For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
51
30/70
Contribute about 50/50 now between 401k/Roth and taxable
401k = $60,000 total
18,000 before tax
6,000 401k catch up
18,000 401k match
18,000 401k after tax converted to tIRA then mega backdoor Roth
12,000 tIRA to backdoor Roth (wife + me over 50)
$72,000 total to tax advantaged
75,000 to taxable
30/70
Contribute about 50/50 now between 401k/Roth and taxable
401k = $60,000 total
18,000 before tax
6,000 401k catch up
18,000 401k match
18,000 401k after tax converted to tIRA then mega backdoor Roth
12,000 tIRA to backdoor Roth (wife + me over 50)
$72,000 total to tax advantaged
75,000 to taxable
Consistently sets low goals and fails to achieve them.
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
Same. We're currently 15/85 as well. Now that houses are paid off and colleges saved for that 15% is likely to start rising a lot faster.Admiral wrote:In case you're curious why I posed this, I am 15% taxable 85% tax advantaged
^This. Our sole purpose of the taxable account is to live off of it during ER while taxing advantage of the 0% and 15% tax brackets to convert tIRAs to Roths and harvest capital gains.Admiral wrote:...since I have no specific future use for it in mind... or to use to fund an early retirement so I don't have to draw from Roth
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
Interesting question. We're at about 12% taxable excluding the emergency fund. That number has been increasing steadily. We do utilize all of our tax advantaged space. I think most everyone here pretty much prioritizes maxing out tax advantaged space. Why wouldn't you want to save on taxes? Especially with a high earned income. Every dollar we put in retirement is like a free $0.33.
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Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
Taxable - 0.87%
Investable assets - a bit out of specified range
Ages - 44/43
Can't max out all tax deferred. We max out all typical tax deferred and then some (NQDC), but NQDC allows up to 90% tax deferral. We have to eat.
Investable assets - a bit out of specified range
Ages - 44/43
Can't max out all tax deferred. We max out all typical tax deferred and then some (NQDC), but NQDC allows up to 90% tax deferral. We have to eat.
Last edited by slowbutsteady on Thu May 18, 2017 8:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The tortoise wins every time I read that story.
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
30 Taxable
70 Deferred
70 Deferred
"One does not accumulate but eliminate. It is not daily increase but daily decrease. The height of cultivation always runs to simplicity" –Bruce Lee
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
Interesting thread....5 -6 years ago on this forum if you had over 50% in tax deferred you were an outlier, but as you can see that is not true today. Philosophy tended to be " Don't go into retirement owing all that money"
I am 90% tax deferred, retired 12 years. Was 80% tax deferred when retired. In a bull market all the taxes you haven't paid are compounding in your tax deferred accounts and they are going up even though you are taking RMD from them every year. Bull markets do wonderful things to tax deferred accounts.
If I had done a lot of Roth conversions I wouldn't be compounding all those unpaid taxes.
(That should add a little controversy to this thread).........Gordon
I am 90% tax deferred, retired 12 years. Was 80% tax deferred when retired. In a bull market all the taxes you haven't paid are compounding in your tax deferred accounts and they are going up even though you are taking RMD from them every year. Bull markets do wonderful things to tax deferred accounts.
If I had done a lot of Roth conversions I wouldn't be compounding all those unpaid taxes.
(That should add a little controversy to this thread).........Gordon
Disciple of John Neff
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
60/40.
My mom though is somewhat the challenge. In retirement and 90/10.
My mom though is somewhat the challenge. In retirement and 90/10.
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Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
I'm outside the range, but have 9% in taxable. Made my first IRA contribution in 1981.
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
40% taxable
60% tax advantaged (28% Roth / 72% TSP+TIRAs)
Taxable from early contractual plan contributions + extra money in savings over the years.
TSP = rolled over my TIRAs after navy retirement + 8 years of wife TSP contributions
Asset allocation is about 55/45 with SCV tilt (currently 15% of stocks)
60% tax advantaged (28% Roth / 72% TSP+TIRAs)
Taxable from early contractual plan contributions + extra money in savings over the years.
TSP = rolled over my TIRAs after navy retirement + 8 years of wife TSP contributions
Asset allocation is about 55/45 with SCV tilt (currently 15% of stocks)
The destination matters. |
"Life moves pretty fast. If you don't don't stop and look around once in a while - you could miss it." -- Ferris Bueller
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
A fair bit out of your range but 10% taxable 90% tax-sheltered.
We built the 100% equity taxable account 1986-1990 when our tax-sheltered space and options were much more limited and haven't added to it since. Have spent multiple 6-figures in gains from it and it's about the same size (inflation adjusted) as it was in 1990.
I call it the money tree and glad we did it.
We built the 100% equity taxable account 1986-1990 when our tax-sheltered space and options were much more limited and haven't added to it since. Have spent multiple 6-figures in gains from it and it's about the same size (inflation adjusted) as it was in 1990.
I call it the money tree and glad we did it.
70/30 AA for life, Global market cap equity. Rebalance if fixed income <25% or >35%. Weighted ER< .10%. 5% of annual portfolio balance SWR, Proportional (to AA) withdrawals.
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
I think for high income savers nearing retirement you will see more taxable money as they have maxed their tax deferred space and are putting their excess savings into taxable.gwrvmd wrote:Interesting thread....5 -6 years ago on this forum if you had over 50% in tax deferred you were an outlier, but as you can see that is not true today. Philosophy tended to be " Don't go into retirement owing all that money"
I am 90% tax deferred, retired 12 years. Was 80% tax deferred when retired. In a bull market all the taxes you haven't paid are compounding in your tax deferred accounts and they are going up even though you are taking RMD from them every year. Bull markets do wonderful things to tax deferred accounts.
If I had done a lot of Roth conversions I wouldn't be compounding all those unpaid taxes.
(That should add a little controversy to this thread).........Gordon
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
I don't believe you have to be 59/12 to access contributions in a Roth.David Jay wrote:I am over 59 1/2 so I have access to my Roth funds without penalty, emergency cash is a HELOC.David Jay wrote:0.9% taxable, 99.1% tax advantaged overall, just retirement portfolio ($682K) 0%/100%
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
We have 60% of our investments in a taxable account. Since we are self employed with employees, our SIMPLE IRA only gives us so much tax deferred space.
"You really don't need leverage in this world much. If you're smart, you're going to make a lot of money without borrowing" Warren Buffet
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
Age 45/47
40% taxable, 60% tax-deferred.
In our case, this split arose because we both only poked into higher tax brackets in the last ~5 years; I was a postdoc for too long before I got a faculty job, and spouse's earnings have fluctuated wildly as he works in software/startups.
We've maximized contributions to tax-deferred as much as possible in these last years, but can't go back to age 30 to contribute then , so taxable is where the excess has gone.
40% taxable, 60% tax-deferred.
In our case, this split arose because we both only poked into higher tax brackets in the last ~5 years; I was a postdoc for too long before I got a faculty job, and spouse's earnings have fluctuated wildly as he works in software/startups.
We've maximized contributions to tax-deferred as much as possible in these last years, but can't go back to age 30 to contribute then , so taxable is where the excess has gone.
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
Age: 37/30
We are about 60% tax advantaged and 40% taxable.
We are about 60% tax advantaged and 40% taxable.
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
We are in Mid 40's and are 100% tax deferred accounts.
When the kids finish college we'll probably start adding to taxable then. Or put some into home improvements?
In the meantime max out retirement accounts and cash flow college and related expenses for the kids.
When the kids finish college we'll probably start adding to taxable then. Or put some into home improvements?
In the meantime max out retirement accounts and cash flow college and related expenses for the kids.
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
I guess I don't understand this sentence. What does a bull market have to do with taxes in a tax-deferred account? Are you saying that as a result of sharp growth in the value of tax deferred investments, your RMDs are larger and thus pushing you into a higher tax bracket? Since the alternative is investments with lower value throwing off less money, this seems like one of those good problems.gwrvmd wrote: In a bull market all the taxes you haven't paid are compounding in your tax deferred accounts and they are going up even though you are taking RMD from them every year.
This is why Roth conversion is appropriate, but of course eventually in either case (convert and pay the income tax on the conversion, or don't convert and pay it on the RMD) you will hit the same tax bracket. Taxes are taxes, they still need to be paid.
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
48
$750k NW, $700k investments
>2% Taxable
98% Tax-advantaged (TSP, IRA, 529)
$750k NW, $700k investments
>2% Taxable
98% Tax-advantaged (TSP, IRA, 529)
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
Was 13%; with inheritance now 25%.
"Never underestimate one's capacity to overestimate one's abilities" - The Dunning-Kruger Effect
- zaboomafoozarg
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Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
30% in taxable.
Last edited by zaboomafoozarg on Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
Maybe, 95% IRA/ROTH. 5% taxable. Most of our gains is in the Tax Qualified spaces because I spend more time and effort in growing them, TQ was much larger at time of retirements, we had very little extra money to fund Taxable spaces . Most importantly, I don't like Sch D hasslesitstoomuch wrote:it's complicated.
IRAs, Roth are mixed in brokerage accounts and annuities (deferred GLWB). A small amount is taxable but deferred or advantaged in some fashion but outside of IRA.
Not counting investment condo held as rental for retirement income.
Rev012718; 4 Incm stream buckets: SS+pension; dfr'd GLWB VA & FI anntys, by time & $$ laddered; Discretionary; Rentals. LTCi. Own, not asset. Tax TBT%. Early SS. FundRatio (FR) >1.1 67/70yo
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Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
56 yrs old. Wife and I have 18% taxable, 82% tax deferred. 5 years ago we only had about 3% in taxable, but major promotion resulted in maxing out of tax advantaged space.
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
10% taxable (checking/taxable investments)
90% tax-advantaged (IRA/401k and 529s)
We are trying to grow our taxable for both unexpected college costs for kids beyond 529s and for use when I plan to semi-retire in the 55ish range - about 12 years from now.
90% tax-advantaged (IRA/401k and 529s)
We are trying to grow our taxable for both unexpected college costs for kids beyond 529s and for use when I plan to semi-retire in the 55ish range - about 12 years from now.
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Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
My wife and I are 60% taxable and 40% Roth. We are retired and have over $1m in investments.
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
90% taxable / 10% non-taxable (I'm from UK, we have ISA - it's British IRA basically)
Too young to have more in non-taxable accounts.
Too young to have more in non-taxable accounts.
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
Welcome! The wiki has some background info: Individual Savings Accounts (UK)
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
Thank you indeed!LadyGeek wrote:Welcome! The wiki has some background info: Individual Savings Accounts (UK)
- goodenyou
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Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
I started a thread 5 years ago on this and added age as a twist.
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=93990&p=1352962#p1352962
I was at taxable/tax-advantaged 75/25 (3:1) at that time (2012). I am now 80/20 (4:1). Most of my equities are in my taxable space and most of bonds and fixed-income in tax-advantaged. Part of the increasing divergence is the rate of return differential between theses asset classes, and I also save more in taxable after maxing-out tax advantaged space.
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=93990&p=1352962#p1352962
I was at taxable/tax-advantaged 75/25 (3:1) at that time (2012). I am now 80/20 (4:1). Most of my equities are in my taxable space and most of bonds and fixed-income in tax-advantaged. Part of the increasing divergence is the rate of return differential between theses asset classes, and I also save more in taxable after maxing-out tax advantaged space.
"Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge" |
“At 50, everyone has the face he deserves”
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
Early 60's here still working. Little over 70% in retirement assets.
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
80% tax deferred
10% tax advantaged
10% taxable
10% tax advantaged
10% taxable
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
Just retired at 63. About 25% in taxable, most of it from an inheritance. At 54 I had < 5% in taxable.
Meet my pet, Peeve, who loves to convert non-acronyms into acronyms: FED, ROTH, CASH, IVY, ...
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
Just want to add how incredibly successful we bogleheads are at savings and investing compared to the majority of the population. It's easy to forget that when so many people here have portfolios in the hundreds of thousands or even millions. I was feeling a little down about how much further I have to reach my retirement portfolio goal so I did some Internet research on average retirement savings this morning. I was shocked at how poorly most are doing and that my portfolio is probably top 5% or even closer to 1% (depending on source) for my age by I feel like I am so far from my goal and with the big bull market and high valuations kind of depressing. But looking at the population as a whole made me feel much better about where I am. Hanging around here doesn't always make me feel so.Admiral wrote:I'm curious to know what percentage of your invest-able assets (that is, liquid assets, so not including home equity) you have in a taxable account versus retirement accounts. I'm including Roth in retirement accounts even though in many cases these monies can be accessed penalty free. How the funds are invested does not concern me.
For example, someone that has a $700k portfolio might have:
10% in a taxable account
90% in tax advantaged accounts
If you want to add more detail, you could also note whether you add to your taxable account, and how much/how often.
Thank you.
By the way 25% taxable rest pension and tax deferred.
- zaboomafoozarg
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Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
Agreed, I felt way more optimistic about my situation and my future before joining this forum.am wrote:But looking at the population as a whole made me feel much better about where I am. Hanging around here doesn't always make me feel so.
Of course it was out of ignorance, but sometimes I yearn for that happy ignorance again.
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Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
30/70. Taxable is building faster than tax advantages.
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Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
We are ~80% taxable and ~20% tax deferred/free (vast majority of the latter is tax deferred).
I am 54 and DW is 52 years old. Retired last year.
Contributed maximum amount allowed by law every year to 401k for at least the last two decades of work (and got sizable company match on those contributions). However, income level allowed for significant savings in taxable accounts (way beyond what we could put in tax deferred) as we lived well below our means (but still quite well and very, very far from frugally).
We plan to do annual Roth conversions every year between now and the time we turn 70 and begin collecting SS and taking RMD's. Whether this allows us to whittle down the tax deferred account or just hold it where it is (conversions offsetting growth) is hard to say. Goal is to try and avoid being pushed into higher tax brackets once we are in our 70's and beyond.
I am 54 and DW is 52 years old. Retired last year.
Contributed maximum amount allowed by law every year to 401k for at least the last two decades of work (and got sizable company match on those contributions). However, income level allowed for significant savings in taxable accounts (way beyond what we could put in tax deferred) as we lived well below our means (but still quite well and very, very far from frugally).
We plan to do annual Roth conversions every year between now and the time we turn 70 and begin collecting SS and taking RMD's. Whether this allows us to whittle down the tax deferred account or just hold it where it is (conversions offsetting growth) is hard to say. Goal is to try and avoid being pushed into higher tax brackets once we are in our 70's and beyond.
Real Knowledge Comes Only From Experience
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
Age 75. We have always put as much in retirement savings as possible, Ratio is 97% in retirement, 3% in taxable, though the latter inches up each year due to MRD's of mine and starting one for my wife next year. Slott's The Retirement Savings Time Bomb, that may not be the exact title, has been of some benefit dealing with related issues.
Tim
Tim
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Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
Interesting to see how widely the answers to this one vary. For us, right in the specified range, age 40:
40% taxable
40% Roth
20% tax-deferred
Reasons taxable is higher than it might otherwise be:
1. Started my career clueless about all of it, and followed the recommendations of a financial salesman advisor, who convinced me that the TSP (our version of a 401k) was a raw deal to be avoided, and best to keep my money in his [high load, high ER] funds where I could access it if needed. So for many years I did not use the TSP at all, but instead put the money in taxable accounts. Glad I have it, but still lament those years I squandered TSP access and the tax advantaged space.
2. One-income family, so only one TSP/401k account (but two IRAs). If we could do two TSP/401k, we certainly would, but my wife is doing the hard work as a stay-at-home mom for the time being.
3. Taxable account is all equities, whereas the bond allocation is all in tax-advantaged.
Current contributions are about 2/3 to TSP & IRAs (max) and 1/3 into taxable (Vanguard).
40% taxable
40% Roth
20% tax-deferred
Reasons taxable is higher than it might otherwise be:
1. Started my career clueless about all of it, and followed the recommendations of a financial salesman advisor, who convinced me that the TSP (our version of a 401k) was a raw deal to be avoided, and best to keep my money in his [high load, high ER] funds where I could access it if needed. So for many years I did not use the TSP at all, but instead put the money in taxable accounts. Glad I have it, but still lament those years I squandered TSP access and the tax advantaged space.
2. One-income family, so only one TSP/401k account (but two IRAs). If we could do two TSP/401k, we certainly would, but my wife is doing the hard work as a stay-at-home mom for the time being.
3. Taxable account is all equities, whereas the bond allocation is all in tax-advantaged.
Current contributions are about 2/3 to TSP & IRAs (max) and 1/3 into taxable (Vanguard).
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Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
Around 20 or 30% taxable. About half of that was actually gifts from my Dad that he wanted me to invest and specifically not put in an IRA, etc.
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
My wife and I are in our mid-40's and are both fortunate to have nice paying careers. We have roughly $3.7MM in invested assets with approx 60% taxable / 40% tax deferred.
We max out our Company 401(k) contributions each year, as well as my IRA and her backdoor Roth. By earning way more than we spend each year (although we don't live too frugally), we are able to save a nice chunk of change towards taxable every year. So I would imagine our taxable as percentage of total should continue to grow until retirement.
We max out our Company 401(k) contributions each year, as well as my IRA and her backdoor Roth. By earning way more than we spend each year (although we don't live too frugally), we are able to save a nice chunk of change towards taxable every year. So I would imagine our taxable as percentage of total should continue to grow until retirement.
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
34 / 52.8% Taxable and 47.2% Tax-Advantaged
Last edited by Regatta03 on Tue Sep 01, 2020 12:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
100% Taxable
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
3% taxable, but that's about to become more like 25% taxable due to an inheritance. That should drift back down as we currently have access to more tax advantaged space than we can afford to fill unless we lose some of that space to future job changes.
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
Age 45. Approx 8% taxable, 14% Roth and 78% tax deferred. Taxable is increasing % though as time goes on, and I didn’t start the taxable acct until a cpl years ago
- firebirdparts
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Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
I'm probably 20% taxable and 80% tax advantaged. If I considered my home equity it would be a different story. That of course is tax advantaged as well if I were to sell.
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
Just did the math
17% taxable
83% tax advantaged
Do not currently add to taxable on regular basis
Will add additional end of month money when spouse goes back to work (on leave, newborn). Unknown how much.
Lower 30s
17% taxable
83% tax advantaged
Do not currently add to taxable on regular basis
Will add additional end of month money when spouse goes back to work (on leave, newborn). Unknown how much.
Lower 30s
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
age: 37
401: 43%
Roth: 17%
Taxable: 40%
Max out all tax advantaged plus HSA. Very fortunate to have a well compensated position and save 51% of gross income.
401: 43%
Roth: 17%
Taxable: 40%
Max out all tax advantaged plus HSA. Very fortunate to have a well compensated position and save 51% of gross income.
Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
Retired for ten years and at 17% taxable. No grand design, though has been useful to have the taxable for trips, new house, etc.
- Portfolio7
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Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
In our 50's.
Basically 100% tax advantaged, though, we have a Heloc with a substantial balance. Factor that in and maybe we're -8% taxable and 108% tax-advantaged?
Edit: This is not by design, just the result of throwing $$ at our retirement accounts. We are focused on retiring debt this decade. We are deciding if it makes sense to build taxable holdings. I think the answer is not yet.
Basically 100% tax advantaged, though, we have a Heloc with a substantial balance. Factor that in and maybe we're -8% taxable and 108% tax-advantaged?
Edit: This is not by design, just the result of throwing $$ at our retirement accounts. We are focused on retiring debt this decade. We are deciding if it makes sense to build taxable holdings. I think the answer is not yet.
Last edited by Portfolio7 on Tue Sep 01, 2020 11:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
"An investment in knowledge pays the best interest" - Benjamin Franklin
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Re: For those with $500k-$1m in investments...
90% Taxable Non-retirement accounts
10% Retirement Accounts (75% pre-tax, 25% Roth)
Have been maxing out Solo 401k, Regret not setting up something like a defined benefit pension plan in some of the better years to allow more contributions in a single year, just didn't understand enough about it.
10% Retirement Accounts (75% pre-tax, 25% Roth)
Have been maxing out Solo 401k, Regret not setting up something like a defined benefit pension plan in some of the better years to allow more contributions in a single year, just didn't understand enough about it.