Blocking robot calls.
Blocking robot calls.
I am working from home lately and get a lot of robo calls. Sometimes a person is there, most often silence or clicking sounds.
Do phone systems exist that you can enter the incoming number and have the call ignored? Not talking about a service, but a blocker within my home phone system.
Suggestions and information appreciated.
Do phone systems exist that you can enter the incoming number and have the call ignored? Not talking about a service, but a blocker within my home phone system.
Suggestions and information appreciated.
Re: Blocking robot calls.
Cell phones can do this. I don't know if a landline can do it or not. It might be possible that an answering machine can learn what calls to block.
However, blocking 1 number will not block the caller. They have hundreds of numbers they can call from. The Do Not Call list might help a little, but it certainly is not 100% effective.
Best solution seems to be caller ID and send all unknown calls to voice mail. If this phone is used for business, that's hardly a good solution though.
It's frustrating, isn't it?
However, blocking 1 number will not block the caller. They have hundreds of numbers they can call from. The Do Not Call list might help a little, but it certainly is not 100% effective.
Best solution seems to be caller ID and send all unknown calls to voice mail. If this phone is used for business, that's hardly a good solution though.
It's frustrating, isn't it?
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Re: Blocking robot calls.
We use www.nomorobo.com for our land line. It blocks about 75% of the robo calls and seems to work quite well.
Re: Blocking robot calls.
Pete12 wrote:We use http://www.nomorobo.com for our land line. It blocks about 75% of the robo calls and seems to work quite well.
Nomorobo is not supported by Centurylink landline.
- tuningfork
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Re: Blocking robot calls.
Panasonic makes phones that allow you to add numbers to a block list. The phone rings once, then it checks the incoming Caller ID, and if it matches a number in the block list it hangs up the call.
Re: Blocking robot calls.
I have a panasonic answering machine and can block up to 20 calls on it, I think.
My FIOS internet lets me block up to 100. Blocking them from the tv is really easy.
My FIOS internet lets me block up to 100. Blocking them from the tv is really easy.
Re: Blocking robot calls.
Check out Panasonic cordless phones with answering machines. We have one that we use to block calls.
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Re: Blocking robot calls.
Mr Number app blocks a lot of junk calls to my cell phone...
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Re: Blocking robot calls.
Wow. Thank you every one.
I'm off to look at panasonic phones.
I'm off to look at panasonic phones.
Re: Blocking robot calls.
Have you asked your provider if they have an option for blocking calls?
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Re: Blocking robot calls.
Just bought a Panasonic cordless phone this week on Amazon. Base phone and two additional hand phones cost $69.
So many features that I have yet to figure them all out.
One feature we required was call blocking. The Panasonic cordless phone can block 50 numbers. We have tried it a couple of times, and it works well.
Here's the model we bought:
https://www.amazon.com/Panasonic-KX-TGD ... ess+phones
So many features that I have yet to figure them all out.
One feature we required was call blocking. The Panasonic cordless phone can block 50 numbers. We have tried it a couple of times, and it works well.
Here's the model we bought:
https://www.amazon.com/Panasonic-KX-TGD ... ess+phones
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Re: Blocking robot calls.
Ok, but some junk calls keep moving to new pseudorandom phone numbers.fandango wrote: One feature we required was call blocking. The Panasonic cordless phone can block 50 numbers. We have tried it a couple of times, and it works well.
This is why an app that does a quick online lookup to determine spam or real is good to have...
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Re: Blocking robot calls.
Call blocking on the panasonic phones is of almost no benefit. I have a Panasonic phone with call block capability. As previously mentioned, telemarketers use random (spoofed) numbers that constantly change.
I used to jack with the callers, just string them along. I figured it costs them money to talk to me, so the longer they talk the more expensive it is. And if they are talking to me, that means I am "taking one for the team", because they are not talking to someone else.
But the constant telemarketers gets tiring. AT&T was of no help. Zero.
I eventually ported my land number to Google Voice, and cancelled my landline. Calls to my home phone number are routed to my cell phone. Life is sweet now. Virtually no telemarketers now. I now get a txt and an email with transcribed voice mails if I don't answer the phone. I also use the app "Should I answer" on my cell phone. Sooner or later I plan to get the Obi phone from Amazon and have my land line transferred to the Obi. But it hasn't happened yet.
Summary: cancel land line, transfer to google voice.
I used to jack with the callers, just string them along. I figured it costs them money to talk to me, so the longer they talk the more expensive it is. And if they are talking to me, that means I am "taking one for the team", because they are not talking to someone else.
But the constant telemarketers gets tiring. AT&T was of no help. Zero.
I eventually ported my land number to Google Voice, and cancelled my landline. Calls to my home phone number are routed to my cell phone. Life is sweet now. Virtually no telemarketers now. I now get a txt and an email with transcribed voice mails if I don't answer the phone. I also use the app "Should I answer" on my cell phone. Sooner or later I plan to get the Obi phone from Amazon and have my land line transferred to the Obi. But it hasn't happened yet.
Summary: cancel land line, transfer to google voice.
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Re: Blocking robot calls.
I get several a day....am grateful they don't come during the middle of the night, horrifying thought. Something needs to be done
“Those who move forward with a happy spirit will find that things always work out.” -Retired 13 years 😀
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Re: Blocking robot calls.
don't recognize the number equals don't answer the phone.
if its a "real" call they'll leave a message.
if its a "real" call they'll leave a message.
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Re: Blocking robot calls.
We use CPR Call Blocker V108 and I wish we bought it earlier. Life is GOOD now
It blocks about 60-70% of calls. If I was on it more, I could hit the button to block more calls but haven't done it.
The minute it was installed the majority of the calls ceased, it became very quiet in the house. IT is connected online so is always updated
At this second, it is $5 cheaper on Ebay. We use a VoiceOverIP w/Suddenlink for our business line
My husband is pretty knowledgeable so you can pm me if you have any questions.
https://www.amazon.com/CPR-Call-Blocker ... locker+108
http://www.ebay.com/itm/CPR-Call-Blocke ... Sw0fhXl9Gv
We had a Telezapper prior. It only prevented about 20% of the calls.
It blocks about 60-70% of calls. If I was on it more, I could hit the button to block more calls but haven't done it.
The minute it was installed the majority of the calls ceased, it became very quiet in the house. IT is connected online so is always updated
At this second, it is $5 cheaper on Ebay. We use a VoiceOverIP w/Suddenlink for our business line
My husband is pretty knowledgeable so you can pm me if you have any questions.
https://www.amazon.com/CPR-Call-Blocker ... locker+108
http://www.ebay.com/itm/CPR-Call-Blocke ... Sw0fhXl9Gv
We had a Telezapper prior. It only prevented about 20% of the calls.
Last edited by outdoorsygal on Sat Aug 06, 2016 8:10 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: Blocking robot calls.
Except that won't necessarily work if you have a business line located in your home.miles monroe wrote:don't recognize the number equals don't answer the phone.
if its a "real" call they'll leave a message.
Re: Blocking robot calls.
Blocking 20 or 200 numbers is unfortunately a very temporary solution. Unless your prepared to constantly add and subtract new numbers, it will be of limited help. 1200 numbers would make a good dent.
Right now nomorobo is being added to other providers and seems to have the best answer. They are blocking more than 75%; closer to 85% of my calls.
From what I read, they are blocking somewhere between 40-50,000 calls per hour and rapidly rising.
Right now nomorobo is being added to other providers and seems to have the best answer. They are blocking more than 75%; closer to 85% of my calls.
From what I read, they are blocking somewhere between 40-50,000 calls per hour and rapidly rising.
Last edited by Rob5TCP on Sat Aug 06, 2016 8:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Blocking robot calls.
miles monroe wrote:don't recognize the number equals don't answer the phone.
if its a "real" call they'll leave a message.
12 or more calls a day? No. I want qiet back.
Re: Blocking robot calls.
Quiet is what I want. Thank you for the suggestion!outdoorsygal wrote:We use CPR Call Blocker V108 and I wish we bought it earlier. Life is GOOD now
It blocks about 60-70% of calls. If I was on it more, I could hit the button to block more calls but haven't done it.
The minute it was installed the majority of the calls ceased, it became very quiet in the .
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Re: Blocking robot calls.
Yes, those calls are very annoying! I must have gotten 20 of the one that starts with "This is Julie". I don't know how the rest of it goes because I hang up and block it immediately after that point.
The reason I don't have to worry about getting them late at night is that our house phone (Ooma) doesn't ring in the bedroom and our cell phones (iPhone 4) have "do not disturb" set from midnight to 9 AM. But I hate getting them in the daytime too.
Oh, and I have Nomorobo set on my Ooma phone system, so I'm sure that helps there too.
The reason I don't have to worry about getting them late at night is that our house phone (Ooma) doesn't ring in the bedroom and our cell phones (iPhone 4) have "do not disturb" set from midnight to 9 AM. But I hate getting them in the daytime too.
Oh, and I have Nomorobo set on my Ooma phone system, so I'm sure that helps there too.
In theory, theory and practice are identical. In practice, they often differ.
Re: Blocking robot calls.
miles monroe wrote:don't recognize the number equals don't answer the phone.
if its a "real" call they'll leave a message.
This is what I do.
Gordon
Re: Blocking robot calls.
I would say that about 70% of the calls we were getting were from about 10 numbers. I am blocking each one and slowly the calls are going away.
The worst time period for us was during the primaries. We were receiving 5 or 6 calls a day. From 9:00 AM to 10:00 PM.
The worst time period for us was during the primaries. We were receiving 5 or 6 calls a day. From 9:00 AM to 10:00 PM.
Re: Blocking robot calls.
I'm using nomorobo, and it works very well. However, I have a concern. In the event of a community disaster, my city will issue warning robo calls to affected neighborhoods. If there was a gas leak in my neighborhood, I would not want to miss the order to evacuate. Is there any protection against this?
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- TomatoTomahto
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Re: Blocking robot calls.
I use nomorobo. I get all robo calls from police and community callers, and even the broadcasts from school callers. I think the school uses a Honeywell system that robo allows through. I think the calls are also different in that they don't put you on the call if you pick up, as distinct from the objectionable calls. They are more a broadcast than a robo call.JPH wrote:I'm using nomorobo, and it works very well. However, I have a concern. In the event of a community disaster, my city will issue warning robo calls to affected neighborhoods. If there was a gas leak in my neighborhood, I would not want to miss the order to evacuate. Is there any protection against this?
I get the FI part but not the RE part of FIRE.
- Phineas J. Whoopee
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Re: Blocking robot calls.
I read a news story, recently, about a new joint initiative on the part of several companies to provide telecom-vendor blocking of auto-dialed calls, but I've searched and just can't find it. Maybe it was a beautiful dream one night?
Anyhow, if I don't recognize a number I let it go to voicemail, which admittedly may not be an option for businesses or parents. The robots are very good at detecting it, and they never leave a message.
If anybody does leave voicemail I retrieve it immediately, and phone them back if warranted.
PJW
Anyhow, if I don't recognize a number I let it go to voicemail, which admittedly may not be an option for businesses or parents. The robots are very good at detecting it, and they never leave a message.
If anybody does leave voicemail I retrieve it immediately, and phone them back if warranted.
PJW
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Re: Blocking robot calls.
Julie? She's from cardmember services.technovelist wrote:Yes, those calls are very annoying! I must have gotten 20 of the one that starts with "This is Julie". I don't know how the rest of it goes because I hang up and block it immediately after that point.
I really need a Donald eliminator. He calls me five to ten times a week, and the pollsters even more often.
So...because I have to keep a land line...is there anything reasonable that works for that? Our cell service is not great, and our security system won't work with VOIP.
Re: Blocking robot calls.
I have a landline. I use an answering machine with caller ID. If I don't know the number/name, I don't answer. Does that not work for you?
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Re: Blocking robot calls.
I am tired of the same numbers calling multiple times a day. I am working from home and want peace and quiet. I do not want to reward the telephone company and buy another service.retiredjg wrote:I have a landline. I use an answering machine with caller ID. If I don't know the number/name, I don't answer. Does that not work for you?
I would drop the land line but cell doesn' work in my condo building.
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Re: Blocking robot calls.
Fwiw, nomorobo is free.Dottie57 wrote:I am tired of the same numbers calling multiple times a day. I am working from home and want peace and quiet. I do not want to reward the telephone company and buy another service.retiredjg wrote:I have a landline. I use an answering machine with caller ID. If I don't know the number/name, I don't answer. Does that not work for you?
I would drop the land line but cell doesn' work in my condo building.
I get the FI part but not the RE part of FIRE.
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Re: Blocking robot calls.
I'd recommend that you get cell service that works with a wifi connection
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Re: Blocking robot calls.
I have a Panasonic cordless phone and basic Ooma (not Ooma Premier). I set the Panasonic phone to silence the ringer. I set the Ooma to answer after 59 seconds (done on the Ooma website) then it goes to the Ooma voicemail. Telemarketers usually hang up long before the 59 seconds. Those who really, really, really want to leave a message will hang on . If you are expecting an important phone call you don't want to miss you can set the ringer to be audible and then reset to silence later.
My Panasonic phone also has voicemail built into it. When I don't want any disturbing phone calls at all, I set the phone to "announcement" mode and set the phone to answer after one ring. My recorded announcement is pure silence for about one-half second. You can record any announcement you want. All the caller hears is a "click" when they are automatically disconnected.
None of this blocks calls but it helps to silence the annoying ones. Nomorobo looks good but it's not available for all carriers including basic Ooma.
My Panasonic phone also has voicemail built into it. When I don't want any disturbing phone calls at all, I set the phone to "announcement" mode and set the phone to answer after one ring. My recorded announcement is pure silence for about one-half second. You can record any announcement you want. All the caller hears is a "click" when they are automatically disconnected.
None of this blocks calls but it helps to silence the annoying ones. Nomorobo looks good but it's not available for all carriers including basic Ooma.
Last edited by Gort on Sun Aug 07, 2016 10:28 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Re: Blocking robot calls.
Thanks, just signed up for nomorobo.
I really hate those calls, and that seemed like a good solution to me.
Does not work for all phones, but they do support mine.
We'll see how well it works.
Seems like potential to disrupt legit calls, but you can
add whitelist and blacklist to their own lists of blocked numbers.
Very interesting idea.
I really hate those calls, and that seemed like a good solution to me.
Does not work for all phones, but they do support mine.
We'll see how well it works.
Seems like potential to disrupt legit calls, but you can
add whitelist and blacklist to their own lists of blocked numbers.
Very interesting idea.
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Re: Blocking robot calls.
Thanks Pete. My VOIP provider supports nomorobo and it's free for VOIP phones. Great tip!Pete12 wrote:We use http://www.nomorobo.com for our land line. It blocks about 75% of the robo calls and seems to work quite well.
Have a plan, stay the course and simplify. Then ignore the noise!
Re: Blocking robot calls.
I exclusively get calls that start with, "Hi! This is Sarah from cardmember services!" I wonder how they decide which of us gets calls from each different fake person. I have never received calls from Julie.technovelist wrote:I must have gotten 20 of the one that starts with "This is Julie".
There are some days where I do not get any calls. On most days I get 1 or 2. On some days I get upwards of 10 calls. It is very annoying.
I'm on the waiting list for Nomorobo for wireless, as it appears to be the only option. I have tried the Mr. Number block list, but it led to my phone freezing randomly (iPhone 6S). I thought perhaps it was due to having too many numbers blocked (>1000) by Mr. Number. I removed them from my blocked list and the phone works again. I would gladly pay $4.99/month to use Nomorobo, but I hope that the cell companies follow the advice of the FTC and choose to make these services free.
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Re: Blocking robot calls.
I don't answer my phone if I don't recognize the name or number. If they don't leave a message they don't get a call back. Easy as that. Before I implemented this policy, 95%+ of the unrecognizable numbers or callers that didn't leave a message were robocalls or people trying to sell something.
Re: Blocking robot calls.
Yep we have Verizon Fios, the odd call still gets through but Nomorobo is free so I'm not complaining. If a call goes past the "first ring" and I don't know who it is then I don't answer. If it's a genuine call they will leave a messageFrugalInvestor wrote:Thanks Pete. My VOIP provider supports nomorobo and it's free for VOIP phones. Great tip!
Re: Blocking robot calls.
I have a big callerid display that I can see from across the room. Unfortunately this one, Telnote, is no longer made.
I have one in the area I read in and one in the bedroom. I do not answer calls whose callerid I don't recognize. When people suggested this, I thought I would miss important calls, particularly from a doctor's office, but that does not happen. Most of the time the doctor's office sends me email.
Other real people, they have an obvious calledid. Otherwise, if it is a real person, they will leave a message.
I always report on the Do Not Call website. I don't know if this does any good, but it is at least something.
What fries my chops is I read that the telephone companies could fix this if they invested in their infrastructure. When you think of the time this wastes and the amount stolen from people who fall for the scams, I think they should be forced to do so.
I have one in the area I read in and one in the bedroom. I do not answer calls whose callerid I don't recognize. When people suggested this, I thought I would miss important calls, particularly from a doctor's office, but that does not happen. Most of the time the doctor's office sends me email.
Other real people, they have an obvious calledid. Otherwise, if it is a real person, they will leave a message.
I always report on the Do Not Call website. I don't know if this does any good, but it is at least something.
What fries my chops is I read that the telephone companies could fix this if they invested in their infrastructure. When you think of the time this wastes and the amount stolen from people who fall for the scams, I think they should be forced to do so.
Re: Blocking robot calls.
Pete12 wrote:We use http://www.nomorobo.com for our land line. It blocks about 75% of the robo calls and seems to work quite well.
How does Nomorobo work? I looked at the link and it said that Nomorobo blocks "known robo calls," but how do they know it's a robocall? Volume? And if the robo gang is consistently changing and adding numbers, isn't it an ongoing battle?Rob5TCP wrote: Right now nomorobo is being added to other providers and seems to have the best answer. They are blocking more than 75%; closer to 85% of my calls.
From what I read, they are blocking somewhere between 40-50,000 calls per hour and rapidly rising.
How does Nomorobo support itself, since it's free? Are there any downsides to signing up for it (such as Nomorobo robo calls or emails
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Re: Blocking robot calls.
IME, there are no downsides to signing up. I've used it ever since it first came out.Miriam2 wrote:Pete12 wrote:We use http://www.nomorobo.com for our land line. It blocks about 75% of the robo calls and seems to work quite well.How does Nomorobo work? I looked at the link and it said that Nomorobo blocks "known robo calls," but how do they know it's a robocall? Volume? And if the robo gang is consistently changing and adding numbers, isn't it an ongoing battle?Rob5TCP wrote: Right now nomorobo is being added to other providers and seems to have the best answer. They are blocking more than 75%; closer to 85% of my calls.
From what I read, they are blocking somewhere between 40-50,000 calls per hour and rapidly rising.
How does Nomorobo support itself, since it's free? Are there any downsides to signing up for it (such as Nomorobo robo calls or emails
I get the FI part but not the RE part of FIRE.
Re: Blocking robot calls.
+1 for us. We just got a call from the IRS. We are being sued by the IRS and we must ASAP call this number. Sounds to me we should have our banking information ready for the criminals. I will put a block on that number.Pete12 wrote:We use http://www.nomorobo.com for our land line. It blocks about 75% of the robo calls and seems to work quite well.
Re: Blocking robot calls.
I don't know how their algorithm works, but the odd call still gets through so presumably they are constantly updating it. They charge $4.99/month if you want to use the service with a cellphone, I guess that's how they make their money. I've never been pestered by them since signing up for the free service.Miriam2 wrote:How does Nomorobo work? I looked at the link and it said that Nomorobo blocks "known robo calls," but how do they know it's a robocall? Volume? And if the robo gang is consistently changing and adding numbers, isn't it an ongoing battle?
How does Nomorobo support itself, since it's free? Are there any downsides to signing up for it (such as Nomorobo robo calls or emails
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Re: Blocking robot calls.
This is from Nomorobo's FAQs on their site.......Pete12 wrote:I don't know how their algorithm works, but the odd call still gets through so presumably they are constantly updating it. They charge $4.99/month if you want to use the service with a cellphone, I guess that's how they make their money. I've never been pestered by them since signing up for the free service.Miriam2 wrote:How does Nomorobo work? I looked at the link and it said that Nomorobo blocks "known robo calls," but how do they know it's a robocall? Volume? And if the robo gang is consistently changing and adding numbers, isn't it an ongoing battle?
How does Nomorobo support itself, since it's free? Are there any downsides to signing up for it (such as Nomorobo robo calls or emails
How Does Nomorobo Stay In Business?
The service is free for consumers but business and public safety organizations pay to license the data. For consumers, robocalls are annoying. But, for businesses it costs them real money. And, for EMS systems (like 911), it could be a matter of life and death.
These are the people that don't mind paying for the service and using it directly in their telephone equipment.
Have a plan, stay the course and simplify. Then ignore the noise!
Re: Blocking robot calls.
We were getting so many robo calls that we eventually decided we needed to do something about it. Caller ID, and just ignoring unrecognized numbers wasn't good enough. So I investigated options with our phone provider (Midco). Turns out the best option was a feature they call Terminating Call Manager (https://www.midco.com/services/home-pho ... ll-manager). Unrecognized numbers get a message the first time they call requiring them to press '1' to be put through. I've had it active for about a week now, and it seems to be working well.
The cost for this service is a one-time fee of $30. I wasn't willing to pay a monthly fee, but for a one-time $30 it's well-worth it for me. Cheaper than a new phone/device to block calls. Easy to set up. And it's working. 'nuff said.
The cost for this service is a one-time fee of $30. I wasn't willing to pay a monthly fee, but for a one-time $30 it's well-worth it for me. Cheaper than a new phone/device to block calls. Easy to set up. And it's working. 'nuff said.
Re: Blocking robot calls.
Another option - take a look at automatic blockers with "white list" capabilities. Typical unit allows you to set up a "black list" for call block, "white list" for pass thru, & requires unrecognized callers to to press 0 (or 1) to ring thru.
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Re: Blocking robot calls.
I use Google Voice in two ways:
- to have a number to give to companies that I don't trust and to people that I don't trust. All calls are "screened" on that number in the sense that the caller must identify themselves, and I can accept, reject, or ignore the call accordingly.
- to transcribe voicemails left at my real number to text, so I don't have to login and follow voice menu prompts to screen it.
I coupled the above with a behavioral change: I don't answer any call I do not recognize.
I haven't talked to a robot in years.
- to have a number to give to companies that I don't trust and to people that I don't trust. All calls are "screened" on that number in the sense that the caller must identify themselves, and I can accept, reject, or ignore the call accordingly.
- to transcribe voicemails left at my real number to text, so I don't have to login and follow voice menu prompts to screen it.
I coupled the above with a behavioral change: I don't answer any call I do not recognize.
I haven't talked to a robot in years.
Re: Blocking robot calls.
This thread is of interest to me.
I started a similar thread a while back, without results that I put to use (yet).
scotthal - What you seem to suggest is similar to what I'm looking for. Do you have a specific brand or model you can suggest?
FWIW, suggestions to ignore unrecognized numbers aren't super helpful. You still have the distraction of a phone ringing, and you need to go to the phone (at least with our current phones) to look at the display to see if it's a regular caller or not. Also, systems that rely on you manually adding black list numbers to a device seem unlikely to be as effective as desired. While I am not entirely sure, I think a high % of the junk calls come from new/randomized numbers.
I started a similar thread a while back, without results that I put to use (yet).
scotthal - What you seem to suggest is similar to what I'm looking for. Do you have a specific brand or model you can suggest?
FWIW, suggestions to ignore unrecognized numbers aren't super helpful. You still have the distraction of a phone ringing, and you need to go to the phone (at least with our current phones) to look at the display to see if it's a regular caller or not. Also, systems that rely on you manually adding black list numbers to a device seem unlikely to be as effective as desired. While I am not entirely sure, I think a high % of the junk calls come from new/randomized numbers.
Re: Blocking robot calls.
I submitted a few numbers to the Do Not Call Registry but it doesn't seem to help me to much.
https://complaints.donotcall.gov/compla ... check.aspx
https://complaints.donotcall.gov/compla ... check.aspx
Re: Blocking robot calls.
The Tel-Sentry v2.2 (& it's v2.0 predecessor) both do the deed, and available thru Amazon.psteinx wrote:This thread is of interest to me.
I started a similar thread a while back, without results that I put to use (yet).
scotthal - What you seem to suggest is similar to what I'm looking for. Do you have a specific brand or model you can suggest?
Growtch, grinch; paranoid contrarian
- Phineas J. Whoopee
- Posts: 9675
- Joined: Sun Dec 18, 2011 5:18 pm
Re: Blocking robot calls.
It appears I was awake.Phineas J. Whoopee wrote:I read a news story, recently, about a new joint initiative on the part of several companies to provide telecom-vendor blocking of auto-dialed calls, but I've searched and just can't find it. Maybe it was a beautiful dream one night?
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PJW