NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

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EliaK
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NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by EliaK » Sat May 23, 2020 12:19 am

Wife and I live in a colonial, 4BR, 2.5bath house in south Jersey.
Property taxes are 8K yr. Want some downsizing but simply because of taxes. Our daughter, hubby and our 2 grandchildren (now teens) live within 4 miles- that's kind of a big anchor. We're very family oriented. Youngest daughter lives in Delaware, an hour away, and expecting her first this summer. As we approach 70, a single story home looks better than when younger. Our cousin, works elder law, says whatever ya do, don't die in NJ. Thoughts appreciated, thanks. If my youngest is reading this, you sure do have a big house. (ok, jk.)

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bertilak
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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by bertilak » Sat May 23, 2020 5:34 am

EliaK wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 12:19 am
Wife and I live in a colonial, 4BR, 2.5bath house in south Jersey.
Property taxes are 8K yr. Want some downsizing but simply because of taxes. Our daughter, hubby and our 2 grandchildren (now teens) live within 4 miles- that's kind of a big anchor. We're very family oriented. Youngest daughter lives in Delaware, an hour away, and expecting her first this summer. As we approach 70, a single story home looks better than when younger. Our cousin, works elder law, says whatever ya do, don't die in NJ. Thoughts appreciated, thanks. If my youngest is reading this, you sure do have a big house. (ok, jk.)
Where does your elder-law cousin live?
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Rainier
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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by Rainier » Sat May 23, 2020 5:49 am

EliaK wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 12:19 am
Wife and I live in a colonial, 4BR, 2.5bath house in south Jersey.
Property taxes are 8K yr. Want some downsizing but simply because of taxes. Our daughter, hubby and our 2 grandchildren (now teens) live within 4 miles- that's kind of a big anchor. We're very family oriented. Youngest daughter lives in Delaware, an hour away, and expecting her first this summer. As we approach 70, a single story home looks better than when younger. Our cousin, works elder law, says whatever ya do, don't die in NJ. Thoughts appreciated, thanks. If my youngest is reading this, you sure do have a big house. (ok, jk.)
Why can't you die in NJ? As far as I can tell there is no estate tax in NJ. Is there another reason?

Also, just telling us how much your property taxes is only half the story. How much is your property worth? Isn't that an important factor in determining whether your property taxes are too high?

You are likely onto something because you no longer need a good school system, but are there any other services you'd be losing if you moved to a low tax state? NJ pretty much has high tax everything. Other states tend to have high income tax and low property tax or vice versa. For example, Vermont has high income tax but low property tax while New Hampshire has no regular income tax but high property tax (and no sales tax). Since your income may be low a place like Vermont would make more sense than NH. Not my recommendation, just an example.

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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by bertilak » Sat May 23, 2020 6:02 am

Rainier wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 5:49 am
EliaK wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 12:19 am
Our cousin, works elder law, says whatever ya do, don't die in NJ.
Why can't you die in NJ? As far as I can tell there is no estate tax in NJ. Is there another reason?
NJ estate tax was recently repealed but their 11%-16% inheritance tax is still in effect. It is retroactive to gifts up to three years prior to death. It does not have an exemption for small estates so everyone gets to participate.

In addition to the amount of the tax, this results in extra work for the executor and perhaps extra cost for whatever estate and tax professionals get involved and probably delays getting everything settled.

Dying in NJ make life more difficult for the survivors.
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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by London » Sat May 23, 2020 6:43 am

While the posts in this chain about the inheritance tax are factually correct, they leave out a major point: your spouse and children are exempt.

(https://www.nj.com/business/2018/11/the ... to_av.html)

I’m not saying it’s a tax I’m dying to pay (pun intended). But the OP probably doesn’t have a huge estate with layers of beneficiaries if he/she is concerned about $8k a year in property taxes.

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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by ted.r.3 » Sat May 23, 2020 6:44 am

bertilak wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 6:02 am
NJ estate tax was recently repealed but their 11%-16% inheritance tax is still in effect. It is retroactive to gifts up to three years prior to death. It does not have an exemption for small estates so everyone gets to participate.

Dying in NJ make life more difficult for the survivors.
Please don't make misleading posts like this.

The New Jersey inheritance tax rate is 0% for gifts to the decedent's spouse, parents, children and grandchildren.

As a result, the vast majority of NJ residents pay no inheritance tax.

New Jersey Probate is easy too.

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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by itmaybejj » Sat May 23, 2020 6:52 am

EliaK wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 12:19 am
Our daughter, hubby and our 2 grandchildren (now teens) live within 4 miles- that's kind of a big anchor.
Would surrender much more than 11-16% of my someday inheritance if it meant my family elders would come live that close.

Unless you are in danger of running out of money and starving, I'd recommend putting a huge dollar value on the ability to come and go without a long drive on either part. Now, to hang out with them. Later, when you have to give up your driver's license and are trying to convince them to drive an hour or two to visit once every few months. Stay close and you can grab a taxi over for lunch on a whim whenever you feel like it.

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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by mortfree » Sat May 23, 2020 6:53 am

8k per year?

I’m in PA and that is less than what a lot of us pay.

You might be splitting hairs or you may find what you are looking for.

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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by rustymutt » Sat May 23, 2020 6:58 am

That's a question lots of us ask about our own states. Seems like property taxes are easy to raise on constituents. I've considered becoming a full time renter, just to avoid them. Executive suites with deluxe high end apartment, paid for in part by property tax savings. I pay $4,000. a year for my home out on the range. They gotta lot a nice girls here. :sharebeer
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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by a_movable_life » Sat May 23, 2020 7:09 am

Yes NJ, MD, PA all have inheritance taxes. I as a single guy NJ would have gotten 15% if I had died there. "How Ya Doin!?"

https://www.state.nj.us/treasury/taxati ... e/o10c.pdf

It really depends on how much you want to see the Grandkids. The teens will be super busy and then be off to college soon. Who's going to be helping you when you get a little older?

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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by TheGreyingDuke » Sat May 23, 2020 7:10 am

rustymutt wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 6:58 am
That's a question lots of us ask about our own states. Seems like property taxes are easy to raise on constituents. I've considered becoming a full time renter, just to avoid them. Executive suites with deluxe high end apartment, paid for in part by property tax savings. I pay $4,000. a year for my home out on the range. They gotta lot a nice girls here. :sharebeer
And where do you think the money for the taxes that your landlord pays comes from??
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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by Jags4186 » Sat May 23, 2020 7:25 am

TheGreyingDuke wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 7:10 am
rustymutt wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 6:58 am
That's a question lots of us ask about our own states. Seems like property taxes are easy to raise on constituents. I've considered becoming a full time renter, just to avoid them. Executive suites with deluxe high end apartment, paid for in part by property tax savings. I pay $4,000. a year for my home out on the range. They gotta lot a nice girls here. :sharebeer
And where do you think the money for the taxes that your landlord pays comes from??
Exactly. You even get to deduct a fairly significant 18% of your rent as payment of property taxes on your NJ tax return. A luxury/executive apartment in NJ might cost $4k a month in rent. $8640 in annual property taxes right there.

yohac
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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by yohac » Sat May 23, 2020 7:31 am

Downsizing sounds like a good idea. But moving to another state to save at best a few thousand a year would never fly with DW. Connections are everything.

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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by abuss368 » Sat May 23, 2020 7:40 am

Pennsylvania
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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by abuss368 » Sat May 23, 2020 7:41 am

Or Delaware
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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by abuss368 » Sat May 23, 2020 7:42 am

What part of southern NJ?
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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by jb1 » Sat May 23, 2020 7:51 am

I used to live in NJ and moved to coastal NC 4 years ago. Everyday I see more and more NJ/NY license plates and it’s great to see.

NJ and NY are overpriced and besides the ability to have a city, offers nothing.

Who wants to be charged a ton to live in the cold on unpaved roads?
Last edited by jb1 on Sat May 23, 2020 8:49 am, edited 1 time in total.

Jefferson
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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by Jefferson » Sat May 23, 2020 7:55 am

Your best case scenario is saving a few grand a year in property taxes. Is that really worth moving far away from your family?

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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by M.Lee » Sat May 23, 2020 8:20 am

jb1 wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 7:51 am
I used to live in NJ and moved to coastal NC 4 years ago. Everyday I see more and more NJ/NY license plates and it’s great to see.

NJ and NC are overpriced and besides the ability to have a city, offers nothing.

Who wants to be charged a ton to live in the cold on unpaved roads?
Did you make a typo above and mean NY instead of NC?
I live in an affluent area of NJ, and I don't see unpaved roads. I see excellent schools, access to good doctors, lots of senior help, good grocery stores, etc. etc. etc. I pay high taxes but it's worth it to me to live where I do. Choices of where to live are personal and what is right for one is not right for another.

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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by jb1 » Sat May 23, 2020 8:49 am

M.Lee wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 8:20 am
jb1 wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 7:51 am
I used to live in NJ and moved to coastal NC 4 years ago. Everyday I see more and more NJ/NY license plates and it’s great to see.

NJ and NC are overpriced and besides the ability to have a city, offers nothing.

Who wants to be charged a ton to live in the cold on unpaved roads?
Did you make a typo above and mean NY instead of NC?
I live in an affluent area of NJ, and I don't see unpaved roads. I see excellent schools, access to good doctors, lots of senior help, good grocery stores, etc. etc. etc. I pay high taxes but it's worth it to me to live where I do. Choices of where to live are personal and what is right for one is not right for another.
Whoops yes. I lived in Middlesex county, of course with my parents back then. I remember their property taxes were 1k a month, which is ridiculous to think of.

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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by macher » Sat May 23, 2020 8:57 am

EliaK wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 12:19 am
Wife and I live in a colonial, 4BR, 2.5bath house in south Jersey.
Property taxes are 8K yr. Want some downsizing but simply because of taxes. Our daughter, hubby and our 2 grandchildren (now teens) live within 4 miles- that's kind of a big anchor. We're very family oriented. Youngest daughter lives in Delaware, an hour away, and expecting her first this summer. As we approach 70, a single story home looks better than when younger. Our cousin, works elder law, says whatever ya do, don't die in NJ. Thoughts appreciated, thanks. If my youngest is reading this, you sure do have a big house. (ok, jk.)
We are originally from Philly moved to South Jersey 23 years ago and recently moved back to Philly in a house we owned outright to escape the high taxes in NJ. We were currently paying $8k a year in NJ now we are paying $2000 a year. We realized even after being debt free we would still have the $8k a year property tax. We love the urban city life. We both work at University of PA for the last 25-32 years and live close enough we can walk to work. No tolls or gas.

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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by adamthesmythe » Sat May 23, 2020 12:38 pm

1. How far do you want to drive? Get a compass and draw a circle.

2. Are you sure your taxes will go down just because you downsize? I suspect you will need to downGRADE also if you want to cut taxes.

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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by hulburt1 » Sat May 23, 2020 12:46 pm

Stay. You voted for the folks that raised your tax's. Live with it.

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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by Kenkat » Sat May 23, 2020 12:59 pm

adamthesmythe wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 12:38 pm
1. How far do you want to drive? Get a compass and draw a circle.

2. Are you sure your taxes will go down just because you downsize? I suspect you will need to downGRADE also if you want to cut taxes.
Alaska is really good if you don’t mind a really big circle.

A little closer to home, maybe Delaware.

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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by Matigas » Sat May 23, 2020 1:05 pm

jb1 wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 7:51 am
I used to live in NJ and moved to coastal NC 4 years ago. Everyday I see more and more NJ/NY license plates and it’s great to see.

NJ and NY are overpriced and besides the ability to have a city, offers nothing.

Who wants to be charged a ton to live in the cold on unpaved roads?
We have met our Yankee quota here.

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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by reln » Sat May 23, 2020 1:14 pm

EliaK wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 12:19 am
Wife and I live in a colonial, 4BR, 2.5bath house in south Jersey.
Property taxes are 8K yr. Want some downsizing but simply because of taxes. Our daughter, hubby and our 2 grandchildren (now teens) live within 4 miles- that's kind of a big anchor. We're very family oriented. Youngest daughter lives in Delaware, an hour away, and expecting her first this summer. As we approach 70, a single story home looks better than when younger. Our cousin, works elder law, says whatever ya do, don't die in NJ. Thoughts appreciated, thanks. If my youngest is reading this, you sure do have a big house. (ok, jk.)
8k doesn't sound too bad. Small price to pay to be near family? How much would it cost to travel to NJ as often as you'd like to see family from somewhere else?

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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by novillero » Sat May 23, 2020 1:19 pm

I’m from Nj. Relocate within the state, and p.s. you are under the average property tax amount for the state: https://www.nj.com/politics/2020/03/njs ... -town.html

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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by Thegame14 » Sat May 23, 2020 1:32 pm

EliaK wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 12:19 am
Wife and I live in a colonial, 4BR, 2.5bath house in south Jersey.
Property taxes are 8K yr. Want some downsizing but simply because of taxes. Our daughter, hubby and our 2 grandchildren (now teens) live within 4 miles- that's kind of a big anchor. We're very family oriented. Youngest daughter lives in Delaware, an hour away, and expecting her first this summer. As we approach 70, a single story home looks better than when younger. Our cousin, works elder law, says whatever ya do, don't die in NJ. Thoughts appreciated, thanks. If my youngest is reading this, you sure do have a big house. (ok, jk.)
I have a split level in NNJ and pay $12.5K in taxes and I am sure smaller house and smaller lot, $8K is reasonable...

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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by Absolute » Sat May 23, 2020 2:10 pm

jb1 wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 8:49 am
M.Lee wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 8:20 am
jb1 wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 7:51 am
I used to live in NJ and moved to coastal NC 4 years ago. Everyday I see more and more NJ/NY license plates and it’s great to see.

NJ and NC are overpriced and besides the ability to have a city, offers nothing.

Who wants to be charged a ton to live in the cold on unpaved roads?
Did you make a typo above and mean NY instead of NC?
I live in an affluent area of NJ, and I don't see unpaved roads. I see excellent schools, access to good doctors, lots of senior help, good grocery stores, etc. etc. etc. I pay high taxes but it's worth it to me to live where I do. Choices of where to live are personal and what is right for one is not right for another.
Whoops yes. I lived in Middlesex county, of course with my parents back then. I remember their property taxes were 1k a month, which is ridiculous to think of.
To address OP's concern, seems to be splitting hairs as family is close by and perhaps you had the wrong impression or were misinformed about the inheritance tax conditions.

I live in Middlesex county currently and pay ~$5500, which is not terrible based on location, schools and property.

Effective real estate tax rates as of Feb 2020 according to WalletHub.

Delaware 0.6%
Pennsylvania 1.6%
New York 1.7%
New Jersey 2.5% (ranked 51st)
Last edited by Absolute on Sat May 23, 2020 2:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.

jb1
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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by jb1 » Sat May 23, 2020 2:11 pm

Matigas wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 1:05 pm
jb1 wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 7:51 am
I used to live in NJ and moved to coastal NC 4 years ago. Everyday I see more and more NJ/NY license plates and it’s great to see.

NJ and NY are overpriced and besides the ability to have a city, offers nothing.

Who wants to be charged a ton to live in the cold on unpaved roads?
We have met our Yankee quota here.
Be happy :). We are raising property values

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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by H-Town » Sat May 23, 2020 2:21 pm

EliaK wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 12:19 am
Wife and I live in a colonial, 4BR, 2.5bath house in south Jersey.
Property taxes are 8K yr. Want some downsizing but simply because of taxes. Our daughter, hubby and our 2 grandchildren (now teens) live within 4 miles- that's kind of a big anchor. We're very family oriented. Youngest daughter lives in Delaware, an hour away, and expecting her first this summer. As we approach 70, a single story home looks better than when younger. Our cousin, works elder law, says whatever ya do, don't die in NJ. Thoughts appreciated, thanks. If my youngest is reading this, you sure do have a big house. (ok, jk.)
Texas has 10k plus property taxes for 4BR 2.5 bath... make me think Texas has to be one of the top of the countries.

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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by abuss368 » Sat May 23, 2020 2:31 pm

I have never understood why New Jersey, with all the tourist attractions, an entire coastline, casino's, and neighbored to New York has any budget issues.
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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by KyleAAA » Sat May 23, 2020 2:34 pm

You probably shouldn’t look at property tax in isolation. Several states that don’t have an income tax have high property and sales taxes. But if you make a decent income, you’re probably still better off. Areas of Texas and a Florida could be nice. Washington if you like milder weather.

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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by Ged » Sat May 23, 2020 2:43 pm

bertilak wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 6:02 am
Rainier wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 5:49 am
EliaK wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 12:19 am
Our cousin, works elder law, says whatever ya do, don't die in NJ.
Why can't you die in NJ? As far as I can tell there is no estate tax in NJ. Is there another reason?
NJ estate tax was recently repealed but their 11%-16% inheritance tax is still in effect. It is retroactive to gifts up to three years prior to death. It does not have an exemption for small estates so everyone gets to participate.
Immediate family members are exempt from NJ inheritance tax.

They include spouses, parents, grandparents, and descendants—the children, grandchildren, and great-grandchildren of the deceased. The deceased's stepchildren are exempt from the tax as well, but the children and grandchildren of stepchildren are not.

If the there is a bequest planned for people outside the immediate family this could be a consideration. Otherwise it is not.

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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by UpperNwGuy » Sat May 23, 2020 2:47 pm

From OP's description of what they want (to be near family but not to pay high property taxes), Delaware seems to be the answer.

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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by Jags4186 » Sat May 23, 2020 2:52 pm

abuss368 wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 2:31 pm
I have never understood why New Jersey, with all the tourist attractions, an entire coastline, casino's, and neighbored to New York has any budget issues.

1) State pensions and retirement healthcare.
2) A ridiculous amount of townships with their own police, fire, EMT, and school systems.
3) Poor cities in many counties which drain surrounding towns' coffers.

I would ask people though to compare what they get elsewhere to what they get here. I've heard some people have to pay $100+ a month for garbage pick up. I actually didn't know that was a thing until I started reading on Bogleheads as in NJ the towns all handle trash pick up and that's included in your property taxes.

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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by sport » Sat May 23, 2020 5:20 pm

I don't know about New Jersey, but in Ohio property taxes vary a lot depending on the community. Moving even a short distance can result in much higher or lower taxes, depending on the city/town/village/township you move to.

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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by mathwhiz » Sat May 23, 2020 5:24 pm

Florida. You save on property taxes, no state income taxes, and there are many affordable home areas. Favorite areas of mine are St. Augustine and Sarasota.

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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by randomguy » Sat May 23, 2020 6:11 pm

sport wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 5:20 pm
I don't know about New Jersey, but in Ohio property taxes vary a lot depending on the community. Moving even a short distance can result in much higher or lower taxes, depending on the city/town/village/township you move to.
NJ is the same way. A 450k house can be almost 16k in one town and "only" 8k in another. You would need to look at what houses you would consider liveable in the various areas are like and then look at the tax burden. And of course the price of the house.

I am guessing moving to Delaware is cheaper but you have to decide if that will affect your quality of life. Hour drives (and think about how much you will pay in bridge tolls:)) are pretty bad. But maybe you would be doing those anyway with the new grand kid.

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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by bugleheadd » Sat May 23, 2020 6:58 pm

mathwhiz wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 5:24 pm
Florida. You save on property taxes, no state income taxes, and there are many affordable home areas. Favorite areas of mine are St. Augustine and Sarasota.
But the hurricanes and home insurance must be expensive

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Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by JediMisty » Sat May 23, 2020 7:08 pm

Jags4186 wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 2:52 pm
abuss368 wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 2:31 pm
I have never understood why New Jersey, with all the tourist attractions, an entire coastline, casino's, and neighbored to New York has any budget issues.

1) State pensions and retirement healthcare.
2) A ridiculous amount of townships with their own police, fire, EMT, and school systems.
3) Poor cities in many counties which drain surrounding towns' coffers.

I would ask people though to compare what they get elsewhere to what they get here. I've heard some people have to pay $100+ a month for garbage pick up. I actually didn't know that was a thing until I started reading on Bogleheads as in NJ the towns all handle trash pick up and that's included in your property taxes.
In Piscataway, trash pick-up is NOT included in property tax.

Norwegianwood
Posts: 8
Joined: Fri Feb 14, 2020 12:10 pm

Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by Norwegianwood » Sat May 23, 2020 7:42 pm

I’m in Southern Delaware-Rehoboth Beach. Beautiful area, low taxes and many retirees from New Jersey have relocated here.

London
Posts: 139
Joined: Sun Dec 11, 2016 11:50 am

Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by London » Sat May 23, 2020 8:24 pm

Jags4186 wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 2:52 pm
abuss368 wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 2:31 pm
I have never understood why New Jersey, with all the tourist attractions, an entire coastline, casino's, and neighbored to New York has any budget issues.

1) State pensions and retirement healthcare.
2) A ridiculous amount of townships with their own police, fire, EMT, and school systems.
3) Poor cities in many counties which drain surrounding towns' coffers.

I would ask people though to compare what they get elsewhere to what they get here. I've heard some people have to pay $100+ a month for garbage pick up. I actually didn't know that was a thing until I started reading on Bogleheads as in NJ the towns all handle trash pick up and that's included in your property taxes.
For the record. I’m in Monmouth County and I pay $30k a year in property tax and trash pickup is NOT included.

Grt2bOutdoors
Posts: 22434
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2007 8:20 pm
Location: New York

Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by Grt2bOutdoors » Sat May 23, 2020 8:32 pm

abuss368 wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 2:31 pm
I have never understood why New Jersey, with all the tourist attractions, an entire coastline, casino's, and neighbored to New York has any budget issues.
Let's count the ways:
1) State funded Medicaid
2) Overly generous pension rejiggering coupled with a major tax cut in the 1980's that was never rescinded
3) Graft/corruption - "not in my town mentality" - needing to maintain control of the school system (ie. paranoia of "riff-raff, trouble, yada, yada), control of police, fire, public works departments. Fear of losing control to a centralized more cost effective system. A regional school system could consolidate alot of administrative positions (job loss with those in the "know" being the ones kicked off the gravy train and increase mobility of students from lower income neighborhoods bringing thought of lowered educational standards. :oops:
4) Playing catch-up with underfunded pensions, short-changing all sorts of programs including education leaving more of the burden on the taxpayer instead of the state contributing it's fair share
5) Abbott laws - siphoning monies away from towns to larger cities based on perceived "discrimination" thereby creating a higher and unnecessary burden on those towns to provide a basic education. The largest generator of tax revenues in NJ is property taxes, followed by income tax, sales taxes, etc.
6) Add yours......
Last edited by Grt2bOutdoors on Sat May 23, 2020 8:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"One should invest based on their need, ability and willingness to take risk - Larry Swedroe" Asking Portfolio Questions

mathwhiz
Posts: 838
Joined: Tue Jul 01, 2008 7:58 pm

Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by mathwhiz » Sat May 23, 2020 8:36 pm

It depends on the age of your house and your proximity to water. Newer homes 10 miles inland away from the flood zones have very reasonable premiums. Waterfront homes and oceanfront condos can be pricey.
bugleheadd wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 6:58 pm
mathwhiz wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 5:24 pm
Florida. You save on property taxes, no state income taxes, and there are many affordable home areas. Favorite areas of mine are St. Augustine and Sarasota.
But the hurricanes and home insurance must be expensive

Jags4186
Posts: 4695
Joined: Wed Jun 18, 2014 7:12 pm

Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by Jags4186 » Sat May 23, 2020 8:55 pm

London wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 8:24 pm
Jags4186 wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 2:52 pm
abuss368 wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 2:31 pm
I have never understood why New Jersey, with all the tourist attractions, an entire coastline, casino's, and neighbored to New York has any budget issues.

1) State pensions and retirement healthcare.
2) A ridiculous amount of townships with their own police, fire, EMT, and school systems.
3) Poor cities in many counties which drain surrounding towns' coffers.

I would ask people though to compare what they get elsewhere to what they get here. I've heard some people have to pay $100+ a month for garbage pick up. I actually didn't know that was a thing until I started reading on Bogleheads as in NJ the towns all handle trash pick up and that's included in your property taxes.
For the record. I’m in Monmouth County and I pay $30k a year in property tax and trash pickup is NOT included.
I continue to be amazed!

Grt2bOutdoors
Posts: 22434
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2007 8:20 pm
Location: New York

Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by Grt2bOutdoors » Sat May 23, 2020 9:32 pm

Jags4186 wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 8:55 pm
London wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 8:24 pm
Jags4186 wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 2:52 pm
abuss368 wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 2:31 pm
I have never understood why New Jersey, with all the tourist attractions, an entire coastline, casino's, and neighbored to New York has any budget issues.

1) State pensions and retirement healthcare.
2) A ridiculous amount of townships with their own police, fire, EMT, and school systems.
3) Poor cities in many counties which drain surrounding towns' coffers.

I would ask people though to compare what they get elsewhere to what they get here. I've heard some people have to pay $100+ a month for garbage pick up. I actually didn't know that was a thing until I started reading on Bogleheads as in NJ the towns all handle trash pick up and that's included in your property taxes.
For the record. I’m in Monmouth County and I pay $30k a year in property tax and trash pickup is NOT included.
I continue to be amazed!
Why are you amazed? He could be living in a $2 million dollar home or in a town where the number of homes are limited, thereby requiring a higher tax rate. If you had your property declared a "farm", then you'd only pay $500 or so a year. You need to do more research.....it's all out there in the public domain.
"One should invest based on their need, ability and willingness to take risk - Larry Swedroe" Asking Portfolio Questions

Jags4186
Posts: 4695
Joined: Wed Jun 18, 2014 7:12 pm

Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by Jags4186 » Sat May 23, 2020 9:43 pm

Grt2bOutdoors wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 9:32 pm
Jags4186 wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 8:55 pm
London wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 8:24 pm
Jags4186 wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 2:52 pm
abuss368 wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 2:31 pm
I have never understood why New Jersey, with all the tourist attractions, an entire coastline, casino's, and neighbored to New York has any budget issues.

1) State pensions and retirement healthcare.
2) A ridiculous amount of townships with their own police, fire, EMT, and school systems.
3) Poor cities in many counties which drain surrounding towns' coffers.

I would ask people though to compare what they get elsewhere to what they get here. I've heard some people have to pay $100+ a month for garbage pick up. I actually didn't know that was a thing until I started reading on Bogleheads as in NJ the towns all handle trash pick up and that's included in your property taxes.
For the record. I’m in Monmouth County and I pay $30k a year in property tax and trash pickup is NOT included.
I continue to be amazed!
Why are you amazed? He could be living in a $2 million dollar home or in a town where the number of homes are limited, thereby requiring a higher tax rate. If you had your property declared a "farm", then you'd only pay $500 or so a year. You need to do more research.....it's all out there in the public domain.
I'm amazed that he has private garbage in NJ. I thought garbage was handled by the town all over the state. There are houses with well more than double $30k in property taxes near where I live.

UpperNwGuy
Posts: 3519
Joined: Sun Oct 08, 2017 7:16 pm

Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by UpperNwGuy » Sat May 23, 2020 9:47 pm

This is another one of those boglehead threads where the OP posts a question and then disappears. Meanwhile the bogleheads discuss the problem among themselves, and often the discussion drifts further and further away from the OP's original question.

OP, if you're still reading this thread, please comment on the many questions and suggestions that have been written here in the 24 hours since you last made an appearance.

Alan S.
Posts: 9572
Joined: Mon May 16, 2011 6:07 pm
Location: Prescott, AZ

Re: NJ property taxes too high. What are my alternative states?

Post by Alan S. » Sat May 23, 2020 9:52 pm

One should not focus on a single expense such as property taxes. They should compare their total state related expenses to those of prospective new states using their own consumption profile. If in retirement you want to live in an expensive house, then property taxes will be weighted higher. If you have large retirement accounts and other assets and live in a more modest house, then state income taxes should carry more weight including whether they tax SS income or not. Sales taxes are also significant, especially if you plan to buy big ticket items such as a boat or vehicles.

States that tax something @ 0 need to make it up elsewhere, such as TX with no income taxes but high property taxes.

That said, NJ and adjoining states are all high tax. Some dislocations will occur due to the pandemic, but the underlying history of each state probably provides a good clue on how they will deal with the massive deficits to come.

A recent wake up call to NJ was provided by David Tepper: https://www.forbes.com/sites/travisbrow ... 2731e47309

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