Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

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WolfgangPauli
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Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by WolfgangPauli » Sun May 12, 2019 9:11 pm

Hi,

Looking to get a new car and I do drive quite a bit (16k to 18k miles per year) so I want a bit of luxury and all the newest safety features. I really like the S90 T5 and the dealer has an incredible deal on a 2018 to move off the lot. There are two things that make me question it: 1) I know this should not matter but it is made in China. Anyone have any experience with a car made in China and quality? 2) 4cyl engine. Yes, it is turbo charged and no, I do not run my cars like race cars but does anyone have any experience with this?

The inside is the most luxurious and spacious I have seen in a long time. The Pilot Assist brings the car pretty close to driving itself on the highway.

Any thoughts on Volvo would be greatly appreciated.
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Scrapr
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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by Scrapr » Sun May 12, 2019 10:42 pm

You are asking the wrong person here....me! I love my Volvos. Currently have '17 V60 wagon with the 4 cylinder. No issues for me. A bit of turbo lag. I'm used to it. Most of the time it's one particular freeway on ramp.I love the safety features. China doesn't bother me. One report had build quality slightly better in China than Europe factories.

Doesn't look as if the S90 is on the Overseas Delivery list. If available that would be my first choice. We were supposed to pick up DW XC60 T6 in a few weeks in Sweden. We are not going to be able to make it.But will pick it up at the dealer about 8-10 weeks from our delivery date

I have had 2 Volvos go 300k miles. I used to do 40-50k miles a year. I still miss my 05 XC90. Just tonight I was looking at an older XC90 and thinking...I wonder if he would sell that to me

edit: Swedespeed has a good forum for all things Volvo https://forums.swedespeed.com/forumdisp ... SPA-2017-)

researcher
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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by researcher » Mon May 13, 2019 7:41 am

WolfgangPauli wrote:
Sun May 12, 2019 9:11 pm
I really like the S90 T5 and the dealer has an incredible deal on a 2018 to move off the lot. There are two things that make me question it: 1) I know this should not matter but it is made in China. Anyone have any experience with a car made in China and quality? 2) 4cyl engine. Yes, it is turbo charged and no, I do not run my cars like race cars but does anyone have any experience with this?

The inside is the most luxurious and spacious I have seen in a long time. The Pilot Assist brings the car pretty close to driving itself on the highway.

Any thoughts on Volvo would be greatly appreciated.
I don't have any first-hand experience, but virtually everything I've read about the latest crop of Volvo vehicles has been positive.

However, I think you should go for the V90 wagon version. It looks incredible (better than the sedan) and has lots of versatile cargo space.

RJC
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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by RJC » Mon May 13, 2019 8:08 am

I know a few folks that have Volvos and reliability is an issue. I believe Consumer Reports also have them near the bottom for reliability.

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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by caffeperfavore » Mon May 13, 2019 8:42 am

Are you sure that S90s are made in China (at least any that are shipped here)? Many are still made in Sweden. Some are made in South Carolina.

I too would choose the V90 wagon over the sedan. More cargo and it looks great, much better than the sedan. Wagons are cool.

Volvo's reliability in general would be my only concern. It seems that Volvo is near the bottom of many lists, although I would only be concerned if it involves drivetrain or big issues (e.g., a lot of vehicles are punished for their entertainment systems).

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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by ohai » Mon May 13, 2019 10:45 am

Some Volvo cars or parts of Volvo cars are made in China, but I doubt that Volvo manufactures more in China than the average car brand. Of course, Volvo, the company, is now owned by a Chinese conglomerate.

I don't think that the country of ownership really has to affect quality. What does matter is the company's strategic direction for the brand. In this case, Volvo's owners intend to elevate the brand to become a Mercedes or BMW competitor through compelling luxury features and cutting edge technology. As a result, they are relying on new engineering with questionable long term reliability. Based on Consumer Reports, Volvo is last in reliability, below even Tesla. Although imperfect, these statistically conducted surveys are a better indicator of reliability than anecdotes (i.e. "well, I have had Volvo with no issues").

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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by camden » Mon May 13, 2019 1:15 pm

My wife has a 2017 T5 (her 6th Volvo). Loves it. As a 2017, hers was assembled in Sweden, not in China, though the latter would not bother me. Having driven it a fair bit, I can certainly speak to the engine, which runs smoothly and with the feel of smooth acceleration and good power. Think you will like it. I liked hers so well that I bought one for myself, though mine is a T6 of the same model year.

When it comes to reliability, anecdotal experience is simply that, and far less valuable than statistical evidence, IF such evidence is well collected, based on proper methodology, and unbiased. Having said that, the first 20,000 miles of hers and 12,000 of mine have been without any problems at all.

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RootSki
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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by RootSki » Mon May 13, 2019 4:10 pm

Volvo is more Swedish now than during the Ford years.

My 2010 XC60 T6 with 173K miles on it has been the most reliable car I’ve owned. Most fun too. Volvo has been turbocharging cars for a really long time now. They know what they are doing with boost.

V90 T6 R-Design would be my choice.

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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by JohnFiscal » Mon May 13, 2019 4:31 pm

FWIW, I love my 2011 S60 T6. The first year of that particular model run.

I love the T6. I've always driven 4 cyl small cars. The V6 with turbo is especially nice for me now. The T5 version of this car had 250 hp versus the 300 of the T6, but I think the power delivery is smoother with the 6.

I'll definitely consider a Volvo next time around (they may change with my retirement $$)

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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by TomatoTomahto » Mon May 13, 2019 4:38 pm

We’ve had good luck with Volvo’s. One thing I didn’t see mentioned is that Volvo seats are comfortable, more comfortable than my Tesla or DW’s Range Rover. Or Mercedes. Definitely better than BMW. and the list goes on.
Okay, I get it; I won't be political or controversial. The Earth is flat.

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msi
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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by msi » Mon May 13, 2019 4:45 pm

One of the best-looking sedans available, but... Consumer Reports gives the S90 a 1/5 for reliability (worst possible score).

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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by rgs92 » Mon May 13, 2019 4:58 pm

Have the changed the strange, intrusive left footrest? For 20+ years now, every time I sat in a Volvo my left foot was forced up (and to the right, inward) by this overly aggressive footrest that I guess was supposed to be good for me ergonomically.

It made the driving position unacceptable.
The seats were very comfortable though otherwise.

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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by Arboecars » Mon May 13, 2019 7:34 pm

Negative/ questionable feedback on the S90, so far.
Stick with an off lease 2017/18 Volvo S80.

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WolfgangPauli
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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by WolfgangPauli » Mon May 13, 2019 8:39 pm

100% sure its final assembly point is Daqing China....

If I could figure out how to upload a picture I would do that to show..

I need to get the CR on this.

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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by TheGreyingDuke » Mon May 13, 2019 9:33 pm

WolfgangPauli wrote:
Mon May 13, 2019 8:39 pm
100% sure its final assembly point is Daqing China....
All those listed for sale show a leading "L" on the VIN, that's China.
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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by WolfgangPauli » Mon May 13, 2019 9:37 pm

TheGreyingDuke wrote:
Mon May 13, 2019 9:33 pm
WolfgangPauli wrote:
Mon May 13, 2019 8:39 pm
100% sure its final assembly point is Daqing China....
All those listed for sale show a leading "L" on the VIN, that's China.
Yes, the VIN starts with a L.. It is China.. Any thoughts on that? Quality seems pristine but then again it is just looks.. I am not a "Car guy". Are there any fully assembled chinese cars being sold in the US?
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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by randomguy » Mon May 13, 2019 11:05 pm

WolfgangPauli wrote:
Mon May 13, 2019 9:37 pm
TheGreyingDuke wrote:
Mon May 13, 2019 9:33 pm
WolfgangPauli wrote:
Mon May 13, 2019 8:39 pm
100% sure its final assembly point is Daqing China....
All those listed for sale show a leading "L" on the VIN, that's China.
Yes, the VIN starts with a L.. It is China.. Any thoughts on that? Quality seems pristine but then again it is just looks.. I am not a "Car guy". Are there any fully assembled chinese cars being sold in the US?
Buick sells a some chinese made cars. Honestly you are worrying about a nonissue. It isn't chinese assembly that is going to cause issues. It is volvo engineering. If you look at all of their releases in the past 5 years, none have been very reliable and it doesn't matter if the car is made Sweden or China.

Every maker has rumors that cars made in different locations (germany, south africa, US, Japan, Mexico,...) are higher or lower quality than the ones built elsewhere. There isn't much data to back up that view point. Toyota can make reliable cars with both Japanese and US workers. Volvo can make unreliable ones with both Swedish and Chinese workers.

Note that reliability and quality aren't quite the same. Quality is using good materials and assembling them to good tolerances. Reliability is that after you do that, the car still works after you put a few miles on it:) If I bought a Volvo, I would get the 8 year warranty (think they offer unlimited miles options) and plan on dumping it at the end. Maybe they have fixed all the teething issues that effected the first couple model years but I wouldn't bet on it.

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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by ssquared87 » Mon May 13, 2019 11:27 pm

I considered an S90 but ruled it out in favor of a BMW 530 which is roughly the same price.

I love the s90 exterior and interior design...probably the best interior out there. I found the engine to be extremely unrefined though in comparison to the bmw which also uses a 4–cyl turbo. The bmw is smoother has no turbo lag like the Volvo, and has a more linear power delivery. I also found the sensus system to be extremely laggy and somewhat of a distraction Audi MMI and BMW iDrive systems are much better. Volvo upgraded the system last year but reviewers say it’s still laggy. The BMW 5 and Mercedes E also have better seats than the Volvo when equipped with multi contour seat option.

The other thing that concerned me with Volvo is the reliability. They are dead last on consumer reports while Bmw and Audi are ranked 7&8 and have been up there for several years.

If Volvo were put a decent engine in the car and improve the sensus system, I’d probably take the chance on reliability, but overall I didn’t think the package was as compelling as the BMW 5 or the Mercedes E. I looked at the Audi A6 too but wasn’t impressed

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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by TheGreyingDuke » Tue May 14, 2019 7:17 am

WolfgangPauli wrote:
Mon May 13, 2019 9:37 pm
TheGreyingDuke wrote:
Mon May 13, 2019 9:33 pm
WolfgangPauli wrote:
Mon May 13, 2019 8:39 pm
100% sure its final assembly point is Daqing China....
All those listed for sale show a leading "L" on the VIN, that's China.
Yes, the VIN starts with a L.. It is China.. Any thoughts on that? Quality seems pristine but then again it is just looks.. I am not a "Car guy". Are there any fully assembled chinese cars being sold in the US?
As others have said, there is no evidence that one assembly site is better than another. From time to time a problem emerges unique to one plant but there is no way to predict that.

The frequent disparaging of made in China-made products misses the point: if you want cheap and quick, China can do that probably better than anyplace. If you want high standards and quality assembly, China can do that. From airplane wings to landing on the dark side of the moon, they have the capability of high-quality manufacturing and assembly. It is the often foreign companies (think Walmart) companies that demand ever cheaper prices that drive the quality down.

In the case of Volvo, they are owned by a Chinese company (Geely) and they have good reason to protect the valuable brand they purchased.
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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by Cycle » Tue May 14, 2019 8:07 am

China makes more cars than the US, Japan, and Germany combined. 28 million last year. They also will have 5x the battery manufacturing volume of the US in 2023. Just saying they know a thing or two about making cars...

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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by cantos » Tue May 14, 2019 8:26 am

Perhaps the most sophisticated piece of modern technology, the iPhone, is made in China. But oh no, you best stay away from China made products.

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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by RootSki » Tue May 14, 2019 8:36 am

RE: Consumer Reports (subjective) "Reliability"

Volvo S90 2016 owner: "Spotify took 30 seconds to load. I have had 2 software updates to fix it"
Consumers Reports: "Totally unacceptable" :shock:

Lexus RX 2015 owner: "My 80's Casio style clock is flawless"
Consumers Reports: "Oh yeah, now we are talking" :oops:
Image

----------

To the poster below how said that BMW and MB "upgraded" seats are "better" than the Volvo stock seats. I feel like this isn't a fair comparison. To be fair, you should them against the luxury (Inscription) seats.

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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by ssquared87 » Tue May 14, 2019 9:04 am

RootSki wrote:
Tue May 14, 2019 8:36 am
To the poster below how said that BMW and MB "upgraded" seats are "better" than the Volvo stock seats. I feel like this isn't a fair comparison. To be fair, you should them against the luxury (Inscription) seats.
Forgot that OP was looking at momentum. My comparison was with the inscription as that was the trim I was considering. The Volvo seats were very good, but not nearly as good as the MB and BMW. For some reason I remember the Volvo seats being better in the older models, but they’ve changed something in the design.

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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by ResearchMed » Tue May 14, 2019 9:19 am

ssquared87 wrote:
Tue May 14, 2019 9:04 am
RootSki wrote:
Tue May 14, 2019 8:36 am
To the poster below how said that BMW and MB "upgraded" seats are "better" than the Volvo stock seats. I feel like this isn't a fair comparison. To be fair, you should them against the luxury (Inscription) seats.
Forgot that OP was looking at momentum. My comparison was with the inscription as that was the trim I was considering. The Volvo seats were very good, but not nearly as good as the MB and BMW. For some reason I remember the Volvo seats being better in the older models, but they’ve changed something in the design.
Yup, the seats have changed.

We've got a 2014 XC60T, with those *very* comfy leather seats.
And the loaners we've usually gotten also had those seats.

But about 2-3 weeks ago, they loaned us a brand new XC60 Polestar. WHAT a car! It almost sells itself, except that we weren't looking for a new one - although we did joke about it precisely because of that loaner!

But the seats were not nearly as comfortable. More adjustments, I think, including something weird about the front "edge" (under the forward part of the thighs). Maybe IF we had bothered to learn the details and make personal adjustments?
But the seat just didn't have the same comfy "feel" in terms of "sinking into it/having it wrap a bit", and that front thingie adjustment kept it quite firm-to-hard where it was not comfortable.
We had noticed the same thing when we test drove the first year's "new model" XC90 about 3-4 years ago.

And I still wish I could "special order" fabric seats. Those old Volvo fabric seats could handle just about any abuse (from toddlers to Great Danes!).
To me, it's not "vinyl is cheap leather", it's "leather is expensive vinyl" (or whatever the synthetic material is).
Cold to the touch in winter, and *burning* hot in the summer sun.
Do the perforated leather seats really avoid the sticky/sweaty feeling in humid summer weather?

RM
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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by pochax » Tue May 14, 2019 9:50 am

i just got a 2019 XC60 T6 so it is not apples to apples but since most current Volvo models share many features i think i can comment on your 2 questions:
1) i have no idea if my model was made in China (no "L" in the VIN, mine has a "Y") but even if it was, the fit and finish of the model is exquisite and well done. remember you will have a 4yr/50k mile warranty with Volvo.
2) i have the T6 which is supercharged and turbocharged which has all but made the turbo-lag obsolete but i don't think the T5 will be that bad. you really should test-drive it first and see if the acceleration dynamics bother you. but being a 250+hp engine, unless you are a power-user/thrill-seeker, should be plenty for your day-to-day driving.

good luck - as a brand i think Volvo is making good strides in the right direction. the value proposition when compared to other european automakers like Audi and BMW is quite good. Audi may be more comparable since BMW and MercedesBenz are a slightly higher price point for similar equipment.

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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by TheGreyingDuke » Tue May 14, 2019 10:01 am

pochax wrote:
Tue May 14, 2019 9:50 am
i just got a 2019 XC60 T6 so it is not apples to apples but since most current Volvo models share many features i think i can comment on your 2 questions:
1) i have no idea if my model was made in China (no "L" in the VIN, mine has a "Y") but even if it was, the fit and finish of the model is exquisite and well done. remember you will have a 4yr/50k mile warranty with Volvo.
2) i have the T6 which is supercharged and turbocharged which has all but made the turbo-lag obsolete but i don't think the T5 will be that bad. you really should test-drive it first and see if the acceleration dynamics bother you. but being a 250+hp engine, unless you are a power-user/thrill-seeker, should be plenty for your day-to-day driving.

good luck - as a brand i think Volvo is making good strides in the right direction. the value proposition when compared to other european automakers like Audi and BMW is quite good. Audi may be more comparable since BMW and MercedesBenz are a slightly higher price point for similar equipment.
That would be Sweden.

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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by RootSki » Tue May 14, 2019 10:10 am

If anyone want to know when and where any Volvo was made, they have a very easy to use VIN Decoder tool on the Volvo Bookstore.

https://www.volvotechinfo.com/index.cfm ... vinDecoder

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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by Scrapr » Tue May 14, 2019 11:22 am

RootSki wrote:
Tue May 14, 2019 8:36 am
RE: Consumer Reports (subjective) "Reliability"

Volvo S90 2016 owner: "Spotify took 30 seconds to load. I have had 2 software updates to fix it"
Consumers Reports: "Totally unacceptable" :shock:

Lexus RX 2015 owner: "My 80's Casio style clock is flawless"
Consumers Reports: "Oh yeah, now we are talking" :oops:
LOL

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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by TheOscarGuy » Tue May 14, 2019 11:34 am

RootSki wrote:
Tue May 14, 2019 8:36 am

Lexus RX 2015 owner: "My 80's Casio style clock is flawless"
Hey now, some of us are still rockin the casio style watch :D

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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by InvisibleAerobar » Tue May 14, 2019 2:12 pm

RootSki wrote:
Tue May 14, 2019 8:36 am
RE: Consumer Reports (subjective) "Reliability"

Volvo S90 2016 owner: "Spotify took 30 seconds to load. I have had 2 software updates to fix it"
Consumers Reports: "Totally unacceptable" :shock:

Lexus RX 2015 owner: "My 80's Casio style clock is flawless"
Consumers Reports: "Oh yeah, now we are talking" :oops:
Jest aside, does anyone know why Volvos get dinged on reliability? Is it the major component reliability (engine, transmission, steering, shocks, etc.) or is it more reliability of the "nice to have" components (user interface, etc)? Consumer Report really doesn't say, other than a mark.

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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by frequentT » Tue May 14, 2019 3:56 pm

I have owned this 2018 model for 18 months and have 19,300 miles on it. There have been no issues so far with it. It is a pleasure to drive and great on the road. The engine is both turbo and super charged. Plenty peppy. The seats were big selling features as have made some long trips (2900,2000, 1200) very comfortably. We like the versatility for cargo, pulling a trailer, and occasionally needing room for 6 or 7.

The only negative which you will see mentioned (for 2017s) is the electronic user interface. It is not intuitive and slow to spool up after starting the car. The dealer has told me the design goal was to minimize dash controls and help the driver keep eyes ahead....the controls work just fine, but take effort to learn.

The safety features are superb and the adaptive cruise is easy to use. The cameras that look around corners and sense cars and pedestrians when reversing have saved me multiple times.

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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by pochax » Tue May 14, 2019 5:30 pm

frequentT wrote:
Tue May 14, 2019 3:56 pm
I have owned this 2018 model for 18 months and have 19,300 miles on it. There have been no issues so far with it. It is a pleasure to drive and great on the road. The engine is both turbo and super charged. Plenty peppy. The seats were big selling features as have made some long trips (2900,2000, 1200) very comfortably. We like the versatility for cargo, pulling a trailer, and occasionally needing room for 6 or 7.

The only negative which you will see mentioned (for 2017s) is the electronic user interface. It is not intuitive and slow to spool up after starting the car. The dealer has told me the design goal was to minimize dash controls and help the driver keep eyes ahead....the controls work just fine, but take effort to learn.

The safety features are superb and the adaptive cruise is easy to use. The cameras that look around corners and sense cars and pedestrians when reversing have saved me multiple times.
the 2019 model i have does not suffer from the slow boot up - my dealer tech rep told me they did some upgrade (RAM, CPU? can't remember exactly) but i would say the system is up and running in ~15-20 secs which is when i pretty much start pulling out of my parking spot.

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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by ssquared87 » Tue May 14, 2019 7:13 pm

pochax wrote:
Tue May 14, 2019 5:30 pm
frequentT wrote:
Tue May 14, 2019 3:56 pm
I have owned this 2018 model for 18 months and have 19,300 miles on it. There have been no issues so far with it. It is a pleasure to drive and great on the road. The engine is both turbo and super charged. Plenty peppy. The seats were big selling features as have made some long trips (2900,2000, 1200) very comfortably. We like the versatility for cargo, pulling a trailer, and occasionally needing room for 6 or 7.

The only negative which you will see mentioned (for 2017s) is the electronic user interface. It is not intuitive and slow to spool up after starting the car. The dealer has told me the design goal was to minimize dash controls and help the driver keep eyes ahead....the controls work just fine, but take effort to learn.

The safety features are superb and the adaptive cruise is easy to use. The cameras that look around corners and sense cars and pedestrians when reversing have saved me multiple times.
the 2019 model i have does not suffer from the slow boot up - my dealer tech rep told me they did some upgrade (RAM, CPU? can't remember exactly) but i would say the system is up and running in ~15-20 secs which is when i pretty much start pulling out of my parking spot.
The infotainment is still extremely slow compared to its competitors. My 2011 BMW 328 was ready to go in less than 5 seconds, my 2017 BMW 530 is ready to go in less than 1 second as was the 2017 Audi A4 I had as a rental. I test drove the Mercedes E when I was shopping but I can't remember much about the infotainment, the sales guy was distracting me and I didn't like how it drove anyway so I discounted it pretty quickly.

The engine in the Volvo is certainly powerful enough, but the 4cylinder BMW and Audi equivalents are smoother, quieter, and put out a bit more power (the specs BMW and Audi state are almost the same as Volvo, but BMW and Audi understate the actual numbers so they're putting out a decent amount of extra power over the stated figures). Mercedes 4-cyl is smoother than the Volvo, but not even close to the BMW and Audi.

Agreed that the Volvo has comfortable seats, but again, the Multi Contour seats in the BMW and Mercedes are better. The Audi A6 seats felt closer to the current Volvo seats from what I remember. For whatever reason, the last gen Volvo seats were much better than the current gen, and arguably the best on the market.

I think the Volvo is a nice car, but unless you're in love with the interior, I see no reason to get one over its German counterparts. The pricing may be slightly cheaper, but the MSRP on the Germans don't really mean anything, you can negotiate pretty significant discounts, many times below invoice due to manufacturer credits and unadvertised promotions. Basically take the MSRP of a 5 series or E class and subtract 9-12%. The A6 just came out this year so pricing may be a bit more challenging, but I wouldn't consider it. Their new dual touchscreen infotainment system is a massive distraction compared to their old MMI interface which was excellent.

spooky105
Posts: 119
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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by spooky105 » Tue May 14, 2019 9:27 pm

My take on the Volvo reliability discussion after having researched an SPA XC90 over the course of several months and settled on buying a CPO 2018:

Volvo moved to a new architecture in MY2016 with the XC90 leading the charge. The 90-series vehicles are built on this architecture, with a similar re-design of the 60-series vehicles and finally the XC40. This overhaul is now complete across the entire product lineup.

As one might expect, not everything worked as planned once thousands of MY2016 XC90s were released into the wild -- plenty of software bugs existed, lots of check engine lights went off, sunroofs leaked, seats didn't hold up as expected, air suspension components didn't function properly, etc. This isn't to say all of these things failed on all vehicles, but rather that the interplay of thousands of newly designed components didn't all come together as imagined on the drawing board. And lots of customers experienced lots of issues. But again, as one might expect, Volvo systematically looked at these issues, determined where the trend lines were, and re-engineered & replaced components as required under warranty, with subsequent model years incorporating these changes. A lot of this was sorted out during the MY2016 & MY2017 vehicles, with the majority of the dust since settled. As lessons were learned on the XC90, these were applied to the other 90 series vehicles that were released later as well as the re-designed 60-series vehicles that followed.

When you look at reliability rankings from a company like CR, I believe the above history heavily impacts their viewpoint. An alternative perspective is that Volvo has successfully weathered the growing pains of completely redesigning the architecture of all of their vehicles and is now well-positioned to deliver a reliable vehicle built on an architecture capable of meeting present and future market demands.

I recommend you get on the swedespeed forum and do some additional research on your potential vehicle there -- you'll find out more than you ever wanted to know.

randomguy
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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by randomguy » Tue May 14, 2019 9:47 pm

InvisibleAerobar wrote:
Tue May 14, 2019 2:12 pm

Jest aside, does anyone know why Volvos get dinged on reliability? Is it the major component reliability (engine, transmission, steering, shocks, etc.) or is it more reliability of the "nice to have" components (user interface, etc)? Consumer Report really doesn't say, other than a mark.
I don't consider having your dashboard go black to be a "nice to have" component:) There are reports also of when the computer goes down, it cuts out the engine. Volvo has had a lot of problems with their UE from stuff like that to just being sluggish. Remember that system isn't some minor thing. It is how you control a good chunk of the car. It is a lot worse than the a report of say a bluetooth headset not pairing.

To some extent all this stuff comes down to expectations. If you expect toyota levels of just driving you will be disappointed. If your ok with Mercedes level reliability where you end up with a couple of dealer trips over the life span of the car, you will probably be ok with the Volvo. They aren't that bad. Of course we also have no long term data on these cars. The 2016+ don't have a lot in common with the ones before then as they dumped all the ford underpinnings.

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RootSki
Posts: 153
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Re: Volvo S90 T5 Momentum - Thoughts and Suggestions???

Post by RootSki » Wed May 15, 2019 7:28 am

randomguy wrote:
Tue May 14, 2019 9:47 pm
InvisibleAerobar wrote:
Tue May 14, 2019 2:12 pm

Jest aside, does anyone know why Volvos get dinged on reliability? Is it the major component reliability (engine, transmission, steering, shocks, etc.) or is it more reliability of the "nice to have" components (user interface, etc)? Consumer Report really doesn't say, other than a mark.
I don't consider having your dashboard go black to be a "nice to have" component:) There are reports also of when the computer goes down, it cuts out the engine. Volvo has had a lot of problems with their UE from stuff like that to just being sluggish. Remember that system isn't some minor thing. It is how you control a good chunk of the car. It is a lot worse than the a report of say a bluetooth headset not pairing.

To some extent all this stuff comes down to expectations. If you expect toyota levels of just driving you will be disappointed. If your ok with Mercedes level reliability where you end up with a couple of dealer trips over the life span of the car, you will probably be ok with the Volvo. They aren't that bad. Of course we also have no long term data on these cars. The 2016+ don't have a lot in common with the ones before then as they dumped all the ford underpinnings.
Firstly, these cars have more than one computer. Secondly, where are these reports of "computer goes down, it cuts out the engine"? I've been on Swedespeed since 2010 and been following Volvo's new architecture very closely since it was released here in 2016 with the XC/S/V 90 series and I've year to hear this one. There have been a few reports of Sensus (what Volvo calls their infotainment system) restarting mid-drive, but that won't cause the engine to turn off. Early adaptors of the T8 PHEV have had some issues with "reduced engine performance" but by 2018/2019 MY these seem to have been corrected at the plant.

If "reliability" is such a major concern to the OP, I'd suggest that they add a few years onto the 5 year/Unlimited milage CPO warranty.

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