Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

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nun
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Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by nun »

This year my Vanguard accounts were change to fully brokerage because of some internal admin stuff. I imagine this happened to all the folks who had just ignored it up to that point. This resulted in me getting two 1099-DIVs. One is the familiar simple to follow one and the other is a consolidated 1099-DIV which is organized very inconveniently. After much work on my calculator I think I have things right now, but come on Vanguard make this more obvious.
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by jebmke »

In my opinion, the brokerage format is simpler. One 1099-Div to enter instead of multiple ones.

What specifically tripped you up?
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by toddthebod »

I don't use Vanguard, but my 1099-Consolidated has a 1099-DIV within that just lists the values for each box.
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by prd1982 »

Make sure you input BOTH of these 1099s into your tax program. The familiar one represents activity before you converted to the brokerage platform. The new format only includes activity on the brokerage platform. Personally I like the new format 1099, since all the funds are on a single set of numbers.
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by jebmke »

toddthebod wrote: Sat Feb 03, 2024 11:59 am I don't use Vanguard, but my 1099-Consolidated has a 1099-DIV within that just lists the values for each box.
That is how VG does it as well. The remaining pages are details that may or may not be relevant.
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by toddthebod »

jebmke wrote: Sat Feb 03, 2024 12:00 pm
toddthebod wrote: Sat Feb 03, 2024 11:59 am I don't use Vanguard, but my 1099-Consolidated has a 1099-DIV within that just lists the values for each box.
That is how VG does it as well. The remaining pages are details that may or may not be relevant.
Yeah, seems pretty straightforward. I don't know why a calculator was involved!
Backtests without cash flows are meaningless. Returns without dividends are lies.
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by tetractys »

I was happy this year with the detail breakdowns, it really made things easier for me.

There was some preliminary cloudiness at first to sort out the order of things.

So Vanguard put everyone on brokerage now?
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by sycamore »

Perhaps too late for the OP but for others moving to a brokerage account, please see Vanguard's Moving your Vanguard funds to a
Vanguard Brokerage Account
. Lots of good info including:
For the tax year of your move, you’ll receive separate tax forms
for your mutual fund accounts and brokerage accounts. Starting
the first full tax year after your move, you’ll receive a single tax
form for each brokerage account.

Note: Brokerage account tax forms are distributed later than
mutual fund account tax forms.
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by Geologist »

prd1982 wrote: Sat Feb 03, 2024 12:00 pm Make sure you input BOTH of these 1099s into your tax program. The familiar one represents activity before you converted to the brokerage platform. The new format only includes activity on the brokerage platform. Personally I like the new format 1099, since all the funds are on a single set of numbers.
prd1982 is correct. If you were using your calculator, so you were adding up total year dividends for each fund on the mutual fund platform plus the brokerage platform to enter in your tax software/tax forms as one annual total for each fund, you shouldn't do that. Enter the familiar one with each mutual fund separately. Then enter the brokerage platform separately as one total just as the 1099-DIV shows (typically you list Vanguard Marketing Corp as the payer). The fact that it includes multiple mutual funds is something you no longer have to deal with on a tax form.
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nun
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by nun »

Ah I’ve had a realization. I don’t need to break out the DIV numbers into individual funds, I can just enter the consolidated DIV numbers all together, that actually makes things simpler….’y Homer Simpson “Doh!’ Moment of the day.
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by HeavyChevy »

Turbotax or equivalent has provided value to me over the last 15 years. Everything downloaded directly from Vanguard, Fidelity, etc.

Glad you figured things out.
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by dave1054 »

On a related topic, has anyone out there gotten their Fidelity 1099 statement.
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by livesoft »

dave1054 wrote: Sun Feb 04, 2024 12:03 pm On a related topic, has anyone out there gotten their Fidelity 1099 statement.
Some of them, but not the one for our taxable account. The Fidelity web site is very clear when our 1099-DIV is expected to be available. OTOH, I have all the 1099s from all my other brokerages.
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by Chip Munk »

dave1054 wrote: Sun Feb 04, 2024 12:03 pm On a related topic, has anyone out there gotten their Fidelity 1099 statement.
There is a link at the top of the main page of Fidelity's website labeled "Important tax information". When I click on that and log in, it shows me the date when my 1099-DIV will likely be available. In the past I've found the date to be accurate. https://www.fidelity.com/tax-information/overview
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by delamer »

dave1054 wrote: Sun Feb 04, 2024 12:03 pm On a related topic, has anyone out there gotten their Fidelity 1099 statement.
Interestingly, Fidelity says mine is delayed (at least in part) because it is waiting for information on a couple Vanguard ETFs that I hold at Fidelity.
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by dave1054 »

Delemar, I got the exact same message. Apparently holding Vanguard ETS at Fidelity delays the process. Oh well, I guess I won’t be able to get an early start on my taxes.
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by livesoft »

dave1054 wrote: Sun Feb 04, 2024 1:17 pm Delemar, I got the exact same message. Apparently holding Vanguard ETS at Fidelity delays the process. Oh well, I guess I won’t be able to get an early start on my taxes.
While I don't have my 1099 from Fidelity, I know exactly what numbers will be on it, so I basically have my taxes done, but won't file until October anyways.
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by Misenplace »

Just a reminder, this thread is about Vanguard's 1099-DIVs. If you want to start a thread about Fidelity, let me know and I will move these posts to it.

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nun
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by nun »

HeavyChevy wrote: Sun Feb 04, 2024 8:20 am Turbotax or equivalent has provided value to me over the last 15 years. Everything downloaded directly from Vanguard, Fidelity, etc.

Glad you figured things out.
I understood that I'd get 2 DIVs from Vanguard for this year, but it was the difference in format that was confusing. The mutual fund format broke out each fund on the DIV whereas the brokerage DIV consolidates them and just reports the totals for the entire account. When I just entered another DIV form in Turbo tax for the consolidated DIV this became very easy...no calculator needed.
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by Swansea »

I copied my Vanguard 1099 and saved them. Tried to upload them into turbo tax, but no luck so far.
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by vrr106 »

Geologist wrote: Sat Feb 03, 2024 1:02 pm
prd1982 wrote: Sat Feb 03, 2024 12:00 pm Make sure you input BOTH of these 1099s into your tax program. The familiar one represents activity before you converted to the brokerage platform. The new format only includes activity on the brokerage platform. Personally I like the new format 1099, since all the funds are on a single set of numbers.
prd1982 is correct. If you were using your calculator, so you were adding up total year dividends for each fund on the mutual fund platform plus the brokerage platform to enter in your tax software/tax forms as one annual total for each fund, you shouldn't do that. Enter the familiar one with each mutual fund separately. Then enter the brokerage platform separately as one total just as the 1099-DIV shows (typically you list Vanguard Marketing Corp as the payer). The fact that it includes multiple mutual funds is something you no longer have to deal with on a tax form.
Was there some cutoff for receiving 2 Vs 1 form depending on when you converted?
Right now Vanguard only has my brokerage 1099 (I converted in August 23). My consolidated 1099 lists both funds such as VTSAX and the etf VTI with mutual fund dividend dates in March/June and ETF in Sep/Dec as I would expect.
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by jebmke »

vrr106 wrote: Mon Feb 05, 2024 10:49 am
Geologist wrote: Sat Feb 03, 2024 1:02 pm
prd1982 wrote: Sat Feb 03, 2024 12:00 pm Make sure you input BOTH of these 1099s into your tax program. The familiar one represents activity before you converted to the brokerage platform. The new format only includes activity on the brokerage platform. Personally I like the new format 1099, since all the funds are on a single set of numbers.
prd1982 is correct. If you were using your calculator, so you were adding up total year dividends for each fund on the mutual fund platform plus the brokerage platform to enter in your tax software/tax forms as one annual total for each fund, you shouldn't do that. Enter the familiar one with each mutual fund separately. Then enter the brokerage platform separately as one total just as the 1099-DIV shows (typically you list Vanguard Marketing Corp as the payer). The fact that it includes multiple mutual funds is something you no longer have to deal with on a tax form.
Was there some cutoff for receiving 2 Vs 1 form depending on when you converted?
Right now Vanguard only has my brokerage 1099 (I converted in August 23). My consolidated 1099 lists both funds such as VTSAX and the etf VTI with mutual fund dividend dates in March/June and ETF in Sep/Dec as I would expect.
If there is taxable activity before and after the transition, you will get two. If not, you will get one (or none).
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by HeavyChevy »

I just started 2023 taxes in Turbotax and had the program download tax information directly from Vanguard. There appeared to be different paths to V MF information vs V brokerage information. So two operations to get total information. Same as Fidelity brokerage vs Fidelity Netbenefits (company 401K etc.) download from only one and you might not have all information needed.

Good luck.
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by Colorado Guy »

Swansea wrote: Mon Feb 05, 2024 10:30 am I copied my Vanguard 1099 and saved them. Tried to upload them into turbo tax, but no luck so far.
?? Can you explain what is happening that prevents the upload? Starting my taxes next week.

Thx
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by Swansea »

A Google search said uploads would happen in 3 stages this month, but I have nothing from Vanguard.
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by TBillT »

Yes we (spouse too) got both...I tried to convert to brokerage early in Jan_23 but still got a few small DIVS.
They seem to say I could not upload the mutual fund DIVs into TT until 21-Feb, but I was able to print out hard copies.
I was able to upload the brokerage to TT (TurboTax).
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by delamer »

Colorado Guy wrote: Mon Feb 05, 2024 11:44 am
Swansea wrote: Mon Feb 05, 2024 10:30 am I copied my Vanguard 1099 and saved them. Tried to upload them into turbo tax, but no luck so far.
?? Can you explain what is happening that prevents the upload? Starting my taxes next week.

Thx
I had no problem uploading my Vanguard 1099 (taxable brokerage) last week.
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by rkhusky »

Interestingly, my consolidated 1099 doesn't include a few weeks of interest on the mutual fund platform, but my 1099-R includes two sets of 1099-R's, one for an early Roth conversion of brokerage tIRA to mutual fund Roth IRA and another set for later Roth conversions of brokerage tIRA to brokerage Roth IRA (after I converted to brokerage platform).
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by sycamore »

rkhusky wrote: Mon Feb 05, 2024 9:28 pm Interestingly, my consolidated 1099 doesn't include a few weeks of interest on the mutual fund platform, but my 1099-R includes two sets of 1099-R's, one for an early Roth conversion of brokerage tIRA to mutual fund Roth IRA and another set for later Roth conversions of brokerage tIRA to brokerage Roth IRA (after I converted to brokerage platform).
If I understand what you wrote, that's all to be expected, yes?
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by rkhusky »

sycamore wrote: Tue Feb 06, 2024 6:32 am
rkhusky wrote: Mon Feb 05, 2024 9:28 pm Interestingly, my consolidated 1099 doesn't include a few weeks of interest on the mutual fund platform, but my 1099-R includes two sets of 1099-R's, one for an early Roth conversion of brokerage tIRA to mutual fund Roth IRA and another set for later Roth conversions of brokerage tIRA to brokerage Roth IRA (after I converted to brokerage platform).
If I understand what you wrote, that's all to be expected, yes?
I wasn’t expecting the two 1099R’s in one document, but either two separate 1099R’s because one involved conversion to a Roth mutual fund account (like other 1099’s) or just one 1099R because the conversions came from the same brokerage tIRA. Doesn’t matter because it won’t happen again.
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by rkhusky »

rkhusky wrote: Tue Feb 06, 2024 6:43 am
sycamore wrote: Tue Feb 06, 2024 6:32 am
rkhusky wrote: Mon Feb 05, 2024 9:28 pm Interestingly, my consolidated 1099 doesn't include a few weeks of interest on the mutual fund platform, but my 1099-R includes two sets of 1099-R's, one for an early Roth conversion of brokerage tIRA to mutual fund Roth IRA and another set for later Roth conversions of brokerage tIRA to brokerage Roth IRA (after I converted to brokerage platform).
If I understand what you wrote, that's all to be expected, yes?
I wasn’t expecting the two 1099R’s in one document, but either two separate 1099R’s because one involved conversion to a Roth mutual fund account (like other 1099’s) or just one 1099R because the conversions came from the same brokerage tIRA. Doesn’t matter because it won’t happen again.
Figured out why I ended up with 2 1099’s. I turned 59.5 during 2023 and some tIRA withdrawals were from before that and some were after. The brokerage transition was a red herring. Different distribution codes in box 7 of the 1099’s - 2 and 7, early distribution and normal distribution.
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by beyou »

Vanguard has added lots of details to the 1099 so it is all in one place. For instance they now show % US gov income and % by state for munis. In the past one had to go look that up elsewhere.
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by livesoft »

beyou wrote: Sat Feb 10, 2024 12:41 pm Vanguard has added lots of details to the 1099 so it is all in one place. For instance they now show % US gov income and % by state for munis. In the past one had to go look that up elsewhere.
Well, I would say not exactly "to the 1099", but "with the supplemental material that comes with the 1099."
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by beyou »

livesoft wrote: Sat Feb 10, 2024 1:15 pm
beyou wrote: Sat Feb 10, 2024 12:41 pm Vanguard has added lots of details to the 1099 so it is all in one place. For instance they now show % US gov income and % by state for munis. In the past one had to go look that up elsewhere.
Well, I would say not exactly "to the 1099", but "with the supplemental material that comes with the 1099."
to the pdf containing 1099 data.
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

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rkhusky wrote: Sat Feb 10, 2024 12:25 pm Figured out why I ended up with 2 1099’s. I turned 59.5 during 2023 and some tIRA withdrawals were from before that and some were after. The brokerage transition was a red herring. Different distribution codes in box 7 of the 1099’s - 2 and 7, early distribution and normal distribution.
Correcting my previous quote: the withdrawal before 59.5 is subject to penalty unless it meets another exception (here, a conversion), so it does need to be coded as an early distribution with exception. Thus this double coding makes sense.
Last edited by grabiner on Sun Feb 11, 2024 11:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

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[Topic is now in Personal Finance (Not Investing) - tax forms - mod mkc]
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by rkhusky »

grabiner wrote: Sun Feb 11, 2024 11:12 am
rkhusky wrote: Sat Feb 10, 2024 12:25 pm Figured out why I ended up with 2 1099’s. I turned 59.5 during 2023 and some tIRA withdrawals were from before that and some were after. The brokerage transition was a red herring. Different distribution codes in box 7 of the 1099’s - 2 and 7, early distribution and normal distribution.
This shouldn't make a difference either. There is no penalty for IRA withdrawals in the year you turn 59.5, whether you do this before or after your birthday. Was one of the withdrawals a conversion, which could be coded differently?
There is no penalty. Prior to 59.5 was a Roth conversion on one 1099R. After 59.5 was a Roth conversion and tIRA withdrawals on the second 1099R.
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by secondcor521 »

grabiner wrote: Sun Feb 11, 2024 11:12 am There is no penalty for IRA withdrawals in the year you turn 59.5, whether you do this before or after your birthday.
I don't believe that's accurate. An IRA distribution prior to 59.5 is subject to the early withdrawal penalty (unless it meets one of the exceptions).
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by grabiner »

secondcor521 wrote: Sun Feb 11, 2024 10:17 pm
grabiner wrote: Sun Feb 11, 2024 11:12 am There is no penalty for IRA withdrawals in the year you turn 59.5, whether you do this before or after your birthday.
I don't believe that's accurate. An IRA distribution prior to 59.5 is subject to the early withdrawal penalty (unless it meets one of the exceptions).
I checked with Publication 590-B, which agrees with this; you have to actually be 59.5 to withdraw penalty-free. I edited my post above. (Some IRS rules do apply to the whole year; you can make catch-up contributions to an IRA in the year you turn 50, even if you do this before your birthday.)
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by Nahtanoj »

beyou wrote: Sat Feb 10, 2024 3:55 pm
livesoft wrote: Sat Feb 10, 2024 1:15 pm
beyou wrote: Sat Feb 10, 2024 12:41 pm Vanguard has added lots of details to the 1099 so it is all in one place. For instance they now show % US gov income and % by state for munis. In the past one had to go look that up elsewhere.
Well, I would say not exactly "to the 1099", but "with the supplemental material that comes with the 1099."
to the pdf containing 1099 data.
Actually, the .pdf containing the 1099 data seems to have USG obligations data for all the funds EXCEPT the settlement fund. I looked through the .pdf and couldn’t find the settlement fund USG obligations percentage anywhere. Am I missing something?

Fortunately, Vanguard has separately posted a .pdf list of funds with their USG obligations percentages in the same format as in previous years, and the settlement fund is included on that list. There is a link to this separate .pdf that you can access via the “Fund-specific tax information” link in the “Tax Center.”
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Re: Vanguard’s confusing 1099-DIVs

Post by beyou »

Nahtanoj wrote: Mon Feb 12, 2024 6:09 am
beyou wrote: Sat Feb 10, 2024 3:55 pm
livesoft wrote: Sat Feb 10, 2024 1:15 pm
beyou wrote: Sat Feb 10, 2024 12:41 pm Vanguard has added lots of details to the 1099 so it is all in one place. For instance they now show % US gov income and % by state for munis. In the past one had to go look that up elsewhere.
Well, I would say not exactly "to the 1099", but "with the supplemental material that comes with the 1099."
to the pdf containing 1099 data.
Actually, the .pdf containing the 1099 data seems to have USG obligations data for all the funds EXCEPT the settlement fund. I looked through the .pdf and couldn’t find the settlement fund USG obligations percentage anywhere. Am I missing something?

Fortunately, Vanguard has separately posted a .pdf list of funds with their USG obligations percentages in the same format as in previous years, and the settlement fund is included on that list. There is a link to this separate .pdf that you can access via the “Fund-specific tax information” link in the “Tax Center.”
I agree they left out the one fund that applies to a large % of clients, meaning most use VMFXX as the settlement fund.
That said, I didn't notice since those of us in NY, CT, CA cannot usually get the tax benefit of US Gov bonds from this fund, since it's only 49.37% and one must have over 50% to get any tax benefit in these states. That said, they should include it as one needs to know this number to even be aware if this rule is impacting them (in NY, CT or CA) or to at least get the partial benefit on other states with income tax. I wish I could say they left it out of MY PDF assuming since I am in NY this does not apply, but they did include another fund that does not apply because of my state :-(

My post was meant to point out they actually added more information that was never there before.
Of course they could add more and make things even easier, such as showing these percentages for non-Vanguard funds you may own.
They are a brokerage and allow purchase of competing products, report some data on the competing products, but chose to leave out % by state, % of US gov, % foreign income etc, for those competing funds. So is the glass half full or half empty (they made improvements but didn't go "all the way" ?
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