Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

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b0B
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by b0B » Tue Dec 04, 2018 11:41 am

RickBoglehead wrote:
Tue Dec 04, 2018 10:59 am
I submitted my HSA paperwork to Fidelity on 11/26/18, via fax, as instructed, because I'm transferring from a bank.

I got an email that my paperwork was not received. I called, and they checked and verified that in fact the fax was received, and that I should ignore them message. Because I am going bank to bank, there is no online signature option. I was told by my initial rep to send it in via fax, which he provided, because he looked up my sending bank and said "they don't need a signature".

Fast forward to today. I tried to chat with the HSA department, you cannot. I tried to email with them, you cannot. I called and spoke to a rep who found the same "Paperwork Not Yet Received" status. I told her that this had already been checked and was received and I was told to ignore the message. She said "that's not right, the message is supposed to be accurate". She showed me how to type in Transfer Tracker in their search box and get to the status, which showed "Paperwork Not Yet Received".

She offered to check again with the back office, confirm all was in order, and check the status of the transfer. When she came back on, she said that nothing had been done, and that the transfer had now been "expedited". She surmised that because of this message (Paperwork Not Yet Received), nothing had been done, even though THEY told me to fax in the documents. She questioned why I faxed it in, and I told her exactly why - because their rep told me to...

This is going along the path that I experienced with Fidelity NetBenefits in late 2017 with my wife's 403B and resulted in me pulling nearly all the assets that Fidelity held from them and making Vanguard our 99% provider. I clarified with her that in fact NetBenefits has nothing to do with this account.

The only reason I am moving to Fidelity is to save $30 in annual fees ($3 per month minus interest earned) on a paltry, $1,300, account that I intended to put into a total stock market index fund and leave for 10 years. If Fidelity continues along this line I'll just cancel the transfer and keep paying the fee. Strike 1 so far. For those that love Fidelity's "great" service, it's not.
I share your bad experiences with Fidelity. They badly messed up a 403b transfer (costing me), they could only be contacted at a specific phone number, where they covered up and lied about it. I don't know where the Fidelity good service myth comes from.

With this HSA transfer, I'm in the long-term "Paperwork Not Yet Received" limbo, with no way to confirm that they actually got it. I'm only transferring the uninvestible cash portion from another HSA, so I'm just going to wait and see. We're only putting up with this because the HSA environment is generally so bad compared to other account types.

On another note, if your HSA is only going to be $1,300, I would suggest just spending it down to zero and being done with it.

RickBoglehead
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by RickBoglehead » Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:37 pm

b0B wrote:
Tue Dec 04, 2018 11:41 am
On another note, if your HSA is only going to be $1,300, I would suggest just spending it down to zero and being done with it.
I have been doing just that. Fortunately for us (unfortunately for my HSA), our medical and dental out of pocket costs each year are minimal. So basically I'm losing $30 a year, and dropping the balance by $500 a year. Biggest cost I throw against it is my wife's contact lenses, and our every 2 or 3 years new eyeglasses.

I expect it won't be empty until 2021 at this rate, and I'd pay another $60 - $90 in fees. So I figured move it, put it in a Total Stock Market fund, and let it sit until many years from now.

b0B
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by b0B » Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:41 pm

RickBoglehead wrote:
Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:37 pm
b0B wrote:
Tue Dec 04, 2018 11:41 am
On another note, if your HSA is only going to be $1,300, I would suggest just spending it down to zero and being done with it.
I have been doing just that. Fortunately for us (unfortunately for my HSA), our medical and dental out of pocket costs each year are minimal. So basically I'm losing $30 a year, and dropping the balance by $500 a year. Biggest cost I throw against it is my wife's contact lenses, and our every 2 or 3 years new eyeglasses.

I expect it won't be empty until 2021 at this rate, and I'd pay another $60 - $90 in fees. So I figured move it, put it in a Total Stock Market fund, and let it sit until many years from now.
Sure, makes more sense with zero fees to keep it. Hopefully the transfer goes through.

schildi
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by schildi » Tue Dec 04, 2018 8:24 pm

Thanks everybody for the great information here!

My timeline wasn't as quick as some of the reports here, but it looks like I am getting there.
I am transferring from Elements (formerly Eli Lilly) CU, and the linked TDAmeritrade account. I went the long route by selling my positions at TDAmeritrade, then transferring to Elements CU, then doing the trustee to trustee transfer to Fidelity.
Here is my timeline:
- 11/16: sold positions at TDA and waited a couple days for settlement
- 11/20: submitted transfer paperwork in person at Fidelity Investment Center branch
- 11/21: transferred cash from TDA to Elements
- 11/27: paperwork shows as received by Fidelity online and transfer request submitted to Elements CU
- this is when I started talking to Elements CU, a person was assigned and I was able to email with her and call
- 12/04: received email from Elements that check was sent to Fidelity that day; HSA account at Elements has been removed online (but I still have access to my TDAmeritrade account, even though that should be closed automatically as well)
- now waiting for the check to get to Fidelity and be deposited, hopefully by EOW.

Fidelity estimates completion by 12/10, I am sure that it will happen by then, probably a little earlier.
No fees so far, beside the trading fee for selling at TDA ($6.95 per position)

While it took a little longer and being out of the market for a while is usually not desirable, it has worked out ok so far for me in this case. My main position (VTI) is now lower than when I sold, let's see what I end up with when everything is said and done .....

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sperry8
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by sperry8 » Wed Dec 05, 2018 9:33 am

Monies hit Fido account today - still pending, but total monies showing there and no monies showing in TD Ameritrade. Good to see some movement finally.
Humbling BH contest results: 2017: #516 of 647 | 2016: #121 of 610 | 2015: #18 of 552 | 2014: #225 of 503 | 2013: #383 of 433 | 2012: #366 of 410 | 2011: #113 of 369 | 2010: #53 of 282

MikeG62
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by MikeG62 » Wed Dec 05, 2018 4:40 pm

Echohammer419 wrote:
Tue Dec 04, 2018 11:02 am
MikeG62 wrote:
Tue Dec 04, 2018 8:30 am
MikeG62 wrote:
Mon Dec 03, 2018 7:03 am
Echohammer419 wrote:
Mon Dec 03, 2018 12:05 am
MikeG62 wrote:
Sat Dec 01, 2018 7:40 am


Mine not processing as quickly as this.

I submitted the request (also entirely done online) on the 28th. Since then crickets. Just an account sitting at Fidelity with no funds and no indication of any activity pending. Transfer status screen only indicates transfer request was submitted. No box checked for processed by Fidelity nor by TDA.

Still have full access still to both my TDA and Lively accounts.

When I submitted the request on the 28th it had a projected completion date of Dec 5 (still says that in fact). Don't think I am on track to achieve that timeline.
I'm interested to see what your update is tomorrow and if you have any activity. I too filled everything out online. I haven't liquidated any of my assets over on TDA, so will Fidelity default to pulling them over in kind?
No change in status as of this morning. Still have full online access to my TDA and Lively accounts.

There are these notes in the "check the status of pending transfers" section of the transfers screen, but they were there the other day too:

"We're working on your transfer of assets request. Please note, it may take up to 48 hours to display below."

"Your assets will be listed when Td Ameritrade Inc notifies Fidelity that your request has been validated."
Update as of this morning.

Fidelity now shows it’s completed it’s review of my application and will now be reaching out to TDA to initiate the process of moving the assets. Projected completion date now extended to Dec 10. We’ll see...
Good to know, keep us posted!
Got a call from Fidelity this morning telling me that in order for TDA to release the assets they need a letter from Lively. As luck would have it, earlier this morning I got a secure message from TDA telling me they have unlocked my account and Fidelity can re-initiate the request. Luckily I had checked the SM before I got the call from Fidelity, so I read the SM to the Fidelity rep and he said he would re-initiate the transfer request. It seems TDA will somehow kickback the request while at the same time notify Lively of it. A little confusing process if you ask me.

The Fidelity rep suggested I check back in a few days.

So that is the latest.
Real Knowledge Comes Only From Experience

mikep
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by mikep » Wed Dec 05, 2018 5:22 pm

Horsefly wrote:
Mon Nov 12, 2018 9:49 am
veggivet wrote:
Mon Nov 12, 2018 9:35 am
For those who may be considering transferring from HSA Bank to Fidelity, it looks like you'd need to liquidate all holdings to cash in order to complete the transfer. It doesn't appear that HSA Bank is set up to transfer assets in kind...
I don't think transfer-in-kind is even a thing in HSAs. It really doesn't matter anyway, since there is no taxable event from liquidating inside an HSA. Get the cash into Fidelity, and buy what you want (even if it is the same funds you had at HSA bank).

The important thing is for HSA Bank to work with Fidelity for a trustee-to-trustee transfer, rather than cutting you a check. Heath Savings Administrators did manage to do this for me, even though they were horrible to deal with in every other way.
Just seeing this thread.. I would want to transfer in kind, since I am in California and selling/tranferring cash is a state taxable event. I own Fidelity TIPS fund at Saturna, would it be able to transfer in kind to Fidelity?

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sperry8
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by sperry8 » Thu Dec 06, 2018 10:39 am

mikep wrote:
Wed Dec 05, 2018 5:22 pm
Horsefly wrote:
Mon Nov 12, 2018 9:49 am
veggivet wrote:
Mon Nov 12, 2018 9:35 am
For those who may be considering transferring from HSA Bank to Fidelity, it looks like you'd need to liquidate all holdings to cash in order to complete the transfer. It doesn't appear that HSA Bank is set up to transfer assets in kind...
I don't think transfer-in-kind is even a thing in HSAs. It really doesn't matter anyway, since there is no taxable event from liquidating inside an HSA. Get the cash into Fidelity, and buy what you want (even if it is the same funds you had at HSA bank).

The important thing is for HSA Bank to work with Fidelity for a trustee-to-trustee transfer, rather than cutting you a check. Heath Savings Administrators did manage to do this for me, even though they were horrible to deal with in every other way.
Just seeing this thread.. I would want to transfer in kind, since I am in California and selling/tranferring cash is a state taxable event. I own Fidelity TIPS fund at Saturna, would it be able to transfer in kind to Fidelity?
I was told by two different reps that transfer in-kind is not allowed. I had to liquidate to cash to transfer.

On another note - I cancelled my HSA account today after successful transfer. Balance showed a negative (due to monthly fees) but I was not charged for it nor was I charged the account closing fee. :sharebeer
Humbling BH contest results: 2017: #516 of 647 | 2016: #121 of 610 | 2015: #18 of 552 | 2014: #225 of 503 | 2013: #383 of 433 | 2012: #366 of 410 | 2011: #113 of 369 | 2010: #53 of 282

mervinj7
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by mervinj7 » Thu Dec 06, 2018 10:49 am

mikep wrote:
Wed Dec 05, 2018 5:22 pm
Just seeing this thread.. I would want to transfer in kind, since I am in California and selling/tranferring cash is a state taxable event. I own Fidelity TIPS fund at Saturna, would it be able to transfer in kind to Fidelity?
Since you are using a TIPS fund, does it actually have any capital gains right now? Many of them are down for the year.

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hoppy08520
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by hoppy08520 » Thu Dec 06, 2018 11:29 am

Hello, here’s an update for people with HSA Bank / TDA who want to transfer to Fidelity HSA.

Summary: My in-kind transfer from TDA to Fidelity successfully posted today in Fidelity, around 11 business days after starting. No evidence at this point of any fees being charged, as far as I can tell.

Details

I did the transfer entirely online in Fidelity, initiated the transfer from within Fidelity, and transferred from the linked TDA account, not from the HSA Bank account. My positions in TDA transferred in-kind, as I requested. Before doing this, I made sure to transfer any cash from HSA Bank into TDA first, so my HSA Bank balance was $0.00.

Fees

I cannot see that I have been charged any transfer or closing fee from TDA or HSA Bank, but I’m not 100% sure. When I try to log in to TDA, it won’t let me — I’ve heard from others that your account can get locked out for a period of time. I also tried to log in to my HSA Bank site via my old health insurance site, but can’t seem to do that anymore either.

As mentioned, I am not seeing any evidence of a fee from HSA Bank or TDA, or a fee reimbursement from Fidelity. If I do see this later, I’ll report back. For reference, my HSA balance is close to $40,000 and this is the only account that I have at Fidelity.

UPDATE 12/7/2018): I verified over the phone with TDA, and verified my before-transfer and after-transfer cash balance, and there was NO FEE from TDA or HSA Bank.I was confused because my cash balance had changed by an odd number ($49.37) before and after. Was that some kind of transfer fee or something? My brain malfunctioned and I initially thought it went down. In fact, my cash amount went UP. Huh? How does that happen. Turns out that this is caused by TDA liquidating fractional shares in my ETF positions. Ahhh, ok. I owed fractional shares (caused by dividend reinvestments), and when doing an in-kind transfer TDA liquidates your fractional shares into cash and transfers only whole shares. EG, if you own 4.75 shares of XYZ at $100/share, then they will transfer 4.00 shares of XYZ, sell the 0.75 shares of XYZ for $75.00, then transfer $75 in cash. I did not see a trade fee for that liquidation of the partial share, fortunately.

Timeline

I opened the Fidelity HSA account and started the transfer in the Fidelity site, entirely online, on Wednesday Nov 21, and the funds posted today, Dec 6, which is around 11 business days. I had the same share counts and cash amount before and after.

There was one snag that required me to make some calls to TDA and HSA Bank, and this caused the overall process to hold up for 2 or 3 business days. Apparently when Fidelity requested an authorization to transfer from TDA, TDA is supposed to “ask” HSA Bank for authorization. Apparently HSA Bank did provide authorization to TDA, but somehow the internal communications hit a snag and TDA “thought” that HSA Bank did not grant authorization, and so TDA rejected the request from Fidelity. After several phone calls from me to figure out what happened, TDA hit the reset button on the process, then apparently TDA “found the letter” (so to speak) from HSA Bank to authorize the transfer request, and then I had to tell Fidelity to try TDA again. So, Fidelity tried again and it all went through a couple of days later.
Last edited by hoppy08520 on Fri Dec 07, 2018 9:36 am, edited 1 time in total.

penumbra
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by penumbra » Thu Dec 06, 2018 11:38 am

Hoppy,
Why did you transfer cash from HSA to TDA first, as opposed to having it transferred directly to Fidelity?

And how did you indicate to TDA that you wanted a transfer in kind? My biggest fear is that TDA will liquidate etf holdings prior to transfer. Thanks for your post!

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hoppy08520
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by hoppy08520 » Thu Dec 06, 2018 11:58 am

penumbra wrote:
Thu Dec 06, 2018 11:38 am
Hoppy,
Why did you transfer cash from HSA to TDA first, as opposed to having it transferred directly to Fidelity?

And how did you indicate to TDA that you wanted a transfer in kind? My biggest fear is that TDA will liquidate etf holdings prior to transfer. Thanks for your post!
penumbra, I can't remember who advised this, but someone in this thread or maybe a person I spoke to at Fidelity, told me: "If you have HSA Bank, transfer your cash from HSA Bank into TD Ameritrade. Then when you do the transfer in Fidelity, when you select your HSA account, give them your TDA account number, not your HSA Bank account number." So that's what I did.

In the online transfer form that I filled out on the Fidelity website, there was an option for "transfer in-kind" and that's what I chose, and my positions did in fact come across in-kind in the same ETF and share-amounts. FWIW, I only had two funds at TDA: 500+ shares in VT (Vanguard Total World Stock) and 2 shares in a SPDR TSM fund (can't remember ticker), plus a small amount of cash that I hadn't gotten around to investing yet.

In HSA Bank, I had some cash from recent payroll contributions that I forgot to transfer into TDA, and I didn't want that $ to get left behind or deal with more issues, so I simply transferred 100% of it from HSA Bank into TDA, so that I had $0 at HSA Bank and all my HSA assets at TDA. Once my last transfer from HSA Bank got to TDA, I didn't bother buying any funds in TDA, I just left it in cash. When the in-kind transfer posted, that cash balance emerged as cash in my Fidelity account. I'll get around to investing that cash in my new Fidelity HSA soon..

Interestingly, when I spoke on the phone to someone at HSA Bank, they told me I was not allowed to do the HSA transfer from TDA, that I had to liquidate my shares at TDA, transfer the $ back to HSA Bank as cash, and then do the transfer from HSA Bank. But that guy clearly was wrong. I read in this thread the advice I wrote in the paragraph above, and that's what I did in spite of what HSA Bank told me. I wanted to transfer in kind because my TDA positions were all in stocks and I wanted to stay in the market. Ironically, in hindsight I would have been better off in cash because of the recent market drop ;-)

exigent
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by exigent » Thu Dec 06, 2018 1:19 pm

exigent wrote:
Thu Nov 29, 2018 9:08 am
Just a quick update on the status of my transfer from HSA Bank to Fidelity...

Nov 17 - Submitted scanned version of signed ToA paperwork via secure message
Nov 21 - Transfer Tracker was updated saying that they had received and were processing paperwork
Nov 21 - Transfer Tracker was updated saying that they had sent paperwork to HSA Bank for review
Nov 28 - HSA Bank cleared out my account and sent funds to Fidelity via check

A couple of things worth noting:

1. Yes, there was a $25 fee, withheld from proceeds before sending check
2. They didn't pay out any accrued interest for Nov even though the month was nearly complete

This was an all cash account, as I hadn't gotten around to setting up the TD Ameritrade side of things yet, so it was a straightforward transfer. I will request reimbursement of the $25 fee from Fidelity once the dust has settled. They have assured me that they'll take care of it. Not sure how long it will take for the check to show up and get credited at Fidelity.

It's annoying that they kept all accrued interest after the funds had sat there for 28 of the 30 days, but were only talking about $10-ish so I'm pretty sure that we'll survive... But if they hadn't gotten to it until Monday, my interest payment would've posted. Oh well.
And... The money was in my account when I checked this morning (Dec 6th). That's actually the estimated date of completion that they initially gave me, so Fidelity was spot-on with their initial prediction.

Minor note: though it initially appeared that they made the distribution on the 28th, it actually processed on the 30th, so they managed to hold my money for all of November, and then keep the interest. I'm happy to be rid of them given that sort of behavior.

The next step is to move a chunk of money from the HSA I have through work (held at Optum). I'm leaving that one open to help avoid FICA taxes on the contributions (which are withheld pre-tax from my checks) and to take advantage of some matching funds.

I'm thinking that I will just withdraw from Optum and do an indirect rollover. Going forward, I will (probably) then repeat this annually, making sure to respect the once-per-12-months limit.

changt81
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by changt81 » Fri Dec 07, 2018 9:35 am

FrugalProfessor wrote:
Tue Dec 04, 2018 11:15 am
My in-kind transfer of assets of VTI from Saturna to Fidelity transfer went through reasonably well today, with a couple of hiccups:

1.) There is still $133 in fractional shares of VTI left at Saturna. Bummer.
2.) I was nailed with a $75 transfer-out fee by Saturna. Unsurprising given that they are simply applying their stated policy.

If I had to do it over again, I'd follow the finance buff's advice, which would have avoided both issues above: https://thefinancebuff.com/how-to-rollo ... r-fee.html. I only came across this article after my blunders.

That said, I have no regrets for jumping ship. I'll just zero out the Saturna account with an HSA distribution of the proceeds remaining after incurring an additional $14.95 selling commission.
Correct me if I am wrong. The link you provided is for Rollover which requires to cash out everything, not in-kind transfer.

For Saturna customer, It seems like we have to eat the $75 transfer fee + 14.95 commission to do the in-kind transfer. There is no way to avoid them if we want to do in-kind transfer.

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sperry8
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by sperry8 » Fri Dec 07, 2018 9:42 am

hoppy08520 wrote:
Thu Dec 06, 2018 11:29 am
Hello, here’s an update for people with HSA Bank / TDA who want to transfer to Fidelity HSA.

Summary: My in-kind transfer from TDA to Fidelity successfully posted today in Fidelity, around 11 business days after starting. No evidence at this point of any fees being charged, as far as I can tell.

Details

I did the transfer entirely online in Fidelity, initiated the transfer from within Fidelity, and transferred from the linked TDA account, not from the HSA Bank account. My positions in TDA transferred in-kind, as I requested. Before doing this, I made sure to transfer any cash from HSA Bank into TDA first, so my HSA Bank balance was $0.00.

Fees

I cannot see that I have been charged any transfer or closing fee from TDA or HSA Bank, but I’m not 100% sure. When I try to log in to TDA, it won’t let me — I’ve heard from others that your account can get locked out for a period of time. I also tried to log in to my HSA Bank site via my old health insurance site, but can’t seem to do that anymore either.

As mentioned, I am not seeing any evidence of a fee from HSA Bank or TDA, or a fee reimbursement from Fidelity. If I do see this later, I’ll report back. For reference, my HSA balance is close to $40,000 and this is the only account that I have at Fidelity.

UPDATE 12/7/2018): I verified over the phone with TDA, and verified my before-transfer and after-transfer cash balance, and there was NO FEE from TDA or HSA Bank.I was confused because my cash balance had changed by an odd number ($49.37) before and after. Was that some kind of transfer fee or something? My brain malfunctioned and I initially thought it went down. In fact, my cash amount went UP. Huh? How does that happen. Turns out that this is caused by TDA liquidating fractional shares in my ETF positions. Ahhh, ok. I owed fractional shares (caused by dividend reinvestments), and when doing an in-kind transfer TDA liquidates your fractional shares into cash and transfers only whole shares. EG, if you own 4.75 shares of XYZ at $100/share, then they will transfer 4.00 shares of XYZ, sell the 0.75 shares of XYZ for $75.00, then transfer $75 in cash. I did not see a trade fee for that liquidation of the partial share, fortunately.

Timeline

I opened the Fidelity HSA account and started the transfer in the Fidelity site, entirely online, on Wednesday Nov 21, and the funds posted today, Dec 6, which is around 11 business days. I had the same share counts and cash amount before and after.

There was one snag that required me to make some calls to TDA and HSA Bank, and this caused the overall process to hold up for 2 or 3 business days. Apparently when Fidelity requested an authorization to transfer from TDA, TDA is supposed to “ask” HSA Bank for authorization. Apparently HSA Bank did provide authorization to TDA, but somehow the internal communications hit a snag and TDA “thought” that HSA Bank did not grant authorization, and so TDA rejected the request from Fidelity. After several phone calls from me to figure out what happened, TDA hit the reset button on the process, then apparently TDA “found the letter” (so to speak) from HSA Bank to authorize the transfer request, and then I had to tell Fidelity to try TDA again. So, Fidelity tried again and it all went through a couple of days later.
So happy you were able to do an in-kind transfer. I wish those Fidelity reps I spoke with told me this was allowed. I challenged them a lot - but they just kept repeating no. So annoying. In any event, I'm with Fidelity now, all cash and waiting to redeploy.
Humbling BH contest results: 2017: #516 of 647 | 2016: #121 of 610 | 2015: #18 of 552 | 2014: #225 of 503 | 2013: #383 of 433 | 2012: #366 of 410 | 2011: #113 of 369 | 2010: #53 of 282

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hoppy08520
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by hoppy08520 » Fri Dec 07, 2018 9:45 am

Hi, one little update about TDA transfers. This probably applies to more than just HSA transfers, but it confused me and I thought I would share this information with others.

In my HSA Bank / TDA HSA account, two of my ETF positions had fractional shares, e.g. you might own 410.37 shares of VTI. The extra 0.37 shares would have come from dividend reinvestment.

When TDA transferred to Fidelity, they can only transfer whole shares. So in the example above, to execute the transfer, TDA liquidated 0.37 shares of VTI at whatever was the current price, lets, say $183.22, which would be $67.79, and then add the $67.79 into your cash balance and transfer it as cash.

I was puzzled by why my before-transfer and after-transfer cash balance had changed. At first I thought the difference was some kind of fee until I realized the cash balance actually went UP after the transfer and not DOWN. It took me a phone call to TDA (because my online account was locked and I couldn't see the details) to learn that my before-transfer positions held some fractional shares and and then they explained how this works.

BTW, there was no trade charge added to liquidate the fractional shares.
Last edited by hoppy08520 on Fri Dec 07, 2018 1:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

schildi
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by schildi » Fri Dec 07, 2018 1:37 pm

sperry8 wrote:
Fri Dec 07, 2018 9:42 am
So happy you were able to do an in-kind transfer. I wish those Fidelity reps I spoke with told me this was allowed. I challenged them a lot - but they just kept repeating no. So annoying. In any event, I'm with Fidelity now, all cash and waiting to redeploy.
At first I had also regretted selling my holdings in the TDA account, but right now it looks like it wasn't too bad, looking at the direction the market went recently. If all is said and done, you may have saved a few bucks, who knows? That's how it goes with the stock market, you never know, there is no way to tell ahead of time.

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sperry8
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by sperry8 » Sat Dec 08, 2018 7:34 am

schildi wrote:
Fri Dec 07, 2018 1:37 pm
sperry8 wrote:
Fri Dec 07, 2018 9:42 am
So happy you were able to do an in-kind transfer. I wish those Fidelity reps I spoke with told me this was allowed. I challenged them a lot - but they just kept repeating no. So annoying. In any event, I'm with Fidelity now, all cash and waiting to redeploy.
At first I had also regretted selling my holdings in the TDA account, but right now it looks like it wasn't too bad, looking at the direction the market went recently. If all is said and done, you may have saved a few bucks, who knows? That's how it goes with the stock market, you never know, there is no way to tell ahead of time.
In hindsight that may prove true. But I don't like the fact that the reps were misinformed and providing me incorrect info. I don't like the fact that I sold regardless of outcome because now that I am out I must overcome an emotional hurdle on when to get back in. None of this should have occured. And I didn't just accept what the reps said - I pushed very hard. They strongly told me (and even got annoyed) when I pressed and said in-kind is allowed. I hung up and called another rep and they told me the same thing. Oh how I wish I took down their names. That third call with their supervisor would've been a doozy!
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by lstone19 » Sat Dec 08, 2018 9:19 am

Only stumbled on to this topic Monday and immediately started moving my HSA from HSAbank to Fidelity. Plan was to liquidate everything at TDA, distribute from HSAbank to my checking account, and then 60-day rollover. Getting even more frustrated by HSAbank. First, everything is taking a day longer than it should. Sell of TDA funds was initiated Monday night to execute Tuesday which it did. But even though it settled Wednesday (and yes, Wednesday was a settlement day despite the market closure for the Bush funeral), not available to pull back to HSAbank until Thursday. Transfer executed in the wee hours Friday morning only to find HSAbank wouldn't show balance as available until today (Saturday morning). And now I went in to make the distribution only to find they have a $2,500/day on-line distribution limit. So now do I just bite the bullet and let Fidelity pull it as a custodian to custodian transfer (and get hit with a closing fee) or do I distribute it $2,500/day over seven days (balance is ~$16k)? I will be so glad to be done with them.
Last edited by lstone19 on Sat Dec 08, 2018 10:50 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by FrugalProfessor » Sat Dec 08, 2018 10:12 am

changt81 wrote:
Fri Dec 07, 2018 9:35 am
FrugalProfessor wrote:
Tue Dec 04, 2018 11:15 am
My in-kind transfer of assets of VTI from Saturna to Fidelity transfer went through reasonably well today, with a couple of hiccups:

1.) There is still $133 in fractional shares of VTI left at Saturna. Bummer.
2.) I was nailed with a $75 transfer-out fee by Saturna. Unsurprising given that they are simply applying their stated policy.

If I had to do it over again, I'd follow the finance buff's advice, which would have avoided both issues above: https://thefinancebuff.com/how-to-rollo ... r-fee.html. I only came across this article after my blunders.

That said, I have no regrets for jumping ship. I'll just zero out the Saturna account with an HSA distribution of the proceeds remaining after incurring an additional $14.95 selling commission.
Correct me if I am wrong. The link you provided is for Rollover which requires to cash out everything, not in-kind transfer.

For Saturna customer, It seems like we have to eat the $75 transfer fee + 14.95 commission to do the in-kind transfer. There is no way to avoid them if we want to do in-kind transfer.
This is my understanding as well. However, given the two blunders, in hindsight I would have preferred to simply to the finance buff's method.
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by dand49 » Sat Dec 08, 2018 10:26 am

I Transferred my Lively HSA to Fidelity HSA.

All Assets in TDA

Requested Transfer online on 11/20

Received call from Fidelity rep on 11/27 stating they needed Lively to unlock TDA account.
Had already received a message from TDA that account was ready to xfer and informed
Fidelity rep.

Transfer was completed on 12/3 showing a $50 account transfer charge.

I called Lively on 12/4 to close my account and told them about the $50 charge. Lively reimbursed the $50 on 12/7 in my Fidelity HSA.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by Thrifty Femme » Sat Dec 08, 2018 10:31 am

dand49 wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 10:26 am
I Transferred my Lively HSA to Fidelity HSA.

All Assets in TDA

Requested Transfer online on 11/20

Received call from Fidelity rep on 11/27 stating they needed Lively to unlock TDA account.
Had already received a message from TDA that account was ready to xfer and informed
Fidelity rep.

Transfer was completed on 12/3 showing a $50 account transfer charge.

I called Lively on 12/4 to close my account and told them about the $50 charge. Lively reimbursed the $50 on 12/7 in my Fidelity HSA.
Did you liquidate or transfer in kind?

dand49
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by dand49 » Sat Dec 08, 2018 10:38 am

Liquidate

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by jhfenton » Sat Dec 08, 2018 11:25 am

dand49 wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 10:26 am
I called Lively on 12/4 to close my account and told them about the $50 charge. Lively reimbursed the $50 on 12/7 in my Fidelity HSA.
:beer I suspected Lively might do that, but in the end TDA left the $50 behind in my TDA account and I just pulled it to my Lively account myself.

Fidelity also reimbursed the $50 cash debit that TDA transferred over with my in-kind transfer.

Of course, as it turned out, I would have been better liquidating. But market drops don't bother me. Missing a market jump would drive me crazy.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by BlueGator » Sat Dec 08, 2018 3:44 pm

I am posting here to see if anyone has executed a transfer from BenefitWallet to the Fidelity HSA.I need to keep my BenefitWallet account open to take advantage of payroll deductions, otherwise I would close and walk away.

I would like to manually perform a cash sweep on a recurring basis, but the amount of paperwork and fees involved with a trustee to trustee transfer seems cumbersome and costly to do more than once.

I currently have the two accounts linked via the Fidelity EFT tool, but the Fidelity phone rep told me it would be coded as a 60 day rollover if I initiated a move this way.

Is anyone else trying to accomplish the same thing?
What is the penalty for multiple rollovers?
Is there a way to combine all tax forms at the end of the year and present a picture that will keep me out of trouble?

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by Atgard » Sat Dec 08, 2018 8:55 pm

cas wrote:
Mon Dec 03, 2018 7:33 am
Echohammer419 wrote:
Sun Dec 02, 2018 7:52 pm
[ . . .] I'm a big believer in a set it and forget it approach to investing...so much so that I barely remember my password into HSA bank, let along how to do transfers. [. . .]
Side note (possibly mostly for the paranoid): apparently HSAs are subject to escheatment (unclaimed property seizure) under at least some state laws.
This just happened to my wife, her set-and-forget HSA got escheated to the state.

Not really a huge deal, the state sent her the check, and luckily Fidelity just happened to start offering individual HSAs! So having a check in hand probably made it a little easier to transfer over to Fidelity anyway.

But yeah, make sure to update your address (the bank's marketing department sent us plenty of spam to our updated address, but apparently the warning letter went to the old address), and I always think it's a good idea to log in at least once a year just to check up on things.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by JustinR » Sun Dec 09, 2018 12:47 am

dand49 wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 10:26 am
I Transferred my Lively HSA to Fidelity HSA.

All Assets in TDA

Requested Transfer online on 11/20

Received call from Fidelity rep on 11/27 stating they needed Lively to unlock TDA account.
Had already received a message from TDA that account was ready to xfer and informed
Fidelity rep.

Transfer was completed on 12/3 showing a $50 account transfer charge.

I called Lively on 12/4 to close my account and told them about the $50 charge. Lively reimbursed the $50 on 12/7 in my Fidelity HSA.
What do you mean by "told them" (lively) about the $50 charge?

For what reason would they reimburse you?

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by jhfenton » Sun Dec 09, 2018 7:38 am

BlueGator wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 3:44 pm
What is the penalty for multiple rollovers?
The second and subsequent rollovers within 12 months are not eligible rollover contributions, so they would be excess contributions to the extent that they exceed your annual contribution limit. Excess contributions are subject to a continuing 6% excise tax each year until removed.

I'm sorry that I don't have any suggestions to offer on BenefitWallet. I don't have any experience with them at all.
JustinR wrote:
Sun Dec 09, 2018 12:47 am
dand49 wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 10:26 am
I called Lively on 12/4 to close my account and told them about the $50 charge. Lively reimbursed the $50 on 12/7 in my Fidelity HSA.
What do you mean by "told them" (lively) about the $50 charge?

For what reason would they reimburse you?
I assume Lively reimbursed the charge because they say explicitly all over their website that there are no termination, transfer, or account closure fees.

If Fidelity had not reimbursed the $50 debit that TD Ameritrade pushed over, and TD Ameritrade had actually charged the $50 rather than leave it sitting in my otherwise empty TD Ameritrade account where I could pull it out, I might have asked LIvely to reimburse the $50 fee too.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by harmoniousmonk » Sun Dec 09, 2018 9:15 am

If I liquidate by selling Spider total stock market etf at TD Ameritrade and take a loss to transfer to Fidelity and buy Fidelity total stock market etf within 30 days is that a wash sale?
In efficient markets, mediocrity is the norm. | Never confuse genius for luck and a bull market.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by jhfenton » Sun Dec 09, 2018 10:05 am

harmoniousmonk wrote:
Sun Dec 09, 2018 9:15 am
If I liquidate by selling Spider total stock market etf at TD Ameritrade and take a loss to transfer to Fidelity and buy Fidelity total stock market etf within 30 days is that a wash sale?
The sale is inside your HSA, so it can't be a wash sale. Replacement property purchased inside an IRA--and maybe an HSA--can trigger a wash sale if you sell the same property in a taxable account, but an underlying sale in a tax-advantaged account cannot be a wash sale. You can't claim losses in those accounts anyway.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by Hayden » Sun Dec 09, 2018 10:53 am

Still not done. Fidelity mailed the transfer form to HSA Bank. HSA Bank says they never received it. So, now my form, with SSN etc, is who knows where. Fidelity is re-mailing the form to them.

Apparently the address Fidelity used is for overnight mail only, but Fidelity used regular mail so HSA Bank didn't receive it. I know, that makes no sense. :oops:

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by lstone19 » Sun Dec 09, 2018 11:14 am

Hayden wrote:
Sun Dec 09, 2018 10:53 am
Still not done. Fidelity mailed the transfer form to HSA Bank. HSA Bank says they never received it. So, now my form, with SSN etc, is who knows where. Fidelity is re-mailing the form to them.
Lovely. Another reason I'm glad I decided to do an indirect transfer (60-day rollover) even though HSAbank's $2,500 per day limit means it will take me seven (business I assume) days to transfer it all to my checking account - then one big check to Fidelity. Plus I'm getting lots of web security errors when I try to read some of their help pages. Can't be done with HSAbank soon enough.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by Hayden » Sun Dec 09, 2018 11:16 am

I receive the Form 5498 each year by logging into my HSA Bank account and downloading the form. If I close the account at HSA Bank, how will I receive the form?

For those of you who closed the account, was there some setting for them to mail the form?

wudged
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by wudged » Sun Dec 09, 2018 11:31 am

Hayden wrote:
Sun Dec 09, 2018 11:16 am
I receive the Form 5498 each year by logging into my HSA Bank account and downloading the form. If I close the account at HSA Bank, how will I receive the form?

For those of you who closed the account, was there some setting for them to mail the form?
When I called to close my account, I specifically asked about this and was told the login would remain active to download the form. However, she also called it a "1099-SA" instead of 5498-SA. This was on Tuesday, and my login is still working today, but it still shows a negative $3 balance that she said would be cleared. So who knows what will happen.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by Thrifty Femme » Sun Dec 09, 2018 12:05 pm

Hayden wrote:
Sun Dec 09, 2018 11:16 am
I receive the Form 5498 each year by logging into my HSA Bank account and downloading the form. If I close the account at HSA Bank, how will I receive the form?

For those of you who closed the account, was there some setting for them to mail the form?
I would think they would be obligated to mail the form if they have yanked your online access.

lstone19
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by lstone19 » Sun Dec 09, 2018 12:08 pm

wudged wrote:
Sun Dec 09, 2018 11:31 am
Hayden wrote:
Sun Dec 09, 2018 11:16 am
I receive the Form 5498 each year by logging into my HSA Bank account and downloading the form. If I close the account at HSA Bank, how will I receive the form?

For those of you who closed the account, was there some setting for them to mail the form?
When I called to close my account, I specifically asked about this and was told the login would remain active to download the form. However, she also called it a "1099-SA" instead of 5498-SA. This was on Tuesday, and my login is still working today, but it still shows a negative $3 balance that she said would be cleared. So who knows what will happen.
There are both. 1099-SA documents your distributions for inclusion on your tax return and is issued by end of January (or maybe sometime in February). 5498-SA documents your contributions and balance and is strictly for you records. For both, a copy is sent to the IRS.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by Spirit Rider » Sun Dec 09, 2018 3:18 pm

lstone19 wrote:
Sun Dec 09, 2018 12:08 pm
There are both. 1099-SA documents your distributions for inclusion on your tax return and is issued by end of January (or maybe sometime in February). 5498-SA documents your contributions and balance and is strictly for you records. For both, a copy is sent to the IRS.
A Form 1099 of any kind is not include in your return. Tax software has you enter the data to properly complete your return. Like any Form 5498 they are both for your records, but the IRS also gets a copy from the custodian.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by Cash » Sun Dec 09, 2018 5:57 pm

Has anyone done a direct transfer of the assets in their HSA Bank-linked TD Ameritrade account, but kept the HSA Bank account open for employer pass-through contributions? I just want to make sure there won't be any issues receiving my employer contributions in the HSA Bank account if I transfer all of the assets in the linked TDA account to Fidelity.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by lstone19 » Sun Dec 09, 2018 7:16 pm

Spirit Rider wrote:
Sun Dec 09, 2018 3:18 pm
lstone19 wrote:
Sun Dec 09, 2018 12:08 pm
There are both. 1099-SA documents your distributions for inclusion on your tax return and is issued by end of January (or maybe sometime in February). 5498-SA documents your contributions and balance and is strictly for you records. For both, a copy is sent to the IRS.
A Form 1099 of any kind is not include in your return. Tax software has you enter the data to properly complete your return. Like any Form 5498 they are both for your records, but the IRS also gets a copy from the custodian.
Depends on what you mean by “include” and what “for inclusion on your tax return” modifies. The data on any 1099 is, almost without exception, included on your return. You normally don’t send it with your return (if it shows withholding, then it is attached to a paper return as it is your receipt for amounts withheld). In the the quote from me, “for inclusion on your tax return” modifies “your distributions” which are most definitely going on your tax return.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by exigent » Sun Dec 09, 2018 8:10 pm

I sent Fidelity a secure message yesterday requesting reimbursement of the $25 fee imposed by HSA Bank when I transferred my HSA. I included a pdf showing the fee deduction prior to them emptying my account to send the funds to Fidelity. Today, I received a reply saying that they’ve forwarded my request to the “back office” and that it should be processed within two days. So far so good...

I also noticed that my balance is currently sitting in an FDIC-insured “core” position that pays something like 0.3%. I clicked the link to change the default core position to a money market mutual fund with a better return but was greeted with a pop up saying that no alternatives were available, and that I’d need to call for assistance. When I called, the voice system ultimately routed me to the HSA group, which was closed for the weekend.

Has anyone had luck changing the core position in their HSA?

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by jhfenton » Sun Dec 09, 2018 9:07 pm

exigent wrote:
Sun Dec 09, 2018 8:10 pm
Has anyone had luck changing the core position in their HSA?
I get the same message when I try to change mine:
Note: There Are No Other Core Options for This Account
There are no other core options available for your account. Additional options might be available by calling a Fidelity representative at 800-xxx-xxxx.
I haven't had any money in it, though, so I haven't tried calling. Fidelity's Treasury and Government money market funds have better yields (1.87% and 1.86%) than 0.31%, but they still trail Vanguard's Federal Money Market (2.22%) by quite a bit due to ER's of 42 bp. They are both supposed to be available in retirement accounts, but I couldn't find anything on options for HSAs.

My plan, if I decide to keep any near cash in the account, is to use FUMBX (Fidelity Short-Term Treasury Bond Index Fund). It is a 1-5 treasury fund. It has an SEC yield of 2.87%, an ER of 0.03%, and a duration of 2.58 years. With Fidelity's new zero kick, there are no minimum investments.

I won't be able to spend directly from it, but I don't plan on ordering a debit card for the account anyway.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by Oh123 » Mon Dec 10, 2018 1:20 pm

I have a question regarding HSA bank/TD to fidelity HSA transfer. Right now I pay $5.50 monthly at HSA bank and it is deducted on the first week of the month. Now, if I transfer full cash balance to TD and then transfer it to Fidelity along with other investments, how can I pay the remaining bill from HSA bank. Is it a good idea to leave $5.50 at HSA bank to cover the fee for the last month? Is it possible to close HSA bank account if the balance is non zero? Will I have to take the balance as distribution before the account closing?

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by dalmatiandan » Mon Dec 10, 2018 5:50 pm

Oh123 wrote:
Mon Dec 10, 2018 1:20 pm
I have a question regarding HSA bank/TD to fidelity HSA transfer. Right now I pay $5.50 monthly at HSA bank and it is deducted on the first week of the month. Now, if I transfer full cash balance to TD and then transfer it to Fidelity along with other investments, how can I pay the remaining bill from HSA bank. Is it a good idea to leave $5.50 at HSA bank to cover the fee for the last month? Is it possible to close HSA bank account if the balance is non zero? Will I have to take the balance as distribution before the account closing?
When I transferred from HSA Bank, I started the process inmediately after the $5.50 fees were processed that particular month, then went ahead and moved every other penny to TDA, leaving $0 in HSA Bank side.

After my TDA assets were moved, it was an easy phone call to close HSA Bank acct, and I was never charged a fee.

Dan

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by schildi » Mon Dec 10, 2018 6:44 pm

schildi wrote:
Tue Dec 04, 2018 8:24 pm
Thanks everybody for the great information here!

My timeline wasn't as quick as some of the reports here, but it looks like I am getting there.
I am transferring from Elements (formerly Eli Lilly) CU, and the linked TDAmeritrade account. I went the long route by selling my positions at TDAmeritrade, then transferring to Elements CU, then doing the trustee to trustee transfer to Fidelity.
Here is my timeline:
- 11/16: sold positions at TDA and waited a couple days for settlement
- 11/20: submitted transfer paperwork in person at Fidelity Investment Center branch
- 11/21: transferred cash from TDA to Elements
- 11/27: paperwork shows as received by Fidelity online and transfer request submitted to Elements CU
- this is when I started talking to Elements CU, a person was assigned and I was able to email with her and call
- 12/04: received email from Elements that check was sent to Fidelity that day; HSA account at Elements has been removed online (but I still have access to my TDAmeritrade account, even though that should be closed automatically as well)
- now waiting for the check to get to Fidelity and be deposited, hopefully by EOW.

Fidelity estimates completion by 12/10, I am sure that it will happen by then, probably a little earlier.
No fees so far, beside the trading fee for selling at TDA ($6.95 per position)

While it took a little longer and being out of the market for a while is usually not desirable, it has worked out ok so far for me in this case. My main position (VTI) is now lower than when I sold, let's see what I end up with when everything is said and done .....
The Fidelity estimate of completion on 12/10 was spot-on, I can report completion of the transfer as of today.
At the same date, my access to TDA has been removed, and my HSA at Elements is gone as well.
No fees, besides for selling my Vanguard funds at TDA.
After the fact, I can say that I am overall pretty happy with how everything went. It was pure luck with the direction that the stock market went during the time when the funds were out of the market.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by exigent » Tue Dec 11, 2018 10:13 am

schildi wrote:
Mon Dec 10, 2018 6:44 pm
The Fidelity estimate of completion on 12/10 was spot-on, I can report completion of the transfer as of today.
The fact that they are so consistently accurate makes me wonder if they overestimate the completion date, and then just sit on the money if they receive it ahead of time. They could pick up a bit of interest, and it would give them an excellent "on-time" record, much like airlines who overestimate flight times to help ensure an on-time arrival.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by indexfundfan » Tue Dec 11, 2018 10:54 am

exigent wrote:
Tue Dec 11, 2018 10:13 am
schildi wrote:
Mon Dec 10, 2018 6:44 pm
The Fidelity estimate of completion on 12/10 was spot-on, I can report completion of the transfer as of today.
The fact that they are so consistently accurate makes me wonder if they overestimate the completion date, and then just sit on the money if they receive it ahead of time. They could pick up a bit of interest, and it would give them an excellent "on-time" record, much like airlines who overestimate flight times to help ensure an on-time arrival.
They may over estimate but I don't think they sit on your money if the funds arrived earlier.

My transfer was completed 11/30 with an original estimated date of 12/4.
My signature has been deleted.

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