Mortgage rates headed lower?

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Watty
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Re: Mortgage rates headed lower?

Post by Watty »

BrandonBogle wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 2:26 pm
wfrobinette wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 1:20 pm My guy was in and out in less than 15 minutes when we did that 3.5 weeks ago. We even had some kind of covid disclosure in ours. I'd spend this time as often as needed to save a $125 a month on interest.
I’m jealous. Mine took 90 minutes at my kitchen table and a hand cramp by the end of it. My full legal name is over 40-characters long.
I once bought a house when my wife was not able to be at the closing so I had a power of attorney for her. Every place I had to sign I needed to sign my name then also sign her long hyphenated with something like "Jane Jingleheimer-Schmit by Power of Attorney John Doe". In addition to a lot of writing it was a challenge to fit that all in on most of the forms.
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unclescrooge
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Re: Mortgage rates headed lower?

Post by unclescrooge »

BrandonBogle wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 4:06 pm
wfrobinette wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 3:40 pm
BrandonBogle wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 2:26 pm
wfrobinette wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 1:20 pm My guy was in and out in less than 15 minutes when we did that 3.5 weeks ago. We even had some kind of covid disclosure in ours. I'd spend this time as often as needed to save a $125 a month on interest.
I’m jealous. Mine took 90 minutes at my kitchen table and a hand cramp by the end of it. My full legal name is over 40-characters long.
Holy cow on name and time to sign. That's why I started with middle initial on all credit and such. I actually have about 28 in my name but because William can be written as wm and my middle initial. i'm at 13.
The closing package included a “Also Known As” form that had shortened versions of my name. However, they were adamant that I sign exactly as indicated on every form, and most had my full legal name. A few had just my middle initial, but included the rest.
That's what every notary has told me at loan signing.
And for the first several homes I believed them. But it's not true and they can't force you.

I tell them politely that I will not be signing that way. I've been signing this way for 30 years and I'm not going to change it for them.
lotusflower
Posts: 289
Joined: Thu Oct 24, 2013 12:32 am

Re: Mortgage rates headed lower?

Post by lotusflower »

unclescrooge wrote: Thu May 28, 2020 2:07 am
BrandonBogle wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 4:06 pm The closing package included a “Also Known As” form that had shortened versions of my name. However, they were adamant that I sign exactly as indicated on every form, and most had my full legal name. A few had just my middle initial, but included the rest.
That's what every notary has told me at loan signing.
And for the first several homes I believed them. But it's not true and they can't force you.

I tell them politely that I will not be signing that way. I've been signing this way for 30 years and I'm not going to change it for them.
I have been frustrated by that too, but I haven't been gutsy enough to stick with the argument and end up signing with my middle name which really isn't my signature. As I understand it the notary is just there to verify that I am the person named in the document and that I have signed it.
It (mostly) shouldn't matter what my signature looks like (except that here in CA you need extra witnesses if your signature is just an 'X').
nolesrule
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Re: Mortgage rates headed lower?

Post by nolesrule »

Planner01 wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 6:44 pm
Wow that’s amazing. I had to get all the information you have above PLUS tax returns for the last two years (we have both with the same employer for almost 2 decades and income has always been stable), copy of divorce decree from over 20 years ago, employment verification, verify and justify names on credit reports (misspelling by other people), proof of the original title insurance, HOA ledger and survey report.

We refinanced to a shorter term mortgage on a house that’s 50% loan to value at less than 20% of our net income. So why all the paperwork? I don’t know. But I never want to do that again!!
I can understand the request for some of those, but they should be able to order tax return transcripts from the IRS (Form 4506-T). I've never had to provide an actual tax return and I'm on my 6th mortgage. I don't recall ever having to provide proof of title insurance or HOA ledger on a refinance either.

I did have to provide a survey report on the refinance of my NJ house in 2016, but for this most recent refi in NC it had only been 7 months since the purchase of new construction and we used the same lender.
Planner01
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Re: Mortgage rates headed lower?

Post by Planner01 »

This is house number 6, but it was our first refinance, so I didn’t know it would be so difficult. I am glad we did it as it saved us quite a bit but will definitely NOT do it again.

The title company was the one asking for proof of the title insurance (it saved me $800 on closing costs) and they also insisted on a copy of the HOA ledger to ensure we didn’t have any liens.

It was all too much. Which increased my desire to pay the loan off even faster so that I never have to deal with that ever again.
BillWalters
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Re: Mortgage rates headed lower?

Post by BillWalters »

Wells Fargo has been an absolute disaster. We have sent an astonishing amount of paperwork. Four months of statements for every bank account, brokerage account, retirement account, etc. two years of tax returns plus W-2 (income is reported on the tax returns...), paystubs, copy of homeowners insurance, HOA, any my favorite, a copy of the paystub showing my 2018 bonus (the bank statement with the deposit was unacceptable).

I locked at sub-4% for a jumbo, part of me thinks they’re just trying to bury me in paperwork so I’ll give up and they don’t have to honor the rate.
wfrobinette
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Re: Mortgage rates headed lower?

Post by wfrobinette »

anon_investor wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 6:52 pm
Planner01 wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 6:44 pm
wfrobinette wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 12:01 pm
Planner01 wrote: Tue May 26, 2020 5:57 am We just refinanced to a 15 year loan at a 2.75% and plan to pay the mortgage off in the next 4 years exactly to the date (or sooner if possible). The refinance paperwork was such a pain that even if it goes down to 1% I would not do it again. Another incentive to pay it off.
Why did you find the paperwork painful?

I just refi'd and had the paperwork piece done in less than hour.

2 pay stubs
2 bank statements for main accounts
Insurance
current loan statement
a couple electronic signatures
1 print sign and scan
1 or two simple letters explaining large stuff, scanned and uploaded.
I did 3/4 of everything on my mobile phone.
Wow that’s amazing. I had to get all the information you have above PLUS tax returns for the last two years (we have both with the same employer for almost 2 decades and income has always been stable), copy of divorce decree from over 20 years ago, employment verification, verify and justify names on credit reports (misspelling by other people), proof of the original title insurance, HOA ledger and survey report.

We refinanced to a shorter term mortgage on a house that’s 50% loan to value at less than 20% of our net income. So why all the paperwork? I don’t know. But I never want to do that again!!
Was this an online outfit or a traditional bank? I did my refi with Ally this month and it was all online and easy. I have done a couple of mortgages with Wells Fargo and those have always been painful, with underwriting always asking for more and more stuff. I would do a refi again with Ally.
I did a wells fargo in 2018 for a purchase and it was all online
wfrobinette
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Joined: Fri Feb 20, 2015 3:14 pm

Re: Mortgage rates headed lower?

Post by wfrobinette »

BillWalters wrote: Thu May 28, 2020 8:54 am Wells Fargo has been an absolute disaster. We have sent an astonishing amount of paperwork. Four months of statements for every bank account, brokerage account, retirement account, etc. two years of tax returns plus W-2 (income is reported on the tax returns...), paystubs, copy of homeowners insurance, HOA, any my favorite, a copy of the paystub showing my 2018 bonus (the bank statement with the deposit was unacceptable).

I locked at sub-4% for a jumbo, part of me thinks they’re just trying to bury me in paperwork so I’ll give up and they don’t have to honor the rate.
Jumbo is a whole different ball game. My experience in 2018 with WF was decent. They want proof of bonus and a deposit is not enough. I never claim bonuses or any other income besides salary so I get underwritten on salary alone.
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anon_investor
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Re: Mortgage rates headed lower?

Post by anon_investor »

wfrobinette wrote: Thu May 28, 2020 9:01 am
anon_investor wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 6:52 pm
Planner01 wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 6:44 pm
wfrobinette wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 12:01 pm
Planner01 wrote: Tue May 26, 2020 5:57 am We just refinanced to a 15 year loan at a 2.75% and plan to pay the mortgage off in the next 4 years exactly to the date (or sooner if possible). The refinance paperwork was such a pain that even if it goes down to 1% I would not do it again. Another incentive to pay it off.
Why did you find the paperwork painful?

I just refi'd and had the paperwork piece done in less than hour.

2 pay stubs
2 bank statements for main accounts
Insurance
current loan statement
a couple electronic signatures
1 print sign and scan
1 or two simple letters explaining large stuff, scanned and uploaded.
I did 3/4 of everything on my mobile phone.
Wow that’s amazing. I had to get all the information you have above PLUS tax returns for the last two years (we have both with the same employer for almost 2 decades and income has always been stable), copy of divorce decree from over 20 years ago, employment verification, verify and justify names on credit reports (misspelling by other people), proof of the original title insurance, HOA ledger and survey report.

We refinanced to a shorter term mortgage on a house that’s 50% loan to value at less than 20% of our net income. So why all the paperwork? I don’t know. But I never want to do that again!!
Was this an online outfit or a traditional bank? I did my refi with Ally this month and it was all online and easy. I have done a couple of mortgages with Wells Fargo and those have always been painful, with underwriting always asking for more and more stuff. I would do a refi again with Ally.
I did a wells fargo in 2018 for a purchase and it was all online
Yea, my Wells Fargo mortgage app was online too, but not as seemless for underwriting. They kept asking for more and more things piecemail, and it took a while in between each request. For my recent refi with Ally, after the initial documents were uploaded, underwriting came back very quickly with all the additional requested documents and clarifications all at once. It just felt a lot more efficient and faster, I was pleasantly surprised.
Contango1025
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Joined: Fri Apr 13, 2018 9:14 am

Re: Mortgage rates headed lower?

Post by Contango1025 »

Golf maniac wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 10:33 am Mortgage rates will vary across the country, so someone getting a certain rate and certain costs in Texas will not be the same as Virginia. So asking someone who they refinanced with and costs is meaningless. You need to do your own research with local lenders, big banks, and online lenders. Some people like using brokers, which is fine, but always compare with other lenders.

For mortgage lenders the value is in the servicing not the interest paid on the loan. The big banks have massive servicing operations across the country. As people refinance and the servicing ends the banks need to feed their servicing operations with new loans. The jumbo market is completely different from the conforming loan market as private securitization are used vs FNMA and FHLMC doing most of the securitization on conforming loans. I have seen headlines about issues with the jumbo market, but I really haven’t researched the issue.
This has been my experience as I've been following the mega refinance thread and trying to find similar deals as others. As a NJ data point for a high conforming loan ($655K), I've shopped with about 12 different lenders and looks like I'll end up at 2.99% with about $5K is loan costs (sections A,B,C on the Loan Estimate) plus prepaids, etc.

While I typically subscribe to the no-cost mentality, I can tell you with two young children there is no way I would have been able to go through this process if I wasn't working from home with a flexible schedule and it's just not worth the headache to go through this process again anytime soon. As we plan on staying here for the duration of the loan, I'm not opposed to paying a few thousand in cost to just lock in a better deal. We're sitting at 3.9% right now, so this will significantly lower our monthly payment and lifetime interest. While it seems like there's a lot of intelligent people providing reasons why mortgage rates could go even lower, this is a bird in the hand situation for me personally.
wfrobinette
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Joined: Fri Feb 20, 2015 3:14 pm

Re: Mortgage rates headed lower?

Post by wfrobinette »

anon_investor wrote: Thu May 28, 2020 9:48 am
wfrobinette wrote: Thu May 28, 2020 9:01 am
anon_investor wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 6:52 pm
Planner01 wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 6:44 pm
wfrobinette wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 12:01 pm

Why did you find the paperwork painful?

I just refi'd and had the paperwork piece done in less than hour.

2 pay stubs
2 bank statements for main accounts
Insurance
current loan statement
a couple electronic signatures
1 print sign and scan
1 or two simple letters explaining large stuff, scanned and uploaded.
I did 3/4 of everything on my mobile phone.
Wow that’s amazing. I had to get all the information you have above PLUS tax returns for the last two years (we have both with the same employer for almost 2 decades and income has always been stable), copy of divorce decree from over 20 years ago, employment verification, verify and justify names on credit reports (misspelling by other people), proof of the original title insurance, HOA ledger and survey report.

We refinanced to a shorter term mortgage on a house that’s 50% loan to value at less than 20% of our net income. So why all the paperwork? I don’t know. But I never want to do that again!!
Was this an online outfit or a traditional bank? I did my refi with Ally this month and it was all online and easy. I have done a couple of mortgages with Wells Fargo and those have always been painful, with underwriting always asking for more and more stuff. I would do a refi again with Ally.
I did a wells fargo in 2018 for a purchase and it was all online
Yea, my Wells Fargo mortgage app was online too, but not as seemless for underwriting. They kept asking for more and more things piecemail, and it took a while in between each request. For my recent refi with Ally, after the initial documents were uploaded, underwriting came back very quickly with all the additional requested documents and clarifications all at once. It just felt a lot more efficient and faster, I was pleasantly surprised.
Yeah I had a little bit of that too.
marklar13
Posts: 123
Joined: Wed Jul 08, 2015 11:47 am

Re: Mortgage rates headed lower?

Post by marklar13 »

Contango1025 wrote: Thu May 28, 2020 11:41 am While it seems like there's a lot of intelligent people providing reasons why mortgage rates could go even lower, this is a bird in the hand situation for me personally.
I agree with this. I understand that there are indicators pointing to mortgage rates heading lower... but the reality is that no one knows what the future holds. I'm taking advantage of the super low rates that are available now and calling that a win.

I see the logic in opting for no-cost refis now, but I think sitting and waiting for lower rates is probably a mistake. Personally I opted for a low rate, with normal closing costs (but no points) -- break-even of about a year. If rates go lower, in the next 6 months then maybe I will be kicking myself for not going with a no-cost option... but I'm still happy locking in savings now.
Golf maniac
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Location: Florida

Re: Mortgage rates headed lower?

Post by Golf maniac »

unclescrooge wrote: Thu May 28, 2020 2:07 am
BrandonBogle wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 4:06 pm
wfrobinette wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 3:40 pm
BrandonBogle wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 2:26 pm
wfrobinette wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 1:20 pm My guy was in and out in less than 15 minutes when we did that 3.5 weeks ago. We even had some kind of covid disclosure in ours. I'd spend this time as often as needed to save a $125 a month on interest.
I’m jealous. Mine took 90 minutes at my kitchen table and a hand cramp by the end of it. My full legal name is over 40-characters long.
Holy cow on name and time to sign. That's why I started with middle initial on all credit and such. I actually have about 28 in my name but because William can be written as wm and my middle initial. i'm at 13.
The closing package included a “Also Known As” form that had shortened versions of my name. However, they were adamant that I sign exactly as indicated on every form, and most had my full legal name. A few had just my middle initial, but included the rest.
That's what every notary has told me at loan signing.
And for the first several homes I believed them. But it's not true and they can't force you.

I tell them politely that I will not be signing that way. I've been signing this way for 30 years and I'm not going to change it for them.
Why do you care how they tell you to sign it? The bank is trying to perfect their lien on your home in exchange for funds to buy or refi. The required signature is how the lien and loan documents were made out. They don’t want a hassle if they need to foreclose and some lawyer says “well, the signature doesn’t match the lien document “. Probably 99% or more of the time it will be no problem, but there will always be one judge who may decide to delay or set aside a foreclosure on a technicality. It has happened, a lot, in the past. So just sign the documents as instructed and save the bank any potential hassle.
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Watty
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Re: Mortgage rates headed lower?

Post by Watty »

marklar13 wrote: Fri May 29, 2020 12:47 pm
Contango1025 wrote: Thu May 28, 2020 11:41 am While it seems like there's a lot of intelligent people providing reasons why mortgage rates could go even lower, this is a bird in the hand situation for me personally.
I agree with this. I understand that there are indicators pointing to mortgage rates heading lower... but the reality is that no one knows what the future holds. I'm taking advantage of the super low rates that are available now and calling that a win.

I see the logic in opting for no-cost refis now, but I think sitting and waiting for lower rates is probably a mistake. Personally I opted for a low rate, with normal closing costs (but no points) -- break-even of about a year. If rates go lower, in the next 6 months then maybe I will be kicking myself for not going with a no-cost option... but I'm still happy locking in savings now.
I did not look up the statistics but my impression is that interest rates tend to also go up a lot faster when there is significant news but when they are going down they seem to drift down very slowly.
alfaspider
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Re: Mortgage rates headed lower?

Post by alfaspider »

Watty wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 11:46 pm
BrandonBogle wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 2:26 pm
wfrobinette wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 1:20 pm My guy was in and out in less than 15 minutes when we did that 3.5 weeks ago. We even had some kind of covid disclosure in ours. I'd spend this time as often as needed to save a $125 a month on interest.
I’m jealous. Mine took 90 minutes at my kitchen table and a hand cramp by the end of it. My full legal name is over 40-characters long.
I once bought a house when my wife was not able to be at the closing so I had a power of attorney for her. Every place I had to sign I needed to sign my name then also sign her long hyphenated with something like "Jane Jingleheimer-Schmit by Power of Attorney John Doe". In addition to a lot of writing it was a challenge to fit that all in on most of the forms.
I had it worse than that. We bought a house not long after the financial crisis when lenders were still extremely strict. We had to close with a POA as well. The next day after spending forever signing "Jane Jacob Jingleheimer-Scmhit by Power of Attorney John Jakcob Jingleheimer-Schmitt", I got a call from the title company that the lender didn't find the signatures legible enough. So I went back the and spent another hour+ signing names over and over. Two days later, they called again- they still didn't like the signatures. Spent another hour+. Fortunately 3rd time was the charm.
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unclescrooge
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Joined: Thu Jun 07, 2012 7:00 pm

Re: Mortgage rates headed lower?

Post by unclescrooge »

Golf maniac wrote: Fri May 29, 2020 1:06 pm
unclescrooge wrote: Thu May 28, 2020 2:07 am
BrandonBogle wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 4:06 pm
wfrobinette wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 3:40 pm
BrandonBogle wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 2:26 pm

I’m jealous. Mine took 90 minutes at my kitchen table and a hand cramp by the end of it. My full legal name is over 40-characters long.
Holy cow on name and time to sign. That's why I started with middle initial on all credit and such. I actually have about 28 in my name but because William can be written as wm and my middle initial. i'm at 13.
The closing package included a “Also Known As” form that had shortened versions of my name. However, they were adamant that I sign exactly as indicated on every form, and most had my full legal name. A few had just my middle initial, but included the rest.
That's what every notary has told me at loan signing.
And for the first several homes I believed them. But it's not true and they can't force you.

I tell them politely that I will not be signing that way. I've been signing this way for 30 years and I'm not going to change it for them.
Why do you care how they tell you to sign it? The bank is trying to perfect their lien on your home in exchange for funds to buy or refi. The required signature is how the lien and loan documents were made out. They don’t want a hassle if they need to foreclose and some lawyer says “well, the signature doesn’t match the lien document “. Probably 99% or more of the time it will be no problem, but there will always be one judge who may decide to delay or set aside a foreclosure on a technicality. It has happened, a lot, in the past. So just sign the documents as instructed and save the bank any potential hassle.
I'm pretty sure that's not how foreclosures work. Half the time, banks can't even produce the loan documents and cut corners in the foreclosure process. That's when a judge decides to teach them a lesson. Not because some dead beat borrower claims that's not his signature.

Besides, what's the point of getting it notarized if they're trying get an exact match on signatures.

Might as well just use a thumb print 😆
mathwhiz
Posts: 867
Joined: Tue Jul 01, 2008 7:58 pm

Re: Mortgage rates headed lower?

Post by mathwhiz »

1000 times yes. We just refinanced a 15 year/2.625%. It was a 2 months ordeal with endless delays because of the pandemic and problems getting an appraisal. NEVER EVER AGAIN. At this point, every .125% only saves me $10 a month. Even at 2.0%, I'm only saving $50 a month. It would have to get to <1.0% for me to ever even think about doing this nonsense again and I'd probably say NOPE!
Planner01 wrote: Tue May 26, 2020 5:57 am We just refinanced to a 15 year loan at a 2.75% and plan to pay the mortgage off in the next 4 years exactly to the date (or sooner if possible). The refinance paperwork was such a pain that even if it goes down to 1% I would not do it again. Another incentive to pay it off.
Golf maniac
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Joined: Wed Dec 27, 2017 2:02 pm
Location: Florida

Re: Mortgage rates headed lower?

Post by Golf maniac »

unclescrooge wrote: Fri May 29, 2020 8:31 pm
Golf maniac wrote: Fri May 29, 2020 1:06 pm
unclescrooge wrote: Thu May 28, 2020 2:07 am
BrandonBogle wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 4:06 pm
wfrobinette wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 3:40 pm

Holy cow on name and time to sign. That's why I started with middle initial on all credit and such. I actually have about 28 in my name but because William can be written as wm and my middle initial. i'm at 13.
The closing package included a “Also Known As” form that had shortened versions of my name. However, they were adamant that I sign exactly as indicated on every form, and most had my full legal name. A few had just my middle initial, but included the rest.
That's what every notary has told me at loan signing.
And for the first several homes I believed them. But it's not true and they can't force you.

I tell them politely that I will not be signing that way. I've been signing this way for 30 years and I'm not going to change it for them.
Why do you care how they tell you to sign it? The bank is trying to perfect their lien on your home in exchange for funds to buy or refi. The required signature is how the lien and loan documents were made out. They don’t want a hassle if they need to foreclose and some lawyer says “well, the signature doesn’t match the lien document “. Probably 99% or more of the time it will be no problem, but there will always be one judge who may decide to delay or set aside a foreclosure on a technicality. It has happened, a lot, in the past. So just sign the documents as instructed and save the bank any potential hassle.
I'm pretty sure that's not how foreclosures work. Half the time, banks can't even produce the loan documents and cut corners in the foreclosure process. That's when a judge decides to teach them a lesson. Not because some dead beat borrower claims that's not his signature.

Besides, what's the point of getting it notarized if they're trying get an exact match on signatures.

Might as well just use a thumb print 😆
Well, you can be pretty sure, but I lived it. In certain jurisdictions any and every excuse was used. It didn’t matter if the people were 4 or 5 years delinquent. Delay as long as they could, not maintain the home, save all the money from the mortgage payments (live rent free), strip the house of anything of value, then walk away. Banks were paying customers money to move as long as they didn’t destroy the house. Again, very rarely if ever did I see a bank not produce loan documents (You really think banks just lose loan documents 50% of the time?). That’s like the myth of people being foreclosed on who where not delinquent, never happened. And guess who pays for all the extra regulation, documentation, and red tape? All of us suckers who pay our loans on time have to pay higher mortgage rates and closing costs to cover for those who decided to stick it to the banks. You may love a Robin Hood story, but if you are paying your loan as agreed you are getting the shaft.
helloeveryone
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Joined: Sun Sep 04, 2016 5:16 pm

Re: Mortgage rates headed lower?

Post by helloeveryone »

HEDGEFUNDIE wrote: Mon May 25, 2020 9:49 pm Great article outlining the challenges facing the mortgage market:

https://www.wsj.com/articles/mortgage-c ... _lead_pos8

Of particular note:
Historically, 30-year fixed mortgage rates hover around 1.7 percentage points above the 10-year Treasury yield. That spread is now 2.6 points, implying the mortgage rate should be closer to 2.5% than 3.3% now.
Pair this with comments Powell made a few weeks back about the learnings from the last financial crisis, when the Fed Funds rate was slashed to zero and kept there for years:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NStvQ7uIAOU

Around 9 minutes:
"It was a great period to watch unemployment decline and not see prices or wages move up, and I think we’ve learned something very fundamental about our ability to associate levels of unemployment with inflation, or indeed, other imbalances. That is a lesson we’ll be carrying forward.”
These facts taken together make me believe that we are about to experience unprecedented low rates in mortgages. A specific prediction I will make is that we will see ARMs drop to <2.0% rates within the next 12 months (before any relationship discounts). The actions to be taken here, if you agree with my prognosis, include not refinancing into any mortgage with points, fees, or a longer term than absolutely necessary, because you will almost certainly have an opportunity to refinance again at record low rates in the near future.
I just got my mortgage adjustment (5/2 arm) and it will go from 4.75% to 3% starting July so your statement is true.
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unclescrooge
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Re: Mortgage rates headed lower?

Post by unclescrooge »

Golf maniac wrote: Fri May 29, 2020 8:58 pm
unclescrooge wrote: Fri May 29, 2020 8:31 pm
Golf maniac wrote: Fri May 29, 2020 1:06 pm
unclescrooge wrote: Thu May 28, 2020 2:07 am
BrandonBogle wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 4:06 pm

The closing package included a “Also Known As” form that had shortened versions of my name. However, they were adamant that I sign exactly as indicated on every form, and most had my full legal name. A few had just my middle initial, but included the rest.
That's what every notary has told me at loan signing.
And for the first several homes I believed them. But it's not true and they can't force you.

I tell them politely that I will not be signing that way. I've been signing this way for 30 years and I'm not going to change it for them.
Why do you care how they tell you to sign it? The bank is trying to perfect their lien on your home in exchange for funds to buy or refi. The required signature is how the lien and loan documents were made out. They don’t want a hassle if they need to foreclose and some lawyer says “well, the signature doesn’t match the lien document “. Probably 99% or more of the time it will be no problem, but there will always be one judge who may decide to delay or set aside a foreclosure on a technicality. It has happened, a lot, in the past. So just sign the documents as instructed and save the bank any potential hassle.
I'm pretty sure that's not how foreclosures work. Half the time, banks can't even produce the loan documents and cut corners in the foreclosure process. That's when a judge decides to teach them a lesson. Not because some dead beat borrower claims that's not his signature.

Besides, what's the point of getting it notarized if they're trying get an exact match on signatures.

Might as well just use a thumb print 😆
Well, you can be pretty sure, but I lived it. In certain jurisdictions any and every excuse was used. It didn’t matter if the people were 4 or 5 years delinquent. Delay as long as they could, not maintain the home, save all the money from the mortgage payments (live rent free), strip the house of anything of value, then walk away. Banks were paying customers money to move as long as they didn’t destroy the house. Again, very rarely if ever did I see a bank not produce loan documents (You really think banks just lose loan documents 50% of the time?). That’s like the myth of people being foreclosed on who where not delinquent, never happened. And guess who pays for all the extra regulation, documentation, and red tape? All of us suckers who pay our loans on time have to pay higher mortgage rates and closing costs to cover for those who decided to stick it to the banks. You may love a Robin Hood story, but if you are paying your loan as agreed you are getting the shaft.
Regulations are meant to protect the borrower more than the lender. There is a reason banks have to give a good faith estimate, disclose whether the rate is adjustable, whether there is a balloon payment or a prepayment penalty. Because they screwed over a lot of people in the past. None of these disclosures as any cost to your loan.

I've been through the loan process 28 times. I refinance my home at least once a year on average. I'll sign my name any way I want. If the bank doesn't like my signature I'm happy to take my business elsewhere. Your arguments about protecting the banks interests are irrelevant, to both the discussion and to me.
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