The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Non-investing personal finance issues including insurance, credit, real estate, taxes, employment and legal issues such as trusts and wills
smitcat
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by smitcat »

HomerJ wrote: Fri May 22, 2020 11:29 pm
KlangFool wrote: Fri May 22, 2020 11:09 pm
HomerJ wrote: Fri May 22, 2020 11:00 pm
If you have the skills you think you have, you can find a $60k job easy. In your neck of the woods, $100k jobs should be easy. Your attitude of "I only want to work on billion dollar systems" is silly. You're not that special. Million dollar systems take hard work and can present interesting challenges too.

But, because you saved well, you don't have to take a job you don't want and can retire instead.

You probably should.
HomerJ,

<<If you have the skills you think you have, you can find a $60k job easy. In your neck of the woods, $100k jobs should be easy.>>

Have you actually tried this before? Please remember I was unemployed for more than 1 year a few times. The last time was only a few years ago. I did apply for those 60K to 80K jobs. I had no offer. Meanwhile, I had job offer in the 120K to 150K range. At the 60K to 80K range, they have cheaper and younger alternatives.

My statement is based on my actual job-hunting experience.

<<Your attitude of "I only want to work on billion dollar systems" is silly. You're not that special. Million dollar systems take hard work and can present interesting challenges too. >>

Your pay is based on the complexity of the system that you work with. The employer will go with a cheaper and younger alternative for a simpler system. This is the fact of life. This is not my attitude. This is the reality presented to me while I was job hunting.

KlangFool
Your experience is not my experience.

It doesn't matter anymore. Retire. Enjoy life. You've earned it.
"Your experience is not my experience."
I agree with you Homer....we transferred careers a few times and it was both profitable and fun. But you need to have a completely open mind and remain flexible in your search and your life to approach any transition like this.
We are very glad we continued on ....
tenkuky
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by tenkuky »

Klang:
I want you to know I am thinking of you and wishing you well.
On this board, you have always cautioned people not to assume that employment is a given and to prepare oneself.
I have taken your advice to heart and feel I am better off for it.
I have nothing to add to the excellent advice given above.

T
delamer
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by delamer »

KlangFool wrote: Fri May 22, 2020 11:18 pm Folks,

I am asking two separate questions:

A) Under what financial condition, it is rewarding for me to take on part-time project work. At this moment, it looks like anything less than $90 per hour is not worthwhile.

B) Under what non-financial condition, would you go back to work?

KlangFool
I’m sorry you are about to be unemployed.

Regarding #2 and something you alluded to earlier, I would not take a job that involved a lot of in-person contact with people. In this pandemic age, if your finances are sound and you are in the retirement age bracket, why take that risk? Sometimes it seems that our country is split between the very cautious and the carefree, with little in between, when it comes to the pandemic. And you can’t know which type of person you are going to end up dealing with.

Good luck.
EnjoyIt
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by EnjoyIt »

Financially you are in great shape and likely you have more money than your current needs. This is especially true with your spouse providing health insurance and still working part time. Is there any thoughts or plans on what to do with the extra money? I’m sure now during these uncertain times being cautious is prudent, but is there something you have considered spending more on?

You have recently been awarded free time and have the opportunity to pursue many different hobbies. Do you have anything you have always wanted to do but have not had the time?
A time to EVALUATE your jitters: | https://www.bogleheads.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=79939&start=400#p5275418
keith6014
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by keith6014 »

KlangFool wrote: Fri May 22, 2020 7:13 pm
MathIsMyWayr wrote: Fri May 22, 2020 7:02 pm
KlangFool wrote: Fri May 22, 2020 6:49 pm
MathIsMyWayr wrote: Fri May 22, 2020 6:43 pm
KlangFool wrote: Fri May 22, 2020 6:17 pm F) Late 50+ years old.

My question is

1) Is it really worthwhile for me to continue working? I worked in the IT area. If I want to stay in this area, I have to study 10 to 20 hours per week just to keep up with the latest technology.

2) If I do contract work, how much should I get paid before it is worthwhile for me to work?

A) I only plan to work 20 hours per week. Between unemployment and the $600 per week, I will get about $900 per week. Unless I am paid at $90 per hour or higher, it may not be worthwhile for me to work

3) Any other comment/feedback as to how do you decide whether you should continue working or just retire.

KlangFool
Sorry for the news.

1) Why not? Studying and learning is always good. Life is a process of experience. Studying and learning is an active part of experience. Game is not over until it is over!
Not if you are a Tier 4 / SME person studying to do a job.

<<Game is not over until it is over!>>

Not if you had played one of the biggest and most complex games in your life. And, everything else that you will be doing going forward is a child game as compared to what you have done before.

KlangFool
A typical sequence of graduate-level math and physics courses/studies:
1) Introduction to ... > 2) Advanced ... > back to 3) Introduction to ... > 4) Advanced ... and on and on ...
MathIsMyWayr,

I am an engineer. After you had built several multi-billion level system, the smaller system at 1 million or smaller is nothing to us.

Engineers are judged by what we built and designed. They are not formulas and theories.

KlangFool
Sorry to hear. I think you are well prepared and should be ok.
What does "multi-billion level" system entail? Does it mean the software and hardware cost $1b? or a system you built with few thousand dollars handle billion dollar worth of transaction? I would be more impressed with the later. Also, for IT I a lot more remote opportunities have appeared.
Luckywon
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by Luckywon »

Wow, the responses here are piling up fast. A heartening sign of how many people care about you, and rightfully so, considering your generous contributions here.
KlangFool wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 7:52 am
A) I only plan to work 20 hours per week. Between unemployment and the $600 per week, I will get about $900 per week. Unless I am paid at $90 per hour or higher, it may not be worthwhile for me to work......


Because of the nature of my work and pay, any part-time that I would have taken would make enough money that I receive no unemployment benefit. At $60 to $100 per hour, it does not take many hours for this to be true. That was my experience a few years ago. It may be different this time.

KlangFool
Then if you work 20 hours/week at $90/hour you are netting $45/hour.
KlangFool wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 8:19 am

1) I have 100K in my home equity that I am not counting. In my neighborhood, this is a small townhouse. So, it is a 400K house.

KlangFool
Don't forget to add the $100k to your net worth.

JUST KIDDING :D :D :D

It seems obvious to me you can afford to retire now.
KlangFool wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 8:05 am
She had seen me working too hard to keep my job for too long that she said I should take it easy. I don't need a job.

KlangFool
So you will be earning $45/hour for your sweat, you don't need the money, and your wife, who knows you best, thinks you should retire. Case closed, in my opinion.
hudson
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by hudson »

KlangFool wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 8:19 am 3) I am a technical person. So, I am only hired to solve a tough technical interesting problem that most people had failed to solve.
B) Very tough network/system problem that many people had failed to fix over months. S
KlangFool
There's a need. for that! I was not that person; I needed that person's help. Sometimes he would figure it out from 1000 miles away. Sometimes he would drop in for a few days or a week. Nothing else would do. He was an employee, not a hired gun.
mnnice
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by mnnice »

This is maybe off topic, but when I first saw this thread I thought about when DH was laid off in the Great Recession. We had a three year old at the time and he liked to loudly announce to strangers, “My dad is laid off.” People often responded, “That’s too bad.” Kiddo was puzzled, “ Laid off” to him meant Dad plays with me all day. He thought it was the greatest ever.

Anyway maybe you can’t embrace with quite the enthusiasm of a three year old but enjoy “laid off” regardless of what comes next.
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KlangFool
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by KlangFool »

mnnice wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 10:25 am This is maybe off topic, but when I first saw this thread I thought about when DH was laid off in the Great Recession. We had a three year old at the time and he liked to loudly announce to strangers, “My dad is laid off.” People often responded, “That’s too bad.” Kiddo was puzzled, “ Laid off” to him meant Dad plays with me all day. He thought it was the greatest ever.

Anyway maybe you can’t embrace with quite the enthusiasm of a three year old but enjoy “laid off” regardless of what comes next.
mnnice,

I worked from home for too many years. My kids can't tell the difference between I am employed or not employed. To them, I am just sitting in front of computer and talking over the phone when I am working. It is hard for my kids to get a level of appreciation for my jobs. They have absolutely no idea why my peers think and speak highly of me when they met some of them.

KlangFool
Da5id
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by Da5id »

Depending on your state, you may well need to prove/document that you are searching for a job to collect unemployment. That was the case win Massachusetts, so I didn't collect when I was laid off and decided to retire.

One caveat of course is how the country/world will recover from COVID. Whether a portfolio with significant fixed income at the current abysmal rates will produce enough to support a 4% SWR over the long haul remains to be seen, as will the performance of stocks. If for example COVID comes back in force this fall effects on the economy/stock market may be pretty severe. If you have to start your retirement with a big plunge, sequence of returns may be troubling. You may also well live longer than the canonical "30 years" on which the 4% is based anyway.

In any case, seems to me like your plan is workable. Your wife working will certainly help quite a bit, both for the income and perhaps more importantly for access to a health plan. My ACA plan (Massachusetts) is quite good, and with subsidy is pretty cheap. But if you don't live in a state with good ACA plans and/or don't qualify for the subsidy by being less than 300% FPL health care can be incredibly expensive. And social security when it kicks in will help quite a bit, and you are old enough that any changes to payouts due to SS trust fund shortfalls are less likely to hit you.

You might want to keep your IT skills/co-worker relationships up for the next year or two just in case you need to go back though.

Good luck!
Last edited by Da5id on Sat May 23, 2020 10:51 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Ben Mathew
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by Ben Mathew »

mnnice wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 10:25 am This is maybe off topic, but when I first saw this thread I thought about when DH was laid off in the Great Recession. We had a three year old at the time and he liked to loudly announce to strangers, “My dad is laid off.” People often responded, “That’s too bad.” Kiddo was puzzled, “ Laid off” to him meant Dad plays with me all day. He thought it was the greatest ever.

Anyway maybe you can’t embrace with quite the enthusiasm of a three year old but enjoy “laid off” regardless of what comes next.
Great story! :happy
prairieman
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by prairieman »

It looks like you’ve got enough to retire but are young enough to work if you want. When I reached that age I became very restless even without being laid off. One new manager that I disliked and often disagreed with finally caused me to choose freedom. In hind sight, that new manager was the best thing to ever happen as I might have missed being free this last three years. It’s really a personal decision, though. My older brother has selected the other road - and I think wonders what the heck he’d do all day if he didn’t have a job.
“As long as the roots are not severed, all is well.” Chauncey Gardner
Random Poster
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by Random Poster »

market timer wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 4:10 am Getting laid off is a great way to retire. You don't have to second guess your decision, and you get a severance and unemployment benefits.
I like this statement. It puts a positive spin on what can be an emotionally negative experience.
MathIsMyWayr
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by MathIsMyWayr »

prairieman wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 11:33 am It looks like you’ve got enough to retire but are young enough to work if you want. When I reached that age I became very restless even without being laid off. One new manager that I disliked and often disagreed with finally caused me to choose freedom. In hind sight, that new manager was the best thing to ever happen as I might have missed being free this last three years. It’s really a personal decision, though. My older brother has selected the other road - and I think wonders what the heck he’d do all day if he didn’t have a job.
"Work" means many different things to different people. According to my observations, those in the "creative" fields do not consider "work" as the same as "earning a living". No wonder, in the minds of the ancient Greeks and Romans, a liberal arts education was necessary for a human being to be free.
https://www.liberalartscollegereview.com/articles/11
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CyclingDuo
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by CyclingDuo »

KlangFool wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 9:18 amBoth of my kids graduated from college and had found jobs. My daughter just graduated a few weeks ago.
Mazeltov!

Well, there you go. It seems to solely come down to your second question.

B) Under what non-financial condition, would you go back to work?

If you want to work after June for a non-financial reason, you will have to find one or more that meets your own individual needs. Joy, passion for your work, helping others, routine/structure, sense of identity/purpose, keeping the mind sharp, not wasting a valuable resource (human capital), problem solving, social aspects, free good coffee and snacks available at the office, training others, mentorship, etc... .

If none of those things (or whatever you come up with) have any import to you - so be it. No reason for you to go back to work after June. Start sharpening your pencil so you can morph into posting things like "I retired last year and it is the best thing I have ever done! Why I didn't do it sooner, I'll never know." :mrgreen:

CyclingDuo
"Save like a pessimist, invest like an optimist." - Morgan Housel
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KlangFool
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by KlangFool »

CyclingDuo wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 12:02 pm
KlangFool wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 9:18 amBoth of my kids graduated from college and had found jobs. My daughter just graduated a few weeks ago.
Mazeltov!

Well, there you go. It seems to solely come down to your second question.

B) Under what non-financial condition, would you go back to work?

If you want to work after June for a non-financial reason, you will have to find one or more that meets your own individual needs. Joy, passion for your work, helping others, routine/structure, sense of identity/purpose, keeping the mind sharp, not wasting a valuable resource (human capital), problem solving, social aspects, free good coffee and snacks available at the office, training others, mentorship, etc... .

If none of those things (or whatever you come up with) have any import to you - so be it. No reason for you to go back to work after June. Start sharpening your pencil so you can morph into posting things like "I retired last year and it is the best thing I have ever done! Why I didn't do it sooner, I'll never know." :mrgreen:

CyclingDuo
Thanks.

KlangFool
A-Commoner
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by A-Commoner »

market timer wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 4:10 am Getting laid off is a great way to retire. You don't have to second guess your decision, and you get a severance and unemployment benefits.

I agree that you should not really look for any work at this time. If I were in your position, I'd focus on hobbies that could potential generate income, but where income is not the primary objective. It might be good to take off your IT hat and try something completely different.
This. If I was in the OP’s shoes, I’d just retire and not look back. This event is cause for celebration, not condolences.
rjbraun
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by rjbraun »

KlangFool,

Sorry about this latest development for you. I have also been unemployed several times throughout my career. I always tried to make the best of it, and even had friends or acquaintances remark how well I seemed to handle the situation. Still, I definitely also recall periods of anxiety, frustration, and disappointment.

Having at least skimmed many of the replies, the only thing I wanted to add was that times change and, if you decide that you want to pursue some sort of employment going forward, I would encourage you to keep an open mind and not necessarily rely too heavily on past experience. More specifically, if you think you would like a certain type of position but you never got positive responses in the past, maybe this time will be different. You only need one job at a time: a place where you want to work and where they want you, too.

I did lose a job in my 50s and was unemployed for over two years. I eventually found something and have stayed longer at this job than any of my prior ones. I make far less money, but it's still not bad, in part because I had saved well from my prior very well paying jobs.

I am also at a crossroads of sorts. For now, I am able to work from home, but once we are expected to return to the office I will need to evaluate the health risk. If the risk seems too great, which seems the case now, I will need to leave the job. Fortunately, my Bogleheads lifestyle should allow for that.

Good luck, and I encourage you to give your all to whatever you decide will be your next move :beer
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telemark
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by telemark »

IBM announced layoffs this week, and it seems to be a general trend in the industry. Makes me glad I'm already retired.
is50xenough
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by is50xenough »

KlangFool let me add my "sorry" and my "congratulations" since both seem to fit. I am mostly responding to say thanks for all your posts. I've learned a lot and enjoy your insights on many topics.

The only wisdom--if can be called that-that I can add (and I only got through about 2 pages of this thread so might be repeat are these thoughts:

1. I am even more conservative than you (hence screen name), so things I would think about include, can you count on SS at level you include in your post? Is wife's job absolutely secure since income and insurance are given's in your post and calculations.

2. Advice is usually to have a "plan" for what to do with retirement. At least through the point I read, I didn't see a plan nor hobbies, activities, yet I recall a post where you described some interests that actually surprised me. Can't remember if was some type of alcohol or coffee or tea you liked. You maybe avoiding the question since obvious to you. Now I didn't have a well thought out plan except desire to get away from the day to day hassle and my time not being my own. Your wife's comment about you working too hard fits this so maybe ok for you, as has been for me.

3. Back to finances. Since no clear plan mentioned and given that you are close to the 25x (not including wife continuing to work and later SS, are you sure you won't become more extravagant in terms of desire to travel, etc---Given who you are, you will control this but you don't deserve to have retirement "crimped" in any way.

My sense is that you are there, you know you are there, you are just using forum as sounding board to be even more certain of your decision. I look forward to your posts as one of the retired to learn from your insights.
MisterMister
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by MisterMister »

aarondearu wrote: Fri May 22, 2020 11:27 pm You could refinance your mortgage to a lower rate.
There are 30 year mortgages under 3% with $0 closing costs right now.
I am curious how that works for someone with strong assets but limited income. It could complicate things substantially. For that reason, and only that reason, I would keep the mortgage if it were me.
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KlangFool
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by KlangFool »

is50xenough wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 1:36 pm KlangFool let me add my "sorry" and my "congratulations" since both seem to fit. I am mostly responding to say thanks for all your posts. I've learned a lot and enjoy your insights on many topics.

The only wisdom--if can be called that-that I can add (and I only got through about 2 pages of this thread so might be repeat are these thoughts:

1. I am even more conservative than you (hence screen name), so things I would think about include, can you count on SS at level you include in your post? Is wife's job absolutely secure since income and insurance are given's in your post and calculations.

2. Advice is usually to have a "plan" for what to do with retirement. At least through the point I read, I didn't see a plan nor hobbies, activities, yet I recall a post where you described some interests that actually surprised me. Can't remember if was some type of alcohol or coffee or tea you liked. You maybe avoiding the question since obvious to you. Now I didn't have a well thought out plan except desire to get away from the day to day hassle and my time not being my own. Your wife's comment about you working too hard fits this so maybe ok for you, as has been for me.

3. Back to finances. Since no clear plan mentioned and given that you are close to the 25x (not including wife continuing to work and later SS, are you sure you won't become more extravagant in terms of desire to travel, etc---Given who you are, you will control this but you don't deserve to have retirement "crimped" in any way.

My sense is that you are there, you know you are there, you are just using forum as sounding board to be even more certain of your decision. I look forward to your posts as one of the retired to learn from your insights.
is50xenough,

1) My employer's insurance for 2 years and my wife's insurance is the backup plan. So, for the next 2 years, I can have double coverage.

2) I have plenty of other interests. The problem here is if I want to stay employed in my area, I have to devote X amount of my time every week to keep up with the technology,

3) I had lived the same way for a very long time. Extravagant to me would be taking voice lessons and try to be a better singer or taking improv lessons. Time to do stuff is more precious to me than buying things.

KlangFool
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willthrill81
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by willthrill81 »

MisterMister wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 1:52 pm
aarondearu wrote: Fri May 22, 2020 11:27 pm You could refinance your mortgage to a lower rate.
There are 30 year mortgages under 3% with $0 closing costs right now.
I am curious how that works for someone with strong assets but limited income. It could complicate things substantially. For that reason, and only that reason, I would keep the mortgage if it were me.
Yes, it could complicate matters. If wants to pursue that route, he might want to do so right now while he's still employed.
“It's a dangerous business, Frodo, going out your door. You step onto the road, and if you don't keep your feet, there's no knowing where you might be swept off to.” J.R.R. Tolkien,The Lord of the Rings
ThankYouJack
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by ThankYouJack »

KlangFool, the numbers seem good to me -- congrats on your success! Two things tho -- are you sure you can get unemployment insurance while receiving severance pay? And is your wife fine working for the next decade (?) for the health insurance benefits?
rjbraun
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by rjbraun »

MisterMister wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 1:52 pm
aarondearu wrote: Fri May 22, 2020 11:27 pm You could refinance your mortgage to a lower rate.
There are 30 year mortgages under 3% with $0 closing costs right now.
I am curious how that works for someone with strong assets but limited income. It could complicate things substantially. For that reason, and only that reason, I would keep the mortgage if it were me.
I have refinanced a mortgage without salary income. Ironically, Chase, where I had a long and fine (as far as I knew) relationship gave me somewhat of a hard time. Eventually, they offered me a mortgage but at terms less attractive than TD Bank, where I had no prior relationship but ended up refinancing. This occurred a number of years ago, though, so no idea of current conditions.
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KlangFool
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by KlangFool »

ThankYouJack wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 2:40 pm KlangFool, the numbers seem good to me -- congrats on your success! Two things tho -- are you sure you can get unemployment insurance while receiving severance pay? And is your wife fine working for the next decade (?) for the health insurance benefits?
ThankYouJack,

<<Two things tho -- are you sure you can get unemployment insurance while receiving severance pay?>>

Yes.

<<And is your wife fine working for the next decade (?) for the health insurance benefits?>>

Plan A -> She work. Plan B -> ACA. None of this matters only after the next 2 years since I am covered under the employer's insurance.

KlangFool
workoutexcite
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by workoutexcite »

KlangFool so sorry to hear about your job. Looks like you are covered both financially and mentally.
ColoradoRick
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by ColoradoRick »

KlangFool, I've always enjoyed the wisdom and logic of your posts. Thanks to you and I'm hopeful you will continue to share your journey as it evolves.

Seems to me that you are more than fine to retire. Your wife says you've been working hard and should retire. That is important and should tell you something. Other than the normal anxiety about change, to me the decider would be what your gut feel is about the first few weeks of not working. If it sounds terrific and fills you with joy, that is the way to go. That was the way it was with me. If there is a sense of dread in spite of your many interests, perhaps it's not the time.

I too subscribe to the theory that you trade money for time. I loved my career for the first 35 years, but the last 4 years not so much as my industry changed. I've been retired 7.5 years and don't regret it. I traded SS @ 8% x 4 years but would do it again. Filed early so I could let my IRA grow and whether luck or skill it worked for us! We are very similar except where the industry we were in. Like the credit card commercial I thought those 4 years were priceless. I have enough and it looks like you do too.

Best Regards,
Colorado Rick
Jags4186
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by Jags4186 »

Sorry to hear about the job loss. If you wish to continue working I suggest you look at smaller companies who may need a generic IT person. Then your age and experience will be an advantage.

1) you won’t need supervision
2) you won’t be looking to climb the ladder and therefore be looking to leave for greener pastures.
ThankYouJack
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by ThankYouJack »

KlangFool wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 2:50 pm
ThankYouJack wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 2:40 pm KlangFool, the numbers seem good to me -- congrats on your success! Two things tho -- are you sure you can get unemployment insurance while receiving severance pay? And is your wife fine working for the next decade (?) for the health insurance benefits?
ThankYouJack,

<<Two things tho -- are you sure you can get unemployment insurance while receiving severance pay?>>

Yes.

<<And is your wife fine working for the next decade (?) for the health insurance benefits?>>

Plan A -> She work. Plan B -> ACA. None of this matters only after the next 2 years since I am covered under the employer's insurance.

KlangFool
Make sure to take a look at the numbers for the subsidized health insurance vs unsubsidized. My wife's went from ~$300/month to well over $2k/month once the subsidy ran out. So you may want to jump over to your wife's health insurance before 2 years. And if that's the case make sure the change in premium will count as a qualified life event if you want to make the change outside of the enrollment period.
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KlangFool
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by KlangFool »

ThankYouJack wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 3:25 pm
KlangFool wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 2:50 pm
ThankYouJack wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 2:40 pm KlangFool, the numbers seem good to me -- congrats on your success! Two things tho -- are you sure you can get unemployment insurance while receiving severance pay? And is your wife fine working for the next decade (?) for the health insurance benefits?
ThankYouJack,

<<Two things tho -- are you sure you can get unemployment insurance while receiving severance pay?>>

Yes.

<<And is your wife fine working for the next decade (?) for the health insurance benefits?>>

Plan A -> She work. Plan B -> ACA. None of this matters only after the next 2 years since I am covered under the employer's insurance.

KlangFool
Make sure to take a look at the numbers for the subsidized health insurance vs unsubsidized. My wife's went from ~$300/month to well over $2k/month once the subsidy ran out. So you may want to jump over to your wife's health insurance before 2 years. And if that's the case make sure the change in premium will count as a qualified life event if you want to make the change outside of the enrollment period.
ThankYouJack,

Okay. Thanks. We will put that down as one of our checklist items.

KlangFool
rjbraun
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by rjbraun »

ThankYouJack wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 3:25 pm
KlangFool wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 2:50 pm
ThankYouJack wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 2:40 pm KlangFool, the numbers seem good to me -- congrats on your success! Two things tho -- are you sure you can get unemployment insurance while receiving severance pay? And is your wife fine working for the next decade (?) for the health insurance benefits?
ThankYouJack,

<<Two things tho -- are you sure you can get unemployment insurance while receiving severance pay?>>

Yes.

<<And is your wife fine working for the next decade (?) for the health insurance benefits?>>

Plan A -> She work. Plan B -> ACA. None of this matters only after the next 2 years since I am covered under the employer's insurance.

KlangFool
Make sure to take a look at the numbers for the subsidized health insurance vs unsubsidized. My wife's went from ~$300/month to well over $2k/month once the subsidy ran out. So you may want to jump over to your wife's health insurance before 2 years. And if that's the case make sure the change in premium will count as a qualified life event if you want to make the change outside of the enrollment period.
Not clear to me if you are already covered under your wife's insurance through her employer. If you are, great, but, if not, you may want to consider it.

As I believe you said that she works in the public sector, I would be concerned about her benefits potentially changing, particularly given the strain of the pandemic on municipalities, etc. If there's a chance that health benefits were to change, such that maybe the employer only insures the employee and not their family members, perhaps they would grandfather existing enrollees. Obviously, the current cost would influence whether or not it's worth having the double coverage.

Any chance she would be entitled to retiree health insurance when she retires? Sounds as if she may be working long enough (>10 years) to access this potential benefit.
makingmistakes
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by makingmistakes »

KlangFool wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 2:00 pm
is50xenough wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 1:36 pm 2) I have plenty of other interests. The problem here is if I want to stay employed in my area, I have to devote X amount of my time every week to keep up with the technology,

3) I had lived the same way for a very long time. Extravagant to me would be taking voice lessons and try to be a better singer or taking improv lessons. Time to do stuff is more precious to me than buying things.

KlangFool
Seems like the decision is a no brainer. I’d be rejoicing at my new found freedom and time.
Elysium
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by Elysium »

KlangFool wrote: Fri May 22, 2020 6:17 pm 1) Is it really worthwhile for me to continue working? I worked in the IT area. If I want to stay in this area, I have to study 10 to 20 hours per week just to keep up with the latest technology.

2) If I do contract work, how much should I get paid before it is worthwhile for me to work?
KlangFool
Klang, you are in fine shape regarding finances, and I know you are well prepared, so I will simply focus on the area you are asking help figuring out since I have experience there.

What are your IT skills like, and what latest tech do you have learn? depending on your location there could be plenty of contract work, all remote until COVID-19 goes away. Contracting rates are negotiable, right now I would take 10% to 15% cut just to make things easier.
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Leif
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by Leif »

If you enjoy working then I would search for home contract work while on unemployment. If I needed to study 10-20 hr./week for a 20 hr. job then I don't think I would bother. But if your wife looses her job then you would need to become more serious for medical coverage. The issue is going to be, however, that many others will be looking for at home contract IT work. Congratulations on being prepared. Many, many are not.

Good luck.
Elysium
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by Elysium »

Leif wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 4:07 pm If you enjoy working then I would search for home contract work while on unemployment. If I needed to study 10-20 hr./week for a 20 hr. job then I don't think I would bother. But if your wife looses her job then you would need to become more serious for medical coverage. The issue is going to be, however, that many others will be looking for at home contract IT work. Congratulations on being prepared. Many, many are not.

Good luck.
No chance IT jobs are $20 an hour, we are talking about nothing less than $80 an hour even for mundane IT jobs, with 10-20 hours of study much more. All IT jobs right now are remote jobs, they will ship you a laptop via UPS after interview/on boarding and you are all set within days to collaborate with co-workers all working remote.
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Leif
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by Leif »

Elysium wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 4:10 pm
Leif wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 4:07 pm If you enjoy working then I would search for home contract work while on unemployment. If I needed to study 10-20 hr./week for a 20 hr. job then I don't think I would bother. But if your wife looses her job then you would need to become more serious for medical coverage. The issue is going to be, however, that many others will be looking for at home contract IT work. Congratulations on being prepared. Many, many are not.

Good luck.
No chance IT jobs are $20 an hour, we are talking about nothing less than $80 an hour even for mundane IT jobs, with 10-20 hours of study much more. All IT jobs right now are remote jobs, they will ship you a laptop via UPS after interview/on boarding and you are all set within days to collaborate with co-workers all working remote.
I don't understand that comment. Are you confusing a 20 hour/week job, which is what the OP indicated he was interested in, and $20/hr? I was in the IT field for 40 years so I'm well aware of the going rates.
Elysium
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by Elysium »

Leif wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 4:13 pm
Elysium wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 4:10 pm
Leif wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 4:07 pm If you enjoy working then I would search for home contract work while on unemployment. If I needed to study 10-20 hr./week for a 20 hr. job then I don't think I would bother. But if your wife looses her job then you would need to become more serious for medical coverage. The issue is going to be, however, that many others will be looking for at home contract IT work. Congratulations on being prepared. Many, many are not.

Good luck.
No chance IT jobs are $20 an hour, we are talking about nothing less than $80 an hour even for mundane IT jobs, with 10-20 hours of study much more. All IT jobs right now are remote jobs, they will ship you a laptop via UPS after interview/on boarding and you are all set within days to collaborate with co-workers all working remote.
I don't understand that comment. Are you confusing a 20 hour/week job, which is what the OP indicated he was interested in, and $20/hr? I was in the IT field for 40 years so I'm well aware of the going rates.
Sorry, I misunderstood.
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tooluser
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by tooluser »

lgs88 wrote: Fri May 22, 2020 10:15 pm KlangFool,

I've always appreciated reading about your conservative approach to wealth management, amid all the 100% stock go-go bulls of the Bogleheads forum. You helped me feel OK about taking some risk off the table. Glad to see you're well-prepared for this. Bravo, and good luck to you.

lgs88
Ditto. And I'm not very conservative with my investments. Always good food for thought, delivered concisely and clearly.
WienerG
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by WienerG »

Klangfool,

What is stopping you hanging up your boots & calling it a day?

You have great numbers, you have health cover & you are clearly adept at budgeting. I would heed DW's advice & enjoy the time.

Thanks for your insightful posts... Really appreciate them.

WienerG
Ependytis
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by Ependytis »

Klngfool, sorry to hear about your loss. I appreciate all the insights you provided over the years. I’m in your same situation and could comfortably live off 2% of my projected investments when my severance runs out however I have decided to continue to look for at least six months. Although I was prepared, the reason I will look is because it will be my choice to not continue to work and not someone else’s. I never thought I would say this but I’m actually enjoying looking for work even though I don’t need to. Exploring a different side of my personality has been something I am really enjoying- I never thought I’d be a sales person. I wish you all the best in the future.
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KlangFool
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by KlangFool »

WienerG wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 4:26 pm Klangfool,

What is stopping you hanging up your boots & calling it a day?

You have great numbers, you have health cover & you are clearly adept at budgeting. I would heed DW's advice & enjoy the time.

Thanks for your insightful posts... Really appreciate them.

WienerG
WienerG,

Essentially, there is no going back if I stay off for 2 years. That is my concern. It may or may not be real. I had done so many jobs and went through so many transitions that it may not be impossible. But, there is always doubt.

KlangFool
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Leif
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by Leif »

Your question is "Can I retire yet?", and I believe based on your initial post, the answer is yes.
cherijoh
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by cherijoh »

nigel_ht wrote: Fri May 22, 2020 6:47 pm Sorry about being laid off.

FIREing with $1.4M at 50 feels a little lean to me. 3.5% withdrawal rate is $49K but you do get $15K from your wife's salary. So you're probably fine.

If the market tanks again you'll be eating into your EF which will have to get replenished.

I dunno, IT is still in demand unless you moved into management like many technical people do in their 50s. Then you may have to study to regain skills if you want to do contract work. I'd start a consulting LLC over the next 3 months while looking for a $90/hr gig. Study a couple hours a day. Maybe get some kind of cyber cert from the local university. Maybe not a spendy Cisco Cyber ones. Write it off taxes this year if you can.
I think you may have misread the post. Klangfool said late 50+ in original post. My guess based on his subsequent post that he is more than 55 and likely in the 57-58 yo range.
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KlangFool
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by KlangFool »

cherijoh wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 5:34 pm
nigel_ht wrote: Fri May 22, 2020 6:47 pm Sorry about being laid off.

FIREing with $1.4M at 50 feels a little lean to me. 3.5% withdrawal rate is $49K but you do get $15K from your wife's salary. So you're probably fine.

If the market tanks again you'll be eating into your EF which will have to get replenished.

I dunno, IT is still in demand unless you moved into management like many technical people do in their 50s. Then you may have to study to regain skills if you want to do contract work. I'd start a consulting LLC over the next 3 months while looking for a $90/hr gig. Study a couple hours a day. Maybe get some kind of cyber cert from the local university. Maybe not a spendy Cisco Cyber ones. Write it off taxes this year if you can.
I think you may have misread the post. Klangfool said late 50+ in original post. My guess based on his subsequent post that he is more than 55 and likely in the 57-58 yo range.
You are correct.

Thanks.

KlangFool
is50xenough
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by is50xenough »

KlangFool wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 2:00 pm
is50xenough wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 1:36 pm
3) I had lived the same way for a very long time. Extravagant to me would be taking voice lessons and try to be a better singer or taking improv lessons. Time to do stuff is more precious to me than buying things.

KlangFool
So then the only question is whether audio and video files of your singing or improv can be posted on bogleheads? I know I would watch! Good luck.
edge
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by edge »

I’m most confused by the statement of needing to spend 10-20 hours per week learning. That seems way over the top.
nigel_ht
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by nigel_ht »

cherijoh wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 5:34 pm
nigel_ht wrote: Fri May 22, 2020 6:47 pm Sorry about being laid off.

FIREing with $1.4M at 50 feels a little lean to me. 3.5% withdrawal rate is $49K but you do get $15K from your wife's salary. So you're probably fine.

If the market tanks again you'll be eating into your EF which will have to get replenished.

I dunno, IT is still in demand unless you moved into management like many technical people do in their 50s. Then you may have to study to regain skills if you want to do contract work. I'd start a consulting LLC over the next 3 months while looking for a $90/hr gig. Study a couple hours a day. Maybe get some kind of cyber cert from the local university. Maybe not a spendy Cisco Cyber ones. Write it off taxes this year if you can.
I think you may have misread the post. Klangfool said late 50+ in original post. My guess based on his subsequent post that he is more than 55 and likely in the 57-58 yo range.
I figured he was older than 55 but gave the benefit of the doubt. If he’s older than 55 then just retire.

The only issue is if your wife is still working you’re stuck geographically so unless you have a hobby to be engrossed in for 10 years or whatever until she retires your own retirement is kinda stuck in neutral.

What are you gonna say? “Hey honey, I’m gonna ride my bike across the country...see ya in a couple months!” Or “hey I found this cheap flight to Iceland on Wed...let’s go! Oh wait, you gotta work...”

Thats why I elected to keep working...I have hobbies but not 20-40hrs per week hobbies...
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CyclingDuo
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by CyclingDuo »

KlangFool wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 2:50 pm
ThankYouJack wrote: Sat May 23, 2020 2:40 pm KlangFool, the numbers seem good to me -- congrats on your success! Two things tho -- are you sure you can get unemployment insurance while receiving severance pay? And is your wife fine working for the next decade (?) for the health insurance benefits?
ThankYouJack,

<<Two things tho -- are you sure you can get unemployment insurance while receiving severance pay?>>

Yes.

<<And is your wife fine working for the next decade (?) for the health insurance benefits?>>

Plan A -> She work. Plan B -> ACA. None of this matters only after the next 2 years since I am covered under the employer's insurance.

KlangFool
Keep in mind if you file for unemployment, you will have to be actively looking for work each week and document it all as well as attend interviews. Each state is different, but you may have been through it before.
"Save like a pessimist, invest like an optimist." - Morgan Housel
Mitchell777
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Re: The axe falls and I am prepared. What's next?

Post by Mitchell777 »

I am sorry to hear of your job loss. Having been through it I know it can be very difficult. Financially, you will probably be fine whichever path you choose. Having said that, personally I feel very uncertain about what the future holds for our financial lives. I would probably keep working at least for awhile. Although, I am risk-averse and you may not be. Best of luck
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