How many security Camera's

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raamakoti
Posts: 83
Joined: Mon Jul 31, 2017 10:20 am

How many security Camera's

Post by raamakoti » Tue Dec 05, 2017 2:02 pm

I am looking for some advise, the house is 2800 sqft on 0.71acre piece of land with nearby friendly neighbors.
There 3 entrance to the house, on is garage, front and backyard.
I was thinking of something like this https://m.costco.com/Arlo-Pro-Smart-Hom ... 47078.html
it comes with only 2. Three would have been nice.

I found another cheaper alternative like this
https://www.wyzecam.com/

but could not made my mind on how many is really needed. I would appreciate help and suggestions

brad.clarkston
Posts: 588
Joined: Fri Jan 03, 2014 8:31 pm
Location: Kansas City, MO

Re: How many security Camera's

Post by brad.clarkston » Tue Dec 05, 2017 2:17 pm

The amount of camera's and brand/model doesn't matter to much what DVR back end are you going to use to store the video ?
That's the part that will dictate the amount of camera's but three is pretty small amount.

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Epsilon Delta
Posts: 6550
Joined: Thu Apr 28, 2011 7:00 pm

Re: How many security Camera's

Post by Epsilon Delta » Tue Dec 05, 2017 2:42 pm

raamakoti wrote:
Tue Dec 05, 2017 2:02 pm
I am looking for some advise, the house is 2800 sqft on 0.71acre piece of land with nearby friendly neighbors.
There 3 entrance to the house, on is garage, front and backyard.
There are 3 entrance for you. Burglars may be more imaginative and use windows or chainsaws. It's called breaking and entering for a reason. The number of cameras depends on exactly what you are trying to protect against.

brad.clarkston
Posts: 588
Joined: Fri Jan 03, 2014 8:31 pm
Location: Kansas City, MO

Re: How many security Camera's

Post by brad.clarkston » Tue Dec 05, 2017 3:00 pm

Epsilon Delta wrote:
Tue Dec 05, 2017 2:42 pm
raamakoti wrote:
Tue Dec 05, 2017 2:02 pm
I am looking for some advise, the house is 2800 sqft on 0.71acre piece of land with nearby friendly neighbors.
There 3 entrance to the house, on is garage, front and backyard.
There are 3 entrance for you. Burglars may be more imaginative and use windows or chainsaws. It's called breaking and entering for a reason. The number of cameras depends on exactly what you are trying to protect against.
Now we are getting into window breaks and door sensors, maybe even a motion sensor or two. Now we are talking ;)

Still depends on the back end DVR system or cloud provider tho.

SittingOnTheFence
Posts: 208
Joined: Sun Sep 27, 2015 5:30 pm

Re: How many security Camera's

Post by SittingOnTheFence » Tue Dec 05, 2017 5:02 pm

Agree with E.D. I have 10 cameras on a NVR. They cover nearly all doors and windows. But what good is that when I'm away and they break in? Even with high quality cameras you may not get enough detail to identify the perp. But it's kinda cool to watch the raccoons & coyotes.

diy60
Posts: 88
Joined: Wed Sep 07, 2016 6:54 pm

Re: How many security Camera's

Post by diy60 » Tue Dec 05, 2017 6:03 pm

A couple of real world examples to think of (happened to my neighbor and also to a close friend);

1) residential camera mounting locations were within reach. Bad guys came up behind the cameras and knocked them out of alignment.
2) bad guys unplugged the NVR unit accidentally when stealing some other electronics (idiots didn't recognize or take the NVR unit, how stupid is that).
3) No 2 above, unplugging the NVR unit corrupted the last 15mins of the disc recording. The unit was Linux based, but the recording was proprietary and could not be read mounted in a desktop computer.

Both cases bad guys were caught and prosecuted based on the available recordings and fingerprints as well. One of the break ins was armed robbery, pretty darn scary seeing the guy shove a handgun down his pants on film.

- considering installing and powering up a fake NVR unit.
- hide the real NVR unit, and house it in a robust steel enclosure, any delay is a deterrent.
- consider backup power supply.
- PoE is probably less hassle.
- consider cloud service for recordings.

snowox
Posts: 120
Joined: Wed Nov 08, 2017 9:17 am

Re: How many security Camera's

Post by snowox » Tue Dec 05, 2017 6:12 pm

Buy a dog! a big mean one.

kerplunk
Posts: 679
Joined: Sun Apr 17, 2011 9:58 pm

Re: How many security Camera's

Post by kerplunk » Tue Dec 05, 2017 9:37 pm

Check out the Nest outdoor cameras.

TravelGeek
Posts: 1221
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2014 3:23 pm

Re: How many security Camera's

Post by TravelGeek » Tue Dec 05, 2017 9:53 pm

raamakoti wrote:
Tue Dec 05, 2017 2:02 pm
I found another cheaper alternative like this
https://www.wyzecam.com/
I just got a Wyze cam to play with. Easy to set up, seems to work great, but I am not sure I would consider it a real security camera. For starters, it is meant for indoor use only.

queso
Posts: 386
Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2016 3:52 pm

Re: How many security Camera's

Post by queso » Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:26 am

I've got a combination of Arlo cameras outside and wired indoor cameras from another manufacturer inside. Both use cloud storage so no on premise DVR to worry about being compromised. IMHO, you need x number of cameras where x is the number of cameras it takes to cover every approach to your home. Good security is about layers so then you need to add a monitored alarm system with contact points, motion sensors and glass break sensors and 1-3 loud (preferably large, but loud is better than large if you have to choose) K9 sentries. Install motion sensing outdoor lighting and equip yourself so you have a means to defend yourself and your family in the event your perimeter is breached while you are home. Ideally you won't need any of it and a would be burglar/invader will take a look around and see all the security crap and just say "*** that!" and go to the next house. :happy

KlangFool
Posts: 7173
Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2008 12:35 pm

Re: How many security Camera's

Post by KlangFool » Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:48 am

raamakoti wrote:
Tue Dec 05, 2017 2:02 pm
I am looking for some advise, the house is 2800 sqft on 0.71acre piece of land with nearby friendly neighbors.
There 3 entrance to the house, on is garage, front and backyard.
I was thinking of something like this https://m.costco.com/Arlo-Pro-Smart-Hom ... 47078.html
it comes with only 2. Three would have been nice.

I found another cheaper alternative like this
https://www.wyzecam.com/

but could not made my mind on how many is really needed. I would appreciate help and suggestions
raamakoti,

As far as I can tell, those Arlo from Costco is not a complete system. They are just add-on cameras.

https://m.costco.com/Arlo-Pro-Smart-Hom ... 47078.html

<<Arlo Pro or Arlo Wire-Free base station required for operation (Not included in this kit).>>

KlangFool
Last edited by KlangFool on Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:58 am, edited 1 time in total.

queso
Posts: 386
Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2016 3:52 pm

Re: How many security Camera's

Post by queso » Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:49 am

KlangFool wrote:
Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:48 am
raamakoti wrote:
Tue Dec 05, 2017 2:02 pm
I am looking for some advise, the house is 2800 sqft on 0.71acre piece of land with nearby friendly neighbors.
There 3 entrance to the house, on is garage, front and backyard.
I was thinking of something like this https://m.costco.com/Arlo-Pro-Smart-Hom ... 47078.html
it comes with only 2. Three would have been nice.

I found another cheaper alternative like this
https://www.wyzecam.com/

but could not made my mind on how many is really needed. I would appreciate help and suggestions
raamakoti,

As far as I can tell, those Arlo from Costco is not a complete system. They are just add-on cameras.

https://www.arlo.com/en-us/products/arl ... fault.aspx

KlangFool
KF is right. I didn't click your link the first time I read your post. You need the complete system from Costco (3 cameras plus base) and then you can add on the other 2 cameras. If you stay at 5 cameras and below and only want 7 days of video storage then Arlo is free. Go beyond 5 cameras and/or want a longer retention period around your video storage and you enter monthly fee territory.

EDIT: just looked on Costco and didn't see the starter bundle. Maybe they stopped carrying it? You can get it at Amazon if Costco doesn't have it, but the Costco bundle was nice since it included extra batteries and mounts. IMHO, if you go Arlo you need the extra batteries (I have 2 extras) and the battery charger so you have a way of replacing your batteries with fresh ones on a rotation. Otherwise your cameras will be down while you charge them since there is no way to charge the packs outside of the cameras without the additional charger (not to mention you may have to take your camera completely off the mount to charge it depending on whether or not you have a cable and outlet that can reach it).
Last edited by queso on Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:54 am, edited 1 time in total.

Cheyenne
Posts: 277
Joined: Sun Jun 14, 2015 6:46 am

Re: How many security Camera's

Post by Cheyenne » Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:53 am

I found another cheaper alternative like this
https://www.wyzecam.com/
This company apparently presents privacy concerns.

From Amazon:

- Why are your cameras sending data to non AWS servers? I consistently see UDP traffic (port 10001) heading to Japan, Germany, China + other locations. IPs below, 45.79.98.243, 45.32.19.31, 45.76.82.115, 106.15.0.207, 192.240.123.153, 192.240.110.98

- Camera sending traffic to non-aws servers located outside us. No visibility / control over security of my own data in the cloud.

- I put an SD card on it and disabling its internet access by assigning an IP that is restricted by my router...to my surprise, the camera changed its macaddress to a new one (completely different from the one in the back label) in order to gain a new IP from my router and regain internet access.

AlD
Posts: 28
Joined: Wed Apr 23, 2008 1:02 pm

Re: How many security Camera's

Post by AlD » Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:47 am

Lorex has some really good deals on their site right now.

I would look into this system:

https://www.lorextechnology.com/hd-nvr- ... 1-p#device

If you think 8 cameras is too much, they have a 4 camera version for sale:

https://www.lorextechnology.com/hd-nvr- ... 80-44W-1-p

When I bought my 8 camera system, I thought that would be plenty for my tiny 1,100 sq ft home, but I actually wish I had 1 more camera to cover an area along my side yard.

If you are going to do it, do it right and cover the entire perimeter of your home. The resolution on that Arlo is garbage (720P is pretty much bottom of the barrel resolution = old technology). The newer systems have 2K or 4K resolution. The system is worthless if you aren't able to capture a good clear image. Having to deal with charging batteries is also a deal-breaker for me.

I like these systems because you own the NVR (recording device). Paying for cloud storage on a monthly or annual basis is not very boglehead-like. You can hide the NVR or buy a steel security cage for it and lag bolt it to your home if you are concerned with the bad guys damaging it, or taking off with it.

TravelGeek
Posts: 1221
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2014 3:23 pm

Re: How many security Camera's

Post by TravelGeek » Wed Dec 06, 2017 1:24 pm

Cheyenne wrote:
Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:53 am
I found another cheaper alternative like this
https://www.wyzecam.com/
This company apparently presents privacy concerns.

From Amazon:

- Why are your cameras sending data to non AWS servers? I consistently see UDP traffic (port 10001) heading to Japan, Germany, China + other locations. IPs below, 45.79.98.243, 45.32.19.31, 45.76.82.115, 106.15.0.207, 192.240.123.153, 192.240.110.98

- Camera sending traffic to non-aws servers located outside us. No visibility / control over security of my own data in the cloud.

- I put an SD card on it and disabling its internet access by assigning an IP that is restricted by my router...to my surprise, the camera changed its macaddress to a new one (completely different from the one in the back label) in order to gain a new IP from my router and regain internet access.
There is some discussion of the camera "by design" (?) changing the Mac address at boot time on Reddit.

https://www.reddit.com/r/wyzecam/commen ... _hours_to/

Also some talk about them talking to one of their suppliers about the callback to foreign servers (somewhat disconcerting that they apparently didn't know this or didn't care until someone discovered it).

If I wanted to block my WyzeCam from internet access, I would probably temporarily change my guest wifi password, set the camera up with that, and then lock it out by changing the network password again.

My biggest concern is that Wyze cam is a proprietary system that will only work as long as the company exists (and we all know what the success rate of small startups is). And while cloud storage at this time is free, there is little to prevent Wyze from imposing a subscription fee later on. You either pay or you have a brick. I'd buy a few more if it was an open system with an SDK.

ViperAttacks
Posts: 49
Joined: Mon Aug 20, 2007 2:41 pm

Re: How many security Camera's

Post by ViperAttacks » Wed Dec 06, 2017 1:27 pm

We have had good luck with Nest (we have 4). We tried Arlo also, but we found we had to use their router and it caused problems with our network unfortunately.

Nest costs more (monthly), but it works so great when you actually need it we think it's worth it.

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