anyone here use BillPay?

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montanagirl
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anyone here use BillPay?

Post by montanagirl » Thu Jul 11, 2019 12:52 pm

I've gotten used to paying most my bills this way at my bank, but I am amazed how some payments don't appear in my account for weeks or months even. Like I paid about 8 bills yesterday, to insurance and city sewer and gas card, but the one to the city doesn't show up in my account list of transactions. Yet when I go to the BillPay tab everything shows just fine. When I search on the amounts I usually still get nothing.

Yesterday I called my optometrist to make sure she'd gotten a payment from a month go that still didn't show up. She was fine. Then today suddenly it's there in my account. Some debits at Albertson's (regional chain) don't show up for weeks on end. OTOH WalMart debits immediately show up. What gives? :confused Making bank recs rather difficult.

I assume BillPay is some third party service that banks contract with? Is there some kind of ACH "handshake" they need from the payee before it "registers" with the bank?

TheDDC
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Re: anyone here use BillPay?

Post by TheDDC » Thu Jul 11, 2019 12:56 pm

montanagirl wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 12:52 pm
I've gotten used to paying most my bills this way at my bank, but I am amazed how some payments don't appear in my account for weeks or months even. Like I paid about 8 bills yesterday, to insurance and city sewer and gas card, but one doesn't show up in my account list of transactions. Yet when I go to the BillPay tab everything shows just fine. When I search on the amounts I usually still get nothing.

Yesterday I called my optometrist to make sure she'd gotten a payment from a month go that still didn't show up. She was fine. Then today suddenly it's there in my account. Some debits at Albertson's (regional chain) don't show up for weeks on end. OTOH WalMart debits immediately show up. What gives? :confused

I assume BillPay is some third party service that banks contract with? Is there some kind of ACH "handshake" they need from the payee before it "registers" with the bank?
Sounds like a poor bill payer service. My credit union clears my bill payments in the same manner as ACH or paper. To my knowledge it is not a third party BP system and is integrated into my bank's web UI without an SSO component.

-TheDDC

02nz
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Re: anyone here use BillPay?

Post by 02nz » Thu Jul 11, 2019 1:03 pm

montanagirl wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 12:52 pm
I've gotten used to paying most my bills this way at my bank, but I am amazed how some payments don't appear in my account for weeks or months even. Like I paid about 8 bills yesterday, to insurance and city sewer and gas card, but the one to the city doesn't show up in my account list of transactions. Yet when I go to the BillPay tab everything shows just fine. When I search on the amounts I usually still get nothing.

Yesterday I called my optometrist to make sure she'd gotten a payment from a month go that still didn't show up. She was fine. Then today suddenly it's there in my account. Some debits at Albertson's (regional chain) don't show up for weeks on end. OTOH WalMart debits immediately show up. What gives? :confused Making bank recs rather difficult.

I assume BillPay is some third party service that banks contract with? Is there some kind of ACH "handshake" they need from the payee before it "registers" with the bank?
I'll bet what's happening is that the payees with the delays are being paid by check. My bank's bill payment is similar: For payees that are set up to receive payment electronically (e.g., mortgage companies and credit card issuers, bigger utilities), the payment is debited from my account on the day of the payment. But of a payee is set up manually, they get sent a check, this takes several days to receive, and only when the payee actually deposit the check and it clears my bank, does the money get debited from my account. This probably explains why the payment to the optometrist showed up so soon after you called her about it - she deposited the check and it cleared your bank.

Some banks handle this differently and debit your account immediately even for check payments.
Last edited by 02nz on Thu Jul 11, 2019 1:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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mickeyd
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Re: anyone here use BillPay?

Post by mickeyd » Thu Jul 11, 2019 1:11 pm

You are over-thinking this mountaingirl. Once you have submitted the payment, your job is done. I have used BillPay thru USAA bank for about 30 years. So far so good.
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Broken Man 1999
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Re: anyone here use BillPay?

Post by Broken Man 1999 » Thu Jul 11, 2019 1:13 pm

Our credit union has had a couple of partners for bill pay over the years. All have been pretty good. And all were free.

Some bill pay payees require a physical check to be mailed, so those will vary according to when the payee deposits the check at their bank/credit union.

Perhaps the one you don't see is one that requires a check to be mailed.

I am down to one bill pay payee, my lawn service. I pay in advance of the month, around the 25th of the month preceding the service, and sometimes it takes a couple of weeks to see the check has been paid. I don't mind because the bill pay takes the money out when the check is presented to my credit union.

Though I can't pay for my lawn service by credit card, at least I have the bill pay automated.

Broken Man 1999
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retiredjg
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Re: anyone here use BillPay?

Post by retiredjg » Thu Jul 11, 2019 1:21 pm

This is what my bill pay says about when the money is taken out.
  • When is the money for the payment withdrawn from my account?

    If the payment is sent electronically, the money is withdrawn from your account one business day after processing begins. If the company or person cannot receive electronic payments, we print a check and mail it to the address you provide.

    For some checks, the money is withdrawn one business day after processing begins. For others, the money is withdrawn when the company or person deposits or cashes the check.
However, I have never seen the money for a check be withdrawn when the check is deposited or cashed. It always comes out about the day the check is mailed....I take that back. :oops: I have one annual bill for $12 that usually takes two or three months to clear, presumably because they cash checks quarterly or something. Very annoying.

Other than that, all electronic and checks come out of my account very quickly.

livesoft
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Re: anyone here use BillPay?

Post by livesoft » Thu Jul 11, 2019 1:22 pm

I use WellsFargo and the bill pay stuff is accurate and timely, so I have never seen what the OP is writing about.
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beyou
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Re: anyone here use BillPay?

Post by beyou » Thu Jul 11, 2019 2:24 pm

Your doctors and other small businesses get a check in the mail from your bank, and takes them time to process.
Bill pay does not help, and in fact you do have the cash withdrawn without credit. The main benefit in these cases is that the
bank could investigate and replace the check if lost by your recipient.

Paying a credit card, I find in 2 days the credit card usually has the payment posted.
True of many that take electronic payments that you initiate via online BillPay.

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montanagirl
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Re: anyone here use BillPay?

Post by montanagirl » Thu Jul 11, 2019 2:51 pm

mickeyd wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 1:11 pm
You are over-thinking this mountaingirl. Once you have submitted the payment, your job is done. I have used BillPay thru USAA bank for about 30 years. So far so good.
Yes and I got billpay mixed up with regular debits... :oops:

I think it's the paper check thing...I thought it was all paper checks. But not to BigCorp apparently.

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ResearchMed
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Re: anyone here use BillPay?

Post by ResearchMed » Thu Jul 11, 2019 2:58 pm

beyou wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 2:24 pm
Your doctors and other small businesses get a check in the mail from your bank, and takes them time to process.
Bill pay does not help, and in fact you do have the cash withdrawn without credit. The main benefit in these cases is that the
bank could investigate and replace the check if lost by your recipient.

Paying a credit card, I find in 2 days the credit card usually has the payment posted.
True of many that take electronic payments that you initiate via online BillPay.
It can depend upon the bank and upon the customer choice (in some cases) when the cash is withdrawn from account.

BoA - kindly, "for the convenience of the customer" - takes the money right away, when the check is initially processed to be sent. IF it's not presented within 90 days, then they'll kindly refund your money. Nice float for them...

OR... one can make the request to have the money withdrawn ONLY when the check is presented to be cashed/deposited/etc.

BoA says the former helps customers, who obviously cannot keep track of their balances...

RM
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JoeRetire
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Re: anyone here use BillPay?

Post by JoeRetire » Thu Jul 11, 2019 3:05 pm

montanagirl wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 12:52 pm
What gives? :confused Making bank recs rather difficult.

I assume BillPay is some third party service that banks contract with? Is there some kind of ACH "handshake" they need from the payee before it "registers" with the bank?
For direct transfer, it will leave your account and enter the payee's account overnight.

For the cases where billpay must send a paper check, it will be in the mail for a while, and then could sit on the payee's desk until they bother to deposit it.

That shouldn't make things more difficult. The second case is the same as if you popped a check into the mail (minus the cost of the stamp).

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FelixTheCat
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Re: anyone here use BillPay?

Post by FelixTheCat » Thu Jul 11, 2019 3:08 pm

I have Fidelity's BillPay. EFTs are logged the day they are sent out. Checks are marked as Processing until the recipient cashes the check.

Maybe it's time for you to switch. :happy
Felix is a wonderful, wonderful cat.

retiredjg
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Re: anyone here use BillPay?

Post by retiredjg » Thu Jul 11, 2019 3:44 pm

mickeyd wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 1:11 pm
You are over-thinking this mountaingirl. Once you have submitted the payment, your job is done.
I think it is not over-thinking. If the cash does not come out right away, a person might forget a check that is outstanding and overdraw their account. This won't happen if you keep a separate check book register, but some people do not do that.

OnLevel
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Re: anyone here use BillPay?

Post by OnLevel » Thu Jul 11, 2019 3:46 pm

mickeyd wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 1:11 pm
You are over-thinking this mountaingirl. Once you have submitted the payment, your job is done. I have used BillPay thru USAA bank for about 30 years. So far so good.
BillPay existed 30 years ago? :?:

mpnret
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Re: anyone here use BillPay?

Post by mpnret » Thu Jul 11, 2019 5:07 pm

livesoft wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 1:22 pm
I use WellsFargo and the bill pay stuff is accurate and timely, so I have never seen what the OP is writing about.
The way WellsFargo works is the day you set for the bill pay is the day the money comes out of your account regardless of when the payment arrives. In the rare event a check doesn't get cashed it will eventually end up back in your account. WF gets the float. Works for me.

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Abe
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Re: anyone here use BillPay?

Post by Abe » Thu Jul 11, 2019 5:14 pm

I always paid my bills by check and it worked good for me even with 10 rental properties. I recently started using Billpay to pay my bills. That was a big mistake. One of the bills I paid with Billpay was a phone bill to ATT; however, Att said they they didn't get it. It took me about 3 months to get it straightened out and I don't know how many phone calls to my bank and ATT. I still don't know what happened, but one day I received a credit on my phone bill from ATT for the lost payment. Needless to say, I'm back using checks to pay my bills. It takes me a little longer and I have to pay postage but it's worth it to me. I have my own system and it works good for me.
Slow and steady wins the race.

mpnret
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Re: anyone here use BillPay?

Post by mpnret » Thu Jul 11, 2019 5:15 pm

OnLevel wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 3:46 pm
mickeyd wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 1:11 pm
You are over-thinking this mountaingirl. Once you have submitted the payment, your job is done. I have used BillPay thru USAA bank for about 30 years. So far so good.
BillPay existed 30 years ago? :?:
It was about 30 years ago. Before that my bank had a service called pay by phone. You actually called your bank on a touch tone phone, logged in and paid your bills using payee account numbers previously set up.

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ResearchMed
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Re: anyone here use BillPay?

Post by ResearchMed » Thu Jul 11, 2019 5:18 pm

Abe wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 5:14 pm
I always paid my bills by check and it worked good for me even with 10 rental properties. I recently started using Billpay to pay my bills. That was a big mistake. One of the bills I paid with Billpay was a phone bill to ATT; however, Att said they they didn't get it. It took me about 3 months to get it straightened out and I don't know how many phone calls to my bank and ATT. I still don't know what happened, but one day I received a credit on my phone bill from ATT for the lost payment. Needless to say, I'm back using checks to pay my bills. It takes me a little longer and I have to pay postage but it's worth it to me. I have my own system and it works good for me.
Not sure about your bill pay, but ours does use physical checks. We get the images of the cancelled checks back, same as if we had written and mailed them. But it's so much easier.
A check could be lost/misplaced if the bank mails it OR if we mailed it.

RM
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mhalley
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Re: anyone here use BillPay?

Post by mhalley » Thu Jul 11, 2019 5:33 pm

I remember back when they used velociraptors to deliver the mail, I used quicken to print out checks, then give it to the raptor. Then quicken had a billpay service, and finally when the dinosaurs became extinct my bank had its own billpay service. I can’t even imagine going back to paying bills with physical checks.

Broken Man 1999
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Re: anyone here use BillPay?

Post by Broken Man 1999 » Thu Jul 11, 2019 5:33 pm

ResearchMed wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 5:18 pm
Abe wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 5:14 pm
I always paid my bills by check and it worked good for me even with 10 rental properties. I recently started using Billpay to pay my bills. That was a big mistake. One of the bills I paid with Billpay was a phone bill to ATT; however, Att said they they didn't get it. It took me about 3 months to get it straightened out and I don't know how many phone calls to my bank and ATT. I still don't know what happened, but one day I received a credit on my phone bill from ATT for the lost payment. Needless to say, I'm back using checks to pay my bills. It takes me a little longer and I have to pay postage but it's worth it to me. I have my own system and it works good for me.
Not sure about your bill pay, but ours does use physical checks. We get the images of the cancelled checks back, same as if we had written and mailed them. But it's so much easier.
A check could be lost/misplaced if the bank mails it OR if we mailed it.

RM
Prior to being able to pay so many bills via credit cards, I used bill pay quite a bit. One nice feature our credit union bill pay had was if they screwed up, and the payee charged late fees, the bill pay provider paid any late fees. Over the many years I used bill pay extensively, never had a late payment, or a lost check. The bill pay system wouldn't let you schedule a check that would normally take a couple of days to arrive. We scheduled when we wanted to have the check arrive at the payee.

We did have a bill pay check that wasn't cashed for a long period of time, called the company, and they said my account was current. They apparently lost the check after posting to my account. I sent them another one, and insisted they cash it, no problems. It was for an amount under $50, so if it had shown up, it wouldn't have been difficult to resolve.

Back in the day I could pay recurring bills quickly, and no postage needed. A really good tool for many years.

Broken Man 1999
“If I cannot drink Bourbon and smoke cigars in Heaven than I shall not go. " -Mark Twain

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Abe
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Re: anyone here use BillPay?

Post by Abe » Thu Jul 11, 2019 5:38 pm

ResearchMed wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 5:18 pm
Abe wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 5:14 pm
I always paid my bills by check and it worked good for me even with 10 rental properties. I recently started using Billpay to pay my bills. That was a big mistake. One of the bills I paid with Billpay was a phone bill to ATT; however, Att said they they didn't get it. It took me about 3 months to get it straightened out and I don't know how many phone calls to my bank and ATT. I still don't know what happened, but one day I received a credit on my phone bill from ATT for the lost payment. Needless to say, I'm back using checks to pay my bills. It takes me a little longer and I have to pay postage but it's worth it to me. I have my own system and it works good for me.
Not sure about your bill pay, but ours does use physical checks. We get the images of the cancelled checks back, same as if we had written and mailed them. But it's so much easier.
A check could be lost/misplaced if the bank mails it OR if we mailed it.

RM
I think billpay will send a physical check if the recipient does not accept electronic payment. I just like my system of paying by checks where I write the check and I can look at my check stubs at any time to see where I am. When you get to be 75 years old it's hard to change. :happy
Slow and steady wins the race.

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ResearchMed
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Re: anyone here use BillPay?

Post by ResearchMed » Thu Jul 11, 2019 5:44 pm

Broken Man 1999 wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 5:33 pm
ResearchMed wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 5:18 pm
Abe wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 5:14 pm
I always paid my bills by check and it worked good for me even with 10 rental properties. I recently started using Billpay to pay my bills. That was a big mistake. One of the bills I paid with Billpay was a phone bill to ATT; however, Att said they they didn't get it. It took me about 3 months to get it straightened out and I don't know how many phone calls to my bank and ATT. I still don't know what happened, but one day I received a credit on my phone bill from ATT for the lost payment. Needless to say, I'm back using checks to pay my bills. It takes me a little longer and I have to pay postage but it's worth it to me. I have my own system and it works good for me.
Not sure about your bill pay, but ours does use physical checks. We get the images of the cancelled checks back, same as if we had written and mailed them. But it's so much easier.
A check could be lost/misplaced if the bank mails it OR if we mailed it.

RM
Prior to being able to pay so many bills via credit cards, I used bill pay quite a bit. One nice feature our credit union bill pay had was if they screwed up, and the payee charged late fees, the bill pay provider paid any late fees. Over the many years I used bill pay extensively, never had a late payment, or a lost check. The bill pay system wouldn't let you schedule a check that would normally take a couple of days to arrive. We scheduled when we wanted to have the check arrive at the payee.

We did have a bill pay check that wasn't cashed for a long period of time, called the company, and they said my account was current. They apparently lost the check after posting to my account. I sent them another one, and insisted they cash it, no problems. It was for an amount under $50, so if it had shown up, it wouldn't have been difficult to resolve.

Back in the day I could pay recurring bills quickly, and no postage needed. A really good tool for many years.

Broken Man 1999
Yup, paying by credit card is even easier... plus one gets those points. We try to pay for ANYTHING using our charge cards, and are thus having a ball with premium international air travel.

But there are still some places where charge cards are not taken, although those are increasingly rare.
Our bill pay would also pay for any late fees, etc. That only happened once, and it was a very hefty penalty - to a cabin housecleaning service, who thus missed their payroll, and the charges snowballed... and... BoA did indeed cover those charges. (I admit I was quite surprised at the ease of getting that paid, once we provided documentation. It was paid directly to the vendor, for their extra costs, so maybe that helped... that the extra didn't come to us?)

Either is so much easier than writing a check, getting a stamp, and getting it mailed, one way or another.
Seems "quaint" now!
:wink:

RM
This signature is a placebo. You are in the control group.

Gray
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Re: anyone here use BillPay?

Post by Gray » Thu Jul 11, 2019 6:05 pm

If you’re ok with paying for it, you can get a third party bill pay service.

https://money.yodlee.com/pfm3/home

http://quickenbillpay.com/

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