Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

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lightheir
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by lightheir » Wed Mar 13, 2019 4:56 pm

White Coat Investor wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 4:22 pm
retire14 wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:55 am
Daughter is 3 years out of college. Very bright. Graduated from a top college in Business. CPA. She has been with 3 companies and did well in all. Companies loved her. She has a very bright future. However, she recently decided that she wants to work for a nonprofit. She was upfront with her current company and they want her to stay and is willing to assign her to another position. She got an offer from an educational nonprofit at reduced pay and is considering it. As a parent, I am a little concerned that her financial situation may not be as good, especially in future years as she really has good potential for growth. At the same time, I know she is idealistic and I want her to be happy at what she does. I want to be supportive, but I am a little anxious. What do you say?
Jonathan Clements says you should be more worried about following your dreams in your 50s and that your 20s are for making and saving money.
I disagree strongly with the practicality of this well-meaning piece of advice.

Unless you're lucky enough to get a high-paying job early on, it's extremely difficult to save meaningful amounts of money under age 30. Particularly if you have student loans and/or postgraduate education years.

I tried this method myself - really scrimped and scrounged to save whatever I could when I was under age 30, figuring that the legendary claims of compound interest would amaze me 20+ years down the road.

Turns out I'm pretty underwhelmed with the result now that I'm approaching middle age. I made so much more money in my first year of a 'real' job in my mid-30s that it crushed my meagre savings in a single year of savings - and it was 100x easier to save at that much higher income point.

The true reality for the (?vast) majority of people is that peak income years are between 45-55, and your lowest earning years are in your early 20s. Most dreams require money to follow them, even partway - hence following dreams at 50 or older makes more sense where you have some financial cushion behind you.

Geologist
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by Geologist » Wed Mar 13, 2019 5:01 pm

It seems to me that Harry Truman said the best way to get a child to do what you want in life is to find out what they want to do and advise them to do it.

retire2022
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by retire2022 » Wed Mar 13, 2019 5:11 pm

retire14 wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:55 am
Daughter is 3 years out of college. Very bright. Graduated from a top college in Business. CPA. She has been with 3 companies and did well in all. Companies loved her. She has a very bright future. However, she recently decided that she wants to work for a nonprofit. She was upfront with her current company and they want her to stay and is willing to assign her to another position. She got an offer from an educational nonprofit at reduced pay and is considering it. As a parent, I am a little concerned that her financial situation may not be as good, especially in future years as she really has good potential for growth. At the same time, I know she is idealistic and I want her to be happy at what she does. I want to be supportive, but I am a little anxious. What do you say?
Retire14

I did not see a mention of student loans, if she has that, it would certainly be a point of contention. Nevertheless not-for-profit is revolving door with government, and her experience would be valuable for government regulators esp Federal Jobs which can equate with higher salaries.

Be supportive of your daughter decision, as a person who was first to obtain a college degree in my family in Art, my mother was not supportive and indifferent.

If you want to have a good relationship with her in the future, be there for best of times and worst of times.

aristotelian
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by aristotelian » Wed Mar 13, 2019 5:22 pm

At least she's not a teacher.

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Christine_NM
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by Christine_NM » Wed Mar 13, 2019 5:27 pm

White Coat Investor wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 4:22 pm
retire14 wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:55 am
Daughter is 3 years out of college. Very bright. Graduated from a top college in Business. CPA. She has been with 3 companies and did well in all. Companies loved her. She has a very bright future. However, she recently decided that she wants to work for a nonprofit. She was upfront with her current company and they want her to stay and is willing to assign her to another position. She got an offer from an educational nonprofit at reduced pay and is considering it. As a parent, I am a little concerned that her financial situation may not be as good, especially in future years as she really has good potential for growth. At the same time, I know she is idealistic and I want her to be happy at what she does. I want to be supportive, but I am a little anxious. What do you say?
Jonathan Clements says you should be more worried about following your dreams in your 50s and that your 20s are for making and saving money.
WCI, I so disagree with Clements on this -- only disagreement with him so far. Dreams in your 50s are all about you and your family. That's fine, but it is not the same as dreams in your 20s, where you want to change the world single-handedly. Two entirely different mindsets. We have to try to satisfy both as best we can. I feel horribly sorry for anyone who wasted their 20s making and saving money.

OP - I think you can shut down your parent helicopter now. She's a CPA with valuable work experience. Congratulations. :sharebeer From now on it is mostly up to her. (Not everyone even wants a big wedding.)
16% cash 48% stock 36% bond. Retired, w/d rate 2.85%

DesertDiva
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by DesertDiva » Wed Mar 13, 2019 5:29 pm

retire14 wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:55 am
Daughter is 3 years out of college. Very bright. Graduated from a top college in Business. CPA.
...
What do you say?
Congrats?

FireProof
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by FireProof » Wed Mar 13, 2019 5:47 pm

miamivice wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 8:55 am
First of all, where are the posters with dumb sons and dumb daughters? Everyone seems to have smarter than average children, but I rarely run into parents with stupider than average children.
Helicopter parenting and a good network does wonders (as do bribes to schools apparently)! And a lot of the "dud" upper-middle class kids are due to drugs and/or mental health problems, which may be too serious for this forum.

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White Coat Investor
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by White Coat Investor » Wed Mar 13, 2019 6:08 pm

lightheir wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 4:56 pm


The true reality for the (?vast) majority of people is that peak income years are between 45-55, and your lowest earning years are in your early 20s. Most dreams require money to follow them, even partway - hence following dreams at 50 or older makes more sense where you have some financial cushion behind you.
That's exactly the point. Get the financial cushion behind you and follow your dreams in the second half of your career.

You think you didn't make squat in your 20s, I was 31 when I started working, 28 if you count an intern position paying $37K. But the point is I busted my butt in my 20s so I could be on easy street and follow my dreams in my 50s. Too many people follow their dreams in their 20s when they would be excited with any work because it's all new and fluffy and then find themselves busting their butt at 55 when they are much less excited about working at all.
1) Invest you must 2) Time is your friend 3) Impulse is your enemy | 4) Basic arithmetic works 5) Stick to simplicity 6) Stay the course

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White Coat Investor
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by White Coat Investor » Wed Mar 13, 2019 6:10 pm

Christine_NM wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 5:27 pm
WCI, I so disagree with Clements on this -- only disagreement with him so far. Dreams in your 50s are all about you and your family. That's fine, but it is not the same as dreams in your 20s, where you want to change the world single-handedly. Two entirely different mindsets. We have to try to satisfy both as best we can. I feel horribly sorry for anyone who wasted their 20s making and saving money.
Maybe your dreams are about your family, but whatever your dreams are about, if you "take care of business" in the first half of your career, you have far more choices in the second half.
1) Invest you must 2) Time is your friend 3) Impulse is your enemy | 4) Basic arithmetic works 5) Stick to simplicity 6) Stay the course

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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by harrychan » Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:00 pm

Sandtrap wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 8:09 am
3
As income streams change, lifestyle changes, safety nets change, therefore . . . . adapt.
This x 100.

Does your daughter live a life of luxuries that barely keeps up with her income and has no plans to adjust her income? Then it would be a red flag and I would have a sit down with her. If she lives a frugal life, lives within her means and this job will mean less vacation, used cars, and less luxurious living arrangements then she'll be fine and you should be too.
This is not legal or certified financial advice but you know that already.

pward
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by pward » Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:10 pm

While financially it would be best to get FI ASAP then go do all the non-profit work in the world from then on... there are some things in life that people find more valuable than money. It sounds like your daughter might have found one. Now, that being said, I do have a friend that works in non-profit that is very successful. It can open a lot of doors and provide a bunch of opportunities for networking, side hustles, political influence, etc if done right. As long as she lives within her means, she should be fine. And, she also could go scratch the itch, decide it's not for her, and go back to the for-profit world in a couple years. Who knows? I would just support her and let her do her thing.

Ollie123
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by Ollie123 » Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:14 pm

I'm surprised/disappointed at many of the answers.

Lifestyles can be adjusted to circumstances. One of the central themes of this board is that you don't need to make a million dollars a year to save and achieve financial independence. If she plans to cut her spending to align with her pay, I'm not sure I see the problem. Isn't this forum generally supportive of the idea that you shouldn't need 3 beach houses and a ferrari to be happy? If we are talking about a situation where she won't make a livable wage that is one thing, but I didn't get that impression.

I think a good way to look at it just like professional field. She is an accountant. Why didn't you push her to become a doctor? Her earnings potential would probably be higher. If she became a doctor, why not a neurosurgeon? Would she be wasting her medical education if she became a lowly general surgeon?

This seems like the boglehead version of keeping up with the jones's...

retired recently
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by retired recently » Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:16 pm

I did not read all of this thread but I see you daughter is a CPA and worked for large companies previously and is now thinking of working for nonprofits. I was an audit partner overseas for most of my career and we audited both MNCs and nonprofit organizations. There is a huge difference between the two in almost everything they do and their outlook. It was always terribly frustrating to audit any nonprofit as the one's I was involved with worked so little. They religiously leave just a bit before they are supposed to, yet are always late to arrive and return from lunch. MNCs are bad about having meetings often but the nonprofits were in a class of their own. I think it would drive most people crazy. Good luck!

By the way, I am sure there are some good one's I just never had any experience with them.

dknightd
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by dknightd » Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:19 pm

Your daughter has grown up, Is apparently bright. Let her do her thing. You can make good money working for a nonprofit. But as others have said there is more to life than money. Likely she be fine. Don;t worry about it until you have something to worry about

cheesepep
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by cheesepep » Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:22 pm

Reminds me of some Judy Judy episodes where the defendants say that their daughter/son/husband/wife/pit bull are so nice, plays so well with kids, the nicest thing in the world and would never commit and offense and somehow the plantiff put them up to it/tricked them/open the gate/instigated the situation.

Your daughter 3 years out of a good college and has had 3 jobs so far and all of the companies love her....ok, if true why is she quitting them all? I understand that job hopping out of college is important and sometimes necessary, but this is job 4 and I might say a bit excessive. I'm not saying not to quit and move to a NPO, but it does seem peculiar.

dknightd
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by dknightd » Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:23 pm

retired recently wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:16 pm
I did not read all of this thread but I see you daughter is a CPA and worked for large companies previously and is now thinking of working for nonprofits. I was an audit partner overseas for most of my career and we audited both MNCs and nonprofit organizations. There is a huge difference between the two in almost everything they do and their outlook. It was always terribly frustrating to audit any nonprofit as the one's I was involved with worked so little. They religiously leave just a bit before they are supposed to, yet are always late to arrive and return from lunch. MNCs are bad about having meetings often but the nonprofits were in a class of their own. I think it would drive most people crazy. Good luck!

By the way, I am sure there are some good one's I just never had any experience with them.
Get to work late, then leave early. And make enough to live on. Sounds horrible ;)

dknightd
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by dknightd » Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:24 pm


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Steelersfan
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by Steelersfan » Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:31 pm

Been there, done that. Seven jobs in 22 years, The first three in marketing, then to non-profits. Everything has worked out just fine.

Her intelligence, personality, and caring would make any parent proud.

KyleAAA
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by KyleAAA » Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:38 pm

It's her life.

HIinvestor
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by HIinvestor » Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:45 pm

As long as your progeny’s income can support her lifestyle, sounds like things are working out.

Nonprofits range greatly between insurance companies and medical centers where top management make 6-7 figure incomes to small ones who have barely enough to pay annual fees with the Dept of Commerce to stay registered.

In any case, once the person is an adult and not asking for advice, is there a question pending?

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calmaniac
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by calmaniac » Wed Mar 13, 2019 8:47 pm

She has a CPA for goodness sakes! It's not like she has a degree in communications or sports marketing. Sounds like she has a good head on her shoulders. No matter what she does, she will be fine.

I got an M.D. and did research with it as a career. I'm sure I could have made 50% or more being in practice, but that was not what I wanted to do. One of the luxuries of having a marketable degree (CPA or MD, for example) is being able to make career decisions based on what is important to you, and still be paid quite well.

Money is the means to the end, not the end itself. Your daughter will have enough money to be fine.

goldendad
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by goldendad » Wed Mar 13, 2019 8:54 pm

My daughter and your's are similar - CPA, 4 years at a Big 4, wanted to work for non-profit. Eventually left and did it. Lasted about 2 years and is now back at a regular corporation in their audit department. It was a good experience (and she needed to get it out of her system), but it was not the environment she thought it would be. She is very satisfied with her current situation.

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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by juliewongferra » Wed Mar 13, 2019 9:42 pm

retire14 wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:55 am
Daughter is 3 years out of college. Very bright. Graduated from a top college in Business. CPA. She has been with 3 companies and did well in all. Companies loved her. She has a very bright future. However, she recently decided that she wants to work for a nonprofit. She was upfront with her current company and they want her to stay and is willing to assign her to another position. She got an offer from an educational nonprofit at reduced pay and is considering it. As a parent, I am a little concerned that her financial situation may not be as good, especially in future years as she really has good potential for growth. At the same time, I know she is idealistic and I want her to be happy at what she does. I want to be supportive, but I am a little anxious. What do you say?
If she's as "bright" as you think she is, then she's already thought this through and wants to give it a shot. Turn off your helicopter parent engine and let her be her.

cheers,
jwf
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pennylane
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by pennylane » Wed Mar 13, 2019 9:51 pm

Please don’t take this the wrong way....

If she’s as bright as you think she is, she might see something you don’t, do stay out of her way.


If it’s the wrong move and she’s considering doing it then she’s really not as bright as you think she is and in that case, she’s not very bright and you should really stay out of her way.

All roads lead to you not giving resistance.

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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by tibbitts » Wed Mar 13, 2019 10:15 pm

White Coat Investor wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 4:22 pm
retire14 wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:55 am
Daughter is 3 years out of college. Very bright. Graduated from a top college in Business. CPA. She has been with 3 companies and did well in all. Companies loved her. She has a very bright future. However, she recently decided that she wants to work for a nonprofit. She was upfront with her current company and they want her to stay and is willing to assign her to another position. She got an offer from an educational nonprofit at reduced pay and is considering it. As a parent, I am a little concerned that her financial situation may not be as good, especially in future years as she really has good potential for growth. At the same time, I know she is idealistic and I want her to be happy at what she does. I want to be supportive, but I am a little anxious. What do you say?
Jonathan Clements says you should be more worried about following your dreams in your 50s and that your 20s are for making and saving money.
It depends on the occupation. With some occupations peak earnings are likely to come in the 20s or early 30s, with very limited potential after that.

tibbitts
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by tibbitts » Wed Mar 13, 2019 10:18 pm

Geologist wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 5:01 pm
It seems to me that Harry Truman said the best way to get a child to do what you want in life is to find out what they want to do and advise them to do it.
I don't understand that quote. Are you saying children will do the opposite of what you advise them to do, and therefore you should tell them to do what they want so they won't do it?

sd323232
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by sd323232 » Wed Mar 13, 2019 10:22 pm

"educational nonprofit at reduced pay and is considering it"

key words: nonprofit, reduced pay.

There is a reason position will be at reduced pay. She will not be challenged there.

Too many times "following your heart" means "work a low paying job with less responsibilities". But the only way to become better at any job is take on more responsibilities and challenges.

Career wise, its a bad choice, but not everything in life is about money and career.

msk
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by msk » Wed Mar 13, 2019 10:33 pm

I have TWO of my 4 kids out to save the planet on low or no pay. Both had done very well academically and one even had a career as a Finance Director in a medium sized company. So now I give both monthly stipends. To be fair, I also give the same to my other two. Frankly, it's just charity in another format. Let her go save the planet, and be proud of it! Somebody has to do it.

Pigeon
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by Pigeon » Thu Mar 14, 2019 7:27 am

She's an adult and it's her career. Presumably, she'll be self-supporting despite the salary cut and isn't asking you for money?

If she's asking you your advice about the matter, I think you can discuss that there are many advantages to having a high salary. There are also advantages to having personal job satisfaction and in making the world a better place (if that's how she views it).

If she's not asking your advise, congratulate her on her new job and wish her success in it.

I have an Ivy-league educated relative with a PhD in engineering. After working at a well paid engineering job for a few years, he took a job as a public school teacher in one of the most impoverished and low paying districts in the US. His mom isn't happy, but he is. It's his life.

Nowizard
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by Nowizard » Thu Mar 14, 2019 8:10 am

With adult children, our view is two-fold: Our role becomes consultant rather than manager, and unasked for advice is often interpreted as criticism. How to fill those roles depends on the relationship with the adult child in our opinion. In retrospect, we sometimes wish we had been able to keep our mouths shut or had been more open!
Generally, it seems that many adults go through a variety of modifications before finding what they commit to vocationally for the long haul. The changes are not necessarily what but where and how we work. A CPA can ply their trade at Price-Waterhouse or Salvation Army, for example, and the latter for a period of time can actually provide information for eventually settling into something more like the former.

Tim

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leeks
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by leeks » Thu Mar 14, 2019 8:31 am

I don't understand this post at all. It sounds like you have a successful child. It is great that she knows what she wants.
  • Are you disappointed that your daughter values career satisfaction/quality of life more than maximizing potential salary?
  • Do you actually think that people who choose to have nonprofit careers do so because they are not "bright" enough for higher-earning jobs?

Another post implied that lower pay rate means the job will not challenge your daughter, a ridiculous claim! This particular position may or may not be challenging, but plenty of high-paced, rewarding, and extremely difficult jobs do not receive very high salaries.

As long as she lives within her means and isn't asking you for money, how much she earns is not your concern. Please don't criticize her for this choice as it is likely to damage your relationship more than it is likely to change her mind.

I hope you get to spend some time with your daughter's new colleagues in the hopes that it will change your perspective.

earlywynnfan
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by earlywynnfan » Thu Mar 14, 2019 9:22 am

Not to beat a dead horse, but if my daughter chose happiness in her career over chasing dollars, I'd feel like a very successful father!
(Assuming, of course, that she could pay her own way.)

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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by stoptothink » Thu Mar 14, 2019 9:46 am

retired recently wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:16 pm
I did not read all of this thread but I see you daughter is a CPA and worked for large companies previously and is now thinking of working for nonprofits. I was an audit partner overseas for most of my career and we audited both MNCs and nonprofit organizations. There is a huge difference between the two in almost everything they do and their outlook. It was always terribly frustrating to audit any nonprofit as the one's I was involved with worked so little. They religiously leave just a bit before they are supposed to, yet are always late to arrive and return from lunch. MNCs are bad about having meetings often but the nonprofits were in a class of their own. I think it would drive most people crazy. Good luck!

By the way, I am sure there are some good one's I just never had any experience with them.
There is a huge spectrum when it comes to "non-profit" and I don't want to generalize, but that was my experience working in the non-profit sector for 9yrs. I met a grand total of two "go-getters" working in non-profits, one I poached for my own department when I left for private industry and the other I married (and she left non-profits before me). That may be the environment OP's daughter wants, but it was very frustrating for myself and my wife.

oldlongbeard
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by oldlongbeard » Thu Mar 14, 2019 10:41 am

Sandtrap wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 8:09 am
retire14 wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:55 am
Daughter is 3 years out of college. Very bright. Graduated from a top college in Business. CPA. She has been with 3 companies and did well in all. Companies loved her. She has a very bright future. However, she recently decided that she wants to work for a nonprofit. She was upfront with her current company and they want her to stay and is willing to assign her to another position. She got an offer from an educational nonprofit at reduced pay and is considering it. As a parent, I am a little concerned that her financial situation may not be as good, especially in future years as she really has good potential for growth. At the same time, I know she is idealistic and I want her to be happy at what she does. I want to be supportive, but I am a little anxious. What do you say?
1
Life's too short. Try it.
2
Have an exit plan.
3
As income streams change, lifestyle changes, safety nets change, therefore . . . . adapt.
4
What is most meaningful in life is not on a spreadsheet.
5
Learn
6
Have fun.
See #4 above. Agreed.

MichCPA
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by MichCPA » Thu Mar 14, 2019 10:53 am

retire14 wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:55 am
Daughter is 3 years out of college. Very bright. Graduated from a top college in Business. CPA. She has been with 3 companies and did well in all. Companies loved her. She has a very bright future. However, she recently decided that she wants to work for a nonprofit. She was upfront with her current company and they want her to stay and is willing to assign her to another position. She got an offer from an educational nonprofit at reduced pay and is considering it. As a parent, I am a little concerned that her financial situation may not be as good, especially in future years as she really has good potential for growth. At the same time, I know she is idealistic and I want her to be happy at what she does. I want to be supportive, but I am a little anxious. What do you say?
I am a CPA and I used to audit non-profits. If you are talking about a position toward the top of the finance department, it could definitely still be solidly into 100k's (this is in a MCOL area). In addition, the fringe benefits can be pretty good. Not sure what her family situation is, but its difficult to grab a top line corporate or public accounting job without sacrificing your quality of life. You didn't mention anything about this, but it becomes a huge deal at her age. (I am 5 yrs out of school)

In short, she will have above average earnings either way. I understand your choices might be different, but she is a bright person and will be able to handle things and make adjustments/changes as she needs to.

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Sandtrap
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by Sandtrap » Thu Mar 14, 2019 11:11 am

retire14 wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:55 am
Daughter is 3 years out of college. Very bright. Graduated from a top college in Business. CPA. She has been with 3 companies and did well in all. Companies loved her. She has a very bright future. However, she recently decided that she wants to work for a nonprofit. She was upfront with her current company and they want her to stay and is willing to assign her to another position. She got an offer from an educational nonprofit at reduced pay and is considering it. As a parent, I am a little concerned that her financial situation may not be as good, especially in future years as she really has good potential for growth. At the same time, I know she is idealistic and I want her to be happy at what she does. I want to be supportive, but I am a little anxious. What do you say?
Real Life Examples:
1. Son's "sister in law" graduated top law school, worked at a top law firm, quit and is now a grade school teacher., Self Sufficianrt. Happy.

2. Niece, graduated top engineering school. Worked. Then switched to LPN then RN. Self Sufficient, Happy.

3. Daughter in Law, graduated top in class. Now a counselor, social worker for non profit. Earns well. Self sufficient. Happy.

The fun is in making one's own canoe and sail, then setting forth on one's journey alone.
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caffeperfavore
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by caffeperfavore » Thu Mar 14, 2019 11:21 am

Another data point here: wife is at a non-profit. Pay is pretty good. She would make more in industry somewhere, but she enjoys her work, interacts with some amazing people, has reasonable hours, and the benefits are excellent. Wouldn't change any of that for more cash.

So, vent your concerns here, but not with her. She's an adult now. She'll be fine.

Nathan Drake
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by Nathan Drake » Thu Mar 14, 2019 11:45 am

There’s been a few posts that have said it’s pretty easy to make 500k in non top management roles at non-profits.

That’s fairly difficult to do at a corporate job, so I would suggest that she goes the non profit route if she wants to earn a very high income.

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dm200
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by dm200 » Thu Mar 14, 2019 1:09 pm

Various observations

1. Seems to me the time to make (and try) such changes is when you are younger.

2. Whatever job/employer changes she pursues, I strongly urge/suggest that she keep her CPA "credentials".

3. Just my "anecdotal" experience and observations, but in financial matters, religious/charitable/non-profits probably have higher incidences of fraud (both internal and external), embezzlement and laxness. I am (and have been) very involved with various aspects of my religious affiliation, and have (first hand) various fraud/embezzlement "situations". There are many reasons, I believe, for this but one is that many wrongly believe that "nobody would steal from a church". Therefore - there may be a real need for someone with financial/auditing "smarts" and credentials in these types of entities.

4. Depending on the details of the "non-profit" - the employment benefits may be (but not always) very good - compared to the "profit" sector.

janezoey
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by janezoey » Thu Mar 14, 2019 2:09 pm

My spouse and I have only ever worked for non-profits and governments (though my spouse did try big law for a short period) and have degrees from places like Harvard. We could be making $400k+ a year, but we make half that much and still are in the top 5% percent of US household income. We have a nice home and retirement funds, and our kids want for nothing. I definitely would encourage my own kids to look at non-profits and government positions because they have pretty good retirement benefits, work-life balance, and best of all for the idealists--usually a very clear sense of mission. Most of the government agencies and non-profits we have worked for have employees of 500+ or even 1000+. I've tried looking at positions in the private sector and often those companies had under 100 employees, and didn't seem so secure (e.g. one person had to wear multiple hats) or offer as many benefits (e.g. tuition reimbursement) or just didn't seem as pleasant (e.g. tiny cubicle in an old office park vs a beautiful campus). So the benefits and environment of a large non-profit might make up for lower compensation than a megacorp, but overall still be better than a small private company.

Swimmer
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by Swimmer » Thu Mar 14, 2019 5:00 pm

I worked for three different not-for-profits. The highly compensated were VERY highly compensated. Incredibly so. The perks were many. The work, to me, very interesting. Not to venture astray, but because of spending I witnessed, I carefully review any organization’s IRS990 before making charitable contributions.

I would not discourage her.

Geologist
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by Geologist » Thu Mar 14, 2019 5:16 pm

tibbitts wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 10:18 pm
Geologist wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 5:01 pm
It seems to me that Harry Truman said the best way to get a child to do what you want in life is to find out what they want to do and advise them to do it.
I don't understand that quote. Are you saying children will do the opposite of what you advise them to do, and therefore you should tell them to do what they want so they won't do it?
No. Truman’s argument was that it isn't likely you can get them to do what you want (let alone force them to do it) so you might as well advise them to do what they want to do.

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Artful Dodger
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by Artful Dodger » Thu Mar 14, 2019 5:18 pm

miamivice wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 8:55 am
First of all, where are the posters with dumb sons and dumb daughters? Everyone seems to have smarter than average children, but I rarely run into parents with stupider than average children.

But to answer your question, your adult daughter needs to live her life. Whether she is financially successful or not, she needs to follow her passion and drive. It is not your place to judge.
Hah!

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stoptothink
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by stoptothink » Thu Mar 14, 2019 5:38 pm

Nathan Drake wrote:
Thu Mar 14, 2019 11:45 am
There’s been a few posts that have said it’s pretty easy to make 500k in non top management roles at non-profits.

That’s fairly difficult to do at a corporate job, so I would suggest that she goes the non profit route if she wants to earn a very high income.
Make no mistake, on average, compensation is lower in the non-profit sector. I'm sure there are some out there making that much, but that is well beyond my experience. I worked at a quite large non-profit for 5yrs in Texas; at a company with nearly 7,000 employees, our CEO made a little more half that. The director of my specific program, overseeing 600 employees, made less than 1/3 of that. When I moved to Utah, the CEO of my ~250 employee non-profit made even less than my former director. When my wife and I left non-profit for private industry, she immediately doubled her salary and I got a 40% raise.

staythecourse
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by staythecourse » Thu Mar 14, 2019 6:48 pm

I tell everyone young that one should always do what they want, but they have to live the life of someone who makes that kind of paycheck. If she has been in the real world for awhile with no assistance from you guys then she should start having an idea of what she wants financially in her life. Let her do it then. If she finds out she wants more financially that can be offered at this new gig then she will change. That's part of growing up, no? It isn't like she hasn't changed several jobs already so if it turns out wrong just add this one to the list.

Good luck.
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whodidntante
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by whodidntante » Thu Mar 14, 2019 6:52 pm

It looks like the OP did a peace out on page 1.

michaelingp
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by michaelingp » Thu Mar 14, 2019 7:17 pm

It would really help to know how big a pay cut, and to what level. My daughter worked for a big IT company near San Hose. She didn't think the work, while highly compensated, was "meaningful." I was a bit surprised (and concerned) that she would give up the Silicone Valley perks (free bus service, free food, etc.). The non-profit (sort of) could not match her salary, but found ways to come close. It's been a couple of years and she's still there and happy. I think part of it is being a big fish in a small pond rather than the other way around. The company does something meaningful, and she has much more influence than at the big IT firm. And she's not starving. Her three-fund portfolio is very healthy.


tibbitts
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by tibbitts » Thu Mar 14, 2019 11:06 pm

I really can't see being "apprehensive" about this. I'd think either career path would have plenty of potential and wouldn't try to discourage her from pursuing the non-profit opportunity. On the other hand, it might be time to start dropping some hints about grandchildren.

toofache32
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Re: Bright daughter wants to work for nonprofit

Post by toofache32 » Fri Mar 15, 2019 12:51 am

I have not read through all this. To my knowledge, "Non-profit" is an IRS classification simply stating the presence or absence of stock holders, although an enormous number of people think this means charity work. What does this IRS classification have to do with her employment choices? I could be wrong because I have no experience in this, but "for profit'" vs "non profit" only has bearing on the shareholders if they exist. Lots of "non profit" hospitals around here putting up multi-million dollar buildings...

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