[Small, Portable, and Ductless Air Conditioners]

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Spirit Rider
Posts: 8139
Joined: Fri Mar 02, 2007 2:39 pm

Re: [Small, Portable, and Ductless Air Conditioners]

Post by Spirit Rider » Wed Jul 11, 2018 9:05 am

I don't think I have ever heard of a ground source retrofit where there wasn't already existing ductwork.

The only one I am familiar with was as suggested by Alf 101: This was essentially drilling a well with a sufficient flow rate.

They had major hassles getting federal and state regulatory approval for the water discharge even though they had a water drainage easement 50ft. from their house.

pshonore
Posts: 6386
Joined: Sun Jun 28, 2009 2:21 pm

Re: [Small, Portable, and Ductless Air Conditioners]

Post by pshonore » Wed Jul 11, 2018 9:58 am

Spirit Rider wrote:
Wed Jul 11, 2018 9:05 am
I don't think I have ever heard of a ground source retrofit where there wasn't already existing ductwork.

The only one I am familiar with was as suggested by Alf 101: This was essentially drilling a well with a sufficient flow rate.

They had major hassles getting federal and state regulatory approval for the water discharge even though they had a water drainage easement 50ft. from their house.
Sounds like an "open loop" pump and dump system. There are also closed loop systems.

http://www.geothermalgenius.org/how-it- ... op-fields/

VaR
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Joined: Sat Dec 05, 2015 11:27 pm

Re: [Small, Portable, and Ductless Air Conditioners]

Post by VaR » Wed Jul 11, 2018 11:33 am

Alf 101 wrote:
Wed Jul 11, 2018 8:46 am
Also, with an oil furnace and baseboard heat, I fear this might also require great rework inside the house to make it functional.
Wait, you have an oil furnace? In your original post you said you only had baseboard heat. Electric resistance baseboard heat would be wildly expensive to run in your climate zone, this is what made me wonder if switching it out would be cost effective.

So do you have electric resistance baseboard heat or do you have a oil-filled or hydronic baseboard heating with an oil furnace? This might mean that I have a fundamental misunderstanding of your situation.

Alf 101
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Joined: Wed Sep 01, 2010 11:24 am

Re: [Small, Portable, and Ductless Air Conditioners]

Post by Alf 101 » Wed Jul 11, 2018 1:00 pm

My error. It is an oil furnace with hydronic baseboard heat. This is a new one to me -- up to now everywhere I lived had natural gas.

I'll have to go back and check what our average fuel costs are per month over the winter. I did talk last night to a HVAC contractor, who I was able to connect up with through a personal connection. He said that he installed a Fujitsu mini-split system for his 2400 sq. ft house. He said the average cost to cool the house during the summer was about $30/month. As for heating, he said he could run it into the shoulder season -- depending on the year maybe into the first days of December, and firing back up in early March. He quoted the price of heating during this late fall/early spring period amounted to about $60/month extra on average in the electric bill. Of course he was trying to sell me something, but if true, the ROI may take some time. Still our realtor was very convinced this was a feature that added to the value of a home when selling it.

More to come...

VaR
Posts: 565
Joined: Sat Dec 05, 2015 11:27 pm

Re: [Small, Portable, and Ductless Air Conditioners]

Post by VaR » Wed Jul 11, 2018 3:18 pm

Alf 101 wrote:
Wed Jul 11, 2018 1:00 pm
My error. It is an oil furnace with hydronic baseboard heat. This is a new one to me -- up to now everywhere I lived had natural gas.

I'll have to go back and check what our average fuel costs are per month over the winter. I did talk last night to a HVAC contractor, who I was able to connect up with through a personal connection. He said that he installed a Fujitsu mini-split system for his 2400 sq. ft house. He said the average cost to cool the house during the summer was about $30/month. As for heating, he said he could run it into the shoulder season -- depending on the year maybe into the first days of December, and firing back up in early March. He quoted the price of heating during this late fall/early spring period amounted to about $60/month extra on average in the electric bill. Of course he was trying to sell me something, but if true, the ROI may take some time. Still our realtor was very convinced this was a feature that added to the value of a home when selling it.

More to come...
A ballpark estimate for the shoulder season savings of a heat pump over heating oil is 40% - but only for the months that the heat pump can operate, so say down to 0 F for Mitsubishi but I'd see if you can get some better estimates of heat pump efficiency under the 17 F that I was able to find.

A geothermal heat pump will net you 65% savings the entire winter and some summer savings as well. But as you said, the upfront cost will be high since you don't have an existing forced air setup. Too bad they don't have ductless geothermal. (Actually, I think they might but it seems very specialized)

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