What are your personal experiences with downside of early retirement?

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DaftInvestor
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Re: What are your personal experiences with downside of early retirement?

Post by DaftInvestor » Mon Mar 11, 2019 12:13 pm

If you don't have succession planning then you have problems with early retirees.
I wouldn't call this a downside of early retirement - but a downside of poor corporate planning.

staythecourse
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Re: What are your personal experiences with downside of early retirement?

Post by staythecourse » Mon Mar 11, 2019 8:42 pm

Ged wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 12:06 pm
staythecourse wrote:
Sun Mar 10, 2019 9:29 pm
Ged wrote:
Sun Mar 10, 2019 4:55 pm
staythecourse wrote:
Sat Mar 09, 2019 9:55 am
Interestingly, if you look at the behavioral aspect I wonder if this is a U.S. centric issue? The studies support our children being overconfident in their educational prowess despite having some of the worst test scores year after year.
Some parts of the US get very good test scores.

http://tumblehomelearning.com/timss-tes ... d-so-well/
That was in reference to the famous poor ratings of U.S. in PISA test scores and then the level of confidence each test taker had immediately after taking the exam.

Good luck.
The overall US results are not among the worst internationally. In fact they are about average for an OECD country. And as before some parts of the US are doing extremely well.

http://www.doe.mass.edu/news/news.aspx?id=24050
I said "some of the worst test scores year to year" not the "worst". Look up the data on the PISA website. For math, reading, and science for the OECD countries (35 total) U.S. was tied for #30 out of 35 in math, #19 out of 35 for reading, #19 out of 35 for science. Take into consideration we likely (don't know of sure, but guessing) spend as much on education per child then any other country on that list we are not very impressive, unless you think being in the middle 50% is a measure of success in 2/3 and bottom on the other subject? Most interesting is that was the year America actually PAID the testers to separately report Mass. and NC as well as included in the total. I would have assumed most folks wouldn't have fallen for it, but for the fact you linked it it seems it does work.

The point of my post stands though as the students were no. 1 on confidence on their potential results right after the exam only to be middle of the pact in 2/3 and near the bottom on the other subject. I would say that constitutes overconfidence.

Good luck.
"The stock market [fluctuation], therefore, is noise. A giant distraction from the business of investing.” | -Jack Bogle

protagonist
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Re: What are your personal experiences with downside of early retirement?

Post by protagonist » Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:07 pm

I retired in early 2008, age 55.

Over the course of the next twelve months, I lost half my life's savings in divorce and close to half of what was left in the market crash.

It was the best decision of my life.

protagonist
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Re: What are your personal experiences with downside of early retirement?

Post by protagonist » Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:10 pm

staythecourse wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 8:42 pm


The point of my post stands though as the students were no. 1 on confidence on their potential results right after the exam only to be middle of the pact in 2/3 and near the bottom on the other subject. I would say that constitutes overconfidence.

Good luck.
Interesting confirmation of Dunning-Kruger effect.

warner25
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Re: What are your personal experiences with downside of early retirement?

Post by warner25 » Tue Mar 12, 2019 6:08 am

Not retired here, but I had an extraordinary amount of downtime in my career over the past couple years (call it a sabbatical), and that gave me some perspective. Depending on how early you're talking, like Mr. Money Mustache style FIRE in your 30s, you need to think hard about life with kids at home. I found that I basically traded my usual job for the job of being a stay-at-home co-parent (which is a unique challenge) with my wife who is a stay-at-home mom. As much as I love my kids, I learned that being a stay-at-home parent to a couple small children is incredibly difficult and not a great fit for me; it was anything but what I imagine for "retirement." I'm reminded of the old joke that there's no such thing as a "vacation" with kids, it's work. And as much as I love my wife, we pretty much only saw each other day-to-day, so it was kind of lonely. There aren't many people in their 30s, especially guys, who aren't at work all week.

harvestbook
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Re: What are your personal experiences with downside of early retirement?

Post by harvestbook » Tue Mar 12, 2019 7:47 am

My perception was that any corporation I worked for always had more human rights, political power, freedom of choice, and tax breaks than I ever would, so I assumed they'd get along just fine without me. So far so good.

My plan is to just own the robots and let them sort it out.
I'm not smart enough to know, and I can't afford to guess.

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Ged
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Re: What are your personal experiences with downside of early retirement?

Post by Ged » Tue Mar 12, 2019 11:04 am

staythecourse wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 8:42 pm

The point of my post stands though as the students were no. 1 on confidence on their potential results right after the exam only to be middle of the pact in 2/3 and near the bottom on the other subject. I would say that constitutes overconfidence.

Good luck.
I went to the PISA web site. http://www.compareyourcountry.org/pisa/ ... /USA?lg=en

On this page there is a graphic that shows the results of various OECD countries in various topic.

For Science and Reading the US shows around average. In Math slightly below average.

Not among the worst. Not near the bottom.

And my point still stands. The results across the United States vary tremendously. Places like Massachusetts are near the top world-wide.

staythecourse
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Re: What are your personal experiences with downside of early retirement?

Post by staythecourse » Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:41 pm

Ged wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 11:04 am
staythecourse wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 8:42 pm

The point of my post stands though as the students were no. 1 on confidence on their potential results right after the exam only to be middle of the pact in 2/3 and near the bottom on the other subject. I would say that constitutes overconfidence.

Good luck.
I went to the PISA web site. http://www.compareyourcountry.org/pisa/ ... /USA?lg=en

On this page there is a graphic that shows the results of various OECD countries in various topic.

For Science and Reading the US shows around average. In Math slightly below average.

Not among the worst. Not near the bottom.

And my point still stands. The results across the United States vary tremendously. Places like Massachusetts are near the top world-wide.
Same website I used. The difference is you used "AVERAGE" and not country to country specific comparisons. IYou can figure out the same and the results I did from the website just use the interactive report and they are not good as I already presented. Of course, Mass. is excellent why do you think America PAID to have it reported separate? What do you think the results would be if Singapore, Finland, or South Korea reported just their best states? America, wanted a good foot from somewhere as they are so lackluster against other OECD countries especially embarrassing based on the per student.

I'm guessing you are in education and trying to support the American education system. You can do that, but NO ONE in the world thinks America has a stellar prek- high school system.

My point though has to do with overconfidence though. Then again, it seems your arguments are making the point I was making. Average- bad performances and you and many other think we are great. That is a perfect example of overconfidence.

Good luck.

p.s. We will have to agree to disagree and won't be arguing on this point anymore. I apologize to the OP as I deviated his thread from its intention.
"The stock market [fluctuation], therefore, is noise. A giant distraction from the business of investing.” | -Jack Bogle

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Ged
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Re: What are your personal experiences with downside of early retirement?

Post by Ged » Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:48 pm

As far as comparing Singapore or Finland to Massachusetts, why not? They are very similar in size.

You are way off base. I am not in the education profession. I am simply pointing out that your reading of the PISA data is ridiculous.

The fact you are making this personal attack is evidence of that, and the futility of my attempt to discuss this with you.

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marti038
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Re: What are your personal experiences with downside of early retirement?

Post by marti038 » Tue Mar 12, 2019 3:06 pm

protagonist wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:07 pm
I retired in early 2008, age 55.

Over the course of the next twelve months, I lost half my life's savings in divorce and close to half of what was left in the market crash.

It was the best decision of my life.
Go on...

protagonist
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Re: What are your personal experiences with downside of early retirement?

Post by protagonist » Tue Mar 12, 2019 5:28 pm

marti038 wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 3:06 pm
protagonist wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:07 pm
I retired in early 2008, age 55.

Over the course of the next twelve months, I lost half my life's savings in divorce and close to half of what was left in the market crash.

It was the best decision of my life.
Go on...
OK, I will try to summarize why I said what I did.....

1. As much as I loved my job, I love not having to work a lot more. My stress level dropped by perhaps 90%, and, imho, stress is a major enemy of true happiness.

2. I am no longer in a loveless marriage. I have since found true love and joy in partnership that I never knew really existed before and has opened my heart in myriad ways. Not to mention I have a great relationship with my daughter and I have time to spend with her and to nurture my friendships. I also have time to pursue my hobbies, exercise, etc. Or do nothing or sleep whenever I want to. My time is my own. How many CEOs or world leaders can say that? You lose one thing, you gain another.

3. Money is not everything. Especially when compared with time. If you have enough money to survive happily without struggling, more does not really do much to improve your lifestyle. Plus I have been fortunate to have invested wisely (using what would probably be considered Boglehead-approved methods), and the past decade has been good to investors like myself.... so, though I have less than I did prior to the divorce and crash, I am not wanting for much. But even if that were not the case, and my finances never recovered and even got worse, requiring me to downsize for example, the first two items above would still make me a far happier person. If necessary I would happily give up my wealth and survive on social security alone in return for what I have now, which is peace of mind, happiness and love. A studio apartment and a beater for a car wouldn't be so bad if you have peace of mind, happiness, lack of stress and love. Not bad at all.
Last edited by protagonist on Tue Mar 12, 2019 6:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

protagonist
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Re: What are your personal experiences with downside of early retirement?

Post by protagonist » Tue Mar 12, 2019 5:48 pm

Ged wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 11:04 am

And my point still stands. The results across the United States vary tremendously. Places like Massachusetts are near the top world-wide.
Massachusetts is one of the wealthiest states in the USA. I assume that is partly because it attracts some of the most educated people from around the country (and world). So it is a skewed sample. To be fair, you would have to compare the test scores of MA residents with those from the wealthiest parts of the other OECD nations, and that would still only give you a ranking of people from wealthy neighborhoods, not a ranking of nations. For I think we can all agree that the USA provides some of the best education that money can buy, if you can afford it.

Rudedog
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Re: What are your personal experiences with downside of early retirement?

Post by Rudedog » Tue Mar 12, 2019 7:54 pm

Retired at 62 from a job working with people who were experts at wasting time in meetings. I keep busy helping my in-laws (in their 90s), walking my dog, riding my Harley, helping my friends with various projects, walking to the local Public Library, making breakfast for my wife as she gets ready for work, talking to my retired neighbors, anticipating my soon-to-arrive grandson. I'll do some volunteer work starting in a few months and travel a bit. No downside that I have noticed. Good luck with your retirement.

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Ged
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Re: What are your personal experiences with downside of early retirement?

Post by Ged » Wed Mar 13, 2019 12:28 pm

protagonist wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 5:48 pm
Ged wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 11:04 am

And my point still stands. The results across the United States vary tremendously. Places like Massachusetts are near the top world-wide.
Massachusetts is one of the wealthiest states in the USA. I assume that is partly because it attracts some of the most educated people from around the country (and world). So it is a skewed sample. To be fair, you would have to compare the test scores of MA residents with those from the wealthiest parts of the other OECD nations, and that would still only give you a ranking of people from wealthy neighborhoods, not a ranking of nations. For I think we can all agree that the USA provides some of the best education that money can buy, if you can afford it.
The Puritans always emphasized education. As such Massachusetts had the first public school (Boston Latin) and college (Harvard) in America. The wealth came later.

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Re: What are your personal experiences with downside of early retirement?

Post by Glockenspiel » Wed Mar 13, 2019 12:51 pm

protagonist wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 5:48 pm
Ged wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 11:04 am

And my point still stands. The results across the United States vary tremendously. Places like Massachusetts are near the top world-wide.
Massachusetts is one of the wealthiest states in the USA. I assume that is partly because it attracts some of the most educated people from around the country (and world). So it is a skewed sample. To be fair, you would have to compare the test scores of MA residents with those from the wealthiest parts of the other OECD nations, and that would still only give you a ranking of people from wealthy neighborhoods, not a ranking of nations. For I think we can all agree that the USA provides some of the best education that money can buy, if you can afford it.
I think you have it backwards. They are some of the wealthiest people because the state has chosen to become a leader in the nation's education and social safety net. Investing tax dollars into children is some of the best tax money that taxpayers can spend, as it creates a highly productive and educated workforce.

protagonist
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Re: What are your personal experiences with downside of early retirement?

Post by protagonist » Wed Mar 13, 2019 1:04 pm

Glockenspiel wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 12:51 pm
protagonist wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 5:48 pm
Ged wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 11:04 am

And my point still stands. The results across the United States vary tremendously. Places like Massachusetts are near the top world-wide.
Massachusetts is one of the wealthiest states in the USA. I assume that is partly because it attracts some of the most educated people from around the country (and world). So it is a skewed sample. To be fair, you would have to compare the test scores of MA residents with those from the wealthiest parts of the other OECD nations, and that would still only give you a ranking of people from wealthy neighborhoods, not a ranking of nations. For I think we can all agree that the USA provides some of the best education that money can buy, if you can afford it.
I think you have it backwards. They are some of the wealthiest people because the state has chosen to become a leader in the nation's education and social safety net. Investing tax dollars into children is some of the best tax money that taxpayers can spend, as it creates a highly productive and educated workforce.
I don't have it backwards. I entirely agree with that. And that, in turn, attracts some of the most educated and enlightened people from around the world. It is a positive loop.

GCD
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Re: What are your personal experiences with downside of early retirement?

Post by GCD » Wed Mar 13, 2019 2:12 pm

So as I was talking with some friends today, another downside occurred to me - my friends are not in the same financial situation.

Fortunately my wife is retired and we get along great so I can do things with her. But all of my old friends are working. Many will have to continue working for at least another decade.

Time to make some new friends I guess.

Bronko
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Re: What are your personal experiences with downside of early retirement?

Post by Bronko » Wed Mar 13, 2019 4:34 pm

protagonist wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 5:28 pm
marti038 wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 3:06 pm
protagonist wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:07 pm
I retired in early 2008, age 55.

Over the course of the next twelve months, I lost half my life's savings in divorce and close to half of what was left in the market crash.

It was the best decision of my life.
Go on...
OK, I will try to summarize why I said what I did.....

1. As much as I loved my job, I love not having to work a lot more. My stress level dropped by perhaps 90%, and, imho, stress is a major enemy of true happiness.

2. I am no longer in a loveless marriage. I have since found true love and joy in partnership that I never knew really existed before and has opened my heart in myriad ways. Not to mention I have a great relationship with my daughter and I have time to spend with her and to nurture my friendships. I also have time to pursue my hobbies, exercise, etc. Or do nothing or sleep whenever I want to. My time is my own. How many CEOs or world leaders can say that? You lose one thing, you gain another.

3. Money is not everything. Especially when compared with time. If you have enough money to survive happily without struggling, more does not really do much to improve your lifestyle. Plus I have been fortunate to have invested wisely (using what would probably be considered Boglehead-approved methods), and the past decade has been good to investors like myself.... so, though I have less than I did prior to the divorce and crash, I am not wanting for much. But even if that were not the case, and my finances never recovered and even got worse, requiring me to downsize for example, the first two items above would still make me a far happier person. If necessary I would happily give up my wealth and survive on social security alone in return for what I have now, which is peace of mind, happiness and love. A studio apartment and a beater for a car wouldn't be so bad if you have peace of mind, happiness, lack of stress and love. Not bad at all.

Mic drop. Congratulations on the self awareness. Tomorrow isn't promised.
Never let a little bit of money get in the way of a real good time.

bhsince87
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Re: What are your personal experiences with downside of early retirement?

Post by bhsince87 » Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:46 pm

protagonist wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 5:28 pm
marti038 wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 3:06 pm
protagonist wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:07 pm
I retired in early 2008, age 55.

Over the course of the next twelve months, I lost half my life's savings in divorce and close to half of what was left in the market crash.

It was the best decision of my life.
Go on...
OK, I will try to summarize why I said what I did.....

1. As much as I loved my job, I love not having to work a lot more. My stress level dropped by perhaps 90%, and, imho, stress is a major enemy of true happiness.

2. I am no longer in a loveless marriage. I have since found true love and joy in partnership that I never knew really existed before and has opened my heart in myriad ways. Not to mention I have a great relationship with my daughter and I have time to spend with her and to nurture my friendships. I also have time to pursue my hobbies, exercise, etc. Or do nothing or sleep whenever I want to. My time is my own. How many CEOs or world leaders can say that? You lose one thing, you gain another.

3. Money is not everything. Especially when compared with time. If you have enough money to survive happily without struggling, more does not really do much to improve your lifestyle. Plus I have been fortunate to have invested wisely (using what would probably be considered Boglehead-approved methods), and the past decade has been good to investors like myself.... so, though I have less than I did prior to the divorce and crash, I am not wanting for much. But even if that were not the case, and my finances never recovered and even got worse, requiring me to downsize for example, the first two items above would still make me a far happier person. If necessary I would happily give up my wealth and survive on social security alone in return for what I have now, which is peace of mind, happiness and love. A studio apartment and a beater for a car wouldn't be so bad if you have peace of mind, happiness, lack of stress and love. Not bad at all.
Very inspiring! Thanks for sharing.
Retirement: When you reach a point where you have enough. Or when you've had enough.

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marti038
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Re: What are your personal experiences with downside of early retirement?

Post by marti038 » Thu Mar 14, 2019 9:31 am

protagonist wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 5:28 pm
marti038 wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 3:06 pm
protagonist wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:07 pm
I retired in early 2008, age 55.

Over the course of the next twelve months, I lost half my life's savings in divorce and close to half of what was left in the market crash.

It was the best decision of my life.
Go on...
OK, I will try to summarize why I said what I did.....

1. As much as I loved my job, I love not having to work a lot more. My stress level dropped by perhaps 90%, and, imho, stress is a major enemy of true happiness.

2. I am no longer in a loveless marriage. I have since found true love and joy in partnership that I never knew really existed before and has opened my heart in myriad ways. Not to mention I have a great relationship with my daughter and I have time to spend with her and to nurture my friendships. I also have time to pursue my hobbies, exercise, etc. Or do nothing or sleep whenever I want to. My time is my own. How many CEOs or world leaders can say that? You lose one thing, you gain another.

3. Money is not everything. Especially when compared with time. If you have enough money to survive happily without struggling, more does not really do much to improve your lifestyle. Plus I have been fortunate to have invested wisely (using what would probably be considered Boglehead-approved methods), and the past decade has been good to investors like myself.... so, though I have less than I did prior to the divorce and crash, I am not wanting for much. But even if that were not the case, and my finances never recovered and even got worse, requiring me to downsize for example, the first two items above would still make me a far happier person. If necessary I would happily give up my wealth and survive on social security alone in return for what I have now, which is peace of mind, happiness and love. A studio apartment and a beater for a car wouldn't be so bad if you have peace of mind, happiness, lack of stress and love. Not bad at all.
Thank you for sharing that. I assumed you meant something along these lines, but it's certainly more clear with this explanation. I'm glad you're happy and wish you well in your retirement.

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