My New Car Buying Tips

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Helo80
Posts: 1580
Joined: Sat Apr 29, 2017 8:47 pm

Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by Helo80 » Mon Jul 06, 2020 7:40 pm

RetiredCSProf wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 7:25 pm
Given that the financing is through the car company's financial services, I do not understand why they are inconsistent in the loan terms.

A general rule of thumb is that you cannot double-dip on the incentives. You cannot have both cash-back and a subvented rate.

Go to the factory's incentives page for your zip and/or go here: https://www.edmunds.com/car-incentives/

Read the fine-print and if it says you can stack a cash back rebate, as well as, special financing terms... then that's something to clarify with your salesman. Since you're CS, it's actually a very binary decision that should be spelled out clearly in the incentive fine print.

hudson
Posts: 3038
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2007 9:15 am

Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by hudson » Mon Jul 06, 2020 8:35 pm

RetiredCSProf,

It looks like you don't have a lot of leverage because there aren't many cars out there.
You do have the leverage of where and when you buy your vehicle.
I would pick one, the lease or the purchase and ask for out the door price. I keep financing and trade-ins separate. I want the price that I have to pay first. If you do otherwise, things can get out of hand.

James Bragg is a great buying coach. He charges $50 for his package and his coaching. He is also good at lease negotiation. I know nothing about leasing. I've used James to buy my last 4 vehicles. https://fightingchance.com/

I never try to get a price at a dealership; I get prices by phone. If I go to a dealership, I exchange contact information with the people I talk to. I freely give out my address, cell phone, and email. I want them to know that I'm a straight shooter and a serious buyer.

When I call on the phone, I also want them to believe that I'm a serious buyer and I exchange contact information.

I'd find out what's on their lot and I'd ask for an out the door price. I'd do that for all of your dealers that are interested. Once you have a list of your cars and prices, you can look at the results. By this time, you should have a good feel for what's out there and the prices. I'm not sure if you can go another round and get lower bids. If there aren't many cars out there, it may not be possible.

Until you get a list of out the door prices, it's hard to know what to do next. If you see a fair deal, you may want to go for it. Or get your name on one that's coming from the port.

When I've run the bid system, the vehicles that I wanted were plentiful. It was a buyers market. For each vehicle, I usually ended up with 5 dealers that would go 2 rounds and 2 or 3 dealers who go to a third round.

Bottom line? You need to figure out if it's a seller's market. If it is, your only leverage is who you chose to buy from. Waiting until the end of the month to try and work a deal may not work in this environment.

lakja
Posts: 107
Joined: Mon Nov 06, 2017 5:34 pm

Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by lakja » Mon Jul 06, 2020 8:45 pm

hudson wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 8:35 pm
RetiredCSProf,

It looks like you don't have a lot of leverage because there aren't many cars out there.
You do have the leverage of where and when you buy your vehicle.
I would pick one, the lease or the purchase and ask for out the door price. I keep financing and trade-ins separate. I want the price that I have to pay first. If you do otherwise, things can get out of hand.

When I've run the bid system, the vehicles that I wanted were plentiful. It was a buyers market. For each vehicle, I usually ended up with 5 dealers that would go 2 rounds and 2 or 3 dealers who go to a third round.

Bottom line? You need to figure out if it's a seller's market. If it is, your only leverage is who you chose to buy from. Waiting until the end of the month to try and work a deal may not work in this environment.
Dealers have to know if you’re leasing or buying. There’s different incentives and rebates for each, so sales price is dependent if you’re buying or leasing. There’s no way around this.

Secondly, I’d love to know how you get dealers to respond to your emails asking OTD price? I’ve never had any success doing cold emails. They usually never respond or when they do, it says to come in and we’ll talk. I will say that I have had much better success with making calls, but nothing final has been agreed to by the sales manager unless you come in the store, wait around, forced to test drive the car, etcetera.

How are you having success using your approach with email? What are you doing that magically makes dealers respond via email? I’d love to know what I’m doing wrong. I’ve bought four cars in the last three years and this approach always sounded good online, but when I attempt to implement it, it seems more like an online fairy tale.

hudson
Posts: 3038
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2007 9:15 am

Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by hudson » Mon Jul 06, 2020 8:49 pm

lakja wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 8:45 pm
hudson wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 8:35 pm
RetiredCSProf,

It looks like you don't have a lot of leverage because there aren't many cars out there.
You do have the leverage of where and when you buy your vehicle.
I would pick one, the lease or the purchase and ask for out the door price. I keep financing and trade-ins separate. I want the price that I have to pay first. If you do otherwise, things can get out of hand.

When I've run the bid system, the vehicles that I wanted were plentiful. It was a buyers market. For each vehicle, I usually ended up with 5 dealers that would go 2 rounds and 2 or 3 dealers who go to a third round.

Bottom line? You need to figure out if it's a seller's market. If it is, your only leverage is who you chose to buy from. Waiting until the end of the month to try and work a deal may not work in this environment.
Dealers have to know if you’re leasing or buying. There’s different incentives and rebates for each, so sales price is dependent if you’re buying or leasing. There’s no way around this.

Secondly, I’d love to know how you get dealers to respond to your emails asking OTD price? I’ve never had any success doing cold emails. They usually never respond or when they do, it says to come in and we’ll talk. I will say that I have had much better success with making calls, but nothing final has been agreed to by the sales manager unless you come in the store, wait around, forced to test drive the car, etcetera.

How are you having success using your approach with email? What are you doing that magically makes dealers respond via email? I’d love to know what I’m doing wrong. I’ve bought four cars in the last three years and this approach always sounded good online, but when I attempt to implement it, it seems more like an online fairy tale.
I'm with you.
I never email to get prices; I always use the phone. Maybe you're asking retiredCSProf?

lakja
Posts: 107
Joined: Mon Nov 06, 2017 5:34 pm

Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by lakja » Mon Jul 06, 2020 8:53 pm

hudson wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 8:49 pm
lakja wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 8:45 pm
hudson wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 8:35 pm
RetiredCSProf,

It looks like you don't have a lot of leverage because there aren't many cars out there.
You do have the leverage of where and when you buy your vehicle.
I would pick one, the lease or the purchase and ask for out the door price. I keep financing and trade-ins separate. I want the price that I have to pay first. If you do otherwise, things can get out of hand.

When I've run the bid system, the vehicles that I wanted were plentiful. It was a buyers market. For each vehicle, I usually ended up with 5 dealers that would go 2 rounds and 2 or 3 dealers who go to a third round.

Bottom line? You need to figure out if it's a seller's market. If it is, your only leverage is who you chose to buy from. Waiting until the end of the month to try and work a deal may not work in this environment.
Dealers have to know if you’re leasing or buying. There’s different incentives and rebates for each, so sales price is dependent if you’re buying or leasing. There’s no way around this.

Secondly, I’d love to know how you get dealers to respond to your emails asking OTD price? I’ve never had any success doing cold emails. They usually never respond or when they do, it says to come in and we’ll talk. I will say that I have had much better success with making calls, but nothing final has been agreed to by the sales manager unless you come in the store, wait around, forced to test drive the car, etcetera.

How are you having success using your approach with email? What are you doing that magically makes dealers respond via email? I’d love to know what I’m doing wrong. I’ve bought four cars in the last three years and this approach always sounded good online, but when I attempt to implement it, it seems more like an online fairy tale.
I'm with you.
I never email to get prices; I always use the phone. Maybe you're asking retiredCSProf?
You’re probably right. However, when you call, you lock on a price, come in, test drive and sign? Are you talking with sales manager or a salesman?

hudson
Posts: 3038
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2007 9:15 am

Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by hudson » Mon Jul 06, 2020 9:08 pm

lakja wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 8:53 pm
hudson wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 8:49 pm
lakja wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 8:45 pm
hudson wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 8:35 pm
RetiredCSProf,

It looks like you don't have a lot of leverage because there aren't many cars out there.
You do have the leverage of where and when you buy your vehicle.
I would pick one, the lease or the purchase and ask for out the door price. I keep financing and trade-ins separate. I want the price that I have to pay first. If you do otherwise, things can get out of hand.

When I've run the bid system, the vehicles that I wanted were plentiful. It was a buyers market. For each vehicle, I usually ended up with 5 dealers that would go 2 rounds and 2 or 3 dealers who go to a third round.

Bottom line? You need to figure out if it's a seller's market. If it is, your only leverage is who you chose to buy from. Waiting until the end of the month to try and work a deal may not work in this environment.
Dealers have to know if you’re leasing or buying. There’s different incentives and rebates for each, so sales price is dependent if you’re buying or leasing. There’s no way around this.

Secondly, I’d love to know how you get dealers to respond to your emails asking OTD price? I’ve never had any success doing cold emails. They usually never respond or when they do, it says to come in and we’ll talk. I will say that I have had much better success with making calls, but nothing final has been agreed to by the sales manager unless you come in the store, wait around, forced to test drive the car, etcetera.

How are you having success using your approach with email? What are you doing that magically makes dealers respond via email? I’d love to know what I’m doing wrong. I’ve bought four cars in the last three years and this approach always sounded good online, but when I attempt to implement it, it seems more like an online fairy tale.
I'm with you.
I never email to get prices; I always use the phone. Maybe you're asking retiredCSProf?
You’re probably right. However, when you call, you lock on a price, come in, test drive and sign? Are you talking with sales manager or a salesman?
Recently it's been the salesperson early in the negotiations. Sometimes a manager will get involved....I think because I've given them a short timeline and they don't want to miss the boat. I've gotten quotes from managers late at night.

I bought my last vehicle in the summer of 2018. I never had to come in to get a price. (I had already test driven and picked out the exact vehicle that I wanted.) I waited until the end of the month, I called a number of dealers and told them that I was a serious buyer who is buying a car in 2 days, and I want an out the door price. If I called 8 dealers, two or three refused. The rest gave me prices. After I got enough bids, I'd go another round. All dealers were giving OTD prices on pretty much identical vehicles. I'd tell them that another dealer had quoted me a price of say $36500, so I'll probably buy from them. Then I wouldn't say another word. They know what they have to do to stay alive. I'll repeat that with the other dealers that gave me an OTD price. I usually have 2-4 dealers who want to make a sale. I doesn't take long after that to get the lowest price. On day 2 or 3, I'm picking up my vehicle.

It sounds like the game may have changed. I wonder what James Bragg would say? If a dealer asked him to come in, he would probably say, "You do want to sell a car don't you?"

RetiredCSProf
Posts: 435
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Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by RetiredCSProf » Tue Jul 07, 2020 1:39 am

lakja wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 8:45 pm
How are you having success using your approach with email? What are you doing that magically makes dealers respond via email? I’d love to know what I’m doing wrong. I’ve bought four cars in the last three years and this approach always sounded good online, but when I attempt to implement it, it seems more like an online fairy tale.
I called the second dealership, I did not send an email. Their website showed 11 vehicles (arrived within the past two weeks). The salesperson said they were selling quickly and only four were left. I made tentative plans to visit the next day. The sales manager called back and explained that seven vehicles are in transit (at the port), two are on the lot, and one each at their "sister locations." The sales manager offered to send me a quote by email.

The car manufacturer's website shows an offer of up to $3K discount AND 0.9% financing on new 2020 models. Website says nothing about 2021 models.

The first dealership offered me the manufacturer's deal plus a standard $2K loyalty discount (for "returning customers"); i.e., a $5K discount off the MSRP. The second dealership is offering a $2K discount off the MSRP -- but it is unclear whether it is a loyalty rebate or an APR credit.

inbox788
Posts: 7242
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2012 5:24 pm

Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by inbox788 » Tue Jul 07, 2020 2:23 pm

RetiredCSProf wrote:
Tue Jul 07, 2020 1:39 am
The first dealership offered me the manufacturer's deal plus a standard $2K loyalty discount (for "returning customers"); i.e., a $5K discount off the MSRP. The second dealership is offering a $2K discount off the MSRP -- but it is unclear whether it is a loyalty rebate or an APR credit.
It's the Tuesday Special. Don't fret over what it's called, just focus on the total out the door price you would pay at one dealer vs. another. Would you care if they didn't give you any of these named offerings and just took 10k off the price? Naming rights don't apply to sales. It's just a gimmick, and at best it provides advertising value, which as a buyer, you really don't care for. (and same applies to useless junk options and services they add to pad expenses and raise prices; don't pay for the extra warranties, service plans, paint protection, fabric spray, disinfecting, etc. that just pure profit for the dealer.)

RetiredCSProf
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Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by RetiredCSProf » Tue Jul 07, 2020 11:52 pm

On face value, the offer from the 1st dealership sounds better - $5K discount off the MSRP and 0.9% financing versus $2K discount off the MSRP and 4.99% financing.

The 1st salesman added $699 for a protective coating, "PermaPlate," on the interior and exterior. I declined it; he said it was mandated by the manufacturer and it would invalidate the warranty if I refused it. Same with anti-theft Phantom Footprints for $160. I knew these were not mandated and left.

The 2nd dealership called back today and explained that the $2K discount "combines" a $1K loyalty discount and a $1K APR discount. They explained that the 4.99% APR is their highest rate and they don't want to "over-promise." In other words, they are not going to negotiate a deal with me unless I am in their showroom and ready to submit to a credit check. There are two mystery charges on their invoice, $30 for "electronic processing" and an $80 "weight fee," which is charged by the DMV for commercial vehicles only.

hudson
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Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by hudson » Wed Jul 08, 2020 6:45 am

RetiredCSProf wrote:
Tue Jul 07, 2020 11:52 pm
On face value, the offer from the 1st dealership sounds better - $5K discount off the MSRP and 0.9% financing versus $2K discount off the MSRP and 4.99% financing.

The 1st salesman added $699 for a protective coating, "PermaPlate," on the interior and exterior. I declined it; he said it was mandated by the manufacturer and it would invalidate the warranty if I refused it. Same with anti-theft Phantom Footprints for $160. I knew these were not mandated and left.

The 2nd dealership called back today and explained that the $2K discount "combines" a $1K loyalty discount and a $1K APR discount. They explained that the 4.99% APR is their highest rate and they don't want to "over-promise." In other words, they are not going to negotiate a deal with me unless I am in their showroom and ready to submit to a credit check. There are two mystery charges on their invoice, $30 for "electronic processing" and an $80 "weight fee," which is charged by the DMV for commercial vehicles only.
I don't care about the extras or any charges. Most of the insane protective coatings and the like are of course dealer profit...but I don't care. They aren't going to remove them because that stuff is already there. I just want the out the door price; that way I can compare their price with the price that other dealers give me. I don't even discuss those details. I don't discuss loans. If they ask about loan or incentive; I always say incentive. It's all about the OTD price....at least for me.

Years ago before I ran the bid system, I would complain about all those insane dealer profit items and charges on the sticker. They never took them off. They never wavered. I bought the vehicle anyway.

After I got my OTD prices, and I'd selected the dealer with the lowest OTD price, then I would talk about the loan. If you talk about financing before, you muddy the water.

Here's what I paid for the extras on a 2013 Toyota....from the Mulroney Sticker:
Southeast Toyota Distributor Plus Certified Technician 46 Point Final Quality Inspection, Digital Picture Asset Program...no charge
Legal Window Tint for my state....$299
Hand Painted Pinstripe, Floor Mats....$602
Delivery Processing and Handling....$950

I've read from James Bragg that the delivery charge is OK. He coaches, "Don't sweat those dealer profit details, focus on the OTD price."

RetiredCSProf
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Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by RetiredCSProf » Sat Jul 11, 2020 7:54 pm

I now have four bids. I find it easier to compare the bids by "discounts" rather than by OTD price because:

A) The vehicles I'm considering have the same base price, but vary in factory-installed options, changing the MSRP by as much as $2K.
B) The manufacturer is offering a $2K discount off the MSRP, which all the dealerships are honoring
C) Two dealerships gave me an OTD price; three dealerships gave me their discount; that is, the amount they are taking off the MSRP before taxes and before the manufacturer's incentive
D) Sales tax is 9.5% in my area, so that compounds any discount I'm given

In the end, it will come down to which vehicle I want -- each one has different options and different color. Probably not the red car with cognac leather seats -- I suspect that one was special ordered by a customer.

Editing my post: I now realize that the manufacturer's $2K discount (also referred to as "cash back," "APR credit," or "loyalty discount" was not off the MSRP, but is instead a "downpayment credit" -- thus, it does not reduce the sales tax on the purchase. For this model, there was no "cash back or reduced APR choice," it was simply "cash back" if financing through the manufacturer.
Last edited by RetiredCSProf on Sat Jul 18, 2020 2:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

hudson
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Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by hudson » Sat Jul 11, 2020 8:39 pm

RetiredCSProf wrote:
Sat Jul 11, 2020 7:54 pm
I now have four bids. I find it easier to compare the bids by "discounts" rather than by OTD price because:

A) The vehicles I'm considering have the same base price, but vary in factory-installed options, changing the MSRP by as much as $2K.
B) The manufacturer is offering a $2K discount off the MSRP, which all the dealerships are honoring
C) Two dealerships gave me an OTD price; three dealerships gave me their discount; that is, the amount they are taking off the MSRP before taxes and before the manufacturer's incentive
D) Sales tax is 9.5% in my area, so that compounds any discount I'm given

In the end, it will come down to which vehicle I want -- each one has different options and different color. Probably not the red car with cognac leather seats -- I suspect that one was special ordered by a customer.
RetiredCSProf,

It sounds like you're on track. You are working 4 dealerships. It sounds like 3 are possibles. Maybe pick one as the best deal and tell the other 2 dealers that you are probably going with another dealer. You are going to make a final decision in say 3 hours....or in 1 day. Wait and see if they drop their price.
Last edited by hudson on Sat Jul 11, 2020 9:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

RunMarkRun
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Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by RunMarkRun » Sat Jul 11, 2020 8:56 pm

I would be all over the red one with cognac leather seats!

worthit
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Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by worthit » Fri Jul 17, 2020 5:13 pm

I have just started my vehicle buying process and came across this helpful posting. But hoping someone can help me here. My question is below the original post.
denovo wrote:
Sun Oct 13, 2013 1:15 pm
I've done this a couple of times, and wonder what you guys think. I think I have got the best deal using this process.

Follow-up here. viewtopic.php?f=11&t=124638&start=150#p3061421

First, before you negotiate you need to decide on a car, and when I mean decide, I mean make model, options and even the color and interior. You may have to flexible on color , but there's usually no difference on price for color. That means test-drive it and then leave the dealership without leaving your number, e-mail , or any contact info. The only way to get the very best deal is to deal with the internet sales department for two simple reasons. A. You can't shop around multiple dealers simultaneously when you are stuck in a showroom. B. They are always slow to respond to get "approval" from their manager for a price request because they are hoping you will get tired out and just give up. Negotiating via e-mail over a couple of days destroys their advantages.

The Negotiating Process
1. Search the dealer inventories online for the exact car you are looking for. They usually give you the VIN Number, and you can usually find the same car at 4-5 different dealerships within a 60 mile radius if you live in a decent sized metro area, if you are not asking for something really unique like a pink Aston Martin. Ask for price requests from those 5 departments through an online questionnaire. DO NOT PUT down a phone number, or if you have to, a fake one, only contact information you leave is an e-mail address, no residential or mailing address.

2. You'll get an initial contact from someone within 24 hours via e-mail once the phone line doesn't work which is the first thing they'll try. Make it clear that you will negotiate over e-mail only, are soliciting multiple dealers for the best price, and want the quotes to be the out-the-door-price which means after taxes and fees. They will need your zip code to calculate taxes so they give them that. Do not let them talk to you about financing or if you have a trade-in. Tell them you are negotiating on the price of the car only and that those things won't be discussed until you find the dealer with the best price. Do not let them lure you into a phone call or insist you come in and talk to them. Eventually, they will all let you contact them via e-mail if you insist.

3. After you get the initial prices, and insist this is an out the door price after taxes and fees, take the lowest offer and take it to Dealer #2. So this doesn't take too long, tell them you will only go with them if they beat the price of Dealer #1 by at least $300.00. Insist, no matching will be accepted. They key thing about negotiating is for you to create the rules and be firm about it. Don't sound desperate, give them at least 24 hours to respond, but usually they will respond within a few hours. If they beat the price from Dealer #1 (which on the first round they usually will, since everyone starts with a high-ball offer) take that offer to Dealer #3, and keep on rinsing till you get the price. In later stages, you may want to say they can beat the price by only going down $200.00. You know you have the best offer when other dealers back out of the deal and refuse to counter. Not always true, but usually the best deal will end up being from a high-volume dealer in your area that can take a low margin. Even though the manufacturer sells the cars to the dealers for the same price, manufacturers will give rebates to dealers who sell higher volumes.

4. When you have the best offer, keep in your hip pocket the closest offer which will probably be within $200.00 A few dishonest dealers may try to give you an excuse when you get there to buy a car that they can't do that offer anymore, or that the car is gone, but that should be rare since by now you have established yourself as a no nonsense customer. Be prepared to walk out if the offer is even $10 more than what was initially quoted, they will either back down or you go to the second dealer. This will only happen rarely.

5. FINANCING- If you are not paying cash for your car, your best pathaway is to finance through one of the national banks or credit unions, they will offer rates as good as the dealer and you are not tied to one specific dealership as the bank will give you a check you can give to any dealer. Dealers usually just take bank loans and add a markup so only focus on negotiating the price of the car with the dealer. The Finance Department of the car dealership is a pure profit center.

6.TRADE-IN , You will never get the best deal from the dealer. Either sell it private party or to a company like autodirect. This is just another profit center for the dealers.

7. Refuse all markup services like lo-jack, extended warranty, etc. These are all rip-offs that usually some people will cave into when they are tired after sitting in a showroom all day. None of them are good deals.

General Advice
*Be realistic on how much of a discount you can get below sticker price. Even with this strategy, there are certain factors out of your control. If a car is really popular, and selling like hotcakes this strategy will only bring the price down a little bit. Certain manufacturers have rebates on certain cars which will bring the price down. Your best deals usually come in Aug-October when they are bringing in the next year's model and the dealer wants to get rid of the prior year stock, especially if the design is being changed.
*Car negotiating isn't about making friends. There's a less of a chance of this happening since you are going to be dealing with people over e-mail until the end, but the dealer sees this as a pure business transaction and so should you. Dealers are pros about trying to make a fake personal connection, so you feel bad about negotiating, don't fall for it. When you walk in with the best deal, they are not going to greet you with roses since you bought the car for the bare minimum they would sell it.

Does the underlined and bolded statement above mean that - the same vehicle will be listed with all the other dealers? Say I see a specific vehicle with a VIN# on dealer #1's website, can I reach out to a 2nd dealer and ask them to quote the OTD price for the same vehicle or a vehicle with the same specs that might have a different VIN#? As far as I can tell VIN#s seem to be dealer specific. May be some one can correct me.

Thanks in advance.

hudson
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Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by hudson » Fri Jul 17, 2020 6:30 pm

worthit,

If the stock levels are high enough, you can find the same or almost the same car at different dealers. All VINs will be different.
I took bids on a truck in 2012. The bids from 3 different dealers were on the SAME VIN. I learned later that the truck was at a fourth dealer 200 miles to the east. The winning bidder planned on buying the truck from the fourth dealer and transporting it.

worthit
Posts: 225
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Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by worthit » Fri Jul 17, 2020 8:54 pm

hudson wrote:
Fri Jul 17, 2020 6:30 pm
worthit,

If the stock levels are high enough, you can find the same or almost the same car at different dealers. All VINs will be different.
I took bids on a truck in 2012. The bids from 3 different dealers were on the SAME VIN. I learned later that the truck was at a fourth dealer 200 miles to the east. The winning bidder planned on buying the truck from the fourth dealer and transporting it.
Thank you, Hudson.

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grabiner
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Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by grabiner » Fri Jul 17, 2020 9:01 pm

worthit wrote:
Fri Jul 17, 2020 5:13 pm
I have just started my vehicle buying process and came across this helpful posting. But hoping someone can help me here. My question is below the original post.
denovo wrote:
Sun Oct 13, 2013 1:15 pm
The Negotiating Process
1. Search the dealer inventories online for the exact car you are looking for. They usually give you the VIN Number, and you can usually find the same car at 4-5 different dealerships within a 60 mile radius if you live in a decent sized metro area, if you are not asking for something really unique like a pink Aston Martin. Ask for price requests from those 5 departments through an online questionnaire. DO NOT PUT down a phone number, or if you have to, a fake one, only contact information you leave is an e-mail address, no residential or mailing address.
Does the underlined and bolded statement above mean that - the same vehicle will be listed with all the other dealers? Say I see a specific vehicle with a VIN# on dealer #1's website, can I reach out to a 2nd dealer and ask them to quote the OTD price for the same vehicle or a vehicle with the same specs that might have a different VIN#? As far as I can tell VIN#s seem to be dealer specific. May be some one can correct me.
The VIN is specific to the car, and the stock number may be specific to the dealer, with different dealers having different inventory systems. But if you ask dealer #1 for a price on vehicle #31415926, and dealer #2 for a price on vehicle #27182818, you can make a fair comparison. If dealer #2's vehicle has $300 in additional options and a price $150 higher, it is a better deal in general, and is a better deal for you if the options are worth something.
Wiki David Grabiner

worthit
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Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by worthit » Sat Jul 18, 2020 7:40 am

Thanks, grabiner. Hopefully I get lucky with my negotiations. This for a Lexus RX350 SUV, so not sure if there is much wiggle room for luxury vehicles.

hudson
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Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by hudson » Sat Jul 18, 2020 8:34 am

worthit wrote:
Sat Jul 18, 2020 7:40 am
Thanks, grabiner. Hopefully I get lucky with my negotiations. This for a Lexus RX350 SUV, so not sure if there is much wiggle room for luxury vehicles.
It looks like the RX350 is in good supply in Raleigh.
https://www.johnsonlexusraleigh.com/new ... l=RX%20350

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Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by worthit » Sat Jul 18, 2020 10:52 am

Thanks hudson, I am looking to take advantage of the 0% financing for the 2019 and 2020 models for 60 months.

inbox788
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Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by inbox788 » Sat Jul 18, 2020 4:34 pm

worthit wrote:
Sat Jul 18, 2020 7:40 am
Thanks, grabiner. Hopefully I get lucky with my negotiations. This for a Lexus RX350 SUV, so not sure if there is much wiggle room for luxury vehicles.
RX350 is their best seller. There's lots of wiggle room. Luxury vehicles have more markup, leaving lots more wiggle room than non-luxury vehicles. And most, though not all factory incentives are stackable, so don't let the dealer steal the incentives, including financing specials.

worthit
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Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by worthit » Sat Jul 18, 2020 4:42 pm

Thanks inbox788. I just updated my original posting. Hopefully, folks can help me there.

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Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by LadyGeek » Sat Jul 18, 2020 6:19 pm

I'm not sure which post you're referring to. Can you post a link here?

Update: See below. Thanks!
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Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by worthit » Sat Jul 18, 2020 6:33 pm


krafty81
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Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by krafty81 » Sat Jul 18, 2020 7:11 pm

Saw the post about many dealers offering the same VIN. I once had a dealer not give me a discount from a car that I wanted. I asked why and he said "I'm getting a ton of calls from other dealers about this car!" I told him that was me...he did not believe that. :? :?

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Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by worthit » Sat Jul 18, 2020 8:45 pm

krafty81 wrote:
Sat Jul 18, 2020 7:11 pm
Saw the post about many dealers offering the same VIN. I once had a dealer not give me a discount from a car that I wanted. I asked why and he said "I'm getting a ton of calls from other dealers about this car!" I told him that was me...he did not believe that. :? :?
That's interesting. I better be cautious with these dealers. :happy So far, I haven't given the 2 dealers I have dealt with any VIN #.

Thanks.

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Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by hudson » Sun Jul 19, 2020 4:46 am

worthit wrote:
Sat Jul 18, 2020 8:45 pm
krafty81 wrote:
Sat Jul 18, 2020 7:11 pm
Saw the post about many dealers offering the same VIN. I once had a dealer not give me a discount from a car that I wanted. I asked why and he said "I'm getting a ton of calls from other dealers about this car!" I told him that was me...he did not believe that. :? :?
That's interesting. I better be cautious with these dealers. :happy So far, I haven't given the 2 dealers I have dealt with any VIN #.

Thanks.
I've never had a problem with VINs. By using the out the door (OTD) price, any discounts or charges would be included. I don't care what makes up the OTD price.
If you haven't looked at James Bragg's page, maybe take a look. I've bought his service for about $50 for every car I've bought since 2007. https://fightingchance.com/
He's a great car buying coach. You can also call him for advice. I was a push over negotiator until I started using his plan....which is also the "denovo bid plan."

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Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by denovo » Sat Jul 25, 2020 11:46 pm

inbox788 wrote:
Sat Jul 18, 2020 4:34 pm
worthit wrote:
Sat Jul 18, 2020 7:40 am
Thanks, grabiner. Hopefully I get lucky with my negotiations. This for a Lexus RX350 SUV, so not sure if there is much wiggle room for luxury vehicles.
RX350 is their best seller. There's lots of wiggle room. Luxury vehicles have more markup, leaving lots more wiggle room than non-luxury vehicles. And most, though not all factory incentives are stackable, so don't let the dealer steal the incentives, including financing specials.
+1

I negotiated 8k off the sticker price on a E-class Mercedes in Feb before the pandemic.
"Don't trust everything you read on the Internet"- Abraham Lincoln

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Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by Sandi_k » Sun Jul 26, 2020 12:03 am

worthit wrote:
Sat Jul 18, 2020 7:40 am
Thanks, grabiner. Hopefully I get lucky with my negotiations. This for a Lexus RX350 SUV, so not sure if there is much wiggle room for luxury vehicles.
Check out the Club Lexus forums for the RX350. They'll be very helpful in giving an idea of offers that have been successful. When I bought mine in 2009, first model year of the Gen3, I got 8% off MSRP without much haggling - and it was a custom order, with the sport suspension and without Nav.

worthit
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Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by worthit » Sun Jul 26, 2020 12:56 am

Thanks Sandi_k. I did based on another member's suggestion here and agree that there is a wealth of information in that forum.

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Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by worthit » Sun Jul 26, 2020 8:54 am

hudson wrote:
Sun Jul 19, 2020 4:46 am
worthit wrote:
Sat Jul 18, 2020 8:45 pm
krafty81 wrote:
Sat Jul 18, 2020 7:11 pm
Saw the post about many dealers offering the same VIN. I once had a dealer not give me a discount from a car that I wanted. I asked why and he said "I'm getting a ton of calls from other dealers about this car!" I told him that was me...he did not believe that. :? :?
That's interesting. I better be cautious with these dealers. :happy So far, I haven't given the 2 dealers I have dealt with any VIN #.

Thanks.
I've never had a problem with VINs. By using the out the door (OTD) price, any discounts or charges would be included. I don't care what makes up the OTD price.
If you haven't looked at James Bragg's page, maybe take a look. I've bought his service for about $50 for every car I've bought since 2007. https://fightingchance.com/
He's a great car buying coach. You can also call him for advice. I was a push over negotiator until I started using his plan....which is also the "denovo bid plan."
Thanks hudson. He seems to have fair amount of success. So not a bad idea if nothing else works. Right now, I am going through collecting quotes several channels including using Costco, leasehackr and "the Denovo" plan etc. Hopeful, one of these will pay off eventually.

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Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by hudson » Sun Jul 26, 2020 4:32 pm

worthit,

It sounds like you are doing your homework!

To buy a vehicle on the 31st. Get 5 or more OTD prices by phone. Say, I'm a serious buyer, I plan to buy this Thursday or Friday.
Go 3 rounds and see if anyone wants to sell an RX350.

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Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by Leesbro63 » Sun Jul 26, 2020 10:17 pm

hudson wrote:
Sun Jul 26, 2020 4:32 pm
worthit,

It sounds like you are doing your homework!

To buy a vehicle on the 31st. Get 5 or more OTD prices by phone. Say, I'm a serious buyer, I plan to buy this Thursday or Friday.
Go 3 rounds and see if anyone wants to sell an RX350.
Except that RX inventories are shrinking, as the factory was closed for a while. So you might not get exactly what you want and dealers might not be that desperate to cut prices.

hudson
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Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by hudson » Mon Jul 27, 2020 5:18 am

RX350 Inventory....according to local dealer website in Raleigh...

https://www.johnsonlexusraleigh.com/new ... r-model-23

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Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by worthit » Fri Jul 31, 2020 8:34 am

An update:

Thanks to all those who took the time to respond.

I picked up my vehicle, a Lexus-450H. 10% off MSRP. I think I could have gotten a 13% discount had I waited for a couple of days - lesson learned.

Overall, a very happy customer here.

hudson
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Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by hudson » Fri Jul 31, 2020 8:47 am

worthit wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 8:34 am
An update:

Thanks to all those who took the time to respond.

I picked up my vehicle, a Lexus-450H. 10% off MSRP. I think I could have gotten a 13% discount had I waited for a couple of days - lesson learned.

Overall, a very happy customer here.
YES!
Did you learn anything else while shopping around?

worthit
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Re: My New Car Buying Tips

Post by worthit » Fri Jul 31, 2020 5:23 pm

yes, hudson.

Lessons learned:

1. To be patient.

2. Aim to pick up the vehicle close to the end of the month as they are desperate to sell the vehicle and don't want to lose your business (in fact, thanks to you - you had reinforced this).

3. If you have Costco (or use websites like Edmunds), use their pricing as sort of a benchmark to guide the negotiations.

4. If you can locate a regional broker (I did via leasehackr), you may be in for some luck because they can potentially get you a price less than what Costco potentially could.

Thanks again to you and all BHs for helping me with this.

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