Can we afford a move to a mountain town?

[BiggerFishToFI]

We want and plan to move from a major metro area in Colorado to a mountain town. Spouse and I both work remote jobs with a combined HHI ~290k. We have a 8 month old infant and may or may not try for another. We are mid-30s.

We currently own a home in said metro and plan to sell and have approx. 230k equity.

We have ~1.1MM in index funds and 60k in I-bonds, 20k in cash. 400k of this is in taxable with not substantial gains. We could sell 200k taxable and only pay a few grand in taxes. We are currently stockpiling excess cash while maxing out tax-deferred space.

We are looking at homes in the $650k-$800k range and plan to buy Fall 2023 or Spring 2024. Plan to use $230k equity + $60k I-bonds + 40k cash + (some amount of taxable). Our goal is to have the home paid off and have ~2MM invested at which point we will transition to part time work / consulting. Stretch goal is to get there in the next 5 years.

Our current housing is only costing us $1250 / month due to the very low interest rate and 270k mortgage balance

If you take housing out of the picture we spend ~85k / year including child care. This should drop to closer to 65k in a few months once we transition from a daytime nanny to daycare, then even more in 4 years once public school is available.

The questions:

How much house can we realistically afford and still meet our goals?

How much taxable should we sell towards a downpayment, if any given current interest rates?

Will we be shooting ourselves in the feet with this lifestyle inflation? The move is strictly about being closer to ski resorts, hiking, biking, rivers and the things that truly bring us joy.

Talk or push us off the ledge! Thanks in advance

[financiallycurious]

You'll have to be strategic about what mountain town you choose. It would be very difficult, close to impossible, to find a SFH somewhere like Aspen, Vail or Park City at that price range, but if you broaden your search it is do-able. Lifestyle inflation isn't that bad if you end up spending all your time recreating outside. Your biggest discretionary expense would be your season pass, equipment and ski team for your kid(s). FWIW, in my opinion, moving to a mountain town to raise our kids was among the best decisions of my life. Good luck.

[jebmke]

Research health care carefully. I have a relative who lives above Steamboat and she has been helping a fairly new resident in the area locate physicians who will take new patients. So far, the closest is 2 hours away.

[NiceUnparticularMan]

Assuming you can find a home you like in that price range, it is prima facie reasonable given your income.

As an aside, I would note that I think that trying to minimize and then quickly pay off a mortgage is somewhat inconsistent with your goal of trying to shift to part-time work/consulting sooner rather than later. I know to many it feels like not having mortgage payments should make that safer, but actually usually having a mortgage at a competitive rate plus a lot more in savings typically makes that safer.

[quantAndHold]

You can probably afford it, if you’re judicious about choosing where you live. There’s a wide variety of places that are “in the mountains”.

My main concern would be that the lifestyle is very different than what you’re used to, and not necessarily in ways that you’re going to like. I would rent for a year, before plunking down a bunch of money on a change that will be expensive to undo if you don’t like it.

[jebmke]

I would rent for a year, before plunking down a bunch of money on a change that will be expensive to undo if you don’t like it.

This is good advice. I live in a rural area. We had an influx of DC/Baltimore area Covid flee-ers. Some are adjusting better than others. My neighbor still gripes when he gets stuck behind a combine moving from one farm to another during harvest season.

"Chris, look around you. How do you think they harvest all this corn and soybeans --- by hand?"

[NiceUnparticularMan]

My main concern would be that the lifestyle is very different than what you’re used to, and not necessarily in ways that you’re going to like. I would rent for a year, before plunking down a bunch of money on a change that will be expensive to undo if you don’t like it.

This also strikes me as very good advice.

[MoonOrb]

I'd also consider that being able to work remotely for the rest of your careers may or may not be possible for one or even both of you. Times change. Right now it seems feasible. But-who knows?

[tashnewbie]

I'd also consider that being able to work remotely for the rest of your careers may or may not be possible for one or even both of you. Times change. Right now it seems feasible. But-who knows?

Agree with this and others who said it may be prudent to rent for a while to see if you really like the area.

You definitely can afford a house in that price range with your current HHI.

But I think whether your portfolio will be $2mm in 5 years is another question altogether. Even if you don't sell anything in taxable for a down payment, you'd need $900k of growth in 5 years. That seems ambitious, and most of the increase will be dependent on the market, not your contributions. Your portfolio could almost double in 5 years, but no one knows what the market will bring. If your target amount or slowdown time is flexible, then you have more runway to work with.

[quantAndHold]

I’ll follow up in my “I’d rent for a year” comment. I’m from Denver, with long-standing family ties there. One of my formative memories was when my aunt and uncle retired, bought five acres up in the hills, spent three years building their dream house on it, then lasted exactly one winter before selling it and moving back to town. The reality of dealing with *winter*, for months on end, was just too much for them.

It was a lovely place to visit, though.

[CoAndy]

Would also love to live in a Colorado mountain town. Was looking at homes in Woodland Park and on Lake George just this morning. Be prepared to pay. A lot.

[cbs2002]

I know to many it feels like not having mortgage payments should make that safer, but actually usually having a mortgage at a competitive rate plus a lot more in savings typically makes that safer.

This is good advice and mirrors the path we have chosen. You can certainly afford the house with your current income level. If I were you I'd be focused on saving and getting that portfolio above $2MM as a top priority, then worry about paying down a mortgage faster. I sleep much better with 5x-10x my mortgage value in investments, rather than having a paid off house.

Either way, a downshift in five years may or may not be possible depending on the market. You are pretty young. Don't get so focused on that that you are disappointed in five years, because lots of other stuff may be going right for you. You've got a great start.

[maddogio]

There's a lot of good advice, here. Some, but not all mountain towns are resort towns. One can find a modest home in Cedaredge (for instance) for well under $500k. You'll not be near expensive restaurants or see too many jet-setters around town, but it's beautiful. It's a far easier drive (against traffic) to resorts. The biggest question, of course, is what you want from your mountain community.

[Katietsu]

Can I ask a side question? A daytime only nanny for five days a week is $85,000 for one 8 month old child? My niece with a bachelors in education in K-4 is paid $24,000 a year at a daycare center in a standard suburban area with a ratio 1 provider to 4 infants under one and higher ratios after one. I understand there is a lot of variation in earnings in any job, just didn't realize it was so significant here.

[smitcat]

Can I ask a side question? A daytime only nanny for five days a week is $85,000 for one 8 month old child? My niece with a bachelors in education in K-4 is paid $24,000 a year at a daycare center in a standard suburban area with a ratio 1 provider to 4 infants under one and higher ratios after one. I understand there is a lot of variation in earnings in any job, just didn't realize it was so significant here.

"My niece with a bachelors in education in K-4 is paid $24,000 a year at a daycare center in a standard suburban area with a ratio 1 provider to 4 infants under one and higher ratios after one."
Near us it is about 50% higher than that along with a 401K plan,10 paid holidays, sick and vacation, paid training, referral bonus's for both clients and staff, etc.
Also used Angel care monitors on all infants.

[forwhatiknow]

We were a long time Summit County Colorado family (15 years) . That area includes five world class ski resorts. Have since relocated but I kept up with the real estate market there and imagine that the other areas close to ski resorts have also experienced similar astronomical market price increases since Covid 19s emergence. Many folks in your situation being able to work remote got the same idea 2 years ago and it hasn't abated. Get on Realtor or Zillow , pick an area plug in your price point and see the lack of inventory and what your budget would afford. The Denver area had great real estate appreciation in the last 5years but the mountain towns just went off the charts do to people in your situation who don't need to live in a population center. Mountain towns offer attainable housing to local government employees and others on a limited basis and you'll be discouraged when you see what 500k to 700k gets you even with the subsidized locals offerings. Certainly not any single family home. The Aspen area is this on steroids. Don't want to discourage but to give a heads up on difficult undertaking. Good Luck

[Watty]

We have a 8 month old infant and may or may not try for another.

Pay a lot of attention to the public schools. I don't know anything about that area but in some rural areas the schools may not be good or you may need to send your kid to a high school that is a long way away.

Access to medical care can also be an issue. I know someone that retired on the Oregon Coast near a small town which had a few doctors and even a tiny hospital which was OK for their normal needs. If there is a hospital nearby also look into how sound it is, many rural hospitals are closing.

The problem was that one of them had something like a relatively common knee or shoulder problem and they needed a specialist. They needed to travel something like 1.5 -to 2 hours one way over a mountain pass to the nearest small city to see one. This meant that they needed multiple trips for an initial visit, MRI, outpatient surgery, and follow visits. They had a couple of overnight stays in a hotel when they had an early appointment and they did not want to risk missing an appointment if the weather was bad. Staying in a hotel for an extra night then being in the car for a long drive home after the surgery was not ideal. They got lucky and found someone near where they lived for physical therapy. They saw that would not work well as they got older so they moved to someplace with better medical care.

Emergency care can also be a problem if you are more than an hour away from a good emergency room and if there is a nearby community hospital it may have limited emergency care facilities. In a rural area there may be limited ambulances available and if there are two ambulances in a rural country they may both already be out on a call when you need one. Evacuation by helicopter is expensive and may not be possible when the weather is bad.

[NiceUnparticularMan]

Access to medical care can also be an issue. I know someone that retired on the Oregon Coast near a small town which had a few doctors and even a tiny hospital which was OK for their normal needs. If there is a hospital nearby also look into how sound it is, many rural hospitals are closing.

Due to somewhat recent events, this is now a pretty overriding concern for us. Like, long story short, I spent a lot of time in a waiting room 15 minutes from my house, talking to people who were regularly getting up early to drive hours to get to the same waiting room, or staying over night.

So I am not sure I would ever have a primary residence that wasn't really close to world class hospitals.

[GreendaleCC]

Can I ask a side question? A daytime only nanny for five days a week is $85,000 for one 8 month old child? My niece with a bachelors in education in K-4 is paid $24,000 a year at a daycare center in a standard suburban area with a ratio 1 provider to 4 infants under one and higher ratios after one. I understand there is a lot of variation in earnings in any job, just didn't realize it was so significant here.

No, the OP said they spend $85k per year, which includes nanny. They expect their expenses to drop by $20k when they move from nanny to daycare.

[DoubleComma]

The key is proximity to some type of a population density, which of course also drives up housing cost in the mountain town. More than anything you would need to create some level of sustainability as life happens. Someone loses their remote job, might need to develop a hybrid situation with a fairly local employer. Similarly for healthcare, many ski towns that actually have a hospital, Mammoth & Truckee come to mind, have excellent emergency care and orthopedic care ... but need something outside of that and you are traveling. Truckee not to bad, Reno & Sacramento are both fairly close. Mammoth is a much different beast.

We have a mountain home, spend a ton of time there, but can't bring ourselves to doing it permanently because of some these challenges mentioned above. I've been fully remote for 20+ years, but that doesn't guarantee it forever. Occasional 45-60 min drive for an annual physical or dentist is acceptable, needing emergency care with the nearest hospital being 60+ min isn't ideal.

Don't want to crush the dream, but I strongly suggest a second home (rent or buy) and spend a lot of time there an see if you can actually port your entire life to that area.

As for the mountain lifestyle, its awesome. We don't get it 100% of the time, but easily are we spending 1/3 of our time in the mountains and its a nice balance. Season to date I have skied 27 days and expect another 20+. During the Summer/Fall there is an equal amount of day on my Mt Bike; then mix in a lot of hiking, fishing and wake surfing and it feels as though I live in the mountains full time even though I don't.

[maddogio]

.... expect their expenses to drop by $20k when they move from nanny to daycare.

That's another item to explore. I live in a mountain-adjacent town. There is essentially no daycare available. Large employers are building their own so that they can recruit and retain professionals.

[CletusCaddy]

I'd also consider that being able to work remotely for the rest of your careers may or may not be possible for one or even both of you. Times change. Right now it seems feasible. But-who knows?

Then they move back?

Having remote jobs and not taking advantage of the benefits seems like a waste.

[invest4]

Assuming you can find a home you like in that price range, it is prima facie reasonable given your income.

As an aside, I would note that I think that trying to minimize and then quickly pay off a mortgage is somewhat inconsistent with your goal of trying to shift to part-time work/consulting sooner rather than later. I know to many it feels like not having mortgage payments should make that safer, but actually usually having a mortgage at a competitive rate plus a lot more in savings typically makes that safer.

+1

[jebmke]

The problem was that one of them had something like a relatively common knee or shoulder problem and they needed a specialist. They needed to travel something like 1.5 -to 2 hours one way over a mountain pass to the nearest small city to see one. This meant that they needed multiple trips for an initial visit, MRI, outpatient surgery, and follow visits. They had a couple of overnight stays in a hotel when they had an early appointment and they did not want to risk missing an appointment if the weather was bad. Staying in a hotel for an extra night then being in the car for a long drive home after the surgery was not ideal. They got lucky and found someone near where they lived for physical therapy. They saw that would not work well as they got older so they moved to someplace with better medical care.

my sister lives in Routt Co above Steamboat. For anything other than basic care they have to go to the front range (Boulder/Ft. Collins/Denver). They are older (as am I) -- they finally bought a condo near Ft. Collins just to have a base in case they needed to stay in the area for a while for medical or other reasons. I don't know how long they will stay up on the mountain - inertia is a funny thing as you get older.

[Hayduke]

We've been down this very same path and learned some valuable lessons. A place in the CO mountains was our dream for a long time and we finally made it happen shortly after our first kid. After our second kid arrived, we moved out of state to be closer to family and raise kids in a different environment.

-Waking up in the mountains and being immersed in daily/seasonal cycles other than the I-70 weekend grind is amazing and there really is a big difference in living there vs doing the weekend warrior thing and I treasured all the out-the-door access we had.

-Child care is extremely hard to come by, schools are hit and miss, medical care can be amazing (e.g. orthopedics in Vail) or hours away.

-Living in a tourist town is a drag and you'll start to resent everyone that comes up from the front range or out of state and clogs up grocery store parking lots, makes a mess of downtown, finds "your" campsite/powder stash/honey hole, etc.

-Industries in the Mountain West are primarily extractive (recreation, mining, lumber, ranching, water). Everyone is there to take or experience something that's in short supply and the scarcity mentality leads to strange distortions (real estate prices, fights over land access, etc)

-Every conversation with a local you meet starts with a competition of who has lived there longest.

-The wealth inequalities are astounding. The main socioeconomic groups are poor rural communities, minimum wage ski bums and service industries, and independently wealthy part time residents. Very few jobs actually in a mountain town provide enough enough income for people to afford a single family home there and it undermines any sense of real community.

-Everything is more expensive than it should be and harder to get service. For example, there was only 1 water well company in Steamboat and when we had issues with our well he was booked out for months.

-We found the kids who grew up in mountains were often not well adjusted to life outside their bubble and there were many examples of what we did not want our kids to turn into.

[khodge]

Moved from metro gulf coast to rural mountain west. Best decision ever!

[jebmke]

We've been down this very same path and learned some valuable lessons. A place in the CO mountains was our dream for a long time and we finally made it happen shortly after our first kid. After our second kid arrived, we moved out of state to be closer to family and raise kids in a different environment.

-Waking up in the mountains and being immersed in daily/seasonal cycles other than the I-70 weekend grind is amazing and there really is a big difference in living there vs doing the weekend warrior thing and I treasured all the out-the-door access we had.

-Child care is extremely hard to come by, schools are hit and miss, medical care can be amazing (e.g. orthopedics in Vail) or hours away.

-Living in a tourist town is a drag and you'll start to resent everyone that comes up from the front range or out of state and clogs up grocery store parking lots, makes a mess of downtown, finds "your" campsite/powder stash/honey hole, etc.

-Industries in the Mountain West are primarily extractive (recreation, mining, lumber, ranching, water). Everyone is there to take or experience something that's in short supply and the scarcity mentality leads to strange distortions (real estate prices, fights over land access, etc)

-Every conversation with a local you meet starts with a competition of who has lived there longest.

-The wealth inequalities are astounding. The main socioeconomic groups are poor rural communities, minimum wage ski bums and service industries, and independently wealthy part time residents. Very few jobs actually in a mountain town provide enough enough income for people to afford a single family home there and it undermines any sense of real community.

-Everything is more expensive than it should be and harder to get service. For example, there was only 1 water well company in Steamboat and when we had issues with our well he was booked out for months.

-We found the kids who grew up in mountains were often not well adjusted to life outside their bubble and there were many examples of what we did not want our kids to turn into.

Good list. I see some of each of these on the Eastern Shore of the Chesapeake. The key for OP is to go in with eyes wide open and have a plan for un-do if it doesn't meet expectations. Only he can judge if it is the right move.

[financiallycurious]

We've been down this very same path and learned some valuable lessons. A place in the CO mountains was our dream for a long time and we finally made it happen shortly after our first kid. After our second kid arrived, we moved out of state to be closer to family and raise kids in a different environment.

-Waking up in the mountains and being immersed in daily/seasonal cycles other than the I-70 weekend grind is amazing and there really is a big difference in living there vs doing the weekend warrior thing and I treasured all the out-the-door access we had.

-Child care is extremely hard to come by, schools are hit and miss, medical care can be amazing (e.g. orthopedics in Vail) or hours away.

-Living in a tourist town is a drag and you'll start to resent everyone that comes up from the front range or out of state and clogs up grocery store parking lots, makes a mess of downtown, finds "your" campsite/powder stash/honey hole, etc.

-Industries in the Mountain West are primarily extractive (recreation, mining, lumber, ranching, water). Everyone is there to take or experience something that's in short supply and the scarcity mentality leads to strange distortions (real estate prices, fights over land access, etc)

-Every conversation with a local you meet starts with a competition of who has lived there longest.

-The wealth inequalities are astounding. The main socioeconomic groups are poor rural communities, minimum wage ski bums and service industries, and independently wealthy part time residents. Very few jobs actually in a mountain town provide enough enough income for people to afford a single family home there and it undermines any sense of real community.

-Everything is more expensive than it should be and harder to get service. For example, there was only 1 water well company in Steamboat and when we had issues with our well he was booked out for months.

-We found the kids who grew up in mountains were often not well adjusted to life outside their bubble and there were many examples of what we did not want our kids to turn into.

I'm back because I want to play devil's advocate on the last point. I love the way most of the kids in our mountain town are turning out, specifically they have a huge love for the outdoors, they are lifelong athletes and they have a deep interest in the environment. The bubble comment is true but there are some interesting nonprofits for them to get involved with, things like adaptive sports and helping the service worker and immigrant population. Even so, being in a bubble of peers who primarily spend their free time skiing and mountain biking when they're not in school is not the worst way to grow up.

Childcare is challenging, but the poster indicated they have remote jobs. A lot of people in our town with remote jobs primarily work while their kids are in school and are free to pick up and be present for their kids after school, so that helps with childcare. The years prior to kindergarten can be quite challenging, though. Nannies demand a very high salary. The most economic solution for most people with young kids is to use au pairs.

Agree that the wealth inequalities are astounding, although the influx of remote workers has brought a new "middle class" (relative term here), though it still seems like many of even the remote workers have had an early liquidity event or family money to give them a head start.

[Nestegg_User]

We have a 8 month old infant and may or may not try for another.

Access to medical care can also be an issue. I know someone that retired on the Oregon Coast near a small town which had a few doctors and even a tiny hospital which was OK for their normal needs. If there is a hospital nearby also look into how sound it is, many rural hospitals are closing.

The problem was that one of them had something like a relatively common knee or shoulder problem and they needed a specialist. They needed to travel something like 1.5 -to 2 hours one way over a mountain pass to the nearest small city to see one. This meant that they needed multiple trips for an initial visit, MRI, outpatient surgery, and follow visits. They had a couple of overnight stays in a hotel when they had an early appointment and they did not want to risk missing an appointment if the weather was bad. Staying in a hotel for an extra night then being in the car for a long drive home after the surgery was not ideal. They got lucky and found someone near where they lived for physical therapy. They saw that would not work well as they got older so they moved to someplace with better medical care.

Emergency care can also be a problem if you are more than an hour away from a good emergency room and if there is a nearby community hospital it may have limited emergency care facilities. In a rural area there may be limited ambulances available and if there are two ambulances in a rural country they may both already be out on a call when you need one. Evacuation by helicopter is expensive and may not be possible when the weather is bad.

Summit county has a very limited amount of physicians that are available (some not taking new patients); have family that have house in Dillon area, in addition to their metro place, and they use keiser in metro but don't really have network availability up in the hills. {They were also hard hit with the first COVID surge, with a large transient tourist and support population, and didn't have enough facilities or staff. It was among the highest positive population in CO}

Watty--
as far as OR is concerned, we'd looked at Florence (along the coast west of Eugene)... but just like mountain towns it has a very limited availability of physicians and especially any specialists. That eliminated it from our consideration; Seaside, Cannon Beach, and Manzanita have similar difficulties and residents might have to traverse 26 to get into the Portland metro for services (especially specialists).

[PowderDay9]

OP,

Which mountain towns are you considering and have you spent much time there? Can you find houses in your price range? Finding child care could be a challenge. You should look into this before house hunting.

This sounds like an amazing lifestyle with all the outdoor activities and I think you should go for it.

[MnD]

Sure you can afford it.
Watch out for intolerable winter and spring day to day living conditions. You are not on vacation 365 days a year.

The dynamic of higher end resort towns is not good. Locals resent the rich people who bring money from elsewhere or make big bucks with mouse clicks and will make a concerted effort to rip you off at every opportunity.

With your housing budget another alternative is moving to a community with much better and quicker access to the high country.
I'd probably move from Denver to Delta, Montrose or Cedaredge if DW was onboard with that.

[maddogio]

I'll add one more detail that folks sometimes don't appreciate. Be sure to be very careful about digital connectivity. My suburban neighborhood is well-established, with the first homes being built in the late 60s. My home is 2/3rds of a mile from an interstate. There is no reliable cellular provider in that neighborhood. This was a significant inconvenience before wifi calling and is still an annoyance.

Broadband access is far better than it was a decade ago, but it can still be a problem. Would satellite internet service satisfy your needs? I've known a few folks who have moved only to learn that satellite internet is their only option. Be sure that you can get what you need, wherever you end up.

[Katietsu]

Can I ask a side question? A daytime only nanny for five days a week is $85,000 for one 8 month old child? My niece with a bachelors in education in K-4 is paid $24,000 a year at a daycare center in a standard suburban area with a ratio 1 provider to 4 infants under one and higher ratios after one. I understand there is a lot of variation in earnings in any job, just didn't realize it was so significant here.

No, the OP said they spend $85k per year, which includes nanny. They expect their expenses to drop by $20k when they move from nanny to daycare.

OK, my mistake. Not enough sleep. Also, maybe not realizing that a $400k - $500k mortgage would be a concern with $290k income and only $85k of other expenses.

[WhyNotUs]

The questions:

How much house can we realistically afford and still meet our goals?
The range you posted should work.

How much taxable should we sell towards a downpayment, if any given current interest rates?
Need to wait and see what the rates are in 2024 when you are ready. For me, higher rates would mean bigger downpayment and using the money that I save from child care to help rebuild savings. Research local public schools before looking into areas before you narrow your choices. Places like Aspen have great public schools but you cannot find a home in your price range.

Will we be shooting ourselves in the feet with this lifestyle inflation? The move is strictly about being closer to ski resorts, hiking, biking, rivers and the things that truly bring us joy.
Maybe, hard to know. A lot of it depends on where you end up. If in your shoes, my criteria would include public school quality, access to transportation Planes/Trains/Autos/bus, access to fiber or high speed internet, distance from resort that meets my budget, medical care, and cultural fit. Others have pointed out some of the challenges to resort area communities from the influx of remote workers, only you can assess your level of concern about that.

In general, lifestyle changes come with a series of cascading costs that are not always considered. Where I live has the highest health insurance rates in the US for instance, child car is very expensive, dining out is about 2x Denver, gas is $1 more a gallon, etc. It is common for people to stay short term rather than long term due to the cumulative effects but some people find paradise. Others see their financial independence slipping away. YMMV.

Talk or push us off the ledge! Thanks in advance

[warner25]

...You are not on vacation 365 days a year...

I think this neatly sums up what a lot of other people in the thread are trying to say. I don't know much about Colorado mountain towns, but I've lived in a wide variety of places over the last 15 years, and this is what I've learned too. A place that's nice to visit is not necessarily nice to live in (and of course vice versa). When you're visiting a destination for a short time, you don't mind as much the inflated prices and congestion and lack of genuine local community. When you're trying to actually make a living, that stuff can get frustrating.

My wife and I love cities, and we've lived in a few of the most vibrant cities in the world. We also love the beach, and we've lived in Hawaii. But we might have been most content when we lived in an almost rural part of Alabama. It would be a terrible place to vacation, but everything we needed was cheap and within ten minutes of our house; no traffic, plenty of parking, no waiting in lines, etc. To be clear, we still enjoyed things about the big cities and Hawaii too, so moving to a cool mountain town is not necessarily a bad idea; it just requires a conscious effort to make the most of it. The sad joke about people who live in destination areas is that they only do the fun things when they have visitors come into town.

[WhyNotUs]

...You are not on vacation 365 days a year...

The sad joke about people who live in destination areas is that they only do the fun things when they have visitors come into town.

That is less true for people who are working remotely and have six-figure income. I enjoy nordic skiing and there are more people in their 30's and 40's piling out of Sprinter vans to ski in the middle of the day. They are getting their fun tickets punched. If you are renting and working two or three jobs to pay your landlord it is a different story.

The OP has an advantage in being on remote at higher income and one or more children. Children bring plenty of opportunities to immerse in community and meet people. The bigger challenge in mountain resort communities are the influx of [unnecessary comment removed by admin LadyGeek]. Need lots of services but pricing out the people who provide them and then fighting housing that could house them.

[twh]

Part of the problem with the mountain towns is getting workers for anything. My mother lives in one, not far from Denver, but just getting someone to do driveway work is near impossible. Most of the mountain towns have a lot of AirBnB/VRBO that have driven out all the affordable housing for the lower income workers. And, the non-mountain town workers don't have an incentive to go to the mountain town to do work because the drive is a hike and they have plenty of work where they are.

[DurangoWino]

We live part time in Durango and just love it here. Homes are “reasonable” when compared to Telluride. Expanding your search area to include Bayfield will help on house costs. Pagosa Springs is also a nice area near Durango. Both Durango and PS have Walmarts and good grocery stores. Very good restaurant scene in both towns. SW CO is THE hidden gem of the state.

[jebmke]

ll add one more detail that folks sometimes don't appreciate. Be sure to be very careful about digital connectivity.

Yes, my sister and her husband had to exist with satellite only for many years. Worked "OK" until snow season when 350-400 inches of snow sometimes disrupted the dish.

[warner25]

...If you are renting and working two or three jobs to pay your landlord it is a different story...

That's certainly a factor for some people. For people who are financially comfortable, it's also just easy to fall into a habit of spending every weekend catching up on chores, errands, projects, or just relaxing at home to avoid the crowds. Like I said, I think it just takes a conscious effort to actually plan something fun every other weekend, or plan for a weekday off every few weeks to do something fun. I agree that having kids, at least within a certain age range, helps with being motivated to get out and do things.

[surveyor]

Have you priced what it will cost you to have those kid(s) on the county ski team?

[ArchibaldGraham]

Can I ask a side question? A daytime only nanny for five days a week is $85,000 for one 8 month old child? My niece with a bachelors in education in K-4 is paid $24,000 a year at a daycare center in a standard suburban area with a ratio 1 provider to 4 infants under one and higher ratios after one. I understand there is a lot of variation in earnings in any job, just didn't realize it was so significant here.

Assuming your niece is working full-time, $24k per year is borderline below minimum wage in many places these days. She could potentially make a lot more money as a nanny - especially if she can articulate the value of her experience and education well and position herself as a true professional.

Our nanny doesn't make $85k, but she is closer to making 85k than she is to making $24k.

[BostonBruins]

It’s late so unable to read through this entire thread but I have lived in Estes Park for a little over a year now so feel free to ping any specific questions you may have.

[StewedCarrot]

We've been down this very same path and learned some valuable lessons. A place in the CO mountains was our dream for a long time and we finally made it happen shortly after our first kid. After our second kid arrived, we moved out of state to be closer to family and raise kids in a different environment.

-Waking up in the mountains and being immersed in daily/seasonal cycles other than the I-70 weekend grind is amazing and there really is a big difference in living there vs doing the weekend warrior thing and I treasured all the out-the-door access we had.

-Child care is extremely hard to come by, schools are hit and miss, medical care can be amazing (e.g. orthopedics in Vail) or hours away.

-Living in a tourist town is a drag and you'll start to resent everyone that comes up from the front range or out of state and clogs up grocery store parking lots, makes a mess of downtown, finds "your" campsite/powder stash/honey hole, etc.

-Industries in the Mountain West are primarily extractive (recreation, mining, lumber, ranching, water). Everyone is there to take or experience something that's in short supply and the scarcity mentality leads to strange distortions (real estate prices, fights over land access, etc)

-Every conversation with a local you meet starts with a competition of who has lived there longest.

-The wealth inequalities are astounding. The main socioeconomic groups are poor rural communities, minimum wage ski bums and service industries, and independently wealthy part time residents. Very few jobs actually in a mountain town provide enough enough income for people to afford a single family home there and it undermines any sense of real community.

-Everything is more expensive than it should be and harder to get service. For example, there was only 1 water well company in Steamboat and when we had issues with our well he was booked out for months.

-We found the kids who grew up in mountains were often not well adjusted to life outside their bubble and there were many examples of what we did not want our kids to turn into.

+1 on Hayduke’s post.

I grew up in a mountain town. The inequality and lack of opportunity in remote places is corrosive. I’d enjoy it as a young adult, but I’d never raise my kids there.

The scarcity mentality comment is insightful too.

[Valuethinker]

My main concern would be that the lifestyle is very different than what you’re used to, and not necessarily in ways that you’re going to like. I would rent for a year, before plunking down a bunch of money on a change that will be expensive to undo if you don’t like it.

This also strikes me as very good advice.

Yes.

And confirming broadband speeds.

All the plans to WFH in the world fail on unreliable or insufficient broadband.

My spouse manages people globally and whilst some places have great broadband speeds, others, some in North America or rural Britain, most assuredly do not.

(Other factors: availability of healthcare, which can be sparse in rural areas. Schools. Need for an international airport.

I had a friend. He used his light plane to commute from a Colorado mountain town. Flying over mountains is a tricky business. One day he flew into the mountain side. Wishing you blessings, Greg, wherever your soul is now).

[Valuethinker]

We want and plan to move from a major metro area in Colorado to a mountain town. Spouse and I both work remote jobs with a combined HHI ~290k. We have a 8 month old infant and may or may not try for another. We are mid-30s.

That age, you may need specialised medical care - to get pregnant and with a greater risk of complications. Don't ignore healthcare in assessing your choices. Small towns don't have great healthcare choices, usually.

Rent for a year before buying would be my suggestion.

[Valuethinker]

We've been down this very same path and learned some valuable lessons. A place in the CO mountains was our dream for a long time and we finally made it happen shortly after our first kid. After our second kid arrived, we moved out of state to be closer to family and raise kids in a different environment.

-Waking up in the mountains and being immersed in daily/seasonal cycles other than the I-70 weekend grind is amazing and there really is a big difference in living there vs doing the weekend warrior thing and I treasured all the out-the-door access we had.

-Child care is extremely hard to come by, schools are hit and miss, medical care can be amazing (e.g. orthopedics in Vail) or hours away.

-Living in a tourist town is a drag and you'll start to resent everyone that comes up from the front range or out of state and clogs up grocery store parking lots, makes a mess of downtown, finds "your" campsite/powder stash/honey hole, etc.

-Industries in the Mountain West are primarily extractive (recreation, mining, lumber, ranching, water). Everyone is there to take or experience something that's in short supply and the scarcity mentality leads to strange distortions (real estate prices, fights over land access, etc)

-Every conversation with a local you meet starts with a competition of who has lived there longest.

-The wealth inequalities are astounding. The main socioeconomic groups are poor rural communities, minimum wage ski bums and service industries, and independently wealthy part time residents. Very few jobs actually in a mountain town provide enough enough income for people to afford a single family home there and it undermines any sense of real community.

-Everything is more expensive than it should be and harder to get service. For example, there was only 1 water well company in Steamboat and when we had issues with our well he was booked out for months.

-We found the kids who grew up in mountains were often not well adjusted to life outside their bubble and there were many examples of what we did not want our kids to turn into.

+1 on Hayduke’s post.

I grew up in a mountain town. The inequality and lack of opportunity in remote places is corrosive. I’d enjoy it as a young adult, but I’d never raise my kids there.

The scarcity mentality comment is insightful too.

Re scarcity. And there's real scarcity, too, around water rights?

In Colorado, the water law which prevails is "the doctrine of prior use" as I understand the situation. Thus all river water is essentially pre-claimed on a "use it or lose it" basis. That includes your runoff (illegal to just put in a tank to store runoff)--again in my understanding.

There is groundwater. Again as I understand the situation the law presumes that each reservoir under each property is entirely separate and not interconnected. Which of course is geological nonsense. People keep drilling deeper and deeper, looking for water, as exhaustion creeps in.

I can only speak to small town Ontario but the drug problems there can be as bad as any city high school.

[bikesandbeers]

Lots of good advice here beyond the dollars and cents my in-laws have a place in the mountains and a condo in the city. the city is close not just to medical appointments, but grandkids, longtime friends, art/concerts etc.

One thing I haven’t seen raised is homeowners/fire insurance. Here in CA many companies are dropping homeowners or doubling the rates if you are in a fire risk zone. There was thread on here about insurance detailing a home purchase in Florida. Make sure to ask your real actor about insurability

[Info_Hound]

Living the mountain life is a dream for many, until you can't.

I personally know several families that went all in (bought or built a home - major money sunk), moved in only to discover they physically couldn't live at that altitude. Altitude sickness is real (and can be life threatening) and if you have not lived at altitude for awhile/recently it becomes the unknown deal breaker to carefully laid plans. It can affect anyone, no matter their fitness level or age.

I echo others, rent for at least a year before buying. It's a good plan for being able to undo things if needed.

[vitaflo]

We've been down this very same path and learned some valuable lessons. A place in the CO mountains was our dream for a long time and we finally made it happen shortly after our first kid. After our second kid arrived, we moved out of state to be closer to family and raise kids in a different environment.

-Waking up in the mountains and being immersed in daily/seasonal cycles other than the I-70 weekend grind is amazing and there really is a big difference in living there vs doing the weekend warrior thing and I treasured all the out-the-door access we had.

-Child care is extremely hard to come by, schools are hit and miss, medical care can be amazing (e.g. orthopedics in Vail) or hours away.

-Living in a tourist town is a drag and you'll start to resent everyone that comes up from the front range or out of state and clogs up grocery store parking lots, makes a mess of downtown, finds "your" campsite/powder stash/honey hole, etc.

-Industries in the Mountain West are primarily extractive (recreation, mining, lumber, ranching, water). Everyone is there to take or experience something that's in short supply and the scarcity mentality leads to strange distortions (real estate prices, fights over land access, etc)

-Every conversation with a local you meet starts with a competition of who has lived there longest.

-The wealth inequalities are astounding. The main socioeconomic groups are poor rural communities, minimum wage ski bums and service industries, and independently wealthy part time residents. Very few jobs actually in a mountain town provide enough enough income for people to afford a single family home there and it undermines any sense of real community.

-Everything is more expensive than it should be and harder to get service. For example, there was only 1 water well company in Steamboat and when we had issues with our well he was booked out for months.

-We found the kids who grew up in mountains were often not well adjusted to life outside their bubble and there were many examples of what we did not want our kids to turn into.

I've lived in a couple small towns that are tourist traps (including being raised in one) and everything written here is extremely accurate, this doesn't just apply to ski resort mountain towns. One thing I'll also add (that was somewhat implied in other posts above), but there is a big difference between visiting these towns and living in them. Day to day life isn't what you may dream it is. Seen way too many people move in and leave within a year because it wasn't what they expected it to be (too small, too seasonal, lack of services, weather, etc).

I would also say that you will want to be an active participant in these communities or you will always be considered an outsider to any locals. It takes a lot to run a tourist town and people moving in with money and doing nothing but consuming services doesn't help.