130
Joined: Tue Sep 15, 2015 6:58 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by topcatin » Fri Jul 31, 2020 4:34 pm

anon_investor wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 12:31 pm
topcatin wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 7:43 am
Any idea how long it takes to get to the finish line after the loan at Lenderfi goes to the Underwriter for "clear to close"?
I just closed with LenderFi, here was my timeline:

7/08 Wed - initial app
7/09 Thu - rate locked
7/10 Fri - all docs submitted
7/15 Wed - updated disclosures reflecting lock received, sent to underwriting
7/20 Mon - under writing approved, title cleared, e-signed pre-closing disclosure
7/26 Sun - final disclosure and payment instructions received
7/27 Mon - closing
Thank you! in the final document (Pre-Closing Closing Disclosure) , did it reflect your last payment?
Our loan amount doesn't reflect the latest payment we made. And also I noticed the following now -
- Attorney fee($300) was missed from Section C
- Section G - I see a aggregate adjustment of $520
- "Cash to Close" section there is a $663 Closing Costs Financed(Paid from your Loan Amt).
(Just noticed the loan amt at the time of applying was $663 more, so that is the difference but still they got the wrong principal amount and don't understand why this says it is paid from the Loan Amt or that it is part of the closing-costs)
Did they simply add now a $663? I don't see this even in the rate-locked doc I signed. Waiting to hear back from them.

mtwhmemn
Posts: 226
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2018 12:07 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by mtwhmemn » Fri Jul 31, 2020 4:58 pm

BrandonBogle wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 4:20 pm
mtwhmemn wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 4:10 pm
Forgive me if I've missed it but can't find the process of getting the $2500 AMEX credit after just closing today with Better.com. Does Better contact me for my AMEX account number or what? When? Thanks.

Also, for those interested in my numbers...

I'm in NC and owed $188k on a $275k home. (I was in a 30 at 3.875 I got last year this time.)

I just closed on a 20 at 3% and I'm netting a gain of around $600, so not a no cost refi but a gain of around $600 after I get the $2500 in AMEX credit. (I'm not counting escrowed taxes and insurance money that I paid or will get back on current loan.)

Thanks.
Contact your closing expert ASAP! The last 5 digits of your Amex were supposed to be collected before closing, after you have reviewed the initial closing disclosures.
I just heard from them. They put the request for the last 5 on my portal and I entered it so I guess now I just wait a couple months?

chavie
Posts: 2
Joined: Tue Oct 03, 2017 3:57 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by chavie » Fri Jul 31, 2020 5:41 pm

BrandonBogle wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 4:25 pm
chavie wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 4:15 pm
Now, it occurred to me, that I might want to cash out some money and asked for 10k cash out refresh. I was shocked they increased the points from 250 to $2500 for just 10k cash-out.
Only option I have is to get another competing LE so they can match it.
My recommendation would NOT be to do a cash-out refi. Especially if you were only wanting around 10k, do a rate-and-term refi, choose to have an escrow, finance all closing costs, and ask your loan officer to set the loan amount so you have $1,950 coming to you at closing. $2k is the limit for it to remain a rate-and-term refi. Depending on how high your escrow funding needs to be, these could indirectly put several thousand in your pocket.

In my case, I have $2,500 being collected for property taxes due in Sept, $2,500 being collected for taxes and insurance escrow funding, and taking out $1,950, plus $1,200 in closing costs, effectively giving me around $8k in cash out while still classifying this as a rate-and-term refi. Now, in my case lender credits are providing most of that, but it is still cash indirectly (by not having to pay such bills) in my pocket because of the refi.
Thanks very much, this might work. I'll see what can be done here.
Right now I'm being paid $2 at closing, so I should ask for a little more money and if I understand correctly, points cost should not change. Only monthly payments will increase a little since I'm asking for almost 2k more, correct?

Pessimist55
Posts: 67
Joined: Thu May 14, 2015 12:16 am

LE Fees

Post by Pessimist55 » Fri Jul 31, 2020 5:47 pm

I got a LE from LC.
Do they have the ability to change section E? Looks high.

A 0
B 250 (HOA Questionnaire) I had them add it cuz it's expected
C 1015
D 1265
E, 406.

Hoodwink
Posts: 15
Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2020 6:47 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Hoodwink » Fri Jul 31, 2020 5:51 pm

I have approval on my loan from underwriter and may be scheduled to close next week. Haven’t heard back from settlement company on any closing date yet. I initially applied for loan with a down payment to bring down the principal. Now thinking of not making the downpayment, since even without putting down the loan it is still confirming as my location confirming limit is higher. Does it effect the approval and will it have to start all over again with underwriter approval needed?

SilenceAttack
Posts: 1
Joined: Fri Jul 31, 2020 5:52 pm

Re: LE Fees

Post by SilenceAttack » Fri Jul 31, 2020 5:55 pm

Pessimist55 wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 5:47 pm
I got a LE from LC.
Do they have the ability to change section E? Looks high.

A 0
B 250 (HOA Questionnaire) I had them add it cuz it's expected
C 1015
D 1265
E, 406.
How long did you have to wait for a quote from LoanCabin? I applied on Wednesday and still waiting for a response.

ChiKid24
Posts: 263
Joined: Fri Aug 09, 2019 3:43 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by ChiKid24 » Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:04 pm

topcatin wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 4:34 pm
anon_investor wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 12:31 pm
topcatin wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 7:43 am
Any idea how long it takes to get to the finish line after the loan at Lenderfi goes to the Underwriter for "clear to close"?
I just closed with LenderFi, here was my timeline:

7/08 Wed - initial app
7/09 Thu - rate locked
7/10 Fri - all docs submitted
7/15 Wed - updated disclosures reflecting lock received, sent to underwriting
7/20 Mon - under writing approved, title cleared, e-signed pre-closing disclosure
7/26 Sun - final disclosure and payment instructions received
7/27 Mon - closing
Thank you! in the final document (Pre-Closing Closing Disclosure) , did it reflect your last payment?
Our loan amount doesn't reflect the latest payment we made. And also I noticed the following now -
- Attorney fee($300) was missed from Section C
- Section G - I see a aggregate adjustment of $520
- "Cash to Close" section there is a $663 Closing Costs Financed(Paid from your Loan Amt).
(Just noticed the loan amt at the time of applying was $663 more, so that is the difference but still they got the wrong principal amount and don't understand why this says it is paid from the Loan Amt or that it is part of the closing-costs)
Did they simply add now a $663? I don't see this even in the rate-locked doc I signed. Waiting to hear back from them.
The payoff amount on your existing loan might look like it doesn't reflect your recent payment because it is based on the new principal PLUS accrued interest for the month of July that you have not paid yet. Remember the payment you make at the beginning of July covers interest for June (paid in arrears). So you've accrued a month of interest in July that has not been paid and is added to the principal. Additionally, depending on when your loan funds, you'll also be accruing interest for part of August until the loan funds. That is probably in your payoff quote as well.

This all sounds confusing, but the good news is it all should get worked out in the end. My last refi added a few days of buffer on the payoff quote just in case there were hiccups in the closing/funding process. Those never happened so the payoff on my old loan was too high. Sure enough about two weeks after closing I received a check from Wells Fargo for the interest they had accrued on the buffer days.

Shikoku
Posts: 321
Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2017 11:01 pm
Location: USA

Re: LE Fees

Post by Shikoku » Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:10 pm

Pessimist55 wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 5:47 pm
I got a LE from LC.
Do they have the ability to change section E? Looks high.

A 0
B 250 (HOA Questionnaire) I had them add it cuz it's expected
C 1015
D 1265
E, 406.
That is a pretty clean LE. Since Section E is for taxes and government fees, I doubt they can be reduced. When did you apply? What did you had to do get the LE?
"I don't worry too much about pointing fingers at the past. I operate on the theory that every saint has a past, every sinner has a future." -- Warren Buffett

Pessimist55
Posts: 67
Joined: Thu May 14, 2015 12:16 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Pessimist55 » Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:23 pm

I first called them w some haggling got an agent. After he gave me some numbers I applied w his link so he gets credit (trying to return the favor) then replied to him asking for an LE. Very fast turn around. But they are 60day not 30 day lock

Press 3 then insist on a loan officer. Leaving a VM or msg is worthless.

All was done over the last 6 hours

topcatin
Posts: 130
Joined: Tue Sep 15, 2015 6:58 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by topcatin » Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:26 pm

ChiKid24 wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:04 pm
topcatin wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 4:34 pm
anon_investor wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 12:31 pm
topcatin wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 7:43 am
Any idea how long it takes to get to the finish line after the loan at Lenderfi goes to the Underwriter for "clear to close"?
I just closed with LenderFi, here was my timeline:

7/08 Wed - initial app
7/09 Thu - rate locked
7/10 Fri - all docs submitted
7/15 Wed - updated disclosures reflecting lock received, sent to underwriting
7/20 Mon - under writing approved, title cleared, e-signed pre-closing disclosure
7/26 Sun - final disclosure and payment instructions received
7/27 Mon - closing
Thank you! in the final document (Pre-Closing Closing Disclosure) , did it reflect your last payment?
Our loan amount doesn't reflect the latest payment we made. And also I noticed the following now -
- Attorney fee($300) was missed from Section C
- Section G - I see a aggregate adjustment of $520
- "Cash to Close" section there is a $663 Closing Costs Financed(Paid from your Loan Amt).
(Just noticed the loan amt at the time of applying was $663 more, so that is the difference but still they got the wrong principal amount and don't understand why this says it is paid from the Loan Amt or that it is part of the closing-costs)
Did they simply add now a $663? I don't see this even in the rate-locked doc I signed. Waiting to hear back from them.
The payoff amount on your existing loan might look like it doesn't reflect your recent payment because it is based on the new principal PLUS accrued interest for the month of July that you have not paid yet. Remember the payment you make at the beginning of July covers interest for June (paid in arrears). So you've accrued a month of interest in July that has not been paid and is added to the principal. Additionally, depending on when your loan funds, you'll also be accruing interest for part of August until the loan funds. That is probably in your payoff quote as well.

This all sounds confusing, but the good news is it all should get worked out in the end. My last refi added a few days of buffer on the payoff quote just in case there were hiccups in the closing/funding process. Those never happened so the payoff on my old loan was too high. Sure enough about two weeks after closing I received a check from Wells Fargo for the interest they had accrued on the buffer days.
Thanks for the explanation, but even when I logged in to my current lender and they have a tool to show the "pay-off" amount, it still didnt match my closing doc. So shouldn't these 2 numbers be the same?

ChiKid24
Posts: 263
Joined: Fri Aug 09, 2019 3:43 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by ChiKid24 » Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:33 pm

topcatin wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:26 pm
ChiKid24 wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:04 pm
topcatin wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 4:34 pm
anon_investor wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 12:31 pm
topcatin wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 7:43 am
Any idea how long it takes to get to the finish line after the loan at Lenderfi goes to the Underwriter for "clear to close"?
I just closed with LenderFi, here was my timeline:

7/08 Wed - initial app
7/09 Thu - rate locked
7/10 Fri - all docs submitted
7/15 Wed - updated disclosures reflecting lock received, sent to underwriting
7/20 Mon - under writing approved, title cleared, e-signed pre-closing disclosure
7/26 Sun - final disclosure and payment instructions received
7/27 Mon - closing
Thank you! in the final document (Pre-Closing Closing Disclosure) , did it reflect your last payment?
Our loan amount doesn't reflect the latest payment we made. And also I noticed the following now -
- Attorney fee($300) was missed from Section C
- Section G - I see a aggregate adjustment of $520
- "Cash to Close" section there is a $663 Closing Costs Financed(Paid from your Loan Amt).
(Just noticed the loan amt at the time of applying was $663 more, so that is the difference but still they got the wrong principal amount and don't understand why this says it is paid from the Loan Amt or that it is part of the closing-costs)
Did they simply add now a $663? I don't see this even in the rate-locked doc I signed. Waiting to hear back from them.
The payoff amount on your existing loan might look like it doesn't reflect your recent payment because it is based on the new principal PLUS accrued interest for the month of July that you have not paid yet. Remember the payment you make at the beginning of July covers interest for June (paid in arrears). So you've accrued a month of interest in July that has not been paid and is added to the principal. Additionally, depending on when your loan funds, you'll also be accruing interest for part of August until the loan funds. That is probably in your payoff quote as well.

This all sounds confusing, but the good news is it all should get worked out in the end. My last refi added a few days of buffer on the payoff quote just in case there were hiccups in the closing/funding process. Those never happened so the payoff on my old loan was too high. Sure enough about two weeks after closing I received a check from Wells Fargo for the interest they had accrued on the buffer days.
Thanks for the explanation, but even when I logged in to my current lender and they have a tool to show the "pay-off" amount, it still didnt match my closing doc. So shouldn't these 2 numbers be the same?
If you are using the same estimated payoff date they should be pretty close. There could be an additional fee from your current lender to close and/or record as well. Mine was slightly different but it was all trued up at close or via the check they sent me shortly after.

Cash is King
Posts: 233
Joined: Sun Dec 10, 2017 9:04 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Cash is King » Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:39 pm

topcatin wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:26 pm
ChiKid24 wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:04 pm
topcatin wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 4:34 pm
anon_investor wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 12:31 pm
topcatin wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 7:43 am
Any idea how long it takes to get to the finish line after the loan at Lenderfi goes to the Underwriter for "clear to close"?
I just closed with LenderFi, here was my timeline:

7/08 Wed - initial app
7/09 Thu - rate locked
7/10 Fri - all docs submitted
7/15 Wed - updated disclosures reflecting lock received, sent to underwriting
7/20 Mon - under writing approved, title cleared, e-signed pre-closing disclosure
7/26 Sun - final disclosure and payment instructions received
7/27 Mon - closing
Thank you! in the final document (Pre-Closing Closing Disclosure) , did it reflect your last payment?
Our loan amount doesn't reflect the latest payment we made. And also I noticed the following now -
- Attorney fee($300) was missed from Section C
- Section G - I see a aggregate adjustment of $520
- "Cash to Close" section there is a $663 Closing Costs Financed(Paid from your Loan Amt).
(Just noticed the loan amt at the time of applying was $663 more, so that is the difference but still they got the wrong principal amount and don't understand why this says it is paid from the Loan Amt or that it is part of the closing-costs)
Did they simply add now a $663? I don't see this even in the rate-locked doc I signed. Waiting to hear back from them.
The payoff amount on your existing loan might look like it doesn't reflect your recent payment because it is based on the new principal PLUS accrued interest for the month of July that you have not paid yet. Remember the payment you make at the beginning of July covers interest for June (paid in arrears). So you've accrued a month of interest in July that has not been paid and is added to the principal. Additionally, depending on when your loan funds, you'll also be accruing interest for part of August until the loan funds. That is probably in your payoff quote as well.

This all sounds confusing, but the good news is it all should get worked out in the end. My last refi added a few days of buffer on the payoff quote just in case there were hiccups in the closing/funding process. Those never happened so the payoff on my old loan was too high. Sure enough about two weeks after closing I received a check from Wells Fargo for the interest they had accrued on the buffer days.
Thanks for the explanation, but even when I logged in to my current lender and they have a tool to show the "pay-off" amount, it still didnt match my closing doc. So shouldn't these 2 numbers be the same?

No. As stated in the previous reply, they add a few days of buffer to the payoff quote. You may want to take your daily interest rate and back into the $663. FWIW, when I refinanced back in March they added 7 buffer days. YMMV, but you will get any overage back.

Pessimist55
Posts: 67
Joined: Thu May 14, 2015 12:16 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Pessimist55 » Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:50 pm

I"m reading over the Calculating cash to close section
There's a huge dollar amount in the Downpayment/Funds from borrower line/

D+I is close to lender credits.
What is that line item comprised of?
Image

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NORDO
Posts: 137
Joined: Fri Apr 20, 2012 9:03 am

Re: LE Fees

Post by NORDO » Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:58 pm

SilenceAttack wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 5:55 pm
How long did you have to wait for a quote from LoanCabin? I applied on Wednesday and still waiting for a response.
It took me 4 business days from application + 3 follow-up emails to get the draft LE this week.

User avatar
BrandonBogle
Posts: 2894
Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2013 11:19 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by BrandonBogle » Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:59 pm

chavie wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 5:41 pm
Thanks very much, this might work. I'll see what can be done here.
Right now I'm being paid $2 at closing, so I should ask for a little more money and if I understand correctly, points cost should not change. Only monthly payments will increase a little since I'm asking for almost 2k more, correct?
Essentially yes. Your title insurance policy may also be slightly higher. For me, it’s another $2 ($1 per $1k). If you didn’t select having an escrow, you can turn that one and finance those as well.

nova148
Posts: 43
Joined: Thu May 05, 2016 9:22 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by nova148 » Fri Jul 31, 2020 7:29 pm

McGilicutty wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 1:22 am
15 year at 1.875%, anyone?

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/head-tur ... 00865.html
Anyone feel like this is a marketing stunt?

1) In order for them to offer 1.85 (without outrageous points), they would need to sell into 1.0 MBS and to best of my research, that hasn't been activated yet. Does someone more knowledgeable want to chime in?

2) I'm following this thread since May and it seems most people have had success with Better, LenderFi, LoanDepot, LoanCabin, Watermark, Northpointe (2-3 months back). Never heard United Mortgage Wholesaler being very competitive. Anyone have good luck with them please share?

Maybe UMW is not getting as much business and hence the ad peice?

Btw, quick update: I closed my 15 year, 600K (confirming high balance) at 2.625 with no cost (only prepaid and escrow) in first week of June. Started looking a couple of weeks back and after exchanging LEs between LF and LD, currently am locked with LD at 2.375, 15 year, 597K (confirming HB) with a credit of $800 in my pocket after accounting for all fees except prepaid and escrow. Location is in Virginia.

Having said this, fingers crossed for sub 2 rates.

topcatin
Posts: 130
Joined: Tue Sep 15, 2015 6:58 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by topcatin » Fri Jul 31, 2020 8:58 pm

Cash is King wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:39 pm
topcatin wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:26 pm
ChiKid24 wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:04 pm
topcatin wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 4:34 pm
anon_investor wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 12:31 pm


I just closed with LenderFi, here was my timeline:

7/08 Wed - initial app
7/09 Thu - rate locked
7/10 Fri - all docs submitted
7/15 Wed - updated disclosures reflecting lock received, sent to underwriting
7/20 Mon - under writing approved, title cleared, e-signed pre-closing disclosure
7/26 Sun - final disclosure and payment instructions received
7/27 Mon - closing
Thank you! in the final document (Pre-Closing Closing Disclosure) , did it reflect your last payment?
Our loan amount doesn't reflect the latest payment we made. And also I noticed the following now -
- Attorney fee($300) was missed from Section C
- Section G - I see a aggregate adjustment of $520
- "Cash to Close" section there is a $663 Closing Costs Financed(Paid from your Loan Amt).
(Just noticed the loan amt at the time of applying was $663 more, so that is the difference but still they got the wrong principal amount and don't understand why this says it is paid from the Loan Amt or that it is part of the closing-costs)
Did they simply add now a $663? I don't see this even in the rate-locked doc I signed. Waiting to hear back from them.
The payoff amount on your existing loan might look like it doesn't reflect your recent payment because it is based on the new principal PLUS accrued interest for the month of July that you have not paid yet. Remember the payment you make at the beginning of July covers interest for June (paid in arrears). So you've accrued a month of interest in July that has not been paid and is added to the principal. Additionally, depending on when your loan funds, you'll also be accruing interest for part of August until the loan funds. That is probably in your payoff quote as well.

This all sounds confusing, but the good news is it all should get worked out in the end. My last refi added a few days of buffer on the payoff quote just in case there were hiccups in the closing/funding process. Those never happened so the payoff on my old loan was too high. Sure enough about two weeks after closing I received a check from Wells Fargo for the interest they had accrued on the buffer days.
Thanks for the explanation, but even when I logged in to my current lender and they have a tool to show the "pay-off" amount, it still didnt match my closing doc. So shouldn't these 2 numbers be the same?

No. As stated in the previous reply, they add a few days of buffer to the payoff quote. You may want to take your daily interest rate and back into the $663. FWIW, when I refinanced back in March they added 7 buffer days. YMMV, but you will get any overage back.
Interest is $20/day, so it comes to 33 days interest..probably July's interest ? Seems like overkill.

thrillhou
Posts: 15
Joined: Thu Jul 02, 2020 12:55 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by thrillhou » Fri Jul 31, 2020 9:45 pm

About 25 min ago, LC had the 15 yr showing 1.75% with $0 points. I took a photo with my phone of the screen (I was having computer problems, or I would have just done a screen capture, but that's a different story... ) The 30 yr was 2.375% with $280 in fees.

Now, if I refresh the site with the same loan parameters (318k, 34.4% LTV, etc), it shows 2.125% at 15yr and 30yr is 2.375% with $436 in fees. These are the lowest I've seen; and the first time the 15 yr dropped below 2.25%.

Also, on Rate Rabbit; for 15 yr, there is a line item for 1.75% (1.995% APR) that has lower fees than the 1.875% and 2.0% lines.

Any chance these things are real or more of a marketing ploy? I guess the only way to know is to try it!

e5116
Posts: 553
Joined: Mon Oct 05, 2009 11:22 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by e5116 » Fri Jul 31, 2020 10:21 pm

nova148 wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 7:29 pm
McGilicutty wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 1:22 am
15 year at 1.875%, anyone?

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/head-tur ... 00865.html
Anyone feel like this is a marketing stunt?

1) In order for them to offer 1.85 (without outrageous points), they would need to sell into 1.0 MBS and to best of my research, that hasn't been activated yet. Does someone more knowledgeable want to chime in?

2) I'm following this thread since May and it seems most people have had success with Better, LenderFi, LoanDepot, LoanCabin, Watermark, Northpointe (2-3 months back). Never heard United Mortgage Wholesaler being very competitive. Anyone have good luck with them please share?

Maybe UMW is not getting as much business and hence the ad peice?

Btw, quick update: I closed my 15 year, 600K (confirming high balance) at 2.625 with no cost (only prepaid and escrow) in first week of June. Started looking a couple of weeks back and after exchanging LEs between LF and LD, currently am locked with LD at 2.375, 15 year, 597K (confirming HB) with a credit of $800 in my pocket after accounting for all fees except prepaid and escrow. Location is in Virginia.

Having said this, fingers crossed for sub 2 rates.
You can't get a loan directly with UMW which is why most haven't heard of them. You have to go through a mortgage broker. They're legit is my understanding. When they had the news of a 2.875 for 30-year, there were several posters on here that secured them through an authorized agent. Apparently, they're pretty widespread but it's not like a bank/site where you just apply through them like you do for LenderFi, Loan Cabin, better, Watermark are other lenders that are popular here. Dunno about your point #1 but maybe they're "banking" on it and simply try to win the race to sub 2%...

tuck3979
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by tuck3979 » Fri Jul 31, 2020 10:39 pm

thrillhou wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 9:45 pm
About 25 min ago, LC had the 15 yr showing 1.75% with $0 points. I took a photo with my phone of the screen (I was having computer problems, or I would have just done a screen capture, but that's a different story... ) The 30 yr was 2.375% with $280 in fees.

Now, if I refresh the site with the same loan parameters (318k, 34.4% LTV, etc), it shows 2.125% at 15yr and 30yr is 2.375% with $436 in fees. These are the lowest I've seen; and the first time the 15 yr dropped below 2.25%.

Also, on Rate Rabbit; for 15 yr, there is a line item for 1.75% (1.995% APR) that has lower fees than the 1.875% and 2.0% lines.

Any chance these things are real or more of a marketing ploy? I guess the only way to know is to try it!
Have a friend at Loan Cabin, in fact their home office is nearby in Lombard, IL (Oakbrook Mall area). Very aggressive rates, and will continue to push boundaries. Expect the 15year rates to get sub 2% in August, and this will be across multiple internet lenders.

As for 30year, 2.5% no-cost is the new norm in the next 2-3 weeks for you aggressive shoppers with good profiles. Even though all the lenders are back logged and getting good business handing out 2.75% no-cost, they will still feel the pressure of competition and their margins are super fat at the moment flipping to the 2.0 MBS coupons, so they have headroom to drop further and be comfy. Slickdeals even has a couple proven success stories of people getting 2.5% 30years with credits of $3-$4k from LC and Better (via match). My guess is that somebody in this thread gets a no-cost 2.375% 30year before the end of August. Fun times...

Heres a screenshot of that 15year 1.75% you were talking about
https://imgur.com/a/Azufgpx

hbdad
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by hbdad » Fri Jul 31, 2020 10:42 pm

Got a no cost 30yr for 2.625 at Owning.com for you CA residents. Their website currently advertises 2.75 for the 30yr, but they will give you the 2.625 over the phone and I was told by their rep, that on Monday the website will reflect the new rate.

manatee2005
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Joined: Wed Dec 18, 2019 9:17 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by manatee2005 » Fri Jul 31, 2020 11:55 pm

hbdad wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 10:42 pm
Got a no cost 30yr for 2.625 at Owning.com for you CA residents. Their website currently advertises 2.75 for the 30yr, but they will give you the 2.625 over the phone and I was told by their rep, that on Monday the website will reflect the new rate.
The problem is they won’t let you refinance. So when it’s 2.5% in a month you’re out of luck. I’d wait.

manatee2005
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Joined: Wed Dec 18, 2019 9:17 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by manatee2005 » Fri Jul 31, 2020 11:58 pm

tuck3979 wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 10:39 pm
thrillhou wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 9:45 pm
About 25 min ago, LC had the 15 yr showing 1.75% with $0 points. I took a photo with my phone of the screen (I was having computer problems, or I would have just done a screen capture, but that's a different story... ) The 30 yr was 2.375% with $280 in fees.

Now, if I refresh the site with the same loan parameters (318k, 34.4% LTV, etc), it shows 2.125% at 15yr and 30yr is 2.375% with $436 in fees. These are the lowest I've seen; and the first time the 15 yr dropped below 2.25%.

Also, on Rate Rabbit; for 15 yr, there is a line item for 1.75% (1.995% APR) that has lower fees than the 1.875% and 2.0% lines.

Any chance these things are real or more of a marketing ploy? I guess the only way to know is to try it!
Have a friend at Loan Cabin, in fact their home office is nearby in Lombard, IL (Oakbrook Mall area). Very aggressive rates, and will continue to push boundaries. Expect the 15year rates to get sub 2% in August, and this will be across multiple internet lenders.

As for 30year, 2.5% no-cost is the new norm in the next 2-3 weeks for you aggressive shoppers with good profiles. Even though all the lenders are back logged and getting good business handing out 2.75% no-cost, they will still feel the pressure of competition and their margins are super fat at the moment flipping to the 2.0 MBS coupons, so they have headroom to drop further and be comfy. Slickdeals even has a couple proven success stories of people getting 2.5% 30years with credits of $3-$4k from LC and Better (via match). My guess is that somebody in this thread gets a no-cost 2.375% 30year before the end of August. Fun times...

Heres a screenshot of that 15year 1.75% you were talking about
https://imgur.com/a/Azufgpx
Can you PM me contact info for your friend to take a look at my application? I applied a while ago and haven’t heard back.

Cash is King
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Cash is King » Sat Aug 01, 2020 12:00 am

topcatin wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 8:58 pm
Cash is King wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:39 pm
topcatin wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:26 pm
ChiKid24 wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:04 pm
topcatin wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 4:34 pm


Thank you! in the final document (Pre-Closing Closing Disclosure) , did it reflect your last payment?
Our loan amount doesn't reflect the latest payment we made. And also I noticed the following now -
- Attorney fee($300) was missed from Section C
- Section G - I see a aggregate adjustment of $520
- "Cash to Close" section there is a $663 Closing Costs Financed(Paid from your Loan Amt).
(Just noticed the loan amt at the time of applying was $663 more, so that is the difference but still they got the wrong principal amount and don't understand why this says it is paid from the Loan Amt or that it is part of the closing-costs)
Did they simply add now a $663? I don't see this even in the rate-locked doc I signed. Waiting to hear back from them.
The payoff amount on your existing loan might look like it doesn't reflect your recent payment because it is based on the new principal PLUS accrued interest for the month of July that you have not paid yet. Remember the payment you make at the beginning of July covers interest for June (paid in arrears). So you've accrued a month of interest in July that has not been paid and is added to the principal. Additionally, depending on when your loan funds, you'll also be accruing interest for part of August until the loan funds. That is probably in your payoff quote as well.

This all sounds confusing, but the good news is it all should get worked out in the end. My last refi added a few days of buffer on the payoff quote just in case there were hiccups in the closing/funding process. Those never happened so the payoff on my old loan was too high. Sure enough about two weeks after closing I received a check from Wells Fargo for the interest they had accrued on the buffer days.
Thanks for the explanation, but even when I logged in to my current lender and they have a tool to show the "pay-off" amount, it still didnt match my closing doc. So shouldn't these 2 numbers be the same?

No. As stated in the previous reply, they add a few days of buffer to the payoff quote. You may want to take your daily interest rate and back into the $663. FWIW, when I refinanced back in March they added 7 buffer days. YMMV, but you will get any overage back.
Interest is $20/day, so it comes to 33 days interest..probably July's interest ? Seems like overkill.
Yes, July interest plus a couple of extra days. It make sense because you have not made your August payment.

manatee2005
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Re: LE Fees

Post by manatee2005 » Sat Aug 01, 2020 12:02 am

NORDO wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:58 pm
SilenceAttack wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 5:55 pm
How long did you have to wait for a quote from LoanCabin? I applied on Wednesday and still waiting for a response.
It took me 4 business days from application + 3 follow-up emails to get the draft LE this week.
I applied 2 weeks ago, nothing.

amking
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by amking » Sat Aug 01, 2020 12:02 am

br0nd wrote:
Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:14 pm
I just locked with lenderfi @ 2.5%
30 yr, 510k loan
Enough lender credits to cover all costs except prepaids/escrow.

When I called in to lock the loan, it was a little awkward. Almost felt like an Inquisition
1) we aren't taking loan apps, how did you even manage to apply today?
2) are you sure you are done shopping, otherwise I don't really want to talk to you
3) you owe us your first born if you refi in 6 months ( well that's a little exaggeration but not much)

Was not a very warm conversation, but I can deal with it to save $$
On a positive note they had my application process credited and loan estimate sent within a few hours of me submitting my app..

I snuck in to apply @ LenderFi earlier this week via the link provided here (thank you!), but with the way their website works I can't see the details on the actual closing costs, lender credits, etc (thankfully I did print to PDF the loan option page). No LE available for download. Chased the loan officer and finally just got an email reply that was very much like what you experienced via phone... unfortunately he is OOO Fri until Monday :|

I was down the path with Better Mortgage via the AMEX offer (which they say I applied through and qualify for, but not 100% sure I will get it since I went through a link vs it being posted on my AMEX offers page), but now considering bailing out on that and going with LenderFi. Need to see the real offer details though.

Keep pushing my home appraisal out on Better side, but have provided all docs to get to Underwriting phase.

North Carolina, FICO = 800+, 4 years into current 30 year @ 3.625%
Est. home value = $460k
Balance remaining = $280k

Better Mortgage offer: (which took shopping @ AimLoan and elsewhere to get them to)

15 year @ 2.50%
A = $404
B = $64
C = $1579
A + B + C = $2,047
(no lender credits)

LenderFi offer: (from what I can see)

15 year @ 2.50%
$260 credit
(have no idea what rest is until I get LE, which hopefully will be Monday)


think LenderFi offer will be better?

unfortunately a lot of the other options posted about here are not available in North Carolina :|

manatee2005
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by manatee2005 » Sat Aug 01, 2020 12:06 am

br0nd wrote:
Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:14 pm
I just locked with lenderfi @ 2.5%
30 yr, 510k loan
Enough lender credits to cover all costs except prepaids/escrow.

When I called in to lock the loan, it was a little awkward. Almost felt like an Inquisition
1) we aren't taking loan apps, how did you even manage to apply today?
2) are you sure you are done shopping, otherwise I don't really want to talk to you
3) you owe us your first born if you refi in 6 months ( well that's a little exaggeration but not much)

Was not a very warm conversation, but I can deal with it to save $$
On a positive note they had my application process credited and loan estimate sent within a few hours of me submitting my app..
I had the same experience as you, they very rude few months ago. I actually refinanced a month after I closed with them haha. They didn’t want to match a lower rate so I went to someone else.

Goal33
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Goal33 » Sat Aug 01, 2020 12:24 am

manatee2005 wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 12:06 am
br0nd wrote:
Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:14 pm
I just locked with lenderfi @ 2.5%
30 yr, 510k loan
Enough lender credits to cover all costs except prepaids/escrow.

When I called in to lock the loan, it was a little awkward. Almost felt like an Inquisition
1) we aren't taking loan apps, how did you even manage to apply today?
2) are you sure you are done shopping, otherwise I don't really want to talk to you
3) you owe us your first born if you refi in 6 months ( well that's a little exaggeration but not much)

Was not a very warm conversation, but I can deal with it to save $$
On a positive note they had my application process credited and loan estimate sent within a few hours of me submitting my app..
I had the same experience as you, they very rude few months ago. I actually refinanced a month after I closed with them haha. They didn’t want to match a lower rate so I went to someone else.
So what happened with the 6 month lender credit clawback?
A man with one watch always knows what time it is; a man with two watches is never sure.

Berean
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Berean » Sat Aug 01, 2020 6:14 am

I have locked in a 15-year refi with Better at 2.625%. As we move toward closing, they keep increasing my costs in Loan Estimate section G, "Initial Escrow Payment at Closing." They now want a full year of property tax payments and 9 months of homeowner's insurance payments up front, totaling $7,000. I of course don't want to plop down that much cash up front, which prevents me from generating any interest on that money.

Are Better's requirements standard and reasonable? Is there anything I can do to decrease these costs?

I don't see why they demand so much up front. My credit score is 800. In 11 years on my current mortgage, I have never been a day late or a dollar short on either property taxes or insurance. At the outset of the process, Better said they would waive escrow if I paid an additional $600. I declined.

Berean
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Berean » Sat Aug 01, 2020 6:46 am

Yesterday I heard that United Wholesale Mortgage was offering 15-year rates below 2%. I contacted a mortgage broker and inquired. He said UWM was offering a 15-year refi at 1.99% with 1.5 points. That made it more expensive than my current, locked-in refi with Better, which is charging 0.6 points. Adding in the AmEx credit, Better was a "Better" deal for me.

ymmt
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by ymmt » Sat Aug 01, 2020 7:09 am

totallynotsure wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 5:43 pm
so 3.125% with $12K closing costs is the best i've found on a jumbo 30 year fixed. can this be true? am i missing something?
Not missing anything. This is the current situation in the jumbo market. Might be worth considering an ARM to bridge you until you get below conforming limits, or may be the better open given the stance of the Fed.

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anon_investor
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by anon_investor » Sat Aug 01, 2020 7:31 am

tuck3979 wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 10:39 pm
Have a friend at Loan Cabin, in fact their home office is nearby in Lombard, IL (Oakbrook Mall area). Very aggressive rates, and will continue to push boundaries. Expect the 15year rates to get sub 2% in August, and this will be across multiple internet lenders.

As for 30year, 2.5% no-cost is the new norm in the next 2-3 weeks for you aggressive shoppers with good profiles. Even though all the lenders are back logged and getting good business handing out 2.75% no-cost, they will still feel the pressure of competition and their margins are super fat at the moment flipping to the 2.0 MBS coupons, so they have headroom to drop further and be comfy. Slickdeals even has a couple proven success stories of people getting 2.5% 30years with credits of $3-$4k from LC and Better (via match). My guess is that somebody in this thread gets a no-cost 2.375% 30year before the end of August. Fun times...

Heres a screenshot of that 15year 1.75% you were talking about
https://imgur.com/a/Azufgpx
Fun times indeed! I just closed on a no cost 2.75 30yr fixed. I wonder how long it will take for the 30yr fixed to get to 2.25 or less.

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BrandonBogle
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by BrandonBogle » Sat Aug 01, 2020 8:23 am

Berean wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 6:14 am
I don't see why they demand so much up front. My credit score is 800. In 11 years on my current mortgage, I have never been a day late or a dollar short on either property taxes or insurance. At the outset of the process, Better said they would waive escrow if I paid an additional $600. I declined.
How much they collect has nothing to do with your credit score or payment history (though the option to waive escrow likely does). You can still switch to waiving escrow if you want, even as you are close to closing.

The size the are collecting really depends on when these payments are due and should be generally consistent between lenders as you approach closing. Early they may have unrealistic numbers in there, but all will adjust as closing approaches. Do you not have escrow with your current lender? If so, you should have roughly $7k in that account right now.

whites27
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by whites27 » Sat Aug 01, 2020 8:26 am

I am trying to get Better to match another LE offer and they keep wanting to use the AMEX Statement credit as a kind of lender credit but it’s not since it is not on the loan estimate. Has anyone had them do this to you? I keep saying you need to beat what’s on the loan estimate but then they will come back and talk about the AMEX credit and how that applies against closing costs. And even then, they only apply it against B+C and ignore that A (points) is way worse in their LE. I just feel like I am getting the run around. Any suggestions?

keith6014
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by keith6014 » Sat Aug 01, 2020 8:33 am

anon_investor wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 7:31 am
tuck3979 wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 10:39 pm
Have a friend at Loan Cabin, in fact their home office is nearby in Lombard, IL (Oakbrook Mall area). Very aggressive rates, and will continue to push boundaries. Expect the 15year rates to get sub 2% in August, and this will be across multiple internet lenders.

As for 30year, 2.5% no-cost is the new norm in the next 2-3 weeks for you aggressive shoppers with good profiles. Even though all the lenders are back logged and getting good business handing out 2.75% no-cost, they will still feel the pressure of competition and their margins are super fat at the moment flipping to the 2.0 MBS coupons, so they have headroom to drop further and be comfy. Slickdeals even has a couple proven success stories of people getting 2.5% 30years with credits of $3-$4k from LC and Better (via match). My guess is that somebody in this thread gets a no-cost 2.375% 30year before the end of August. Fun times...

Heres a screenshot of that 15year 1.75% you were talking about
https://imgur.com/a/Azufgpx
Fun times indeed! I just closed on a no cost 2.75 30yr fixed. I wonder how long it will take for the 30yr fixed to get to 2.25 or less.
What is the loan amount and location?

Berean
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Berean » Sat Aug 01, 2020 8:46 am

BrandonBogle wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 8:23 am
Berean wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 6:14 am
I don't see why they demand so much up front. My credit score is 800. In 11 years on my current mortgage, I have never been a day late or a dollar short on either property taxes or insurance. At the outset of the process, Better said they would waive escrow if I paid an additional $600. I declined.
How much they collect has nothing to do with your credit score or payment history (though the option to waive escrow likely does). You can still switch to waiving escrow if you want, even as you are close to closing.

The size the are collecting really depends on when these payments are due and should be generally consistent between lenders as you approach closing. Early they may have unrealistic numbers in there, but all will adjust as closing approaches. Do you not have escrow with your current lender? If so, you should have roughly $7k in that account right now.
Thank you, Brandon.

Do you think I should waive escrow? It would cost me $600 to avoid paying $7,000 up front. If I retained that $7,000 in my Ally account at slightly more than 1% interest for 12 months, it would not earn anything close to $600. It seems that waiving escrow would cost me a lot more than just biting the bullet and paying it all up front.

I escrow taxes and insurance on my current mortgage. The most recent billing statement reports that the lender has disbursed $5,310 from escrow so far this year; my escrow balance is $2,287.

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BrandonBogle
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by BrandonBogle » Sat Aug 01, 2020 8:59 am

Berean wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 6:14 am
I have locked in a 15-year refi with Better at 2.625%. As we move toward closing, they keep increasing my costs in Loan Estimate section G, "Initial Escrow Payment at Closing." They now want a full year of property tax payments and 9 months of homeowner's insurance payments up front, totaling $7,000.
Berean wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 8:46 am
I escrow taxes and insurance on my current mortgage. The most recent billing statement reports that the lender has disbursed $5,310 from escrow so far this year; my escrow balance is $2,287.
That seemed off at first to me, but you are saying “this year” vs. over the last twelve months. Thus, there is likely a tax payment coming up in a few months that isn’t reflected in your prior lender’s statement. What was their full disbursement for the year on the year-end summary they send for your taxes? I think that will be around $8k. Otherwise, I’d be asking for how they are calculating the annual totals to then come back with $7k for taxes plus 3/4 of insurance.

Mako
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Location: MD

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Mako » Sat Aug 01, 2020 9:03 am

Berean wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 8:46 am
Thank you, Brandon.

Do you think I should waive escrow? It would cost me $600 to avoid paying $7,000 up front. If I retained that $7,000 in my Ally account at slightly more than 1% interest for 12 months, it would not earn anything close to $600. It seems that waiving escrow would cost me a lot more than just biting the bullet and paying it all up front.

I escrow taxes and insurance on my current mortgage. The most recent billing statement reports that the lender has disbursed $5,310 from escrow so far this year; my escrow balance is $2,287.
Some states require the lender pay interest in escrow accounts. I was surprised that last year I got a better rate in escrow than in my ally account (though now it’d be less I think). So for me I don’t care about having escrow since I wouldn’t have such things in anything but a bank account anyway and the difference just isn’t much. YMMV. I agree based on the above that it seems odd they are asking for so much, but I guess it could have to do with the timing of bills. I think the amount they can keep in escrow is pretty regulated and they can’t just make up what they want.

amking
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by amking » Sat Aug 01, 2020 9:19 am

Berean wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 6:14 am
I have locked in a 15-year refi with Better at 2.625%. As we move toward closing, they keep increasing my costs in Loan Estimate section G, "Initial Escrow Payment at Closing." They now want a full year of property tax payments and 9 months of homeowner's insurance payments up front, totaling $7,000. I of course don't want to plop down that much cash up front, which prevents me from generating any interest on that money.

Are Better's requirements standard and reasonable? Is there anything I can do to decrease these costs?

I don't see why they demand so much up front. My credit score is 800. In 11 years on my current mortgage, I have never been a day late or a dollar short on either property taxes or insurance. At the outset of the process, Better said they would waive escrow if I paid an additional $600. I declined.
Better continues to do this to me as well. Each new version of the loan estimate has had a higher and higher amount for the prepaids and escrows. My property tax is due in Sept, so I don’t understand why I need to pay so much into escrow for the following year.

I plan to ask them about this in more detail once I’m done shopping

topcatin
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by topcatin » Sat Aug 01, 2020 9:22 am

Cash is King wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 12:00 am
topcatin wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 8:58 pm
Cash is King wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:39 pm
topcatin wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:26 pm
ChiKid24 wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:04 pm


The payoff amount on your existing loan might look like it doesn't reflect your recent payment because it is based on the new principal PLUS accrued interest for the month of July that you have not paid yet. Remember the payment you make at the beginning of July covers interest for June (paid in arrears). So you've accrued a month of interest in July that has not been paid and is added to the principal. Additionally, depending on when your loan funds, you'll also be accruing interest for part of August until the loan funds. That is probably in your payoff quote as well.

This all sounds confusing, but the good news is it all should get worked out in the end. My last refi added a few days of buffer on the payoff quote just in case there were hiccups in the closing/funding process. Those never happened so the payoff on my old loan was too high. Sure enough about two weeks after closing I received a check from Wells Fargo for the interest they had accrued on the buffer days.
Thanks for the explanation, but even when I logged in to my current lender and they have a tool to show the "pay-off" amount, it still didnt match my closing doc. So shouldn't these 2 numbers be the same?

No. As stated in the previous reply, they add a few days of buffer to the payoff quote. You may want to take your daily interest rate and back into the $663. FWIW, when I refinanced back in March they added 7 buffer days. YMMV, but you will get any overage back.
Interest is $20/day, so it comes to 33 days interest..probably July's interest ? Seems like overkill.
Yes, July interest plus a couple of extra days. It make sense because you have not made your August payment.
Thanks for helping me understand. I figured out Lenderfi has the latest principal + 17 days of interest added to it.
My old lender gave a quote for the Principal Bal + interest for 14 days (aug 1 - Aug 14). So does this mean if the disbursement date is say Aug 10, then I should expect a refund for 7 days worth of interest?

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anon_investor
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by anon_investor » Sat Aug 01, 2020 9:36 am

keith6014 wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 8:33 am
anon_investor wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 7:31 am
tuck3979 wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 10:39 pm
Have a friend at Loan Cabin, in fact their home office is nearby in Lombard, IL (Oakbrook Mall area). Very aggressive rates, and will continue to push boundaries. Expect the 15year rates to get sub 2% in August, and this will be across multiple internet lenders.

As for 30year, 2.5% no-cost is the new norm in the next 2-3 weeks for you aggressive shoppers with good profiles. Even though all the lenders are back logged and getting good business handing out 2.75% no-cost, they will still feel the pressure of competition and their margins are super fat at the moment flipping to the 2.0 MBS coupons, so they have headroom to drop further and be comfy. Slickdeals even has a couple proven success stories of people getting 2.5% 30years with credits of $3-$4k from LC and Better (via match). My guess is that somebody in this thread gets a no-cost 2.375% 30year before the end of August. Fun times...

Heres a screenshot of that 15year 1.75% you were talking about
https://imgur.com/a/Azufgpx
Fun times indeed! I just closed on a no cost 2.75 30yr fixed. I wonder how long it will take for the 30yr fixed to get to 2.25 or less.
What is the loan amount and location?
My refi was with LenderFi for $400k+, 70%+ LTV, 2.75%, 30 year fixed, appraisal waived, no cost, closed in less than 3 weeks from initial app. I am not sharing my location in order to remain anonymous, but I others from various states posted receiving the same loan rate/term/no cost from multiple lenders when I was shopping in early/mid July.

It seems like many lenders are swamped right now and rates have not changed significantly since early/mid July. I am guessing rates will start dropping again once lenders are less swamped.

Berean
Posts: 47
Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2020 4:30 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Berean » Sat Aug 01, 2020 9:36 am

BrandonBogle wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 8:59 am
Berean wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 6:14 am
I have locked in a 15-year refi with Better at 2.625%. As we move toward closing, they keep increasing my costs in Loan Estimate section G, "Initial Escrow Payment at Closing." They now want a full year of property tax payments and 9 months of homeowner's insurance payments up front, totaling $7,000.
Berean wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 8:46 am
I escrow taxes and insurance on my current mortgage. The most recent billing statement reports that the lender has disbursed $5,310 from escrow so far this year; my escrow balance is $2,287.
That seemed off at first to me, but you are saying “this year” vs. over the last twelve months. Thus, there is likely a tax payment coming up in a few months that isn’t reflected in your prior lender’s statement. What was their full disbursement for the year on the year-end summary they send for your taxes? I think that will be around $8k. Otherwise, I’d be asking for how they are calculating the annual totals to then come back with $7k for taxes plus 3/4 of insurance.
Brandon, you are good. In 2019, my current lender disbursed $7,994 from my escrow account: $2,343 to insurance and $5,651 to taxes. What does that indicate about Better's fees in my refi Loan Estimate?

Berean
Posts: 47
Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2020 4:30 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Berean » Sat Aug 01, 2020 9:40 am

Berean wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 9:36 am
BrandonBogle wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 8:59 am
Berean wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 6:14 am
I have locked in a 15-year refi with Better at 2.625%. As we move toward closing, they keep increasing my costs in Loan Estimate section G, "Initial Escrow Payment at Closing." They now want a full year of property tax payments and 9 months of homeowner's insurance payments up front, totaling $7,000.
Berean wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 8:46 am
I escrow taxes and insurance on my current mortgage. The most recent billing statement reports that the lender has disbursed $5,310 from escrow so far this year; my escrow balance is $2,287.
That seemed off at first to me, but you are saying “this year” vs. over the last twelve months. Thus, there is likely a tax payment coming up in a few months that isn’t reflected in your prior lender’s statement. What was their full disbursement for the year on the year-end summary they send for your taxes? I think that will be around $8k. Otherwise, I’d be asking for how they are calculating the annual totals to then come back with $7k for taxes plus 3/4 of insurance.
Brandon, you are good. In 2019, my current lender disbursed $7,994 from my escrow account: $2,343 to insurance and $5,651 to taxes. What does that indicate about Better's fees in my refi Loan Estimate?
Half my property taxes are due in June; the other half, in November.

keith6014
Posts: 321
Joined: Thu Jan 02, 2014 11:58 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by keith6014 » Sat Aug 01, 2020 9:46 am

anon_investor wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 9:36 am
keith6014 wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 8:33 am
anon_investor wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 7:31 am
tuck3979 wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 10:39 pm
Have a friend at Loan Cabin, in fact their home office is nearby in Lombard, IL (Oakbrook Mall area). Very aggressive rates, and will continue to push boundaries. Expect the 15year rates to get sub 2% in August, and this will be across multiple internet lenders.

As for 30year, 2.5% no-cost is the new norm in the next 2-3 weeks for you aggressive shoppers with good profiles. Even though all the lenders are back logged and getting good business handing out 2.75% no-cost, they will still feel the pressure of competition and their margins are super fat at the moment flipping to the 2.0 MBS coupons, so they have headroom to drop further and be comfy. Slickdeals even has a couple proven success stories of people getting 2.5% 30years with credits of $3-$4k from LC and Better (via match). My guess is that somebody in this thread gets a no-cost 2.375% 30year before the end of August. Fun times...

Heres a screenshot of that 15year 1.75% you were talking about
https://imgur.com/a/Azufgpx
Fun times indeed! I just closed on a no cost 2.75 30yr fixed. I wonder how long it will take for the 30yr fixed to get to 2.25 or less.
What is the loan amount and location?
My refi was with LenderFi for $400k+, 70%+ LTV, 2.75%, 30 year fixed, appraisal waived, no cost, closed in less than 3 weeks from initial app. I am not sharing my location in order to remain anonymous, but I others from various states posted receiving the same loan rate/term/no cost from multiple lenders when I was shopping in early/mid July.

It seems like many lenders are swamped right now and rates have not changed significantly since early/mid July. I am guessing rates will start dropping again once lenders are less swamped.
:sharebeer great rate! Hoping to get something like that in October -- tied to LenderFi's 6 month waiting period.

User avatar
anon_investor
Posts: 2697
Joined: Mon Jun 03, 2019 1:43 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by anon_investor » Sat Aug 01, 2020 9:52 am

keith6014 wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 9:46 am
anon_investor wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 9:36 am
keith6014 wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 8:33 am
anon_investor wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 7:31 am
tuck3979 wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 10:39 pm
Have a friend at Loan Cabin, in fact their home office is nearby in Lombard, IL (Oakbrook Mall area). Very aggressive rates, and will continue to push boundaries. Expect the 15year rates to get sub 2% in August, and this will be across multiple internet lenders.

As for 30year, 2.5% no-cost is the new norm in the next 2-3 weeks for you aggressive shoppers with good profiles. Even though all the lenders are back logged and getting good business handing out 2.75% no-cost, they will still feel the pressure of competition and their margins are super fat at the moment flipping to the 2.0 MBS coupons, so they have headroom to drop further and be comfy. Slickdeals even has a couple proven success stories of people getting 2.5% 30years with credits of $3-$4k from LC and Better (via match). My guess is that somebody in this thread gets a no-cost 2.375% 30year before the end of August. Fun times...

Heres a screenshot of that 15year 1.75% you were talking about
https://imgur.com/a/Azufgpx
Fun times indeed! I just closed on a no cost 2.75 30yr fixed. I wonder how long it will take for the 30yr fixed to get to 2.25 or less.
What is the loan amount and location?
My refi was with LenderFi for $400k+, 70%+ LTV, 2.75%, 30 year fixed, appraisal waived, no cost, closed in less than 3 weeks from initial app. I am not sharing my location in order to remain anonymous, but I others from various states posted receiving the same loan rate/term/no cost from multiple lenders when I was shopping in early/mid July.

It seems like many lenders are swamped right now and rates have not changed significantly since early/mid July. I am guessing rates will start dropping again once lenders are less swamped.
:sharebeer great rate! Hoping to get something like that in October -- tied to LenderFi's 6 month waiting period.
Good luck! :sharebeer

Others have reported LenderFi proactively contacting them offering a no cost refi after the 6 months. I will be looking out for that next year. Who know how low rates will be!

ChiKid24
Posts: 263
Joined: Fri Aug 09, 2019 3:43 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by ChiKid24 » Sat Aug 01, 2020 10:12 am

topcatin wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 9:22 am
Cash is King wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 12:00 am
topcatin wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 8:58 pm
Cash is King wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:39 pm
topcatin wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:26 pm

Thanks for the explanation, but even when I logged in to my current lender and they have a tool to show the "pay-off" amount, it still didnt match my closing doc. So shouldn't these 2 numbers be the same?

No. As stated in the previous reply, they add a few days of buffer to the payoff quote. You may want to take your daily interest rate and back into the $663. FWIW, when I refinanced back in March they added 7 buffer days. YMMV, but you will get any overage back.
Interest is $20/day, so it comes to 33 days interest..probably July's interest ? Seems like overkill.
Yes, July interest plus a couple of extra days. It make sense because you have not made your August payment.
Thanks for helping me understand. I figured out Lenderfi has the latest principal + 17 days of interest added to it.
My old lender gave a quote for the Principal Bal + interest for 14 days (aug 1 - Aug 14). So does this mean if the disbursement date is say Aug 10, then I should expect a refund for 7 days worth of interest?
Thats correct. As mentioned previously, you'll get a check from your current lender for the lower intetest a few weeks after the loan funds.

sharker10
Posts: 10
Joined: Wed Jul 29, 2020 2:45 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by sharker10 » Sat Aug 01, 2020 10:32 am

sharker10 wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 2:46 pm
MrJedi wrote:
Thu Jul 30, 2020 10:05 am
sharker10 wrote:
Thu Jul 30, 2020 9:43 am
Thanks guys, yea my numbers are wrong then. Realized a bit ago while reading some more that I am including sections F + G in that 3.3k. So my Fees right now are:

A: $839
B: $351
C: $785
E: $60

So I would need a lender credit of roughly $2050 to have a true no cost refi. I will reach out to the loan officer they assigned me to see what it would cost me rate wise to get that credit. I also reached out to WaterMark to get a Loan estimate from them as well.
Typically when you are asking for lender credits, section A goes to zero. So what you are looking for is section A=$0 and then lender credits line in section J to be roughly $1196 in your case (offsetting A+B+C+E). That will be a true no cost refinance.

This will move the rate up a bit, but if it's a better rate than your current loan, you save money immediately. As you know now, sections F and G are costs you need to pay anyway without refinancing.

Edit: see commentary below about section A vs lender credits, other lenders might leave section A and put a bigger number in lender credits. The main point is to do the math and verify, since there is not a single line that tells you the whole story.
Thanks everyone for your help. I finally received a reply from LenderFi and the lowest they can offer is 3% with credit covering A,B,C, and E fully. I think this is a pretty solid offer considering im only financing 160k. I wish I could get a response from WaterMark, no reply online and over the phone they just took my info and told me they would contact me soon.

Do you think its worth locking this in with LenderFi?

Anyone with data points with low mortgage balance? Worth the lock here? Any tips to get a quick reply from WM?

Thanks!!

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