Is there a boglehead muscle car?
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Is there a boglehead muscle car?
Owning a muscle car doesn’t seem to be a very economical thing to do. But for those that do, which is the best choice? I have been looking at the more fuel efficient v6/ecoboost, love the look of the challenger/charger but not too excited about Chrysler reputation, although it seems to have come a long way from where it was before. The Charger has always been my favorite car, but I don’t think I could live with myself if I bought one and it crapped out on me.
The mustang is popular and seems to have the best rating reliability wise, although the Mustang is almost too popular to me and doesntt stand out as much on the road to me as say a Camaro, challenger or charger.
Of course there are the more powerful options (GT, R/T, Hellcat) but I’m looking to stay below $25k. Plus it is mostly the appearance of muscle without the performance/noise I am chasing after
The mustang is popular and seems to have the best rating reliability wise, although the Mustang is almost too popular to me and doesntt stand out as much on the road to me as say a Camaro, challenger or charger.
Of course there are the more powerful options (GT, R/T, Hellcat) but I’m looking to stay below $25k. Plus it is mostly the appearance of muscle without the performance/noise I am chasing after
Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
I think it's a Tesla with Ludicrous Speed.
I suppose one day somebody will put a Mustang body on a Tesla frame.
I suppose one day somebody will put a Mustang body on a Tesla frame.
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Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
BogleHead Smart Car Muscle Car
Cheers
Cheers
Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
anything AMG
- PrettyCoolWorkshop
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Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
Probably a Nissan 240sx. That is the car that a lot of drifters buy for cheap so they can modify the heck out of them for cheap.
Be greedy and fearful. All the time.
Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
A modified Honda Civic. That's what the kids covet around here. Leave the car for a few weeks at a shop and you'll not recognize it when you pick it up. Shouldn't cost too much and if its just for show for you the chip won't show any abuse so resale will be quick and easy.
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Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
Any rental car is definitely a muscle car as well. I always laugh when people talk about buying rental cars.
Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
I see no reason why a modern day muscle car couldn't be on the list.
People don't think twice about buying a $50k Honda Pilot and then not have more than 2 people in it 99% of the time.
Buy a couple year old Camaro SS or Mustang GT and you'll have a fun and reliable car that will cost you less to own over it's lifetime than your average SUV. There are certain families where they don't make sense but for someone like myself who doesn't have kids, have another vehicle for long road trips, etc. they would be a fine choice.
If you go with a Mustang or Camaro I would go with the V8 without hesitation. The V6 options are a lot better than they use to be but the V8 is still where it's at. They get good gas mileage and they sound great. Most have active exhaust so they can be quiet if you want them to be. The only problem I have with the camaro is rear visibility. Correct mirror adjustment helps a lot but it's still pretty bad. I'd guess 95% of the people on the road have their mirrors set up incorrectly.
People don't think twice about buying a $50k Honda Pilot and then not have more than 2 people in it 99% of the time.
Buy a couple year old Camaro SS or Mustang GT and you'll have a fun and reliable car that will cost you less to own over it's lifetime than your average SUV. There are certain families where they don't make sense but for someone like myself who doesn't have kids, have another vehicle for long road trips, etc. they would be a fine choice.
If you go with a Mustang or Camaro I would go with the V8 without hesitation. The V6 options are a lot better than they use to be but the V8 is still where it's at. They get good gas mileage and they sound great. Most have active exhaust so they can be quiet if you want them to be. The only problem I have with the camaro is rear visibility. Correct mirror adjustment helps a lot but it's still pretty bad. I'd guess 95% of the people on the road have their mirrors set up incorrectly.
Last edited by dsmclone on Mon May 14, 2018 8:10 am, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
The Nissan Versa. It's the most inexpensive car sold today. I tend to flex my muscles elsewhere.
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Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
The Chevrolet SS comes to mind.
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Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
A bogglehead muscle car would be built by the owner rather than purchased as a muscle car. You might procure a motor such as this idea for a "free" 500hp LS motor produced by mixing and matching junkyard components and selling the extras:
https://oppositelock.kinja.com/how-to-s ... 1131506504
And then stuff it into an inexpensive and unassuming shell.
https://oppositelock.kinja.com/how-to-s ... 1131506504
And then stuff it into an inexpensive and unassuming shell.
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- JMacDonald
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Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
This website might give you some information on how a car you are interested in has been doing:
https://www.carcomplaints.com
https://www.carcomplaints.com
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Joe
Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
A Suburu WRX with snow tires.
Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
If it’s going to be a summer car, a C5 corvette is a good choice. You can get a immaculate, low mileage, 6 speed convertible for under $15K, have a 170 mph car that still gets 30 mpg on the highway. If you want something newer, 2011 or newer mustang Gt’s are good choices, just look for the garage Queen not the daily driver.
Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
Don't buy a v6 mustang, camaro, or charger/challenger. Aside from being boring to drive, it will be completely worthless in a few years where as the v8 version should retain value pretty well.
Besides, everyone laughs at the guy driving a v6 camaro/mustang.
Besides, everyone laughs at the guy driving a v6 camaro/mustang.
Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
I rented a camaro ss convertible for a month and loved it, so if I was going new(er) I'd look into one of these. I love the challengers, but I'm a convertible guy.
My personal preference is the "real" musclecars from that era (American models, 60s to early 70s) and is what I personally own. The ones that I own get driven and driven fairly hard once in a while, as that is what they are for. I prefer non-matching number cars and/or well done 'clones' to the collectibles, as I want to have fun with them, and not pay too much for them. Cars like this can be had for anywhere between $5k to $25k with varying degrees of quality and very model dependent. Mopars in general are more expensive, with many Ford and GM models being very reasonable.
So, that being said I also like to wrench. If you don't, or don't have the space or tools to, then this might not be the best choice.
My personal preference is the "real" musclecars from that era (American models, 60s to early 70s) and is what I personally own. The ones that I own get driven and driven fairly hard once in a while, as that is what they are for. I prefer non-matching number cars and/or well done 'clones' to the collectibles, as I want to have fun with them, and not pay too much for them. Cars like this can be had for anywhere between $5k to $25k with varying degrees of quality and very model dependent. Mopars in general are more expensive, with many Ford and GM models being very reasonable.
So, that being said I also like to wrench. If you don't, or don't have the space or tools to, then this might not be the best choice.
Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
Come on now, that's the antithesis of a muscle car.
To qualify your ride as a muscle car, you have to buy a reliable modern day 2 door coupe with a V8 from GM, Ford or Dodge. Upon delivery, start doing completely idiotic mods: like changing out the camshaft, ECU tune, add a supercharger or turbocharger, exhaust, suspension, whatever your budget will allow. In doing so, you'll render the car completely unreliable, horrible to drive... but fun as hell to play with in the garage.
Or just buy a classic muscle car.
Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
Oh, NASCAR runs the Camry.
I often see the Camry recommended, so that's it, That must be the Boglehead Muscle Car
I often see the Camry recommended, so that's it, That must be the Boglehead Muscle Car
Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
I'll second that - I've got one. Bought it with 125K on the odometer. Looks good and goes real quick-like. As noted above, if you can keep your right foot out of it, you'll get nearly 30MPG on the highway.jeffG wrote: ↑Mon May 14, 2018 8:38 am If it’s going to be a summer car, a C5 corvette is a good choice. You can get a immaculate, low mileage, 6 speed convertible for under $15K, have a 170 mph car that still gets 30 mpg on the highway. If you want something newer, 2011 or newer mustang Gt’s are good choices, just look for the garage Queen not the daily driver.
Semper Augustus
Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
Boglehead muscle car?
A 25 year old Toyota Camry with a spoiler.
A 25 year old Toyota Camry with a spoiler.
Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
I had a 2009 Pontiac G8 GT. Loved driving it. Unfortunately, Pontiac is no longer around. The same vehicle has been repackaged as the Chevy SS but I think it just got discontinued. Maybe look at getting a 2016.
Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
Not muscle, but used Infiniti G37 coupes are dirt cheap now.
330hp, pseudo luxury, japanese reliability. Terrible gas mileage, so thats the only anti-boglehead thing about it.
330hp, pseudo luxury, japanese reliability. Terrible gas mileage, so thats the only anti-boglehead thing about it.
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Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
OP ends by saying looking for the appearance of a muscle car without the performance/noise so in reality OP is not looking for a muscle car at all but a boy racer trim package might fit the bill.....
- nisiprius
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Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
I think it's about "investing advice inspired by Jack Bogle," not fashion or lifestyle advice.
But, of course, according to the Vanguard cost comparison tool, the savings on 0.15% expense ratio instead of 0.75%, for a year 2050 target-date fund, on a $500,000 portfolio, over 10 years, assuming 6% annual returns...
..."could" create $51,593.93 more wealth, which is more than the difference between a Toyota Yaris and a Ford Mustang Shelby GT350.
But, of course, according to the Vanguard cost comparison tool, the savings on 0.15% expense ratio instead of 0.75%, for a year 2050 target-date fund, on a $500,000 portfolio, over 10 years, assuming 6% annual returns...
..."could" create $51,593.93 more wealth, which is more than the difference between a Toyota Yaris and a Ford Mustang Shelby GT350.
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Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
Look into the Honda Civic Type R
Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
My Boglehead muscle car is a 2007 Honda Civic Hybrid. I measure my cars by their mileage, maintenance costs, and lack of impact to my budget. I have a friend with a similar car, and we bet on how high we can push the miles per gallon (The Hyper-miling Challenge).
I'd rather sink my spare funds into investing, not in a depreciating asset.
I'd rather sink my spare funds into investing, not in a depreciating asset.
Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
I own a Dodge charger RT with the V8. Great car , comfortable , fast , sounds great and looks aweseme. Dont care about the gas mileage so far has been solid would not worry about reliability , buy the car you want. It's my toy .
Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
We just got a low mileage Challenger SRT8 - it is a fun car, true modern muscle car. Was a bit of a splurge, but we're doing well on the other finances and figured why not, it's time to live. DW is just going back to work, so she reallocated my bonus for me - and she's the bigger fan of it than me.
Now will probably need to start a speeding ticket fund.
Now will probably need to start a speeding ticket fund.
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Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
Going with the “sleeper car” / millionaire next door angle… I would suggest that the recently discontinued Chevy SS would be the ideal boglehead muscle car.
You have a very nice old-school performance sedan that everyone thinks is a rental Malibu or Impala.
You have a very nice old-school performance sedan that everyone thinks is a rental Malibu or Impala.
Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
I've never heard a muscle car owner say "I really wish I would have gotten the smaller engine".
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Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
It certainly isn't a muscle car but driving my 2005 Honda S2000 is a blast and it looks good on the road.
Cheers
Cheers
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Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
The perfect "Boglehead" muscle car has the right allocation between practicality, economy, and performance. With a higher allocation to performance per dollar for younger folks in the accumulation stage.
Thus, a used quick and spiffy Honda Civic or other performance compact.
The allocation changes as one approaches retirement with a smaller allocation to performance and greater emphasis on economy. So for those early seniors, a Toyota Prius.
Then, at the later stages of retirement, notwithstanding "lifestyle creep", the allocation glide slope would call for either a 100% electric vehicle such as a . . . Nissan Leaf,. . . a 40 volt Golf Cart, . . . or . . . a rechargeable "power chair".
aloha
j
Thus, a used quick and spiffy Honda Civic or other performance compact.
The allocation changes as one approaches retirement with a smaller allocation to performance and greater emphasis on economy. So for those early seniors, a Toyota Prius.
Then, at the later stages of retirement, notwithstanding "lifestyle creep", the allocation glide slope would call for either a 100% electric vehicle such as a . . . Nissan Leaf,. . . a 40 volt Golf Cart, . . . or . . . a rechargeable "power chair".
aloha
j
Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
I would love a V8, but considering I had a V6 2011 Camaro w 30k miles fall into my lap. I'm m good! My buddy sold it b/c the 300 go wasn't enough- he has 450 hp w/ the SS, but 7 years of payments. I paid $14,000 cash. I'm good! Not too concerned with people mocking the V6. A blast to drive
Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
I drive a Mk6 VW GTI that I’ve taken to Stage 2+ using parts and software from Unitronic. It was quite a fun project to take a modestly priced sports car and make it so fast. GTIs go for mid 20s to mid 30s and my mods were about 8 grand including labor for everything.
Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
I'm sorry but if you're asking for a muscle car a Honda Civic or other "performance compact" really isn't going to cut it.
A boglehead muscle car is probably either a Mustang GT or Camaro SS (1SS trim), both which are pushing upwards of 450hp, rear drive and easy to find with a manual transmission. Bargain hunting and keeping the options down will allow access in the mid 30s. The Camaro particularly at times has a lot of cash on the hood. As there is a refreshed car coming out for '19, you can probably find some good deals on '18s soon (and personally I think the '19 refresh is far less handsome). A true bogglehead would probably scrounge for a deal on a used one and lower the price of entry to 20K or so.
To be honest, it's not really fair to call them muscle cars anymore. The cognoscenti will nit pick the definition of a muscle car ad naseum, but generally it's thought of as cheap straight line speed, fast from stoplight to stoplight and nothing more. The reality is both of those two are more than credible all around performance cars, as they can go fast, turn and stop with the best of them, including the high priced Germans like the M4 and AMG's. A far cry from when I bought my new (still owned) 2001 Trans Am that was full of compromises, and lacking in quality and comfort just to have a ton of power and a 6 speed at a newly hired engineer's affordability.
I can vouch for the Chevy SS Sedan being an excellent muscle car as I bought one, at a 20% discount. But as mentioned they are out of production as of 2017 and they are still holding very strong value on the used market, particularly the 6 speed cars. If you don't need 4 doors, the Camaro is a better deal and faster, if you do need 4 doors the 485hp Scat Pack Chargers can be had for well under 40 new.
A boglehead muscle car is probably either a Mustang GT or Camaro SS (1SS trim), both which are pushing upwards of 450hp, rear drive and easy to find with a manual transmission. Bargain hunting and keeping the options down will allow access in the mid 30s. The Camaro particularly at times has a lot of cash on the hood. As there is a refreshed car coming out for '19, you can probably find some good deals on '18s soon (and personally I think the '19 refresh is far less handsome). A true bogglehead would probably scrounge for a deal on a used one and lower the price of entry to 20K or so.
To be honest, it's not really fair to call them muscle cars anymore. The cognoscenti will nit pick the definition of a muscle car ad naseum, but generally it's thought of as cheap straight line speed, fast from stoplight to stoplight and nothing more. The reality is both of those two are more than credible all around performance cars, as they can go fast, turn and stop with the best of them, including the high priced Germans like the M4 and AMG's. A far cry from when I bought my new (still owned) 2001 Trans Am that was full of compromises, and lacking in quality and comfort just to have a ton of power and a 6 speed at a newly hired engineer's affordability.
I can vouch for the Chevy SS Sedan being an excellent muscle car as I bought one, at a 20% discount. But as mentioned they are out of production as of 2017 and they are still holding very strong value on the used market, particularly the 6 speed cars. If you don't need 4 doors, the Camaro is a better deal and faster, if you do need 4 doors the 485hp Scat Pack Chargers can be had for well under 40 new.
Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
I'd have to say Mustang GT. Maybe a Camaro. Dodge would have to be actively managed by your mechanic
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Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
Nobody likes Corvettes I suppose... If I were to buy a muscle car that would be it. Holds a decent value, looks good and nice performance.
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Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
Corvettes aren't muscle cars. They're proper sports cars.totallystudly wrote: ↑Mon May 14, 2018 11:31 am Nobody likes Corvettes I suppose... If I were to buy a muscle car that would be it. Holds a decent value, looks good and nice performance.
Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
1996 Chevrolet Caprice.
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Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
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Last edited by GoldenFinch on Mon May 14, 2018 1:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
The single best answer!stimulacra wrote: ↑Mon May 14, 2018 9:47 am Going with the “sleeper car” / millionaire next door angle… I would suggest that the recently discontinued Chevy SS would be the ideal boglehead muscle car.
You have a very nice old-school performance sedan that everyone thinks is a rental Malibu or Impala.
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Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
I remember reading about some guys putting drag racing engines into a geo metro.
Buy that car.
Buy that car.
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- whodidntante
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Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
I drive a mustang GT as my only car in a place where winter weather is measured by suicide rates. It is comfortable, quiet, has a good ride, and will do ridiculous antics when called upon. It is incredibly reliable for a rocket ship.
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Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
A boglehead muscle car is a Honda or a Toyota with an after-market spoiler and exhaust.
OTOH my view of being a Boglehead is to help enable one to be able to afford things and experiences that are important to them. If I really wanted a muscle car, I would check the financial implications to see if I could afford one and what effect the costs would have on my long-term plans. If those parameters checked out, I would shop for good value in something that would satisfy my needs.
What I would not do is settle for something short of what I really wanted or reach for something I could not afford. I would choose to defer that luxury until I didn't have to ask about "boglehead muscle cars" and could get what I wanted. Good luck in your search!
OTOH my view of being a Boglehead is to help enable one to be able to afford things and experiences that are important to them. If I really wanted a muscle car, I would check the financial implications to see if I could afford one and what effect the costs would have on my long-term plans. If those parameters checked out, I would shop for good value in something that would satisfy my needs.
What I would not do is settle for something short of what I really wanted or reach for something I could not afford. I would choose to defer that luxury until I didn't have to ask about "boglehead muscle cars" and could get what I wanted. Good luck in your search!
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Re: Is there a boglehead muscle car?
I suspect the OP would consider an economy car with an aftermarket muffler (commonly known in car circles as a "fart cannon") something short of what they really want.Doom&Gloom wrote: ↑Mon May 14, 2018 1:11 pm
What I would not do is settle for something short of what I really wanted or reach for something I could not afford. I would choose to defer that luxury until I didn't have to ask about "boglehead muscle cars" and could get what I wanted. Good luck in your search!
Seeing as the OP is more interested in the look of a muscle car than the performance and cares about reliability, I submit an 3-5 year old v6 Mustang or Camaro is a cheap and relatively reliable way to do it. Pendants will call these "Pony Cars" but I submit they are close enough to what the OP is looking for. There's a reason why common cars are common.