What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

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Nicolas
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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by Nicolas » Sat Jul 16, 2016 10:02 pm

I'm waiting for holographic TVs before I upgrade. Currently I have a Panasonic plasma, superior to LCD, and nobody makes them anymore. Also one TV is enough for me. Since I've retired I don't watch it much.

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by BW1985 » Sat Jul 16, 2016 10:03 pm

lack_ey wrote:
BW1985 wrote:I bought my system 6-7 years ago (Onkyo reciever, Klipsch speakers, Velodyne sub) but if I was buying today I would definitely go Sonos for the wireless & wifi.
You can always hook up something like a Chromecast Audio (the $35 dongle) to dumb audio sets. That has multiroom support too.

With Sonos you're kind of locked into an ecosystem with components that aren't that cheap, and their speakers (though they have a receiver too, for using non-Sonos speakers) are more for room sound than sound-good-in-a-dedicated-listening/TV spot sound.
Good points. I already use air play so really I just like the wireless speaker aspect, but they may not sound as good as what I already have.
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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by BW1985 » Sat Jul 16, 2016 10:04 pm

Nicolas wrote:I'm waiting for holographic TVs before I upgrade. Currently I have a Panasonic plasma, superior to LCD, and nobody makes them anymore. Also one TV is enough for me. Since I've retired I don't watch it much.
I like my Panasonic plasma too especially for movies in the dark.
"Squirrels figured out how to save eons ago. They buried acorns. Some, they dug up, for food. Others, they let to sprout, in new oak trees. We could learn from squirrels." -john94549

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by JonnyDVM » Sat Jul 16, 2016 11:04 pm

toofache32 wrote:
Cindyjrn wrote:
toofache32 wrote:
JonnyDVM wrote: So it sounds like for now it's OK to go with my original plan for 1080p. Then when 4K takes the world over I'll consider upgrading. Will be buying everything this week. Now I just need help with the stereo receiver...
Do people still buy "receivers"? I use the Sonos speaker system and absolutely love it. They have a soundbar that can go with your TV although I have not used it. The speakers sound really really good and are connected by wifi. Your friends can download the app on their phone and play their music on your speakers.
People who have high end home theaters do. Your idea of really good probably greatly differs from mine.
If you're talking about speakers for the TV then I agree, Sonos is not the way to go. Sorry I thought you were talking about something for playing music.
If you ARE talking about playing music, consider giving the Sonos a try and return it if you don't like it. I am a music snob with a college degree in music who used to have those big boxes in a cabinet...receiver, tuner, amplifier, etc. I surprised myself when I decided I liked the Sonos system several years ago.
To be honest I'm not a sound guy. There's speakers all over the place in this house. In the ceiling and outside. I need to get the box that controls them all. That's lower on the list.
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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by Cindyjrn » Sat Jul 16, 2016 11:10 pm

toofache32 wrote:
Cindyjrn wrote:
toofache32 wrote:
JonnyDVM wrote: So it sounds like for now it's OK to go with my original plan for 1080p. Then when 4K takes the world over I'll consider upgrading. Will be buying everything this week. Now I just need help with the stereo receiver...
Do people still buy "receivers"? I use the Sonos speaker system and absolutely love it. They have a soundbar that can go with your TV although I have not used it. The speakers sound really really good and are connected by wifi. Your friends can download the app on their phone and play their music on your speakers.
People who have high end home theaters do. Your idea of really good probably greatly differs from mine.
If you're talking about speakers for the TV then I agree, Sonos is not the way to go. Sorry I thought you were talking about something for playing music.
If you ARE talking about playing music, consider giving the Sonos a try and return it if you don't like it. I am a music snob with a college degree in music who used to have those big boxes in a cabinet...receiver, tuner, amplifier, etc. I surprised myself when I decided I liked the Sonos system several years ago.
I honestly can't imagine listening to music through wifi speakers, let alone watching movies with DTSHD or TrueHD tracks or Atmos. Fortunately I don't have to give them a try, I already have a very elaborate home theater system. Different strokes.

And just out of curiosity, what files types of music are you listening to via these wireless Sonos speakers? All of my music is ripped to FLAC. I understand that most people are listening and streaming mp3 and AAC. It's very possible that those specific file types sound good on a Sonos type system being that they're low bitrate. Believe it or not, those highly compressed low bitrate files sound pretty bad on a good system.

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by JonnyDVM » Sat Jul 16, 2016 11:15 pm

Funny I recently replaced my old 720p plasma with an LG LCD. I'm not crazy about the LCD but it's a lot lighter

As to why 5 Tvs? Well actually I counted wrong. It's 6. There's mounts already in place in the master, main floor, finished basement, and outdoor patio. The extra two are for my lifelong dream of having two "auxiliary" TVs going for football Sunday's and March Madness. I'm planning to get the new wireless direct tv boxes. That way I can keep the extra two in the guest bedrooms and pull them out for the games. We've had only one TV for years. I didn't actually want to purchase and mount all the TVs right now, but apparently if you don't have all the TVs in place Direct TV won't do the install.

I went to Costco today and the Samsung 1080p Smart was the best deal I could find. I don't really want the smart features but I didn't see any without. I would rather get plain old not smart 1080p if I can find it. Not crazy about Vizio though. Trying to stick with Samsung.
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Epsilon Delta
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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by Epsilon Delta » Sat Jul 16, 2016 11:18 pm

Uncompressed CD is 0.7Mb/s. It's hard to see why Wi-Fi would have any trouble handling this for any reasonable number of speakers.

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by FrugalInvestor » Sat Jul 16, 2016 11:37 pm

My suggestion is to buy good quality HD TVs at half-price today. Then wait for 8K TVs appear on the consumer market and 4k to drop by half and buy 4k. In other words, always buy one generation back.

The fact is that all the related technology needs to catch up before you realize the benefit of new generation technology - other than bragging rights. If bragging rights are important to you then buy 4k today. Otherwise stay one generation back, get your money's worth and invest the rest.
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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by stratton » Sun Jul 17, 2016 1:20 am

2015 Samsung 4k TV as a Monitor Set Up Guide
Assumptions/Disclaimers:

-This guide was written based on my JS9000 model. All of these models (JU6500, JU6700, JU7100, JU7500, JS7000 JS8500, JS9000) are very similar, but there are slight differences. This guide should still be mostly applicable for all of them.

-This guide assumes you have the TV assembled already, have powered it on for the first time, and gone through the initial setup (setting date, time, network settings, etc.) but have not yet gotten to picture modes, color configurations, and other things which really make these TV's shine as monitors.

-This guide assumes you have a HDMI 2.0 capable video card. These TV's are only equipped with HDMI ports, and this means that if you want the full 3840x2160 resolution at 60hz, and full 4:4:4 Chroma, HDMI 2.0 is the only interface that is going to work. At the time I am writing this, this means a GeForce GTX 9xx series card. While these ports will likely be available on all kinds of GPU's and computers in the future, right now GeForce GTX 9xx cards are the only game in town.

-TV picture settings are VERY subjective. There may be recommendations in this guide you disagree with. That doesn't mean either of us are wrong, it just means we prefer things one way or another. Wherever possible I intend to identify which of the recommendations are particularly subjective ones, and which are fairly objective.
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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by Cindyjrn » Sun Jul 17, 2016 9:55 am

Epsilon Delta wrote:Uncompressed CD is 0.7Mb/s. It's hard to see why Wi-Fi would have any trouble handling this for any reasonable number of speakers.
Many high quality CDs ripped to FLAC have a bitrate in the 2500-3000kbps range. 24 bit/192kHz files are close to 10000. And you're quoting single channel CD bitrate. A stereo CD will have a bitrate of 1.4, not .7.

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by Epsilon Delta » Sun Jul 17, 2016 11:24 am

Cindyjrn wrote:
Epsilon Delta wrote:Uncompressed CD is 0.7Mb/s. It's hard to see why Wi-Fi would have any trouble handling this for any reasonable number of speakers.
Many high quality CDs ripped to FLAC have a bitrate in the 2500-3000kbps range. 24 bit/192kHz files are close to 10000. And you're
quoting single channel CD bitrate. A stereo CD will have a bitrate of 1.4, not .7.
You cannot increase the information in the CD by recoding to FLAC. You just encode it less efficiently. You can compress it losslessly by reverting to the original CD encoding. And stereo is a reasonable number of speakers.

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by Farmboyslim83 » Sun Jul 17, 2016 11:46 am

Highest end Vizio line is the new "P" series, 55" was on sale at Best Buy for $1199, seems like a nice tv to me.

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by DSInvestor » Sun Jul 17, 2016 4:16 pm

[Post removed --admin LadyGeek]
[Response to removed post --admin LadyGeek],
I was under the impression that the standard CD encoding is 44,100 times per second 16 bits per sample per channel. 44,100 X 2 X 16 = 1,411,200 bits per second. Are you working with a different CD encoding that results in a higher bit rate of 2500-3000Kbps? Is this what you mean by "high quality CD" perhaps HDCD or SA-CD? If using a computer to rip, can computer drives even read the enhanced formats or do they revert to reading the standard CD format? If ripping a regular CD to FLAC, wouldn't the lossless compression also result in 1,411Kbps bit rate, same as for the CD? I'm not an expert but curious.
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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by reneeh63 » Sun Jul 17, 2016 6:33 pm

toofache32 wrote:I just went through the same scenario with 5 TVs in a new house. My one big TV is 85" and it's 4k because, well, just because. I use a Roku 4 to watch movies which can upscale to 4k. The picture looks great regardless. I have read online reviews that say 4k is not worth it until your screen gets above a certain size (I can't remember).
JonnyDVM wrote: Ok, that's sort of where I was at: 5- 7 years down the road maybe. Of course I'll have an argument with my wife about it then. She'll say what we have is good enough. Future me is already shaking his head.
If you ever get divorced, give me her number...
All this talk of 4 or 5 or 6 tv's in a single house sounds crazy to me! What, one in the family room, a game room, and each bedroom? Kitchen? Doesn't anyone watch on their lil' ole laptop or tablet? Sounds like lotsa money for....I dunno. Just me but I've always vetoed tv's in the bedroom...I only use the bedroom for 2 things, sleep and... - and tv interferes with both of them.

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by Doom&Gloom » Sun Jul 17, 2016 6:55 pm

reneeh63 wrote:
toofache32 wrote:I just went through the same scenario with 5 TVs in a new house. My one big TV is 85" and it's 4k because, well, just because. I use a Roku 4 to watch movies which can upscale to 4k. The picture looks great regardless. I have read online reviews that say 4k is not worth it until your screen gets above a certain size (I can't remember).
JonnyDVM wrote: Ok, that's sort of where I was at: 5- 7 years down the road maybe. Of course I'll have an argument with my wife about it then. She'll say what we have is good enough. Future me is already shaking his head.
If you ever get divorced, give me her number...
All this talk of 4 or 5 or 6 tv's in a single house sounds crazy to me! What, one in the family room, a game room, and each bedroom? Kitchen? Doesn't anyone watch on their lil' ole laptop or tablet? Sounds like lotsa money for....I dunno. Just me but I've always vetoed tv's in the bedroom...I only use the bedroom for 2 things, sleep and... - and tv interferes with both of them.
We have 4: a 55" plasma in the living room; a 42" plasma in the MBR; a 42" plasma in the den/rec room; and a 32" LCD in the kitchen/den. The three plasmas are connected to AVRs with multiple speakers. Except for a few sporting events, I rarely watch TV prior to 6pm. My wife, on the other hand, wants a TV on in front of her whenever possible--even if she isn't paying attention.

I would rather take a beating than watch any sort of program on a phone, tablet, laptop, or PC. I very rarely even watch a YouTube video. Those are simply not enjoyable experiences for me. I guess people are different. Who woulda thunk it?

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by LadyGeek » Sun Jul 17, 2016 7:13 pm

With reference to some earlier posts regarding bit rates, I think there is some confusion on where these bit rates are occurring.

See: What Data Compression Does To Your Music There are many references, I just picked this one.

1) The audio sampling rate of 44.1 KHz is what goes to the digital processor --> analog --> amplifier --> speakers to become sound. The data is streamed at 16 (bits) x 44,100 (fs) x 2 (two channels in a stereo signal) = 1411.2kbps.

Streaming audio bits over a network, like from a PC to wi-fi headphones, is doable.

2) The format of the audio source file. This is the .WAV, FLAC, MP3, and a host of others. The point of these many file formats is to get the best bang for the buck, namely the smallest file size with the highest audio quality. Those are 2 diametrical opposites, you have to choose something that's "good enough" for what you want.

The data rate comes into play when you want to stream the compressed audio format over your home network. For example, streaming from your PC to a DVD player that can handle FLAC files. The data rate goes crazy high, which can bog down your home network.

Once the DVD player has the data (which is the digital processor), it then proceeds to decode and convert the bits into analog audio and send it up the audio chain where it gets to your speakers.
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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by toofache32 » Sun Jul 17, 2016 8:31 pm

Doom&Gloom wrote:
reneeh63 wrote:
toofache32 wrote:I just went through the same scenario with 5 TVs in a new house. My one big TV is 85" and it's 4k because, well, just because. I use a Roku 4 to watch movies which can upscale to 4k. The picture looks great regardless. I have read online reviews that say 4k is not worth it until your screen gets above a certain size (I can't remember).
JonnyDVM wrote: Ok, that's sort of where I was at: 5- 7 years down the road maybe. Of course I'll have an argument with my wife about it then. She'll say what we have is good enough. Future me is already shaking his head.
If you ever get divorced, give me her number...
All this talk of 4 or 5 or 6 tv's in a single house sounds crazy to me! What, one in the family room, a game room, and each bedroom? Kitchen? Doesn't anyone watch on their lil' ole laptop or tablet? Sounds like lotsa money for....I dunno. Just me but I've always vetoed tv's in the bedroom...I only use the bedroom for 2 things, sleep and... - and tv interferes with both of them.
We have 4: a 55" plasma in the living room; a 42" plasma in the MBR; a 42" plasma in the den/rec room; and a 32" LCD in the kitchen/den. The three plasmas are connected to AVRs with multiple speakers. Except for a few sporting events, I rarely watch TV prior to 6pm. My wife, on the other hand, wants a TV on in front of her whenever possible--even if she isn't paying attention.

I would rather take a beating than watch any sort of program on a phone, tablet, laptop, or PC.
I very rarely even watch a YouTube video. Those are simply not enjoyable experiences for me. I guess people are different. Who woulda thunk it?
Ditto that. I would rather stare at the wall.

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by fsrph » Sun Jul 17, 2016 8:43 pm

BW1985 wrote:
Nicolas wrote:I'm waiting for holographic TVs before I upgrade. Currently I have a Panasonic plasma, superior to LCD, and nobody makes them anymore. Also one TV is enough for me. Since I've retired I don't watch it much.
I like my Panasonic plasma too especially for movies in the dark.
I like my Samsung plasma also. Hooked up a Sony Blu-ray and can stream all the main services. Don't want to derail the thread, but why don't they make plasmas anymore?

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by spammagnet » Sun Jul 17, 2016 8:50 pm

fsrph wrote:Don't want to derail the thread, but why don't they make plasmas anymore?
Why aren't plasma TVs made any more?

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by JonnyDVM » Sun Jul 17, 2016 9:50 pm

My 42' plasma from 2007 literally weighed 90lbs. Great TV though. Many memories of mounting and moving it by myself.

I'm sure your all just dying to know what I ended up purchasing. Best Buy had a 55' Toshiba 1080p dumb TV for $399. I grabbed the last one the had for my "outside" TV. Costco still had the best deal on the Samsung 1080p Smart TVs. Bought one 60' ($700) for basement, one 55' ($600) for main floor and two 40' ($300) for guest bedrooms/play room and auxiliary football watching on Sundays. They had the Samsung 55' 4K for $850 which was tempting, but I took the majority advice in the thread and stayed with the slightly older 1080p models. I figure getting TVs for the whole house for $2300 wasn't too bad considering 4K sets would have been significantly more. Probably won't get a ton of use for smart features but the price was right and not that much different from the non smart TVs.

Turns out my friend actually has a stereo receiver he isn't using so I'm going to borrow it. So the stereo problem is solved.

Now we just need the master bedroom set, kitchen table, dining room table, couch...
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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by acanthurus » Sun Jul 17, 2016 10:24 pm

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by Epsilon Delta » Sun Jul 17, 2016 10:36 pm

LadyGeek wrote:The data rate comes into play when you want to stream the compressed audio format over your home network. For example, streaming from your PC to a DVD player that can handle FLAC files. The data rate goes crazy high, which can bog down your home network.
Here's what you didn't say.

If the FLAC originally came from a ripped CD you don't need a crazy high bit rate. Converting a CD to FLAC creates no new information. Conceptually you could just send the CD (at the CD bit rate) and convert to FLAC in the DVD player. In practice just send the CD data and play that. It will sound the same as the larger FLAC unless the DVD's CD decoder is broken.

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by acanthurus » Sun Jul 17, 2016 10:50 pm

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by UALflyer » Mon Jul 18, 2016 9:43 am

toofache32 wrote:
JonnyDVM wrote: So it sounds like for now it's OK to go with my original plan for 1080p. Then when 4K takes the world over I'll consider upgrading. Will be buying everything this week. Now I just need help with the stereo receiver...
Do people still buy "receivers"? I use the Sonos speaker system and absolutely love it. They have a soundbar that can go with your TV although I have not used it. The speakers sound really really good and are connected by wifi. Your friends can download the app on their phone and play their music on your speakers.
If you don't already have the wiring in place, a wireless speaker system, such as Sonos, will sound ok, but it has quite a few limitations. A lot of people already have the wiring and speakers in place though, which sound significantly better than any wireless system out there. Also, quality receivers can do things than no other wireless speaker system can do on its own, such as make multiple audio and video systems work together, etc...

By the way, the vast majority of modern receivers also have Bluetooth and WiFi, so playing music from your phone through the receiver is not an issue.

Hence, the reason that the receiver market is doing very well.
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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by alfaspider » Mon Jul 18, 2016 10:39 am

toofache32 wrote:
JonnyDVM wrote: So it sounds like for now it's OK to go with my original plan for 1080p. Then when 4K takes the world over I'll consider upgrading. Will be buying everything this week. Now I just need help with the stereo receiver...
Do people still buy "receivers"? I use the Sonos speaker system and absolutely love it. They have a soundbar that can go with your TV although I have not used it. The speakers sound really really good and are connected by wifi. Your friends can download the app on their phone and play their music on your speakers.
Physics being what it is, a receiver (or some sort of dedicated amplifier setup) is always going to be needed to reproduce the highest quality sound. Sound is vibration, and in order to accurately reproduce those vibrations you have to use electricity to get some sort of membrane to sympathetically vibrate. A powerful low frequency sound is going to require a large membrane and a lot of power to move it. High frequency sounds require a lot of accuracy, which is best achieved with a tweeter that is very stiff (so it will not continue to vibrate after power is applied), requiring a lot of power to move. A small soundbar or sonos type device is relying on a single speaker size to reproduce the entire sound range, which can be setup to mimic larger vibrating devices through things like bandpass enclosures (essentially the same trick as an unpowered megaphone), but they can never reproduce sound with the same power and accuracy of discrete speakers sized appropriately for a given frequency range and a larger, more powerful amplifier.

Most people really don't care that much about sound quality so long as they can hear dialogue properly and the lyrics to their favorite song. Midrange sound (at the frequency of the human voice) tends to be easier to reproduce, and our brains are tuned to pick up frequencies in that range. But those who value high sound quality and full range sound reproduction are always going to want a larger setup.

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by kir_royale » Mon Jul 18, 2016 1:24 pm

We recently bought a TCL Roku 55" Roku t.v. at Costco. http://www.tclusa.com/currentmodels/55up120/

It was around $560 on sale. Our last t.v. we bought (11 years ago) was $1200 and weighed 90lbs. The reviews say the sound sucks and you need a sound bar. Ridiculous, the sound is fine.

Our friend is a video game/graphics person and we were considering a Samsung and he said don't waste your money on the name brand. We're very happy with it.

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by toofache32 » Mon Jul 18, 2016 2:21 pm

kir_royale wrote:We recently bought a TCL Roku 55" Roku t.v. at Costco. http://www.tclusa.com/currentmodels/55up120/

It was around $560 on sale. Our last t.v. we bought (11 years ago) was $1200 and weighed 90lbs. The reviews say the sound sucks and you need a sound bar. Ridiculous, the sound is fine.

Our friend is a video game/graphics person and we were considering a Samsung and he said don't waste your money on the name brand. We're very happy with it.
Very interesting, I didn't know Roku was integrated into some TVs but it makes perfect sense. I have a Roku 4 and love it because it consolidates Netflix, Hulu, Amazon TV and Plex which are the main online services I use.

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by munemaker » Mon Jul 18, 2016 2:28 pm

Not upgrading to the 3D TV, the curved-screen TV, the 4K TV or any other gimmicks the manufacturers come up with to sell more TVs.

I am very satisfied with the 1080 format.

If my TV would go bad, then yes, I may consider based on what is going on at the time. However TVs last so long, that probably won't happen for a long time.

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by Youngblood » Mon Jul 18, 2016 2:54 pm

NightFall wrote:Personally I would by a 1080p non-smart TV and get a chromecast if you want streaming features. Smart tvs have a significant premium over regular tvs. Plus, this hardware/software is usually outdated quickly. I'd rather replace a $35 stick than a $1000 TV. As others noted, there is little to no content that uses 4k right now.
+1

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by Youngblood » Mon Jul 18, 2016 2:59 pm

quantAndHold wrote:I'm still trying to wrap my head around needing five TV's. We have one that we barely watch. I can't imagine what the other four would be for.
Amen, even though I like TV an hour or mostly two a day. My wife, if she were a gun totin' mama, would probably shoot at least four of them.

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by cherijoh » Mon Jul 18, 2016 3:47 pm

quantAndHold wrote:I'm still trying to wrap my head around needing five TV's. We have one that we barely watch. I can't imagine what the other four would be for.
I'm glad to see I'm not the only 1 TV household out there. I was beginning to think I was an anomaly and that Bogleheads weren't as frugal as I thought. :wink:

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by alfaspider » Mon Jul 18, 2016 4:10 pm

cherijoh wrote:
quantAndHold wrote:I'm still trying to wrap my head around needing five TV's. We have one that we barely watch. I can't imagine what the other four would be for.
I'm glad to see I'm not the only 1 TV household out there. I was beginning to think I was an anomaly and that Bogleheads weren't as frugal as I thought. :wink:
I'm right there with you. I don't get the TV in every room of the house thing. We have one, and that's plenty.

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by stoptothink » Mon Jul 18, 2016 4:34 pm

cherijoh wrote:
quantAndHold wrote:I'm still trying to wrap my head around needing five TV's. We have one that we barely watch. I can't imagine what the other four would be for.
I'm glad to see I'm not the only 1 TV household out there. I was beginning to think I was an anomaly and that Bogleheads weren't as frugal as I thought. :wink:
We were a zero TV household for the first 2yrs of our marriage and I never owned one between the ages of 16 and 32. Couldn't turn down a freebie from my wife's grandpa. We'll likely be upgrading to a larger unit (current is 37") as we watch very little TV, but do prefer Netflix and our couch to going to the movies. Would love for the 55" TCL Roku TV to get below $400.

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by Ged » Mon Jul 18, 2016 4:54 pm

UALflyer wrote:If you don't already have the wiring in place, a wireless speaker system, such as Sonos, will sound ok, but it has quite a few limitations. A lot of people already have the wiring and speakers in place though, which sound significantly better than any wireless system out there. Also, quality receivers can do things than no other wireless speaker system can do on its own, such as make multiple audio and video systems work together, etc...

By the way, the vast majority of modern receivers also have Bluetooth and WiFi, so playing music from your phone through the receiver is not an issue.

Hence, the reason that the receiver market is doing very well.
Depends what you mean by wireless system.

WiFi transmission of audio is capable of transmitting the full quality of the original recording. A modern WiFi connection is capable of 50+ Mbps transmission rates which is well above CD data rates, And for a variety of reasons a properly mastered CD is perceptually indistinguishable from recordings made at higher bit rates.

My home system uses a mix of WiFi and wired Ethernet to distribute music to some pretty high end equipment. The transmission media makes no difference. The two important factors are the original recording and the speakers. Is it a wireless system? For music, yes. Is it anything like a Sonus system? No.

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by Broken Man 1999 » Mon Jul 18, 2016 5:34 pm

quantAndHold wrote:I'm still trying to wrap my head around needing five TV's. We have one that we barely watch. I can't imagine what the other four would be for.
I'll see his five and raise him one!

3 - TVs in bedrooms (I pretty much watch TV only at night, or in my garage) My bedroom has Onkyo receiver w/Polk Audio speakers.
1 - TV living room ( fading fast, another 6 months maybe) coupled to an Onkyo receiver w/HSU speakers. Older receiver will be moved to Sunroom, replaced by Onkyo network receiver when I get a chance, unit in my closet for now.
1 - TV garage (40" TCL Roku TV, gift from my children. Replaced an old, old 36" Toshiba Tube TV that had done service in living room, and a bedroom) Old Kenwood receiver I need to hook up for great sound. But, I will say the TCL Roku speakers are pretty darn good.
1 - TV Sunroom (doubles as grandkid's playroom)

2 Samsungs, 2 LGs, 1 Sony, 1 TCL Roku.

I also have a cable drop on my deck, but have never rolled out a TV.

Broken Man 1999
“If I cannot drink Bourbon and smoke cigars in Heaven than I shall not go. " -Mark Twain

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by unclescrooge » Mon Jul 18, 2016 8:00 pm

JonnyDVM wrote:I need to stock a new house with TVs. I only have one and I need four more. I thought no stations broadcast in 4K yet and thus it didn't make sense to buy 4K, but now I'm being pressured to buy at least one by a friend. I don't want to feel dumb three years down the line for not buying 4K but they are twice as expensive. Any opinions? FWIW I'm looking at getting a 60', 55' and two 40's. Was going to do Samsung smart LCD tvs 1080p. Good deal at Costco.

The 60' will be my main football watching tv. Should I be without question paying double for 4K? :confused
I was convinced by the "salesman" at Costco to not waste my money on Samsung and get the much cheaper vizio 4k smart tv instead.

Maybe because we're both of the same ethnicity.

I'm very happy with it.

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by pondering » Mon Jul 18, 2016 9:57 pm

Does anyone have experience using a 4K TV as a monitor?

Thanks
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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by toofache32 » Mon Jul 18, 2016 11:44 pm

pondering wrote:Does anyone have experience using a 4K TV as a monitor?

Thanks
I haven't done this but I do have multiple 30" monitors that are greater than 1080 (2560 x 1600). You have to make sure your video card will support the resolution you want and have the appropriate plugs that are compatible with your monitor. You also have to like the wide-screen format many 4k panels come in.

http://www.geforce.com/hardware/technol ... orted-gpus

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by stratton » Mon Jul 18, 2016 11:50 pm

pondering wrote:Does anyone have experience using a 4K TV as a monitor?

Thanks
From the same place I previously mentioned.

New Samsung 4k for everyone

174+ page thread. :P

Paul
...and then Buffy staked Edward. The end.

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by vladimirb0b » Tue Jul 19, 2016 4:16 am

It depends on how big the TV is and how far away you are going to watch it... That is, assuming that there is 4K content during the life of your TV

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f8-ge ... post563982

Image
Last edited by vladimirb0b on Tue Jul 19, 2016 12:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by wrongfunds » Tue Jul 19, 2016 12:10 pm

I am not impressed by numbers of TVs you have in your house. If you want to impress me, tell me how many set top boxes do you rent from your service provider!

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by LadyGeek » Tue Jul 19, 2016 6:37 pm

toofache32 wrote:
pondering wrote:Does anyone have experience using a 4K TV as a monitor?

Thanks
I haven't done this but I do have multiple 30" monitors that are greater than 1080 (2560 x 1600). You have to make sure your video card will support the resolution you want and have the appropriate plugs that are compatible with your monitor. You also have to like the wide-screen format many 4k panels come in.

http://www.geforce.com/hardware/technol ... orted-gpus
I'm running a 30" monitor at 2560 x 1440 x 60 Hz. You are correct about the plugs, as HDMI runs out of gas at this resolution (and refresh rate). You need DisplayPort: DisplayPort vs HDMI: What's the difference?
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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by JonnyDVM » Tue Jul 19, 2016 9:32 pm

vladimirb0b wrote:It depends on how big the TV is and how far away you are going to watch it... That is, assuming that there is 4K content during the life of your TV

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f8-ge ... post563982

Image
I did see a similar chart. I'm actually right at about 12 feet viewing distance in the main room and the basement. So right on the borderline for 60"and 55" where even needing 1080 is questionable per that chart. I don't think I'll have significant regret about the decision to forgo 4K for now. I think I did pretty well cost wise relatively speaking especially with the 55" Toshiba for $399.

To the one TV bogleheads- I was once like you. Then I got a new house with four TV mounts already in place along with the behind the wall wiring. So now here I am keeping Costco in business. It's going to be fun around here on Sunday's though. Now I just need to get a pool table by Week one. That'll probably be another thread.

Also- who sits 4 feet away from a 65" TV? For the love of God scoot back a bit!
Last edited by JonnyDVM on Wed Jul 20, 2016 11:00 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by LadyGeek » Tue Jul 19, 2016 9:45 pm

JonnyDVM wrote:...Also- who sits 4 feet away from a 65' TV? For the love of God scoot back a bit!
You mean 65" (double quote after 65), which is 65". Otherwise, it's 65 feet.

I sat about 10 feet back from my 65" TV when I had one. Now, it's a 63" plasma. I scooted up a bit closer.

Don't forget about your viewing height. Here's an old example, which is based on Field of View: HDTV Set Up « THX.com
Wiki To some, the glass is half full. To others, the glass is half empty. To an engineer, it's twice the size it needs to be.

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by Dead Man Walking » Wed Jul 20, 2016 2:33 am

I have a 55" Samsung 4k smart TV and Time Warner cable. The 4k is worthless. Samsung UN55F9000AF isn't a top quality TV. Thank God, I bought the extended warranty. My TV is WiFi connected and the internet diagnosis was incorrect - took 3 service calls and a month to repair it. When I needed another TV, I bought a Vizio HD dumb TV - great picture, good sound, no problems. My experience is that Samsung and 4k smart TV are both overpriced and overhyped.

DMW

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by cjking » Wed Jul 20, 2016 2:46 am

I was googling 4K yesterday, probably triggered by this thread. I came across an article from three years ago saying what I had myself thought: the vast majority of people will never need 4K resolution. As resolutions have improved, people's viewing distances have not changed. To get an advantage from higher resolution means having bigger screens. The size of screen needed to benefit from 4K will simply not be acceptable in most homes.

Three years later the author has now given the green light for buying 4K, partly because prices have fallen, but mainly because nearly all top quality TVs are apparently 4K. People may not need 4K (or Smart TV technology, or 3D support) but if you buy the best TV for picture quality, you will get all of these thrown in. (I've read elsewhere that there are improvements other than resolution that may come bundled with 4K, and those are worth having even if the increased resolution does nothing for you. This is assuming you are the kind of TV buyer who wants the best regardless of price.)

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by mmcmonster » Wed Jul 20, 2016 5:22 am

toofache32 wrote:Do people still buy "receivers"? I use the Sonos speaker system and absolutely love it. They have a soundbar that can go with your TV although I have not used it. The speakers sound really really good and are connected by wifi. Your friends can download the app on their phone and play their music on your speakers.
I don't know about "people", but I love the flexibility of receivers. Attach multiple sources to your TV and drive external speakers and subwoofers from the receiver. (Newer receivers do airplay as well.)

It's quite important if you have a wall-mounted TV and want to minimize cables going to and from it (or if you built the room with just a single HDMI cable going to it in-wall).

But beware: some of the newer cheap receivers do not transcode signals. What I mean is that if you have a composite source and an HDMI source, what used to be is that you would connect the TV to the receiver with just an HDMI cable and the receiver would convert the composite into an HDMI signal to send to the TV. Now you have to connect an HDMI and a composite cable from the receiver to the TV.

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by JonnyDVM » Wed Jul 20, 2016 11:07 am

LadyGeek wrote:
JonnyDVM wrote:...Also- who sits 4 feet away from a 65' TV? For the love of God scoot back a bit!
You mean 65" (double quote after 65), which is 65". Otherwise, it's 65 feet.

I sat about 10 feet back from my 65" TV when I had one. Now, it's a 63" plasma. I scooted up a bit closer.

Don't forget about your viewing height. Here's an old example, which is based on Field of View: HDTV Set Up « THX.com
Hah yes. I fixed it. 60 feet would be a pretty big tv. :P

Good quality dumb 1080 TVs are getting hard to come by these days.
Sometimes the questions are complicated and the answers are simple. -Dr. Seuss

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by Doom&Gloom » Wed Jul 20, 2016 2:13 pm

mmcmonster wrote:
toofache32 wrote:Do people still buy "receivers"? I use the Sonos speaker system and absolutely love it. They have a soundbar that can go with your TV although I have not used it. The speakers sound really really good and are connected by wifi. Your friends can download the app on their phone and play their music on your speakers.
I don't know about "people", but I love the flexibility of receivers. Attach multiple sources to your TV and drive external speakers and subwoofers from the receiver. (Newer receivers do airplay as well.)

It's quite important if you have a wall-mounted TV and want to minimize cables going to and from it (or if you built the room with just a single HDMI cable going to it in-wall).

But beware: some of the newer cheap receivers do not transcode signals. What I mean is that if you have a composite source and an HDMI source, what used to be is that you would connect the TV to the receiver with just an HDMI cable and the receiver would convert the composite into an HDMI signal to send to the TV. Now you have to connect an HDMI and a composite cable from the receiver to the TV.
I agree. I have receivers, surrounds speakers, and subs connected to all three of my plasmas. My sources are cable, Roku3 or Chromecast, Blu-ray or PS4, and Squeezeboxes or Chromecast Audio. I can't even imagine not having receivers.

It can be a bit of a rabbit-hole, so YMMV.

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Re: What's up with 4K tv? Should I buy one?

Post by ralph124cf » Wed Jul 20, 2016 5:20 pm

I am in the market for a new TV, and I looked at the 60" Samsung 1080p at Best Buy for $699.

At full volume the speakers simply did not put out a loud enough sound. If you are going to attach speakers to this set anyway this should not matter.

My wife is not willing to go with speakers, so I had to pass on this one.

Ralph

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