Help me understand question-less financial status (e.g. "2 comma club") threads.

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HueyLD
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Re: Help me understand question-less financial status (e.g. "2 comma club") threads.

Post by HueyLD » Tue Jan 09, 2018 10:40 am

I pay no attention to those 2 comma threads.

How about 3 comma threads? That is something to "aspire" to.

WillRetire
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Re: Help me understand question-less financial status (e.g. "2 comma club") threads.

Post by WillRetire » Tue Jan 09, 2018 10:47 am

I prefer to see these question-less posts in a separate category. Many seem like phishing or market research polling, and as such, should be labeled.

fire_rebel
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Re: Help me understand question-less financial status (e.g. "2 comma club") threads.

Post by fire_rebel » Tue Jan 09, 2018 11:16 am

I enjoy those question less financial threads.
If you take out those threads, all that left is a variant of these -
- How much international?
- How much Bonds ?
- How much in 529 ?

UpstaterMom
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Re: Help me understand question-less financial status (e.g. "2 comma club") threads.

Post by UpstaterMom » Tue Jan 09, 2018 11:47 am

I like those types of threads and find them motivating.

I don't feel like I have a lot to add on many posts here...I am more in the learning phase than the teaching/giving feedback phase. I endeavor to move to the giving feedback phase as soon as possible!

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JupiterJones
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Re: Help me understand question-less financial status (e.g. "2 comma club") threads.

Post by JupiterJones » Tue Jan 09, 2018 11:47 am

Well here's a recently-bumped, "question-less" thread that I doubt will get locked anytime soon: viewtopic.php?p=2928263#p2928263

Taylor's not asking for anything he might "take action" on. He's just passing along an interesting article that he thought would be helpful to some of us. The post is the "action".

Seems a perfectly good use of this forum, IMHO. Same with the "two comma" threads--they're helpful places to celebrate for the poster (who often can't celebrate anywhere else) and are inspiring to those who aren't as far along on their financial journey.

So, like any good organization, how about we change/clarify the "rules" to encompass what we're already doing? Maybe amend the policy from this...
Non-actionable (Trolling) Topics

If readers can't do anything with the content of a topic other than argue about it, it does not belong here.
To this...
Non-actionable/non-useful (Trolling) Topics

Purely informational topics (i.e., threads that do not pose questions) should endeavor to either educate or inspire. If readers can't do anything with the content of a topic other than argue about it, it does not belong here.
Or something along those lines. Just a thought.
Stay on target...

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Watty
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Re: Help me understand question-less financial status (e.g. "2 comma club") threads.

Post by Watty » Tue Jan 09, 2018 12:40 pm

HELP ME UNDERSTAND QUESTION-LESS FINANCIAL STATUS (E.G. "2 COMMA CLUB") THREADS.
I thought about this overnight before responding so hopefully this does not get buried too deep in the thread.

I think that some of the less actionable or somewhat off topic threads add value to the board to keep it from becoming too dry. I would consider them to somewhat like how you will put an occasional cartoon in a powerpoint presentation that would otherwise be a painfully boring topic. The powerpoint cartoon, or peripheral post, at least helps keep the audience awake even if it is still an inherently boring topic.

This could help newcomers from feeling too overwhelmed with only seeing technical investing posts and also help keep experienced posters returning and adding useful input when they do not have a question of their own.

Some threads like the "2 COMMA CLUB" or "I paid off my mortgage!" can also be useful in helping people with average incomes realize that hitting the million dollar mark or getting a paid off house is very doable with regular investing.

There are some threads that might not be actionable like "The reality hits - my dementia update"
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=237348&newpost=3710 ... ead#unread

But I find they add a lot of value in a way that is hard to put into words and I would hate to lose that.

There are also threads that are actionable but pretty far off topic like; hot water problems, travel suggestions, computer problems, car repairs, camera suggestions, etc.

I just looked through the forum index and there are currently 302 active topics and I would guess that there are maybe a dozen threads that are probably not actionable or not really related to investing, somewhere around 4% of the threads. With a percent like that it is easy to ignore even though it is not perfect it is maybe good enough. There is quote that often comes up here.
'The enemy of a good plan is the dream of a perfect plan.'
Keeping things like politics off the boards is really important but a certain amount of "fluff" helps keep the board from becoming too dry.

WillRetire
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Re: Help me understand question-less financial status (e.g. "2 comma club") threads.

Post by WillRetire » Tue Jan 09, 2018 12:52 pm

WillRetire wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2018 10:47 am
I prefer to see these question-less posts in a separate category. Many seem like phishing or market research polling, and as such, should be labeled.
Adding to my post: Action-less threads are NOT easy to ignore unless labeled. Also, some threads have subjects that sound like action-less, and it isn't until the end of the lengthy first post that you see it is actually from someone who is seeking advice on a specific situation.

In other words, you can't judge a thread by its title. Action-less threads need to be in a separate category.

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nisiprius
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Re: Help me understand question-less financial status (e.g. "2 comma club") threads.

Post by nisiprius » Tue Jan 09, 2018 1:10 pm

...As someone still in the accumulation phase, they validate to me the Boglehead philosophy works...
If individual stories of people who reached $1 million following the Boglehead philosophy "validate" that philosophy, then individual stories of people who made much more than that following some other philosophy invalidate it.

Should we encourage cryptocurrency millionaires to post their stories as inspiration and validation?

I personally have a nodding acquaintance with two people who hit, respectively, six- and seven-figure jackpots in the state lottery. Does that validate playing the lottery?

(As I've noted I personally have no objections at all to creating subforums for social chat and non-actionable information. I'm not sure what the issues might be with 501(c) status of the John C. Bogle Center for Financial Literacy... or whether the forum could function without support from it).
Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen nineteen and six, result happiness; Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pounds ought and six, result misery.

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Re: Help me understand question-less financial status (e.g. "2 comma club") threads.

Post by saltycaper » Tue Jan 09, 2018 1:34 pm

JupiterJones wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2018 11:47 am
Well here's a recently-bumped, "question-less" thread that I doubt will get locked anytime soon: viewtopic.php?p=2928263#p2928263

Taylor's not asking for anything he might "take action" on. He's just passing along an interesting article that he thought would be helpful to some of us. The post is the "action".
Posting something informational in the Investing News/Theory forum is considered actionable even if there is no question.
Quod vitae sectabor iter?

mptfan
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Re: Help me understand question-less financial status (e.g. "2 comma club") threads.

Post by mptfan » Tue Jan 09, 2018 2:22 pm

nisiprius wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2018 1:10 pm
If individual stories of people who reached $1 million following the Boglehead philosophy "validate" that philosophy, then individual stories of people who made much more than that following some other philosophy invalidate it.
Respectfully, I don't think this is logically correct. Two philosophies can be validated without one or the other being necessarily invalidated.

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ThereAreNoGurus
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Re: Help me understand question-less financial status (e.g. "2 comma club") threads.

Post by ThereAreNoGurus » Tue Jan 09, 2018 2:39 pm

I hope the milestone posts are allowed to continue for many of the reasons already expressed.

I not only enjoy reading the 2 comma milestones, but the ascent to zero net-worth, the first 100K, or whatever milestone a poster feels like celebrating or posting.

I've never attended an AA meeting, but the way they are depicted on TV brings to mind a somewhat similar idea with respect to discussing one's financial state.

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fishandgolf
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Re: Help me understand question-less financial status (e.g. "2 comma club") threads.

Post by fishandgolf » Tue Jan 09, 2018 3:02 pm

Watty wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2018 12:40 pm
HELP ME UNDERSTAND QUESTION-LESS FINANCIAL STATUS (E.G. "2 COMMA CLUB") THREADS.
I thought about this overnight before responding so hopefully this does not get buried too deep in the thread.

I think that some of the less actionable or somewhat off topic threads add value to the board to keep it from becoming too dry. I would consider them to somewhat like how you will put an occasional cartoon in a powerpoint presentation that would otherwise be a painfully boring topic. The powerpoint cartoon, or peripheral post, at least helps keep the audience awake even if it is still an inherently boring topic.

This could help newcomers from feeling too overwhelmed with only seeing technical investing posts and also help keep experienced posters returning and adding useful input when they do not have a question of their own.

Some threads like the "2 COMMA CLUB" or "I paid off my mortgage!" can also be useful in helping people with average incomes realize that hitting the million dollar mark or getting a paid off house is very doable with regular investing.

There are some threads that might not be actionable like "The reality hits - my dementia update"
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=237348&newpost=3710 ... ead#unread

But I find they add a lot of value in a way that is hard to put into words and I would hate to lose that.

There are also threads that are actionable but pretty far off topic like; hot water problems, travel suggestions, computer problems, car repairs, camera suggestions, etc.

I just looked through the forum index and there are currently 302 active topics and I would guess that there are maybe a dozen threads that are probably not actionable or not really related to investing, somewhere around 4% of the threads. With a percent like that it is easy to ignore even though it is not perfect it is maybe good enough. There is quote that often comes up here.
'The enemy of a good plan is the dream of a perfect plan.'
Keeping things like politics off the boards is really important but a certain amount of "fluff" helps keep the board from becoming too dry.
+10000....this guy nailed it for me. A little humor, a good laugh....isn't that what a healthy life is about? I was drawn to this forum because I needed help with some of the tricky investing stuff.....and I found it. I keep coming back because........this forum has character and meaning....don't take that away. :wink:

By the way.....gotta share this with you. Shortly after I joined, I recall one of the moderators posted a thread entitled something along the lines of............"The best Tread of 2016"....or something similar to that. Anyway.........it was about a guy who kept hearing strange noises in his attic. It was a realtivey long thread.......but so very much enjoyable.....it was funny, and made me laugh at some of the great posts... That is what this forum is about.

GoldenFinch
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Re: Help me understand question-less financial status (e.g. "2 comma club") threads.

Post by GoldenFinch » Tue Jan 09, 2018 3:19 pm

^^The squirrels and bats in the attic threads are forever etched in my mind. :happy

After reading all of the responses here it’s clear that people feel very strongly one way or the other about this topic and there is probably no way to make everyone happy. :(

SilverGirl
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Re: Help me understand question-less financial status (e.g. "2 comma club") threads.

Post by SilverGirl » Tue Jan 09, 2018 3:38 pm

As a newer member, these posts don't bother me at all and in fact they motivate me. However, there is a survey somewhere on here listing the net worths of everyone who replied to it and that was a little depressing because I could see just how MANY people had a higher net worth than I do. Not their issue, it's mine, but I was wondering what the point of that was, and wished I hadn't looked at it.

However the two comma club ones just make me look a them and ask "Is there anything in here that would be useful to me? Anything they did to reach their goal that could help me?" And sometimes, there is.

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Re: Help me understand question-less financial status (e.g. "2 comma club") threads.

Post by bobcat2 » Tue Jan 09, 2018 4:50 pm

I'll feel that Bogleheads are well informed about finance and reaching meaningful financial goals when we get threads announcing that posters have reached a 100% retirement income funded ratio. Backhandedly announcing that you have a $1,000,000 portfolio without accounting for inflation, and failing to describe why a $1 million nominal portfolio value reaches a meaningful personal financial goal indicates, at best, a shallow knowledge of personal finance.

BobK
In finance risk is defined as uncertainty that is consequential (nontrivial). | The two main methods of dealing with financial risk are the matching of assets to goals & diversifying.

TwstdSista
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Re: Help me understand question-less financial status (e.g. "2 comma club") threads.

Post by TwstdSista » Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:00 pm

I just wanted to thank this thread for getting me to google bats and squirrels in the attic BH threads -- priceless!

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Re: Help me understand question-less financial status (e.g. "2 comma club") threads.

Post by LadyGeek » Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:12 pm

This thread is the all-time winner from that aspect: Noise in my attic
To some, the glass is half full. To others, the glass is half empty. To an engineer, it's twice the size it needs to be.

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Re: Help me understand question-less financial status (e.g. "2 comma club") threads.

Post by AnalogKid22 » Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:17 pm

bobcat2 wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2018 4:50 pm
I'll feel that Bogleheads are well informed about finance and reaching meaningful financial goals when we get threads announcing that posters have reached a 100% retirement income funded ratio. Backhandedly announcing that you have a $1,000,000 portfolio without accounting for inflation, and failing to describe why a $1 million nominal portfolio value reaches a meaningful personal financial goal indicates, at best, a shallow knowledge of personal finance.

BobK
+1

I also don't agree with the definition of a millionaire being a person with a net worth of assets, minus liabilities, that equals 1 million dollars. People include their homes, cars, jewelry, etc., and are now, by definition, millionaires. In my mind, a millionaire must be able to withdraw 1 million in cash and a multi-millionaire can repeat this.

I'm getting really sick of Dave Ramsey throwing around "you're a millionaire" or "you're gonna be a millionaire" to people who might meet the definition. It diminishes what it takes to actually amass 1 million in equities/cash. It's also irresponsible of him because it can easily change people's mindsets into thinking they can change their spending habits when they're anchored by physical assets that they rely on in their daily lives.
Last edited by AnalogKid22 on Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:31 pm, edited 4 times in total.

TwstdSista
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Re: Help me understand question-less financial status (e.g. "2 comma club") threads.

Post by TwstdSista » Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:17 pm

LadyGeek wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:12 pm
This thread is the all-time winner from that aspect: Noise in my attic
I loved that one! I even had my husband listening to the youtube video -- a definite classic!

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Re: Help me understand question-less financial status (e.g. "2 comma club") threads.

Post by mptfan » Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:20 pm

AnalogKid22 wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:17 pm
I also don't agree with the definition of a millionaire being a person with a net worth of assets, minus liabilities, that equals 1 million dollars. People include their homes, cars, jewelry, etc., and are now, by definition, millionaires. In my mind, a millionaire must be able to withdraw 1 million in cash and a multi-millionaire can repeat this.
You are entitled to use whatever definition you want, but you are referring to the commonly accepted defintion of "liquid net worth" not "net worth."

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DaftInvestor
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Re: Help me understand question-less financial status (e.g. "2 comma club") threads.

Post by DaftInvestor » Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:24 pm

LadyGeek wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:12 pm
This thread is the all-time winner from that aspect: Noise in my attic
Thanks for sharing as I wasn't here back when that thread was written.
An awesome 6 page mystery followed by a survey and finally the answer!
It was a page-turner of a story with an awesome ending! :D

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Re: Help me understand question-less financial status (e.g. "2 comma club") threads.

Post by AnalogKid22 » Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:39 pm

mptfan wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:20 pm
AnalogKid22 wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:17 pm
I also don't agree with the definition of a millionaire being a person with a net worth of assets, minus liabilities, that equals 1 million dollars. People include their homes, cars, jewelry, etc., and are now, by definition, millionaires. In my mind, a millionaire must be able to withdraw 1 million in cash and a multi-millionaire can repeat this.
You are entitled to use whatever definition you want, but you are referring to the commonly accepted defintion of "liquid net worth" not "net worth."
That's because there's a stigma, I think, that a millionaire possesses $1 million. The US has millions of (by definition) millionaires, yet, apparently, 70% of the populattion lives paycheck-to-paycheck and over half can't afford a $400 emergency.

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Re: Help me understand question-less financial status (e.g. "2 comma club") threads.

Post by TravelforFun » Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:57 pm

nisiprius wrote:
Mon Jan 08, 2018 8:37 am
[*]If the principle is that anything people enjoy, that hasn't been demonstrated frequently go off the rails into anger and bad feeling so quickly that moderators can't nip it in the bud (i.e. "sex, politics, and religion," although only one of those is a problem here),
,
Haha... I agree. Only one of those is a problem.

TravelforFun

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Re: Help me understand question-less financial status (e.g. "2 comma club") threads.

Post by mptfan » Wed Jan 10, 2018 10:52 am

AnalogKid22 wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:39 pm
That's because there's a stigma, I think, that a millionaire possesses $1 million. The US has millions of (by definition) millionaires, yet, apparently, 70% of the populattion lives paycheck-to-paycheck and over half can't afford a $400 emergency.
I don't agree that there is a "stigma" that a millionare possesses $1 million, that is the definition. And there is nothing contradictory about the U.S. having many millionaires and many people who live paycheck to paycheck.

yarnandthread
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Re: Help me understand question-less financial status (e.g. "2 comma club") threads.

Post by yarnandthread » Wed Jan 10, 2018 11:32 pm

I am in favor of allowing them....to me it motivates and educates others.

trigger08
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Re: Help me understand question-less financial status (e.g. "2 comma club") threads.

Post by trigger08 » Thu Jan 11, 2018 9:29 am

I ignore them. There is so much excellent information here on BH that I (personally) don't feel there is much value in random announcements about individuals' financial status. But from this discussion it certainly seems like many people find them entertaining/encouraging, so they should not be banned entirely. I think the proposal that future posts on such topics be directed to the new consolidated thread is a reasonable compromise.

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