Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

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debrajo61
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Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by debrajo61 »

Hi Bogleheads,

I wrote a post a couple of months ago similar to this one, but since then we've learned alot. The previous questions were more in relation to the pros/cons of a vacation home in FL vs a full time residence in FL. This post is going to be asking questions related to a permanent cross country move at age 60 AND a mortgage at this age (albeit not a big one, relatively speaking). Please give any input, all will be well received and taken into consideration, as I know there are very differing points of view....exactly what I'm looking for.

We are a 60 year old couple who are both retired civil service. Our combined pensions are around $8,600 a month net. We pay our BCBS health ins premium out of my husbands pension. That is already deducted from the $8,600. Our state (IL) does not tax pensions. Our property taxes are outrageous at $~7,400 a year on a home worth $275-300k (pushing it at being able to sell for 300k).

We have no debt. We own a new Honda Accord and a 2012 Jeep Grand Cherokee with only 40,000 miles on it (probably put 50 on it since covid March drama began). We are not extravagant spenders, we do like to travel, we are down to earth and really don't ask for alot. We have a son who is married living 15 minutes away. They have no children. We have a daughter with a family (2 grands) in Colorado. They do not plan to move back to IL and we do not want to live in Colorado Springs. Not our thing. The big draw to Colorado for us is just them.

Quick breakout of assets:

Home if sold would bring around $275,000 in cash. Very slow market in IL, high property taxes one reason. A concern is if we can even sell in this market with covid and all of the uncertainty, high taxes, etc. Homes just are not selling well here presently.

Savings/checking/money market liquid accounts: ~200k (this includes emergency fund $)

Taxable Vanguard investments currently ~$245,000 total stock market index admiral shares and total intl stock market index funds 80%/20%

TSP: Mine ~$380,000 G fund
TSP: His: ~$415,000 G fund

Roth Vanguard Me: ~$375,000 Life Strategy Moderate Growth 90% and intl stock market index fund 10%
Roth Vanguard Him: $~$345,000 Life Strategy Conservative Growth 85% and Intl stock market index 15%

529 for grandson ~$20,000

We've front end helped our adult children to the tune of paying for their 2 college degrees and giving each of them a very good chunk of cash for down payments on homes, to the tune of around $100k each. We thought we could afford to do that (we could) but we also never considered we would want what we do now and may need those funds. Well, hindsight is 20 20 and they are all doing well, employed, launched, self sufficient, so all is good at present.

-----------

We have run the numbers, we have considered the change in lifestyle (we have wintered in Florida, Pinellas County specifically, for four winters and we love it there. No, we have not gone down in the summer but are kicking around flying down in a couple weeks to "feel Florida summer heat" (yes we understand this is a hot spot, but Pinellas County really is not, if we believe the numbers. Who really knows what's going on with this covid reporting??) as well as drive around areas and neighborhoods we have now zeroed in on). Bottom line is we really would like to make this move but we would like to do it within the next year or so. We know we would likely need to do the following: Sell our home, rent in FL, then purchase having cash in hand from our home sale, in order to get what we want (hopefully....who knows).

The quandry:

As of now the market in Florida is on fire. Homes are selling above asking price with multiple offers in a day. Example: we are not impulsive buyers, totally the opposite (note our investments --- conservative, probably too conservative but they fit us). We saw a home we loved online. We made an offer last week $20,000 above asking price (this is not us but we loved the home and were determined to make it work if we got it). The home was on the market 36 hours and had 21 offers. Needless to say, we did not get it. Probably a blessing but also a real eye opener as far as competition. This home was listed at $479,000. We bid $500,000. So, basically, if we live our dream, it is going to cost us. We have not had a mortgage in 25 years. We would have a mortgage at age 60! Yikes. NEVER in our long term plan. On the flip side, we could stay in our home, a very nice home that we love but much too big for us, and age in place and continue spending winters in Florida (I believe the Bogleheads vote will be for this option :) Or, we could sell this beautiful 1910 Craftsman that is too big for us and go to a new little condo or villa or ranch home.....and probably spend more money here in IL also if we did this; probably an additional $100k to purchase something like this, end up with the same or higher taxes, a smaller cookie cutter home or condo, but would attain more freedom, less maintenance, zero entry amenities for old people, etc. It really makes no sense to move from our current home if we do not plan to relocate, unless we HAVE TO and can't age in place (or one of us dies). IF we relocate we are looking at mid century ranch homes out of the flood zone to avoid flood insurance, however, within minutes drive to the beaches, as that is really what we love. For a nice home in a nice area, something we would really be comfortable in (doesn't have to be big, in fact it will likely be 2,000 sf at the most and probably smaller) it will cost us for sure around $500k-$550k at this time (market could drop in months --- who knows? but as of now its premium $ sellers market). If the stars aligned and we sold our home, we'd have our home equity plus some of our savings and we would likely still need to borrow around $150,000 estimated. I understand this is not a huge mortgage, and we certainly can afford it at todays rates (with both of us alive), but gosh, we honestly never thought we'd be in a position of having to get a mortgage at our age to "live our dream". Is this absurd? I think our bubble has been burst in the last couple months of fine tuning this plan and understanding the FL market is VERY DIFFERENT, the cost of homes, car and home insurance, etc higher, oh and there are critters and big insects and hurricanes yes we know :/

Any thoughts on any of this, good or bad? We are blessed and fortunate to be where we are in our lives and we don't take that for granted. We certainly could just sit tight. We don't want to throw caution to the wind. On the other hand we have this itch that wont go away, and that is moving to Florida and living near the beaches. It just suits us. If anyone has done this sort of thing, or thought about it, or thought oh my gosh no way never, please advise. Any info from this group always gives us more to think about. Covid, we are not living in fear about; we wear masks, we social distance, we wash our hands, we do our best. I understand no one can make our decisions for us and again any input is valuable. Thank you all. Stay safe.
delamer
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by delamer »

You have a fixed income of over $100,000/year and liquid assets of $1.75 million from which you could withdraw 3% a year, or another $52,000.

There is no reason that you can’t take on a mortgage in Florida or carry the costs of your current home until it sells. The fact that you’re retired is irrelevant.

Those are the financials. The rest of the decision no one can help you with.
Gill
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by Gill »

Are you sure the market in Florida is "on fire"? I live in a very desirable part of Florida and that is certainly not the case here.
Gill
Cost basis is redundant. One has a basis in an investment | One advises and gives advice | One should follow the principle of investing one's principal
BoomerM3
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by BoomerM3 »

I'm living in a gated community in Fort Myers. There is no real estate fire here. Homes range from $500,000 to $900,000. I suggest you take another look at the marketplace.
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debrajo61
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by debrajo61 »

Gill wrote: Mon Jul 20, 2020 11:40 am Are you sure the market in Florida is "on fire"? I live in a very desirable part of Florida and that is certainly not the case here.
Gill
i can only speak for the area we are looking which is Pinellas County, including areas of Indian Rocks Beach, Treasure Island, Seminole, St. Pete, St. Pete Beach, Gulfport, Tierra Verde....that market is on fire. Homes in the price range we are looking at least, are going within a day or two with multiple, sometimes double digits (as i said, we put offer in on $479k home at 500k, up against 20 other offers, on a home in Seminole and it was up for 36 hours. This is the area we want. Apparently either alot of people took their homes off due to covid or they are just going fast but something in that area is definitely cranking fast. Our budge it so around 600k max and its extremely hard to find ANYTHING.
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debrajo61
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by debrajo61 »

BoomerM3 wrote: Mon Jul 20, 2020 3:26 pm I'm living in a gated community in Fort Myers. There is no real estate fire here. Homes range from $500,000 to $900,000. I suggest you take another look at the marketplace.
We've looked there and yes it looks like the market is quite saturated with plenty of options. We are looking in Indian Rocks Beach, Treasure Island, Seminole, Gulfport, St. Pete, St. Pete Beach areas specifically. Our budget is at the lower end of your range with a max of 650k, and we are looking farther north a bit, in the price range we are looking, from 450-650ish they are flying with multiple offers and there may be two new listings a day in Pinellas County in this price range. We have been watching the market here and the number of homes going up has definitely gone down, I assume due to covid but who knows, maybe people are just sitting tight, definitely what is out there that is halfway good is selling fast. In IL not much is moving. Ten minutes away from us, over the bridge in Iowa, things are moving. Strange times and no logic I can figure.
go_mets
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by go_mets »

I guess I am not sure why the rush.
I personally would wait to see how the everything shakes out over winter.

I had planned on selling my home and buying another home in a 55+ community in the area this summer.
I had gone to open houses before everything was shut down in March.
Now I am waiting to see how things pan out and make the move next year.


.
singledigit12b
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by singledigit12b »

debrajo61 wrote: Mon Jul 20, 2020 7:54 pm
BoomerM3 wrote: Mon Jul 20, 2020 3:26 pm I'm living in a gated community in Fort Myers. There is no real estate fire here. Homes range from $500,000 to $900,000. I suggest you take another look at the marketplace.
We've looked there and yes it looks like the market is quite saturated with plenty of options. We are looking in Indian Rocks Beach, Treasure Island, Seminole, Gulfport, St. Pete, St. Pete Beach areas specifically. Our budget is at the lower end of your range with a max of 650k, and we are looking farther north a bit, in the price range we are looking, from 450-650ish they are flying with multiple offers and there may be two new listings a day in Pinellas County in this price range. We have been watching the market here and the number of homes going up has definitely gone down, I assume due to covid but who knows, maybe people are just sitting tight, definitely what is out there that is halfway good is selling fast. In IL not much is moving. Ten minutes away from us, over the bridge in Iowa, things are moving. Strange times and no logic I can figure.
Yes the housing market is on fire here in Pinellas County. I can confirm houses are selling in a day with multiple offers. I’m amazed at the prices homes are going for. I’m putting my house on the market in a couple of weeks and moving to the east coast. The problem is the market where I’m going is hot also. I have decided to sell and rent month to month unless I get lucky and find the right property at just the right time.
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dcnut
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by dcnut »

DW and I also live in IL (Chicago suburbs), and we are in a similar situation as yours (except we are older). Fortunately, we are still in good health. Unfortunately, all our children live far away, and scattered along the east and west coasts. When we do decide to move, however, it will definitely to be near one of them. We are hoping that one of our children will move closer to a sibling in the meantime.

If one of our children lived in FL, we would probably already be living there. We are just not thrilled with the current choices.
Sailorgirl
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by Sailorgirl »

Before making your decision you need to weigh carefully the cost of homeowners Insurance and property taxes. Check carefully the new flood maps. My daughter lives in St Pete and everything seems to flood these days. I am not sure that you can afford a house in that price 500 to 600k range even with just a mortgage of 150 to 200K without being house poor. We live on the east coast of Florida and absolutely love St Pete but we think flooding is a problem and they are over due for a hurricane.

The cost if living outside of housing is cheaper there than here on the east coast of Florida. We have many friends from the NE who winter here in Northern Palm Beach County. They find that a seasonal rental is more affordable. States get their moneys from somewhere. Florida makes up for zero income tax in sales and property taxes. With a covid decimated economy both sales and property taxes will be going up as well as medical insurance. Run your numbers. You may find more affordable options in the Cape Coral Fort Meyers area on the west coast or Melbourne Palm
Bay on the east coast.
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Watty
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by Watty »

With all your uncertainty about what to do one option would be to just sell your house then rent a place in Florida for a year so your can really decide what you want to do.

It sounds like your house will take a while to sell so by the time it sells there may be a lot more clarity with what is happening with COVID.

I did not add up all the numbers but if you sell your house it looks like you will have well over $2 million in funds, large pensions, and maybe Social Security too(that was not clear). There is no need for a mortgage and you can pretty much do whatever the heck you want to do.

--------------------------------

Whenever someone posts about having large TSP accounts I try to remind them that they have different inheritance rules. Here is what I have posted about that before.
Be sure that you understand that the TSP inheritance laws are different than IRA inheritance laws and they are sometimes worse. There is a wiki on this;

https://www.bogleheads.org/wiki/TSP_estate_planning

There was a post awhile back where where someone had run into this situation;

1) Dad had a large TSP, he died and left it to his wife.
2) Wife left the money in the TSP as a beneficiary participant, that worked OK for her.
3) A few years later the wife died and left the TSP to their kid. 

The problem was because of the TSP inheritance rules that the kid could not roll the money out to an inherited IRA and they could also not leave the money in the beneficiary participant account so the kid had to withdraw the money and pay taxes on it. If either the Mom or Dad had rolled the money into an IRA then the kid could have avoided, or at least delayed, a six figure tax bill since they could have the money in an inherited IRA.

You might want to consider rolling the money out to an IRA.

When I have posted about this before there have occasionally been comments to the effect of "I will leave a note for my wife to roll the money out to an IRA if I die first." I would not want to count on an 80 year old recently widowed person actually doing that.
bltn
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by bltn »

In your situation, I would put my house on the market, and arrange a rental in Florida on a month by month basis once the Covid virus has subsided, possibly next year. Consider a home purchase once the Illinois house sells.
Property taxes And income taxes in Florida will be less and you ll enjoy the life down here.
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snackdog
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by snackdog »

How about renting our your Chicago house now and renting a condo in FL? At your age I don’t recommend another house. If you like it after a full year including hurricane season, sell in IL.

I don’t recommend buying, as you nearly did, over the internet while owning a house in IL. STOP looking at real estate online until you live there!
hudson
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by hudson »

debrajo61 wrote: Mon Jul 20, 2020 10:55 am Home if sold would bring around $275,000 in cash. Very slow market in IL, high property taxes one reason. A concern is if we can even sell in this market with covid and all of the uncertainty, high taxes, etc. Homes just are not selling well here presently.
Would it sell if the price was right?
Have you talked with an agent?
It sounds like a buyer's market? The house is worth what a buyer will pay. A good real estate person should be able to help you with that price.

What would Sandtrap say?
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midareff
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by midareff »

Gill wrote: Mon Jul 20, 2020 11:40 am Are you sure the market in Florida is "on fire"? I live in a very desirable part of Florida and that is certainly not the case here.
Gill
Certainly not true in Miami or Fort Lauderdale either..... have been looking from time to time in Fort Myers and not true there either. I think the only "fire" is in the news reports which also report there are many millions of defaults and foreclosures about to happen in the next few weeks as protections expire.
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by Jack FFR1846 »

If you priced lower than market, your house will sell pretty quickly. Fast/slow always depends on where the house is compared to the market.

Florida is the home of trailers. There are quite nice double wides in very nice gated parks. My mom is in one. She could afford to pay cash for a half million dollar house but likes the closeness of the parks and the very low price. I don't know the Tampa area where you're looking but know that around Orlando, if you show up with $70k, you can get quite a nice trailer in a park with all appliances, multiple flat screen tvs, tile and wood flooring and of course the security of the gates.
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by Escapevelocity »

I'm not comprehending why you are even considering a mortgage. Your pensions are more than enough to live on as far as your ongoing expenses are concerned. Why wouldn't you simply pay cash for the house using some combination of your taxable investments, savings, and Roth accounts?
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by Escapevelocity »

Sailorgirl wrote: Mon Jul 20, 2020 8:45 pm I am not sure that you can afford a house in that price 500 to 600k range even with just a mortgage of 150 to 200K without being house poor.
How are you reaching this conclusion? They have huge pensions and sizeable Roth accounts that will do nothing but sit there without a purpose other than leaving to their heirs".
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debrajo61
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by debrajo61 »

go_mets wrote: Mon Jul 20, 2020 8:00 pm I guess I am not sure why the rush.
I personally would wait to see how the everything shakes out over winter.

I had planned on selling my home and buying another home in a 55+ community in the area this summer.
I had gone to open houses before everything was shut down in March.
Now I am waiting to see how things pan out and make the move next year.


.
i agree. i'm just looking for input. i think that is what we are going to do. honestly, why the rush? in reality there is no rush. we have both had too much time on our hands since returning from winter in Florida and I think became overly focused on this. We are taking a step back now and we are going to see how things go in the next few months. we already have winter rentals so we are actually pretty well set if we want to continue the path we were on. thank you.
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debrajo61
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by debrajo61 »

Sailorgirl wrote: Mon Jul 20, 2020 8:45 pm Before making your decision you need to weigh carefully the cost of homeowners Insurance and property taxes. Check carefully the new flood maps. My daughter lives in St Pete and everything seems to flood these days. I am not sure that you can afford a house in that price 500 to 600k range even with just a mortgage of 150 to 200K without being house poor. We live on the east coast of Florida and absolutely love St Pete but we think flooding is a problem and they are over due for a hurricane.

The cost if living outside of housing is cheaper there than here on the east coast of Florida. We have many friends from the NE who winter here in Northern Palm Beach County. They find that a seasonal rental is more affordable. States get their moneys from somewhere. Florida makes up for zero income tax in sales and property taxes. With a covid decimated economy both sales and property taxes will be going up as well as medical insurance. Run your numbers. You may find more affordable options in the Cape Coral Fort Meyers area on the west coast or Melbourne Palm
Bay on the east coast.
[/quote

great points to consider. honestly, i thought we could afford to do something like this, but to get what we want in this area is just so very expensive. i put these posts on here to get a reality check. And I appreciate getting one from all of the input I receive. I think we will continue to purge excess in our current home and enjoy what we have, and try to stop having beach lust (me). :D
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debrajo61
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by debrajo61 »

Escapevelocity wrote: Tue Jul 21, 2020 9:51 am I'm not comprehending why you are even considering a mortgage. Your pensions are more than enough to live on as far as your ongoing expenses are concerned. Why wouldn't you simply pay cash for the house using some combination of your taxable investments, savings, and Roth accounts?
its an option. we are in flux and looking at pros and cons. as days or months go by, it seems we are probably better off sitting tight in our home as long as we can (we are happy here but its too big, has a large yard to maintain, etc), watching the housing market in Florida, and continue renting seasonally....depending on how covid goes in the next few months. thank you.
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debrajo61
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by debrajo61 »

Escapevelocity wrote: Tue Jul 21, 2020 9:55 am
Sailorgirl wrote: Mon Jul 20, 2020 8:45 pm I am not sure that you can afford a house in that price 500 to 600k range even with just a mortgage of 150 to 200K without being house poor.
How are you reaching this conclusion? They have huge pensions and sizeable Roth accounts that will do nothing but sit there without a purpose other than leaving to their heirs".
i dont see us being house poor, what i do see is that a move to Florida will cost more which we do understand. Housing is much more. Insurance for car and home, wind, flood if needed is very high, food prices are higher, utilities are higher. We do know all of this and that is why we are stuck at $600-650k price point as max for a home or condo. honestly, it is hard to find something we want bad enough, that is nice enough, to spend that kind of money at present (there really is nothing there, and people are overpaying in my opinion...something we wont do (except on the house we bid on last week....a beauty that apparently many others agreed on this point and bid higher. This really shocked us into the reality of the current market there. The home we bid on was listed at $479k. It went for 560k w/ cash buyer, there were 21 offers in 36 hours).
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debrajo61
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by debrajo61 »

midareff wrote: Tue Jul 21, 2020 8:42 am
Gill wrote: Mon Jul 20, 2020 11:40 am Are you sure the market in Florida is "on fire"? I live in a very desirable part of Florida and that is certainly not the case here.
Gill
Certainly not true in Miami or Fort Lauderdale either..... have been looking from time to time in Fort Myers and not true there either. I think the only "fire" is in the news reports which also report there are many millions of defaults and foreclosures about to happen in the next few weeks as protections expire.
i can only speak for what we are seeing in Pinellas County near St. Pete, Treasure Island, Seminole, Indian Rocks Beach areas. And that is at present and in the past couple months. Have a look at what's for sale in that price range from Indian Rock Beach down to Tierre Verde in our range. Pretty much zilch, and what is any good is gone in a day or two. I do agree Fort Myers is completely different. Lots to choose from, but not the area we want either. Thanks.
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debrajo61
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by debrajo61 »

snackdog wrote: Tue Jul 21, 2020 5:18 am How about renting our your Chicago house now and renting a condo in FL? At your age I don’t recommend another house. If you like it after a full year including hurricane season, sell in IL.

I don’t recommend buying, as you nearly did, over the internet while owning a house in IL. STOP looking at real estate online until you live there!
oh my gosh my husband says the same thing...stop the madness. I have had too much time on my hands, got him on my bandwagon, and here i am now asking you all for input. I get what you are saying and trust me we have thought all of these same things.
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debrajo61
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by debrajo61 »

Watty wrote: Tue Jul 21, 2020 12:51 am With all your uncertainty about what to do one option would be to just sell your house then rent a place in Florida for a year so your can really decide what you want to do.

It sounds like your house will take a while to sell so by the time it sells there may be a lot more clarity with what is happening with COVID.

I did not add up all the numbers but if you sell your house it looks like you will have well over $2 million in funds, large pensions, and maybe Social Security too(that was not clear). There is no need for a mortgage and you can pretty much do whatever the heck you want to do.

--------------------------------

Whenever someone posts about having large TSP accounts I try to remind them that they have different inheritance rules. Here is what I have posted about that before.
Be sure that you understand that the TSP inheritance laws are different than IRA inheritance laws and they are sometimes worse. There is a wiki on this;

https://www.bogleheads.org/wiki/TSP_estate_planning

There was a post awhile back where where someone had run into this situation;

1) Dad had a large TSP, he died and left it to his wife.
2) Wife left the money in the TSP as a beneficiary participant, that worked OK for her.
3) A few years later the wife died and left the TSP to their kid. 

The problem was because of the TSP inheritance rules that the kid could not roll the money out to an inherited IRA and they could also not leave the money in the beneficiary participant account so the kid had to withdraw the money and pay taxes on it. If either the Mom or Dad had rolled the money into an IRA then the kid could have avoided, or at least delayed, a six figure tax bill since they could have the money in an inherited IRA.

You might want to consider rolling the money out to an IRA.

When I have posted about this before there have occasionally been comments to the effect of "I will leave a note for my wife to roll the money out to an IRA if I die first." I would not want to count on an 80 year old recently widowed person actually doing that.

interesting and something we did not know. thank you for this. will research this more.
megabad
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by megabad »

Agree with others, you can definitely do it if you want. You don’t give your expenses but I am assuming you could likely nearly live on just the pensions. Just make sure you get what you want for the future long term. I think the suggestions to move and rent for now are great as this gives you time to figure things out. I don’t understand any of your logic about being forced to get a mortgage (or, for that matter being “forced” to spend 500k to get a nice home), but that doesn’t matter. If you are asking whether you can afford to spend maybe 20k more per year on a more expensive home, my answer is yes unless your current expenses are very high (you state they aren’t).. Only you can decide whether it is worth it. They are an unlimited number of great options that cost less (and more).
tibbitts
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by tibbitts »

You have plenty of wealth to be able to do anything you want, but there is no urgency here to move at a time when a trip to the grocery store is a major expedition. And I'm not buying into this one area that happens to be (from what people have said here) the least buyer-friendly real estate market on the planet being the only place you'd enjoy living, among all the coastal areas available to you. I'd completely understand if your kids where there, but they aren't and apparently aren't planning to be(?) Even if you knew other people in the area it's not like you could spend time with any of them now. Well I guess you could, while masked and six feet apart, and not touching any common surfaces.

I don't remember if you said but have you rented in the area in summer?
hudson
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by hudson »

I enjoyed the discussion. I learned a lot about Florida real estate from experts!
Those places sound tempting, but when I look at Google Maps, it looks crowded; Tampa almost reaches to Lakeland.
Where are the mountains?
I'll probably just stick it out....out in the semi-rural mid-Atlantic.
Escapevelocity
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by Escapevelocity »

By the way, why Florida? If it's not a family hub, why not San Diego? No brutal summers to contend with.
Broken Man 1999
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by Broken Man 1999 »

hudson wrote: Tue Jul 21, 2020 12:00 pm I enjoyed the discussion. I learned a lot about Florida real estate from experts!
Those places sound tempting, but when I look at Google Maps, it looks crowded; Tampa almost reaches to Lakeland.
Where are the mountains?
I'll probably just stick it out....out in the semi-rural mid-Atlantic.
Mount Dora!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Dora,_Florida

Thats all we got, other than maybe Spook Hill!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spook_HillThats all we got, other than maybe Spook Hill!

Well, actually the highest elevation in Florida is Britton Hill, but not much there.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Britton_Hill

My casa is perched at an amazingly high level of 76' above mean sea level.

Broken Man 1999
“If I cannot drink Bourbon and smoke cigars in Heaven then I shall not go. " -Mark Twain
megabad
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by megabad »

Escapevelocity wrote: Tue Jul 21, 2020 12:11 pm By the way, why Florida? If it's not a family hub, why not San Diego? No brutal summers to contend with.
Because money? Florida is definitely a jump in cost of living from Illinois but we are talking another planet of expenses to go to CA though. I agree that the weather is nice though.
hudson
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by hudson »

Broken Man 1999 wrote: Tue Jul 21, 2020 12:31 pm My casa is perched at an amazingly high level of 76' above mean sea level.
Broken Man 1999
Thanks! So, no reports of altitude sickness?
My parents met and married in Florida during WW2. My dad was at McDill Field; my mother was at Drew Field; both airfields were B29 Bomber training bases. They were there from 1943 to 1945. My dad repeated something like "One a day in Tampa Bay." They also talked about a restaurant in the Spanish Section of Tampa that served green beans in the salad.
When I passed through the area 50 years ago, I just remember some little town that had great strawberries in March....Plant City.
Robdac
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by Robdac »

Do it.

We moved a family of four from Illinois, near St. Louis, to Broward county six years ago. Aside from the current, temporary, COVID issues it's been one of the best decisions we've ever made.

In our case getting out from under IL income and property taxes made the decision even easier. It was like getting a noticeable raise right onto our paychecks.

The summers down here are no joke however. Both my wife and I like to exercise outdoors. During summer that usually occurs shortly after dawn. You already know winter is heaven here.

There is no situation where I can imagine moving back to The People's Republic of Illinois. Last one out please turn off the lights, they can't afford the electric bill.

Bogleheads are about financial responsibility. Illinois doesn't understand what that means. That's why they have one of the highest net migrations out of Illinois to other states.

https://www.illinoispolicy.org/illinois ... ight-year/
e5116
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by e5116 »

megabad wrote: Tue Jul 21, 2020 12:40 pm
Escapevelocity wrote: Tue Jul 21, 2020 12:11 pm By the way, why Florida? If it's not a family hub, why not San Diego? No brutal summers to contend with.
Because money? Florida is definitely a jump in cost of living from Illinois but we are talking another planet of expenses to go to CA though. I agree that the weather is nice though.
FL and IL are pretty comparable in cost according to most measures....
https://worldpopulationreview.com/state ... x-by-state

Of course, the OP is looking at a much more expensive area in FL than they live in IL from a housing perspective. But I'm sure there are plenty of areas in FL that have much cheaper real estate than the expensive areas of IL.

FL may have a bit higher prices on groceries and the like, but IL has much higher taxes than FL. Suffice it to say, OP could easily choose a cheaper area of FL should they choose that is comparable to most parts of IL. Having said all that, I agree that there shouldn't really be a rush, and perhaps renting and living there for a bit longer makes the most sense. I don't' understand the rush. With the pensions and investments, should be set to do what you want....and renting gives way more flexibility.

I certainly agree that CA is another level of cost.
PoppyA
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by PoppyA »

And if you are leaving in part because of high taxes, don’t move to another state and continue to perpetuate the things that cause those high taxes. Please.
chipperd
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by chipperd »

OP: Great area, we love Madeira Beach! Best of luck.
"A portfolio is like a bar of soap, the more it's handled, the less there is." Dr. William Bernstein
GreenLawn
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by GreenLawn »

Escapevelocity wrote: Tue Jul 21, 2020 12:11 pm By the way, why Florida? If it's not a family hub, why not San Diego? No brutal summers to contend with.
I've lived in both San Diego and Florida. San Diego has much nicer weather. When folks say the summers are rough in Florida, keep in mind the summers are very long in Florida. Always rent for a year first. Plus you get to check out the traffic, culture, cost of auto insurance etc. And the alligators! I love the gators, we have several in the lake behind us. I'm always disappointed when I take my walk and I don't see my prehistoric friends :D
Broken Man 1999
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by Broken Man 1999 »

PoppyA wrote: Tue Jul 21, 2020 2:59 pm And if you are leaving in part because of high taxes, don’t move to another state and continue to perpetuate the things that cause those high taxes. Please.
Amen!

Natives love newbies. Anyone having a home for many years has low property taxes relative to someone just moving in. The newbies will have their home "marked to market" if they buy an existing house, and their taxes might multiples of what the previous owner might have been paying.

However, over time, newbies taxes won't go crazy, as Florida has a program like Prop 13 in CA.

If a newbie buys new, same idea. Taxes capped, but higher to start with.

Basically newbies fund the growth somewhat with property taxes, tourists via bed taxes and general sales taxes.

Florida is certainly built up around pretty much all the coastline, but still rural away from the coastlines.

You need some serious $$$ to live on/near the water.

My BIL lives in south Florida and his corner condo overlooks the Intercoastal Waterway. His condo has boat docks which can can add another $100K, if you can even score one. Anytime docks are become available they are usually scooped up before they are listed.

He has a boat, but has to trailer it and store it in the condo compound area. But at least he can launch it at the condo's boat ramp to get out to the ocean. So he is OK without a dock, but it would be nice to be able to hoist it out of the water to take care of the boat's bottom.

He visited this past weekend, and said houses are in great demand north of him up towards the Palm Beach area.

Broken Man 1999
“If I cannot drink Bourbon and smoke cigars in Heaven then I shall not go. " -Mark Twain
megabad
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by megabad »

Broken Man 1999 wrote: Tue Jul 21, 2020 4:11 pm
PoppyA wrote: Tue Jul 21, 2020 2:59 pm And if you are leaving in part because of high taxes, don’t move to another state and continue to perpetuate the things that cause those high taxes. Please.
Amen!

Natives love newbies. Anyone having a home for many years has low property taxes relative to someone just moving in. The newbies will have their home "marked to market" if they buy an existing house, and their taxes might multiples of what the previous owner might have been paying.

However, over time, newbies taxes won't go crazy, as Florida has a program like Prop 13 in CA.
Just wanted to point out that this is not how property taxes work in the vast majority of the US. CA is an oddity (along with a few other places).
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by Broken Man 1999 »

megabad wrote: Tue Jul 21, 2020 4:19 pm
Broken Man 1999 wrote: Tue Jul 21, 2020 4:11 pm
PoppyA wrote: Tue Jul 21, 2020 2:59 pm And if you are leaving in part because of high taxes, don’t move to another state and continue to perpetuate the things that cause those high taxes. Please.
Amen!

Natives love newbies. Anyone having a home for many years has low property taxes relative to someone just moving in. The newbies will have their home "marked to market" if they buy an existing house, and their taxes might multiples of what the previous owner might have been paying.

However, over time, newbies taxes won't go crazy, as Florida has a program like Prop 13 in CA.
Just wanted to point out that this is not how property taxes work in the vast majority of the US. CA is an oddity (along with a few other places).
True. I'm happy Florida is an oddity, but I am certainly glad we have no other oddities that seem to be resident in CA.


Broken Man 1999
“If I cannot drink Bourbon and smoke cigars in Heaven then I shall not go. " -Mark Twain
go_mets
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Re: Govt Retirees Considering Relocating Permanently from IL to FL - Input and Thoughts Pls

Post by go_mets »

debrajo61 wrote: Tue Jul 21, 2020 11:08 am
go_mets wrote: Mon Jul 20, 2020 8:00 pm I guess I am not sure why the rush.
I personally would wait to see how the everything shakes out over winter.

I had planned on selling my home and buying another home in a 55+ community in the area this summer.
I had gone to open houses before everything was shut down in March.
Now I am waiting to see how things pan out and make the move next year.


.
i agree. i'm just looking for input. i think that is what we are going to do. honestly, why the rush? in reality there is no rush. we have both had too much time on our hands since returning from winter in Florida and I think became overly focused on this. We are taking a step back now and we are going to see how things go in the next few months. we already have winter rentals so we are actually pretty well set if we want to continue the path we were on. thank you.
With regards to property taxes, does Illinois offer a "rebate" for seniors?

I was toying with the idea of moving to Delaware.
It was mentioned by someone else in another thread.
Worth a look. More moderate weather but not the humidity of Florida. And if you like beaches, there are beaches.

.
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