Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

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cowdogman
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Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by cowdogman »

I'll post later with details (which I suspect some of you will find interesting), but for now some basic facts.

I bought a large (in size) consumer product in early July and the charge posted to my Chase credit card account on July 10. The charge was for approximately $13,000.

The product was defective (plugged it in and it didn't run) and the vendor said I could return it for a full refund.

The vendor issued an RMA and arranged to pick up the product at my house, and it arrived back at the vendor's warehouse on August 7.

Since then I have been told a few times by the vendor that the credit card refund was "in progress." Several days ago I was told by the vendor the refund would be reflected on my credit card account in "24-48 hours." I still haven't seen the refund on my card.

All the above is in writing in a long email chain with the vendor. The back and forth with the vendor has been cordial.

My credit card bill is due next Tuesday and I really don't want to go out of pocket $13,000 for a defective product I no longer have.

I plan to give the vendor until Monday and then file a dispute with Chase--before my due date on Tuesday.

In 40 years of having credit cards I don't think I have ever filed a dispute (other than once for a fraudulent charge).

Any suggestions?
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by montanagirl »

No answer but I have a similar dispute. Vendor is similarly cordial in emails.

I went ahead and disputed, maybe too early, and I keep hearing that disputes hang up the refund process. I really don't understand this. Customer support for all parties is apparently overseas, have poor English in texting and are hard to understand on the phone.

I'm wondering if it's some new kind of ripoff scheme.
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by cowdogman »

montanagirl wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 10:04 am No answer but I have a similar dispute. Vendor is similarly cordial in emails.

I went ahead and disputed, maybe too early, and I keep hearing that disputes hang up the refund process. I really don't understand this. Customer support for all parties is apparently overseas, have poor English in texting and are hard to understand on the phone.

I'm wondering if it's some new kind of ripoff scheme.
Yes, I was afraid a dispute would slow down the refund, but I am coming up on the credit card due date--so really no choice. I'm beginning to wonder whether the vendor is trying to run out the 60-day clock on disputes (60 days from the the posting of the original charge), but (for now) I doubt it.
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by JoMoney »

I wouldn't make a payment on a disputed charge, and I would dispute any charge I was billed for that is incorrect/invalid.
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by galawdawg »

cowdogman wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 10:11 am
montanagirl wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 10:04 am No answer but I have a similar dispute. Vendor is similarly cordial in emails.

I went ahead and disputed, maybe too early, and I keep hearing that disputes hang up the refund process. I really don't understand this. Customer support for all parties is apparently overseas, have poor English in texting and are hard to understand on the phone.

I'm wondering if it's some new kind of ripoff scheme.
Yes, I was afraid a dispute would slow down the refund, but I am coming up on the credit card due date--so really no choice. I'm beginning to wonder whether the vendor is trying to run out the 60-day clock on disputes (60 days from the the posting of the original charge), but (for now) I doubt it.
It is sixty (60) days from the date of the first statement that the charge at issue appeared, not sixty (60) days from the date the charge posted. 15 USC §1666.
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by j0nnyg1984 »

Everything sounds good to me. If they aren’t processing a refund in a timely fashion, a dispute is the next step.

It doesn’t slow anything down, it just costs the vendor money, and forces them to take action.
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by cowdogman »

galawdawg wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 10:18 am It is sixty (60) days from the date of the first statement that the charge at issue appeared, not sixty (60) days from the date the charge posted. 15 USC §1666.
I stand corrected.
J295
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by J295 »

Just dispute it. I had to do this once for a recurring car wash subscription they didn't cancel so I disputed; a bit later the vendor took care of it with a credit. No hard feelings and no hassles.
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by yules »

I agree with others, dispute it.

Now that you have your answer, post the details! I am intrigued by your teaser about details that we may be interested in, and will be watching this thread like a hawk!!! :D :D :D

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Kenkat
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by Kenkat »

Yes, file the dispute. If the vendor gets cranky because you filed a dispute, you can simply tell them the bill was coming due and you had no choice.
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by dknightd »

cowdogman wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 9:29 am I'll post later with details (which I suspect some of you will find interesting), but for now some basic facts.

I bought a large (in size) consumer product in early July and the charge posted to my Chase credit card account on July 10. The charge was for approximately $13,000.

The product was defective (plugged it in and it didn't run) and the vendor said I could return it for a full refund.

The vendor issued an RMA and arranged to pick up the product at my house, and it arrived back at the vendor's warehouse on August 7.

Since then I have been told a few times by the vendor that the credit card refund was "in progress." Several days ago I was told by the vendor the refund would be reflected on my credit card account in "24-48 hours." I still haven't seen the refund on my card.

All the above is in writing in a long email chain with the vendor. The back and forth with the vendor has been cordial.

My credit card bill is due next Tuesday and I really don't want to go out of pocket $13,000 for a defective product I no longer have.

I plan to give the vendor until Monday and then file a dispute with Chase--before my due date on Tuesday.

In 40 years of having credit cards I don't think I have ever filed a dispute (other than once for a fraudulent charge).

Any suggestions?
Without any further information, my suggestion would be to continue with your plan. Dispute the charge. I'd call the credit card company on Monday (or before if they had 24/7 phone support). Explain the situation. You have a well documented defective item. That you have shipped back. The only reason I would not dispute the charge is if you actually wanted to get a replacement from the vendor. Then I would probably pay the bill, wait a bit, and see what happened. In the mean time I would get the problem on the credit card radar.
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by dknightd »

Kenkat wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 10:50 am Yes, file the dispute. If the vendor gets cranky because you filed a dispute, you can simply tell them the bill was coming due and you had no choice.
+3
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by FIREchief »

Contest the charge with your credit card provider. No brainer. 8-)
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by galawdawg »

Just check the Chase website or app on Tuesday. If the refund hasn't appeared on Tuesday, select the purchase transaction, click "dispute transaction", and enter the appropriate information. No need to call, wait on hold, or explain anything to a CSR. Very quick and simple, even a lawyer can do it! :wink: :beer
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by nguy44 »

One of the good things about disputing a charge with Chase - they immediately issue you a credit for the charge while they investigate it, so you should not have to make a payment against it. If you do get the credit during the dispute period, just let Chase know, they will close the case, no issues.
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by Stinky »

nguy44 wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 12:09 pm One of the good things about disputing a charge with Chase - they immediately issue you a credit for the charge while they investigate it, so you should not have to make a payment against it. If you do get the credit during the dispute period, just let Chase know, they will close the case, no issues.
+1

You need a credit back to your account. If the vendor won’t give you a credit in a timely fashion, dispute the charge so Chase gives you the credit.
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by eye.surgeon »

One of the mysteries of the universe is why when I purchase something my card is charged within 5 seconds and when a refund is issued to the card it takes a week.
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by cowdogman »

eye.surgeon wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 12:18 pm One of the mysteries of the universe is why when I purchase something my card is charged within 5 seconds and when a refund is issued to the card it takes a week.
Yes, that thought has crossed my mind many (many) times over the last couple weeks.
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by Normchad »

Yep, file a dispute. There is absolutely no reason not too.

I’ve probably filed 5 disputes in my life. And every experience was great. The credit card company handled everything promptly and clearly.

You did your part. You worked with the vendor in good faith. Just turn it over to the credit card company to wrap it up.

I booked a really expensive hotel room ten months in advance. Due to COVID, I ended up not needing that room, so,I cancelled it about five months after booking it. The hotel said a refund would be coming, but couldn’t say when. So I waited, and waited. I probably waited three months or so. Then I called the credit card company. And they took care of it. I expected a hassle on that one because the transaction was so,old, and I had paid way back then for a hotel, room I never ended up,using. But it’s all good now.

This is one of the reasons I love credit cards. If I’d been using a debit card, I’d probably just be out of luck.
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by galawdawg »

Normchad wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 12:28 pm ...I expected a hassle on that one because the transaction was so,old, and I had paid way back then for a hotel, room I never ended up,using.
That is likely because both Mastercard and VISA have extended protections for the purchase of services that are not scheduled to be performed by the merchant until some future date. Those protections allow disputes in some circumstances up to 540 days after the original transaction processing date.
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by ResearchMed »

cowdogman wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 10:11 am
montanagirl wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 10:04 am No answer but I have a similar dispute. Vendor is similarly cordial in emails.

I went ahead and disputed, maybe too early, and I keep hearing that disputes hang up the refund process. I really don't understand this. Customer support for all parties is apparently overseas, have poor English in texting and are hard to understand on the phone.

I'm wondering if it's some new kind of ripoff scheme.
Yes, I was afraid a dispute would slow down the refund, but I am coming up on the credit card due date--so really no choice. I'm beginning to wonder whether the vendor is trying to run out the 60-day clock on disputes (60 days from the the posting of the original charge), but (for now) I doubt it.
What do you both mean by a dispute slowing down the refund process?
That's not YOUR problem, or certainly shouldn't be with any regular charge card vendor.

When one disputes a charge, the usual process is for the charge card vendor to give a temporary credit (or the equivalent, point being that the charge is NOT currently due anymore).
Then they take up the situation with the seller.
Assuming a resolution that is favorable to the buyer, that credit would change to permanent.

What card is this? VISA? MasterCard? Amex?

For anything pricy or with any "questionable seller" (or potentially so) such as eBay or even Amazon, we use Amex. They are by far, in our experience, the most consumer friendly/helpful charge card company.

The waffling around by the seller already should be more than sufficient for the card vendor to start the dispute process.

RM
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by THY4373 »

galawdawg wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 12:38 pm
Normchad wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 12:28 pm ...I expected a hassle on that one because the transaction was so,old, and I had paid way back then for a hotel, room I never ended up,using.
That is likely because both Mastercard and VISA have extended protections for the purchase of services that are not scheduled to be performed by the merchant until some future date. Those protections allow disputes in some circumstances up to 540 days after the original transaction processing date.
Amex seemingly does this too. I successfully did a chargeback on a charge that was nearly a year old due to the fact that I bought airline tickets last summer for flights this summer. Amex clearly was looking at the when the services were to be delivered vs when the charge was made.

To OPs question. I'd do a chargeback ASAP via the vendor's website/app. I'd include a short letter explaining the situation and what your ask is (full refund it seems) and attach any supporting documentation (e.g. communications with vendor, their advertised refund policy, etc.).
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by Normchad »

galawdawg wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 12:38 pm
Normchad wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 12:28 pm ...I expected a hassle on that one because the transaction was so,old, and I had paid way back then for a hotel, room I never ended up,using.
That is likely because both Mastercard and VISA have extended protections for the purchase of services that are not scheduled to be performed by the merchant until some future date. Those protections allow disputes in some circumstances up to 540 days after the original transaction processing date.
Galawdawg brings a lot of really good, interesting information to these forums. Thank you!
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by ResearchMed »

THY4373 wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 1:30 pm
galawdawg wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 12:38 pm
Normchad wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 12:28 pm ...I expected a hassle on that one because the transaction was so,old, and I had paid way back then for a hotel, room I never ended up,using.
That is likely because both Mastercard and VISA have extended protections for the purchase of services that are not scheduled to be performed by the merchant until some future date. Those protections allow disputes in some circumstances up to 540 days after the original transaction processing date.
Amex seemingly does this too. I successfully did a chargeback on a charge that was nearly a year old due to the fact that I bought airline tickets last summer for flights this summer. Amex clearly was looking at the when the services were to be delivered vs when the charge was made.

To OPs question. I'd do a chargeback ASAP via the vendor's website/app. I'd include a short letter explaining the situation and what your ask is (full refund it seems) and attach any supporting documentation (e.g. communications with vendor, their advertised refund policy, etc.).
I'd suggest a quick phone call to the card issuer in this situation, given that the seller isn't (yet?) contesting the situation.

It might be that a quick call from the card issuer will give the seller a kick to process the refund, without needing lots of documentation.
It's worth a quick and easy try, I'd think.
And then perhaps they can tell you about a temporary credit...?

RM
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by neilpilot »

ResearchMed wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 2:07 pm
THY4373 wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 1:30 pm
galawdawg wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 12:38 pm
Normchad wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 12:28 pm ...I expected a hassle on that one because the transaction was so,old, and I had paid way back then for a hotel, room I never ended up,using.
That is likely because both Mastercard and VISA have extended protections for the purchase of services that are not scheduled to be performed by the merchant until some future date. Those protections allow disputes in some circumstances up to 540 days after the original transaction processing date.
Amex seemingly does this too. I successfully did a chargeback on a charge that was nearly a year old due to the fact that I bought airline tickets last summer for flights this summer. Amex clearly was looking at the when the services were to be delivered vs when the charge was made.

To OPs question. I'd do a chargeback ASAP via the vendor's website/app. I'd include a short letter explaining the situation and what your ask is (full refund it seems) and attach any supporting documentation (e.g. communications with vendor, their advertised refund policy, etc.).
I'd suggest a quick phone call to the card issuer in this situation, given that the seller isn't (yet?) contesting the situation.

It might be that a quick call from the card issuer will give the seller a kick to process the refund, without needing lots of documentation.
It's worth a quick and easy try, I'd think.
And then perhaps they can tell you about a temporary credit...?

RM
Sounds like a good idea, except the banks that I'm aware of won't make that "quick call" before the buyer files a formal dispute.
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by FrugalInvestor »

I've filed a dispute once. The service provider had represented that he was providing one brand of product and instead provided a knock-off (he had excuses). Filing the dispute put me in the driver's seat for negotiating a very favorable resolution because he didn't want to eat the (custom) product.

My dispute was filed online and was approved within a couple of days or less as I recall. The vendor couldn't get his money until I notified the card company of a satisfactory resolution. The vendor was a bit miffed that even then he couldn't get his money for awhile but I had little compassion for him after the intentional misrepresentation.
Last edited by FrugalInvestor on Sat Aug 22, 2020 2:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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ResearchMed
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by ResearchMed »

neilpilot wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 2:11 pm
ResearchMed wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 2:07 pm
THY4373 wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 1:30 pm
galawdawg wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 12:38 pm
Normchad wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 12:28 pm ...I expected a hassle on that one because the transaction was so,old, and I had paid way back then for a hotel, room I never ended up,using.
That is likely because both Mastercard and VISA have extended protections for the purchase of services that are not scheduled to be performed by the merchant until some future date. Those protections allow disputes in some circumstances up to 540 days after the original transaction processing date.
Amex seemingly does this too. I successfully did a chargeback on a charge that was nearly a year old due to the fact that I bought airline tickets last summer for flights this summer. Amex clearly was looking at the when the services were to be delivered vs when the charge was made.

To OPs question. I'd do a chargeback ASAP via the vendor's website/app. I'd include a short letter explaining the situation and what your ask is (full refund it seems) and attach any supporting documentation (e.g. communications with vendor, their advertised refund policy, etc.).
I'd suggest a quick phone call to the card issuer in this situation, given that the seller isn't (yet?) contesting the situation.

It might be that a quick call from the card issuer will give the seller a kick to process the refund, without needing lots of documentation.
It's worth a quick and easy try, I'd think.
And then perhaps they can tell you about a temporary credit...?

RM
Sounds like a good idea, except the banks that I'm aware of won't make that "quick call" before the buyer files a formal dispute.
That "quick call" IS supposed to be the start of the "formal" dispute.

But depending upon the circumstances, it often does not need "documentation", etc.
This sounds like if might (*might*) be one of those, assuming the seller is just delaying, and not up to anything more nefarious.

Contact from the charge card processor (e.g., VISA, Amex) may well get the ball rolling and put an end to this before there is lots more aggravation.

RM
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by RetiredAL »

OP,

Even if the credit from the vendor shows up today, it will not count as a payment towards your last statement's balance. It will post as a credit, not as a payment, to this month activity and show on the next statement.
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by Mudpuppy »

ResearchMed wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 1:24 pm What card is this? VISA? MasterCard? Amex?

For anything pricy or with any "questionable seller" (or potentially so) such as eBay or even Amazon, we use Amex. They are by far, in our experience, the most consumer friendly/helpful charge card company.

The waffling around by the seller already should be more than sufficient for the card vendor to start the dispute process.
The OP said Chase was the bank, so likely VISA. I've not filed a dispute with Chase, so I don't know how that experience compares to other companies. Usually just threatening the vendor with filing a dispute is enough to spur them into action, e.g. "You have been promising this for over a week. If this is not resolved by Friday, I will file a dispute with my credit card company."
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by neilpilot »

RetiredAL wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 2:38 pm OP,

Even if the credit from the vendor shows up today, it will not count as a payment towards your last statement's balance. It will post as a credit, not as a payment, to this month activity and show on the next statement.
That may be true for your cards. When a credit posts to either my Barclays (MC) or Chase (VISA) cards, it immediately reduces the balance due. So even if I’ve received a statement for $x, I can pay $x - $credit and the statement balance is fully satisfied.
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by RetiredAL »

neilpilot wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 2:44 pm
RetiredAL wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 2:38 pm OP,

Even if the credit from the vendor shows up today, it will not count as a payment towards your last statement's balance. It will post as a credit, not as a payment, to this month activity and show on the next statement.
That may be true for your cards. When a credit posts to either my Barclays (MC) or Chase (VISA) cards, it immediately reduces the balance due. So even if I’ve received a statement for $x, I can pay $x - $credit and the statement balance is fully satisfied.
That does match my experience, which I learned the hard way.

Chase is relatively new to me, and I've never had to deal with a large credit with them.
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by galawdawg »

THY4373 wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 1:30 pm
galawdawg wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 12:38 pm
Normchad wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 12:28 pm ...I expected a hassle on that one because the transaction was so,old, and I had paid way back then for a hotel, room I never ended up,using.
That is likely because both Mastercard and VISA have extended protections for the purchase of services that are not scheduled to be performed by the merchant until some future date. Those protections allow disputes in some circumstances up to 540 days after the original transaction processing date.
Amex seemingly does this too. I successfully did a chargeback on a charge that was nearly a year old due to the fact that I bought airline tickets last summer for flights this summer. Amex clearly was looking at the when the services were to be delivered vs when the charge was made.
Good to know AMEX likely provides similar protections.
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by cowdogman »

RetiredAL wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 2:38 pm OP,

Even if the credit from the vendor shows up today, it will not count as a payment towards your last statement's balance. It will post as a credit, not as a payment, to this month activity and show on the next statement.
I don't think that is right in all cases.

The charge is on my statement issued at the end of July. If I get a credit/refund on that charge it will go toward the amount due on the July statement.

I agree that if the charge were from the current period the credit would not apply to the previous statement balance.
123
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by 123 »

File a dispute with Citi.

They have an online dispute process that is very easy to use. I just used it this morning after they sent me a fraud alert about an unusual charge. There is likely a mechanism where you can include the correspondance with the vendor in your dispute.
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by Barcelonasteve »

My experience disputing a charge with Chase earlier this year was so poor that I decided to get rid of all my Chase cards. I eventually got my money back from the merchant, no thanks to Chase. I strongly recommend doing everything online and uploading supporting documents rather than calling. I called and the CS rep’s notes on the conversation and the misinformation she provided to me were grossly inaccurate, but of course the Chase position was “We are sorry if you misunderstood.” The dispute processor was clearly trying to close it as quickly as possible and did so based on “more information needed.” He made no notes about my voicemails to him attempting to call him back in response to his voicemails to me.

My experiences with Amex have been much, much better.
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by cowdogman »

ResearchMed wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 1:24 pm What do you both mean by a dispute slowing down the refund process?
The vendor has been promising a refund for 2 weeks+. If the refund were in the process of being issued at the vendor and then the dispute came in, it would likely slow down the refund as the vendor tried to figure out how to respond to the dispute--and coordinate the refund with the resolution of the dispute.

Why do I care? Because I'd like this to be over and so have given the vendor the maximum amount of time to process the refund--with my deadline being the day before the due date on my credit card statement.

I'd prefer not to dispute the charge and then have to continue dealing with this issue.
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by ResearchMed »

cowdogman wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 3:40 pm
ResearchMed wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 1:24 pm What do you both mean by a dispute slowing down the refund process?
The vendor has been promising a refund for 2 weeks+. If the refund were in the process of being issued at the vendor and then the dispute came in, it would likely slow down the refund as the vendor tried to figure out how to respond to the dispute--and coordinate the refund with the resolution of the dispute.

Why do I care? Because I'd like this to be over and so have given the vendor the maximum amount of time to process the refund--with my deadline being the day before the due date on my credit card statement.

I'd prefer not to dispute the charge and then have to continue dealing with this issue.
From our experiences with disputes, not frequent, but over the decades, yes... there have been some...

The seller doesn't need to "figure this out".
The card issuer will do that, but only when you notify them.

They'll issue a temporary credit, and when the vendor's credit processing arrives (assuming it does), then the charge issuer will coordinate them.

At least call the card issuer (e.g., VISA), and ask them, so you can set your mind at ease about how the process works.

RM
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by cowdogman »

Barcelonasteve wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 3:39 pm I strongly recommend doing everything online and uploading supporting documents rather than calling.
Yes. A paper trail is so much better than that playing customer service rep roulette.
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by cowdogman »

ResearchMed wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 3:45 pm From our experiences with disputes, not frequent, but over the decades, yes... there have been some...

The seller doesn't need to "figure this out".
The card issuer will do that, but only when you notify them.

They'll issue a temporary credit, and when the vendor's credit processing arrives (assuming it does), then the charge issuer will coordinate them.

At least call the card issuer (e.g., VISA), and ask them, so you can set your mind at ease about how the process works.

RM
Thanks.

I think I understand the dispute procedure (I've already gone thru it, stopping short of clicking the final "Submit" button), and am ready to submit the email chain and other documentation if required by Chase.

If the refund/credit is not reflected on my card account Monday morning, I'll dispute the charge.
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by shelanman »

Definitely start a dispute.

Chase has a very easy to follow online process for starting a dispute. They follow up in writing within 14 days in virtually all cases. Both of these facts give you the necessary document trail to show that you really did start the dispute within 60 days.

In my experience (always smaller disputes than yours) by the time I get the letter 14 days later, the dispute has already been resolved -- as getting told that the dispute has been opened usually gets recalcitrant merchants to start paying attention.
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by cowdogman »

Update: No sign of the credit from the vendor and so I filed a dispute this morning with Chase. I filed online, and then called Chase to make sure it is in their system--it is.

Couple things:

1. According to the customer service rep (CSR) in the Chase dispute department, the temporary credit has already been applied to my card, but it will take several days to be reflected online--that is, when I log in to check charges/balances. In hindsight, I probably should not have waited until so close to my due date (tomorrow)--because now I'm uncertain how the temporary credit will be applied to the amount coming due tomorrow. The CSR was zero help with this issue--even tho I asked the same quest three different ways--she kept telling me to call the main number and ask my question--and I suspect the main number would tell me to call the dispute number again.

2. I have run up enuf current charges on my card so that even if I pay the balance tomorrow from the July statement (where the disputed charge is) my current balance will still be above the disputed charge amount--that is, even if pay the July balance tomorrow my charges from the current billing period will still be above $13,000. I have heard/read various people say "don't pay the disputed charge" but I have never understood why. Is there some legal/administrative reason that makes a difference? Or is the thought merely that it would reduce my leverage over the bank--if the disputed charge has already been paid?
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by ResearchMed »

cowdogman wrote: Mon Aug 24, 2020 1:41 pm Update: No sign of the credit from the vendor and so I filed a dispute this morning with Chase. I filed online, and then called Chase to make sure it is in their system--it is.

Couple things:

1. According to the customer service rep (CSR) in the Chase dispute department, the temporary credit has already been applied to my card, but it will take several days to be reflected online--that is, when I log in to check charges/balances. In hindsight, I probably should not have waited until so close to my due date (tomorrow)--because now I'm uncertain how the temporary credit will be applied to the amount coming due tomorrow. The CSR was zero help with this issue--even tho I asked the same quest three different ways--she kept telling me to call the main number and ask my question--and I suspect the main number would tell me to call the dispute number again.

2. I have run up enuf current charges on my card so that even if I pay the balance tomorrow from the July statement (where the disputed charge is) my current balance will still be above the disputed charge amount--that is, even if pay the July balance tomorrow my charges from the current billing period will still be above $13,000. I have heard/read various people say "don't pay the disputed charge" but I have never understood why. Is there some legal/administrative reason that makes a difference? Or is the thought merely that it would reduce my leverage over the bank--if the disputed charge has already been paid?
Why are you so reluctant to call them?

I'd strongly suggest calling that main number, as recommended.
They are most likely the ones who could make a note on your account to avoid, or refund, any late fee due to the processing time. Or at least help with not reporting any missed payment (not sure if this would have caused any credit ding anyway, but "just in case", etc.)

And yes, try not to wait until so close to deadlines, with this or any such... you could get sick; there could be a major power or phone outage, etc. "Things happen", etc.

These charge card companies can often (er, not always!) be quite helpful.
And if not, then try the HUCA strategy: Hang Up and Call Again :happy

Good luck!

RM
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by Pete3 »

123 wrote: Sat Aug 22, 2020 3:33 pm File a dispute with Citi.

They have an online dispute process that is very easy to use. I just used it this morning after they sent me a fraud alert about an unusual charge. There is likely a mechanism where you can include the correspondance with the vendor in your dispute.
That seems like a strange thing to recommend since the purchase was made with a Chase credit card.

What do you think citi is going to do for op? :D
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by cowdogman »

ResearchMed wrote: Mon Aug 24, 2020 2:28 pm Why are you so reluctant to call them?
Thanks. Answer to your question below.

I did call the main number and explained the situation and the CSR tried to transfer me to the dispute department, and when I said the dispute department told me to call the main number, I was put on hold and then disconnected.

So I called the main number again and explained the situation again. The CSR said "hold on" and before I could say anything I was transferred to the dispute department. After asking the dispute CSR the same question at least 5 different ways without getting an answer, she said she was going to transfer me to main number but stay on the line. I said ok, but then she transferred me and hung up.

The next CSR was a "Sapphire" CSR (I have the Reserve card) and she was was good. Here's what she told me. The dispute credit may post overnight, and if it does my balance due tomorrow will be zero. If it doesn't post overnight I have two options.

One, just pay the balance due tomorrow and apply the dispute credit to my next statement (which will be for more than the dispute amount). She said that there is absolutely no downside to paying the disputed amount pending the outcome of the dispute (and that sounds right to me) and in any case my next statement will be for more than the disputed amount.

Two, don't pay my card tomorrow and if I am charged interest I can call Chase and Chase will reverse the interest--while the dispute is outstanding.

So, that is why I was reluctant to call again. It's CSR Reverse Russian Roulette. I had to talk to 5 people before I finally got a loaded chamber.
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by ResearchMed »

cowdogman wrote: Mon Aug 24, 2020 2:49 pm
ResearchMed wrote: Mon Aug 24, 2020 2:28 pm Why are you so reluctant to call them?
Thanks. Answer to your question below.

I did call the main number and explained the situation and the CSR tried to transfer me to the dispute department, and when I said the dispute department told me to call the main number, I was put on hold and then disconnected.

So I called the main number again and explained the situation again. The CSR said "hold on" and before I could say anything I was transferred to the dispute department. After asking the dispute CSR the same question at least 5 different ways without getting an answer, she said she was going to transfer me to main number but stay on the line. I said ok, but then she transferred me and hung up.

The next CSR was a "Sapphire" CSR (I have the Reserve card) and she was was good. Here's what she told me. The dispute credit may post overnight, and if it does my balance due tomorrow will be zero. If it doesn't post overnight I have two options.

One, just pay the balance due tomorrow and apply the dispute credit to my next statement (which will be for more than the dispute amount). She said that there is absolutely no downside to paying the disputed amount pending the outcome of the dispute (and that sounds right to me) and in any case my next statement will be for more than the disputed amount.

Two, don't pay my card tomorrow and if I am charged interest I can call Chase and Chase will reverse the interest--while the dispute is outstanding.

So, that is why I was reluctant to call again. It's CSR Reverse Russian Roulette. I had to talk to 5 people before I finally got a loaded chamber.
Uh, okay :shock:
Not good!

And to answer your question, at least partially, about why the common advice about not paying the disputed amount...
Many people genuinely may not be able to cough up that money that really shouldn't be due in the first place. They may have already re-spent that money to get the same thing elsewhere or such.
And IF a dispute is filed, then there should be ("should" being the operative word, of course) no interest or late fee, which those people may not realize.
Maybe there are other reasons, too.

Sorry you've had such difficulty.
But it does sound, from your description, that the seller is not contesting the "problem", so that should (ha!?) make it easier for the charge card company and thus you.

RM
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by deikel »

went through a dispute process process with citi lately and it was extremely pain free (the credit card part that is). They posted temporary credit the same day, tried to contact the seller and gave them 60 day to respond.

After the 60 days were up, the credit became permanent. I called them up to see if they had contact with the seller and the answer was 'seller did not return out contact requests, so you get the credit and we take it from here'. I sincerely hope that they place this seller on a do-not-do-business-with list.

Now, in the background, I sent the merchandise back to the seller (they paid shipping) and ....never saw a credit from them. I will assume if there ever was a credit, the credit card company would get the credit (rightly so) - however that did not happen yet.

Despite this seller being somewhat responsive and even sending me a prepaid shipping label, its effectively fraudulent since I have still to see the refund for the returned merchandise, maybe they even sold the same part again to someone to make another buck...

Bottom line, call the CC company and get the dispute in. That starts your refund clock from the CC and if it resolves prior you can just cancel the dispute - that is the nr 1 reason why its nice to have a CC - to dispute shady sellers and have that extra layer of protection.
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Re: Credit Card Dispute--Any Suggestions?

Post by RetiredAL »

cowdogman wrote: Mon Aug 24, 2020 2:49 pm

The next CSR was a "Sapphire" CSR (I have the Reserve card) and she was was good. Here's what she told me. The dispute credit may post overnight, and if it does my balance due tomorrow will be zero. If it doesn't post overnight I have two options.

One, just pay the balance due tomorrow and apply the dispute credit to my next statement (which will be for more than the dispute amount). She said that there is absolutely no downside to paying the disputed amount pending the outcome of the dispute (and that sounds right to me) and in any case my next statement will be for more than the disputed amount.

Two, don't pay my card tomorrow and if I am charged interest I can call Chase and Chase will reverse the interest--while the dispute is outstanding.

So, that is why I was reluctant to call again. It's CSR Reverse Russian Roulette. I had to talk to 5 people before I finally got a loaded chamber.
My experience with other cards over the years - as long as the 'minimum due' is paid by the due date, you can pay the rest before the 'billing date' without incurring an interest charge. It might be worth asking that to Chase as a question.
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