Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Questions on how we spend our money and our time - consumer goods and services, home and vehicle, leisure and recreational activities
softwaregeek
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by softwaregeek » Wed Mar 25, 2020 2:34 pm

There won't be a huge new supply of N95 masks in the next 60 days. Those require a raw material called melt-blown plastic. The machines to create melt-blown on a large scale are enormous, complicated, expensive, available from few suppliers, and have a long lead time. If 3m is increasing it's production, it had spare capacity from the beginning. Probably by switching production from the industrial to the medical version, the key difference being the exhale valve.

Surgical masks are much cheaper. I don't understand why we aren't producing them en masse, although it is true that we don't have much of a manufacturing culture any more.

clip651
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by clip651 » Wed Mar 25, 2020 10:29 pm

softwaregeek wrote:
Wed Mar 25, 2020 2:34 pm

Surgical masks are much cheaper. I don't understand why we aren't producing them en masse, although it is true that we don't have much of a manufacturing culture any more.
I think they are trying to increase production everywhere. But there is sudden, humongous, increased worldwide demand.

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BHs I need help on a Corona Virus Situation

Post by HappyJack » Thu Mar 26, 2020 6:21 am

Please forgive me if this question is out of line on the BH network. I know we have a lot of very intelligent people here and I am asking for some help.

I just replaced my upstairs heating and AC unit and all the ductwork which was old and nasty. I had a crew of five workers upstairs for two days. My family and I stayed
separated on the first floor.

If I turn on the system it occurred to me that it will blow potential virus contaminants (i.e. sweat, breath)back on all of us. My only thought was to leave it off and let it heat up in the attic maybe kill some contaminants.

Thanks for any thoughts you may have.

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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by LadyGeek » Thu Mar 26, 2020 7:18 am

No problem. There are quite a number of posts relating to the virus' survival time in Bogleheads community discussion - Coronavirus. Try asking your question in that thread.

Let's try to keep the virus-specific questions contained in the general discussion thread (pun intended).
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by MnD » Fri Mar 27, 2020 9:51 am

We've had no liquid hand sanitizer, no isopropyl alcohol, no hydrogen peroxide and no skin-approved sanitizer wipes since the get-go.
When we shop we look and _never_ find any of the above but aren't making special trips to multiple stores just to look for above.
We have no need to shop for a couple weeks.

What we do have is plenty of Lysol "Brand New Day" wipes with .26% alkyl dimethyl benzyl we've been using as hand wipes when out despite label advising the wipes are for cleaning surfaces. We have plenty of foaming and regular hand soap at home. We have lots (as in LOTS) of 49% ethyl alcohol in the form of 97 proof London Dry Gin.

Questions:
1) Amazon does have somewhat over-priced 62.5% alcohol 4-bottle lots of somewhat off-brand but legit hand sanitizer in stock with long delivery time (2 weeks). Think I should I buy it given our above inventory and lack thereof?

2) Right now I could make and use ~50% alcohol hand wipes using the gin as opposed to using Lysol wipes on hands. Any thoughts on that trade-off? I will not run out of gin for enjoyment if using a little bit for homemade wipes.
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Mako » Fri Mar 27, 2020 10:03 am

MnD wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 9:51 am
We've had no liquid hand sanitizer, no isopropyl alcohol, no hydrogen peroxide and no skin-approved sanitizer wipes since the get-go.
When we shop we look and _never_ find any of the above but aren't making special trips to multiple stores just to look for above.
We have no need to shop for a couple weeks.

What we do have is plenty of Lysol "Brand New Day" wipes with .26% alkyl dimethyl benzyl we've been using as hand wipes when out despite label advising the wipes are for cleaning surfaces. We have plenty of foaming and regular hand soap at home. We have lots (as in LOTS) of 49% ethyl alcohol in the form of 97 proof London Dry Gin.

Questions:
1) Amazon does have somewhat over-priced 62.5% alcohol 4-bottle lots of somewhat off-brand but legit hand sanitizer in stock with long delivery time (2 weeks). Think I should I buy it given our above inventory and lack thereof?

2) Right now I could make and use ~50% alcohol hand wipes using the gin as opposed to using Lysol wipes on hands? Any thoughts on that trade-off? I will not run out of gin for enjoyment if using a little bit for homemade wipes.
Everything I've heard or read has said you need 60% or more to be effective. I have no idea how true that is scientifically--like is 50% pretty good just less effective, is it totally useless, or is that just wrong and it's perfectly fine? But 60 is consistently what I've seen so I'd worry that 49 isn't going to do much unless someone showed me otherwise.

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ResearchMed
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by ResearchMed » Fri Mar 27, 2020 10:09 am

Mako wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 10:03 am
MnD wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 9:51 am
We've had no liquid hand sanitizer, no isopropyl alcohol, no hydrogen peroxide and no skin-approved sanitizer wipes since the get-go.
When we shop we look and _never_ find any of the above but aren't making special trips to multiple stores just to look for above.
We have no need to shop for a couple weeks.

What we do have is plenty of Lysol "Brand New Day" wipes with .26% alkyl dimethyl benzyl we've been using as hand wipes when out despite label advising the wipes are for cleaning surfaces. We have plenty of foaming and regular hand soap at home. We have lots (as in LOTS) of 49% ethyl alcohol in the form of 97 proof London Dry Gin.

Questions:
1) Amazon does have somewhat over-priced 62.5% alcohol 4-bottle lots of somewhat off-brand but legit hand sanitizer in stock with long delivery time (2 weeks). Think I should I buy it given our above inventory and lack thereof?

2) Right now I could make and use ~50% alcohol hand wipes using the gin as opposed to using Lysol wipes on hands? Any thoughts on that trade-off? I will not run out of gin for enjoyment if using a little bit for homemade wipes.
Everything I've heard or read has said you need 60% or more to be effective. I have no idea how true that is scientifically--like is 50% pretty good just less effective, is it totally useless, or is that just wrong and it's perfectly fine? But 60 is consistently what I've seen so I'd worry that 49 isn't going to do much unless someone showed me otherwise.
Yes, 60% is supposed to be the minimum to be effective for this purpose.

I just looked at Total Wine for "Everclear" and other high proof booze, and... sold out. I guess that's no surprise...

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El Greco
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by El Greco » Fri Mar 27, 2020 10:20 am

As it has been impossible to procure hand sanitizer, wipes, isopropyl alcohol, etc for sanitizing purposes, I looked through my work shop supplies and noticed I had a fresh, full quart can of Denatured Alcohol. I use this stuff to mix shellac flakes, etc. I believe it has a very high alcohol content, maybe higher than isopropyl. Can I use this stuff for wiping down packages, etc?

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Re: Masks (medical or N95) availability

Post by Dottie57 » Fri Mar 27, 2020 10:33 am

smitcat wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 5:17 pm
For updated (but not completely recent) models please see the link below.
It is applicable to the USA and not Korea , or Belgium or the Galapagos.
It is interactive in that you can vary the countermeasures in place and also the future date to see results.
You can therefore test your own variables to see what they might mean without relying on others opinions...
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/202 ... break.html
No subscription here. :|

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willthrill81
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by willthrill81 » Fri Mar 27, 2020 10:40 am

El Greco wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 10:20 am
As it has been impossible to procure hand sanitizer, wipes, isopropyl alcohol, etc for sanitizing purposes, I looked through my work shop supplies and noticed I had a fresh, full quart can of Denatured Alcohol. I use this stuff to mix shellac flakes, etc. I believe it has a very high alcohol content, maybe higher than isopropyl. Can I use this stuff for wiping down packages, etc?
Yes, it will work as a disinfectant. It's just regular ethanol with additives that make it undrinkable. But since it's poisonous, you would want to be careful to thoroughly rinse it off of any surfaces you spread it on. Wash your hands thoroughly after working with it.

But why wouldn't you just use plain soap? It's highly effective.
“It's a dangerous business, Frodo, going out your door. You step onto the road, and if you don't keep your feet, there's no knowing where you might be swept off to.” J.R.R. Tolkien,The Lord of the Rings

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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Dottie57 » Fri Mar 27, 2020 10:48 am

Soap is highly effective because it chemically breaks down the virus.

I post a link that tells how it works. The link was from marketwatch.

smitcat
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Re: Masks (medical or N95) availability

Post by smitcat » Fri Mar 27, 2020 11:41 am

Dottie57 wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 10:33 am
smitcat wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 5:17 pm
For updated (but not completely recent) models please see the link below.
It is applicable to the USA and not Korea , or Belgium or the Galapagos.
It is interactive in that you can vary the countermeasures in place and also the future date to see results.
You can therefore test your own variables to see what they might mean without relying on others opinions...
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/202 ... break.html
No subscription here. :|
I do not have a subscription either - I just click it and its open.

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El Greco
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by El Greco » Fri Mar 27, 2020 12:54 pm

willthrill81 wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 10:40 am
El Greco wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 10:20 am
As it has been impossible to procure hand sanitizer, wipes, isopropyl alcohol, etc for sanitizing purposes, I looked through my work shop supplies and noticed I had a fresh, full quart can of Denatured Alcohol. I use this stuff to mix shellac flakes, etc. I believe it has a very high alcohol content, maybe higher than isopropyl. Can I use this stuff for wiping down packages, etc?
Yes, it will work as a disinfectant. It's just regular ethanol with additives that make it undrinkable. But since it's poisonous, you would want to be careful to thoroughly rinse it off of any surfaces you spread it on. Wash your hands thoroughly after working with it.

But why wouldn't you just use plain soap? It's highly effective.
Thanks willthrill81:

I'm thinking of using it to wipe down plastic and metal packaging that I receive from the outside. Are you saying soapy water would be better?

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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by LadyGeek » Fri Mar 27, 2020 1:00 pm

:!: Caution, we're dealing with health and safety here. :!:

Please do your own due diligence when working with chemicals. Those providing recommendations should cite credible (authoritative) sources.
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by willthrill81 » Fri Mar 27, 2020 1:03 pm

El Greco wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 12:54 pm
willthrill81 wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 10:40 am
El Greco wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 10:20 am
As it has been impossible to procure hand sanitizer, wipes, isopropyl alcohol, etc for sanitizing purposes, I looked through my work shop supplies and noticed I had a fresh, full quart can of Denatured Alcohol. I use this stuff to mix shellac flakes, etc. I believe it has a very high alcohol content, maybe higher than isopropyl. Can I use this stuff for wiping down packages, etc?
Yes, it will work as a disinfectant. It's just regular ethanol with additives that make it undrinkable. But since it's poisonous, you would want to be careful to thoroughly rinse it off of any surfaces you spread it on. Wash your hands thoroughly after working with it.

But why wouldn't you just use plain soap? It's highly effective.
Thanks willthrill81:

I'm thinking of using it to wipe down plastic and metal packaging that I receive from the outside. Are you saying soapy water would be better?
The CDC has addressed this specifically as it applies to washing hands, but I don't see why the same logic wouldn't apply to washing other items.
Soap and water are more effective than hand sanitizers at removing certain kinds of germs, like Cryptosporidium, norovirus, and Clostridium difficile. Although alcohol-based hand sanitizers can inactivate many types of microbes very effectively when used correctly, people may not use a large enough volume of the sanitizers or may wipe it off before it has dried.
https://www.cdc.gov/handwashing/show-me ... tizer.html
“It's a dangerous business, Frodo, going out your door. You step onto the road, and if you don't keep your feet, there's no knowing where you might be swept off to.” J.R.R. Tolkien,The Lord of the Rings

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Re: Masks (medical or N95) availability

Post by Dottie57 » Fri Mar 27, 2020 4:36 pm

smitcat wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 11:41 am
Dottie57 wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 10:33 am
smitcat wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 5:17 pm
For updated (but not completely recent) models please see the link below.
It is applicable to the USA and not Korea , or Belgium or the Galapagos.
It is interactive in that you can vary the countermeasures in place and also the future date to see results.
You can therefore test your own variables to see what they might mean without relying on others opinions...
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/202 ... break.html
No subscription here. :|
I do not have a subscription either - I just click it and its open.
I get a page with the title of the article and then 2 buttons on top right - Subscribe and Login.

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Re: Masks (medical or N95) availability

Post by HomeStretch » Fri Mar 27, 2020 4:48 pm

Dottie57 wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 4:36 pm
I get a page with the title of the article and then 2 buttons on top right - Subscribe and Login.
Try clearing your phone or laptop’s browsing history/cookies. After clearing, I usually can read a few NY Times articles free each month before the subscribe and logon appears.

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Re: Masks (medical or N95) availability

Post by Nyc10036 » Fri Mar 27, 2020 7:55 pm

HomeStretch wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 4:48 pm
Dottie57 wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 4:36 pm
I get a page with the title of the article and then 2 buttons on top right - Subscribe and Login.
Try clearing your phone or laptop’s browsing history/cookies. After clearing, I usually can read a few NY Times articles free each month before the subscribe and logon appears.
I subscribed to their $1/week digital subscription.
They bill at $4 every month.
Very reasonable rate.

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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Nyc10036 » Fri Mar 27, 2020 7:58 pm

El Greco wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 10:20 am
As it has been impossible to procure hand sanitizer, wipes, isopropyl alcohol, etc for sanitizing purposes, I looked through my work shop supplies and noticed I had a fresh, full quart can of Denatured Alcohol. I use this stuff to mix shellac flakes, etc. I believe it has a very high alcohol content, maybe higher than isopropyl. Can I use this stuff for wiping down packages, etc?
do-it-yourself https://www.familysavvy.com/how-to-make ... -a-doctor/

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VeganBH
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by VeganBH » Sat Mar 28, 2020 2:00 pm

alfaspider wrote:
Fri Mar 20, 2020 10:06 am
cusetownusa wrote:
Fri Mar 20, 2020 9:52 am
nigel_ht wrote:
Fri Mar 20, 2020 9:48 am
stoptothink wrote:
Fri Mar 20, 2020 9:38 am
livesoft wrote:
Fri Mar 20, 2020 9:08 am
It might be worthwhile to tell your children that "Life is not fair" and "You can't always get what you want." I would have no qualms not going to the store and buying milk for my children. I do have some powdered milk around for possible use when there is no power (i.e. hurricanes), but I know it doesn't taste as good as dairy-case milk.

Anyways, I'm curious why you seem to feel guilty about not providing milk for your children?
The 3x I've gone to the store in the last few weeks I've seen no milk or bread. Thank heavens we never had milk and greatly minimize the consumption of bread in our house. My 8 and 4yr olds don't even notice.
We're ambivalent on milk...as in we try to get our kids to drink it but not entirely sold on whether it really is a good thing or not.

That said, cereal without milk is a non-starter for them. Not that cereal is all that healthy either...my wife had to go into work today so will swing by Costco and hope to score a couple jugs. Fresh veggies and fruit has been the thing hardest to keep in stock so more frozen I guess.
How about Soy milk? We haven't had cows milk in our house in a long time. WHile we prefer Soy milk, I do understand that others may no like the taste. Just a thought. Plus, it doesn't go bad as quickly as cows milk.
Soy milk is subject to the same purchase restrictions.
While soymilk is fairly easy to make (from dry soybeans) - the simplest plant milks to make are cashew and rice milk. You just need a decent blender, water and either cashews (raw) or cooked rice (no filtering required). Add some sweetener if you like (we like to blend in a few dates) and presto, a very healthy, tasty plant-milk for your coffee, cereal, or glass.
Here's a simple how to: https://www.absolutevegan.org/plant-milks.html :beer

Now, if you prefer soymilk or almond milk....homemade can be super easy too. The easiest way though, is using a special "soymilk or almond milk maker" - which is a small carafe like appliance that you just dump your bean/nuts into - and the heating, grinding, filtering is all done by the appliance. We use the "Soybella" but there are a number of them available on Amazon. Just search for "soymilk maker".
Good luck.
"Until we extend our circle of compassion to all living things, humanity will not find peace."​ ~ Albert Sc​hweitzer

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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by LadyGeek » Sat Mar 28, 2020 2:45 pm

^^^ Feel free to go into the details here: So what are you cooking
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Re: Masks (medical or N95) availability

Post by rustymutt » Sat Mar 28, 2020 3:15 pm

livesoft wrote:
Wed Mar 25, 2020 10:21 am
Seasonal wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 6:48 pm
windaar wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 4:30 pm
So people posting to the effect that "most folks will eventually get the virus" are posting very false and alarming info, given that the US is employing very strong countermeasures.
That's a controversial view. Compare the percentage of the population that's in lockdown compared to many other countries.
I'm not seeing any strong countermeasures in my area of Texas ... unless you call the daily report of new cases a strong countermeasure. Sure, there are countermeasures such as closing of schools and public places, but I would not call those "strong."
My Texas buddies are all hardheaded and stubborn. They get this and they'll wish they'd listened to experts.
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Watty
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Watty » Sat Mar 28, 2020 4:19 pm

I just received a food order delivery from Kroger which used Instacart that I had placed on Tuesday when the earliest delivery appointment I could get was today(Saturday) between 2- 3 PM. When I placed the order they did not have any curbside pickup times available. It arrived at around 2:15 PM. This was in suburban Atlanta.

Once you place your order you can modify it up until about an hour before your appointment. I had added a few things to it and my son had me add about a dozen things to it so the entire order came to around $200.

We texted back and forth as they were picking the order and they had to substitute brands for some of the things but the only two things I did not get were bread and bread flour. I had also ordered bagels and tortillas which I got so that is not a big deal.

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ResearchMed
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by ResearchMed » Sat Mar 28, 2020 4:38 pm

At least in our area, InstaCart is going on strike (or similar action) starting Monday, unless they get more safety equipment, etc.

Orders placed several days ago for pickup tomorrow (Sunday) are still showing as scheduled, but after that, there are no times available.

Now, if an underlying problem is that there just are not masks or hand sanitizer, etc., then... :confused

RM
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Grogs » Sat Mar 28, 2020 6:38 pm

ResearchMed wrote:
Sat Mar 28, 2020 4:38 pm
At least in our area, InstaCart is going on strike (or similar action) starting Monday, unless they get more safety equipment, etc.

Orders placed several days ago for pickup tomorrow (Sunday) are still showing as scheduled, but after that, there are no times available.

Now, if an underlying problem is that there just are not masks or hand sanitizer, etc., then... :confused

RM
I think the big problem is that they go around and fill orders while the store is full of shoppers. At least that's what I always saw them doing until a couple of weeks ago when I last went in. I can certainly understand that they would be nervous about that. I would get nervous just going in the store for a few items, so I can't imagine doing it for 8 hours+ every day. Maybe they're doing more filling of orders during the night while it's closed now. That would certainly be safer for them, but more difficult logistically since they would have to keep things frozen or refrigerated until pickup.

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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by ResearchMed » Sat Mar 28, 2020 9:38 pm

Grogs wrote:
Sat Mar 28, 2020 6:38 pm
ResearchMed wrote:
Sat Mar 28, 2020 4:38 pm
At least in our area, InstaCart is going on strike (or similar action) starting Monday, unless they get more safety equipment, etc.

Orders placed several days ago for pickup tomorrow (Sunday) are still showing as scheduled, but after that, there are no times available.

Now, if an underlying problem is that there just are not masks or hand sanitizer, etc., then... :confused

RM
I think the big problem is that they go around and fill orders while the store is full of shoppers. At least that's what I always saw them doing until a couple of weeks ago when I last went in. I can certainly understand that they would be nervous about that. I would get nervous just going in the store for a few items, so I can't imagine doing it for 8 hours+ every day. Maybe they're doing more filling of orders during the night while it's closed now. That would certainly be safer for them, but more difficult logistically since they would have to keep things frozen or refrigerated until pickup.
You are correct that they fill orders while shoppers are there/the store is open, at least near us.
They will text in real time if X is an acceptable substitute. If not, they'll try something else sometimes.
That wouldn't work if it had been done at night.

I fully understand their concerns!

RM
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by willthrill81 » Sat Mar 28, 2020 9:48 pm

A local produce wholesaler has started selling directly to the public. You give them your order through your car window, and they put it in the back of your vehicle. Produce was the only thing we were remotely low on after a nearly two week quarantine, so we loaded up for another good two weeks. There were lots of other people there doing the same thing. I was almost tempted to buy a 50# sack of Russet potatoes for $15 but wasn't sure that we would eat them before they'd go bad.

We and many others were far more attracted to this than going inside a grocery store and having a strong likelihood of being exposed to the virus. One that we drove by on the way to the wholesaler had a packed parking lot. No thanks.
“It's a dangerous business, Frodo, going out your door. You step onto the road, and if you don't keep your feet, there's no knowing where you might be swept off to.” J.R.R. Tolkien,The Lord of the Rings

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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by ResearchMed » Sun Mar 29, 2020 1:22 pm

I was starting to get worried about food rationing, but that seemed silly (especially to DH!).

But just now, our "pickup order" of groceries... we were notified by text that there is a "one can of beans limit per order".
ONE can per order?
:shock:

I'm hoping that is one can per type of bean? Even so, that's pretty limited, and was not happening two days ago. although some items were a bit short of the order number.
This is a very large supermarket in a relatively nice suburban neighborhood.

NO Clorox/rubbing alcohol/wipes of any kind, that we already knew about.
But ONE can of beans?

ETA: Order received. It was "one can" per type of bean. But they were totally out of some types of beans...

RM
Last edited by ResearchMed on Sun Mar 29, 2020 2:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by neilpilot » Sun Mar 29, 2020 1:28 pm

ResearchMed wrote:
Sun Mar 29, 2020 1:22 pm
I was starting to get worried about food rationing, but that seemed silly (especially to DH!).

But just now, our "pickup order" of groceries... we were notified by text that there is a "one can of beans limit per order".
ONE can per order?
In that case, I recommend the 117 oz can of Bush's Baked Beans
https://www.walmart.com/ip/BUSHS-Origin ... z/21560291

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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Barkingsparrow » Sun Mar 29, 2020 1:54 pm

ResearchMed wrote:
Sun Mar 29, 2020 1:22 pm
But just now, our "pickup order" of groceries... we were notified by text that there is a "one can of beans limit per order".
ONE can per order?
:shock:
RM
Why not dried beans? Back in late Feb I got a 5lb bag of garbanzo beans and a 5lb bag of black beans.

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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Lynette » Sun Mar 29, 2020 3:57 pm

ResearchMed wrote:
Sun Mar 29, 2020 1:22 pm
NO Clorox/rubbing alcohol/wipes of any kind, that we already knew about.
RM
My local supermarket also ran out of Clorox. I always wake up early in the morning so I went to Home Depot. I bought two bottles of Clorox - one for me and one for my neighbor.

Lynette
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Lynette » Sun Mar 29, 2020 3:58 pm

ResearchMed wrote:
Sun Mar 29, 2020 1:22 pm
NO Clorox/rubbing alcohol/wipes of any kind, that we already knew about.
RM
My local supermarket also ran out of Clorox. I always wake up early in the morning so I went to Home Depot at 6:00 a.m. There were very few people there. I bought two bottles of Clorox - one for me and one for my neighbor.

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Sandtrap
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Re: BHs I need help on a Corona Virus Situation

Post by Sandtrap » Sun Mar 29, 2020 4:02 pm

HappyJack wrote:
Thu Mar 26, 2020 6:21 am
Please forgive me if this question is out of line on the BH network. I know we have a lot of very intelligent people here and I am asking for some help.

I just replaced my upstairs heating and AC unit and all the ductwork which was old and nasty. I had a crew of five workers upstairs for two days. My family and I stayed
separated on the first floor.

If I turn on the system it occurred to me that it will blow potential virus contaminants (i.e. sweat, breath)back on all of us. My only thought was to leave it off and let it heat up in the attic maybe kill some contaminants.

Thanks for any thoughts you may have.
This warrants a new post as it's a different topic.
We had a duck cleaning company come into sanitize everything before turning the system on.
j :happy
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ResearchMed
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Re: BHs I need help on a Corona Virus Situation

Post by ResearchMed » Sun Mar 29, 2020 4:04 pm

Sandtrap wrote:
Sun Mar 29, 2020 4:02 pm
HappyJack wrote:
Thu Mar 26, 2020 6:21 am
Please forgive me if this question is out of line on the BH network. I know we have a lot of very intelligent people here and I am asking for some help.

I just replaced my upstairs heating and AC unit and all the ductwork which was old and nasty. I had a crew of five workers upstairs for two days. My family and I stayed
separated on the first floor.

If I turn on the system it occurred to me that it will blow potential virus contaminants (i.e. sweat, breath)back on all of us. My only thought was to leave it off and let it heat up in the attic maybe kill some contaminants.

Thanks for any thoughts you may have.
This warrants a new post as it's a different topic.
We had a duck cleaning company come into sanitize everything before turning the system on.
j :happy
Have your chickens and geese been cleaned as well?
:wink:

RM
This signature is a placebo. You are in the control group.

neilpilot
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Re: BHs I need help on a Corona Virus Situation

Post by neilpilot » Sun Mar 29, 2020 4:08 pm

ResearchMed wrote:
Sun Mar 29, 2020 4:04 pm
Sandtrap wrote:
Sun Mar 29, 2020 4:02 pm

We had a duck cleaning company come into sanitize everything before turning the system on.
j :happy
Have your chickens and geese been cleaned as well?
:wink:

RM
no need to clean the other fowl. They've been restrained with Duck Tape.

Hockey10
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Re: BHs I need help on a Corona Virus Situation

Post by Hockey10 » Mon Mar 30, 2020 12:10 pm

ResearchMed wrote:
Sun Mar 29, 2020 4:04 pm
Sandtrap wrote:
Sun Mar 29, 2020 4:02 pm
HappyJack wrote:
Thu Mar 26, 2020 6:21 am
Please forgive me if this question is out of line on the BH network. I know we have a lot of very intelligent people here and I am asking for some help.

I just replaced my upstairs heating and AC unit and all the ductwork which was old and nasty. I had a crew of five workers upstairs for two days. My family and I stayed
separated on the first floor.

If I turn on the system it occurred to me that it will blow potential virus contaminants (i.e. sweat, breath)back on all of us. My only thought was to leave it off and let it heat up in the attic maybe kill some contaminants.

Thanks for any thoughts you may have.
This warrants a new post as it's a different topic.
We had a duck cleaning company come into sanitize everything before turning the system on.
j :happy
Have your chickens and geese been cleaned as well?
:wink:

RM
I bet that Mrs. Sandtrap's horses have also been cleaned.

lazydavid
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by lazydavid » Tue Mar 31, 2020 8:46 am

Lynette wrote:
Sun Mar 29, 2020 3:57 pm
ResearchMed wrote:
Sun Mar 29, 2020 1:22 pm
NO Clorox/rubbing alcohol/wipes of any kind, that we already knew about.
RM
My local supermarket also ran out of Clorox. I always wake up early in the morning so I went to Home Depot. I bought two bottles of Clorox - one for me and one for my neighbor.
I'm definitely good in this regard. Last year's pool season was sad and pathetic, so I have 18 gallons of liquid shock left over. It's 12.5% Hypochlorite, so diluting 50/50 with water will turn it into unscented household bleach. :)

HomeStretch
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by HomeStretch » Tue Mar 31, 2020 8:58 am

We are in a hot spot where most grocery delivery and curbside pickup has been shutoff. So we are shopping in store for our household plus age 80+ parents/in laws. More meats and pantry items available in the store today (wiped out last two weeks). No flour, yeast, bleach products/wipes or paper products (wiped out for weeks).

All stores have daily one hour senior shopping prior to opening to the general public which I support. As I went in right at the start of general public hours, I was hopeful to find paper towels, toilet paper and clorox for parents as seniors were walking out with those items in their carriages. No dice. Manager says the store is wiped out daily before general public hours start. I requested just one day a week where everyone was let in at the same time.

KlangFool
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by KlangFool » Tue Mar 31, 2020 9:18 am

Folks,

https://www.amazon.com/PM2-5-Activated- ... 153&sr=8-6

What do you think about using a PM2.5 mask for protection? They are washable and they use PM2.5 insert. And, they are not used for medical personnel.

KlangFool

stoptothink
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by stoptothink » Tue Mar 31, 2020 9:23 am

HomeStretch wrote:
Tue Mar 31, 2020 8:58 am
We are in a hot spot where most grocery delivery and curbside pickup has been shutoff. So we are shopping in store for our household plus age 80+ parents/in laws. More meats and pantry items available in the store today (wiped out last two weeks). No flour, yeast, bleach products/wipes or paper products (wiped out for weeks).

All stores have daily one hour senior shopping prior to opening to the general public which I support. As I went in right at the start of general public hours, I was hopeful to find paper towels, toilet paper and clorox for parents as seniors were walking out with those items in their carriages. No dice. Manager says the store is wiped out daily before general public hours start. I requested just one day a week where everyone was let in at the same time.
2 weeks ago I got enough food to last us ~2 months, hoping not to have to go again for a while. We are still stocked, but it was wife's birthday so I ventured out to the grocery store at open (7am). There were a few things that were not available 2 weeks ago (bread, eggs), but many things were limited and you were only allowed to get a small amount (could only get 1 carton of eggs and they were 2.5x the normal price). I picked up a few things to top off our stash for probably another 2 months and got what I came there for (5lbs. of pistachios for the wifey). Oh, there were no paper products whatsoever, but we are good for a while.

lazydavid
Posts: 2827
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by lazydavid » Tue Mar 31, 2020 9:35 am

KlangFool wrote:
Tue Mar 31, 2020 9:18 am
What do you think about using a PM2.5 mask for protection? They are washable and they use PM2.5 insert. And, they are not used for medical personnel.
PM2.5 filters down to 2.5 microns. Coronavirus is 0.125 microns, 20x smaller. It will pass through easily.

KlangFool
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by KlangFool » Tue Mar 31, 2020 9:42 am

lazydavid wrote:
Tue Mar 31, 2020 9:35 am
KlangFool wrote:
Tue Mar 31, 2020 9:18 am
What do you think about using a PM2.5 mask for protection? They are washable and they use PM2.5 insert. And, they are not used for medical personnel.
PM2.5 filters down to 2.5 microns. Coronavirus is 0.125 microns, 20x smaller. It will pass through easily.
I know. So does a surgical mask. The only one really works fully is the N95. There are not enough N95 to go around.

KlangFool

livesoft
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by livesoft » Tue Mar 31, 2020 9:46 am

Had a pleasant uncrowded grocery shopping experience in my area. Saw some friends there, too. Plenty of almost everything including toilet paper and fresh produce, baked goods, fish, & meats. Notably not present: paper towels, pasta, and orange juice. No line at checkout either and a very very fast checker and faster bagger. If people weren't wearing masks and gloves, I might not have noticed anything different than a year ago.
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livesoft
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by livesoft » Tue Mar 31, 2020 9:49 am

KlangFool wrote:
Tue Mar 31, 2020 9:42 am
I know. So does a surgical mask. The only one really works fully is the N95. There are not enough N95 to go around.
You have been fooled. An N95 mask lets 5% of the particles through. It is not an N100 mask nor an N99 mask. And the particle size is pretty large (think smoke particles and droplets from sneezes).

I have some N95 masks purchased about a year ago for working in smoky & dusty places. They are not what you think they are.

The seal around the edges of an N95 mask are not even as airtight as a scuba mask.
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H-Town
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by H-Town » Tue Mar 31, 2020 9:50 am

KlangFool wrote:
Tue Mar 31, 2020 9:42 am
lazydavid wrote:
Tue Mar 31, 2020 9:35 am
KlangFool wrote:
Tue Mar 31, 2020 9:18 am
What do you think about using a PM2.5 mask for protection? They are washable and they use PM2.5 insert. And, they are not used for medical personnel.
PM2.5 filters down to 2.5 microns. Coronavirus is 0.125 microns, 20x smaller. It will pass through easily.
I know. So does a surgical mask. The only one really works fully is the N95. There are not enough N95 to go around.

KlangFool
Should we leave mask to medical personnel who are at the front line battling the virus? They need it more than we do.

KlangFool
Posts: 15578
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by KlangFool » Tue Mar 31, 2020 9:53 am

H-Town wrote:
Tue Mar 31, 2020 9:50 am
KlangFool wrote:
Tue Mar 31, 2020 9:42 am
lazydavid wrote:
Tue Mar 31, 2020 9:35 am
KlangFool wrote:
Tue Mar 31, 2020 9:18 am
What do you think about using a PM2.5 mask for protection? They are washable and they use PM2.5 insert. And, they are not used for medical personnel.
PM2.5 filters down to 2.5 microns. Coronavirus is 0.125 microns, 20x smaller. It will pass through easily.
I know. So does a surgical mask. The only one really works fully is the N95. There are not enough N95 to go around.

KlangFool
Should we leave mask to medical personnel who are at the front line battling the virus? They need it more than we do.
Medical personnel does not use PM 2.5 masks. They are for allergy and dust control. They are just slightly better than the DIY cloth mask.

KlangFool
Last edited by KlangFool on Tue Mar 31, 2020 9:59 am, edited 1 time in total.

KlangFool
Posts: 15578
Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2008 12:35 pm

Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by KlangFool » Tue Mar 31, 2020 9:58 am

livesoft wrote:
Tue Mar 31, 2020 9:49 am
KlangFool wrote:
Tue Mar 31, 2020 9:42 am
I know. So does a surgical mask. The only one really works fully is the N95. There are not enough N95 to go around.
You have been fooled. An N95 mask lets 5% of the particles through. It is not an N100 mask nor an N99 mask. And the particle size is pretty large (think smoke particles and droplets from sneezes).

I have some N95 masks purchased about a year ago for working in smoky & dusty places. They are not what you think they are.

The seal around the edges of an N95 mask are not even as airtight as a scuba mask.
Thank you for the information.

KlangFool

cs412a
Posts: 46
Joined: Sun Dec 17, 2017 1:37 pm

Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by cs412a » Tue Mar 31, 2020 10:07 am

lazydavid wrote:
Tue Mar 31, 2020 9:35 am
KlangFool wrote:
Tue Mar 31, 2020 9:18 am
What do you think about using a PM2.5 mask for protection? They are washable and they use PM2.5 insert. And, they are not used for medical personnel.
PM2.5 filters down to 2.5 microns. Coronavirus is 0.125 microns, 20x smaller. It will pass through easily.
Yes, but the virus is on respiratory droplets, right? So if the mask prevents many respiratory droplets from penetrating, then it might not be as effective as a surgical or n95 mask while still being useful.

This description (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK143281/) notes that droplets that are less than 5 microns can remain suspended in air for some time, and that "sneezing may produce as many as 40 000 droplets between 0.5–12 μm in diameter".

For any mask, it seems to be a matter of degree. I'm not a clinician in prolonged and/or direct contact with infected individuals. For infrequent errands such as grocery shopping, a less effective mask might still be relatively worthwhile.

SimonJester
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by SimonJester » Tue Mar 31, 2020 10:10 am

H-Town wrote:
Tue Mar 31, 2020 9:50 am
Should we leave mask to medical personnel who are at the front line battling the virus? They need it more than we do.
Yes my wife, an RN, is having to reuse her one single N95 mask, I think she is on week two now using it, when it was rated for 8 hours. Co workers are using normal isolation masks rated for 15 minutes all day long. Their facility cannot get any PPE, all supply chains are exhausted. The state is allocating what little PPE they have to higher priority facilities.

My local grocery store just announced a worker just tested positive and had been working for several weeks prior. Of course this person was working one day when I went shopping.

Right now we are determining which room we will isolate one of us to should one become sick. Bathroom will be a little more difficult to isolate to as we only have one on each floor.

We have one construction grade n95 mask at home (cannot use it at work due to the exhaust valve).
"They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." - Benjamin Franklin

Lynette
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Re: Coronavirus (Consumer Issues) How you are preparing?

Post by Lynette » Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:58 am

On the subject of masks, how about the eyes? This morning I wore a R95 mask I have for painting when I went shopping. I also took some painting googles and nitrile gloves. Maybe I wore the R95 mask incorrectly but it only covered my nose and mouth. Unfortunately I had to learn how the eyes are connected to the nose as my one eye kept on watering. The specialist told me that I had a blocked tear duct and I had to have surgery to open it. Afterwards the doctor placed a saline solution in my tear duct and it flowed into my nose. I suppose that the main way of getting air into the lungs is through the nose or an open mouth but can the eyes not also contribute to this? If so, one really needs a full face mask - probably really impractical for everyday life.

I went shopping at 6:00 am and was very grateful to take the mask off outside the store and get some cool air. I will probably wear one when I go shopping but do not like it!
Last edited by Lynette on Wed Apr 01, 2020 10:06 am, edited 1 time in total.

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