I made a mistake by not selling when the market was high this year

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retire2022
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Location: NYC

Re: I made a mistake by not selling when the market was high this year

Post by retire2022 » Fri Jan 04, 2019 5:58 pm

sheople2 wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 11:58 pm
The support and superior information that I get from this board is unparalleled. I’m so glad that this thread wasn’t closed. I keep learning every time. Personal finance is not an easy subject. Your time and effort in creating these posts are of great value to myself and so many others. Thanks for the service that all of you provide. It’s nice to be allowed to be included in such an upscale, patient and kind board.
Sheople

With all this advice explained in different ways, did the information get you to the same place?

Topic Author
sheople2
Posts: 285
Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2007 10:04 pm

Re: I made a mistake by not selling when the market was high this year

Post by sheople2 » Sat Jan 05, 2019 1:31 am

dodecahedron wrote:
Fri Jan 04, 2019 12:10 am
ljb wrote:
Wed Jan 02, 2019 9:36 am

Did you know that, as a person with SSDI income, you qualify to make contributions to a Roth IRA?

IRS regulation require that someone must have earned income to contribute to an IRA, but SSDI income counts.
No, unfortunately SSDI does not count as earned income for the purpose of IRA contribution.

Certain other types of disability income DO count for this purpose, but not SSDI.

https://www.jklasser.com/askjk/i-receiv ... is-income/

The only type of disability insurance that qualifies as earned income is taxable long term disability reported in box 1 of a W-2. SSDI is not reported on a W-2. It is reported on an SSA-1099.
No need for sorry. I'll be using your formula. It's so simple and is close enough. Exactly what I was looking for. Thanks so much. Also, thanks for verifying about the SSDI. I suspected that was the case. I wish they would change the law on that.

Topic Author
sheople2
Posts: 285
Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2007 10:04 pm

Re: I made a mistake by not selling when the market was high this year

Post by sheople2 » Sat Jan 05, 2019 1:50 am

retire2022 wrote:
Fri Jan 04, 2019 5:58 pm
sheople2 wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 11:58 pm
The support and superior information that I get from this board is unparalleled. I’m so glad that this thread wasn’t closed. I keep learning every time. Personal finance is not an easy subject. Your time and effort in creating these posts are of great value to myself and so many others. Thanks for the service that all of you provide. It’s nice to be allowed to be included in such an upscale, patient and kind board.
Sheople

With all this advice explained in different ways, did the information get you to the same place?
Yes, I did. A lot for me to digest. Much of it is review, which is always good. (As far as Apple stock goes - yes, I do firmly believe that I made a mistake but I have to move forward. Again - I wasn’t trying to be clever or time the market. I noticed that it was way up and that my allocation was too bloated in that one stock. It would have been smart to take a gain of say 20K and put it on the safe side in order to use it to buy a replacement car I will soon need. I always learn the hard way. I recently heard a Navy SEAL commander speaking and at the end of his speech he said, "know that life is not fair and you will fail often". The important lesson is to keep trying and “not ring the bell”.

Topic Author
sheople2
Posts: 285
Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2007 10:04 pm

Re: I made a mistake by not selling when the market was high this year

Post by sheople2 » Sat Jan 05, 2019 11:46 pm

Youngblood wrote:
Sat Dec 15, 2018 2:47 pm
OP, please read my signature below. I have used this philosophy since retiring over twenty years ago. I have avoided losing significant money during that time period because whenever I see that my capital gains and resulting net worth are eliciting a wow response, I realize that this won’t go on forever and therefore I reduce my equity allocation by selling. Yes, when you sell you won’t continue the percentage gain if the market continues to rise but it sure is a relief when these rapid declines occur.

I don’t think it's prudent to hold stocks in high percentages forever (your old age).
I don’t think it’s prudent to believe you haven’t lost anything until you sell.
I do think it’s wise when you have made a certain percentage profit (rapidly) to take some money off the table.

If the market rapidly advances (which I hope it does) before I decide to increase my stock allocation I will be happy with the gains I made this year by selling too soon.
I reread all of the posts again. I concur with what he says. I wasn't trying to time the market - I was happy with my AA - I simply saw a "wow" moment and should have acted because I knew it wasn't going to last. A rapid rise in an individual stock is a gift not to be ignored - no matter what else is going in life to distract us, it's important to take a few minutes to execute what we sense is correct.

learningLady
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Re: I made a mistake by not selling when the market was high this year

Post by learningLady » Tue Jan 14, 2020 4:43 pm

I was thinking of selling my index funds and move to bonds - as I felt market is very high. This post and advice by everybody is very motivational. Thank you. Staying the course after reading most of the posts here.

vipertom1970
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Re: I made a mistake by not selling when the market was high this year

Post by vipertom1970 » Tue Jan 14, 2020 5:38 pm

^^^^^ Learning lady, I am just curious if were you in the market before 2008-2009 and did you sell in 2009 ?

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Stef
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Re: I made a mistake by not selling when the market was high this year

Post by Stef » Wed Jan 15, 2020 12:50 am

OP please update, did you keep your Apple stocks?

learningLady
Posts: 52
Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2008 3:07 pm

Re: I made a mistake by not selling when the market was high this year

Post by learningLady » Wed Jan 15, 2020 9:01 am

I did not sell in 2008 - as I was reasonably young (mid 30's) than and had smaller portfolio. I think I have stomach to ride out a recession.
I did transfer my kids 529 this week to 70% bond. He will be needing it very soon.

I only invest in vanguard index funds no stocks.

Now portfolio is bigger and I was getting little greedy. :D :D

an_asker
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Re: I made a mistake by not selling when the market was high this year

Post by an_asker » Wed Jan 15, 2020 9:16 am

I haven't followed the whole thread but am really interested from a human behavioral perspective (not that that is anything I do for a living): of those folks who were :oops: -ing right around a year ago about not selling when the market was high in 2018 - when(if) did you sell in 2019? If you are still holding on, why are you doing so?

learningLady
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Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2008 3:07 pm

Re: I made a mistake by not selling when the market was high this year

Post by learningLady » Wed Jan 15, 2020 9:23 am

I have not sold anything in 2018 or 2019. But i am tempted right now. Another thing when market was 14000 I sold everthing and moved to bonds for 2-3 years. And market kept going up. So lesson learn follow the path.

FrankLUSMC
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Joined: Tue Nov 28, 2017 1:43 pm

Re: I made a mistake by not selling when the market was high this year

Post by FrankLUSMC » Wed Jan 15, 2020 9:28 am

an_asker wrote:
Wed Jan 15, 2020 9:16 am
I haven't followed the whole thread but am really interested from a human behavioral perspective (not that that is anything I do for a living): of those folks who were :oops: -ing right around a year ago about not selling when the market was high in 2018 - when(if) did you sell in 2019? If you are still holding on, why are you doing so?
I bought an ETF, now a LTCG far right column
12/10/2018 100.0000 $81.96 $8,195.50 $9,386.00 — $1,190.50 $1,190.50
01/02/2019 100.0000 $77.54 $7,754.00 $9,386.00 — $1,632.00 $1,632.00

:sharebeer

an_asker
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Joined: Thu Jun 27, 2013 2:15 pm

Re: I made a mistake by not selling when the market was high this year

Post by an_asker » Wed Jan 15, 2020 10:14 am

FrankLUSMC wrote:
Wed Jan 15, 2020 9:28 am
an_asker wrote:
Wed Jan 15, 2020 9:16 am
I haven't followed the whole thread but am really interested from a human behavioral perspective (not that that is anything I do for a living): of those folks who were :oops: -ing right around a year ago about not selling when the market was high in 2018 - when(if) did you sell in 2019? If you are still holding on, why are you doing so?
I bought an ETF, now a LTCG far right column
12/10/2018 100.0000 $81.96 $8,195.50 $9,386.00 — $1,190.50 $1,190.50
01/02/2019 100.0000 $77.54 $7,754.00 $9,386.00 — $1,632.00 $1,632.00

:sharebeer
I confess I had been on the fence in 12/2018. (I think I shared that on these forums though I don't recall).

We had recently swapped out some ESPP proceeds into SPY. I wanted to swap into VTI or related and take the short term loss. Unfortunately for us, we were in S&P500 all over the place and had automatic investments going in. So, we would've fallen foul of wash sale rules. In the analysis paralysis, I did nothing - thankfully* LOL!!

* if I had swapped out, I would have gotten the short term loss and saved a little on taxes; however, over the last 12 months, S&P500 has slightly outperformed the entire market, so it would've been much ado about nothing

an_asker
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Re: I made a mistake by not selling when the market was high this year

Post by an_asker » Wed Jan 15, 2020 10:15 am

learningLady wrote:
Wed Jan 15, 2020 9:23 am
I have not sold anything in 2018 or 2019. But i am tempted right now. Another thing when market was 14000 I sold everthing and moved to bonds for 2-3 years. And market kept going up. So lesson learn follow the path.
Absolutely!!

delamer
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Joined: Tue Feb 08, 2011 6:13 pm

Re: I made a mistake by not selling when the market was high this year

Post by delamer » Wed Jan 15, 2020 12:02 pm

an_asker wrote:
Wed Jan 15, 2020 9:16 am
I haven't followed the whole thread but am really interested from a human behavioral perspective (not that that is anything I do for a living): of those folks who were :oops: -ing right around a year ago about not selling when the market was high in 2018 - when(if) did you sell in 2019? If you are still holding on, why are you doing so?
A lot of people in the forum did tax-loss harvesting in late 2018 after the drop (me included). Not quite what you were asking, but making lemonade out of lemons.

I did a sale earlier this week in my taxable account because I really needed to rebalance it due to the stock market runup (cash/bonds were about 1/3 lower than my target asset allocation). Not looking forward to paying the taxes, but in that case the asset had doubled in value so I sold high.

Hopefully what the above says from a human behavioral perspective is that I acted rationally in the circumstances. :happy

an_asker
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Joined: Thu Jun 27, 2013 2:15 pm

Re: I made a mistake by not selling when the market was high this year

Post by an_asker » Wed Jan 15, 2020 12:06 pm

delamer wrote:
Wed Jan 15, 2020 12:02 pm
an_asker wrote:
Wed Jan 15, 2020 9:16 am
I haven't followed the whole thread but am really interested from a human behavioral perspective (not that that is anything I do for a living): of those folks who were :oops: -ing right around a year ago about not selling when the market was high in 2018 - when(if) did you sell in 2019? If you are still holding on, why are you doing so?
A lot of people in the forum did tax-loss harvesting in late 2018 after the drop (me included). Not quite what you were asking, but making lemonade out of lemons.

I did a sale earlier this week in my taxable account because I really needed to rebalance it due to the stock market runup (cash/bonds were about 1/3 lower than my target asset allocation). Not looking forward to paying the taxes, but in that case the asset had doubled in value so I sold high.

Hopefully what the above says from a human behavioral perspective is that I acted rationally in the circumstances. :happy
You are not in my target population ;-)

I was trying to find out who met the following criteria:

- in December 2018, they were complaining that they didn't sell at the high of 2018
- sold sometime in 2019
- not for tax (gain or loss) harvesting, rebalancing, etc

To those folks who meet the above criteria, my questions are:

- when in 2019 did you sell?
- if you didn't sell in 2019, why are you still holding - especially after complaining in 12/2018? Are you waiting for the next downturn so you can come back and say the same thing all over again, i.e., "Dang it, I should've sold in 1/2020 when the market was at a high"?

delamer
Posts: 9492
Joined: Tue Feb 08, 2011 6:13 pm

Re: I made a mistake by not selling when the market was high this year

Post by delamer » Wed Jan 15, 2020 12:16 pm

an_asker wrote:
Wed Jan 15, 2020 12:06 pm
delamer wrote:
Wed Jan 15, 2020 12:02 pm
an_asker wrote:
Wed Jan 15, 2020 9:16 am
I haven't followed the whole thread but am really interested from a human behavioral perspective (not that that is anything I do for a living): of those folks who were :oops: -ing right around a year ago about not selling when the market was high in 2018 - when(if) did you sell in 2019? If you are still holding on, why are you doing so?
A lot of people in the forum did tax-loss harvesting in late 2018 after the drop (me included). Not quite what you were asking, but making lemonade out of lemons.

I did a sale earlier this week in my taxable account because I really needed to rebalance it due to the stock market runup (cash/bonds were about 1/3 lower than my target asset allocation). Not looking forward to paying the taxes, but in that case the asset had doubled in value so I sold high.

Hopefully what the above says from a human behavioral perspective is that I acted rationally in the circumstances. :happy
You are not in my target population ;-)

I was trying to find out who met the following criteria:

- in December 2018, they were complaining that they didn't sell at the high of 2018
- sold sometime in 2019
- not for tax (gain or loss) harvesting, rebalancing, etc

To those folks who meet the above criteria, my questions are:

- when in 2019 did you sell?
- if you didn't sell in 2019, why are you still holding - especially after complaining in 12/2018? Are you waiting for the next downturn so you can come back and say the same thing all over again, i.e., "Dang it, I should've sold in 1/2020 when the market was at a high"?
Unless someone needed to spend down their assets to cover their expenses, why would they sell if they weren’t rebalancing or tax loss harvesting?

Not meant as a snarky question; if someone is selling for other than the above reasons, then they are playing the market rather than investing for the long term. So not very Boglehead like.

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