Quality Power-Tool Brands

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spitty
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by spitty » Wed Dec 18, 2019 9:17 am

Lots of Youtube reviews/comparisons on all the brands mentioned. I have a few Milwaukee Fuel M12 pieces and am very happy with them (2351-20 flashlight is amazing). They probably won't pop off lug nuts torqued to 140--you'd need the M18 tools which are pretty expensive to just rotate your tires 1-2x per year.

ScaledWheel
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by ScaledWheel » Wed Dec 18, 2019 10:11 am

As others have said, your choice will depend on what you're trying to do. After remodeling a house, I'd definitely go with a single brand of cordless tools.

The Milwaukee M18 tools (available from Home Depot, and probably Lowes) can run pretty much everything: from drills to oscillating tools to mitre saws, and more. They are pricey but worth the convenience if you're using them every week/weekend.

mancich
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by mancich » Wed Dec 18, 2019 10:14 am

ScaledWheel wrote:
Wed Dec 18, 2019 10:11 am
As others have said, your choice will depend on what you're trying to do. After remodeling a house, I'd definitely go with a single brand of cordless tools.

The Milwaukee M18 tools (available from Home Depot, and probably Lowes) can run pretty much everything: from drills to oscillating tools to mitre saws, and more. They are pricey but worth the convenience if you're using them every week/weekend.
+1 for Milwaukee. Have several and love them. Plenty powerful enough for most purposes. Though I also have some Dewalt tools and those have been solid too.

ddurrett896
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by ddurrett896 » Wed Dec 18, 2019 11:10 am

Milwaukee

M12 if you don't do a lot of heavy hitting. Nice and light.

I switched to M18 because the assortment of tools was much larger.

iamlucky13
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by iamlucky13 » Wed Dec 18, 2019 6:29 pm

czeckers wrote:
Wed Dec 18, 2019 5:46 am
Whatever brand tool you buy, you are buying into their entire lineup. Because batteries are so expensive and not too nterchangeable between brands, people will stick with the same brand and swap a couple of batteries between all their tools.

Festool is the top of the heap but super expensive

Then Dewalt, Milwaukee, Makita, Porter Cable are all professional grade

Then Ryobi and the rest are for hobbyists.
Porter Cable is Black and Decker's mid-grade brand, not the same level as the others mentioned. I'd compare them to Ridgid, and some of the better Ryobi and Craftsman tools. Still a good choice for general use, though.

I'd put Bosch roughly on par with Makita and Milwaukee. Definitely not "the rest." Regarding Dewalt - reliability seems good, but of the tools I've used, Bosch, Milwaukee, and Makita always feel better to me in terms of ergonomics and smooth operation.

michaelingp
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by michaelingp » Wed Dec 18, 2019 7:13 pm

Watty wrote:
Tue Dec 17, 2019 12:38 pm

With the cost of replacement batteries I stopped using them years ago and just use corded tools and run an extension cord when I need to. I do have some extension cords with multiple outlets which makes this easier. One nice thing about corded power tools is that they tend to be more powerful.

You don't say how many years ago when you stopped, but you may find that technology has improved immensely. I don't think it's true that corded tools are more powerful these days, although they are less expensive. I just built a deck with my Makita 18V cordless drill. I never even had to charge the battery. My wife just went to a cordless leaf blower after saying it wasn't worth it for years. Now you can't get the Ego out of her hands.

As to the OP, there are a lot of good tools out there, and most people find one brand and stick with it because batteries are so expensive, making it hard to find people who can make objective comparisons. I have never had a Makita tool fail, so if that's my first choice in a new tool. But I've used a lot of others and they are great too. I will even buy Harbor Freight if I'm pretty sure I only need the tool for one job, like a tile cutter.

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czeckers
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by czeckers » Wed Dec 18, 2019 7:30 pm

Porter Cable is Black and Decker's mid-grade brand, not the same level as the others mentioned. I'd compare them to Ridgid, and some of the better Ryobi and Craftsman tools. Still a good choice for general use, though.

I'd put Bosch roughly on par with Makita and Milwaukee. Definitely not "the rest." Regarding Dewalt - reliability seems good, but of the tools I've used, Bosch, Milwaukee, and Makita always feel better to me in terms of ergonomics and smooth operation.
I would agree with you there. Forgot about Bosch.
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David Jay
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by David Jay » Wed Dec 18, 2019 7:37 pm

Hanksmoney wrote:
Tue Dec 17, 2019 2:46 pm
lthenderson wrote:
Tue Dec 17, 2019 10:24 am
In my opinion only:

Festool - Professional Grade

Milwaukee, Makita, Bosch, Porter Cable, Dewalt - Weekend Warrior

Ryobi, Black and Decker, Hitachi - Disposable
I take issue with where you placed Hitachi - it's definitely good weekend warrior stuff. Superior in some ways - as they all have +/-
Agree, Hitachi does not belong in the “disposable” category.
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sajohnson
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by sajohnson » Wed Dec 18, 2019 7:47 pm

I searched for "Consumer Reports" (CR) and came up empty, so I'm guessing it hasn't been mentioned.

Here are their ratings of cordless drills:
https://www.consumerreports.org/product ... -overview/

The top 2 "heavy-duty" drills are DeWalt. That said, one of the worst in that category is also DeWalt.

The top drills in the "general" and "light" duty categories are made by Makita.

There are other good choices as well.

FWIW -- while the fact that CR has partnered with Facebook is disturbing, it is still a very good (and often the only) source of objective information. An online subscription is well worth the price.

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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by abuss368 » Wed Dec 18, 2019 8:04 pm

I have used Dewalt products over the years and they did the job.
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sajohnson
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by sajohnson » Wed Dec 18, 2019 8:44 pm

Often times, threads like this do not result in any consensus because everyone has their favorites. Either tools they personally own and use, or what their brother/father/uncle/friend have told them are 'the best'.

One thing to consider is that Ridgid will replace batteries for the life of the tool. That can save a significant amount of money. I did not realize that when I purchased my drill and driver. Had I known, I might have purchased Ridgid tools -- if they were rated well by CR.

There are 2 Ridgid drills in CR's current ratings. Both did well.

CR only rated drills. Their ratings may not apply to other types of cordless tools.

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mlh46
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by mlh46 » Mon Dec 23, 2019 9:53 am

Thanks everyone for your thoughts and suggestions. Based on the advice, I purchased a Milwaukee M18 drill/driver set. I'm pleased so far. Thanks.

hicabob
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by hicabob » Mon Dec 23, 2019 10:01 am

mlh46 wrote:
Mon Dec 23, 2019 9:53 am
Thanks everyone for your thoughts and suggestions. Based on the advice, I purchased a Milwaukee M18 drill/driver set. I'm pleased so far. Thanks.
That'll work!
https://tenor.com/view/toolman-taylor-t ... if-5701538

jharkin
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by jharkin » Mon Dec 23, 2019 3:14 pm

carolinaman wrote:
Wed Dec 18, 2019 7:46 am

My son is a remodeling contractor and he uses a lot of Ridgid power tools. They must be good for him to have used them for so many years.
Some contractors switched to them because Rigid offers free battery replacements. My dad started buying into Rigid (having been a DeWalt guy for decades) in the last few years he ran his remodeling business.

Like others I put DeWalt, Milwaukee, Makita and Bosch into the "pro" category. Festool is in a league of its own for contractors with TV contracts (I'm looking at you Tommy Silva :mrgreen: ). Of these, different brands seem to have different levels of popularity in various trades based on the tool mix and region - i.e. I tend to see more carpenters and general contractors using yellow tools, and more plumbers using red...

Porter Cable, etc are all mid grade tools... but I see pro's using them from time to time, especially for less frequently used tools where they dont need the best of the best.


Black and Decker is just junk. Dont bother.


Keep in mind that many of these tool brands are under one umbrella in homeowner grade/ mid grade/pro grade groups.
I.e. the Stanley Black & Decker Corp. owns:
* DeWalt (pro )
* Bostitch (pro - only fastening tools)
* Porter-Cable (mid)
* Black and Decker (homeowner)
* Craftsman (hand tools, acquired from Sears)
* Irwin (hand tools)
* Stanley (hand tools)

boomer_techie
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by boomer_techie » Mon Dec 23, 2019 5:16 pm

jharkin wrote:
Mon Dec 23, 2019 3:14 pm
Keep in mind that many of these tool brands are under one umbrella in homeowner grade/ mid grade/pro grade groups.
I.e. the Stanley Black & Decker Corp. owns:
* Craftsman (hand tools, acquired from Sears)
Power tools too. However, be cautious: Sears retained the right to sell Craftsman branded tools for 15 years. The Sears/Craftsman is different from the Stanley/Craftsman.

teamDE
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by teamDE » Mon Dec 23, 2019 11:12 pm

jharkin wrote:
Mon Dec 23, 2019 3:14 pm
carolinaman wrote:
Wed Dec 18, 2019 7:46 am

My son is a remodeling contractor and he uses a lot of Ridgid power tools. They must be good for him to have used them for so many years.
Some contractors switched to them because Rigid offers free battery replacements. My dad started buying into Rigid (having been a DeWalt guy for decades) in the last few years he ran his remodeling business.

Like others I put DeWalt, Milwaukee, Makita and Bosch into the "pro" category. Festool is in a league of its own for contractors with TV contracts (I'm looking at you Tommy Silva :mrgreen: ). Of these, different brands seem to have different levels of popularity in various trades based on the tool mix and region - i.e. I tend to see more carpenters and general contractors using yellow tools, and more plumbers using red...
Hah, this. Festool is for rich guys who do "woodworking" in their garage and spend too much time on the internet researching tools. Most contractors i see use DeWalt with Milwaukee right behind. Makita and Bosch are up there as well.

sajohnson
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by sajohnson » Mon Dec 23, 2019 11:48 pm

Next we need to start a "Which motor oil is best?" thread. :wink:

Barcelonasteve
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by Barcelonasteve » Mon Dec 23, 2019 11:56 pm

Festool if you can find them on craigslist for a decent price. The company used to sell recons occasionally at amazing discounts, but rejiggered things so that it’s nowhere near as good a deal.

I have a combination drill/impact driver that I like, but it is a compromise and isn’t in the same league as the router, sander, and track saw, which can all be connected to their dust collectors for amazingly efficient dust collection for both safety and reduction in mess/cleanup, which is great if you’re doing a job in the house. Bought the drill reconditioned maybe five years ago. The batteries (14 volt) still hold a great charge. I once priced the batteries and they were a lot more reasonable than Milwaukee’s. I got fed up with Milwaukee; the batteries died after a year, over and over again. They changed the connections twice in a short period so that I’d have to replace the tool since the battery would cost the same as a new tool.

Sold the festool track saw for almost twice what I paid. I never managed to get my hands on their sliding miter saw, but I’ve been pretty happy with my Bosch glide.

One offering that was missing was a regular circular saw. The track saw won’t work without a track. I’d go with a P-C sidewinder for that.

For jobs where strangers are working nearby, Harbor Freight. Tools tend to grow legs and walk off a job site. Evolution’s a bitch.

mdavis
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by mdavis » Tue Dec 24, 2019 12:16 am

The best: festool.

-mark

jharkin
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by jharkin » Tue Dec 24, 2019 9:38 am

boomer_techie wrote:
Mon Dec 23, 2019 5:16 pm
jharkin wrote:
Mon Dec 23, 2019 3:14 pm
Keep in mind that many of these tool brands are under one umbrella in homeowner grade/ mid grade/pro grade groups.
I.e. the Stanley Black & Decker Corp. owns:
* Craftsman (hand tools, acquired from Sears)
Power tools too. However, be cautious: Sears retained the right to sell Craftsman branded tools for 15 years. The Sears/Craftsman is different from the Stanley/Craftsman.
All the Craftsman I have at the moment are hand me downs from my Dad. Mostly 1960s to 80s production. I don’t plan on acquiring any more unless it’s similar vintage. :sharebeer

falconsfan
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by falconsfan » Tue Dec 24, 2019 11:18 am

sajohnson wrote:
Mon Dec 23, 2019 11:48 pm
Next we need to start a "Which motor oil is best?" thread. :wink:
No need for that. Guy over on u tube did a great bracket style competition and came up with a winner. Although for most of us any synthetic will do.

Project Farm channel on the tube.

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Quercus Palustris
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by Quercus Palustris » Tue Dec 24, 2019 11:24 am

falconsfan wrote:
Tue Dec 24, 2019 11:18 am
No need for that. Guy over on u tube did a great bracket style competition and came up with a winner. Although for most of us any synthetic will do.

Project Farm channel on the tube.
Ugh. That seems as unscientific as possible, and unrelated to how oil actually works and wears in a real engine (heat cycles, metal shavings from moving parts, cold starts).

There's actually a whole forum dedicated to motor oil, that treats it as seriously as Bogleheads treat investment - google "Bob is the oil guy" forums.

The only way to know how good an oil is, is to run it in your particular engine, in your particular conditions, and get the used oil analyzed (not too expensive) to compare to an analysis of the unused oil.

Everything else is as good as backtesting and wishful thinking :D

Edit: now that I think about it, portfolio selection and "which motor oil is best" are almost the same question! The only way to be sure of an oil is to run and analyze it in your car for 200,000 miles at which point you can be fairly certain it's good or bad - just in time to buy a new car, at which point you're back to uncertain because it's a different engine.

So in the end you just take into account everyone else's opinion, disregard the industry advertising, hope for the best - and go for the lowest expense ratio since that's all you control :beer

Mr. Rumples
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by Mr. Rumples » Thu Jan 02, 2020 9:18 am

A helpful tool review site:

https://www.toolboxbuzz.com

falconsfan
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by falconsfan » Thu Jan 02, 2020 10:17 am

Quercus Palustris wrote:
Tue Dec 24, 2019 11:24 am
falconsfan wrote:
Tue Dec 24, 2019 11:18 am
No need for that. Guy over on u tube did a great bracket style competition and came up with a winner. Although for most of us any synthetic will do.

Project Farm channel on the tube.
Ugh. That seems as unscientific as possible, and unrelated to how oil actually works and wears in a real engine (heat cycles, metal shavings from moving parts, cold starts).

There's actually a whole forum dedicated to motor oil, that treats it as seriously as Bogleheads treat investment - google "Bob is the oil guy" forums.

The only way to know how good an oil is, is to run it in your particular engine, in your particular conditions, and get the used oil analyzed (not too expensive) to compare to an analysis of the unused oil.

Everything else is as good as backtesting and wishful thinking :D

Edit: now that I think about it, portfolio selection and "which motor oil is best" are almost the same question! The only way to be sure of an oil is to run and analyze it in your car for 200,000 miles at which point you can be fairly certain it's good or bad - just in time to buy a new car, at which point you're back to uncertain because it's a different engine.

So in the end you just take into account everyone else's opinion, disregard the industry advertising, hope for the best - and go for the lowest expense ratio since that's all you control :beer
Hardly unscientific and as good as any comments on bobs site. Did you even watch it?

destinationnc
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by destinationnc » Thu Jan 02, 2020 10:46 am

hicabob wrote:
Tue Dec 17, 2019 10:43 am
Hilti's are some of the the best but expensive. My German associates used to buy them and scoff at others. Sometimes buying a cheap tool at Harbor Freight then upgrading if you find you use it extensively works out well.
I'm surprised to not see more mentions for Hilti, but they are quite expensive. I follow the same process with Harbor Freight tools - some are perfectly fine for around the house but some are worth the upgrade. One thing I've found is I really like variable speed tools at the very least if you're considering the Harbor Freight cheapy tools.

squirm
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by squirm » Thu Jan 02, 2020 11:02 am

falconsfan wrote:
Thu Jan 02, 2020 10:17 am
Quercus Palustris wrote:
Tue Dec 24, 2019 11:24 am
falconsfan wrote:
Tue Dec 24, 2019 11:18 am
No need for that. Guy over on u tube did a great bracket style competition and came up with a winner. Although for most of us any synthetic will do.

Project Farm channel on the tube.
Ugh. That seems as unscientific as possible, and unrelated to how oil actually works and wears in a real engine (heat cycles, metal shavings from moving parts, cold starts).

There's actually a whole forum dedicated to motor oil, that treats it as seriously as Bogleheads treat investment - google "Bob is the oil guy" forums.

The only way to know how good an oil is, is to run it in your particular engine, in your particular conditions, and get the used oil analyzed (not too expensive) to compare to an analysis of the unused oil.

Everything else is as good as backtesting and wishful thinking :D

Edit: now that I think about it, portfolio selection and "which motor oil is best" are almost the same question! The only way to be sure of an oil is to run and analyze it in your car for 200,000 miles at which point you can be fairly certain it's good or bad - just in time to buy a new car, at which point you're back to uncertain because it's a different engine.

So in the end you just take into account everyone else's opinion, disregard the industry advertising, hope for the best - and go for the lowest expense ratio since that's all you control :beer
Hardly unscientific and as good as any comments on bobs site. Did you even watch it?
I like project farm and his style of testing. Very antibias, and understands testing methods. I'll take his recommendations over anyone elses.
I hope as his channel gets more popular he doesn't veer off course.

-ryan-
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by -ryan- » Thu Jan 02, 2020 11:10 am

About 10 years ago (give or take a year) I bought a set of Ryobi cordless tools when they had recently come out with their one+ 18v lithium ion setup (when they first started doing the lime green tools). The price was so much lower than a similar Dewalt set (their pre-lithium ion batteries) that I figured I would buy them and throw them out when they broke. At the same time I bought a Ryobi $89 miter saw.

Since then I have done tons of projects with these tools, including building two decks. They still work great, except that one of the batteries finally stopped holding a charge last year. For $99 I was able to get two new lithium ion batteries, another charger, and an impact driver, so it was a no-brainer. Still using the same tools, and I would say I have more than gotten my money's worth.

That said, I am not sure what I will buy when I need to replace them. I wouldn't hesitate to buy another Ryobi product though.

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FrugalInvestor
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by FrugalInvestor » Sun Jan 12, 2020 10:34 am

I asked for a starter set of Ryobi cordless tools for Christmas about 15 years ago. My goal was to standardize on one system so all my tools could share a common batteries for convenience and cost control (batteries are expensive over time). I'm a very heavy user for a DIY'er and wasn't sure about the longevity of the tools or batteries but they have proven to be excellent in all respects for me. I've added many other tools over the years because of the convenience of the single system, durability of the tools, the breadth of tool selection (both shop lawn & garden) and the cost effectiveness.

I've changed from the regular-duty batteries and single chargers that often can be purchased along with the tools to high capacity batteries and a multi-charger. When I need replacement batteries I purchase them when there is a 2-for-1 battery special. Batteries usually last 2-3 years for me. Having a multi-charger allows me to rotate batteries so I never run out of charge.

There are always excellent discounts on batteries and tools (or tool sets) around Father's day or Christmas at Home Depot.
IGNORE the noise! | Our life is frittered away by detail... simplify, simplify. - Henry David Thoreau

vested1
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by vested1 » Sun Jan 12, 2020 11:28 am

For cordless tools, I suggest no smaller than 18v. Use corded electric tools for those jobs where lugging down the motor can be dangerous. I use Milwaukee for more heavy duty jobs, like my porta-band saw that cuts through galvanized pipe or metal fence posts like butter. Bosch hammer drills for concrete drilling, and laser measuring tools. I use DeWalt for cordless and corded wood/metal drilling, and jobs that require the extensive installation of screws. I also use DeWalt tile saws. I've gotten over buying cheap tools after having to replace so many over the years.

For chain saws, I suggest Stihl.

Helo80
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by Helo80 » Sun Jan 12, 2020 11:37 am

I would honestly be surprised if you can go wrong with any of the brands in this list --- especially if you're a casual user. If your income relies on reliable tools, probably look at Milwaukee or Makita and those tiers. As with anything, you pay more for higher quality stuff.

I personally use Ridgid, and there is not a bolt my impact wrench has not been able to take off. I think if I upgrade to their octane batteries, I'll get even more power out of the tool. But, the Lifetime Service Agreement (when you register said tool within 90 days of purchase), is great as it includes the batteries when purchased in a kit. I don't think batteries purchased solo are eligible for said LSA.

Spirit Rider
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by Spirit Rider » Sun Jan 12, 2020 12:32 pm

squirm wrote:
Thu Jan 02, 2020 11:02 am
falconsfan wrote:
Thu Jan 02, 2020 10:17 am
Quercus Palustris wrote:
Tue Dec 24, 2019 11:24 am
falconsfan wrote:
Tue Dec 24, 2019 11:18 am
No need for that. Guy over on u tube did a great bracket style competition and came up with a winner. Although for most of us any synthetic will do.

Project Farm channel on the tube.
Ugh. That seems as unscientific as possible, and unrelated to how oil actually works and wears in a real engine (heat cycles, metal shavings from moving parts, cold starts).

There's actually a whole forum dedicated to motor oil, that treats it as seriously as Bogleheads treat investment - google "Bob is the oil guy" forums.

The only way to know how good an oil is, is to run it in your particular engine, in your particular conditions, and get the used oil analyzed (not too expensive) to compare to an analysis of the unused oil.

Everything else is as good as backtesting and wishful thinking :D

Edit: now that I think about it, portfolio selection and "which motor oil is best" are almost the same question! The only way to be sure of an oil is to run and analyze it in your car for 200,000 miles at which point you can be fairly certain it's good or bad - just in time to buy a new car, at which point you're back to uncertain because it's a different engine.

So in the end you just take into account everyone else's opinion, disregard the industry advertising, hope for the best - and go for the lowest expense ratio since that's all you control :beer
Hardly unscientific and as good as any comments on bobs site. Did you even watch it?
Do you even bother to read @Quercus Palustris' post you are commenting on. He wasn't referring to just some baseless comments on the forum. He was referring to actual results from a lab doing true scientific oil analysis.

I did watch several youtube Project Far channel oil comparison videos. I wouldn't call them unscientific. I would call it quasi-scientific with the results somewhat indicative of a limited number of data points. However, simply testing lubricity, evaporation and cold flow rates before and after the evaporation test hardly compares to scientific lab analysis of used oil.
I like project farm and his style of testing. Very antibias, and understands testing methods. I'll take his recommendations over anyone elses.
I hope as his channel gets more popular he doesn't veer off course.
He maybe unbiased and his testing understandable, but overly simplistic in what he is testing. His testing is better than no testing, but not even close to a good analysis of the relative merits of various oil products. He does no duration testing at all.

The various labs that perform used oil testing do spectral analysis to report on ~20 metals, additives, silicon, etc..., viscosity, flashpoint, fuel dilution, water and antifreeze contamination and insoluables. The spectral analysis give a FAR better analysis of metal wear and other performance of the oil than some simple scar analysis on a bearing.

Spirit Rider
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Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by Spirit Rider » Sun Jan 12, 2020 12:38 pm

Spirit Rider wrote:
Sun Jan 12, 2020 12:32 pm
falconsfan wrote:
Thu Jan 02, 2020 10:17 am
Quercus Palustris wrote:
Tue Dec 24, 2019 11:24 am
falconsfan wrote:
Tue Dec 24, 2019 11:18 am
No need for that. Guy over on u tube did a great bracket style competition and came up with a winner. Although for most of us any synthetic will do.

Project Farm channel on the tube.
Ugh. That seems as unscientific as possible, and unrelated to how oil actually works and wears in a real engine (heat cycles, metal shavings from moving parts, cold starts).

There's actually a whole forum dedicated to motor oil, that treats it as seriously as Bogleheads treat investment - google "Bob is the oil guy" forums.

The only way to know how good an oil is, is to run it in your particular engine, in your particular conditions, and get the used oil analyzed (not too expensive) to compare to an analysis of the unused oil.

Everything else is as good as backtesting and wishful thinking :D

Edit: now that I think about it, portfolio selection and "which motor oil is best" are almost the same question! The only way to be sure of an oil is to run and analyze it in your car for 200,000 miles at which point you can be fairly certain it's good or bad - just in time to buy a new car, at which point you're back to uncertain because it's a different engine.

So in the end you just take into account everyone else's opinion, disregard the industry advertising, hope for the best - and go for the lowest expense ratio since that's all you control :beer
Hardly unscientific and as good as any comments on bobs site. Did you even watch it?
Did you even bother to read @Quercus Palustris' post you are commenting on. He wasn't referring to just some baseless comments on the forum. He was referring to actual results from a lab doing true scientific oil analysis.

I did watch several youtube Project Far channel oil comparison videos. I wouldn't call them unscientific. I would call it quasi-scientific with the results somewhat indicative of a limited number of data points. However, simply testing lubricity, evaporation and cold flow rates before and after the evaporation test hardly compares to scientific lab analysis of used oil.
squirm wrote:
Thu Jan 02, 2020 11:02 am
I like project farm and his style of testing. Very antibias, and understands testing methods. I'll take his recommendations over anyone elses.
I hope as his channel gets more popular he doesn't veer off course.
He maybe unbiased and his testing understandable, but overly simplistic in what he is testing. His testing is better than no testing, but not even close to a good analysis of the relative merits of various oil products. He does no duration testing at all.

The various labs that perform used oil testing do spectral analysis to report on ~20 metals, additives, silicon, etc..., viscosity, flashpoint, fuel dilution, water and antifreeze contamination and insoluables. The spectral analysis give a FAR better analysis of metal wear and other performance of the oil than some simple scar analysis on a bearing.

Small Savanna
Posts: 167
Joined: Sat Feb 09, 2019 2:27 am

Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by Small Savanna » Sun Jan 12, 2020 12:43 pm

I've had good luck with Ryobi for occasional DIY purposes. It used to not matter if all your tools were from the same manufacturer, but there seems to be an advantage now of picking one brand so that the batteries and chargers are interchangeable. I have an older Black and Decker cordless drill that worked fine, but I haven't been able to find the charger since we moved.

squirm
Posts: 2008
Joined: Sat Mar 19, 2011 11:53 am

Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by squirm » Sun Jan 12, 2020 4:40 pm

Spirit Rider wrote:
Sun Jan 12, 2020 12:38 pm
Spirit Rider wrote:
Sun Jan 12, 2020 12:32 pm
falconsfan wrote:
Thu Jan 02, 2020 10:17 am
Quercus Palustris wrote:
Tue Dec 24, 2019 11:24 am
falconsfan wrote:
Tue Dec 24, 2019 11:18 am
No need for that. Guy over on u tube did a great bracket style competition and came up with a winner. Although for most of us any synthetic will do.

Project Farm channel on the tube.
Ugh. That seems as unscientific as possible, and unrelated to how oil actually works and wears in a real engine (heat cycles, metal shavings from moving parts, cold starts).

There's actually a whole forum dedicated to motor oil, that treats it as seriously as Bogleheads treat investment - google "Bob is the oil guy" forums.

The only way to know how good an oil is, is to run it in your particular engine, in your particular conditions, and get the used oil analyzed (not too expensive) to compare to an analysis of the unused oil.

Everything else is as good as backtesting and wishful thinking :D

Edit: now that I think about it, portfolio selection and "which motor oil is best" are almost the same question! The only way to be sure of an oil is to run and analyze it in your car for 200,000 miles at which point you can be fairly certain it's good or bad - just in time to buy a new car, at which point you're back to uncertain because it's a different engine.

So in the end you just take into account everyone else's opinion, disregard the industry advertising, hope for the best - and go for the lowest expense ratio since that's all you control :beer
Hardly unscientific and as good as any comments on bobs site. Did you even watch it?
Did you even bother to read @Quercus Palustris' post you are commenting on. He wasn't referring to just some baseless comments on the forum. He was referring to actual results from a lab doing true scientific oil analysis.

I did watch several youtube Project Far channel oil comparison videos. I wouldn't call them unscientific. I would call it quasi-scientific with the results somewhat indicative of a limited number of data points. However, simply testing lubricity, evaporation and cold flow rates before and after the evaporation test hardly compares to scientific lab analysis of used oil.
squirm wrote:
Thu Jan 02, 2020 11:02 am
I like project farm and his style of testing. Very antibias, and understands testing methods. I'll take his recommendations over anyone elses.
I hope as his channel gets more popular he doesn't veer off course.
He maybe unbiased and his testing understandable, but overly simplistic in what he is testing. His testing is better than no testing, but not even close to a good analysis of the relative merits of various oil products. He does no duration testing at all.

The various labs that perform used oil testing do spectral analysis to report on ~20 metals, additives, silicon, etc..., viscosity, flashpoint, fuel dilution, water and antifreeze contamination and insoluables. The spectral analysis give a FAR better analysis of metal wear and other performance of the oil than some simple scar analysis on a bearing.
regardless, I still like his testing...good enough for me.

dsmclone
Posts: 393
Joined: Fri Oct 25, 2013 8:50 am

Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by dsmclone » Mon Jan 13, 2020 8:07 am

Probably 80+% of cordless tools problems probably have to do with the battery. Rigid is the only one I know of that has lifetime replacement on the battery. Therefore, I went with Rigid. After a year, I've already had one battery replaced.

marc515
Posts: 148
Joined: Sun Jan 27, 2008 9:12 am

Re: Quality Power-Tool Brands

Post by marc515 » Mon Jan 13, 2020 10:37 am

For around the home, I purchased a Ridgid Cordless Drill 7 years ago, and it's still going strong with a good amount of use. The batteries don't seem to last as long now, and I'm going to exchange them under the lifetime warranty.

From the Home Depot site: "Your power tool is covered if it breaks due to normal wear and tear, as long as it's been properly maintained and used correctly. Ridgid will replace your damaged tool or parts including brushes, chucks, motors, switches, gears and even cordless batteries."

To me, that is a great warranty!

m

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