should daughter negotiate first job offer?

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gips
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should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by gips »

Hi,

my d , a recent college graduate received a job offer today for ~50k at a non-profit. She doesn't have competing job offers on the table. the benefits are great and the vacation time is stupidly great. My sense is they really want her, she has a high gpa from a top school and interviews well. however, without a competing job offer, I'm thinking she should accept the offer without any negotiation.

thoughts?

best,
123
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by 123 »

If she wants it she should accept it as is. She does not have any bargaining power (like a current job).
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britcoal
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by britcoal »

I, personally, would graciously ask if there is any wiggle room in the salary offered and indicate that you (your daughter) were hoping to start at $50 + $x (Maybe $5k? $10k?). I have never had a job offer rescinded simply for asking if there was room for negotiation. If they say the salary is firm then she has her answer and must decide if $50k is acceptable. If not, there is a good chance they throw a bone. The chance for $5k extra is worth asking IMHO.
SubPar
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by SubPar »

Doesn't sound like she has much in the way of leverage. I would take the offer.

I certainly didn't feel that I was in a position to negotiate without any track record of success in the real world. As an early twenty-something, my ~$48K job offer was more money than I ever earned in my life by, like, a wide margin. I was elated.
Soon2BXProgrammer
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by Soon2BXProgrammer »

always ask... "just trying to understand, is that the best you can do on salary?" and hopefully they will ask what she was thinking... and even if she jsut asks for a few thousand dollars more, and they give it to her.. that is worth a fortune over her life...
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campy2010
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by campy2010 »

Soon2BXProgrammer wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:18 pm always ask... "just trying to understand, is that the best you can do on salary?" and hopefully they will ask what she was thinking... and even if she jsut asks for a few thousand dollars more, and they give it to her.. that is worth a fortune over her life...
This! Women especially should be taught to ask for more rather than accept the offer as written. If nothing else, it is good practice for having what might be perceived as an uncomfortable conversation.
KlangFool
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by KlangFool »

OP,

He/she does not negotiate has to accept whatever is given. It is up to you whether that is acceptable.

My daughter negotiate even when she did not have another offer. She got a better deal.

KlangFool
Last edited by KlangFool on Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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8foot7
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by 8foot7 »

Careful. I sometimes extend offers to folks right out of college with no experience. One polite attempt at a counter is OK, which I’ll always decline. But further attempts, or even one clumsily executed attempt, will cause me to go elsewhere. Know when you have leverage and when you don’t.

And I would certainly not just “ask for more,” woman or not. If that’s the way it is approached, I’m more likely than not going to retract the offer.
amindu
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by amindu »

You can always see if they are willing to do a signing bonus, that's how I negotiated my very first offer out of college, and was a win-win for both parties.
muffins14
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by muffins14 »

She absolutely has to negotiate, this should not even be a debatable topic. There are absolutely less qualified men that will negotiate for the same role. This is a statistical fact.

Ask or you will never receive

Something very polite that shows excitement for the role, knowledge of her market value, and some hint that she would be likely to join at compensation X, for example
Last edited by muffins14 on Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
pasadena
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by pasadena »

Never accept the first offer without at least trying to negotiate. They *expect* you to, and there is never any harm in asking. They also don't need to know that she doesn't have another offer or that she likes the vacation time. It only means that she should be careful in how she does it, not that she shouldn't do it. She has nothing to lose, they won't rescind the offer - at worst they say no.

It's also a good lesson when starting out, especially for a woman, as much as I hate to say it.

Did she give them her compensation expectations during the recruitment process?
Last edited by pasadena on Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Calico
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by Calico »

This is a tough one. I work for a non-profit myself and they, traditionally, don't pay well but try to make up for it in benefits.

Personally, I always ask for more than what is offered. I read once that women don't do this and that's why many are paid less then men, so I started doing it so I wouldn't be one of those women. And it works! Every time I asked, I got paid more. My current job, I shot high and they accepted. I think employers must low ball salaries to see what they can get. I figure the worst they can do is say no and if they really do want her, they aren't going to take the employment offer off the table.

Maybe a compromise, if she's overly cautious about asking for more now, would be for her to ask at an interview what they are looking for from her that will merit future pay increases. It shows she has drive and is willing to work hard they way they need someone too while expressing her interest to eventually be paid more. But she should be prepared to hold them to it and ask in a certain amount of time about a pay raise.
nordsteve
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by nordsteve »

While money is important, for a first job I'd be more concerned about getting the right experiences and having a great manager. Once you have some skills the money discussion becomes easier.
oilrig
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by oilrig »

8foot7 wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:24 pm Careful. I sometimes extend offers to folks right out of college with no experience. One polite attempt at a counter is OK, which I’ll always decline. But further attempts, or even one clumsily executed attempt, will cause me to go elsewhere. Know when you have leverage and when you don’t.

And I would certainly not just “ask for more,” woman or not. If that’s the way it is approached, I’m more likely than not going to retract the offer.
This. Dont negotiate just for the sake of negotiating. Your daughter has zero leverage here as a recent college grad, basically she needs them more than they need her. $50k seems like a reasonable offer at a non-profit, take it.

Now the next time she receives an offer she will have more leverage to negotiate.
MittensMoney
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by MittensMoney »

Ask for $60k citing cost-of-living and accept the original offer if they refuse to increase the salary. It never hurts to ask for more.
ScubaHogg
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by ScubaHogg »

If a single, polite request for a higher salary causes the employer to get angry and withdraw the offer, your daughter doesn’t want to work there anyway. It’ll be just a preview of things to come.
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Former Usher
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by Former Usher »

8foot7 wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:24 pm Careful. I sometimes extend offers to folks right out of college with no experience. One polite attempt at a counter is OK, which I’ll always decline. But further attempts, or even one clumsily executed attempt, will cause me to go elsewhere. Know when you have leverage and when you don’t.

And I would certainly not just “ask for more,” woman or not. If that’s the way it is approached, I’m more likely than not going to retract the offer.
And this is the problem. As a job candidate, you often have no way of knowing how a particular employer or hiring manager will react to a negotiation attempt. Sometimes it's expected that you negotiate, and other times it's offensive. As a new graduate, an attempt to negotiate is quite likely to be "clumsily executed."
tibbitts
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by tibbitts »

britcoal wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:14 pm I, personally, would graciously ask if there is any wiggle room in the salary offered and indicate that you (your daughter) were hoping to start at $50 + $x (Maybe $5k? $10k?). I have never had a job offer rescinded simply for asking if there was room for negotiation. If they say the salary is firm then she has her answer and must decide if $50k is acceptable. If not, there is a good chance they throw a bone. The chance for $5k extra is worth asking IMHO.
I've had an offer rescinded when trying to negotiate. Coincidentally, the offer was for exactly $50k.

There are pros and cons to either approach. If she really wants the job and plans to stay forever, her starting salary might end up compounding for the rest of her life. So a $5k difference now might translate to a $50k difference years down the road. On the other hand, if the offer is withdrawn, she might end up wondering for the rest of her life what might have been if she'd taken that job. Overall I wouldn't want to be the person who suggests she negotiate, but I might be okay with suggesting she not negotiate.
hotscot
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by hotscot »

Take the job and be grateful.
Ask for a 6 month review.
Normchad
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by Normchad »

She can certainly try. But be tactful. And have an actual position for negotiating, dint just go with “I’d like more”. Something along the lines of “comparable roles in the area seem to be around. 55-65. Can you help me close the gap” is much more effective.

But it’s also possible the offer will be rescinded. I don’t typically do that, but…. From the employer side, new college grads for $50k are a dime a dozen. They are hiring potential, and there isn’t any reason to prefer this candidate over a dozen others.

Best of luck to her!

I will say, in my experience, women undervalue their talent and contributions, and do not go far enough in managing their careers and asking for what they want. I encourage her to keep that in mind, and be strategic in the future about standing up for herself, and asking for what she wants.
Impatience
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by Impatience »

She should try, though not firmly. It’s important to get in the habit of it early if only for practice, especially as she’s a she and women have for so long been put at a disadvantage by being less predisposed to negotiate. She has nothing to lose and everything to gain - experience and maybe even some more $.
dbr
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by dbr »

I think politely communicating that one was hoping for a bit higher salary is completely legit and would even be expected. At the same time the chances of getting more are not high.

I would also not feel bad to just take the offer.

If this job is as attractive as it sounds and there is no evidence she is being low balled, then just take it.
Afty
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by Afty »

It seems odd to rescind an offer over an attempt to negotiate. Why not just politely say no? You've already interviewed this person and decided you want them. If you withdraw the offer you're back to square one.
muffins14
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by muffins14 »

I’m surprised to see all the “just take it” suggestions

She has good credentials and interviews well. I think it’s a good habit to negotiate politely, too.

If a future employer rescinds an offer over $5-10k rather than politely declining, that reflects very poorly on such an employer.

I do generally agree that her biggest compensation success will come from doing great in the role and getting promoted or getting a new job in a year’s time, but that’s no reason to just forego negotiations now
stoptothink
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by stoptothink »

Former Usher wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:46 pm
8foot7 wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:24 pm Careful. I sometimes extend offers to folks right out of college with no experience. One polite attempt at a counter is OK, which I’ll always decline. But further attempts, or even one clumsily executed attempt, will cause me to go elsewhere. Know when you have leverage and when you don’t.

And I would certainly not just “ask for more,” woman or not. If that’s the way it is approached, I’m more likely than not going to retract the offer.
And this is the problem. As a job candidate, you often have no way of knowing how a particular employer or hiring manager will react to a negotiation attempt. Sometimes it's expected that you negotiate, and other times it's offensive. As a new graduate, an attempt to negotiate is quite likely to be "clumsily executed."
+1. "Always negotiate" is a good general rule of thumb, with context. It doesn't work with some employers and maybe not with specific hiring managers. Whether you should negotiate depends not only on her options, but theirs' as well. She only knows the answer to one of those. For a first job, if you are generally satisfied with the compensation package, I'd lean towards accepting unless you have other options. I currently work for a large organization where the response to negotiation for lower level employees is generally: "next"...

As an anecdote, a decade ago I had just finished my PhD at a highly respected U and accepted an offer with a non-profit for less than OP's daughter was offered. It was definitely not my first job, but my first one in a new field directly relevant to my PhD. There were other extenuating circumstances, but basically I didn't have other immediate options. Of course today I make 3x that and always negotiate.
HomeStretch
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by HomeStretch »

As it’s your daughter’s first job, if it’s a good offer my suggestion is that she let her comfort level dictate whether or not she negotiates. She can negotiate her next job after she gets some experience and confidence in her business skills.
Californiastate
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by Californiastate »

She has no track record post academia. I wouldn't suggest she start out with a hard line on her first job. Especially since she doesn't have any other offers. She can build up her chops and move on in a year if she's chasing the all mighty dollar.
TheBeanCounter
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by TheBeanCounter »

I actually got offered a job making $50,000 out of college. I liked the people, needed a job, and it was mid-covid, so I accepted without negotiating. I got two $1,000 bonuses throughout the next year and a $5,000 bonus for exceeding expectations. I just recently changed jobs with about a year of experience and told them I wanted $70,000. They gave me what I asked for (and I am still bonus eligible). Health insurance premiums are also about 1/4th of my previous employer, so I ended up increasing my take home pay quite significantly,

I understand what people are saying about women tending to be more agreeable than men, being one factor in lower pay. Being a male, I didn't just naturally start negotiating my first job salary. I assessed my options, the current environment, and went from there. Sure, as my career progresses, I will most likely be more apt to negotiate, but I feel that the first job is definitely a weird position to do that (excluding some really in demand positions).

If she needs the job and is excited about the opportunity, I would not jeopardize it. Although I have limited experience, I have seen firsthand how getting some experience, exceeding expectations and continually improving can lead to an increase in pay down the road. I am sure this could happen for her as well. Hopefully my little anecdote is helpful.
dukeblue219
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by dukeblue219 »

Some of this depends on supply and demand, which we can't assess. Is this the kind of job where she is simply at the top of a massive list of similarly qualified applicants? Or is she in some way desirable to the organization?

It's hard to find good people right now. I don't think many hiring managers are going to pull an offer entirely if they're having even a slightly hard time filling the role. However, if they can just call the next person on the list and get the same generic skill set...
Normchad
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by Normchad »

Afty wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 5:05 pm It seems odd to rescind an offer over an attempt to negotiate. Why not just politely say no? You've already interviewed this person and decided you want them. If you withdraw the offer you're back to square one.
As an employer, a lot can happen. Sometimes we agree to make an offer to a candidate that we aren’t crazy about. Or we are on the fence, and decide to take a chance. Remember, we don’t spend a ton of time interviewing any single candidate, so the depth of what we can learn about them in term of cultural fit and communications is limited.

Then after the offer is made, a lot of back and forth communication happens. If in this communication, we catch a “bad vibe”, we might pull the offer. Personally, I don’t do that. But I understand why it can happen.

A lot of young folk aren’t well equipped to communicate with the old people in business. I do everything via email. But I’ve had several candidates who only check their email every 3 days or every week. They are just accustomed to communicating differently.

So,if I make you an offer, and I don’t hear back for an entire week,and then the only thingI hear is “I want more money”, then I might move on to the next candidate. They sound disinterested, and communicate poorly. Do,I really want to work with somebody like that?

If instead,I hear back on the first or second day with some thoughtful follow up questions, that really says something positive about that person. And if they want to discus compensation, and come armed with facts, I’m all for having that talk.

As with everything, communication and relationship building is hugely important, and yet, completely ignored by most people.

And one last thing unrelated to this specific case. Kids like to,put there GitHub on their resume. I will look through your GitHub. If you don’t have something great in there, you are in trouble. If you graduated six months ago, and your last commit was nine months ago, you are in big trouble.
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by boogiehead »

Californiastate wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 5:40 pm She has no track record post academia. I wouldn't suggest she start out with a hard line on her first job. Especially since she doesn't have any other offers. She can build up her chops and move on in a year if she's chasing the all mighty dollar.
+1 … If it’s a fair offer and her only offer and she never had any corporate experience, not sure if it’s worth the risk of getting the offer rescinded even if the probability is very low. When you are negotiating you need gauge your leverage as well.
psteinx
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by psteinx »

The downside of asking for more is its a potential signal to the employer that the kid will be difficult to deal with, or is reluctant to take the position and may quit in 6 months or a year for something better.

The upside of asking for more is that you may get more.

It's a balancing act. There is no always right or always wrong answer. Context matters. That said, as others have suggested, a fresh college grad is particularly poorly positioned to evaluate context and to signal the request for a raise gracefully (to minimize the dangers of burning bridges.) So, unless there are other contextual clues that a raise (or other perk, such as signing bonus) would be considered, and/or research suggests higher norms, then given lack of a plan B by OP's kid, I'd be reluctant to try to negotiate this much, if at all.
psteinx
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by psteinx »

BTW: I would be particularly cautious about advice along the lines of "women get bad deals because they don't negotiate." Perhaps that is true, but that doesn't say much about THIS offer and THIS employer, and if daughter starts nurturing resentment from the get go, that's probably not a good thing for job/income/life satisfaction.
KlangFool
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by KlangFool »

Former Usher wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:46 pm
8foot7 wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:24 pm Careful. I sometimes extend offers to folks right out of college with no experience. One polite attempt at a counter is OK, which I’ll always decline. But further attempts, or even one clumsily executed attempt, will cause me to go elsewhere. Know when you have leverage and when you don’t.

And I would certainly not just “ask for more,” woman or not. If that’s the way it is approached, I’m more likely than not going to retract the offer.
And this is the problem. As a job candidate, you often have no way of knowing how a particular employer or hiring manager will react to a negotiation attempt. Sometimes it's expected that you negotiate, and other times it's offensive. As a new graduate, an attempt to negotiate is quite likely to be "clumsily executed."
And, why is this a bad thing? Through the process, you may learn that you do not want to work for this employer anyhow. It is a two ways street. It is a good test to find out whether this employer really want you.

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Last edited by KlangFool on Tue Sep 14, 2021 6:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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DoctorPhysics
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by DoctorPhysics »

I negotiated my first job offer out of school for a slightly higher base. It was done graciously. I ended up getting a bit more than I asked on the equity side instead of the base increase.

There’s an opportunity to build on a skill that doesn’t come around often. She already has the no if she doesn’t try.
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Watty
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by Watty »

What is her major and what the local cost of living?

That is also a big factor and I did not see that.
gips wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:08 pm my d , a recent college graduate
When did she graduate?

If she graduated in May and this is the first job offer then it might be good to bite the bullet and take the job just to get some experience. If she graduated in May then her resume will be getting stale so there is a lot to be said for taking any halfway decent job offer.

How are her classmates that just graduated doing in their job searches?

If she wants to ask for more then she should also have a reason to be able to justify a higher salary and not just ask for more. Does she have statistics that would support a higher salary? When looking at averages she also needs to remember that half the people make less than average.

One compromise would be to ask if she could have a salary review in six months if she would normally wait a year for her first salary review.
PowderDay9
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by PowderDay9 »

In most cases you should not negotiate for entry-level jobs. I've seen companies that have countered with a higher starting salary when an entry-level candidate has multiple offers. I've also seen the same companies give lower raises to those same candidates so that within a few years they're at a similar compensation level as their peers.

The experience gained and networking at your first job are much more important than whether you make $50k or $55k the first year.
Last edited by PowderDay9 on Tue Sep 14, 2021 6:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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celia
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by celia »

There’s more to a job offer than just salary. In this case, the better benefits and time off may be meant to make up for lower perceived pay.

But the on-the-job experiences may be worth more than the salary. Many non-profits have you do things that would be outside your job description if this position was in a megacorp. If there is some community contact involved, that in itself may lead to a later position in the future. This will be a better route to learn networking which usually comes in handy later on.
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gips
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by gips »

thank you for all the thoughtful replies! obviously the decision will be hers, she's leaning towards trying to negotiate a moving expense budget. She'll be moving to nyc and will need first month rent + sec deposit + moving expenses + furnishings and feels more comfortable with substantiating this position than additional salary. I will say this, she is not shy or nervous about asking...

will write an epilogue later in the week when it's done.

thanks again!
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Watty
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by Watty »

gips wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 7:04 pm She'll be moving to nyc....
Whoa, Nelly.

I have never lived in NYC but will she even be able to afford to live on $50K a year there?
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by Dottie57 »

SubPar wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:17 pm Doesn't sound like she has much in the way of leverage. I would take the offer.

I certainly didn't feel that I was in a position to negotiate without any track record of success in the real world. As an early twenty-something, my ~$48K job offer was more money than I ever earned in my life by, like, a wide margin. I was elated.
This. First job -don’t try negotiating.
psteinx
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by psteinx »

Watty wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 7:08 pm
gips wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 7:04 pm She'll be moving to nyc....
Whoa, Nelly.

I have never lived in NYC but will she even be able to afford to live on $50K a year there?
Presumably she would live a lifestyle closer to that of a college kid than a working person.

i.e. Multiple folks sharing an apartment. Probably no car. Modest vacations. Living cheaply in general...
stoptothink
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by stoptothink »

Watty wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 7:08 pm
gips wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 7:04 pm She'll be moving to nyc....
Whoa, Nelly.

I have never lived in NYC but will she even be able to afford to live on $50K a year there?
My sister lived in NYC for a decade (moved to Salt Lake City 3yrs ago) and never made $50k. Certainly adds another wrinkle to the the discussion, but there are plenty of young single people in NYC doing just fine on less. If OP's daughter is purposely relocating to NYC for a $50k/yr job, I would assume there are non-work related reasons they want to be in NYC.
killjoy2012
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by killjoy2012 »

Frist job out of college, no other offers in hand, no current job to be lured away from? Now has a job offer at a place she likes that is an attractive offer? I would take the generous offer!

Negotiating job offers is fine, but you need to do it from a position of power, where you have leverage over the company trying to lure you away. That's not this situation IMO. If you push too hard, or against the wrong hiring manager, could surely sour the offer. I'd be careful as a first job out of college scenario... playing coy. Just my opinion.
stan1
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by stan1 »

gips wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 7:04 pm thank you for all the thoughtful replies! obviously the decision will be hers, she's leaning towards trying to negotiate a moving expense budget. She'll be moving to nyc and will need first month rent + sec deposit + moving expenses + furnishings and feels more comfortable with substantiating this position than additional salary. I will say this, she is not shy or nervous about asking...

will write an epilogue later in the week when it's done.

thanks again!
Sounds like fun and what a great place to start out after college! I hope you encourage her, and if financially able to do so, chip in a little bit to help with the rent (which I believe is pretty common for recent college grads living in NYC who do not have hedge fund or FAANG jobs).

The job and the experience both at the non-profit and in NYC in general should be amazing!
bluebolt
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by bluebolt »

Dottie57 wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 7:11 pm
SubPar wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:17 pm Doesn't sound like she has much in the way of leverage. I would take the offer.

I certainly didn't feel that I was in a position to negotiate without any track record of success in the real world. As an early twenty-something, my ~$48K job offer was more money than I ever earned in my life by, like, a wide margin. I was elated.
This. First job -don’t try negotiating.
I increased the base of my first job out of college by more than 10% by politely asking if there was any flexibility in the comp. As others have said, it would be surprising if a polite ask would cause a rejection of the offer.

That said, it is possible and if she is prepared for the possibility of losing the offer over that, that's a good negotiating lesson.

Politely asking if there's flexibility is a lot different than a candidate coming in and asking for comp 10%, 20%, or 30% above what was offered. Those folks I would politely say that this isn't the role for them.
Carguy85
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by Carguy85 »

Who has more leverage? How desperate is the company? How specialized is her training? Why does she think she should be paid more? Why should the company want to pay her more? How exceptional are her skills currently? A foot in the door and real world experience are pretty valuable as is the confidence that follows.
muffins14
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by muffins14 »

stan1 wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 7:35 pm
The job and the experience both at the non-profit and in NYC in general should be amazing!
+1

It’s a great place to kickstart a career and build a network, both personal and professional
tomsense76
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by tomsense76 »

I don't see why not.

It's good experience for her to try and negotiate. While others have stated this may be clumsily executed (and that could be the case), the way one gets better is by practicing.

Also this salary sets the starting point from which later raises, job offers, etc. build from. It's better to have this higher than lower.

I think one that is missing from this discussion though is where location-wise this employer is. For example $50k in DC is not much. Maybe ok for starting, but a bit more could really help. Alternatively if this is somewhere else, maybe $50k is a lot. So COL is an important factor. A good exercise for her is to look at the cost of renting (especially if this involves moving) and compare COL between where she lives and the place where this job is (assuming a move is involved). This would help in her negotiations.

Edit: Missed this is in NYC. Anyways would compare that to home or college. Wherever those were.
"Anyone who claims to understand quantum theory is either lying or crazy" -- Richard Feynman
tibbitts
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Re: should daughter negotiate first job offer?

Post by tibbitts »

tomsense76 wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 9:29 pm I don't see why not.

It's good experience for her to try and negotiate. While others have stated this may be clumsily executed (and that could be the case), the way one gets better is by practicing.

Also this salary sets the starting point from which later raises, job offers, etc. build from. It's better to have this higher than lower.

I think one that is missing from this discussion though is where location-wise this employer is. For example $50k in DC is not much. Maybe ok for starting, but a bit more could really help. Alternatively if this is somewhere else, maybe $50k is a lot. So COL is an important factor. A good exercise for her is to look at the cost of renting (especially if this involves moving) and compare COL between where she lives and the place where this job is (assuming a move is involved). This would help in her negotiations.

Edit: Missed this is in NYC. Anyways would compare that to home or college. Wherever those were.
It really depends on how she feels about the job. I negotiated my $50k offer because I was okay with not getting that job. I've also applied for a job that I've known at the time was an opportunity I wanted and would never be available to me again. I took that job and didn't attempt to negotiate. And just as I predicted, a similar opportunity never came along again.

At another job I definitely encountered the effect of the initial salary being my base forever. I did attempt to negotiate for that position, but the employer wouldn't budge. So I took it knowing I'd probably move on within a fairly short time. And I did.
Last edited by tibbitts on Tue Sep 14, 2021 9:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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