Capital One is at it again

Non-investing personal finance issues including insurance, credit, real estate, taxes, employment and legal issues such as trusts and wills
Topic Author
JD2775
Posts: 608
Joined: Thu Jul 09, 2015 10:47 pm

Capital One is at it again

Post by JD2775 »

Just noticed....MM account interest went from 1.3% to 0.8 %. I have been with them for a lonnnng time and hesitate to move anywhere, but this is kind of ridiculous. Seems like not too long ago it was 2.4%. Maybe this drop is standard though in these times, across all banks
sailaway
Posts: 2223
Joined: Fri May 12, 2017 1:11 pm

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by sailaway »

JD2775 wrote: Wed Jun 17, 2020 10:21 pm Just noticed....MM account interest went from 1.3% to 0.8 %. I have been with them for a lonnnng time and hesitate to move anywhere, but this is kind of ridiculous. Seems like not too long ago it was 2.4%. Maybe this drop is standard though in these times, across all banks
That seems a bit extreme. I believe my HYS went from 2.1 (not easy to check on past rates) to 1.0 (as of today).
fyre4ce
Posts: 953
Joined: Sun Aug 06, 2017 11:29 am

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by fyre4ce »

It is standard... interest rates have dropped everywhere, for both borrowing and lending. It's not a specific issue with Capital One. Rates fluctuate, and different banks will have the best rate at any particular point in time. Capital One tends to be one of the better ones, but usually not at the very top.

You can check rates here: https://www.bankrate.com/banking/savings/rates/
System1
Posts: 18
Joined: Thu Sep 12, 2019 10:08 pm

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by System1 »

You have to switch over to their new "Performance" savings accounts for the best rate, the MM is no longer the best. Although this rate is not particularly high, 1.0 today. I moved mine 6 months ago or so.
02nz
Posts: 5555
Joined: Wed Feb 21, 2018 3:17 pm

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by 02nz »

System1 wrote: Wed Jun 17, 2020 10:46 pm You have to switch over to their new "Performance" savings accounts for the best rate, the MM is no longer the best. Although this rate is not particularly high, 1.0 today. I moved mine 6 months ago or so.
Ally and Marcus don’t pull this slimy trick. And they tend to make promos available to existing customers as well. Two reasons I don’t keep any money with Capital One.
JackoC
Posts: 1719
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2018 11:14 am

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by JackoC »

02nz wrote: Wed Jun 17, 2020 11:07 pm
System1 wrote: Wed Jun 17, 2020 10:46 pm You have to switch over to their new "Performance" savings accounts for the best rate, the MM is no longer the best. Although this rate is not particularly high, 1.0 today. I moved mine 6 months ago or so.
Ally and Marcus don’t pull this slimy trick. And they tend to make promos available to existing customers as well. Two reasons I don’t keep any money with Capital One.
I don't see the slimy trick particularly. The MM account was highest at some point but not for awhile. As to promotions, there was at least till very recently a $450 bonus for existing Performance Savings accounts if you put in $50k for 3 months, check out if it's still going. It was $500 for new customers. I have $50k at work May-August to get that one. It's a bit of a downer they've so far lowered the rate from 1.3% to 1% whereas two of my other HYSA's were in the 1.30's then, and so far still are. But still worth it for the bonus, account to be drained once the bonus posts unless Cap 1 is best rate by then. But Cap 1 hasn't been tops on rates recently. The periodic existing customer bonuses are the reason to maintain accounts with them. This will be the second bonus I've gotten for keeping $50k for 3 months in Performance Savings in less than a year.
User avatar
Kenkat
Posts: 6667
Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 11:18 am
Location: Cincinnati, OH

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by Kenkat »

I think you should expect rates for online savings accounts to fall given what has happened with interest rates in general - treasuries near zero, etc.

That said, I used to have a CapitalOne 360 account but when rates started to rise after the great recession (08-09) around 2011-12, CapitalOne was very slow to raise their interest rate on the 360 account. I ended up moving back to PrimeMM but recently moved back to an online savings account, this time at Discover Bank. They are paying 1.05% currently.
3funder
Posts: 1448
Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2017 9:35 pm

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by 3funder »

fyre4ce wrote: Wed Jun 17, 2020 10:31 pm It is standard... interest rates have dropped everywhere, for both borrowing and lending. It's not a specific issue with Capital One. Rates fluctuate, and different banks will have the best rate at any particular point in time. Capital One tends to be one of the better ones, but usually not at the very top.

You can check rates here: https://www.bankrate.com/banking/savings/rates/
+1
02nz
Posts: 5555
Joined: Wed Feb 21, 2018 3:17 pm

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by 02nz »

JackoC wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 8:50 am
02nz wrote: Wed Jun 17, 2020 11:07 pm
System1 wrote: Wed Jun 17, 2020 10:46 pm You have to switch over to their new "Performance" savings accounts for the best rate, the MM is no longer the best. Although this rate is not particularly high, 1.0 today. I moved mine 6 months ago or so.
Ally and Marcus don’t pull this slimy trick. And they tend to make promos available to existing customers as well. Two reasons I don’t keep any money with Capital One.
I don't see the slimy trick particularly. The MM account was highest at some point but not for awhile. As to promotions, there was at least till very recently a $450 bonus for existing Performance Savings accounts if you put in $50k for 3 months, check out if it's still going. It was $500 for new customers. I have $50k at work May-August to get that one. It's a bit of a downer they've so far lowered the rate from 1.3% to 1% whereas two of my other HYSA's were in the 1.30's then, and so far still are. But still worth it for the bonus, account to be drained once the bonus posts unless Cap 1 is best rate by then. But Cap 1 hasn't been tops on rates recently. The periodic existing customer bonuses are the reason to maintain accounts with them. This will be the second bonus I've gotten for keeping $50k for 3 months in Performance Savings in less than a year.
MM account was highest until they created they "new" Performance Savings account. Since then MM account has always had a worse rate. Many (probably most) existing customers don't pay close attention to this stuff and so didn't switch, so this was an easy way for Capital One to pay less interest to most of them. I'm not aware of any real difference between MM and Performance Savings - they could easily have converted everyone or given MM accounts the same rate. That's what I find slimy.

As for promos - the existing customers are targeted and I was not. Ally and Marcus offers are generally open to all to enroll.
User avatar
SmileyFace
Posts: 5684
Joined: Wed Feb 19, 2014 10:11 am

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by SmileyFace »

I used to have an ING High-Interest Savings Account which then became Capital One 360. They eventually stopped being in the top group of interest-rates (I have been watching rates for years). Synchrony, Marcus, Ally, and (to a lesser degree) Barclays have been the 4 bigger online banks that have seemed to stay consistently in the top tier (all recently dropped rates as well but all are still greater than 1%) the last few years (others come and go) so I would go with one of these for HY Savings unless you are sticking with CapOne because you like their other account types and services for some reason. Personally my preference is Marcus.
CycloRista
Posts: 173
Joined: Sun Feb 16, 2020 11:53 am

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by CycloRista »

Not atypical for rates to slide. I have avoided Capital One for a long time due to other encounters (as a past customer of an acquired bank) and negative experiences some of my former colleagues had with them.

I use Ally and a local brick and mortar bank that both have slightly better interest rates.
JackoC
Posts: 1719
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2018 11:14 am

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by JackoC »

02nz wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 9:19 am
JackoC wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 8:50 am
02nz wrote: Wed Jun 17, 2020 11:07 pm
System1 wrote: Wed Jun 17, 2020 10:46 pm You have to switch over to their new "Performance" savings accounts for the best rate, the MM is no longer the best. Although this rate is not particularly high, 1.0 today. I moved mine 6 months ago or so.
Ally and Marcus don’t pull this slimy trick. And they tend to make promos available to existing customers as well. Two reasons I don’t keep any money with Capital One.
I don't see the slimy trick particularly. The MM account was highest at some point but not for awhile. As to promotions, there was at least till very recently a $450 bonus for existing Performance Savings accounts if you put in $50k for 3 months, check out if it's still going. It was $500 for new customers. I have $50k at work May-August to get that one. It's a bit of a downer they've so far lowered the rate from 1.3% to 1% whereas two of my other HYSA's were in the 1.30's then, and so far still are. But still worth it for the bonus, account to be drained once the bonus posts unless Cap 1 is best rate by then. But Cap 1 hasn't been tops on rates recently. The periodic existing customer bonuses are the reason to maintain accounts with them. This will be the second bonus I've gotten for keeping $50k for 3 months in Performance Savings in less than a year.
MM account was highest until they created they "new" Performance Savings account. Since then MM account has always had a worse rate. Many (probably most) existing customers don't pay close attention to this stuff and so didn't switch, so this was an easy way for Capital One to pay less interest to most of them. I'm not aware of any real difference between MM and Performance Savings - they could easily have converted everyone or given MM accounts the same rate. That's what I find slimy.

As for promos - the existing customers are targeted and I was not. Ally and Marcus offers are generally open to all to enroll.
I think the recent bonus offers from Cap 1 were both existing and new; but maybe ads not sent to all existing. As to similar accounts with different names/rates and they don't specifically tell you to switch to the highest I guess I can see not liking that. CIT has done that too. But I'm highly rate/bonus driven. Ally's 11 mo no-penalty CD 1.50% was best recently, and I got it. Otherwise they aren't top so I have nothing else with them. Marcus has never been top than I can remember so I've never opened an account. Again I have $50k in Cap 1 Performance Savings because they'll give my $450 after 3 months, money coming out as soon as they pay the bonus. Besides the Ally NPCD, we have serious savings account balances with SFGI (1.36%) and Live Oak (1.35%). I don' t mind having dormant savings accounts to start back up again if they have the best rate or an existing customer bonus. My Ally account was sleeping a couple of yrs till they recently had that CD offer.
User avatar
nisiprius
Advisory Board
Posts: 41948
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2007 9:33 am
Location: The terrestrial, globular, planetary hunk of matter, flattened at the poles, is my abode.--O. Henry

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by nisiprius »

Thank you for the alert. I agree that Capital One is sleazy in the sense that it is like pulling teeth simply to find out what interest rate all of my accounts are earning. They don't just show it to you in one consolidated view, and they don't show it to you on any screen by default. You have to go to the specific account and click on the microscopic I-in-a-circle "view details," and from there you have to click on "current terms and conditions" to refresh your memory of minimums and limits.

I could swear I remember Capital One sending me emails about interest rate changes, but perhaps they only do that for increases.

No, there's nothing illegal about this, but it is sleazy and IMHO it shows a bad attitude toward customers.

It's also true that bank rates are dropping like a rock, and Capital One gives an exaggerated appearance of high rates by doing it just slightly slower than others. My local brick-and-mortar bank cut their rates drastically a few months ago and I started to wonder "hmmm... should I move most of my money from their to Capital One 360?" I decided to wait and see, and Capital One is now only marginally higher. If I'd done nothing at all--my biggest account at Capital One was a 360 Money Market--I'd be getting 0.80% at Capital One versus 0.59% at the local bank.
Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen nineteen and six, result happiness; Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pounds ought and six, result misery.
j0nnyg1984
Posts: 747
Joined: Sun Apr 24, 2016 9:55 am

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by j0nnyg1984 »

I’ve been a cap1 / ING customer for a long, long time, and I think it’s extremely sleazy for them to dump the MM rate like they did and add a new “performance Saving” account. I have put up with Cap1 not having the best rates because I’ve always had great experiences - their free mailed check service has never failed me, transfers are fast, etc. but I’ve moved almost all of my money to other banks now and will be looking for somewhere else to send my direct deposits and future money.
Topic Author
JD2775
Posts: 608
Joined: Thu Jul 09, 2015 10:47 pm

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by JD2775 »

nisiprius wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 9:42 am Thank you for the alert. I agree that Capital One is sleazy in the sense that it is like pulling teeth simply to find out what interest rate all of my accounts are earning. They don't just show it to you in one consolidated view, and they don't show it to you on any screen by default. You have to go to the specific account and click on the microscopic I-in-a-circle "view details," and from there you have to click on "current terms and conditions" to refresh your memory of minimums and limits.

I could swear I remember Capital One sending me emails about interest rate changes, but perhaps they only do that for increases.

No, there's nothing illegal about this, but it is sleazy and IMHO it shows a bad attitude toward customers.

It's also true that bank rates are dropping like a rock, and Capital One gives an exaggerated appearance of high rates by doing it just slightly slower than others. My local brick-and-mortar bank cut their rates drastically a few months ago and I started to wonder "hmmm... should I move most of my money from their to Capital One 360?" I decided to wait and see, and Capital One is now only marginally higher. If I'd done nothing at all--my biggest account at Capital One was a 360 Money Market--I'd be getting 0.80% at Capital One versus 0.59% at the local bank.
Ha, good point. Didn't think of that...they DO send you alerts for increases, never for decreases though. As you said you need to dig around and find that for yourself.
Jack FFR1846
Posts: 12635
Joined: Tue Dec 31, 2013 7:05 am
Location: 26 miles, 385 yards west of Copley Square

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by Jack FFR1846 »

I'm happy with my promo 2.5% at Ally for adding $25k (dancing bear emoji)

Otherwise, Redneck Bank tends to stay near to top at 1.35% up to $50k.
Bogle: Smart Beta is stupid
User avatar
AAA
Posts: 1384
Joined: Sat Jan 12, 2008 8:56 am

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by AAA »

02nz wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 9:19 am
MM account was highest until they created they "new" Performance Savings account. Since then MM account has always had a worse rate. Many (probably most) existing customers don't pay close attention to this stuff and so didn't switch, so this was an easy way for Capital One to pay less interest to most of them. I'm not aware of any real difference between MM and Performance Savings - they could easily have converted everyone or given MM accounts the same rate. That's what I find slimy.
I tend to agree. My original ING account was changed to a Capital One 360 account but at some point I noticed the MM account had a better interest rate. I called Capital One and they switched me over right then and there. I realized recently that they were no longer promoting the MM account and the Performance Savings account seemed a better deal. So I called them again to switch me over but they said they couldn't - I'd have to go from scratch through the process of applying for a Performance Savings account. I don't think I'll be doing that. I'll probably just let what I have in MM dwindle down or just transfer it somewhere else. I don't want to be playing these sorts of games.
User avatar
Kenkat
Posts: 6667
Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 11:18 am
Location: Cincinnati, OH

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by Kenkat »

j0nnyg1984 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 9:56 am I’ve been a cap1 / ING customer for a long, long time, and I think it’s extremely sleazy for them to dump the MM rate like they did and add a new “performance Saving” account. I have put up with Cap1 not having the best rates because I’ve always had great experiences - their free mailed check service has never failed me, transfers are fast, etc. but I’ve moved almost all of my money to other banks now and will be looking for somewhere else to send my direct deposits and future money.
Yes, this is what ultimately led me away from CapOne. I too started with an ING Orange which became a CapitalOne 360. Then they created a new CapitalOne Money Market with better rates. Now it sounds like the Performance Savings is their newer product with better rates than the money market. I think they are occasionally switching which type of account pays the best rate knowing there will be some inertia with current customers that aren’t paying attention and don’t move to the new / better account, No thanks, see ya CapitalOne.
sport
Posts: 9527
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 3:26 pm
Location: Cleveland, OH

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by sport »

In my experience, all banks are sleazy. It's just that some are worse than others. My bank recently offered a money market account with an attractive rate. HOWEVER, the minimum amount was $25K, the rate was for only 3 months, and it was only available for "new money", that is money not already on deposit at that bank.
02nz
Posts: 5555
Joined: Wed Feb 21, 2018 3:17 pm

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by 02nz »

sport wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 10:42 am In my experience, all banks are sleazy. It's just that some are worse than others. My bank recently offered a money market account with an attractive rate. HOWEVER, the minimum amount was $25K, the rate was for only 3 months, and it was only available for "new money", that is money not already on deposit at that bank.
All banks are money-making operations. But Marcus and Ally don't pull the shenanigans with interest rates and account types that Capital One does. And they inform customers about interest rate changes up AND down.
CFM300
Posts: 1977
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2007 5:13 am

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by CFM300 »

Just chiming in as another person who stared with ING. I believe it was originally called Orange Savings, then became ING Direct, then was acquired by Capital One and rebranded 360 Savings.

Periodically, I'd log in and see that my rate had plummeted and that they had a new product offering a much higher return. So I'd sign up for the new thing and then transfer the money. Like others, I did that twice -- moving from Capital One 360 to Capital One Money Market to Capital One Performance Savings. Each time I thought, why didn't they just migrate me automatically or at least send me an email notice?

I recently closed all of the Capital One accounts and moved everything to AMEX Savings.

I thought about starting a thread entitled "Disappointed with Capital One" but decided not to. :D (Inside joke, for some.)
FootballFan5548
Posts: 255
Joined: Mon May 01, 2017 2:20 pm

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by FootballFan5548 »

I've got about $50k emergency fund with CapOne360 MM. I'm annoyed to see the rate tumble, but I think that's just the way interest rates are right now.
I have a very small amount in the TIP ETF at Merrill Edge. Should I take most of my emergency fund and move it over to the TIP ETF? I do most of my actual banking with Bank of America, and since Cap One Investments shut down moved all my taxable to Merrill Edge. TIP ETF probably has a little more risk, but should still be safe and offer a slightly better yield.
azianbob
Posts: 354
Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2019 6:53 pm

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by azianbob »

CIT bank does the same thing, every several months they create a new money market or savings that has a higher rate and lower the rates the previous one so you have to be checking and create the new account yourself and move the money over.

I used to have their money market, but the rate kept dropping then found out they had a new savings builder one with a higher rate so moved it over, then like 6 months later realized they had a new money market with a higher rate so had to move it over again … it now only 0.1% higher than Ally so considering if its worth it to deal with these shenanigans
abc132
Posts: 387
Joined: Thu Oct 18, 2018 1:11 am

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by abc132 »

Capital One had my back when a computer company sent me a computer that would get the blue screen of death.

It was beyond their 30 day return policy, and capital one used their muscle to get me every penny of that $8000 computer back. No restocking fee, nothing.

I couldn't be happier with my Capital One experience.

I can say that I have had other credit card companies change their due date, and perform all kinds of shady tricks.

Capital One is one of the best for integrity and service, and if you want to go to some discount credit union for a better rate, by all means do so.

Adjusting rates according to their own returns is anything but shady.
JLJL
Posts: 484
Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2014 11:10 pm

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by JLJL »

System1 wrote: Wed Jun 17, 2020 10:46 pm You have to switch over to their new "Performance" savings accounts for the best rate, the MM is no longer the best. Although this rate is not particularly high, 1.0 today. I moved mine 6 months ago or so.
Yup. I learned about this on here about a month ago (of course not from CapOne). Moved it at 1.5%, then 1.3%, now 1.0%. At least I got a couple weeks of the non-bonused 1.5% teaser rate.

Yes rates are dropping but this is joke-territory.
JLJL
Posts: 484
Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2014 11:10 pm

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by JLJL »

abc132 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 1:28 pm Capital One had my back when a computer company sent me a computer that would get the blue screen of death.

It was beyond their 30 day return policy, and capital one used their muscle to get me every penny of that $8000 computer back. No restocking fee, nothing.

I couldn't be happier with my Capital One experience.

I can say that I have had other credit card companies change their due date, and perform all kinds of shady tricks.

Capital One is one of the best for integrity and service, and if you want to go to some discount credit union for a better rate, by all means do so.

Adjusting rates according to their own returns is anything but shady.
They don't notify you they are reducing your interest rate. They don't notify you when there is another "type" of savings account that is earning DOUBLE what your rate has been reduced to, even after having money with them for a decade. Shady.
abc132
Posts: 387
Joined: Thu Oct 18, 2018 1:11 am

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by abc132 »

A money market account is a variable rate investment.


Would anyone here complain less if they were notified?

I seriously doubt it.


Behavioral error increases with frequency of checking accounts, and if you don't know what you bought, you have the right to complain, but it is of your own doing.

Did you read what you bought?

Did they promise you to notify you with every rate change, and not deliver?

You can log in and check your rate, the same way you can check your stock balance to decide when to buy or sell them. Or you could have bought a CD for at least 3.00% that is not a variable rate investment. You have to live with your own choices, I guess.
02nz
Posts: 5555
Joined: Wed Feb 21, 2018 3:17 pm

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by 02nz »

abc132 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 1:41 pm A money market account is a variable rate investment.


Would anyone here complain less if they were notified?

I seriously doubt it.


Behavioral error increases with frequency of checking accounts, and if you don't know what you bought, you have the right to complain, but it is of your own doing.

Did you read what you bought?

Did they promise you to notify you with every rate change, and not deliver?

You can log in and check your rate, the same way you can check your stock balance to decide when to buy or sell them. Or you could have bought a CD for at least 3.00% that is not a variable rate investment. You have to live with your own choices, I guess.
Nobody is saying a savings account should have a fixed rate. Rates are dropping, we get that. What's shady is when Capital One, CIT, and others create a new type of account, and only the new one has a competitive rate, while rates on existing accounts become uncompetitive. When you add the lack of notification about rate changes and difficulty of seeing the actual rate (both in contrast to Ally and Marcus, who put it right on their home pages, no need to even log in), yeah, I think it's totally fair to call it shady.

Also, why do you say that "behavioral error increases with frequency of checking accounts"? That would mean that we should not look at the accounts, like people sometimes recommend with retirement accounts? But then we'd never know when the rate changed, at least with Capital One, since it doesn't notify customers about dropping rates. :confused
abc132
Posts: 387
Joined: Thu Oct 18, 2018 1:11 am

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by abc132 »

02nz wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 1:54 pm
Nobody is saying a savings account should have a fixed rate. Rates are dropping, we get that. What's shady is when Capital One, CIT, and others create a new type of account, and only the new one has a competitive rate, while rates on existing accounts become uncompetitive. When you add the lack of notification about rate changes and difficulty of seeing the actual rate (both in contrast to Ally and Marcus, who put it right on their home pages, no need to even log in), yeah, I think it's totally fair to call it shady.
You are free to invest in a company that sends you a notification every time one of their products has a change. Most people would be annoyed by the constant spamming. Capital One is a company that provides great services, and that is why you invest in them. People go to Capital One because of the variety of products and services they provide.

Ally is a company that tries to earn customers through their rates. Go there, and stop calling Capital One shady for delivering on what they promised. Shady is changing a due date to incur fees.

02nz wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 1:54 pm Also, why do you say that "behavioral error increases with frequency of checking accounts"? That would mean that we should not look at the accounts, like people sometimes recommend with retirement accounts? But then we'd never know when the rate changed, at least with Capital One, since it doesn't notify customers about dropping rates. :confused
I don't think those of you that get irate about a low money market rate (how much over the national average?) in a low interest rate environment are the target market for Capital One. Capital one gives good, but not the best rates, and you choose to use them if you like their services.

I think someone getting this mad about not being notified, and throwing shade at Capital One for delivering what they promised are going to be prone to behavioral errors - like investing in a product they don't understand.

Explain to us why you expected to be notified with every rate change, and how Capital One did not deliver on their promise. Their information is very easy to read.
livesoft
Posts: 73338
Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 8:00 pm

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by livesoft »

I don't think Capital One is in the business of Rose Gardens.
Wiki This signature message sponsored by sscritic: Learn to fish.
CFM300
Posts: 1977
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2007 5:13 am

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by CFM300 »

abc132 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 2:23 pm Explain to us why you expected to be notified with every rate change
It's not just that they drop rates without notification. It's that they MOVE the rate from the current product to a new product AND drop the rate on the old product AND that they do that without any notification.

Existing customers can continue to get the same (or sometimes even better) rate, but only if they notice and then sign up for the new product and transfer their money. It's annoying to have to chase rates within a company, but the lack of notification is annoying and disrespectful and feels intentionally designed to cost customers money.
abc132
Posts: 387
Joined: Thu Oct 18, 2018 1:11 am

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by abc132 »

CFM300 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 2:56 pm
abc132 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 2:23 pm Explain to us why you expected to be notified with every rate change
It's not just that they drop rates without notification. It's that they MOVE the rate from the current product to a new product AND drop the rate on the old product AND that they do that without any notification.

Existing customers can continue to get the same (or sometimes even better) rate, but only if they notice and then sign up for the new product and transfer their money. It's annoying to have to chase rates within a company, but the lack of notification is annoying and disrespectful and feels intentionally designed to cost customers money.
As far as I know, all of the companies offer specials and other products that would require you to comparisons shop. We have a thread here at Bogleheads for just such a reason. I find it hard to believe the people shopping around between different companies can't check their own rates at the same time they look at other rates for a better deal. I find it hard to believe that the people in this thread would not be comparison shopping if their rate was fixed, and that a change in rate really has little bearing when compared to the various other products that are always changing.

Banks offer better deals to new customers because of the value once into their system. You can benefit with a higher rate by being the person that pays attention, and grabs the best deal. They can offer a better deal because not everyone takes that deal.

The Boglehead that likes to pay attention to rates benefits from this process. From what I gather in this thread, most can now get a rate better than what they started with, as rates have dropped. Hardly something to complain about from someone comparing rates anyway.

I get the "my preference would be to have the rate displayed more easily", or "I would like to be notified with every change". Those are all preferences that are different from other people that don't even know their rate, or don't want to be spammed with every change.

Those of you upset with a bank offering specials have not paid attention to how banks work. A company that offer sales or specials is not shady. You either pay attention and look for the best deals, or you pay a higher price.

Make your choice.
User avatar
Horton
Posts: 744
Joined: Mon Jan 21, 2008 3:53 pm

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by Horton »

System1 wrote: Wed Jun 17, 2020 10:46 pm You have to switch over to their new "Performance" savings accounts for the best rate, the MM is no longer the best. Although this rate is not particularly high, 1.0 today. I moved mine 6 months ago or so.
Wasn’t aware of this until now, thanks! Time to switch :dollar
User avatar
peetsperk
Posts: 268
Joined: Wed Feb 04, 2015 4:02 pm

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by peetsperk »

I"ve said it once and I'll say it again, based on my experience, Capital One is not a quality company. I'm glad I kicked them to the curb in 2014!
leviathan
Posts: 46
Joined: Tue Jul 09, 2019 3:03 pm

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by leviathan »

Of course, I didn't read "disclosures" when I opened a new capital one savings account recently. Now I checked it. It says
"Rate Information - The Interest Rate on your account is 0.9954% with an Annual Percentage Yield of 1.00%. The interest rates and annual percentage yields are variable and may change at any time at our discretion."
I didn't expect that the rate can change this fast. During last a few days I moved all the money and bought some bond fund.
NewMoneyMustBeSmart
Posts: 376
Joined: Sat Jun 01, 2019 10:28 pm
Location: Midwest

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by NewMoneyMustBeSmart »

JD2775 wrote: Wed Jun 17, 2020 10:21 pm Just noticed....MM account interest went from 1.3% to 0.8 %. I have been with them for a lonnnng time and hesitate to move anywhere, but this is kind of ridiculous. Seems like not too long ago it was 2.4%. Maybe this drop is standard though in these times, across all banks
Just move. They don't even know who you are.
-- | Few are those who see with their own eyes and feel with their own hearts - Einstein
User avatar
anon_investor
Posts: 3458
Joined: Mon Jun 03, 2019 1:43 pm

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by anon_investor »

02nz wrote: Wed Jun 17, 2020 11:07 pm
System1 wrote: Wed Jun 17, 2020 10:46 pm You have to switch over to their new "Performance" savings accounts for the best rate, the MM is no longer the best. Although this rate is not particularly high, 1.0 today. I moved mine 6 months ago or so.
Ally and Marcus don’t pull this slimy trick. And they tend to make promos available to existing customers as well. Two reasons I don’t keep any money with Capital One.
+1.
Mudpuppy
Posts: 6445
Joined: Sat Aug 27, 2011 2:26 am
Location: Sunny California

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by Mudpuppy »

I've posted these links on past threads, so I'll post them again. Go to the CO rate disclosure page to see the current rate. No logins required.

360 Money Market: https://www.capitalone.com/bank/savings ... sclosures/
360 Performance Savings: https://www.capitalone.com/bank/savings ... sclosures/
abc132
Posts: 387
Joined: Thu Oct 18, 2018 1:11 am

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by abc132 »

Mudpuppy wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 7:27 pm I've posted these links on past threads, so I'll post them again. Go to the CO rate disclosure page to see the current rate. No logins required.

360 Money Market: https://www.capitalone.com/bank/savings ... sclosures/
360 Performance Savings: https://www.capitalone.com/bank/savings ... sclosures/
Thanks!

0.8% MM and 1.0% Savings at Capital One.

Is Ally really only giving 0.5%?

https://www.ally.com/bank/money-market-account/
Mudpuppy
Posts: 6445
Joined: Sat Aug 27, 2011 2:26 am
Location: Sunny California

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by Mudpuppy »

abc132 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 8:23 pm
Mudpuppy wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 7:27 pm I've posted these links on past threads, so I'll post them again. Go to the CO rate disclosure page to see the current rate. No logins required.

360 Money Market: https://www.capitalone.com/bank/savings ... sclosures/
360 Performance Savings: https://www.capitalone.com/bank/savings ... sclosures/
Thanks!

0.8% MM and 1.0% Savings at Capital One.

Is Ally really only giving 0.5%?

https://www.ally.com/bank/money-market-account/
Rates are just going down these days. It makes me wish I'd put the full 10k into I-Bonds back at the start of the year instead of my standard 5k.
CFM300
Posts: 1977
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2007 5:13 am

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by CFM300 »

abc132 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 8:23 pm Is Ally really only giving 0.5%?
1.10%

https://www.ally.com/bank/online-savings-account/
jharkin
Posts: 2596
Joined: Mon Mar 28, 2016 7:14 am
Location: Boston suburbs

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by jharkin »

Everybody is dropping rates. Yes CapOne was over 2 last year, but in 2010-2014ish they dropped as low as 0.5 with the rest of the market.

Now THAT stung, as just a few years before we where getting 3.5-5% before the GFC.
abc132
Posts: 387
Joined: Thu Oct 18, 2018 1:11 am

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by abc132 »

CFM300 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 9:13 pm
abc132 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 8:23 pm Is Ally really only giving 0.5%?
1.10%

https://www.ally.com/bank/online-savings-account/
So
Capital One MM 0.8%
Ally MM 0.5%

Capital One Savings 1.0%
Ally Savings 1.1%

It looks like Ally is stealing from their MM customers much more than Capital One.
I can see how they can pay 1.1%.

I guess all those people upset at Capital One for the 0.2% difference are going to be really outraged at Ally for 3x as much stealing of their money in Allies money market account.
abc132
Posts: 387
Joined: Thu Oct 18, 2018 1:11 am

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by abc132 »

Mudpuppy wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 9:13 pm Rates are just going down these days. It makes me wish I'd put the full 10k into I-Bonds back at the start of the year instead of my standard 5k.
Yes, it really is that simple.

I'm happy with my 5 year 3.0% CD choice, I think it even had a cash bonus.
CFM300
Posts: 1977
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2007 5:13 am

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by CFM300 »

abc132 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 10:54 pm I guess all those people upset at Capital One for the 0.2% difference
That's not what people are complaining about.
User avatar
anon_investor
Posts: 3458
Joined: Mon Jun 03, 2019 1:43 pm

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by anon_investor »

abc132 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 10:54 pm
CFM300 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 9:13 pm
abc132 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 8:23 pm Is Ally really only giving 0.5%?
1.10%

https://www.ally.com/bank/online-savings-account/
So
Capital One MM 0.8%
Ally MM 0.5%

Capital One Savings 1.0%
Ally Savings 1.1%

It looks like Ally is stealing from their MM customers much more than Capital One.
I can see how they can pay 1.1%.

I guess all those people upset at Capital One for the 0.2% difference are going to be really outraged at Ally for 3x as much stealing of their money in Allies money market account.
Ally MM has never been higher than their savings. Capital One plays games where they change around which account type pays more.

But the rates keep falling for everyone. I just open no penalty CDs at Ally Bank.
02nz
Posts: 5555
Joined: Wed Feb 21, 2018 3:17 pm

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by 02nz »

abc132 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 10:54 pm
CFM300 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 9:13 pm
abc132 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 8:23 pm Is Ally really only giving 0.5%?
1.10%

https://www.ally.com/bank/online-savings-account/
So
Capital One MM 0.8%
Ally MM 0.5%

Capital One Savings 1.0%
Ally Savings 1.1%

It looks like Ally is stealing from their MM customers much more than Capital One.
I can see how they can pay 1.1%.

I guess all those people upset at Capital One for the 0.2% difference are going to be really outraged at Ally for 3x as much stealing of their money in Allies money market account.
Ally has offered MM and Online Savings from the beginning. As has Capital One (MM and 360 Savings, inherited from the ING Direct days). MM accounts offer a debit card and check-writing, savings accounts do not.

What's slimy is that while 360 Savings used to be heavily promoted and had a competitive rate, Capital One created a whole new account, 360 Performance Savings, with competitive rates, and made the old accounts' rates uncompetitive (the older one gets 0.5% and the new one gets 1%). Unlike with MM, there's no discernible difference between 360 Savings and 360 Performance Savings, so there's zero reason for this except to screw over existing customers. And because they don't "spam" their customers as you call it (except, interestingly, when rates go up!), many customers don't know about this.
abc132
Posts: 387
Joined: Thu Oct 18, 2018 1:11 am

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by abc132 »

02nz wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 11:19 pm Ally MM has never been higher than their savings. Capital One plays games where they change around which account type pays more.

But the rates keep falling for everyone. I just open no penalty CDs at Ally Bank.

That's a fair point if true, anyone have a graph?

Ally MM vs time
Ally Savings vs time

Capital One MM vs time
Capital One Savings vs time

It would be interesting to look for a logical explanation for any differences.
abc132
Posts: 387
Joined: Thu Oct 18, 2018 1:11 am

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by abc132 »

02nz wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 11:19 pm
abc132 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 10:54 pm
CFM300 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 9:13 pm
abc132 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 8:23 pm Is Ally really only giving 0.5%?
1.10%

https://www.ally.com/bank/online-savings-account/
So
Capital One MM 0.8%
Ally MM 0.5%

Capital One Savings 1.0%
Ally Savings 1.1%

It looks like Ally is stealing from their MM customers much more than Capital One.
I can see how they can pay 1.1%.

I guess all those people upset at Capital One for the 0.2% difference are going to be really outraged at Ally for 3x as much stealing of their money in Allies money market account.
Ally has offered MM and Online Savings from the beginning. As has Capital One (MM and 360 Savings, inherited from the ING Direct days). MM accounts offer a debit card and check-writing, savings accounts do not.

What's slimy is that while 360 Savings used to be heavily promoted and had a competitive rate, Capital One created a whole new account, 360 Performance Savings, with competitive rates, and made the old accounts' rates uncompetitive (the older one gets 0.5% and the new one gets 1%). Unlike with MM, there's no discernible difference between 360 Savings and 360 Performance Savings, so there's zero reason for this except to screw over existing customers. And because they don't "spam" their customers as you call it (except, interestingly, when rates go up!), many customers don't know about this.
Has Ally ever offered specials or cash bonuses for new accounts?

You have me really curious, as I seem to recall such things.
02nz
Posts: 5555
Joined: Wed Feb 21, 2018 3:17 pm

Re: Capital One is at it again

Post by 02nz »

abc132 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 11:30 pm
02nz wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 11:19 pm
abc132 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 10:54 pm
CFM300 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 9:13 pm
abc132 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 8:23 pm Is Ally really only giving 0.5%?
1.10%

https://www.ally.com/bank/online-savings-account/
So
Capital One MM 0.8%
Ally MM 0.5%

Capital One Savings 1.0%
Ally Savings 1.1%

It looks like Ally is stealing from their MM customers much more than Capital One.
I can see how they can pay 1.1%.

I guess all those people upset at Capital One for the 0.2% difference are going to be really outraged at Ally for 3x as much stealing of their money in Allies money market account.
Ally has offered MM and Online Savings from the beginning. As has Capital One (MM and 360 Savings, inherited from the ING Direct days). MM accounts offer a debit card and check-writing, savings accounts do not.

What's slimy is that while 360 Savings used to be heavily promoted and had a competitive rate, Capital One created a whole new account, 360 Performance Savings, with competitive rates, and made the old accounts' rates uncompetitive (the older one gets 0.5% and the new one gets 1%). Unlike with MM, there's no discernible difference between 360 Savings and 360 Performance Savings, so there's zero reason for this except to screw over existing customers. And because they don't "spam" their customers as you call it (except, interestingly, when rates go up!), many customers don't know about this.
Has Ally ever offered specials?
Sure, like this one that was open to all customers, new and existing:

viewtopic.php?t=261504

Or this $250 one I'm doing now, which was also open to all:

viewtopic.php?t=307264

Marcus has had similar ones, also open to all.

I've never been targeted for a Capital One existing customer promo, and the new customer promo is like once every 5 years. I don't have a problem with that - it's the games with account types, not my not being targeted for promos, that led me to the "slimy" characterization.
Post Reply