Sherwin Williams "Rejuvinate" for old home paint job?

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UnLearnYourself
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Sherwin Williams "Rejuvinate" for old home paint job?

Post by UnLearnYourself » Mon Sep 09, 2019 11:04 am

I have a house build in the 1850s, I've only owned it 3 years. The paint is currently in rough shape, faded, cracking in some areas, and in other areas it is peeling in sheets. I'm gearing up for a paint job later this week and am debating my final decision on product.

The painters will be pressure washing, scraping, and sanding the siding, so it should be fairly well prepared. However in a nearly 200 year old home there will most certainly be areas left after they prep that still have layers of old paint, and other areas that are down to the bare wood.

My local Sherwin Williams is recommending I use "Rejuvinate" over the entire home - 2 coats. 1st coat sprayed and back rolled, then the 2nd coat just sprayed. They say this will work on both the bare wood spots as well as a the existing layer spots, and the product will glue down, seal, and level any old layers left.

Does anybody have experience with this product after it's been on the walls several years?

This should save me some decent money on labor, and based on what I see now where this home is prone to peeling, it's possible this compound will help avoid that happening so soon. And if by chance there is some critical issue causing the peeling, then spending less money on my paint job while I learn this hard lesson is more appealing then spending up to have 1-2 layers of priming + an additional 1-2 layers of top coat.

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vineviz
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Re: Sherwin Williams "Rejuvinate" for old home paint job?

Post by vineviz » Mon Sep 09, 2019 11:35 am

UnLearnYourself wrote:
Mon Sep 09, 2019 11:04 am
Does anybody have experience with this product after it's been on the walls several years?
I think this product was only introduced in 2016, so it's too early for any really useful field tests.

I haven't used it, but I've used a Sherwin-Williams high-build primer that I think works similarly and have been pleased so far. It bonds reasonably well to old paint and mildly levels the surfaces so things don't look quite as bad.

Proper surface preparation is still crucial, including aggressive scraping and sanding. If your painters get down to bare wood, or encounter areas that seem especially prone to peeling, I'd ask them to spot prime those areas with PrimeRx primer before the first coat of Rejuvenate.
"Far more money has been lost by investors preparing for corrections than has been lost in corrections themselves." ~~ Peter Lynch

dbr
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Re: Sherwin Williams "Rejuvinate" for old home paint job?

Post by dbr » Mon Sep 09, 2019 11:40 am

I don't know how you can glue down an interface without actually introducing the adhesive into the interface. The new paint might seal the edges of sheets of old paint but could hardly improve the adhesion overall. It could help to prevent moisture from penetrating that interface from the edges and failures do propagate from edges. That may indeed be successful for awhile, but it would be better if all the old paint could be stripped to bare wood. If the old paint is thick I would not think coating over it will prevent cracking and checking, which are endemic to thick layers of paint. I would also be dubious that the new paint will "level" the base to a point of not being evident. I have been happiest with the results of completely stripping thick old paint, though the job of doing so is far from trivial. In some cases just replacing old siding, etc. is a better approach, but I don't know what you are really working with.

Does the existing paint contain lead? I hope the painters are handling this properly.

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lthenderson
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Re: Sherwin Williams "Rejuvinate" for old home paint job?

Post by lthenderson » Mon Sep 09, 2019 11:46 am

I haven't used that but I've used a number of Sherwin Williams products recommended to me and I've never been disappointed. My only disappointment recently is self inflicted when I asked them to pre-tint the primer so I could possibly get by with one top coat of exterior paint. I probably would have but the wet color of the top coat was the exact same color as the dry color of the tinted primer so I could not see what spots had been missed until the top coat dried a slightly darker color. So I ended up putting a second coat on anyway. I just finished painting my exterior last week and hope that is the last time I have to do it myself. The next time I will be too old to fool around with such endeavors.

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UnLearnYourself
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Re: Sherwin Williams "Rejuvinate" for old home paint job?

Post by UnLearnYourself » Wed Sep 11, 2019 1:23 pm

vineviz wrote:
Mon Sep 09, 2019 11:35 am
UnLearnYourself wrote:
Mon Sep 09, 2019 11:04 am
Does anybody have experience with this product after it's been on the walls several years?
I think this product was only introduced in 2016, so it's too early for any really useful field tests.

I haven't used it, but I've used a Sherwin-Williams high-build primer that I think works similarly and have been pleased so far. It bonds reasonably well to old paint and mildly levels the surfaces so things don't look quite as bad.

Proper surface preparation is still crucial, including aggressive scraping and sanding. If your painters get down to bare wood, or encounter areas that seem especially prone to peeling, I'd ask them to spot prime those areas with PrimeRx primer before the first coat of Rejuvenate.
Siding was aggressively power washed (I know this can compromise old clap, but did it anyways and don't see any major issues as a result). Now today and tomorrow they will be scraping and sanding as well. This should yield properly prepped walls for them to work. (I just couldn't justify the extra prep costs to truly take this down to entirely bare wood).

I suspect there will be some old layers left, but hopefully by that time whatever is left will be properly adhered to the clap with properly sanded edges.

What I plan to have applied, first is Zinsser Peel Stop Triple Thick Binding Primer. This will be sprayed on and back rolled/brushed as a first prime coat.

Then I will have them follow with SW Rejuvenate for 2 top coat layers. Perhaps slight overkill, but I am hopeful this will leave a nice clean finish that will hopefully avoid any significant peeling anytime soon.

Thoughts on this?

dbr
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Re: Sherwin Williams "Rejuvinate" for old home paint job?

Post by dbr » Wed Sep 11, 2019 1:30 pm

My experience is that the only really satisfactory way to paint a surface with badly deteriorated paint, especially thick old paint that is cracked, checked, and peeling is to strip everything to bare wood. Obviously there are lots of examples of doing the best one can and getting by. It never looks as good or will maintain as well into the future as paint on new wood or completely stripped paint.

This is just one point of view and I am not a professional painter or renovator though I have dealt with paint on an old house for decades now.

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vineviz
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Re: Sherwin Williams "Rejuvinate" for old home paint job?

Post by vineviz » Wed Sep 11, 2019 2:04 pm

UnLearnYourself wrote:
Wed Sep 11, 2019 1:23 pm
What I plan to have applied, first is Zinsser Peel Stop Triple Thick Binding Primer. This will be sprayed on and back rolled/brushed as a first prime coat.

Then I will have them follow with SW Rejuvenate for 2 top coat layers. Perhaps slight overkill, but I am hopeful this will leave a nice clean finish that will hopefully avoid any significant peeling anytime soon.
I'm not a professional painter, but based on my experiences with my own old home this seems like an entirely reasonable plan. The Zinsser product is very similar to the PrimeRx from Sherwin-Williams that I've used, and I think it'll make a great base coat. It's not magic, but it does adhere and bond better than you might imagine if you've never used something like it.

The only modification I might suggest you discuss with your painters is whether you want to use two coats of Rejuvenate or just one. Because you're already using high build primer, and Rejuvenate itself can be top-coated with other SW acrylic latex paints, you might get a better result with Duration or Emerald exterior paint in a satin finish as the final coat. This is likely to be more durable (i.e. last longer before repainting, especially if you expect to ever pressure-wash the house again) than the "low sheen" finish of Rejuvenate.

So Zinsser>>Rejuvenate>>Duration/Emerald as the three coats.
"Far more money has been lost by investors preparing for corrections than has been lost in corrections themselves." ~~ Peter Lynch

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UnLearnYourself
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Re: Sherwin Williams "Rejuvinate" for old home paint job?

Post by UnLearnYourself » Wed Sep 11, 2019 2:20 pm

vineviz wrote:
Wed Sep 11, 2019 2:04 pm
UnLearnYourself wrote:
Wed Sep 11, 2019 1:23 pm
What I plan to have applied, first is Zinsser Peel Stop Triple Thick Binding Primer. This will be sprayed on and back rolled/brushed as a first prime coat.

Then I will have them follow with SW Rejuvenate for 2 top coat layers. Perhaps slight overkill, but I am hopeful this will leave a nice clean finish that will hopefully avoid any significant peeling anytime soon.
I'm not a professional painter, but based on my experiences with my own old home this seems like an entirely reasonable plan. The Zinsser product is very similar to the PrimeRx from Sherwin-Williams that I've used, and I think it'll make a great base coat. It's not magic, but it does adhere and bond better than you might imagine if you've never used something like it.

The only modification I might suggest you discuss with your painters is whether you want to use two coats of Rejuvenate or just one. Because you're already using high build primer, and Rejuvenate itself can be top-coated with other SW acrylic latex paints, you might get a better result with Duration or Emerald exterior paint in a satin finish as the final coat. This is likely to be more durable (i.e. last longer before repainting, especially if you expect to ever pressure-wash the house again) than the "low sheen" finish of Rejuvenate.

So Zinsser>>Rejuvenate>>Duration/Emerald as the three coats.
I considered this as a best practice. My issue now is simply coordinating the quantities and process for all of this, without either wasting money on product that won't be used, or having a timing issue if the guys are on site and run out. Will have to chat with the painters to see how to best approach if I wanted to split into 3 products.

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Re: Sherwin Williams "Rejuvinate" for old home paint job?

Post by UnLearnYourself » Wed Sep 11, 2019 2:27 pm

Only caveat being I've read Duration and Emerald aren't the best over old layers because they exert tension on prior layers and can lead to premature bubbling and peeling.

Every time I call Sherwin Williams they just read me the labels on the product - useless.

Not sure if that still leaves me with 2 coats of Rejuvenate, or if I should do one of Rejuv and 1 of superpaint or some lesser quality but lesser weight/tension product.

This is all dizzying...

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vineviz
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Re: Sherwin Williams "Rejuvinate" for old home paint job?

Post by vineviz » Wed Sep 11, 2019 2:37 pm

UnLearnYourself wrote:
Wed Sep 11, 2019 2:27 pm
Only caveat being I've read Duration and Emerald aren't the best over old layers because they exert tension on prior layers and can lead to premature bubbling and peeling.

Every time I call Sherwin Williams they just read me the labels on the product - useless.

Not sure if that still leaves me with 2 coats of Rejuvenate, or if I should do one of Rejuv and 1 of superpaint or some lesser quality but lesser weight/tension product.

This is all dizzying...
I'd do what your pros tell you to do, but as far as I can tell both the Zinsser primer and the Rejuvenate product has a slight elastomeric quality which makes the premium topcoats safe to use as a final coat.

Personally I wouldn't use Superpaint on siding: I'd just go with the original plan of 2x Rejuvenate first.
"Far more money has been lost by investors preparing for corrections than has been lost in corrections themselves." ~~ Peter Lynch

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Re: Sherwin Williams "Rejuvinate" for old home paint job?

Post by iamlucky13 » Wed Sep 11, 2019 2:43 pm

No experience with it, but I've got a fair amount of trust for the companies that specialize in paint and deal largely with professional painters, like Sherwin Williams and Benjamin Moore, compared to store-affiliated or other brands that market mainly to consumers and incessantly market their paints as not needing primers or second coats, such as Behr.

If the price difference is reasonable between Rejuvenate and one of their regular paints like Duration, I'd be willing to give it a try based on past good experience with Sherwin Williams and their reputation with painters as offering a well-tested product.

The main concern I would have is if they were pitching it as a cost-saver to allow reduced prep or skip on priming, but it sounds like you're getting a proper scrape, sand, wash, and prime.

I also don't know if the Rejuvenate provides additional value on top of the Peel Stop binding primer, or if the main benefit is when used with a normal primer, but I wouldn't call that a concern so much as a question of value.

You could also browse the painttalk.com forums to see if any of the contractors there have shared experiences with Rejuvenate. I've found useful information there in the past. You commented that calling Sherwin Williams is useless, but the technical reps that they connect professional painters with seem to be far more knowledgeable, and some of the members on PaintTalk pick up a lot of detailed information about functional differences and application best practices between different products their preferred brands offer.

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Re: Sherwin Williams "Rejuvinate" for old home paint job?

Post by iamlucky13 » Wed Sep 11, 2019 2:57 pm

UnLearnYourself wrote:
Wed Sep 11, 2019 2:27 pm
Not sure if that still leaves me with 2 coats of Rejuvenate, or if I should do one of Rejuv and 1 of superpaint or some lesser quality but lesser weight/tension product.
My understanding is Superpaint is intended for use when you have to paint in unfavorable weather conditions - low temperature, high humidity, or rain too soon in the forecast for other paints.

I'm not certain on this, but I thought Duration is generally recommended when those situations don't apply. I'm not familiar with Emerald - sounds like it's designed to spray a little better but can be a bit harder to brush or roll compared to Duration. I'd take the painter's recommendation between those products if you decide to proceed with a final coat of something other than Rejuvanate

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Re: Sherwin Williams "Rejuvinate" for old home paint job?

Post by jharkin » Wed Sep 11, 2019 4:34 pm

A method recommended to me by professional old house restorers when I owned an 18th century home is this:

1 strip siding to bare wood using your favorite method

2 Apply a coat of “blopturp” a 50/50 mix of Boiled linseed oil and turpentine (some blend in 20% penetrol) ... this soaks in and conditions the wood and helps the oil primer n the next step bond.

3 After 24 hours (minimum) prime with a slow dry “long oil” exterior primer (2 coats recommended)

4 Top coat with a quality exterior latex (BM Aura, SW Duration, etc) 2 or 3 coats.



I’ve used this method myself, it’s time consuming but works very well.

rich126
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Re: Sherwin Williams "Rejuvinate" for old home paint job?

Post by rich126 » Wed Sep 11, 2019 4:53 pm

I've never been a fan of Sherwin Williams paints but contractors all want to use them. I think it is because the contractors get a sizable discount off of the brand. I'm not a professional, and hopefully have retired from painting, but I've done a ton of painting, including two fixer upper homes and have never seen my work look worse than a professional except for not having a steady hand doing some delicate trim work.

I'm a big believe that you need:
1. Patch/sand holes/repairs
2. Wash the walls
3. Prime
4. Use two coats of paint. Personally the stuff Home Depot works as well as anything (Behr).

I've never been a fan of the one coat primer+paint stuff. It may work for some but it never looked good to me. The only thing I won't do are ceilings, especially after messing up my back one time. Unfortunately a lot of "pros" just want to come in and throw on a coat of paint and collect the money.

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