frequent trading

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mouses
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frequent trading

Post by mouses » Tue Oct 10, 2017 10:38 pm

I have accounts at both Vanguard and Schwab. I had intended to have each account be about half Wellington and half Wellesley, so that's the way the Vanguard account is. The Schwab account, which I opened recently, has just money in it.

But then I learned Wellington can't be bought outside Vanguard unless one already owns it in the outside place.

So I changed my plan to have all my Vanguard account be Wellington and all my Schwab account be Wellesley. (I could have transferred some Wellington to Schwab and then bought more there, but this seemed easier.) Hence I just entered a trade (exchange) at Vanguard to turn the Wellesley into Wellington. The page said "This fund is subject to the frequent-trading policy and limits you from buying more shares by phone or online until 11/10/2017."

I had planned to next buy Wellesley at Schwab with all my funds at Schwab.

Can I do that at Schwab now or do I have to wait until 11/10/2017? It seems that logically the restriction would apply across all financial institutions in which one has accounts, but I'm not sure that it does?

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Sandtrap
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Re: frequent trading

Post by Sandtrap » Tue Oct 10, 2017 10:46 pm

You must wait, even add a few days to be sure.
Or it may cost you "bigleague".
Be very careful to read the prospectus and "frequent trading" restrictions at Schwab. There will be no warning window or "pop up" that you are incurring a "frequent trading" fee which can be enormous. The Schwab website will not "save you" from incurring fees and penalties unlike the Vanguard site which will let you know before hand. The responsibility of checking for this is completely on the customer at Schwab and sometimes not very obvious on the website.
Actionably: Follow the Schwab guidelines and be very very careful.

mouses
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Re: frequent trading

Post by mouses » Tue Oct 10, 2017 10:58 pm

Thanks. Yikes :-)

livesoft
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Re: frequent trading

Post by livesoft » Wed Oct 11, 2017 4:39 am

It does not apply across financial institutions. Nor does it apply across accounts at the same financial institution.

Anyways, just try it and see what happens.

Also read this: https://www.bogleheads.org/wiki/Frequent_trading_policy

Basically, it's a joke really.
This signature message sponsored by sscritic: Learn to fish.

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Sandtrap
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Re: frequent trading

Post by Sandtrap » Wed Oct 11, 2017 9:37 am

livesoft wrote:
Wed Oct 11, 2017 4:39 am
It does not apply across financial institutions. Nor does it apply across accounts at the same financial institution.

Anyways, just try it and see what happens.

Also read this: https://www.bogleheads.org/wiki/Frequent_trading_policy

Basically, it's a joke really.
Agreed.
The customer bears full responsibility and consequence of each transaction no matter the brokerage or fund within a brokerage.
Be careful as mistakes can be very very expensive. :oops:

goingup
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Re: frequent trading

Post by goingup » Wed Oct 11, 2017 9:41 am

No waiting. Different brokerages.

I'm curious why you opened a Schwab account to hold a Vanguard fund. Was this a move to diversify institutions--risk mitigation?

mouses
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Re: frequent trading

Post by mouses » Wed Oct 11, 2017 10:58 am

goingup wrote:
Wed Oct 11, 2017 9:41 am
No waiting. Different brokerages.

I'm curious why you opened a Schwab account to hold a Vanguard fund. Was this a move to diversify institutions--risk mitigation?
I was going to have everything at Vanguard, but they drove me crazy with the second set of transfers into Vanguard, which were in limbo for weeks with customer service saying they were "in progress" when the source institution had not heard a word from Vanguard. It was more complex than that, but I'll spare everyone the details.

So finally I went to the source institution, got a check, and hand carried it to the Schwab office. I wasn't even willing to mail the check to Vanguard at that point, since I remembered how they had misplaced an incoming check for weeks years ago, besides the recent stuff.

So I am not sure what I will do now, move everything to Schwab or leave them split. I wouldn't
move everything to Vanguard because of the reports on here of their "losing" accounts. On the other hand having things in two places seems better than one.

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Sandtrap
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Re: frequent trading

Post by Sandtrap » Wed Oct 11, 2017 5:13 pm

mouses wrote:
Wed Oct 11, 2017 10:58 am
goingup wrote:
Wed Oct 11, 2017 9:41 am
No waiting. Different brokerages.

I'm curious why you opened a Schwab account to hold a Vanguard fund. Was this a move to diversify institutions--risk mitigation?
I was going to have everything at Vanguard, but they drove me crazy with the second set of transfers into Vanguard, which were in limbo for weeks with customer service saying they were "in progress" when the source institution had not heard a word from Vanguard. It was more complex than that, but I'll spare everyone the details.

So finally I went to the source institution, got a check, and hand carried it to the Schwab office. I wasn't even willing to mail the check to Vanguard at that point, since I remembered how they had misplaced an incoming check for weeks years ago, besides the recent stuff.

So I am not sure what I will do now, move everything to Schwab or leave them split. I wouldn't
move everything to Vanguard because of the reports on here of their "losing" accounts. On the other hand having things in two places seems better than one.
Curious.
Why does having things in two places seem better to you?
thanks,
j

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