NYC Living Options

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Topic Author
JJP
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NYC Living Options

Post by JJP » Wed Aug 24, 2016 9:18 am

Hey everyone,

As I mentioned in another thread, I should be finally starting my dream job shortly. This will require me to move to the NYC area where I will need easy access to all 3 airports, LaGuardia, Kennedy, and sometimes Newark. I've always wanted to live in NYC but could never justify it. Now, I have a chance. My problem is that I cannot for the life of me figure out how to find a decent place and decide whether to buy or rent.

I've decided that throwing away $3500 a month in rent isn't worth it. So should I buy? I'd like Manhattan living, but I've never lived there before. I'm a believer of trying before buying, but again, can't justify throwing all of that rent away. It appears that 1 bedroom apartments in Manhattan are going for 800-900k which seems high. Another option would be living on Long Island and driving or taking the LIRR to the airports (I know I'd need to connect from LIRR to subway/bus). This could be an option because I would not have to get rid of my car and could be potentially much cheaper. I would consider renting, not buying on Long Island.

Given all of this, I'm in my late 20s, single, and basically free to do whatever I want. However, I'm to the point where I'd prefer not to have roommates. Price point wise, anything under $3.5-4k a month would probably work. although I'd like to keep it below $3k.

Any tips for tackling this NYC monster?

mcraepat9
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by mcraepat9 » Wed Aug 24, 2016 9:27 am

JJP wrote:Hey everyone,

As I mentioned in another thread, I should be finally starting my dream job shortly. This will require me to move to the NYC area welcome!, it's a great place to live where I will need easy access to all 3 airports, LaGuardia, Kennedy, and sometimes Newark will you have a car? is your plan to use a car, cab or transit to get to the airports?. I've always wanted to live in NYC but could never justify it. Now, I have a chance. My problem is that I cannot for the life of me figure out how to find a decent place and decide whether to buy or rent.rent

I've decided that throwing away $3500 a month in rent isn't worth it. this is absolutely false. please read the many "Rent vs buy" threads on this forum as well as talk to numerous owners. renting is not "throwing money away". So should I buy? no, you are in your late 20s, there is no need to buy now I'd like Manhattan living, but I've never lived there before. yes you should try it if you can - it is a different lifestyle but one that is very well suited to your late 20s. I'm a believer of trying before buying, but again, can't justify throwing all of that rent away. you need to take a hard look at this thinking. this mindset will prevent you from thinking clearly about this. It appears that 1 bedroom apartments in Manhattan are going for 800-900k which seems high. correct, this is about right for a 1BR in a decent neighborhood and decent amenities Another option would be living on Long Island and driving or taking the LIRR to the airports (I know I'd need to connect from LIRR to subway/bus). This could be an option because I would not have to get rid of my car and could be potentially much cheaper. I would consider renting, not buying on Long Island. in my humble opinion, a late 20s single guy or girl would not enjoy living in the suburbs. you get what you pay for. moving to this region to live on long island i think would be a waste. if you can stomach the cost, live in the city.

Given all of this, I'm in my late 20s, single, and basically free to do whatever I want. However, I'm to the point where I'd prefer not to have roommates. Price point wise, anything under $3.5-4k a month would probably work. although I'd like to keep it below $3k.you can definitely find studios and 1BR below $4k in desirable neighborhoods, below $3k is a little harder but still doable. if you were to buy you would be looking at $9k per month PITI for the same apartment. get a one year lease in a fun neighborhood and live it up. i envy you.

Any tips for tackling this NYC monster? talk to friends, get you boots on the ground walking around neighborhoods you would want to live in and understand that NYC real estate is an exhausting process. if you are going to be in manhattan and carless, you may want to find a spot with easy access to penn station trains to EWR/JFK. there are also a handful of buses that go to the airports too from grand central and the port authority.
Last edited by mcraepat9 on Wed Aug 24, 2016 9:34 am, edited 1 time in total.
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rmelvey
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by rmelvey » Wed Aug 24, 2016 9:34 am

Don't buy a car. If you really hate the subway just use Uber or yellow cabs. You can certainly find something much cheaper than $3.5-$4K. I live in a 2BR apartment in chinatown for $2,500 and have a roommate so I pay $1,275. Try to keep in mind that you will be meeting and hanging out with people outside of your apartment so it's not that bad living in a small cheap apartment.

The funny thing with buying a Manhattan apartment is that even if you buy it all cash, you still have monthly payments spanning between $500 - $1,000 each month in maintenance fees. The buy vs. rent math in NYC is quite different from the rest of the country.

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Rob5TCP
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by Rob5TCP » Wed Aug 24, 2016 9:37 am

$3500 for a studio is readily available. Finding $2500 is also do-able.

In Harlem (rapidly becoming a hot area after years of being avoided is much less expensive)
My friends live on West 110th Street (now Central Park North); there are apts that 10 years ago were $800 a month; now they are $500,000
for a large 1 bedroom or small 2 bedroom.

This will give you an idea of what's available in studios and 1 bedrooms
I set $2500 for the maximum; and selected any of the neighborhoods I would consider relocating to
(I like where I am living now; East 20th by the FDR).

https://www.citihabitats.com/find-real- ... &View=Grid
Last edited by Rob5TCP on Wed Aug 24, 2016 9:52 am, edited 1 time in total.

meaghansketch
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by meaghansketch » Wed Aug 24, 2016 9:44 am

Any reason you didn't mention the NYC boroughs?

Will you be commuting to an office every day?

Use a transit map like this one: https://project.wnyc.org/transit-time/ to figure out how long your commute might take. If you're working in the Financial district either Brooklyn or New Jersey might be a good option, if you're working in Midtown then Astoria, Long Island City or Sunnyside in Queens might be good options. Then again don't expect to save a *lot* vs Manhattan- the differential is a lot less than it used to be, and some neighborhoods in Brooklyn are now more expensive than Manhattan. On the other hand there are other advantages to not being in Manhattan- I like the (relative) quietness and villagey feel of my Brooklyn neighborhood.

IMO both rents and prices are on a downswing right now. (http://ny.curbed.com/2016/4/7/11381852/ ... rices-drop) Too many empty luxury buildings not renting at expected prices. Particularly at the high end you might be able to negotiate a deal. I would not buy right now but I would be keeping an eye on prices in case they do drop significantly.

Topic Author
JJP
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by JJP » Wed Aug 24, 2016 9:49 am

Thanks everyone. I do currently have a car that I purchased new in 2012. I'd hate to sell it, but I also don't want to have it sitting around. If I'm living in Manhattan, my primary transportation to the airport would be the subway/bus and occasionally Uber if it is early morning.

No office for me. I'll be heading to the airports for work then going "home" to my apartment in the city.

Fixmen
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by Fixmen » Wed Aug 24, 2016 9:51 am

You definitely should not buy. I guarantee that you will regret buying something until you get a better idea of where you want to live.

Regarding rent vs buy, make sure you're accounting for maintenance charges (in NYC this commonly includes property taxes). You should expect to pay $1-2K per month on and $800K apartment. If you think renting is "throwing away month", then property taxes on top of mortgage interest is definitely "throwing away money".

The airports in NYC are hard to get to by public transportation. Whether that's a quirk of geography, poor planning or just the handiwork of a powerful taxi union, it's the reality. If you're traveling for work, you'll probably be able to expense an Uber to the airport. If so, then you should probably drop any plans of living on LI and driving to the airport.

themesrob
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by themesrob » Wed Aug 24, 2016 9:54 am

JJP wrote:Hey everyone,

As I mentioned in another thread, I should be finally starting my dream job shortly. This will require me to move to the NYC area where I will need easy access to all 3 airports, LaGuardia, Kennedy, and sometimes Newark. I've always wanted to live in NYC but could never justify it. Now, I have a chance. My problem is that I cannot for the life of me figure out how to find a decent place and decide whether to buy or rent.

I've decided that throwing away $3500 a month in rent isn't worth it. So should I buy? I'd like Manhattan living, but I've never lived there before. I'm a believer of trying before buying, but again, can't justify throwing all of that rent away. It appears that 1 bedroom apartments in Manhattan are going for 800-900k which seems high. Another option would be living on Long Island and driving or taking the LIRR to the airports (I know I'd need to connect from LIRR to subway/bus). This could be an option because I would not have to get rid of my car and could be potentially much cheaper. I would consider renting, not buying on Long Island.

Given all of this, I'm in my late 20s, single, and basically free to do whatever I want. However, I'm to the point where I'd prefer not to have roommates. Price point wise, anything under $3.5-4k a month would probably work. although I'd like to keep it below $3k.

Any tips for tackling this NYC monster?
Congrats on the job!

The NYC area is for renters, IMHO, unless you have very particular circumstances and are certain that you'll be fixed in place for years.

If Manhattan living is more your speed but less your pricing, you may be thinking in the wrong direction with Long Island. Given your preferences, look at Hoboken/Jersey City.
- It's a quick trip to EWR, and you have quick access to Penn Station, which then gets you to JFK via the A and LGA via the E (though, to be honest, there is no good way to get to LGA, from anywhere).
- in terms of lifestyle for a younger single person, NJ, from what I hear, is a lot of fun (I think Hoboken is the singles capital of the world), and you have much faster access to Manhattan than from Long Island.
- rents are not cheap, but you'll save by comparison to Manhattan (you'll be very comfortable on your own underneath $3k), and you'd likely be able to keep your car.

my two cents. good luck!

R2D2
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by R2D2 » Wed Aug 24, 2016 9:59 am

Some of this is echoing what others have said:

You can get a 1BR for around $3000 if you're not too picky about neighborhoods. Upper East Side is a good place to start.

It's very expensive to have a car in Manhattan. Annoyingly enough, it's tough (though possible) to get to the airport via public transit. Uber is your friend here, but of course it's not cheap. (Getting to Newark is sort of an exception. You can take NJTransit to the AirTrain. It takes a long time, but driving/getting a cab can take arbitrarily long. Traffic is completely unpredictable.)

Commuting in from LI is going to get really annoying.

If you're single and in your 20s, just live in Manhattan, ditch the car, sign up for match.com and figure that you're paying a premium to live in a good "dating area". It's much easier to meet someone if you live in Manhattan compared to the outer boroughs and esp. Long Island.

As someone else mentioned, you can consider Astoria (in Queens). It's pretty quick to get to Manhattan from there.

mcraepat9
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by mcraepat9 » Wed Aug 24, 2016 10:02 am

R2D2 wrote:If you're single and in your 20s, just live in Manhattan, ditch the car, sign up for match.com and figure that you're paying a premium to live in a good "dating area". It's much easier to meet someone if you live in Manhattan compared to the outer boroughs and esp. Long Island.
This made me laugh, but is so true.
Amateur investors are not cool-headed logicians.

ChrisC
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by ChrisC » Wed Aug 24, 2016 10:11 am

You should be able to get a decent apartment under $3500 in Brooklyn though LI City might offer a break on rental. My daughter lived in Kips Bay, near the UN with a roommate in a 2 bedroom 900 SF apartment; rent was 3600 in 2013-2014. She moved to Williamsburg B'klyn in a studio, modern bldg, at 450 SF at $2600 in 2016, which she downsized from a 1 brm, 700 sf at $3400 in the same building in 2015. She walks to the subway (though there will be changes in subway service for a while) and it takes her 30 minutes door to door to her job in midtown.

I have a preference for my home town in Brooklyn. In many desirable places in Brooklyn, you should be able to find decent housing in pre-WWII blds. Avoid using a realtor and hunt online and you'll save a lot of change.

R2D2
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by R2D2 » Wed Aug 24, 2016 10:17 am

ChrisC wrote:Avoid using a realtor and hunt online and you'll save a lot of change.
+1
In NYC, they call themselves "apartment brokers" and they charge a fortune. (Two months' rent seems to ring a bell.) AFAICT, their profession is no longer needed now that we have the internet.

HomoLudens
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by HomoLudens » Wed Aug 24, 2016 10:23 am

JJP wrote:Hey everyone,

As I mentioned in another thread, I should be finally starting my dream job shortly. This will require me to move to the NYC area where I will need easy access to all 3 airports, LaGuardia, Kennedy, and sometimes Newark. I've always wanted to live in NYC but could never justify it. Now, I have a chance. My problem is that I cannot for the life of me figure out how to find a decent place and decide whether to buy or rent.

I've decided that throwing away $3500 a month in rent isn't worth it. So should I buy? I'd like Manhattan living, but I've never lived there before. I'm a believer of trying before buying, but again, can't justify throwing all of that rent away. It appears that 1 bedroom apartments in Manhattan are going for 800-900k which seems high. Another option would be living on Long Island and driving or taking the LIRR to the airports (I know I'd need to connect from LIRR to subway/bus). This could be an option because I would not have to get rid of my car and could be potentially much cheaper. I would consider renting, not buying on Long Island.

Given all of this, I'm in my late 20s, single, and basically free to do whatever I want. However, I'm to the point where I'd prefer not to have roommates. Price point wise, anything under $3.5-4k a month would probably work. although I'd like to keep it below $3k.

Any tips for tackling this NYC monster?
Astoria, Queens is a good option with a short trip to La Guardia. The M60 bus is really convenient, it goes to La Guardia for 10-5 minutes; same bus goes to the Harlem and Columbia University. The trip to JFK will be longer of course. If you want a quite, more peaceful setting check studios on Astoria Blvd and Ditmars Blvd ( especially the latter). 30 Av. is more of a hipster area, but it's nice. A studio should be around $ 1500-1700 ( but that's my rough estimate). Sunnyside is OK, but you will have an airplane noise problem. But noise is always a problem in NYC so eventually you will learn to live with it.
"'Thoughts without content are empty, intuitions without concepts are blind." Immanuel Kant

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Rob5TCP
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by Rob5TCP » Wed Aug 24, 2016 10:24 am

Image


Getting to Laguardia is not that expensive
$30 +/- depending where you live for Laguardia
$55 +/- for JFK
$85 +/- for Newark

For Newark I take a cab to Grand Central and then take the bus (around $22 for both).
There is also the supershuttle option, but you have to give hours of extra time because they are not always reliable (time wise).
From my place to JFK is 3 subways and I rarely bother unless I have minimal luggage with me (L train to A train to Airtrain). Can take 90 minutes or 2 1/2 hours. LAQ I just take Uber or a taxi.
I second the idea to rent because you do not know where you will ultimately want to live.

Long Island City is going on a massive building spree. There are hundreds if not thousands of new units coming "online" now and for the foreseeable future. As mentioned you may get some concessions on rent there . Parts of LIC have gone from light manufacturing to mini Manhattan in the last 10-12 years. It's easy access to LAQ and one subway stop to 59/Lex.

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tennisplyr
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by tennisplyr » Wed Aug 24, 2016 10:54 am

Where in the city is your job? I've lived on Long Island most of my life and commuted via LIRR to the city. You could find some nice places to rent for under $3000. JFK and LaGuardia airports are typically ~1/2 hour drive to get to from most parts of Nassau County. You may want to try VRBO and Airbnb for short term rentals to check out the areas. Good luck, NY can be lots of fun especially for younger folks.
Those who move forward with a happy spirit will find that things always work out.

PoppyA
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by PoppyA » Wed Aug 24, 2016 11:10 am

I'd say you should live in Manhattan or Brooklyn. You are young, go for it. Don't compromise, live the dream. You will not regret it.

I agree, rent before you buy. You have to get a feel for all the ins & outs of NYC real estate. You might end up in a great rent controlled apartment you could keep a life time!
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casualflower
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by casualflower » Wed Aug 24, 2016 11:18 am

Travel to LaGuardia or JFK is incredibly affordable and easy to do.

It's $2.75 to get from LGA to most places in the city via bus to subway. It's $7.75 for JFK.

I haven't flown into/out of EWR in years, so I can't comment on that.

ChrisC
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by ChrisC » Wed Aug 24, 2016 12:53 pm

PoppyA wrote:I'd say you should live in Manhattan or Brooklyn. You are young, go for it. Don't compromise, live the dream. You will not regret it.

I agree, rent before you buy. You have to get a feel for all the ins & outs of NYC real estate. You might end up in a great rent controlled apartment you could keep a life time!
I agree with your post except for the rent control part. I know a little about rent control since we own a 4-family apartment bldg in Cobble Hill, Brooklyn, which was built around the turn of the 20th Century (1899). Multi-family apartment buildings built before 1947 were subject to rent control. But once a rent control tenant vacates that rent controlled unit, the apartment is no longer subject to rent control, generally. Our building was subject to rent control; over the years, we had three rent control tenants who vacated their units and these apartments were no longer under rent control. The last rent control unit became de-controlled last year: we had a family friend tenant who lived in our building for over 50 years; she paid the rent control rate of $242.50 a month for the last 15 years; when she first moved into the apartment, she paid $55 a month. She passed away at 94 years old in 2015, and her apartment became de-controlled, subject now to market rates. We just rented this 3rd floor walk-up, 700 sft apartment for $2500 a month after some renovations that cost us around $15K (new appliances, hardwoods, bathroom grouting, new ceiling in the living room, new coats of paint). The new tenants who just moved to NYC from the midwest, a young couple, have a 2 year lease and prepaid us a year's rent, with payment guaranty from a third party. They paid a broker, 15% of the annual rent as the broker's finder's fee for this rental.

Rent control apartments can be transferred to relatives who live in the apartment with the primary rent control tenant. You just can't go out a get a rent control apartment from someone who has that benefit. It has been reported that landlords wishing to remove rent control tenants will go to great lengths, financial and in some cases quite unsavory, to have a rent control apartment de-controlled.

rgs92
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by rgs92 » Wed Aug 24, 2016 1:07 pm

Move to Forest Hills Queens. It's a very nice safe place and not outrageously expensive. LGA and JFK are easy to get to, and, if needed, just take the subway to Penn Station (1 no-change train trip of about 45 minutes and grab the train to EWR [Newark Liberty Airport].)
No car needed to live there.

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Rob5TCP
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by Rob5TCP » Wed Aug 24, 2016 2:03 pm

Rent controlled apartments are impossible to get. Rent STABILIZED are available, but difficult.
There are stories of rent controlled apartments of 3 bedrooms on 5th Ave., for $900 a month but they are as rare as finding a diamond on the street.
Rent stabilized are still fairly common, but take a lot of looking to find/rent.
I'm in a rent stabilized and I pay less than half market rent.
I am not asking for people's opinion of rent stabilization. If the law is there I will use it to the best advantage I can.
You might contact some people you know about waiting lists for these apts.
Fair market are going up all over the place and are not hard to find or get into. But, the rent, as you know is sky high.
I don't know what the wait is, but Stuyvesant Town again starting taking names for their rent stabilized apts. It's worth a check.

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slayed
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by slayed » Wed Aug 24, 2016 2:31 pm

there has been a bit of hype around WeLive (it's sort of like luxury dorm living for adults). you could check it out. https://www.welive.com/
WeLive is a new way of living built upon community, flexibility, and a fundamental belief that we are only as good as the people we surround ourselves with. We know life is better when we are part of a community that believes in something larger than itself. From mailrooms and laundry rooms that double as bars and event spaces to communal kitchens, roof decks, and hot tubs, WeLive challenges traditional apartment living through physical spaces that foster meaningful relationships. Whether for a day, a week, a month, or a year, by joining WeLive - you’ll be psyched to be alive.
the nice thing about it is the units are furnished and you don't have to commit to a long term lease. so maybe try it as an initial landing spot when you are in NYC to figure out what you want to do.

ny_rn
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by ny_rn » Wed Aug 24, 2016 2:50 pm

JJP wrote:Hey everyone,

As I mentioned in another thread, I should be finally starting my dream job shortly. This will require me to move to the NYC area where I will need easy access to all 3 airports, LaGuardia, Kennedy, and sometimes Newark. I've always wanted to live in NYC but could never justify it. Now, I have a chance. My problem is that I cannot for the life of me figure out how to find a decent place and decide whether to buy or rent.

I've decided that throwing away $3500 a month in rent isn't worth it. So should I buy? I'd like Manhattan living, but I've never lived there before. I'm a believer of trying before buying, but again, can't justify throwing all of that rent away. It appears that 1 bedroom apartments in Manhattan are going for 800-900k which seems high. Another option would be living on Long Island and driving or taking the LIRR to the airports (I know I'd need to connect from LIRR to subway/bus). This could be an option because I would not have to get rid of my car and could be potentially much cheaper. I would consider renting, not buying on Long Island.

Given all of this, I'm in my late 20s, single, and basically free to do whatever I want. However, I'm to the point where I'd prefer not to have roommates. Price point wise, anything under $3.5-4k a month would probably work. although I'd like to keep it below $3k.

Any tips for tackling this NYC monster?
Here are a few tips:

- Live in Brooklyn or Manhattan.
- My "luxury" 1 bd in Crown Heights, Brooklyn is $2,300. I have a balcony, washer/dryer, central a/c, etc. Very safe. You have no problem with getting a nice place for the low end of your budget.
- Consider Crown Heights, Prospect Heights, Park Slope. All are very close to lower Manhattan.
- Take car service to JFK/LGA ($35).
- If you do end up living in Manhattan, you will be pressured to spend a little more money on happy hours, etc. I had a beer last night that was $8.
- Stay close to a train station (express train if needed).
- Always carry cash.

Zott
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by Zott » Wed Aug 24, 2016 10:25 pm

How is Tudor City nowadays? I used to work in the area and thought it was a great neighborhood (UN area). I see studios and 1BR's for rent at under 3,000.

travellight
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by travellight » Wed Aug 24, 2016 10:30 pm

I am also looking at NYC and generally feel it is great to be in Manhattan rather than too far out. I would consider nice areas just on the other side of the river in Brooklyn or even LIC.
364

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Rob5TCP
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by Rob5TCP » Wed Aug 24, 2016 10:34 pm

Zott wrote:How is Tudor City nowadays? I used to work in the area and thought it was a great neighborhood (UN area). I see studios and 1BR's for rent at under 3,000.
I lived a number of years at 5 Tudor City Place (hence Rob5TCP)
The problem is size.

The studio I bought was less than 200 square feet-- 200-300 for a studio is the norm there.
The one bedrooms are larger, but still rather on the small size.
I was 25 when I moved in and it was perfect. My job was 4 blocks away on East 43rd.

The location is great - UN across the street - Grand central 5 minute walk.
Crosstown and downtown buses right there.
Tons of restaurants nearby. If you really going to spend a lot night "out" or on the town;
this can be a great place to live.
When I originally moved in 1 bedroom were about $800 (mid 80's).

itsf8
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by itsf8 » Wed Aug 24, 2016 11:46 pm

While NYC is expensive, you can definitely find places less costly, and more interesting, outside Manhattan. Some have mentioned Brooklyn which is the 'hip' borough and long ago also become expensive. Astoria is great, especially for someone young, as is Sunnyside (not as known by super convenient and near Manhattan, Astoria, LIC and convenient by public transit or Uber to the airports. Also, sort of is and will soon become the next Williamsburg (lots of artists), but food shopping is not great in that area. Also, I love Jackson Heights-convenient to public transit or if you have a car, fabulous location if you like ethnic diversity, great food shopping, ethnic restaurant galore there and in nearby Woodside, Elmhurst (best Thai food in town), Sunnyside, etc. Forest Hills which someone mentioned is an option but a bit "suburban" and better if you have a family or JFK is your main go to airport. For Newark, scratch going by car/cab to avoid traffic and just take the train from Penn or a bus from midtown (unless rush hour in which case TRAFFIC.) Another option, Roosevelt Island - essentially car free and clean/quiet (cable car to Manhattan or F train but transit can be iffy if F if re-routed, especially weekends.) Enjoy your new life in NY.

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Pajamas
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by Pajamas » Thu Aug 25, 2016 12:50 am

If you are going to be flying out of all three airports, the best location for you is Manhattan. If you will be flying mostly out of just one or perhaps two of them, then it might be different.

If you will be flying for work, the expense of your transportation to the airport will probably be covered and you would probably take a car service of some sort. Your company would also arrange that if they are making the travel arrangements. You probably would not be taking trains unless you wanted to, but you might ask your employer about how it usually works.

Renting or buying in NYC is not like it is in other places. If you will be spending $3,000 a month for a rental, you will most likely need an income of $120,000 or have a guarantor and I think the requirements are higher for a guarantor. (That is why so many people here have roommates, even people over 30.) Vacancy rates here are low. You have to have everything ready to go if you find a great apartment at a reasonable price or it will probably be rented by someone else before you get everything together. Seriously, you have to be able to write a check for a deposit when you look at the apartment. Most people use a broker but you can also rent directly from a landlord and save fees but that limits the field. Also be aware that there are a lot of scams like people renting out apartments they don't actually have the right to rent. It's easier to run scams here because renting apartments is so difficult.

You should definitely rent before buying if you have never lived here, and maybe even take a sublet for a couple of months before really renting so you can find something to sign a lease on.

Buying can be really crazy even compared to renting. It can take several months, multiple lawyers are usually involved, and you need to understand the basics of condos vs. co-ops before you even start looking unless you are buying an actual house. It might also take a while to find something you like.

This seems to be a pretty good overview of the way it works: https://www.dnainfo.com/new-york/201404 ... -apartment

Here is a good overview of cost: http://ny.curbed.com/2016/8/11/12428444 ... -july-2016

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Rob5TCP
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by Rob5TCP » Thu Aug 25, 2016 9:07 am

If your in the millennial age group; this might be an interesting/fun alternative to a traditional apartment.

https://www.dnainfo.com/new-york/201608 ... s-included

remomnyc
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by remomnyc » Thu Aug 25, 2016 3:39 pm

1. RENT. Renting is not a waste of money, especially in NYC and especially given current price levels. Due to the high buying and selling costs, it only makes sense if you're staying 5 to 7 years minimum.
2. Ditch your car. Take M-60 bus to LaGuardia, subway to Air Train to JFK or EWR (if you need to do it economically) or Uber, taxi or car service if you're expensing it or can afford it.
3. Live in Manhattan, Brooklyn or Long Island City.
4. Use Streeteasy.com to find an apartment. Choose no fee options.
5. Enjoy your 20s in NYC!

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Pajamas
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by Pajamas » Thu Aug 25, 2016 4:15 pm

Just saw this map of average rents in various neighborhoods that might be helpful for you in getting a feel for it. Just remember that they are averages and there is a wide range.

http://ny.curbed.com/2016/8/24/12628842 ... =Curbed+NY

psteinx
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by psteinx » Thu Aug 25, 2016 4:23 pm

JJP wrote:I'm a believer of trying before buying, but again, can't justify throwing all of that rent away.
Paying money for rent is not throwing the money away - it's paying for a service. If you buy a home, you're still paying money, but in different ways (interest on a mortgage, and foregone earnings on the capital deployed for down payment and such, property taxes and other costs, etc.)

Yes, sometimes it makes sense to buy a home rather than rent, but usually that's moreso the case for when you're confident that both the location and the type/size of housing will stay constant for 5+ years. As a young person moving to a new city for a new job, while you hope things will work out, there are a lot of moving parts, and it would seem that renting (or splitting an apartment with roommates) for a while is more likely a good idea.
Last edited by psteinx on Fri Aug 26, 2016 12:02 am, edited 2 times in total.

GreenGrowTheDollars
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by GreenGrowTheDollars » Thu Aug 25, 2016 7:49 pm

Will you be out-of-town most of the week? Your own room in a shared apartment might get you a nicer space in a nicer place, and maybe a doorman building. (Really, really helpful for getting deliveries.)

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JJP
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by JJP » Thu Aug 25, 2016 8:28 pm

Thanks for the advice and links everyone. I will be working out of the airports and will be gone anywhere from 1 to 5 days at a time, and I am on my own for transportation to and from. I figured I'd use the subways/buses for most flights that are during business hours and use Uber/Lyft for those early mornings or late nights.

It sounds like I may be giving renting a shot for a year and we will see what happens.

Dimitri
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by Dimitri » Thu Aug 25, 2016 8:42 pm

I haven't been to New York City for many years. That said, I used to live at 300 E 75th Street - The Fairmont. It was a nice Upper East Side doorman building which was quite convenient to the subway (as mentioned in advert below) and shopping. If memory serves correct I was paying $1,550 for a one bedroom.

One Bedroom, $3,395/mo.
NEW JOB IN NYC? Walk to subway from this centrally located Upper East Side home. Separate kitchen has microwave,icemaker refrig and dishwasher ! Marble bath, and custom closets-plus bicycle and luggage storage.All new fitness center-with free weights and trainer.Marvel at our glorious city from the rooftop sunterrace. Avail. 08/26/16

http://www.glenwoodnyc.com/properties/u ... -fairmont/
Let's never come here again because it would never be as much fun.

abrix
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by abrix » Thu Aug 25, 2016 9:15 pm

I have lived in NYC since 2007, first in Astoria, then Sunnyside, and now in Long Island City. I agree that Astoria is just about the most convenient place you can be to get to LaGuardia and it's also easy to get to 34th Street there so you can get the NJ Transit to Newark ($13, was just there last month).

There are a ton of apartments available here in LIC and I have loved living here (just over a year now). Lots of young folks and a growing night life. I live one subway stop away from Manhattan and my apartment is on the river--two beautiful parks here and great views.

I disagree with the poster who mentioned airplane noise in Sunnyside. I lived there for 5 years and don't remember noticing or being bothered by that.

eskouster
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by eskouster » Thu Aug 25, 2016 9:38 pm

Check out Jackson Heights in Queens. It's a 10-minute express bus to LaGuardia (runs 24/7), and a 45-minute subway ride to JFK. Don't think you can do much better with public transportation. Great food too, if you like Thai or Indian.

Further from the airports is Long Island City. About 40 minutes to LaGuardia and an hour to JFK via subway and bus, though a cab isn't too much ($15 to LGA, $40 to JFK). Lots of nice new buildings and decent restaurants.

genjix
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by genjix » Fri Aug 26, 2016 5:51 am

I would recommend queens. Most flight attendants live in Kew gardens / Forest hills area because it's close to JFK and LaGuardia it's also a 25 min subway ride to midtown manhattan or 16 mins 1 stop on LIRR. If you want to be in queens but still closer to Manhattan look at long island city. 1 subway stop to Manhattan and luxury buildings, bit still in queens and can get to airports.
Also the luxury buildings in lic is in your price range and have in building parking garages although I don't know if they charge extra for that

Valuethinker
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by Valuethinker » Fri Aug 26, 2016 6:08 am

JJP wrote:Thanks for the advice and links everyone. I will be working out of the airports and will be gone anywhere from 1 to 5 days at a time, and I am on my own for transportation to and from. I figured I'd use the subways/buses for most flights that are during business hours and use Uber/Lyft for those early mornings or late nights.

It sounds like I may be giving renting a shot for a year and we will see what happens.
Long Island City has the feel of a place you might like. OK for the airports *and* the delights of NYC are very close when you are home.

Oakwood42
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by Oakwood42 » Thu Jul 11, 2019 1:25 pm

ChrisC wrote:
Wed Aug 24, 2016 12:53 pm
PoppyA wrote:I'd say you should live in Manhattan or Brooklyn. You are young, go for it. Don't compromise, live the dream. You will not regret it.

I agree, rent before you buy. You have to get a feel for all the ins & outs of NYC real estate. You might end up in a great rent controlled apartment you could keep a life time!
I agree with your post except for the rent control part. I know a little about rent control since we own a 4-family apartment bldg in Cobble Hill, Brooklyn, which was built around the turn of the 20th Century (1899). Multi-family apartment buildings built before 1947 were subject to rent control. But once a rent control tenant vacates that rent controlled unit, the apartment is no longer subject to rent control, generally. Our building was subject to rent control; over the years, we had three rent control tenants who vacated their units and these apartments were no longer under rent control. The last rent control unit became de-controlled last year: we had a family friend tenant who lived in our building for over 50 years; she paid the rent control rate of $242.50 a month for the last 15 years; when she first moved into the apartment, she paid $55 a month. She passed away at 94 years old in 2015, and her apartment became de-controlled, subject now to market rates. We just rented this 3rd floor walk-up, 700 sft apartment for $2500 a month after some renovations that cost us around $15K (new appliances, hardwoods, bathroom grouting, new ceiling in the living room, new coats of paint). The new tenants who just moved to NYC from the midwest, a young couple, have a 2 year lease and prepaid us a year's rent, with payment guaranty from a third party. They paid a broker, 15% of the annual rent as the broker's finder's fee for this rental.

Rent control apartments can be transferred to relatives who live in the apartment with the primary rent control tenant. You just can't go out a get a rent control apartment from someone who has that benefit. It has been reported that landlords wishing to remove rent control tenants will go to great lengths, financial and in some cases quite unsavory, to have a rent control apartment de-controlled.
Good insight!

Oakwood42
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by Oakwood42 » Thu Jul 11, 2019 2:00 pm

ny_rn wrote:
Wed Aug 24, 2016 2:50 pm
JJP wrote:Hey everyone,

As I mentioned in another thread, I should be finally starting my dream job shortly. This will require me to move to the NYC area where I will need easy access to all 3 airports, LaGuardia, Kennedy, and sometimes Newark. I've always wanted to live in NYC but could never justify it. Now, I have a chance. My problem is that I cannot for the life of me figure out how to find a decent place and decide whether to buy or rent.

I've decided that throwing away $3500 a month in rent isn't worth it. So should I buy? I'd like Manhattan living, but I've never lived there before. I'm a believer of trying before buying, but again, can't justify throwing all of that rent away. It appears that 1 bedroom apartments in Manhattan are going for 800-900k which seems high. Another option would be living on Long Island and driving or taking the LIRR to the airports (I know I'd need to connect from LIRR to subway/bus). This could be an option because I would not have to get rid of my car and could be potentially much cheaper. I would consider renting, not buying on Long Island.

Given all of this, I'm in my late 20s, single, and basically free to do whatever I want. However, I'm to the point where I'd prefer not to have roommates. Price point wise, anything under $3.5-4k a month would probably work. although I'd like to keep it below $3k.

Any tips for tackling this NYC monster?
Here are a few tips:

- Live in Brooklyn or Manhattan.
- My "luxury" 1 bd in Crown Heights, Brooklyn is $2,300. I have a balcony, washer/dryer, central a/c, etc. Very safe. You have no problem with getting a nice place for the low end of your budget.
- Consider Crown Heights, Prospect Heights, Park Slope. All are very close to lower Manhattan.
- Take car service to JFK/LGA ($35).
- If you do end up living in Manhattan, you will be pressured to spend a little more money on happy hours, etc. I had a beer last night that was $8.
- Stay close to a train station (express train if needed).
- Always carry cash.
"- Always carry cash."

Seems counter intuitive to the norm today - Any reason in particular you suggest?

bernoulli
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by bernoulli » Thu Jul 11, 2019 4:42 pm

Might consider areas in Queens like Forest Hill which is reasonably priced, close to Manhattan and train accessible. Also you can rent for a few months for a year to figure out the lay of the land then decide to buy a place. Co-Ops are the least expensive option and you can also sign up for the lottery system if your income meets certain requirements.

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beyou
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by beyou » Thu Jul 11, 2019 10:29 pm

bernoulli wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 4:42 pm
Might consider areas in Queens like Forest Hill which is reasonably priced, close to Manhattan and train accessible. Also you can rent for a few months for a year to figure out the lay of the land then decide to buy a place. Co-Ops are the least expensive option and you can also sign up for the lottery system if your income meets certain requirements.
+1 for Forest Hills, Queens. Right between the 2 major airports, options of both houses and apartment buildings, and possibility to keep a car. I did have to go on a very long waiting list for an indoor parking garage. Outdoor parking on street will not work for you if you have to be away overnight, since you need to move your car daily. Also note 30 mins to midtown Manhattan, so close to work and entertainment.

nexesn
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by nexesn » Thu Jul 11, 2019 11:23 pm

mcraepat9 wrote:
Wed Aug 24, 2016 9:27 am
JJP wrote:Hey everyone,

As I mentioned in another thread, I should be finally starting my dream job shortly. This will require me to move to the NYC area welcome!, it's a great place to live where I will need easy access to all 3 airports, LaGuardia, Kennedy, and sometimes Newark will you have a car? is your plan to use a car, cab or transit to get to the airports?. I've always wanted to live in NYC but could never justify it. Now, I have a chance. My problem is that I cannot for the life of me figure out how to find a decent place and decide whether to buy or rent.rent

I've decided that throwing away $3500 a month in rent isn't worth it. this is absolutely false. please read the many "Rent vs buy" threads on this forum as well as talk to numerous owners. renting is not "throwing money away". So should I buy? no, you are in your late 20s, there is no need to buy now I'd like Manhattan living, but I've never lived there before. yes you should try it if you can - it is a different lifestyle but one that is very well suited to your late 20s. I'm a believer of trying before buying, but again, can't justify throwing all of that rent away. you need to take a hard look at this thinking. this mindset will prevent you from thinking clearly about this. It appears that 1 bedroom apartments in Manhattan are going for 800-900k which seems high. correct, this is about right for a 1BR in a decent neighborhood and decent amenities Another option would be living on Long Island and driving or taking the LIRR to the airports (I know I'd need to connect from LIRR to subway/bus). This could be an option because I would not have to get rid of my car and could be potentially much cheaper. I would consider renting, not buying on Long Island. in my humble opinion, a late 20s single guy or girl would not enjoy living in the suburbs. you get what you pay for. moving to this region to live on long island i think would be a waste. if you can stomach the cost, live in the city.

Given all of this, I'm in my late 20s, single, and basically free to do whatever I want. However, I'm to the point where I'd prefer not to have roommates. Price point wise, anything under $3.5-4k a month would probably work. although I'd like to keep it below $3k.you can definitely find studios and 1BR below $4k in desirable neighborhoods, below $3k is a little harder but still doable. if you were to buy you would be looking at $9k per month PITI for the same apartment. get a one year lease in a fun neighborhood and live it up. i envy you.

Any tips for tackling this NYC monster? talk to friends, get you boots on the ground walking around neighborhoods you would want to live in and understand that NYC real estate is an exhausting process. if you are going to be in manhattan and carless, you may want to find a spot with easy access to penn station trains to EWR/JFK. there are also a handful of buses that go to the airports too from grand central and the port authority.
+1 To everything said here.
Don’t buy until you try the city.
Don’t live in the burbs when single.
Splurge and live in the city.
Nybits.com is a good resource for apartments that don’t charge broker fees (broker fees tend to be about 14% of annualized rent for a year). It’s a one time cost, but best to avoid if you can.
I have no idea of your personality, but living downtown is great. Upper east side is also nice and much cheaper.

Good luck.

nexesn
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by nexesn » Thu Jul 11, 2019 11:30 pm

JJP wrote:
Thu Aug 25, 2016 8:28 pm
Thanks for the advice and links everyone. I will be working out of the airports and will be gone anywhere from 1 to 5 days at a time, and I am on my own for transportation to and from. I figured I'd use the subways/buses for most flights that are during business hours and use Uber/Lyft for those early mornings or late nights.

It sounds like I may be giving renting a shot for a year and we will see what happens.

Something really nice about renting in NYC is you can neighborhood hop. You can try a neighborhood for a year, then move to another if you don’t like where you are.

Definitely rent. You will quickly realize that you are not loosing anything by buying right now.

ohai
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by ohai » Thu Jul 11, 2019 11:36 pm

"No office for me. I'll be heading to the airports for work then going "home" to my apartment in the city."

OP, given this situation, it makes the most sense for you to live in Queens, or maybe some north part of Brooklyn. Rent for a 1br apartment can be less than $3k. You will probably be able to pay for a parking space for $300 a month or less. You can still go to Manhattan for fun whenever you want, although if you ask me, Queens has more interesting and affordable things to do, in terms of food at least. Owning a car will make you much more mobile in the outer city or outside the city. Public transportation works, technically, but it is unpleasant, stressful, and always involves a lot of tiresome walking, fighting crowds, and stair climbing, to the point that you won't want to do anything on the weekend or outside work.

One downside of Queens is that it will take a longer time to get to Newark Airport, but it sounds like you will not go there so often compared to the other airports.

Buying an apartment is very unlikely to make sense for you. Cap rates for residential real estate are generally lower than 3%. The breakeven time for buy vs rent is 7 years or longer. There will be some kinds of properties where the economics will be better, but probably still unlikely to make sense for you.

ohai
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by ohai » Thu Jul 11, 2019 11:44 pm

Zott wrote:
Wed Aug 24, 2016 10:25 pm
How is Tudor City nowadays? I used to work in the area and thought it was a great neighborhood (UN area). I see studios and 1BR's for rent at under 3,000.
To me, Tudor City is awful. There is 24 hour traffic, a huge tunnel entrance with honking beeping, and is isolated from public transportation. When something in NY is cheaper than other things, there is generally a good reason.

bowman
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by bowman » Fri Jul 12, 2019 11:53 am

Late 20s, single, budget topping out at 3.5 to 4K? Absolutely ignore all the advice about Forest Hills and the like. Please. My generic advice for your situation would be East Village or LES. But depends on your style. Try living in one of those two and you can move after a year. Take a look on Streeteasy for prices/size

nyclon
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by nyclon » Fri Jul 12, 2019 12:44 pm

JJP wrote:
Wed Aug 24, 2016 9:18 am
Hey everyone,

As I mentioned in another thread, I should be finally starting my dream job shortly. This will require me to move to the NYC area where I will need easy access to all 3 airports, LaGuardia, Kennedy, and sometimes Newark. I've always wanted to live in NYC but could never justify it. Now, I have a chance. My problem is that I cannot for the life of me figure out how to find a decent place and decide whether to buy or rent.

I've decided that throwing away $3500 a month in rent isn't worth it. So should I buy? I'd like Manhattan living, but I've never lived there before. I'm a believer of trying before buying, but again, can't justify throwing all of that rent away. It appears that 1 bedroom apartments in Manhattan are going for 800-900k which seems high. Another option would be living on Long Island and driving or taking the LIRR to the airports (I know I'd need to connect from LIRR to subway/bus). This could be an option because I would not have to get rid of my car and could be potentially much cheaper. I would consider renting, not buying on Long Island.

Given all of this, I'm in my late 20s, single, and basically free to do whatever I want. However, I'm to the point where I'd prefer not to have roommates. Price point wise, anything under $3.5-4k a month would probably work. although I'd like to keep it below $3k.

Any tips for tackling this NYC monster?
If your dream has been to live in NYC then you should try Manhattan (south of central park) for at least your first year there. As they say, you don't know what you don't know. As you say - try before you buy - apply that to the geography you're choosing by living in the heart of NYC first. Manhattan is an incredible part of NYC.

If you're open to renting in LI then you're open to renting, period. And that should translate to being open to renting in Manhattan. What you're experiencing is sticker shock. The economics of buying vs renting are very similar in both places, one happens to be more expensive to buy, so simplify your decision process:

1. Choose where you want to live (LI, Manhattan, etc)
2. Rent for a year wherever you choose, ignore the sticker shock since you can clearly afford it

Use streeteasy.com to find a place.

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leeks
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by leeks » Fri Jul 12, 2019 12:54 pm

Rent for sure. Maybe consider buying after you have lived here a few years.

If you are single, pick a neighborhood based on your recreational/social preferences.

If you are a solitary type who likes personal space and privacy, driving to beaches and/or hiking areas, would enjoy reading books on your commute, and wants to keep a car for non-commute purposes, consider Westchester or Nassau County within walking distance to a Metro North or LIRR station.

If you want to be more social (including easier dating options), live within a short subway commute of work in Brooklyn, Jersey City, or Western Queens (Sunnyside/Woodside area is more affordable than Long Island City or Astoria and still has a good commute and social vibe). If you want to be around lots of hip younger people, rent in Bushwick.

A roommate gets you more space for less money than a studio apt. If it were me moving here as a single person, I would put my stuff and car in storage, sublet a furnished room with roommates for 3-6 months (from someone traveling or something, you see plenty of these listings), and learn about neighborhoods/commutes before committing to a place. Not all but many apartments are going to require a broker fee of one month's rent to move in on your own lease, which means the transaction cost of moving is high (so you don't want to commit too much to a neighborhood you might not like). A sublet at first postpones that cost until you are sure about living alone vs roommates, which neighborhood, if you will keep the car, etc.

DXG1987
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Re: NYC Living Options

Post by DXG1987 » Fri Jul 12, 2019 1:25 pm

I am in my early 30's and spent much of my 20's living in NYC. Based on your commute, I would suggest Long Island City. It is filled with people your age, the buildings are very new, have nice amenities, and keeping your car will be easier than in other locations.

The E will take you to the JFK Airtrain. You'll also be close to the "Express" buses to LaGuardia.

If you are willing to part with your car, midtown east would be an option as well.

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