Breaking "Poor" Mentality

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Topic Author
broncocountry25
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Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by broncocountry25 »

Happy Saturday!

Any other Bogleheads grow up poor or seeing family really struggle? My mom worked three jobs and parents divorced when I was 4. When I was young I have a ton of negative memories about money. It was a source of constant stress in my families life.

Now that I have money at 31 I am actively working on becoming better at spending. I do not wish to be frugal my whole life.

What have others done to help them spend more along the journey and not over think it?

I love saving/investing and building in life but I also know we are going to be just fine down the road (already millionaires and good chance of inheritance from my wife's side later in life). I want to get better at spending some more now, what has helped others?

I have a hard time spending directly on myself, not so hard spending to take my family/friends to dinner, or pay to take a trip etc. I just need to get better on spending a bit more on myself and am working on it.

Thank You! :sharebeer
Californiastate
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by Californiastate »

You don't need to learn to spend yourself to happiness. I don't see a problem unless you're living like the Unabomber.
ZMonet
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by ZMonet »

I get your concern. I grew up with a fear of being poor and it has been a struggle to let go of the saver mentality. What helped me was getting to a number that was a combination of time, consistently saving a set amount and raising it each year, and reaching an asset number that is enough to know that my family could live a relatively good baseline life should something like job loss, etc. occurs. Money is a tool and so I do see a problem if you (or I) are not using it to make ourselves (and our families) happy.
fortunefavored
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by fortunefavored »

I got married to someone who enjoys spending money (although not extravagantly.) Having grown up with immigrant parents eating government cheese, I would probably spend 75% less if I wasn't married. I don't believe I ever went on a vacation until I met my future spouse.

Probably not helpful, but that's what did it for me!

(I still wear shoes for 20+ years though. :)
KlangFool
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by KlangFool »

broncocountry25 wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 1:14 pm
Now that I have money at 31 I am actively working on becoming better at spending. I do not wish to be frugal my whole life.
broncocountry25,

You believe that you are frugal. But, are you really OBJECTIVELY frugal? What makes you believe that you are frugal?

I save 1 year of expense every year. I spend 50K to 60K per year. I am not frugal. The US median household income is about 50K to 60K per year. I spend as much as the US median household income.

Or, if you believe that as long as you save 5% of your income aka save much more than the average American, you are frugal.

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PersonalFinanceJam
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by PersonalFinanceJam »

I grew up poor but didn’t really know it because when there was any extra it was saved. Any purchase which was not a necessity was scrutinized because of the question “what if you need that money some day?”. That way when the rainy days came, my parents were covered.

My wife and I have savings targets. An agreed upon percentage of each pay check which goes to our savings goals. We also each pay an agreed upon amount to our shared expenses. Whatever is left over is left for us to spend how we wish. In order to combat the save at all cost mentality I was raised with, I ask myself if I’m depriving myself of something I really want which will improve my life or make me happier. My advice is to spend your excess money on the things which make you happy, make sure you aren’t depriving yourself of happiness you can afford. If you are not spending your excess then are you depriving yourself or is there just nothing (at the moment) you want to spend on?
JBTX
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by JBTX »

You don't give a lot of specifics. You say you don't want to be frugal. Frugal is relative, and is also a mindset. You don't have to be penny pinchers your entire life but you do have to prioritize.

Sounds like you need to set goals, and a plan. Do you want to retire early, or is it more important to spend money now (on what?) and work to a later retirement age?
senex
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by senex »

Californiastate wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 1:43 pm You don't need to learn to spend yourself to happiness. I don't see a problem unless you're living like the Unabomber.
+1

Especially if you’re comfortable spending on others.

https://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2012/09 ... -question/
boogiehead
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by boogiehead »

Californiastate wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 1:43 pm You don't need to learn to spend yourself to happiness. I don't see a problem unless you're living like the Unabomber.
+1… don’t really see a problem unless you are neglecting your basic needs… just ask Warren Buffet who I believe still drives like a Lincoln and eats at McDs. In fact I would say this more of a “rich mentality”.
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celia
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by celia »

Why not give your mom (or other relative, if she has died) some monthly money that she can now depend on? That should ease your concerns as well as hers.

She was most likely setting you up to have a better life than she had.

And now you have it!
Last edited by celia on Sat Aug 28, 2021 2:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
docco
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by docco »

broncocountry25 wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 1:14 pm What have others done to help them spend more along the journey and not over think it?
...

I want to get better at spending some more now, what has helped others?
If you find yourself continuing measuring your relative success by how much you are able to spend, I think you're indirectly still letting money control how you feel about your relationship to money. Money is meant to be a tool and resource, and nothing more. I would encourage you not to measure yourself by how frugal or not you are, but rather try to find satisfaction by focusing on other areas such as your relationships, hobbies/pursuits, health, etc. As you find varying levels of success in these areas of your life, you may find that your relationship with money is just one aspect of those many things.
sailaway
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by sailaway »

The poor mentality is generally anti-frugal. You can't stock up because you can't buy in bulk, even if it is a great sale. You might as well spend this money while you have it, because it is just going to disappear somewhere, anyway. ...

Not sure why anyone would set not being frugal as a goal. Even billionaires will usually negotiate the best price for the thing that they want.
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JPH
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by JPH »

Sometimes I enjoy spending money, and sometimes I enjoy not spending money. If the spending hurts a little, then the outcome is enjoyed just a little more.
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Da5id
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by Da5id »

broncocountry25 wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 1:14 pm I love saving/investing and building in life but I also know we are going to be just fine down the road (already millionaires and good chance of inheritance from my wife's side later in life). I want to get better at spending some more now, what has helped others?

I have a hard time spending directly on myself, not so hard spending to take my family/friends to dinner, or pay to take a trip etc. I just need to get better on spending a bit more on myself and am working on it.
Stuff doesn't generally make you happier, so you seem OK as is to me :) Spending on experiences (vacations, dinners with friends, etc) seems like a better bet. That said, if you want to let yourself spend more you could budget for it and persuade yourself that the budget amount really is available for whatever whim comes your way, or to get an upgraded version of something you need. I've never felt the urge to push myself to spend though.
Topic Author
broncocountry25
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by broncocountry25 »

Thank you for all the quick responses!

Good points on everything being relative. When I say frugal it is not the same as the median in U.S. that is for sure. I don't think there is much "average" about the this forum though...

We have saved 6 figures a year for the last 5 years or so and continually increase our income and have a good long term plan.

I guess I was just hoping for some tips from those who are more comfortable on the forum buying things for themselves. I feel I have a healthy balance with money other then when it comes time to buy something for me.

I do like the idea of helping family out more. I actually took student loans in college and worked about 30 hours a week. I would send these paychecks back to my mom and made a plan to get her out of credit card debt. Unfortunately at that point life had gotten the best of her and she turned heavy to alcohol. So that was a real learning lesson and really hard for me. We were going to have her debt free in roughly 18 months and instead she ended up going to rehab and still has debt. Mentally she is in a great place now but I just do not like mixing family and money. I have given many family members money advice and help over the years and learned people are going to ultimately do whatever they want.

I have thought lately that getting an Airbnb for everyone who can make it in (Colorado) would be a great way to get family together for some time without feeling any money obligations.

This question though was selfishly geared towards me and how to get over feeling that spending on any wants I have is bad.
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David Jay
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by David Jay »

broncocountry25 wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 2:47 pmI guess I was just hoping for some tips from those who are more comfortable on the forum buying things for themselves. I feel I have a healthy balance with money other then when it comes time to buy something for me.
I find a budget really helps. By setting a budget for various items (eating out, vacations, clothes, vehicles, etc.) you are actually giving yourself permission to spend the budgeted amount.

This really helped us with eating out. After the kids were gone, we had the income to eat out but not the habit. We actually used the "envelope" method, I put $X in a physical envelope every pay period. When the envelope started getting "thick", I would remind my wife that it was her responsibility to spend that money instead of cooking.
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KlangFool
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by KlangFool »

broncocountry25 wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 2:47 pm
We have saved 6 figures a year for the last 5 years or so and continually increase our income and have a good long term plan.
broncocountry25,

And, you probably spend 6 figures per year too. So, why do you think that you have a spending problem?

In fact, the REAL PROBLEM is why do you have to think about MONEY at all? Money is just a tool to achieve your life goal. It is not an end goal by itself.

It is very simple.

Save as much as you spend. Then, prioritize spending on your real want and need.

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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by namajones »

broncocountry25 wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 1:14 pm I do not wish to be frugal my whole life.
Why not? Things can't buy happiness. Happiness comes from human connection.

Frugality is a virtue. If your family taught you that, you should be thankful. So many people suffer under the illusion that more stuff will buy them happiness. It's downright sad.
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LilyFleur
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by LilyFleur »

namajones wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 3:00 pm
broncocountry25 wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 1:14 pm I do not wish to be frugal my whole life.
Why not? Things can't buy happiness. Happiness comes from human connection.

Frugality is a virtue. If your family taught you that, you should be thankful. So many people suffer under the illusion that more stuff will buy them happiness. It's downright sad.
Even frugal people do hobbies. And hobbies can cost a bit of money.

I used to garden. It did make me happy. It was meditative and relaxing.

Now I paint. It does the same things for me that gardening did. There is a lot of research about creating art and people's happiness.

A hobby is different than hoarding "stuff." It is experiential.
Robin1234
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by Robin1234 »

You may like this talk from Boglehead speaker series about money and our relation to it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OztmXoMPjjQ&t=1745s
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by Minty »

I also grew up very poor for the United States (not that I am competing with anyone else) but now am modestly comfortable. I still look for discounts, use cash-back credit cards, do my own minor household and car maintenance, drive a 25-year-old vehicle, and generally treat engaging in some measure of frugality as a hobby. (A decade or more ago, I really enjoyed credit card arbitrage.) On the other hand, based in part on Boglehead wisdom, for my spouse and children, I buy new cars or late-model former rental cars for cash or 0% financing, because they are good values, considering safety and long-term cost of ownership. I have come to believe that sometimes, you have to spend money to make money. For the same reason, I cheerfully spend what I need to for good suits for work.

When it comes to spending on myself, it was hard for some years, but in my late 50s, I am more comfortable because I conceptualize it as investing in myself. For example, I have a perfectly satisfactory work situation, but I thought I would be happier changing up my mix of duties slightly. I am in the middle of spending $20-30K out of pocket to sharpen certain skills and make certain connections. At one time that would have been nearly impossible psychologically for me. But I have come to view expenditures such as that as reasonable and appropriate if it allows me to work another 12 years instead of 2 or 4, or even to have those 2-4 years be more pleasant and less taxing. A miserable person is less likely to get a raise or promoted; overworked people do drop dead, and to collect on one's life insurance is not part of the plan. This is just how I think about it; I am interested in other's views. Good luck!
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by tennisplyr »

I have the same issue, for me rather than being resistant to getting something based on price, now if I want something, typically I just do it. Eg, DW wanted some new ceiling fans that I didn’t want, I just said let’s do it. For me, to some extent, just piling up more money seems like a waste. So for me, I’m indulging more than I used to.
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lws
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by lws »

Grew up dirt poor but never had a "poor" mentality.
Do not think my frugality is related to with poverty.
Could be wrong.
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by Fallible »

Delete repeat.
Last edited by Fallible on Sat Aug 28, 2021 7:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Carousel
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by Carousel »

I like someone else's advice to set yourself a spending budget. Try it for a year or two and see how it feels.
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Fallible
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by Fallible »

broncocountry25 wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 1:14 pm ...
I have a hard time spending directly on myself, not so hard spending to take my family/friends to dinner, or pay to take a trip etc. I just need to get better on spending a bit more on myself and am working on it. ...
What do you want to spend on yourself? Is there something you want that you won’t spend money on? Can you provide an example(s)?
"Yes, investing is simple. But it is not easy, for it requires discipline, patience, steadfastness, and that most uncommon of all gifts, common sense." ~Jack Bogle
ThankYouJack
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by ThankYouJack »

I'm following as I can relate somewhat to the OP.

Some people have a scarcity mindset when it comes to money (often from childhood), while others have an abundance mindset. Not sure how one can have a paradigm shift to abundance, even when they have 7 figures in their early 30's.

OP, would it help having defined goals for savings (and spending)? Like I'm going to save $X per year towards retirement and spend the rest because I don't want to die as the wealthiest in the graveyard?
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by 2pedals »

I didn't grow up poor but my mother did and my father lived through the great depression in very poor conditions in a city environment when they were young. Both had to give up earnings for the family before they were adults. I learned how to live without based on what my parents did and taught me. All my clothes were passed down from my older brothers and they were badly worn and stained. They rarely spent money on toys for the boys when I was growing up but I did live in a good environment but they did save money for the more important things, such as living in a decent neighborhood and getting a college education. For this reason, I have a difficult time buying things that could make my life more "convenient and/or sexy". It is part of who I am now and I don't think I could change without great stress even though I know I have more than enough. So I just live with it and try to relax more and more as I get older.
PowderDay9
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by PowderDay9 »

Read "Die with Zero" by Bill Perkins.

It's a good book for those that are very frugal and may be passing up experiences they should be buying.
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by tomsense76 »

Maybe it's not about spending more, but stressing less over spending?

It's worth noting that after a certain amount of income. More doesn't necessarily lead to happiness. Certainly not covering the basics is stressful, but it sounds like you are well past that. After that I think life starts becoming about other things like personal fulfillment, happiness, spending time with those you care about, etc.

Spending on others or just giving to others (as you have identified) does help improve happiness. Am a big fan of Laurie Santos' work in this area. This article gives a pretty good overview on her thoughts on happiness. She does a podcast called The Happiness Lab, which is great too.
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Ed 2
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by Ed 2 »

I am first immigrant generation in my family. We came to this Country when I was 24 with nothing. Country’s I am from lifestyle and levels of living way lower than here, poor people over here are the rich in my motherland)) . For our family immigration was equal as a moon landing if you know what I mean. So I am 51 now and all my life I worked and lived like I am going to loose my job at any moment and only this way I survived and become “ next door millionaire “ . I never regretted that I lived frugal way, I actually glad that am doing same constant dime pinching anyway I can because I have a goal to retire in at least 3-4 years from my job . So, I can’t give you a perfect recipe to be not frugal unless you expect to get some kind of multi million inheritance. There is no other way if you ask me.
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by jaqenhghar »

I can't say whether this'll answer your question, but I've realized something similar about myself recently.

Last month was Restaurant Week in our city. SO wanted to go to a fancy steak house, and I mentally calculated it'd be 50 x 2 + tax/tip, so we'd be looking at close to $150 or so for a meal that I'd have to get dressed up for, put on makeup, etc. He could tell I wasn't a fan of the idea, so we ended up not going.

I hate spending money on food that I don't enjoy or am not comfortable in the environment. I do, however, love all the comforts of "cheap" food, so I've intentionally tried to increase the amount of food we get when we eat out.

Example: at Costco now, anytime we're thinking about getting a whole pizza, I automatically always order 2. We love their pizzas, and I only recently discovered how much I love their cheese pizza. It'll cost $20, last us 4-5 days of meals, and I love eating it in the comfort of our own home.

Another example: our favorite burger chain had a "buy one meal, get a burger" free coupon last week. Typically, we'd get one meal (which would come with large fries and a large drink) & using the coupon, we'd get the free burger. Portion sizes at this place are huge, so we could split everything and still leave stuffed. This time around, though, we each got an individual meal for dinner, and split the free burger as a midnight snack when we got home.
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by ThankYouJack »

mahtoji wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 3:42 pm You may like this talk from Boglehead speaker series about money and our relation to it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OztmXoMPjjQ&t=1745s
I like that very simple approach...put a set amount that you want to spend in your checking account at the beginning of the year. Anything you have left over at the end of the year, give it to charity.
namajones
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by namajones »

LilyFleur wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 3:03 pm
namajones wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 3:00 pm
broncocountry25 wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 1:14 pm I do not wish to be frugal my whole life.
Why not? Things can't buy happiness. Happiness comes from human connection.

Frugality is a virtue. If your family taught you that, you should be thankful. So many people suffer under the illusion that more stuff will buy them happiness. It's downright sad.
Even frugal people do hobbies. And hobbies can cost a bit of money.

I used to garden. It did make me happy. It was meditative and relaxing.

Now I paint. It does the same things for me that gardening did. There is a lot of research about creating art and people's happiness.

A hobby is different than hoarding "stuff." It is experiential.
Absolutely. There's a big difference between buying "stuff" and buying experiences.

Prosocial spending and buying time make people happy.

Much of the other stuff people buy will not make them happier or improve their sense of wellbeing.

Thankfully, once they realize that, there's eBay. :)
free
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by free »

I can relate to your unwillingness to spend money on yourself. I wanted to share that the mental shift occurred for me when I retired. Until then I was in saving mode, and other than vacations, would save rather than spend. When I retired, I realized that the race was over, and gave myself permission to recognize where we were financially. That was my experience, but I would encourage you to start making the shift now to recognize your financial security rather than retirement, like I did.
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by RJC »

It's all about value for me now. Still always looking for the best price; however, will not buy cheap things over long-term quality.
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by basspond »

I have seen several posts like yours about how to not be frugal. It all goes back to where is money on your priority list? If it’s on top you will either have a hard time letting it go or a hard time not spending it. Get involved with good charitable organizations. You first have to change your heart before you will be less stressed about the pitfalls of money.
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by Sandtrap »

broncocountry25 wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 1:14 pm Happy Saturday!

Any other Bogleheads grow up poor or seeing family really struggle? My mom worked three jobs and parents divorced when I was 4. When I was young I have a ton of negative memories about money. It was a source of constant stress in my families life.

Now that I have money at 31 I am actively working on becoming better at spending. I do not wish to be frugal my whole life.

What have others done to help them spend more along the journey and not over think it?

I love saving/investing and building in life but I also know we are going to be just fine down the road (already millionaires and good chance of inheritance from my wife's side later in life). I want to get better at spending some more now, what has helped others?

I have a hard time spending directly on myself, not so hard spending to take my family/friends to dinner, or pay to take a trip etc. I just need to get better on spending a bit more on myself and am working on it.

Thank You! :sharebeer
Our past, our roots, our most powerful memories and experiences as a child can become a powerful motivator and source of drive and relativism that most do not have.
Turn this into your greatest positive.

It’s not about money and spending at all.
Not at all. Not much would change internally if you had 10 mil in the bank.
And only you can understand that within your own perspective. Nobody else.

Actionably, set life and financial short and long term goals.
Make a plan
Work your plan.

Improvise
Adapt
Overcome

Read in paperback: Life Strategy, Life Code, by Dr. Phil McGraw. Available Amazon.com.

Read in paperback and listen to the tapes: As A Man Thinketh, by Allen Lakein.

*Labelling or assigning a "definition" of "poor mentality" is an artificial construct. Several generations ago, a "poor mentality" was not labelled as such, in fact, it was admired. So, that's cultural and sociological.
(PM me for this).

Similar experiences.
PM me as you wish.
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stoptothink
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by stoptothink »

1st generation citizen, my mom raised 5 kids on her own (has since added 2 step-kids) without a high school diploma in probably the most impoverished inner-city neighborhood in California, worked 2-3 jobs; I grew up well below any poverty standard. I didn't even realize we were really poor until I got to college. I had what I considered a happy childhood, simply had no idea what we were missing. It's interesting how that upbringing has affected us siblings differently, as I have 3 siblings that spend every dime (and then some) before it ever reaches their pocket. They have boldly proclaimed that they'll never "do without" and want to provide their kids everything they didn't have as a child (despite generally successful careers, they're completely broke as a result). Me, I may be the most frugal poster on this board. Truly believe that upbringing has helped us (my wife grew up with a slightly higher standard of living, but in reality her parents were worse off financially than my mom) get to financial independence very early, but it isn't all roses. I definitely have a mental block against spending money on things that are not bare essential needs, my wife is a little better about. It has, in the past, caused some friction in our marriage and there are times when my reasonable mind knows I shouldn't be so tight-fisted

For the most part, I don't have advice as I am not actively looking to break myself of that poor mentality. We have financial stability that pretty much nobody I grew around will ever experience, and that is priceless to me. We want for nothing and my kids have a fairy-tale life despite technically living right at the standard "poverty threshold" for a family of 4 (based on our annual household expenses). We've been slowly opening up as we reached >40x expenses and a paid off home in our mid-late 30's; we just ordered a 2nd car that we don't need, after nearly 4yrs of researching and dreaming I finally bought wife and I e-assist bikes - but our expenses are still a fraction of most on here, and some things others consider "necessities" are still not (and probably never will be) a part of our lives. Life is good, even if those around us are constantly telling us to loosen the purse strings.
RoadagentMN
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by RoadagentMN »

broncocountry25 wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 1:14 pm Happy Saturday!

Any other Bogleheads grow up poor or seeing family really struggle? My mom worked three jobs and parents divorced when I was 4. When I was young I have a ton of negative memories about money. It was a source of constant stress in my families life.

Now that I have money at 31 I am actively working on becoming better at spending. I do not wish to be frugal my whole life.

What have others done to help them spend more along the journey and not over think it?

I love saving/investing and building in life but I also know we are going to be just fine down the road (already millionaires and good chance of inheritance from my wife's side later in life). I want to get better at spending some more now, what has helped others?

I have a hard time spending directly on myself, not so hard spending to take my family/friends to dinner, or pay to take a trip etc. I just need to get better on spending a bit more on myself and am working on it.

Thank You! :sharebeer
It’s an interesting paradox, once I could afford more, the desire faded.
ThankYouJack
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by ThankYouJack »

stoptothink wrote: Sun Aug 29, 2021 7:48 am We've been slowly opening up as we reached >40x expenses and a paid off home in our mid-late 30's; ...
after nearly 4yrs of researching and dreaming I finally bought wife and I e-assist bikes
Why did you wait 4 years to achieve the dream of owning an e-bike? I understand being analytical with bigger purchases but with >40x expenses isn't waiting many years missing out / depriving oneself since you could have been enjoying the bike during all that time?
rockstar
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by rockstar »

I grew up poor, and we spent every dime. We didn't save. There wasn't anything left over. In my mind, that's the poor mentality. You don't learn to save because you have nothing to save.

I think, you're trying to be less frugal. No idea how to tell you to become less frugal. For me, my favorite activity is hiking, and the biggest cost with that activity is paying for new trail runners every 6 months. It makes me happy. Now, I can add on top of that a vehicle to get to more challenging trail heads, so that would mean paying up a little more for a vehicle with some simple mods to get there. That adds some coin. Finally, it's living a healthy lifestyle to keep me moving. This means not eating a lot of junk food and exercising, so I pay a little bit more for food.

Figure out what actually makes you happy. This is super challenging. This might take your entire life to figure out, or you might already know. Explore lots of different activities and figure out what works for you. Then, devote your resources there. I can tell you that buying furniture doesn't make me happy.
SQRT
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by SQRT »

Don’t worry. You will, very likely, gradually get used to your improved financial circumstances and feel more comfortable spending more. The fact you are concerned about this and have posted that concern here at a relatively young age, makes me think you are on the right path. Congrats.
stoptothink
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by stoptothink »

ThankYouJack wrote: Sun Aug 29, 2021 8:58 am
stoptothink wrote: Sun Aug 29, 2021 7:48 am We've been slowly opening up as we reached >40x expenses and a paid off home in our mid-late 30's; ...
after nearly 4yrs of researching and dreaming I finally bought wife and I e-assist bikes
Why did you wait 4 years to achieve the dream of owning an e-bike? I understand being analytical with bigger purchases but with >40x expenses isn't waiting many years missing out / depriving oneself since you could have been enjoying the bike during all that time?
I wanted to hit certain benchmarks before blowing $5k+ on a toy and there really wasn't anything on the market that checked all the boxes. In fact, there still isn't; we had to pre-order a totally new model from a known manufacturer in April and are expecting delivery in November.
smitcat
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by smitcat »

stoptothink wrote: Sun Aug 29, 2021 9:38 am
ThankYouJack wrote: Sun Aug 29, 2021 8:58 am
stoptothink wrote: Sun Aug 29, 2021 7:48 am We've been slowly opening up as we reached >40x expenses and a paid off home in our mid-late 30's; ...
after nearly 4yrs of researching and dreaming I finally bought wife and I e-assist bikes
Why did you wait 4 years to achieve the dream of owning an e-bike? I understand being analytical with bigger purchases but with >40x expenses isn't waiting many years missing out / depriving oneself since you could have been enjoying the bike during all that time?
I wanted to hit certain benchmarks before blowing $5k+ on a toy and there really wasn't anything on the market that checked all the boxes. In fact, there still isn't; we had to pre-order a totally new model from a known manufacturer in April and are expecting delivery in November.
Your posts are evolving over time - better times are ahead I am sure.
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bampf
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by bampf »

It is interesting reading some of these responses. It is obvious to me that some people don't really understand poverty mentality.

For example, if you have poverty mentality you might buy something that is cheap instead of good rationalizing that you don't really need the good thing as the cheap thing will do just fine. If that is true, that is a reasonable approach. Many times it is not. A harbor freight tool isn't the same as a line of professional mechanics tools. So far as that goes, even that isn't a big deal. But, maybe you decide to do your own electrical work because hiring an electrician is expensive. Maybe you work on your car for something like brakes or shocks. Maybe you put in your water heater. Again, perhaps all reasonable things except that when you make a mistake on one of those things because you didn't understand that the risk of failure is extreme and the cost savings when you have $2mm+ is pretty negligible.

To be clear, I do and have done all those things. But sometimes I shake my head when I realized I dodged a bullet and saved only a few dollars or I put in something that was substandard when buying the thing that really would have met my needs was easily affordable. It is that making do mentality that helped lift us out of poverty but is now oddly frugal for very little benefit.

It is a hard mental calculous to realize that $100 doesn't matter to you at all now, but, a substandard repair or tool or item is demonstrably worse or risky or dangerous. That poor mentality can be hard to overcome.
Nescio
stoptothink
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by stoptothink »

bampf wrote: Sun Aug 29, 2021 10:01 am It is interesting reading some of these responses. It is obvious to me that some people don't really understand poverty mentality.

For example, if you have poverty mentality you might buy something that is cheap instead of good rationalizing that you don't really need the good thing as the cheap thing will do just fine. If that is true, that is a reasonable approach. Many times it is not. A harbor freight tool isn't the same as a line of professional mechanics tools. So far as that goes, even that isn't a big deal. But, maybe you decide to do your own electrical work because hiring an electrician is expensive. Maybe you work on your car for something like brakes or shocks. Maybe you put in your water heater. Again, perhaps all reasonable things except that when you make a mistake on one of those things because you didn't understand that the risk of failure is extreme and the cost savings when you have $2mm+ is pretty negligible.

To be clear, I do and have done all those things. But sometimes I shake my head when I realized I dodged a bullet and saved only a few dollars or I put in something that was substandard when buying the thing that really would have met my needs was easily affordable. It is that making do mentality that helped lift us out of poverty but is now oddly frugal for very little benefit.

It is a hard mental calculous to realize that $100 doesn't matter to you at all now, but, a substandard repair or tool or item is demonstrably worse or risky or dangerous. That poor mentality can be hard to overcome.
I think I've taken the poverty mentality to the next level, I've never purchased a tool in my life (we have a small toolbox that I got for Christmas after buying our home - the basics to do the most menial household repairs) and a service man has been in our home a grand total of once...to replace our water heater, when I was out of town. Even then, wife was really angry when her co-worker told her later that day he would have been glad to do it for a home-cooked meal. I choose my friends wisely; among them, a general contractor, an electrician, a small business owner who is just generally handy (and owes me a life's worth of favors), wife's co-worker who is also handy (and owes my wife a lot of favors for helping him at work), and a next-door neighbor who is a plumber. We are not shy about calling in favors.

We also never buy something that we can borrow from others. It's great having two brother-in-laws who are obsessed with accumulating all of the nicest outdoor/camping gear, yet are practically hermits who never actually go outside.
Last edited by stoptothink on Sun Aug 29, 2021 10:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Wricha
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by Wricha »

Being poor or retelling a story how you were poor does not seem to serving you well. You not poor right now, so deal will that reality and give up the ghosts of the past they are a waste of energy.
Mike Scott
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by Mike Scott »

There is "frugal/living within your means" level and then there is a mentality that interfers with life/family/friends/relationships. The first has a DIY budgeting solution. The second may want some professional help/therapy.
KlangFool
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Re: Breaking "Poor" Mentality

Post by KlangFool »

OP,

Are you sure that you are not "House Poor"? Many of my income peers claimed that they are frugal and they do not eat out. But, they overspent on their houses and they do not have money for anything else. Hence, they feel poor even though they spend a lot of money every year.

You are spending 6 figures per year. As long as you do not overspent on your house, you should have plenty of money to spend on everything else.

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