Large attic - to finish or not finish?

[mister_sparkle]

I purchased a new house in December that has very large unfinished second-floor attic. It's approximately 25' x 25' -- I've included pictures below that show the depth of it and the framing situation/flue piping on the sides. It is not insulated at the moment and only has 2 bare lightbulbs in the middle of the angled roof. The heat/air conditioning currently do not have any ductwork in the room, although the unit is in a little elevated area near the entrance to the attic. I currently use it to store some plastic tubs of documents and mementoes/photos, extra boxes, etc. There is plenty of unused space in it.

I want to convert some of the area into a workout room, and I am really at a loss about what I should do with the space. The options appear to be:

1. Go whole hog and have all of the room finished -- insulated, add electric, drywall, a ceiling, recessed can lights, carpet, etc. I estimate this would cost somewhere around $25K-$30K -- does that sound reasonable? I am not concerned about getting my money's worth out of this improvement if/when I sell; I am primarily interested in creating an environment where I enjoy working out rather than dreading it, so I would hang a flat-screen TV on the wall, add an Apple TV so that I can watch TV/movies through that, etc.

2. Convert part of the room, leaving 30-50% of it unfinished for storage.

3. Keep it skeletal and put down some gym padding, and have the bare minimum of electrical work done so that I can watch TV while working out. Not sure if I would rely on space heaters and portable air conditioner to keep it reasonable, or pay to have ductwork installed so that there is heat and air conditioning.

Would love to hear from anyone that went through a similar dilemma. Thanks!

[London]

As long as the joists can support the weight, I’d do it.

The only consideration around resale would be the entrance to the space. If it’s through a narrow staircase, people may not value it as much.

[Monsterflockster]

My vote: Finish it!

[Puretaxableindexer]

I purchased a new house in December that has very large unfinished second-floor attic. It's approximately 25' x 25' -- I've included pictures below that show the depth of it and the framing situation/flue piping on the sides. It is not insulated at the moment and only has 2 bare lightbulbs in the middle of the angled roof. The heat/air conditioning currently do not have any ductwork in the room, although the unit is in a little elevated area near the entrance to the attic. I currently use it to store some plastic tubs of documents and mementoes/photos, extra boxes, etc. There is plenty of unused space in it.

I want to convert some of the area into a workout room, and I am really at a loss about what I should do with the space. The options appear to be:

1. Go whole hog and have all of the room finished -- insulated, add electric, drywall, a ceiling, recessed can lights, carpet, etc. I estimate this would cost somewhere around $25K-$30K -- does that sound reasonable? I am not concerned about getting my money's worth out of this improvement if/when I sell; I am primarily interested in creating an environment where I enjoy working out rather than dreading it, so I would hang a flat-screen TV on the wall, add an Apple TV so that I can watch TV/movies through that, etc.

2. Convert part of the room, leaving 30-50% of it unfinished for storage.

3. Keep it skeletal and put down some gym padding, and have the bare minimum of electrical work done so that I can watch TV while working out. Not sure if I would rely on space heaters and portable air conditioner to keep it reasonable, or pay to have ductwork installed so that there is heat and air conditioning.

Would love to hear from anyone that went through a similar dilemma. Thanks!

Very nice attic. I understand why you would want to do something with it. Make it a part workout/man cave and storage area.

Good luck.

[HomeStretch]

+1 on finishing it if the floor joists can support the weight. Would be nice to have a bathroom up there...

If you finish it, pull any necessary permits so as not to have an issue when you sell.

[Watty]

I purchased a new house in December that has very large unfinished second-floor attic.

The first thing to do would be to call the builder and ask if the space was designed to be finished.

If it was not designed with the right support and whatnot it might not be easy to bring it up to the building code so you could finish it.

Some living spaces, like in a finished basement, may require a second exit so you would not be trapped in a fire. I don't' know if that would also apply to a finished attic.

If it could easily be finished it seems odd that the builder did not do a minimal finish and call it a bonus room so they could charge more for the house.

[blackholescion]

I purchased a new house in December that has very large unfinished second-floor attic.

The first thing to do would be to call the builder and ask if the space was designed to be finished.

If it was not designed with the right support and whatnot it might not be easy to bring it up to the building code so you could finish it.

Some living spaces, like in a finished basement, may require a second exit so you would not be trapped in a fire. I don't' know if that would also apply to a finished attic.

If it could easily be finished it seems odd that the builder did not do a minimal finish and call it a bonus room so they could charge more for the house.

Our attic is unfinished and plumbed for a bathroom/shower plus a/c and heat. The previous owner built the house and chose not to finish the attic. It’s most of the reason why the house down the street is worth 100k more than ours. Theirs is finished and ours isn’t.

I would expect that you would get your money back out. Generally speaking houses of the nature tend to cluster together unless it was overbuilt for the neighborhood. As long as it wasn’t, you’ll at least break even.

Whatever you think it’ll cost, add 30-50%. Also keep in mind that workers have to either carry stuff up there or lift it in through a window. Since you only have a single window, it may be worth expanding to a double so you don’t have them carry drywall and ducting and all their other materials through your house but can lift it in through the window.

[UpperNwGuy]

Why can't you work out in an unfinished attic? It already looks nicer than the gym where I work out.

[Jack FFR1846]

I think the entrance plans would be key. A building inspector might look at a narrow stairway and simply say "Nope".

[Sandtrap]

Anything from #1-3 is fine depending on your budget and if the space is per code structurally for that use.

If up to code, what I would do:

Bring up the stairway access to code.
Finish it.

Do everything right.
You will be glad for the effort.

Be sure to soundproof and pad the floor so thumping and noise doesn't travel below too badly.

However, if it was not designed as another floor with structural strength for that, then put a minimal effort.
Check with the builder and the building plans.
Are the floor joists minimum 2x12 solid or TGI's 16" o.c. ??

j

[JoeRetire]

Why waste money on a workout room? Just do the minimum to make it usable.

[OAG]

I purchased a new house in December that has very large unfinished second-floor attic.

The first thing to do would be to call the builder and ask if the space was designed to be finished.

If it was not designed with the right support and whatnot it might not be easy to bring it up to the building code so you could finish it.

Some living spaces, like in a finished basement, may require a second exit so you would not be trapped in a fire. I don't' know if that would also apply to a finished attic.

If it could easily be finished it seems odd that the builder did not do a minimal finish and call it a bonus room so they could charge more for the house.

Our attic is unfinished and plumbed for a bathroom/shower plus a/c and heat. The previous owner built the house and chose not to finish the attic. It’s most of the reason why the house down the street is worth 100k more than ours. Theirs is finished and ours isn’t.

I would expect that you would get your money back out. Generally speaking houses of the nature tend to cluster together unless it was overbuilt for the neighborhood. As long as it wasn’t, you’ll at least break even.

Whatever you think it’ll cost, add 30-50%. Also keep in mind that workers have to either carry stuff up there or lift it in through a window. Since you only have a single window, it may be worth expanding to a double so you don’t have them carry drywall and ducting and all their other materials through your house but can lift it in through the window.

Unless I am mistaken I see at least 3 windows. One plus 2 dormers.

[campy2010]

Temperature control is probably the biggest issue with the more skeletal options.

Will your HVAC system support the added square footage?

Will portable air conditioners cool this large enough space to use as a workout room?

Heat is less of an issue. Working out when it's a little chilly is manageable, or even preferable to some.

[cashboy]

3. Keep it skeletal and put down some gym padding, and have the bare minimum of electrical work done so that I can watch TV while working out.

i faced a similar dilemma with my basement. i went bare bones and am glad i did.

i vote #3 without any permanent heat/ac changes.

you can use it almost immediately at a very low cost.

if over time you really love it up there you can look at upgrading it then.

if over time you DO NOT really love it up there you lost very little.

one other thing to keep in mind is that an attic upgraded to 'true' living space will likely increase your property taxes and house insurance.

[mister_sparkle]

Anything from #1-3 is fine depending on your budget and if the space is per code structurally for that use.

If up to code, what I would do:

Bring up the stairway access to code.
Finish it.

Do everything right.
You will be glad for the effort.

Be sure to soundproof and pad the floor so thumping and noise doesn't travel below too badly.

However, if it was not designed as another floor with structural strength for that, then put a minimal effort.
Check with the builder and the building plans.
Are the floor joists minimum 2x12 solid or TGI's 16" o.c. ??

j

Here are pictures of the walk-in entrance to the attic, which is about 10 feet away from stairs going downstairs. In addition, I'm showing the area where the a/c unit/furnace is.

I'm sure the unit could handle one more room. The other rooms on the second floor are a medium-sized bedroom, bathroom, large bonus room and closet.

I'll check with the builder to see if they think the space would need extra support. They provided dozens of photos of the house mid-build in case I needed to review location of things behind the walls, and it appears that the sub-flooring in the attic is the exact same as was used in the occupied rooms on the second floor.

[mister_sparkle]

Why can't you work out in an unfinished attic? It already looks nicer than the gym where I work out.

I just think a bare-bones area would not be nearly as enticing to working out, which I'm not the biggest fan of.

[123]

Looks like a great house. Kind of surprising that part of the upper floor was finished but part was left as an attic (instead of the entire floor as an attic). Just curious, what is underneath the unfinished attic part? Is it finished living space or perhaps an unheated area like the garage?

[mister_sparkle]

Looks like a great house. Kind of surprising that part of the upper floor was finished but part was left as an attic (instead of the entire floor as an attic). Just curious, what is underneath the unfinished attic part? Is it finished living space or perhaps an unheated area like the garage?

The garage.

We looked at several houses on our street (new development) and they all had 1 or 2 unfinished attic spaces. Down here in NC, almost no one has basements, so I think that's probably the reason (storage).

[Sandtrap]

Anything from #1-3 is fine depending on your budget and if the space is per code structurally for that use.

If up to code, what I would do:

Bring up the stairway access to code.
Finish it.

Do everything right.
You will be glad for the effort.

Be sure to soundproof and pad the floor so thumping and noise doesn't travel below too badly.

However, if it was not designed as another floor with structural strength for that, then put a minimal effort.
Check with the builder and the building plans.
Are the floor joists minimum 2x12 solid or TGI's 16" o.c. ??

j

Here are pictures of the walk-in entrance to the attic, which is about 10 feet away from stairs going downstairs. In addition, I'm showing the area where the a/c unit/furnace is.

I'm sure the unit could handle one more room. The other rooms on the second floor are a medium-sized bedroom, bathroom, large bonus room and closet.

I'll check with the builder to see if they think the space would need extra support. They provided dozens of photos of the house mid-build in case I needed to review location of things behind the walls, and it appears that the sub-flooring in the attic is the exact same as was used in the occupied rooms on the second floor.

Awesome.
That's a really nice room to build out.

There's really no practical way to increase support beyond installing a beam down the center (below the floor)and post supports directly to load bearing below and below.

I would imagine that "code" would require at least a bedroom size access door, electrical outlets every 12 feet, direct wired smoke detectors connected to the rest of the house (all go off), etc, etc, just as they do in the rooms on other floors of the house.

It might be a good idea to also look into foaming between the roof rafters before closing them up. Could get really hot in the summer.

Great that the HVAC system is right there for you to tap in to.

Do the dormers have openable windows?

Great pics. Thanks for posting them.
j

[mister_sparkle]

Yes, the windows do open.

[816_Feet]

I'm an architect. I'm unsure of how your home is insulated/designed. Typically, homes in the US are stick framed (wood 2x4 platform framed) with cold roofs. A cold roof is when you put insulation above the ceiling on your highest floor then you vent the attic (bring in outside air low and vent it at the ridge (top). In the summer it's hot in the attic and in the winter it's cold. It's important that it's cold because that keeps the heat from your home from melting the snow above which would then turn into water and back into ice once it reaches the edge of your roof where there's no more heat which then causes an ice dam (basically icicles) that rip up your roof. It's a very clever way to build, and blowing fiberglass insulation above exposed rafters is cheap and effective.

But the photos you show have several clues that make me think that the space you're showing is closer to unfinished space as opposed to a vented attic/cold roof:

• I don't see vents to the outside at the perimeter of the roof

• There's a subfloor installed over the floor joists/bottom chords.

• There appears to be foil faced insulation (polyiso?) beneath your roof sheathing - is that how the roof is insulated or is that just a radiant barrier?

• But if this is the case then why aren't the dormers insulated?

• There's a photo where you show conditioned living space on the same level as the "attic" plus another level of attic above with your HVAC unit.

If it was only designed as an attic space the floor loading will only be designed as the bottom chord of a truss and won't be meant for live load (humans walking around). You could sister joists to the existing (glue and nail an additional joist to the side of the existing). If you're only going to be up there by yourself it's not a big deal. We design structures for people's comfort more than their capacity. Floors can deflect far more than people are comfortable with and still be okay structurally.

If you're working out up there mats is a decent option. Better yet is to build an entirely new floor on top of acoustic isolators over your existing subfloor.

[blackholescion]

I purchased a new house in December that has very large unfinished second-floor attic.

The first thing to do would be to call the builder and ask if the space was designed to be finished.

If it was not designed with the right support and whatnot it might not be easy to bring it up to the building code so you could finish it.

Some living spaces, like in a finished basement, may require a second exit so you would not be trapped in a fire. I don't' know if that would also apply to a finished attic.

If it could easily be finished it seems odd that the builder did not do a minimal finish and call it a bonus room so they could charge more for the house.

Our attic is unfinished and plumbed for a bathroom/shower plus a/c and heat. The previous owner built the house and chose not to finish the attic. It’s most of the reason why the house down the street is worth 100k more than ours. Theirs is finished and ours isn’t.

I would expect that you would get your money back out. Generally speaking houses of the nature tend to cluster together unless it was overbuilt for the neighborhood. As long as it wasn’t, you’ll at least break even.

Whatever you think it’ll cost, add 30-50%. Also keep in mind that workers have to either carry stuff up there or lift it in through a window. Since you only have a single window, it may be worth expanding to a double so you don’t have them carry drywall and ducting and all their other materials through your house but can lift it in through the window.

Unless I am mistaken I see at least 3 windows. One plus 2 dormers.

I don’t see a double wide window like this one. .

You can fit sheetrock by taking out the window when it’s a double. You can’t in a single.

[CurlyDave]

I'm an architect. I'm unsure of how your home is insulated/designed. Typically, homes in the US are stick framed (wood 2x4 platform framed) with cold roofs. A cold roof is when you put insulation above the ceiling on your highest floor then you vent the attic (bring in outside air low and vent it at the ridge (top). In the summer it's hot in the attic and in the winter it's cold. It's important that it's cold because that keeps the heat from your home from melting the snow above which would then turn into water and back into ice once it reaches the edge of your roof where there's no more heat which then causes an ice dam (basically icicles) that rip up your roof. It's a very clever way to build, and blowing fiberglass insulation above exposed rafters is cheap and effective.

But the photos you show have several clues that make me think that the space you're showing is closer to unfinished space as opposed to a vented attic/cold roof:

• I don't see vents to the outside at the perimeter of the roof

• There's a subfloor installed over the floor joists/bottom chords.

• There appears to be foil faced insulation (polyiso?) beneath your roof sheathing - is that how the roof is insulated or is that just a radiant barrier?

• But if this is the case then why aren't the dormers insulated?

• There's a photo where you show conditioned living space on the same level as the "attic" plus another level of attic above with your HVAC unit.

If it was only designed as an attic space the floor loading will only be designed as the bottom chord of a truss and won't be meant for live load (humans walking around). You could sister joists to the existing (glue and nail an additional joist to the side of the existing). If you're only going to be up there by yourself it's not a big deal. We design structures for people's comfort more than their capacity. Floors can deflect far more than people are comfortable with and still be okay structurally.

If you're working out up there mats is a decent option. Better yet is to build an entirely new floor on top of acoustic isolators over your existing subfloor.

I am not an architect, but I am an engineer.

1. The last picture, the one with the homemade ladder, seems to show the attic floor joists, but they appear to be running parallel with the peak of the roof. I have not seen this type of construction before. They are perpendicular to the direction the bottom chord of a truss would run. Is this possibly a platform on top of the true floor joists, to allow for ducting underneath the HVAC unit? Is the level of the floor under the HVAC unit the same as the floor in the other side of the attic?

2. If these really are the floor joists in the attic, you can just measure them directly and any architect or engineer can tell you if they are adequate for the span. You can also measure the span directly.

3. I once bought an older house where an attic had been converted, and the joists were inadequate. Long before anything fails, the flexing of the joists will cause them to "print" on the sheetrock in the ceilings of the room below. Especially if you use it as an exercise room.

4. I strongly recommend replacing that homemade ladder with a real store-bought one. If you get anyone else to work up there and there is any kind of accident with that one, your liability is huge. Even if you do it all yourself, your accident potential is high. Even if you decide to not do anything at all with the attic, replace that one and then burn it in the back yard.

[816_Feet]

1. The last picture, the one with the homemade ladder, seems to show the attic floor joists, but they appear to be running parallel with the peak of the roof. I have not seen this type of construction before. They are perpendicular to the direction the bottom chord of a truss would run. Is this possibly a platform on top of the true floor joists, to allow for ducting underneath the HVAC unit? Is the level of the floor under the HVAC unit the same as the floor in the other side of the attic?

Good catch, I didn't notice that. It almost looks like the finished interior space is built within the vented attic?

[Freetime76]

Well, you’ve got feedback from real estate experts, an architect and an engineer, so you’re probably in good shape.

I’ll chime in as a consumer ... I’d do it. Suggest to go all the way to the knee walls, and put in plumbing while the walls are open, even if you don’t do a bathroom now. The cost is minimal for the extra space you’re going to get, and it could serve a lot of different purposes -art studio, reading area, play area, place to house the in-laws (check the rules on qualifying as a bedroom if that might be a desired use) - should your needs change or if you decide to sell some day.

[Hockey10]

There's really no practical way to increase support beyond installing a beam down the center (below the floor)and post supports directly to load bearing below and below.

We once had a house built and chose the option of a finished space above the 2 car garage. This was a great space and I was able to easily fit in an office and workout area. As others have said, just be certain that the floor can properly support the load. You may end up having to add a lally column or two in the garage.

[Sandtrap]

There's really no practical way to increase support beyond installing a beam down the center (below the floor)and post supports directly to load bearing below and below.

We once had a house built and chose the option of a finished space above the 2 car garage. This was a great space and I was able to easily fit in an office and workout area. As others have said, just be certain that the floor can properly support the load. You may end up having to add a lally column or two in the garage.

Yes. Entirely doable if the OP's unit is over a garage!!!
Great!!!

j

[Nowizard]

The space is beautifully set up to be finished, and the largest portion of sf cost has been completed. Most builders want more square footage, and space like this, typically located over a garage, is prime for that. You get your extra space for other activities at a reasonable cost that will be recaptured when you sell in all probability. Hopefully, you will consider that you do need some storage space, too.

Tim

[CurlyDave]

1. The last picture, the one with the homemade ladder, seems to show the attic floor joists, but they appear to be running parallel with the peak of the roof. I have not seen this type of construction before. They are perpendicular to the direction the bottom chord of a truss would run. Is this possibly a platform on top of the true floor joists, to allow for ducting underneath the HVAC unit? Is the level of the floor under the HVAC unit the same as the floor in the other side of the attic?

Good catch, I didn't notice that. It almost looks like the finished interior space is built within the vented attic?

It sure looks that way to me. The other clue is that in the same picture with the homemade ladder it looks like fiberglass batt insulation sticking up from between the floor joists.

If this is designed as a vented attic it is still possible to finish it as living space, but it is a lot more involved than just some sheetrock and flooring. The OP needs to consult an architect or engineer first instead of just hiring a contractor who may not really understand the reasons for the way it is built.

[imebe]

I live in a high property tax locale, but my first thought was what finishing the attic will do to your property taxes?

[trueblueky]

What does the tax assessor say?

We had a house with a partially finished basement. The large furnace room / storage room was unfinished -- cement floor, exposed lumber on walls and ceiling. The rest of the basement had tile floor, painted sheetrock and acoustic tile ceiling; finished bath, office, closets.

Under that state's law, the whole basement was considered unfinished, so the square footage was not included in the assessor's calculation. That made it easy to convince DW not to finish the basement.

[gr7070]

What's the square footage with a 7' ceiling?

That would be a significant consideration for me.

[Sandtrap]

1. The last picture, the one with the homemade ladder, seems to show the attic floor joists, but they appear to be running parallel with the peak of the roof. I have not seen this type of construction before. They are perpendicular to the direction the bottom chord of a truss would run. Is this possibly a platform on top of the true floor joists, to allow for ducting underneath the HVAC unit? Is the level of the floor under the HVAC unit the same as the floor in the other side of the attic?

Good catch, I didn't notice that. It almost looks like the finished interior space is built within the vented attic?

It sure looks that way to me. The other clue is that in the same picture with the homemade ladder it looks like fiberglass batt insulation sticking up from between the floor joists.

If this is designed as a vented attic it is still possible to finish it as living space, but it is a lot more involved than just some sheetrock and flooring. The OP needs to consult an architect or engineer first instead of just hiring a contractor who may not really understand the reasons for the way it is built.

You guys are sharp with good eyes.
Yes
If you zoom in on the picture, the nailing pattern definitely looks like floor joists are running in line with the ridge vs the rafters.

I've done a number of custom homes and have never seen or done this. Very strange.

The whole area under the floor is a chaise for the HVAC ducting, etc.

Definitely have to check the structural feasabilty of putting heavy duty gym stuff on that floor.

j

[fru-gal]

Why can't you work out in an unfinished attic? It already looks nicer than the gym where I work out.

I like unfinished attics. They are nice and spooky and show the bones of the house. Also, why spend money on something you don't need.