Fidelity as a one stop shop

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boston10
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by boston10 » Thu Sep 05, 2019 5:13 am

ghost9804 wrote:
Wed Sep 04, 2019 9:34 pm
When I set the auto-replenish with minimum target balance, it seems that Fidelity ignores the MM fund and only count the core FDIC sweep into the minimum balance, resulting in over funding the CMA. Is this also the case for you?

Also, another question is that, if I tap below the minimum target balance multiple times in one day, would it result in multiple auto-replenish actions? if so, then it setup seems not quite useful for fraud protection.
I enabled the auto-replenish feature and noticed it moved $250 to my CMA overnight despite a $500 balance in SPRXX. I wasn't sure why that happened, but it would make sense if it's only looking at the FDIC balance.

My response was to turn off the cash manager feature entirely. I don't have a need for it and it's counterproductive to my fraud-avoidance goals.

The transactions that I need my CMA for are generally predictable bill pay paper check transactions, which I set up automatic transfers from my non-CMA brokerage to cover. For ATM needs, it's difficult to imagine a scenario that doesn't involve fraud where I'd need to withdraw over $500 in cash and wouldn't be able to do a manual, instant transfer via the app on my phone. And for any random ad-hoc checkwriting, I'd just transfer the amount of the check from brokerage to CMA immediately upon writing the check so I won't forget (this is probably a once-a-year situation for me).

student
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by student » Thu Sep 05, 2019 6:30 am

addicoe wrote:
Wed Jul 31, 2019 5:31 pm
I talked with a rep today and they told me that > 100k would qualify me for premium client status so I would get free ATM withdrawals from the investment/brokerage account. If that is the case I'm not sure of the point to the CMA. Is there a benefit to having both in this case?
Sorry if someone answered this question already. How about reimbursing the charge if you use ATM internationally? My understanding is the it does for CMA and not for a brokerage account.

boston10
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by boston10 » Thu Sep 05, 2019 6:35 am

student wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 6:30 am
addicoe wrote:
Wed Jul 31, 2019 5:31 pm
I talked with a rep today and they told me that > 100k would qualify me for premium client status so I would get free ATM withdrawals from the investment/brokerage account. If that is the case I'm not sure of the point to the CMA. Is there a benefit to having both in this case?
Sorry if someone answered this question already. How about reimbursing the charge if you use ATM internationally? My understanding is the it does for CMA and not for a brokerage account.
Fidelity makes no distinction between international and domestic ATM fees.

ATM fees for CMAs are always reimbursed, while for brokerage accounts they are only reimbursed if you're a part of a premium client group or have significant annual trading volume according to their definitions.

boston10
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by boston10 » Thu Sep 05, 2019 6:39 am

boston10 wrote:
Fri Aug 30, 2019 7:25 pm
Does anyone know how long it takes for them to lift your mobile check deposit limit? How much money and/or how much time? Any datapoints would be appreciated.
As of today my mobile deposit limit has been bumped from $10k to $50k. My accounts with Fido have been open for about a month, with a CMA, brokerage, and 529. I've mobile deposited one small check so far, but also have direct deposit set up. About $5k balance between all accounts at this point with significant bill pay volume.

arf30
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by arf30 » Thu Sep 05, 2019 7:16 am

I wouldn't read too much into the mobile deposit limits. I've been a customer for years with significiant balance and have seen the deposit limit fluctuate between 25k-100k at random. It's probably linked to how many overall deposits have happened that day.

student
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by student » Thu Sep 05, 2019 8:47 am

boston10 wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 6:35 am
student wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 6:30 am
addicoe wrote:
Wed Jul 31, 2019 5:31 pm
I talked with a rep today and they told me that > 100k would qualify me for premium client status so I would get free ATM withdrawals from the investment/brokerage account. If that is the case I'm not sure of the point to the CMA. Is there a benefit to having both in this case?
Sorry if someone answered this question already. How about reimbursing the charge if you use ATM internationally? My understanding is the it does for CMA and not for a brokerage account.
Fidelity makes no distinction between international and domestic ATM fees.

ATM fees for CMAs are always reimbursed, while for brokerage accounts they are only reimbursed if you're a part of a premium client group or have significant annual trading volume according to their definitions.
There are two types of ATM fee. Fidelity does not charge you to use a non-Fidelity ATM. However, the owners of non-Fidelity ATMs may charge you a fee for usage. My understanding is Fidelity will reimburse such fee for all domestic ATM withdrawals regardless of client status for both CMA accounts and brokerage accounts. Moreover, this fee will be reimbursed for international ATM but not the brokerage account, at least that's what the CS person told me when I inquired specifically about this, as I was evaluating whether to open a CMA account in addition to my existing brokerage account. Of course, this does not preclude them waiving the fee for premium client group members. (At the time of my inquiry, they did not mention this possibility to me.)

Do you have a link to info for premium client group? I would like to see what can I do to qualify and what goodies does it come with. I have heard about it but I could not find any info.

boston10
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by boston10 » Thu Sep 05, 2019 10:10 am

student wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 8:47 am
Do you have a link to info for premium client group? I would like to see what can I do to qualify and what goodies does it come with. I have heard about it but I could not find any info.
https://www.fidelity.com/cash-management/atm-debit-card

^ Click the "ATM Reimbursement Levels" link on that page. Their description is:
Fidelity Account Premium, Private Client Group, Wealth Management, or with household trading activity of 120 or more stock, bond, or options trades

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bostondan
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by bostondan » Thu Sep 05, 2019 10:18 am

Is there any good reason to use the CMA account linked to a brokerage account if I qualify for the free brokerage ATM fees? It seems like it would be much simpler to just do everything through the brokerage account.

I know there is a difference in FDIC insurance, but that doesn’t seem as important to me.
“There may be times when we are powerless to prevent injustice, but there must never be a time when we fail to protest.” - Elie Wiesel

student
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by student » Thu Sep 05, 2019 11:50 am

boston10 wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 10:10 am
student wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 8:47 am
Do you have a link to info for premium client group? I would like to see what can I do to qualify and what goodies does it come with. I have heard about it but I could not find any info.
https://www.fidelity.com/cash-management/atm-debit-card

^ Click the "ATM Reimbursement Levels" link on that page. Their description is:
Fidelity Account Premium, Private Client Group, Wealth Management, or with household trading activity of 120 or more stock, bond, or options trades
Thanks. I have seen this before but I guess I forgot about it. (I guess they have either changed the setup or the CS rep that I talked to misinformed me.) Do you have a link to the criteria to be a premium client. I have found links to Private Client Group, Wealth Management but not premium client.

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Artsdoctor
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by Artsdoctor » Thu Sep 05, 2019 1:54 pm

bostondan wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 10:18 am
Is there any good reason to use the CMA account linked to a brokerage account if I qualify for the free brokerage ATM fees? It seems like it would be much simpler to just do everything through the brokerage account.

I know there is a difference in FDIC insurance, but that doesn’t seem as important to me.
This was discussed further upstream. There are perils associated with a 21-page thread!

You're correct. If you qualify for free brokerage ATM fees, you don't need a CMA. I use our brokerage account for bill pay, mobile deposits, electronic deposits and withdrawals, and ATM withdrawals. It's a very smooth process.

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indexfundfan
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by indexfundfan » Thu Sep 05, 2019 6:37 pm

student wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 11:50 am
boston10 wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 10:10 am
student wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 8:47 am
Do you have a link to info for premium client group? I would like to see what can I do to qualify and what goodies does it come with. I have heard about it but I could not find any info.
https://www.fidelity.com/cash-management/atm-debit-card

^ Click the "ATM Reimbursement Levels" link on that page. Their description is:
Fidelity Account Premium, Private Client Group, Wealth Management, or with household trading activity of 120 or more stock, bond, or options trades
Thanks. I have seen this before but I guess I forgot about it. (I guess they have either changed the setup or the CS rep that I talked to misinformed me.) Do you have a link to the criteria to be a premium client. I have found links to Private Client Group, Wealth Management but not premium client.
If you google for it, there is a document that says Fidelity Premium requires $250k in assets.
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student
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by student » Thu Sep 05, 2019 7:11 pm

indexfundfan wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 6:37 pm
student wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 11:50 am
boston10 wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 10:10 am
student wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 8:47 am
Do you have a link to info for premium client group? I would like to see what can I do to qualify and what goodies does it come with. I have heard about it but I could not find any info.
https://www.fidelity.com/cash-management/atm-debit-card

^ Click the "ATM Reimbursement Levels" link on that page. Their description is:
Fidelity Account Premium, Private Client Group, Wealth Management, or with household trading activity of 120 or more stock, bond, or options trades
Thanks. I have seen this before but I guess I forgot about it. (I guess they have either changed the setup or the CS rep that I talked to misinformed me.) Do you have a link to the criteria to be a premium client. I have found links to Private Client Group, Wealth Management but not premium client.
If you google for it, there is a document that says Fidelity Premium requires $250k in assets.
You mean https://workplacecontent.fidelity.com/b ... rvices.pdf This seems to be under workplacecontent.fidelity.com At one point, I have seen something close to it. Is this still active? If it is, it seems that it is not prominently displayed. Maybe I should give them a call.

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bostondan
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by bostondan » Tue Sep 10, 2019 6:10 pm

One unexpected perk of the Fidelity account has been the fact that there are two account numbers for the same account. There is the one provided through the website, and another on the checks, though both work just fine.

This feature allows for my wife and I to both add the same account to our Venmo accounts. Venmo only allows a checking account to be added to one account. When my wife receives Venmo transfers she typically had to transfer it to me on Venmo and I would then deposit it to our checking account at BofA. By having two account numbers for the same Fidelity account, Venmo allowed us to add the Fidelity account to both of our Venmo accounts.

Also, I think it’s crazy that Venmo doesn’t allow both owners of a joint checking account to add it. I am sure it is for security reasons to avoid fraud, but was very inconvenient.
“There may be times when we are powerless to prevent injustice, but there must never be a time when we fail to protest.” - Elie Wiesel

DCode
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by DCode » Wed Sep 11, 2019 6:54 pm

Hello everyone. I've got a couple questions regarding (possibly) consolidating at Fidelity.

1. I have a Roth IRA at Vanguard, all in VTSAX (Vanguard Total Stock Market Index Admiral). Can I transfer it in-kind to Fidelity, keeping VTSAX with no penalty? Or does/should it be exchanged for a Fidelity sold fund? And I assume any future contributions do need to be in a Fidelity sold fund?

2. I have two 529 plans offered by my state. They are well funded and we have not contributed to them for years, and no intention to contribute further. As far as I can tell, the state benefit was tax deduction for contributions for the year. Since we are no longer contributing, I don't see the benefit of leaving them there if we were to consolidate under Fidelity. Similar to the question above, can I transfer those in-kind to Fidelity and just leave them alone until we are ready to start withdrawing from them?

I'd run this all by a Fidelity rep also when/if the time comes, but I'm sure this has already been done by some folks here and would love to get some feedback/opinions on it.

Thanks!

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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by BUBear29 » Wed Sep 11, 2019 9:51 pm

DCode wrote:
Wed Sep 11, 2019 6:54 pm
Hello everyone. I've got a couple questions regarding (possibly) consolidating at Fidelity.

1. I have a Roth IRA at Vanguard, all in VTSAX (Vanguard Total Stock Market Index Admiral). Can I transfer it in-kind to Fidelity, keeping VTSAX with no penalty? Or does/should it be exchanged for a Fidelity sold fund? And I assume any future contributions do need to be in a Fidelity sold fund?

2. I have two 529 plans offered by my state. They are well funded and we have not contributed to them for years, and no intention to contribute further. As far as I can tell, the state benefit was tax deduction for contributions for the year. Since we are no longer contributing, I don't see the benefit of leaving them there if we were to consolidate under Fidelity. Similar to the question above, can I transfer those in-kind to Fidelity and just leave them alone until we are ready to start withdrawing from them?

I'd run this all by a Fidelity rep also when/if the time comes, but I'm sure this has already been done by some folks here and would love to get some feedback/opinions on it.

Thanks!
I just transferred everything from Vanguard to consolidate at Fidelity.

1) Yes you can transfer VTSAX in kind. I did this then exchanged for FSKAX in my Roth. Not sure if you have taxable funds but that would be a different approach.

2) Yes you can transfer in kind to Fidelity. It will likely be the Unique plan. My transfer is still in progress. 529 transfers can take up to a month as they are done by mail.

Good luck!
There is no dignity quite so impressive, and no one independence quite so important, as living within your means.

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indexfundfan
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by indexfundfan » Thu Sep 12, 2019 7:11 am

BUBear29 wrote:
Wed Sep 11, 2019 9:51 pm
I just transferred everything from Vanguard to consolidate at Fidelity.

1) Yes you can transfer VTSAX in kind. I did this then exchanged for FSKAX in my Roth. Not sure if you have taxable funds but that would be a different approach.

2) Yes you can transfer in kind to Fidelity. It will likely be the Unique plan. My transfer is still in progress. 529 transfers can take up to a month as they are done by mail.

Good luck!
When you exchange VTSAX to FSKAX, is this a two-day trade, i.e. VTSAX is sold on day T, then FSKAX is purchased on day T+1?

Was the original 529 plan also managed by Fidelity? I have not heard of being able to "transfer in kind" for 529 plans. Usually, a change of custodian entails selling the funds, transferring the cash, and then purchasing replacement funds. You will out of the market from the time the assets are sold to the time they are re-purchased.
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LongRoad
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by LongRoad » Thu Sep 12, 2019 7:37 am

DCode wrote:
Wed Sep 11, 2019 6:54 pm
Hello everyone. I've got a couple questions regarding (possibly) consolidating at Fidelity.

1. I have a Roth IRA at Vanguard, all in VTSAX (Vanguard Total Stock Market Index Admiral). Can I transfer it in-kind to Fidelity, keeping VTSAX with no penalty? Or does/should it be exchanged for a Fidelity sold fund? And I assume any future contributions do need to be in a Fidelity sold fund?

2. I have two 529 plans offered by my state. They are well funded and we have not contributed to them for years, and no intention to contribute further. As far as I can tell, the state benefit was tax deduction for contributions for the year. Since we are no longer contributing, I don't see the benefit of leaving them there if we were to consolidate under Fidelity. Similar to the question above, can I transfer those in-kind to Fidelity and just leave them alone until we are ready to start withdrawing from them?

I'd run this all by a Fidelity rep also when/if the time comes, but I'm sure this has already been done by some folks here and would love to get some feedback/opinions on it.

Thanks!
Just a couple of thoughts.

If you'd like to transfer VTSAX to Fidelity, you might consider the free conversion of VTSAX shares to VTI (equivalent ETF) at Vanguard before transferring. At Fidelity, it is less expensive in the future to buy or sell VTI vs. VTSAX.

If your state affiliated 529 offers a state income tax deduction, at least a few states will recapture the deduction when transferring the funds out of the plan, even to another 529. Check your state plan's documents, or there is a summary at https://www.savingforcollege.com/compar ... _questions

Direwolf14
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by Direwolf14 » Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:28 am

BUBear29 wrote:
Wed Sep 11, 2019 9:51 pm
I just transferred everything from Vanguard to consolidate at Fidelity.

1) Yes you can transfer VTSAX in kind. I did this then exchanged for FSKAX in my Roth. Not sure if you have taxable funds but that would be a different approach.

2) Yes you can transfer in kind to Fidelity. It will likely be the Unique plan. My transfer is still in progress. 529 transfers can take up to a month as they are done by mail.

Good luck!
Just curious if you were able to get a cash bonus with this transfer or Fidelity only offered free trades? Thanks.

BUBear29
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by BUBear29 » Thu Sep 12, 2019 11:14 am

indexfundfan wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 7:11 am
BUBear29 wrote:
Wed Sep 11, 2019 9:51 pm
I just transferred everything from Vanguard to consolidate at Fidelity.

1) Yes you can transfer VTSAX in kind. I did this then exchanged for FSKAX in my Roth. Not sure if you have taxable funds but that would be a different approach.

2) Yes you can transfer in kind to Fidelity. It will likely be the Unique plan. My transfer is still in progress. 529 transfers can take up to a month as they are done by mail.

Good luck!
When you exchange VTSAX to FSKAX, is this a two-day trade, i.e. VTSAX is sold on day T, then FSKAX is purchased on day T+1?

Was the original 529 plan also managed by Fidelity? I have not heard of being able to "transfer in kind" for 529 plans. Usually, a change of custodian entails selling the funds, transferring the cash, and then purchasing replacement funds. You will out of the market from the time the assets are sold to the time they are re-purchased.
woah sorry yes I was half asleep when responding. they cash out the 529 then transfer to new custodian
There is no dignity quite so impressive, and no one independence quite so important, as living within your means.

BUBear29
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by BUBear29 » Thu Sep 12, 2019 11:15 am

Direwolf14 wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:28 am
BUBear29 wrote:
Wed Sep 11, 2019 9:51 pm
I just transferred everything from Vanguard to consolidate at Fidelity.

1) Yes you can transfer VTSAX in kind. I did this then exchanged for FSKAX in my Roth. Not sure if you have taxable funds but that would be a different approach.

2) Yes you can transfer in kind to Fidelity. It will likely be the Unique plan. My transfer is still in progress. 529 transfers can take up to a month as they are done by mail.

Good luck!
Just curious if you were able to get a cash bonus with this transfer or Fidelity only offered free trades? Thanks.
i moved in excess of $200k in roths and taxable and received 500 free trades.

per the question on sale/buy, i can’t recall but believe it was a two day process
There is no dignity quite so impressive, and no one independence quite so important, as living within your means.

ndpage
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by ndpage » Tue Sep 17, 2019 3:42 pm

So after taking care of a mid-life transition, and getting ready for a possible job change/underemployment, I started the process of converting my diverse set of financial instituions to be almost completely Fidelity. My 401k has been there for 20+ years, I'm getting close to 59.5, the rates, processes, and user interface seem good, and it's time to simplify.

I set up both the CMA (for everyday bills/ATM) and brokerage (for my short-term and intermediate emergency funds), started a $2500 ACH from one of my other banks to get it going, and renamed the accounts from the annyoying INDIVIDUAL and INDIVIDUAL (seriously?) to CMA and Brokerage. The billpay is in process, and it looks like i have to wait a day or two for the ATM and checkwriting, which is fine.

The next two things I want to do are
a) Set up the overdraft MMA (so what used to be my BOFA checking account balance), and
b) Set up my paycheck direct deposit.

Questions where i'm confused by some of the earlier conversation:
1) The default cash account in the brokerage is SPAXX, is that what gets auto-depleted to fill FCASH in the CMA? Or do I have to create another SPAXX in the CMA?
2) Can I get the direct deposit to be automatically deposited into SPAXX, or does it have to go in FCASH and I have to remember to move it over?

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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by FrugalProfessor » Tue Sep 17, 2019 3:54 pm

ndpage wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 3:42 pm
So after taking care of a mid-life transition, and getting ready for a possible job change/underemployment, I started the process of converting my diverse set of financial instituions to be almost completely Fidelity. My 401k has been there for 20+ years, I'm getting close to 59.5, the rates, processes, and user interface seem good, and it's time to simplify.

I set up both the CMA (for everyday bills/ATM) and brokerage (for my short-term and intermediate emergency funds), started a $2500 ACH from one of my other banks to get it going, and renamed the accounts from the annyoying INDIVIDUAL and INDIVIDUAL (seriously?) to CMA and Brokerage. The billpay is in process, and it looks like i have to wait a day or two for the ATM and checkwriting, which is fine.

The next two things I want to do are
a) Set up the overdraft MMA (so what used to be my BOFA checking account balance), and
b) Set up my paycheck direct deposit.

Questions where i'm confused by some of the earlier conversation:
1) The default cash account in the brokerage is SPAXX, is that what gets auto-depleted to fill FCASH in the CMA? Or do I have to create another SPAXX in the CMA?
2) Can I get the direct deposit to be automatically deposited into SPAXX, or does it have to go in FCASH and I have to remember to move it over?
I tried to synthesize the entire thread into a single blog post here: https://www.frugalprofessor.com/cash-management/.

The overdraft setup is covered in the blog.

I use the brokerage as my true checking account and the CMA as the ATM checking account. Consequently, direct deposits go to the brokerage and are automatically allocated to SPAXX, my default core position.

Since writing the initial post a few months ago, I've transitioned everything but ATM from CMA to brokerage. My apologies for not updating the post accordingly (at the time, I'd pay my mortgage, credit cards, etc from CMA but eventually found the unnecessary OD transfers to be unruly to monitor in Personal Capital).
I blog. Taxes are the lowest hanging source of alpha. I eat tax alpha for breakfast.

ScaledWheel
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by ScaledWheel » Tue Sep 17, 2019 4:18 pm

FrugalProfessor wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 3:54 pm
I tried to synthesize the entire thread into a single blog post here: https://www.frugalprofessor.com/cash-management/.

The overdraft setup is covered in the blog.

I use the brokerage as my true checking account and the CMA as the ATM checking account. Consequently, direct deposits go to the brokerage and are automatically allocated to SPAXX, my default core position.

Since writing the initial post a few months ago, I've transitioned everything but ATM from CMA to brokerage. My apologies for not updating the post accordingly (at the time, I'd pay my mortgage, credit cards, etc from CMA but eventually found the unnecessary OD transfers to be unruly to monitor in Personal Capital).
Thanks for this. Wife and I are finally combining finances and looking to simplify with Fidelity. I'll definitely refer to your post as I look to set up the accounts.

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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by mighty72 » Tue Sep 17, 2019 4:29 pm

The wiki also summaries this post. All are encouraged to add to the wiki if there is more relevant info. You can PM me if you are not a wiki contributor and I can add the info there.
https://bogleheads.org/wiki/Fidelity:_one_stop_shop

ndpage
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by ndpage » Tue Sep 17, 2019 8:54 pm

FrugalProfessor wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 3:54 pm
I tried to synthesize the entire thread into a single blog post here: https://www.frugalprofessor.com/cash-management/.

The overdraft setup is covered in the blog.

I use the brokerage as my true checking account and the CMA as the ATM checking account. Consequently, direct deposits go to the brokerage and are automatically allocated to SPAXX, my default core position.

Since writing the initial post a few months ago, I've transitioned everything but ATM from CMA to brokerage. My apologies for not updating the post accordingly (at the time, I'd pay my mortgage, credit cards, etc from CMA but eventually found the unnecessary OD transfers to be unruly to monitor in Personal Capital).
Ok, this makes more sense now: ATM card for the perpetually $0 balance CMA, and the checkwriting, direct deposit, and billpay connected to the brokerage SPAXX.

I probably should have done all this before starting a YNAB account. :) [I can always zero out the current budget and start over again once I close the various checking accounts and cut the savings accounts to the bare minimums while I wait for some CDs to mature.]

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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by bostondan » Tue Sep 17, 2019 9:08 pm

ndpage wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 8:54 pm
Ok, this makes more sense now: ATM card for the perpetually $0 balance CMA, and the checkwriting, direct deposit, and billpay connected to the brokerage SPAXX.
Check if you have enough assets to qualify for free ATMs in the brokerage account. If you do qualify, then you have no need for a CMA account and can simplify to just using a brokerage account for everything.

I initially started going down the CMA/brokerage path, but then realized that as a private wealth level client I got everything free just using the brokerage account, so am using that as my only account now and it is working very well.
“There may be times when we are powerless to prevent injustice, but there must never be a time when we fail to protest.” - Elie Wiesel

ndpage
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by ndpage » Tue Sep 17, 2019 9:34 pm

bostondan wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 9:08 pm
ndpage wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 8:54 pm
Ok, this makes more sense now: ATM card for the perpetually $0 balance CMA, and the checkwriting, direct deposit, and billpay connected to the brokerage SPAXX.
Check if you have enough assets to qualify for free ATMs in the brokerage account. If you do qualify, then you have no need for a CMA account and can simplify to just using a brokerage account for everything.

I initially started going down the CMA/brokerage path, but then realized that as a private wealth level client I got everything free just using the brokerage account, so am using that as my only account now and it is working very well.
Sadly, I am nowhere near a private wealth level client. :( That's ok, I use about $75 in cash in a typical month, so one ATM transaction monthly to refill my wallet to $120 in cash
..

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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by indexfundfan » Tue Sep 17, 2019 9:39 pm

bostondan wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 9:08 pm
Check if you have enough assets to qualify for free ATMs in the brokerage account. If you do qualify, then you have no need for a CMA account and can simplify to just using a brokerage account for everything.

I initially started going down the CMA/brokerage path, but then realized that as a private wealth level client I got everything free just using the brokerage account, so am using that as my only account now and it is working very well.
How much is the private wealth level client? Any other benefits besides the free ATM?
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by bostondan » Tue Sep 17, 2019 9:59 pm

indexfundfan wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 9:39 pm
bostondan wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 9:08 pm
Check if you have enough assets to qualify for free ATMs in the brokerage account. If you do qualify, then you have no need for a CMA account and can simplify to just using a brokerage account for everything.

I initially started going down the CMA/brokerage path, but then realized that as a private wealth level client I got everything free just using the brokerage account, so am using that as my only account now and it is working very well.
How much is the private wealth level client? Any other benefits besides the free ATM?
I don't know. We have about $6m at Fidelity. I think someone said it might be $250k to get the free ATMs?

Our total expense ratio for all investments at Fidelity is about 0.03%, so they're not making all that much money from us. I guess they just see me as a potential source of income for them if I ever stop being a DIY investor, or when I die and my heirs want to just let Fidelity manage the money (though I have advised my wife to let Vanguard manage it).

The primary benefit I have seen is that when I call through the Fidelity app (it logs in before placing the call) I have never had to wait more than 10 seconds to reach a human. That person is always extremely helpful and knowledgable. I once waited about 10 seconds and the person apologized profusely to me for making me wait so long. I think I must have a small group of people who take my calls, even when calling the main number, because I frequently get the same people even though I don't call that often. They also pre-fill my forms for me and will go to great lengths to fix whatever issue arises. They always offer to expedite anything I need. For example, I needed new checks and they had them out to me within 48 hours at no charge. I once found some a ton of old stock certificates from the 1960s in a drawer at our old house (after my father passed) and Fidelity did extensive research for free to determine if any of them had value and then deposited the shares in our account.

I think they basically treat me like they're making a ton of money off me because they should be if I have $6m there, but in reality they make almost nothing from me. It's possible they treat everybody this way, even if you have only $10 at Fidelity. I have no way to compare.
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by FrugalProfessor » Tue Sep 17, 2019 10:51 pm

bostondan wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 9:08 pm
ndpage wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 8:54 pm
Ok, this makes more sense now: ATM card for the perpetually $0 balance CMA, and the checkwriting, direct deposit, and billpay connected to the brokerage SPAXX.
Check if you have enough assets to qualify for free ATMs in the brokerage account. If you do qualify, then you have no need for a CMA account and can simplify to just using a brokerage account for everything.

I initially started going down the CMA/brokerage path, but then realized that as a private wealth level client I got everything free just using the brokerage account, so am using that as my only account now and it is working very well.
I was lucky enough to have the revered Finance Buff grace my blog and leave this same suggestion in a comment (https://www.frugalprofessor.com/cash-ma ... mment-2362). Unfortunately we don't have the $6M that bostondan has yet but are converging on $1M in the not-too-distant future at Fidelity. Despite that, the vast majority is tied up in employer sponsored accounts which don't count towards the $250k threshold.

So Alas, we've begun the CMA/brokerage path. It seems like a pain in the rear on paper, but in reality I seamlessly use the brokerage for 99.999% of my transactions and the CMA for the 0.001% of the time that I need cash. Given how rarely we use cash, we could almost be just as well served with the brokerage-only approach, but we like having the option of the free ATM for that once-in-a-blue-moon scenario. As documented in the blog post, the CMA overdraft setup is a one-time fixed cost of 5 minutes that you'll never have to mess with again.
Last edited by FrugalProfessor on Thu Sep 19, 2019 9:24 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by ChrisBenn » Wed Sep 18, 2019 9:28 am

Is there potential for an unintended Roth IRA interaction here? I'm under the impression that you can't make Roth contributions directly from a taxable brokerage- but instead have to withdraw it (From the taxable brokerage account) to a banking institution then fund the Roth through that (though in trying to google for this the question gets blurred by people trying to move equities or the like directly over).

Granted this doesn't mean you couldn't benefit from this; just that you might need to keep a standard bank account around with the minimum deposits/balances to negate fees. If I'm misunderstanding the regs though that makes this much simpler. If I'm not misunderstanding it, then I wonder if the FDIC CMA sweep would qualify as a Roth funding source?

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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by zeal » Wed Sep 18, 2019 9:53 am

ChrisBenn wrote:
Wed Sep 18, 2019 9:28 am
Is there potential for an unintended Roth IRA interaction here? I'm under the impression that you can't make Roth contributions directly from a taxable brokerage- but instead have to withdraw it (From the taxable brokerage account) to a banking institution then fund the Roth through that (though in trying to google for this the question gets blurred by people trying to move equities or the like directly over).

Granted this doesn't mean you couldn't benefit from this; just that you might need to keep a standard bank account around with the minimum deposits/balances to negate fees. If I'm misunderstanding the regs though that makes this much simpler. If I'm not misunderstanding it, then I wonder if the FDIC CMA sweep would qualify as a Roth funding source?
Good question, Chris. I wasn't sure so I checked. I can confirm I made a contribution to my Fidelity Roth IRA from my Fidelity Brokerage account earlier this year. However, I do still keep an account open at my local credit union, since the nearest Fidelity branch is several hours away. This way I can still deposit cash when necessary and have access to any other things only available at a brick & mortar bank.

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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by FrugalProfessor » Wed Sep 18, 2019 3:57 pm

ChrisBenn wrote:
Wed Sep 18, 2019 9:28 am
Is there potential for an unintended Roth IRA interaction here? I'm under the impression that you can't make Roth contributions directly from a taxable brokerage- but instead have to withdraw it (From the taxable brokerage account) to a banking institution then fund the Roth through that (though in trying to google for this the question gets blurred by people trying to move equities or the like directly over).

Granted this doesn't mean you couldn't benefit from this; just that you might need to keep a standard bank account around with the minimum deposits/balances to negate fees. If I'm misunderstanding the regs though that makes this much simpler. If I'm not misunderstanding it, then I wonder if the FDIC CMA sweep would qualify as a Roth funding source?
When I fund my Traditional Fidelity IRA (as part of the backdoor Roth), I can choose either the CMA or the brokerage account as the funding source. My wife and I have a joint brokerage account so we can fund either of our IRAs with it.
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by mervinj7 » Wed Sep 18, 2019 4:18 pm

FrugalProfessor wrote:
Wed Sep 18, 2019 3:57 pm
ChrisBenn wrote:
Wed Sep 18, 2019 9:28 am
Is there potential for an unintended Roth IRA interaction here? I'm under the impression that you can't make Roth contributions directly from a taxable brokerage- but instead have to withdraw it (From the taxable brokerage account) to a banking institution then fund the Roth through that (though in trying to google for this the question gets blurred by people trying to move equities or the like directly over).

Granted this doesn't mean you couldn't benefit from this; just that you might need to keep a standard bank account around with the minimum deposits/balances to negate fees. If I'm misunderstanding the regs though that makes this much simpler. If I'm not misunderstanding it, then I wonder if the FDIC CMA sweep would qualify as a Roth funding source?
When I fund my Traditional Fidelity IRA (as part of the backdoor Roth), I can choose either the CMA or the brokerage account as the funding source. My wife and I have a joint brokerage account so we can fund either of our IRAs with it.
Same here. Single joint CMA can fund two individual Traditional IRAs which are then converted to Roth IRAs. No restrictions on source in my experience but it's not exactly ChrisBenn's situation of contributing directly to a Roth IRA from a brokerage account. However, I don't see what it should be different.

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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by mptfan » Wed Sep 18, 2019 4:38 pm

bostondan wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 9:59 pm
The primary benefit I have seen is that when I call through the Fidelity app (it logs in before placing the call) I have never had to wait more than 10 seconds to reach a human. That person is always extremely helpful and knowledgable. I once waited about 10 seconds and the person apologized profusely to me for making me wait so long.
Thank you for this, I was not aware that you could call through the Fidelity app, that is good to know.

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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by ChrisBenn » Wed Sep 18, 2019 6:02 pm

Thanks all for the info and confirmations on IRA funding viability!

I didn't originally expect there to be an issue, but some other articles around the internet brought that assumption into question. Good to hear it's a non issue.

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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by lstone19 » Wed Sep 18, 2019 7:07 pm

Perhaps ChrisBenn (or whatever source he is reading) is confusing the restriction on only contributing cash (no in-kind contributions) to mean no contributing from a brokerage account. But when you contribute from a brokerage account and assuming the money being contributed was in the core money market fund, Fidelity does not transfer shares of the money market fund, they sell them, contribute the cash, and then buy whatever money market fund is used as the core in the IRA (even if it's the same fund).

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Re: Fidelity as a one-stop shop

Post by obafgkm » Wed Sep 18, 2019 7:56 pm

Wow.

This morning, before 6:00 am EDT, I initiated a transfer of just under $1000 from my Cash Management Account to my brick-and-mortar credit union account. About 8:00 am, I received an email from Fidelity saying the "EFT processed successfully."

This evening at 8:50 p.m., I checked, and the money was in my credit union account. :shock: I don't know when it arrived.

That is FAST. I've never seen money go from one institution to another the SAME DAY.

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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by Minty » Thu Sep 19, 2019 9:01 am

Long-time Fidelity customer (as well as Vanguard) and just consolidated paycheck direct deposit, billpay, checking, etc. at Fidelity so I could make some interest. I've never actually used the ATM/Debit card, only electronic transactions. Today someone withdrew about $500 from an ATM 300 miles away. I hope this isn't how it is going to go.
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by bostondan » Thu Sep 19, 2019 11:02 am

Minty wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 9:01 am
Long-time Fidelity customer (as well as Vanguard) and just consolidated paycheck direct deposit, billpay, checking, etc. at Fidelity so I could make some interest. I've never actually used the ATM/Debit card, only electronic transactions. Today someone withdrew about $500 from an ATM 300 miles away. I hope this isn't how it is going to go.
What did Fidelity have to say about it?

Seems unlikely that Fidelity is less secure than any other major bank. Does anybody have access to your card? Is it still in your possession? Do you keep it in your wallet? Was it definitely a physical ATM and not an EFT transaction?
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by Kevin M » Thu Sep 19, 2019 2:49 pm

Minty wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 9:01 am
Long-time Fidelity customer (as well as Vanguard) and just consolidated paycheck direct deposit, billpay, checking, etc. at Fidelity so I could make some interest. I've never actually used the ATM/Debit card, only electronic transactions. Today someone withdrew about $500 from an ATM 300 miles away. I hope this isn't how it is going to go.
Not that I think that this is common, but it's an example of why I have a CMA for ATM withdrawals only, with no overdraft from any other account set up. I think I have less than $20 in that account now, and have never even done an ATM withdrawal from it yet. Everything else is done with a brokerage account dedicated to cash management (separate from my main investing brokerage account), and this has been working flawlessly. I am private client, so could do free ATM withdrawals from the brokerage, but I didn't even request an ATM/debit card for this brokerage account, since I don't want it exposed to fraudulent ATM or debit transactions.

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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by bostondan » Thu Sep 19, 2019 3:07 pm

Kevin M wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 2:49 pm
Minty wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 9:01 am
Long-time Fidelity customer (as well as Vanguard) and just consolidated paycheck direct deposit, billpay, checking, etc. at Fidelity so I could make some interest. I've never actually used the ATM/Debit card, only electronic transactions. Today someone withdrew about $500 from an ATM 300 miles away. I hope this isn't how it is going to go.
Not that I think that this is common, but it's an example of why I have a CMA for ATM withdrawals only, with no overdraft from any other account set up. I think I have less than $20 in that account now, and have never even done an ATM withdrawal from it yet. Everything else is done with a brokerage account dedicated to cash management (separate from my main investing brokerage account), and this has been working flawlessly. I am private client, so could do free ATM withdrawals from the brokerage, but I didn't even request an ATM/debit card for this brokerage account, since I don't want it exposed to fraudulent ATM or debit transactions.

Kevin
Got it. I created a new brokerage account, so it is the same as just using a separate CMA. This brokerage account is only used for being a “checking” account.
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by Kevin M » Thu Sep 19, 2019 4:26 pm

bostondan wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 3:07 pm
Kevin M wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 2:49 pm
Minty wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 9:01 am
Long-time Fidelity customer (as well as Vanguard) and just consolidated paycheck direct deposit, billpay, checking, etc. at Fidelity so I could make some interest. I've never actually used the ATM/Debit card, only electronic transactions. Today someone withdrew about $500 from an ATM 300 miles away. I hope this isn't how it is going to go.
Not that I think that this is common, but it's an example of why I have a CMA for ATM withdrawals only, with no overdraft from any other account set up. I think I have less than $20 in that account now, and have never even done an ATM withdrawal from it yet. Everything else is done with a brokerage account dedicated to cash management (separate from my main investing brokerage account), and this has been working flawlessly. I am private client, so could do free ATM withdrawals from the brokerage, but I didn't even request an ATM/debit card for this brokerage account, since I don't want it exposed to fraudulent ATM or debit transactions.

Kevin
Got it. I created a new brokerage account, so it is the same as just using a separate CMA. This brokerage account is only used for being a “checking” account.
Exactly. A Fidelity rep explained this to me some time ago--I think before this thread started, but this thread has helped elucidate it.

As a tangent, at that time, all I wanted to do was have a Fidelity account that was easy to add external banks to, which is not the case for my main brokerage trust account. So I opened a POD CMA (POD = payable on death with named beneficiaries, accomplishes same probate avoidance objective as the trust), for some reason thinking that it would better suit my needs for this specific purpose, but when I called to ask some questions about it, the Fidelity rep explained to me that I could do everything I wanted with a POD brokerage account, so that's what I'm using now for "CM".

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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by FrugalProfessor » Thu Sep 19, 2019 4:48 pm

Kevin M wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 2:49 pm
Minty wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 9:01 am
Long-time Fidelity customer (as well as Vanguard) and just consolidated paycheck direct deposit, billpay, checking, etc. at Fidelity so I could make some interest. I've never actually used the ATM/Debit card, only electronic transactions. Today someone withdrew about $500 from an ATM 300 miles away. I hope this isn't how it is going to go.
Not that I think that this is common, but it's an example of why I have a CMA for ATM withdrawals only, with no overdraft from any other account set up. I think I have less than $20 in that account now, and have never even done an ATM withdrawal from it yet. Everything else is done with a brokerage account dedicated to cash management (separate from my main investing brokerage account), and this has been working flawlessly. I am private client, so could do free ATM withdrawals from the brokerage, but I didn't even request an ATM/debit card for this brokerage account, since I don't want it exposed to fraudulent ATM or debit transactions.

Kevin
I like your system (ATM-only CMA with no overdraft protection from brokerage). It's safer than my system (ATM-only CMA w/ OD protection) because it places a ceiling on the maximum loss from fraud (no greater than the balance of the CMA account) but is more inconvenient because it forces me to plan ahead when using the ATM.

I use an ATM very sparingly (I seldom carry my card with me), so perhaps I'll park $20-$100 of SPRXX in the CMA in perpetuity on the off chance that I need to visit an ATM. If I need more cash, I'd know to simply execute the brokerage->CMA transfer before visiting the ATM.

Given that the brokerage account is my main checking account, perhaps I'll even set up my overdraft in opposite direction to how I have it set up currently. After changing directions, CMA funds would now cover shortfalls in the brokerage account in the event of a brokerage shortfall.

I like it.

Edit - On second thought it looks like I can't set up the overdraft protection in the other direction (CMA funds brokerage). Oh well. I'll turn of OD protection and simply park a few dollars in the CMA in the event of the rare ATM withdrawal.
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by indexfundfan » Thu Sep 19, 2019 6:46 pm

Kevin M wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 4:26 pm
As a tangent, at that time, all I wanted to do was have a Fidelity account that was easy to add external banks to, which is not the case for my main brokerage trust account. So I opened a POD CMA (POD = payable on death with named beneficiaries, accomplishes same probate avoidance objective as the trust), for some reason thinking that it would better suit my needs for this specific purpose, but when I called to ask some questions about it, the Fidelity rep explained to me that I could do everything I wanted with a POD brokerage account, so that's what I'm using now for "CM".
I recently opened a trust account at Fido, and I just realized it is so much harder to link a bank account to it. There is no online ACH link setup (e.g. micro-deposits). I had to print out a PDF form and fill it in. I then scanned and submitted it by secure email. Fido replied and told me -- no sir, scanning does not work, you need to mail the hardcopy in or bring it to the investor center. :oops:

At this point, I'm not sure if I want to even move part of my trust assets to them. No promo bonus. Difficulty in adding new banks. I should probably just restrict myself to using their regular brokerage for checking.
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by Horsefly » Thu Sep 19, 2019 9:39 pm

indexfundfan wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 6:46 pm
I recently opened a trust account at Fido, and I just realized it is so much harder to link a bank account to it. There is no online ACH link setup (e.g. micro-deposits). I had to print out a PDF form and fill it in. I then scanned and submitted it by secure email. Fido replied and told me -- no sir, scanning does not work, you need to mail the hardcopy in or bring it to the investor center. :oops:

At this point, I'm not sure if I want to even move part of my trust assets to them. No promo bonus. Difficulty in adding new banks. I should probably just restrict myself to using their regular brokerage for checking.
Funny thing: In 2013, we set up our trust, and moved most of our non-IRA assets into it (including the bank and Fidelity). At that point I already had ACH / wire transfer set up from our Fidelity brokerage to our bank account. When we changed the registration of the Fidelity account to the trust, it all just stayed in place.

When we changed banks to get away from the thieves at Wells Fargo, we set up a new trust account at Ally. I re-set up everything to do transfers both ways between Ally and Fidelity, and everything worked great with no paper forms. The Fidelity brokerage is our spending money, so I move money to the bank maybe twice per month. Easy peasy.

Anyway, I never experienced the pain you went through. It's been quite nice.

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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by indexfundfan » Thu Sep 19, 2019 10:12 pm

Horsefly wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 9:39 pm
indexfundfan wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 6:46 pm
I recently opened a trust account at Fido, and I just realized it is so much harder to link a bank account to it. There is no online ACH link setup (e.g. micro-deposits). I had to print out a PDF form and fill it in. I then scanned and submitted it by secure email. Fido replied and told me -- no sir, scanning does not work, you need to mail the hardcopy in or bring it to the investor center. :oops:

At this point, I'm not sure if I want to even move part of my trust assets to them. No promo bonus. Difficulty in adding new banks. I should probably just restrict myself to using their regular brokerage for checking.
Funny thing: In 2013, we set up our trust, and moved most of our non-IRA assets into it (including the bank and Fidelity). At that point I already had ACH / wire transfer set up from our Fidelity brokerage to our bank account. When we changed the registration of the Fidelity account to the trust, it all just stayed in place.

When we changed banks to get away from the thieves at Wells Fargo, we set up a new trust account at Ally. I re-set up everything to do transfers both ways between Ally and Fidelity, and everything worked great with no paper forms. The Fidelity brokerage is our spending money, so I move money to the bank maybe twice per month. Easy peasy.

Anyway, I never experienced the pain you went through. It's been quite nice.
Good for you! I suppose the policies changed. Compared to this Fidelity policy, Vanguard's ACH setup is so much easier -- you only need the ABA and Acc numbers.

At Fidelity, even the ACH link for the regular brokerage account requires a copy of the check or a statement showing the account numbers.
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by Minty » Fri Sep 20, 2019 12:18 am

bostondan wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 11:02 am
Minty wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 9:01 am
Long-time Fidelity customer (as well as Vanguard) and just consolidated paycheck direct deposit, billpay, checking, etc. at Fidelity so I could make some interest. I've never actually used the ATM/Debit card, only electronic transactions. Today someone withdrew about $500 from an ATM 300 miles away. I hope this isn't how it is going to go.
What did Fidelity have to say about it?

Seems unlikely that Fidelity is less secure than any other major bank. Does anybody have access to your card? Is it still in your possession? Do you keep it in your wallet? Was it definitely a physical ATM and not an EFT transaction?
Fidelity said they would have the fraud department investigate. Yes, I have the card. Fidelity said it was an ATM withdrawal, which AFAIK can only be done with a physical card.
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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by boston10 » Fri Sep 20, 2019 5:55 am

indexfundfan wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 10:12 pm
At Fidelity, even the ACH link for the regular brokerage account requires a copy of the check or a statement showing the account numbers.
Are you sure your account isn't restricted in some way? Fidelity definitely doesn't require a check or statement to add an ACH link. Just routing number and account number.

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Re: Fidelity as a one stop shop

Post by mrmass » Fri Sep 20, 2019 6:01 am

boston10 wrote:
Fri Sep 20, 2019 5:55 am
indexfundfan wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 10:12 pm
At Fidelity, even the ACH link for the regular brokerage account requires a copy of the check or a statement showing the account numbers.
Are you sure your account isn't restricted in some way? Fidelity definitely doesn't require a check or statement to add an ACH link. Just routing number and account number.
I have Fido, and for a time I wanted to make them my "bank" I found the account numbering system odd. See here https://www.fidelity.com/cash-managemen ... unt-number

setting up outside banks, etc was fine, but there's no tiny deposit to provide confidence. I still use them but send my paycheck to CapitalOne. It's very easy, and from there I can move it around very very easily.

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