How will you describe your investing journey so far?

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Topic Author
mohd
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How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by mohd »

Hey there :)

I recently started a new topic to get help in my first investment. I am grateful for the help and the information received in this topic which really helped me to get started.

I started investing last week, and I admit, the first feeling was odd and scary. I feel that the odd feeling is started to fade away. However, I've got a new habit (and I bet every new investor did this too :D) of regularly checking the market and how it performs. Well.. I'll try to avoid the daily noise and get away of my account (as best as I can)

So, I've no specific question, just wondering, how and when was your first investment step. How did it go. What lessons you have learned over the time of your investment journey?
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arcticpineapplecorp.
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by arcticpineapplecorp. »

diversification means always having to say you're sorry.

it's time in the market, not timing the market that matters.

this too shall pass.

stay the course.

invest we must.

slow and steady wins the race.

the first $100k is the hardest.

take only as much risk as you have the need, ability and willingness to take.
It's "Stay" the course, not Stray the Course. Buy and Hold works. You should really try it sometime. Get a plan: www.bogleheads.org/wiki/Investment_policy_statement
TedSwippet
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by TedSwippet »

mohd wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:43 pm What lessons you have learned over the time of your investment journey?
It's exciting at the start, then after a year or so it becomes fairly routine, borderline boring, and stays that way for a relatively long stretch. This is the good bit. :-)

As balances rise it can start to become a bit of a headache. The consequences of risk are larger when you have more at stake. Particularly political risk; you start to pay attention less to your account balance and more to the mental meanderings of whichever politicians hold sway over your investing results. Finally, for those of us in countries with income taxes, capital gains taxes, estate taxes, and inheritance taxes, all of which rules are unstable and subject to the whim of politicians, the end-game is a continual process of trying to second-guess and then mitigate or avoid all of these taxes.

My one lesson would be: Nobody cares about your investing results as much as you do. Not your accountant. Not your financial adviser. Not your tax adviser, if you have one. Not your pension adviser. Not your best friend. Perhaps not even your spouse.

That's not to say that any of these people are out to rip you off or take you for a ride; most will be well-meaning and may well be worth listening to. It's just that only you really know your own self, your goals, aims and priorities, and that none of these other people is, or can be, invested -- in every sense of the word -- in your success as much as you are. By all means take into account what they say, but ultimately you have to learn enough of the terrain to both take and own your decisions.
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mohd
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by mohd »

arcticpineapplecorp. wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:49 pm diversification means always having to say you're sorry.

it's time in the market, not timing the market that matters.

this too shall pass.

stay the course.

invest we must.

slow and steady wins the race.

the first $100k is the hardest.

take only as much risk as you have the need, ability and willingness to take.
Staying the course! i think this is the hardest point out there. I am not sure how will be my feeling when the market is down, but I will try to trick my mind that it's a buying opportunity -the stock market is the only market where things go on sale and all the customers run out of the store-.

Since when did you started your investment journey? Things you wish you did in this journey?
TedSwippet wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 5:37 pm
mohd wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:43 pm What lessons you have learned over the time of your investment journey?
It's exciting at the start, then after a year or so it becomes fairly routine, borderline boring, and stays that way for a relatively long stretch. This is the good bit. :-)

As balances rise it can start to become a bit of a headache. The consequences of risk are larger when you have more at stake. Particularly political risk; you start to pay attention less to your account balance and more to the mental meanderings of whichever politicians hold sway over your investing results. Finally, for those of us in countries with income taxes, capital gains taxes, estate taxes, and inheritance taxes, all of which rules are unstable and subject to the whim of politicians, the end-game is a continual process of trying to second-guess and then mitigate or avoid all of these taxes.

My one lesson would be: Nobody cares about your investing results as much as you do. Not your accountant. Not your financial adviser. Not your tax adviser, if you have one. Not your pension adviser. Not your best friend. Perhaps not even your spouse.

That's not to say that any of these people are out to rip you off or take you for a ride; most will be well-meaning and may well be worth listening to. It's just that only you really know your own self, your goals, aims and priorities, and that none of these other people is, or can be, invested -- in every sense of the word -- in your success as much as you are. By all means take into account what they say, but ultimately you have to learn enough of the terrain to both take and own your decisions.
Boring is a good thing I guess in investment :)

Here in my country we don't have any sort of taxes. except for VAT on products. I am wondering if this would change in future.

Exactly! since it's your money you will worry the most about it. That's why I ditched all other investment options such Mutual Funds and decided that index funds are most suitable for me. Doing investment by yourself will give u the responsibility of educating yourself about it and how to manage it. Some people suggested that I ditch bonds in my age, but honestly I feel more confident when I have a portion of it in my portfolio. It's not only about the % return, but the level of risk that I can handle and feel good with.

What things do you regret since your investment journey? Do you regularly check your portfolio and watch the daily ups and downs?
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by TedSwippet »

mohd wrote: Thu Sep 03, 2020 4:22 am What things do you regret since your investment journey? Do you regularly check your portfolio and watch the daily ups and downs?
Regrets is an interesting one. Not many, but one I could mention is not stopping work to live on investments sooner than I did. I had the money to do this around four or five years earlier than I did, but wasn't on top of the situation enough to make the decision. Also, I was enjoying my job, so no particular reason to stop. As a result though, I kept saving hard, so that I now have assets that are bubbling dangerously close to a punitive UK tax rate on pension savings.

A consequence of this is that I check my portfolio more often than is healthy. Below this asset level a pension is tax-efficient; above it, a pension is tax-inefficient. Optimising it means catching it exactly at the transition point between these two, but with a two-week lead time between decision and action (UK pension companies want everything done on paper via snail-mail), catching that point is tricky and uncertain. Add to this a tax system that gets tweaked practically every year, and sometimes even more often than that, and rarely if ever to the investor's advantage, and you have a recipe for chronic unease.

That's a good example of what I was referring to in my earlier post. A never-ending game of trying to mitigate taxes.
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galeno
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by galeno »

Bump.
Last edited by galeno on Thu Sep 03, 2020 5:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
KISS & STC.
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wander
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by wander »

Bogleheads investing style is boring, but it works and I like it.
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galeno
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by galeno »

A constant effort to "invest like Americans". A constant effort to lower portfolio costs.

4 different brokers in 40 years. We started with a Costa Rican bank. Moved to a Bermuda Bank. From there to Schwab and last to IBKR.

Only regret is all the needless money we've paid in extra withholding taxes to the USA and fees to the financial intermediaries.
KISS & STC.
flaccidsteele
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by flaccidsteele »

mohd wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:43 pm How did it go. What lessons you have learned over the time of your investment journey?
Investing is a simple game. The US market always recovers. Always. It’s never different this time

Always buy. Buy more during bears. Rinse and repeat

Retire early. No point trading your Life for money once you’ve won the game
The US market always recovers. It’s never different this time. Retired in my 40s. Investing is a simple game of rinse and repeat
mega317
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by mega317 »

Man I got so lucky. Used basically all my savings (something like 3k, I was in college) to buy right at the peak of the tech bubble. I think 3 individual stocks on the advice of my dad who read about stocks all the time, looked at financials, subscribed to newsletters, etc. I got creamed obviously and realized that if the guy who spends all his free time researching stocks did that, there must be a better way. Then I got near the end of med school and realized I needed a plan for my money. Did a ton of reading and stumbled on a Bogle book. End of "journey", beginning of one of the most boring parts of my life.
https://www.bogleheads.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6212
Rosales
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by Rosales »

I consider myself lucky to have stumbled upon this forum just at the beginning of my journey, now sailing away with a comfort :)
VWRA & chill | Retired @28 y.o.
Normchad
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by Normchad »

flaccidsteele wrote: Thu Sep 03, 2020 11:54 pm
mohd wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:43 pm How did it go. What lessons you have learned over the time of your investment journey?
Investing is a simple game. The US market always recovers. Always. It’s never different this time

Always buy. Buy more during bears. Rinse and repeat

Retire early. No point trading your Life for money once you’ve won the game
+1. You distilled it perfectly.
Mr.BB
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by Mr.BB »

Peaks and valleys
"We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act, but a habit."
jaqenhghar
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by jaqenhghar »

Only peek when the market goes up.
Paul78
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by Paul78 »

Boring.

Pretty much just keep throwing 30% of gross income into retirement (most tsp/ira/hsa but also some taxable). Obviously can't complain about the returns over the past 9 years (time since I started investing). Slightly annoyed that international has done so poorly compared to domestic (stock wise I am about 70% domestic 30% international) but going to continue to stick to my plan. Eventually the tables might turn the other way.

Really the only "exciting" thing was throwing some of my bond money into the market (a chunk at DOW 25,000 and another chunk at DOW 21,000) during this recent downturn. Basically went from 80% stocks 20% bonds to 90% stocks 10% bonds. I was comfortable with either allocation so my plan was just to keep at 80/20 if the market continued to go up and if there was ever a significant downturn go to 90/10. Will probably starting moving more towards bonds (with new contributions) in 5-7 years.

I handled this recent downturn just fine. But it was only a couple of months and investment wise I am still pretty young. So wasn't much of a test for me (I am sure there will be more difficult test in the future).
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by Fallible »

Lucky to find Jack Bogle and low-cost index funds as I began investing in the market.
"Yes, investing is simple. But it is not easy, for it requires discipline, patience, steadfastness, and that most uncommon of all gifts, common sense." ~Jack Bogle
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bubbasour
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by bubbasour »

I'm very grateful of the work the author put in Layman's Guide to Investing in S&P 500, this forum and all the guidance I've received! Jack Bogle and the investment philosophy mentioned here from which I created my own investment plan.

Scars from the field,
- Minimize brokerage fees and costs from the start, practice with a paper account if that helps you better understand your brokers platform.

- Just keep things really simple, personally I only do AAA Gov bonds(local currency), FDs, and VUSD ETFs (USD, investment only). The more variables, the more knobs, the more complex will it be to manage.

- Stay the course, stay calm in bumpy times and think long term. Investing can be a painful experience especially for the novice when your portfolio is -10, -20 or -30% and you need to learn to manage your emotions.
NRA, Prefer VUSD (VOO) and VWRD (VT), No capital gain tax.
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mohd
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by mohd »

TedSwippet wrote: Thu Sep 03, 2020 7:32 am
mohd wrote: Thu Sep 03, 2020 4:22 am What things do you regret since your investment journey? Do you regularly check your portfolio and watch the daily ups and downs?
Regrets is an interesting one. Not many, but one I could mention is not stopping work to live on investments sooner than I did. I had the money to do this around four or five years earlier than I did, but wasn't on top of the situation enough to make the decision. Also, I was enjoying my job, so no particular reason to stop. As a result though, I kept saving hard, so that I now have assets that are bubbling dangerously close to a punitive UK tax rate on pension savings.

A consequence of this is that I check my portfolio more often than is healthy. Below this asset level a pension is tax-efficient; above it, a pension is tax-inefficient. Optimising it means catching it exactly at the transition point between these two, but with a two-week lead time between decision and action (UK pension companies want everything done on paper via snail-mail), catching that point is tricky and uncertain. Add to this a tax system that gets tweaked practically every year, and sometimes even more often than that, and rarely if ever to the investor's advantage, and you have a recipe for chronic unease.

That's a good example of what I was referring to in my earlier post. A never-ending game of trying to mitigate taxes.
Unless you hated your job, this could be a big regression. But otherwise I think that's should feel fine.

I always thought that for someone who invested long term in market and had the ups and downs, his only regression would be not investing more earlier.

In my case, I can invest more than I started with, but I chose not to do that. Maybe because of "fear" of this new stage. If I stayed the course for the next years and the market managed to grow in those years, my regret will be not investing more than I did.

Mitigating taxes is interesting one. Honestly when I see in other countries that people have to deal with taxes and on top of that they stay the course and invest more and more, it puts me in a situation that I should feel guilt & luck. And to put more effort on investing since we don't have any sort of taxes in my country.
wander wrote: Thu Sep 03, 2020 4:54 pm Bogleheads investing style is boring, but it works and I like it.
The boring aspect is what made me chose this style of investment :)
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mohd
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by mohd »

galeno wrote: Thu Sep 03, 2020 5:04 pm A constant effort to "invest like Americans". A constant effort to lower portfolio costs.

4 different brokers in 40 years. We started with a Costa Rican bank. Moved to a Bermuda Bank. From there to Schwab and last to IBKR.

Only regret is all the needless money we've paid in extra withholding taxes to the USA and fees to the financial intermediaries.
Was it because you was unaware of mitigating taxes or you had no choices for that?

40 years of investing is really great :) . Any advise for someone who just stepped in the market earlier to stay that long
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mohd
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by mohd »

flaccidsteele wrote: Thu Sep 03, 2020 11:54 pm
mohd wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:43 pm How did it go. What lessons you have learned over the time of your investment journey?
Investing is a simple game. The US market always recovers. Always. It’s never different this time

Always buy. Buy more during bears. Rinse and repeat

Retire early. No point trading your Life for money once you’ve won the game
It looks really simple, but not really easy :) I can feel that since I just started last month.

For someone who just started investing and his portfolio turned into red, this feel odd and scary. But I guess, every market has a flash sale, right :)
mega317 wrote: Fri Sep 04, 2020 12:03 am Man I got so lucky. Used basically all my savings (something like 3k, I was in college) to buy right at the peak of the tech bubble. I think 3 individual stocks on the advice of my dad who read about stocks all the time, looked at financials, subscribed to newsletters, etc. I got creamed obviously and realized that if the guy who spends all his free time researching stocks did that, there must be a better way. Then I got near the end of med school and realized I needed a plan for my money. Did a ton of reading and stumbled on a Bogle book. End of "journey", beginning of one of the most boring parts of my life.
It's good that you landed on the most boring investment journey :)
I wish that I knew about this style of investment when I was in college.

I always thought that the investment is all about picking the winning individual stocks and doing fancy analysis and very few % of people can do that. This is what kept me away from learning about investing.

Now I am 28, nearly 29 and I wish that I started even earlier. But I still have plenty of time to invest. Now that I am in the market, I have to learn how to stay in the market and do invest more!
Rosales wrote: Fri Sep 04, 2020 11:51 am I consider myself lucky to have stumbled upon this forum just at the beginning of my journey, now sailing away with a comfort :)
:) So do I. I don't even remember how I landed here and I am grateful for that. Since when you've been in the market?
Mr.BB wrote: Fri Sep 04, 2020 12:10 pm Peaks and valleys


:D quite descriptive
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mohd
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by mohd »

Paul78 wrote: Fri Sep 04, 2020 12:41 pm Boring.

Pretty much just keep throwing 30% of gross income into retirement (most tsp/ira/hsa but also some taxable). Obviously can't complain about the returns over the past 9 years (time since I started investing). Slightly annoyed that international has done so poorly compared to domestic (stock wise I am about 70% domestic 30% international) but going to continue to stick to my plan. Eventually the tables might turn the other way.

Really the only "exciting" thing was throwing some of my bond money into the market (a chunk at DOW 25,000 and another chunk at DOW 21,000) during this recent downturn. Basically went from 80% stocks 20% bonds to 90% stocks 10% bonds. I was comfortable with either allocation so my plan was just to keep at 80/20 if the market continued to go up and if there was ever a significant downturn go to 90/10. Will probably starting moving more towards bonds (with new contributions) in 5-7 years.

I handled this recent downturn just fine. But it was only a couple of months and investment wise I am still pretty young. So wasn't much of a test for me (I am sure there will be more difficult test in the future).
Boring is good :D

I am also planning to dedicate 30% of my income every month into the investment :)

DOW at 21,000 is really interesting. When I look at the chart I wish I have started on the down time to capture some returns. It would be a great start. However, late better than never. And I am still young (28) and have plenty of time in the market.

Which domestic market are u investing in? I suppose it's UK?

My portfolio is 80% VWRA + 20% AGGU (despite that some people advised me to ditch the bonds at this age, but I feel more comfortable to have portion of it right now)
Fallible wrote: Fri Sep 04, 2020 1:57 pm Lucky to find Jack Bogle and low-cost index funds as I began investing in the market.
:D Great to hear that. Since when have you been in the market. How did you managed to get rid of the fear during all this time?
bubbasour wrote: Fri Sep 04, 2020 8:24 pm I'm very grateful of the work the author put in Layman's Guide to Investing in S&P 500, this forum and all the guidance I've received! Jack Bogle and the investment philosophy mentioned here from which I created my own investment plan.

Scars from the field,
- Minimize brokerage fees and costs from the start, practice with a paper account if that helps you better understand your brokers platform.

- Just keep things really simple, personally I only do AAA Gov bonds(local currency), FDs, and VUSD ETFs (USD, investment only). The more variables, the more knobs, the more complex will it be to manage.

- Stay the course, stay calm in bumpy times and think long term. Investing can be a painful experience especially for the novice when your portfolio is -10, -20 or -30% and you need to learn to manage your emotions.
I chose Interactive Brokers. My fees will be $120 yearly which is fine I guess. I didn't find any other reliable option to go with.

My portfolio is really simple, VWRA & AGGU. I wasn't sure whether to add emerging market or not. But at the end I chose to add it to make it more diversify.

Now that I am in the market, I really have to learn how stay the course and be calm in the down times, I think this is the hardest part. Appreciate any advise on that :)
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by Lauretta »

I'd say that I have learnt that the intellectual part is much less important than I thought; the emotional and behavioural part is much more important. I was also much more excited at first in looking after my investments and doing some complicated stuff; now I am weary of that and I understand by experience the importance of simplifying.
When everyone is thinking the same, no one is thinking at all
pennywise
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by pennywise »

TedSwippet wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 5:37 pm
mohd wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:43 pm What lessons you have learned over the time of your investment journey?
My one lesson would be: Nobody cares about your investing results as much as you do. Not your accountant. Not your financial adviser. Not your tax adviser, if you have one. Not your pension adviser. Not your best friend. Perhaps not even your spouse.

That's not to say that any of these people are out to rip you off or take you for a ride; most will be well-meaning and may well be worth listening to. It's just that only you really know your own self, your goals, aims and priorities, and that none of these other people is, or can be, invested -- in every sense of the word -- in your success as much as you are. By all means take into account what they say, but ultimately you have to learn enough of the terrain to both take and own your decisions.
+1000

This is perhaps the most succinct, true and well phrased investment principle I've ever read on BH.

Always knowing that YOU are the best steward of what you earn and more importantly what you save brings you power and autonomy to create the future you want for yourself.

It doesn't mean going it alone or following a specific path. It does mean educating yourself and getting help along the way if you need it. As long as you focus on what works FOR YOU, that education and advice will help you find your unique path to investment success.
Tamalak
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by Tamalak »

I've been 100% invested in stocks since Sept 2015 (during a little dip)

I've held through every dip and crash and am pleased that I've never felt truly tempted to change my approach, even when March basically wiped out all my returns.

I'm looking forward to retiring earlier because I was lucky enough to hear the boglehead approach (there, I jinxed it)
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mohd
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by mohd »

Tamalak wrote: Sat Sep 05, 2020 8:53 am I've been 100% invested in stocks since Sept 2015 (during a little dip)

I've held through every dip and crash and am pleased that I've never felt truly tempted to change my approach, even when March basically wiped out all my returns.

I'm looking forward to retiring earlier because I was lucky enough to hear the boglehead approach (there, I jinxed it)
That's great to hear :D It's encouraging to see how others are holding up even when market dips.
michoco911
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by michoco911 »

Bumpy but slept well nevertheless and stayed the course (Even though i am less than 4Years in the market). A good investment policy statement IPS written in advance helps in that, to remove emotions and transact in a straight forward way.
30% VWRD 30% VUSD 40% AGGG until further notice
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by abuss368 »

mohd wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:43 pm Hey there :)

I recently started a new topic to get help in my first investment. I am grateful for the help and the information received in this topic which really helped me to get started.

I started investing last week, and I admit, the first feeling was odd and scary. I feel that the odd feeling is started to fade away. However, I've got a new habit (and I bet every new investor did this too :D) of regularly checking the market and how it performs. Well.. I'll try to avoid the daily noise and get away of my account (as best as I can)

So, I've no specific question, just wondering, how and when was your first investment step. How did it go. What lessons you have learned over the time of your investment journey?
An incredible journey thus far that is still building. Tons of complexity to now index funds. Individual stocks and stock options ruled the day because we were smarter than others (or so we told ourselves). Only once I began to learn about the Gordon Gekkos on the other aide of our trading did I start to realize we do not stand a chance.
John C. Bogle: “Simplicity is the master key to financial success."
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by abuss368 »

Our journey now is a never ending quest to simplify both our financial and non-financial lives.
John C. Bogle: “Simplicity is the master key to financial success."
Texanbybirth
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by Texanbybirth »

I’m thinking of the tortoise and the hare. “Slow and steady...” but I can’t tell you for another 30 years whether I’ve won the investing race. :D

And I’m pretty much only racing against my hypothetical self, so it’s not very exciting. :beer
“The strong cannot be brave. Only the weak can be brave; and yet again, in practice, only those who can be brave can be trusted, in time of doubt, to be strong.“ - GK Chesterton
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by mohd »

Texanbybirth wrote: Sat Sep 05, 2020 9:34 am I’m thinking of the tortoise and the hare. “Slow and steady...” but I can’t tell you for another 30 years whether I’ve won the investing race. :D

And I’m pretty much only racing against my hypothetical self, so it’s not very exciting. :beer
We believe in the tortoise :)
abuss368 wrote: Sat Sep 05, 2020 9:32 am Our journey now is a never ending quest to simplify both our financial and non-financial lives.
I stepped in this journey, let's see how it goes :)
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by Fallible »

mohd wrote: Sat Sep 05, 2020 6:59 am ...
Fallible wrote: Fri Sep 04, 2020 1:57 pm Lucky to find Jack Bogle and low-cost index funds as I began investing in the market.
:D Great to hear that. Since when have you been in the market. How did you managed to get rid of the fear during all this time? ...
It's not getting rid of fear but learning to understand and deal with it, same as risk. I started investing actively in 1987, just months before the October Crash, and I discovered Jack and indexing about a year later. It's been a wild ride and I still managed to make mistakes along the way, but I'm still investing in those index funds, still thankful for Jack Bogle.
"Yes, investing is simple. But it is not easy, for it requires discipline, patience, steadfastness, and that most uncommon of all gifts, common sense." ~Jack Bogle
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abuss368
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by abuss368 »

mohd wrote: Sat Sep 05, 2020 12:17 pm
Texanbybirth wrote: Sat Sep 05, 2020 9:34 am I’m thinking of the tortoise and the hare. “Slow and steady...” but I can’t tell you for another 30 years whether I’ve won the investing race. :D

And I’m pretty much only racing against my hypothetical self, so it’s not very exciting. :beer
We believe in the tortoise :)
abuss368 wrote: Sat Sep 05, 2020 9:32 am Our journey now is a never ending quest to simplify both our financial and non-financial lives.
I stepped in this journey, let's see how it goes :)
I would bet you will look back and be thankful for the simplicity and effectiveness.
John C. Bogle: “Simplicity is the master key to financial success."
xxd091
Posts: 197
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Location: UK

Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by xxd091 »

Some encouragement from a 75 year old UK Boglehead who has walked the walk
Retired 18 years
3 funds only -a World Equities Index Tracker ex UK,a FTSE AllShare Index Tracker and a Global Bond Index Tracker Fund hedged to the Pound
Split 26%/4%/65%/5%- the 5% is cash 2 years living expenses
Simple cheap easy to understand
Age minus 10 in bonds is a rough guide
Done the job for me-so far!
Stay the course live frugally and keep investing
You can do it
xxd091
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StevieG72
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by StevieG72 »

I opened a Vangaurd account in 2012. What I have learned....

Less is more! I started off with a tilt towards small cap & REITs. I have since dumped the REIT and would also sell the small caps if they were not in a taxable account. At one point I tax loss harvested my international fund and bought each international sector separately. While none of these investments would be considered a poor choice, in my opinion the added complexity is unnecessary.

My asset allocation (stocks to bonds ratio) has shifted over the last 8 years. I started at 60 /40 decided that was too conservative for my age. I switched to 80/20 which was too aggressive for my risk tolerance. 70/30 made sense, right in the middle! Now I am comfortable at 65/35 as my portfolio has grown there is no need to be too aggressive. I will probably dial that back to 60/40 as I reach my retirement goals.

I have experienced a couple market downturns. These can be scary! You really do not know your risk tolerance until you have survived a few roller coaster dips with your portfolio. The drop in March was probably the most significant in my investing lifetime. I typically try to invest additional cash when the market dips, I was buying on the way down but lost my enthusiasm before we hit the bottom! My portfolio has grown significantly over the years and the value of my portfolio dipped dramatically.

I do check my portfolio balance daily for the most part. It is really easy with the Vangaurd app! There are a few benefits to doing this in my opinion. I can invest additional cash if the market takes a dive and I feel like buying the dip. ( the ideal way to invest is immediately when money is earned, I do have weekly automatic investments.) The other benefit is to keep your asset allocation / risk tolerance in check. It is not uncommon for me to see my portfolio drop in value thousands of dollars in a day. I am used to seeing this happen and do not get too alarmed.

Lastly I learned to tune out the noise! Even us Bogleheads are a finicky bunch. If the market tanks, the sky is falling! If the market reaches an all time high, it is overvalued and a correction is coming! Ignore the alarming posts and stick with your investing plan.
Fools think their own way is right, but the wise listen to others.
Valuethinker
Posts: 41120
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by Valuethinker »

StevieG72 wrote: Sun Sep 06, 2020 5:58 am I opened a Vangaurd account in 2012. What I have learned....

Less is more! I started off with a tilt towards small cap & REITs. I have since dumped the REIT and would also sell the small caps if they were not in a taxable account. At one point I tax loss harvested my international fund and bought each international sector separately. While none of these investments would be considered a poor choice, in my opinion the added complexity is unnecessary.

My asset allocation (stocks to bonds ratio) has shifted over the last 8 years. I started at 60 /40 decided that was too conservative for my age. I switched to 80/20 which was too aggressive for my risk tolerance. 70/30 made sense, right in the middle! Now I am comfortable at 65/35 as my portfolio has grown there is no need to be too aggressive. I will probably dial that back to 60/40 as I reach my retirement goals.

I have experienced a couple market downturns. These can be scary! You really do not know your risk tolerance until you have survived a few roller coaster dips with your portfolio. The drop in March was probably the most significant in my investing lifetime. I typically try to invest additional cash when the market dips, I was buying on the way down but lost my enthusiasm before we hit the bottom! My portfolio has grown significantly over the years and the value of my portfolio dipped dramatically.
March was nothing in the history of bear markets: 1. it was only about an average fall (around -30%)? 2. it was over incredibly quickly. One could make analogies to October 1987 however the market ended up that year. It was just that in a single say you lost 1/5th of your portfolio.

You have not experienced a real bear market as yet. In 2008-09 those of us who were paying attention realised the entire financial system was threatened, stocks could have gone down 80%, not 50%. 2000 was less painful (c. -35%) but went on for nearly 3 years. Those who have experienced Japan (30 year bear market then stagnation) or the UK 1973-74 (down about 80% in real terms, in a period when inflation was c. 20% pa) or the Great Depression (stocks fell in 1929, had several false recoveries, did not again cross the positive line until the 1940s) have experienced real bear markets.

You won't know what you will feel about these events until you experience them. I have had different reactions each time, so you will change as well.

Kudos to you for recognising the importance of having a bond weighting. We have too many 100% equity followers here.

I do check my portfolio balance daily for the most part. It is really easy with the Vangaurd app! There are a few benefits to doing this in my opinion. I can invest additional cash if the market takes a dive and I feel like buying the dip. ( the ideal way to invest is immediately when money is earned, I do have weekly automatic investments.) The other benefit is to keep your asset allocation / risk tolerance in check. It is not uncommon for me to see my portfolio drop in value thousands of dollars in a day. I am used to seeing this happen and do not get too alarmed.

Lastly I learned to tune out the noise! Even us Bogleheads are a finicky bunch. If the market tanks, the sky is falling! If the market reaches an all time high, it is overvalued and a correction is coming! Ignore the alarming posts and stick with your investing plan.
I think it is dangerous to check portfolio values more than monthly. I have accounts I only check once a year (pensions with insurance companies).

"Buying the dips" is dangerous because they can turn out to be something a lot worse than a dip.
catlady
Posts: 138
Joined: Sat Mar 26, 2016 8:31 pm

Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by catlady »

I would describe our investing journey so far as incredibly lucky. I found Bogleheads right at the beginning of our investing around 2011 and we’ve been following the philosophy ever since.

The main thing I’ve learned is make a reasonable plan and stay the course.
radiowave
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by radiowave »

ditto to all above.

One other aspect of the "Boglehead philosophy" is living below your means. The practical points are avoiding major debt (except mortgage) as you can't invest if you are in debt and saving 15% or more of your salary each year. Also, keep your portfolio simple, diversified, and low cost as possible. Use the investment tools wisely, e.g., contribute up to the max match in your company's retirement program and contribute to a Roth or Traditional IRA each year. Be sure you have a plan (investment policy statement = see Wiki) and stick to it. Lastly, invest for the haul and don't worry about the volatility of the market.
Bogleheads Wiki: https://www.bogleheads.org/wiki/Main_Page
Topic Author
mohd
Posts: 62
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Location: Bahrain

Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by mohd »

Valuethinker wrote: Sun Sep 06, 2020 9:14 am
StevieG72 wrote: Sun Sep 06, 2020 5:58 am I opened a Vangaurd account in 2012. What I have learned....

Less is more! I started off with a tilt towards small cap & REITs. I have since dumped the REIT and would also sell the small caps if they were not in a taxable account. At one point I tax loss harvested my international fund and bought each international sector separately. While none of these investments would be considered a poor choice, in my opinion the added complexity is unnecessary.

My asset allocation (stocks to bonds ratio) has shifted over the last 8 years. I started at 60 /40 decided that was too conservative for my age. I switched to 80/20 which was too aggressive for my risk tolerance. 70/30 made sense, right in the middle! Now I am comfortable at 65/35 as my portfolio has grown there is no need to be too aggressive. I will probably dial that back to 60/40 as I reach my retirement goals.

I have experienced a couple market downturns. These can be scary! You really do not know your risk tolerance until you have survived a few roller coaster dips with your portfolio. The drop in March was probably the most significant in my investing lifetime. I typically try to invest additional cash when the market dips, I was buying on the way down but lost my enthusiasm before we hit the bottom! My portfolio has grown significantly over the years and the value of my portfolio dipped dramatically.
March was nothing in the history of bear markets: 1. it was only about an average fall (around -30%)? 2. it was over incredibly quickly. One could make analogies to October 1987 however the market ended up that year. It was just that in a single say you lost 1/5th of your portfolio.

You have not experienced a real bear market as yet. In 2008-09 those of us who were paying attention realised the entire financial system was threatened, stocks could have gone down 80%, not 50%. 2000 was less painful (c. -35%) but went on for nearly 3 years. Those who have experienced Japan (30 year bear market then stagnation) or the UK 1973-74 (down about 80% in real terms, in a period when inflation was c. 20% pa) or the Great Depression (stocks fell in 1929, had several false recoveries, did not again cross the positive line until the 1940s) have experienced real bear markets.

You won't know what you will feel about these events until you experience them. I have had different reactions each time, so you will change as well.

Kudos to you for recognising the importance of having a bond weighting. We have too many 100% equity followers here.

I do check my portfolio balance daily for the most part. It is really easy with the Vangaurd app! There are a few benefits to doing this in my opinion. I can invest additional cash if the market takes a dive and I feel like buying the dip. ( the ideal way to invest is immediately when money is earned, I do have weekly automatic investments.) The other benefit is to keep your asset allocation / risk tolerance in check. It is not uncommon for me to see my portfolio drop in value thousands of dollars in a day. I am used to seeing this happen and do not get too alarmed.

Lastly I learned to tune out the noise! Even us Bogleheads are a finicky bunch. If the market tanks, the sky is falling! If the market reaches an all time high, it is overvalued and a correction is coming! Ignore the alarming posts and stick with your investing plan.
I think it is dangerous to check portfolio values more than monthly. I have accounts I only check once a year (pensions with insurance companies).

"Buying the dips" is dangerous because they can turn out to be something a lot worse than a dip.

so we understand that:

1. Diversification is very important to minimize the damage in case of bear market

2. It's important to have portion of bonds to stabilize your portfolio in case of bear.
Topic Author
mohd
Posts: 62
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Location: Bahrain

Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by mohd »

xxd091 wrote: Sun Sep 06, 2020 5:14 am Some encouragement from a 75 year old UK Boglehead who has walked the walk
Retired 18 years
3 funds only -a World Equities Index Tracker ex UK,a FTSE AllShare Index Tracker and a Global Bond Index Tracker Fund hedged to the Pound
Split 26%/4%/65%/5%- the 5% is cash 2 years living expenses
Simple cheap easy to understand
Age minus 10 in bonds is a rough guide
Done the job for me-so far!
Stay the course live frugally and keep investing
You can do it
xxd091
This is impressive :) Thanks for sharing that
catlady wrote: Sun Sep 06, 2020 9:25 am I would describe our investing journey so far as incredibly lucky. I found Bogleheads right at the beginning of our investing around 2011 and we’ve been following the philosophy ever since.

The main thing I’ve learned is make a reasonable plan and stay the course.
Great to hear that!
What's your portfolio?
Since 2011 if not mistaken there is only one major crash which happened recently in March. How did you react to that?
catlady
Posts: 138
Joined: Sat Mar 26, 2016 8:31 pm

Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by catlady »

mohd wrote: Sun Sep 06, 2020 10:45 am
catlady wrote: Sun Sep 06, 2020 9:25 am I would describe our investing journey so far as incredibly lucky. I found Bogleheads right at the beginning of our investing around 2011 and we’ve been following the philosophy ever since.

The main thing I’ve learned is make a reasonable plan and stay the course.
Great to hear that!
What's your portfolio?
Since 2011 if not mistaken there is only one major crash which happened recently in March. How did you react to that?
Currently about 85/15. Did some TLH between VTSAX and VFIAX in March and otherwise stayed the course.
Normchad
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by Normchad »

It’s been very boring, and astonishingly successful.

I’m not a stick picker. I didn’t get any windfalls. I’ve done this through 3 recessions, etc. I probably didn’t contribute more than 15,000 in a single year for the first 15 years if this.

I’ve been at this for 28 years. I have a multi million dollar portfolio. My contributions account for less than half of it. So I’ve earned an awful lot of free money, doing it the Boglehead way.
JS-Elcano
Posts: 90
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by JS-Elcano »

I didn't start investing for retirement or otherwise until I was 30. This is when I got my first job; it paid 29.5k per year (after graduate school :shock: ). I didn't invest much, which was a mistake, but what I did invest went into lower cost index funds through TIAA, so at least that was good. I was 95% stocks until last year (I am now in my late 40s). About three years ago (late :oops: ) I found MMM and then through them, this forum. Everything changed. I now max out my RothIRA, Roth/pre-tax403b and 457b. I didn't max my RothIRA until I was 39 and I didn't max my 403b until I was 45 and my portfolio only now passed the 500k mark :?

But, maybe I am a good example that it is never too late to get started and still be on target for an early-ish retirement at 59/60. I am making a better salary now (150-180k) and feel I am doing a good job of catching up. I do wish I had found this site earlier and had realized the power of early investing, but it is what it is and I am making the most of what I can do now. Fortunately, I never bought more house (4 more years until its paid off) or used car (cash) than I could easily afford and my lifestyle never got out of hand because of the low salary I had until recently. Last year I went from 95% stocks to 60% so I can SWAN and now I am at 70% as I realized I could still SWAN at 70%. As I get closer to retirement I will reduce this back to 60% and put 5 years of living expenses into HYS. I also now have some money to dabble in individual stocks, but my ISP says to not go above 7% of my total investments. :sharebeer
Topic Author
mohd
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Location: Bahrain

Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by mohd »

Normchad wrote: Sun Sep 06, 2020 1:18 pm It’s been very boring, and astonishingly successful.

I’m not a stick picker. I didn’t get any windfalls. I’ve done this through 3 recessions, etc. I probably didn’t contribute more than 15,000 in a single year for the first 15 years if this.

I’ve been at this for 28 years. I have a multi million dollar portfolio. My contributions account for less than half of it. So I’ve earned an awful lot of free money, doing it the Boglehead way.
Nice to hear that

Boring is good! it let you focus on your profession. And this is my primary reason to choose this style of investment. I didn't want to spend time picking individual stocks and try to beat the market.

I am wondering how would be my feeling in my first recession :D time will tell.
JS-Elcano wrote: Sun Sep 06, 2020 1:57 pm I didn't start investing for retirement or otherwise until I was 30. This is when I got my first job; it paid 29.5k per year (after graduate school :shock: ). I didn't invest much, which was a mistake, but what I did invest went into lower cost index funds through TIAA, so at least that was good. I was 95% stocks until last year (I am now in my late 40s). About three years ago (late :oops: ) I found MMM and then through them, this forum. Everything changed. I now max out my RothIRA, Roth/pre-tax403b and 457b. I didn't max my RothIRA until I was 39 and I didn't max my 403b until I was 45 and my portfolio only now passed the 500k mark :?

But, maybe I am a good example that it is never too late to get started and still be on target for an early-ish retirement at 59/60. I am making a better salary now (150-180k) and feel I am doing a good job of catching up. I do wish I had found this site earlier and had realized the power of early investing, but it is what it is and I am making the most of what I can do now. Fortunately, I never bought more house (4 more years until its paid off) or used car (cash) than I could easily afford and my lifestyle never got out of hand because of the low salary I had until recently. Last year I went from 95% stocks to 60% so I can SWAN and now I am at 70% as I realized I could still SWAN at 70%. As I get closer to retirement I will reduce this back to 60% and put 5 years of living expenses into HYS. I also now have some money to dabble in individual stocks, but my ISP says to not go above 7% of my total investments. :sharebeer
Starting late is better than never. When I just started (I am 28) I felt sorry that I didn't know about all this and started earlier. But saw many successful people starter later and this gave me encouragement.

I think the only regret when we see the returns over the long run is that we did not invest more :D

In my country the pension plan is different. We contribute almost 6% of the basic salary to the pension fund. And based on how many years you worked, you get a pension salary when you retire. Let's say you worked for 40 years, then 40*2=80, you get 80% of the avg of your last 5 years salary. I really doubt that many countries do this.
Bernmaster
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by Bernmaster »

When I was a child my parents bought stocks from a company that later went bankrupt. When I started working a bank consultant sold me life insurance and high cost managed funds. After two years I realised both were a bad deal and started stock picking and buying factor funds reaping slightly below market results.

Finally, I realised that simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. When Vanguard funds became available in my country I switched to VGWL - been happy ever since.
thibaulthib
Posts: 154
Joined: Mon Nov 12, 2018 8:46 am

Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by thibaulthib »

Have started the journey 4 years ago, investing 100% in VWRD (I was 26 yo, now 30).

DCA-ing every month, super duper boring journey, but very happy about the returns.

Will keep investing that way for the foreseeable future.
Topic Author
mohd
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Location: Bahrain

Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by mohd »

Bernmaster wrote: Tue Sep 08, 2020 6:18 am When I was a child my parents bought stocks from a company that later went bankrupt. When I started working a bank consultant sold me life insurance and high cost managed funds. After two years I realised both were a bad deal and started stock picking and buying factor funds reaping slightly below market results.

Finally, I realised that simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. When Vanguard funds became available in my country I switched to VGWL - been happy ever since.
Simple gets to the point :)
thibaulthib wrote: Tue Sep 08, 2020 6:30 am Have started the journey 4 years ago, investing 100% in VWRD (I was 26 yo, now 30).

DCA-ing every month, super duper boring journey, but very happy about the returns.

Will keep investing that way for the foreseeable future.
Nice to hear it's going well with you :) I like boring stuff, they are not complex!
CarpeDiem22
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by CarpeDiem22 »

mohd wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:43 pm So, I've no specific question, just wondering, how and when was your first investment step. How did it go. What lessons you have learned over the time of your investment journey?
Started investing at start of 2017. I have always been conscious of my expenses as those directly impacted my month-on-month increase in net worth. Now it has become less relevant as portfolio has become larger. Sometimes, my net worth after getting salary is lower than a week before getting salary due to capital market movements. So, it's getting difficult to maintain savings discipline. I can now understand why many forum members don't want to track their networth more than once a year.
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Stef
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by Stef »

Didn't expect it to become so boring within 12 months.

The only thing that I'm enjoying now is talking about it on Bogleheads lol.
RadAudit
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Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by RadAudit »

mohd wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:43 pm Just wondering, how and when was your first investment step. How did it go. What lessons you have learned over the time of your investment journey?
First step was in Sept 1972, when after a year of employment in MinorCorp, I was allowed to join their savings plan at about 1% of salary and with a 50% corporate match. The next significant step came about 15 years later when I had about $100k stashed away and after I read Bogle on Mutual Funds while on a business trip. From that point on I started the transition to low cost, broad based mutual funds and a portfolio with an appropriate AA. About 25 years later, I retired when the kids got out of college and I had hit my number. I've been retired for about 10 years.

I think I / we did OK considering our goals and income. I've learned - or have convinced myself - that investing isn't as hard as most people seem to want to make it look. Some rather short, straightforward books (Three Fund Portfolio, If You Can (Bernstein?)) will get you pretty close to being on the right path very quickly - a lot quicker than 15 years, anyway.
FI is the best revenge. LBYM. Invest the rest. Stay the course. - PS: The cavalry isn't coming, kids. You are on your own.
Valuethinker
Posts: 41120
Joined: Fri May 11, 2007 11:07 am

Re: How will you describe your investing journey so far?

Post by Valuethinker »

mohd wrote: Sun Sep 06, 2020 9:44 am
Valuethinker wrote: Sun Sep 06, 2020 9:14 am
StevieG72 wrote: Sun Sep 06, 2020 5:58 am I opened a Vangaurd account in 2012. What I have learned....

Less is more! I started off with a tilt towards small cap & REITs. I have since dumped the REIT and would also sell the small caps if they were not in a taxable account. At one point I tax loss harvested my international fund and bought each international sector separately. While none of these investments would be considered a poor choice, in my opinion the added complexity is unnecessary.

My asset allocation (stocks to bonds ratio) has shifted over the last 8 years. I started at 60 /40 decided that was too conservative for my age. I switched to 80/20 which was too aggressive for my risk tolerance. 70/30 made sense, right in the middle! Now I am comfortable at 65/35 as my portfolio has grown there is no need to be too aggressive. I will probably dial that back to 60/40 as I reach my retirement goals.

I have experienced a couple market downturns. These can be scary! You really do not know your risk tolerance until you have survived a few roller coaster dips with your portfolio. The drop in March was probably the most significant in my investing lifetime. I typically try to invest additional cash when the market dips, I was buying on the way down but lost my enthusiasm before we hit the bottom! My portfolio has grown significantly over the years and the value of my portfolio dipped dramatically.
March was nothing in the history of bear markets: 1. it was only about an average fall (around -30%)? 2. it was over incredibly quickly. One could make analogies to October 1987 however the market ended up that year. It was just that in a single say you lost 1/5th of your portfolio.

You have not experienced a real bear market as yet. In 2008-09 those of us who were paying attention realised the entire financial system was threatened, stocks could have gone down 80%, not 50%. 2000 was less painful (c. -35%) but went on for nearly 3 years. Those who have experienced Japan (30 year bear market then stagnation) or the UK 1973-74 (down about 80% in real terms, in a period when inflation was c. 20% pa) or the Great Depression (stocks fell in 1929, had several false recoveries, did not again cross the positive line until the 1940s) have experienced real bear markets.

You won't know what you will feel about these events until you experience them. I have had different reactions each time, so you will change as well.

Kudos to you for recognising the importance of having a bond weighting. We have too many 100% equity followers here.

I do check my portfolio balance daily for the most part. It is really easy with the Vangaurd app! There are a few benefits to doing this in my opinion. I can invest additional cash if the market takes a dive and I feel like buying the dip. ( the ideal way to invest is immediately when money is earned, I do have weekly automatic investments.) The other benefit is to keep your asset allocation / risk tolerance in check. It is not uncommon for me to see my portfolio drop in value thousands of dollars in a day. I am used to seeing this happen and do not get too alarmed.

Lastly I learned to tune out the noise! Even us Bogleheads are a finicky bunch. If the market tanks, the sky is falling! If the market reaches an all time high, it is overvalued and a correction is coming! Ignore the alarming posts and stick with your investing plan.
I think it is dangerous to check portfolio values more than monthly. I have accounts I only check once a year (pensions with insurance companies).

"Buying the dips" is dangerous because they can turn out to be something a lot worse than a dip.

so we understand that:

1. Diversification is very important to minimize the damage in case of bear market

2. It's important to have portion of bonds to stabilize your portfolio in case of bear.
1. Diversification does not protect against bear markets. It reduces the damage from single stock risk eg Enron WorldCom GE.

Equity markets tend to fall together.

2. Yes. But sometimes stocks and bonds go down together. Bonds are mostly less volatile.
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