How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

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miamivice
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How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by miamivice »

For mid-career folks, how often do you receive out of sequence pay bumps? i.e., most of us receive an annual raise, and I am not talking about those because those are loosely based on inflation and allow one to simply maintain their lifestyle. What I'm referring to is an increase in salary that offers an opportunity to bump up one's lifestyle.

When I was youthful, I remember the boss would give me random pay bumps when he saw that I was working hard and pleased with my performance. Then early in my career I switched jobs a couple times, each netting a handsome increase. Once I increased my salary by 90% (going from $37k to $67k) and that was a pretty sweet bump.

Then the bumps dried up, leaving me with annual raises that essentially match inflation.

Wondering how often does a mid-career person see a bump up in salary? Last time I received any sort of out of sequence bump was just about 8 years ago.
MotoTrojan
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by MotoTrojan »

I have never heard of such a thing unless it was a promotion, that is nice. My current gig has given me a bonus the last two years equal to about 9% of my salary which is new/nice, along with a solid raise and a bit of equity. But that is all part of the annual comp-review.
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miamivice
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by miamivice »

MotoTrojan wrote: Wed Sep 04, 2019 11:40 am I have never heard of such a thing unless it was a promotion, that is nice.
Most folks / employers probably would call an out of sequence bump a promotion. I'm using the term more generally here to not tie it only to promotions, but any out of sequence bump for any reason.
mak1277
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by mak1277 »

20+ years in the workforce. I have only one time ever received an out of sequence pay bump, and that was tied to relocation into a higher COL area.

Most of my career was in a Big 4 public accounting firm, so even the promotions were "in sequence".

I have, once or twice, processed out of sequence pay raises for my employees who were under-compensated compared to market prices. These were typically tied to the hiring of other people, and the adjustments were made to maintain fairness among a department of people.
PVW
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by PVW »

At my first professional job, the review and raise cycle was annual. For probably the first 5 years, in addition to the annual raise, I also got an extra raise at mid year. It wasn't uncommon for the young employees to get mid year raises. Mostly because the pay schedule had sharp increases for young employees and we were in a period of rapid industry-wide increases in pay so the annual raises weren't keeping up with the pay schedule.

At my current job, I receive an annual pay increase. Never had anything other than that and I haven't heard of anyone else getting a raise other than the annual. Before I started at this company, their regular review/raise cycle was something like every 16 months but they switched to every 12 months before I started.
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by TomatoTomahto »

DW has at megabanks. Salary seldom increased more than a nominal amount; the big bumps were in annual bonus.
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by Jack FFR1846 »

Annual raise? That's a good one. Very baby boomer centric and from what I hear, common in the 60's.

No, Megacorp has annual excuses. Wage freeze (for random reason), stagnant business cancels all raises, executives did something extra stupid, so we get to share the pain. I do remember 2 years ago being pulled aside and told I was one of 2 in our office of 50 getting 3%. The other 48....zero, as usual. Previous job went 10 years with no reviews and no raises. But that was privately owned, so they didn't even bother with excuses. If I married one of the many nieces of the CEO, I'd have received a huge raise.
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runner3081
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by runner3081 »

In the large healthcare company I work for... Never.
DVMResident
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by DVMResident »

My vague sense (manager perspective) is corporate comp structures have shifted away from these in lieu of one time/sporadic lump bonuses. These lumps are typically in the 3-to-5 digit range with the later accompanied with a handshake and photo op with someone in the C-suite. Higher salaries lock in costs while bonuses are not (fixed vs variable costs).

Maybe an HR comp specialist can comment.
eer_no_evil
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by eer_no_evil »

I'm in HR- and consult quite a bit on compensation related issues...Unfortunately, its quite rare to receive an out-of-cycle pay bump....if they occur they are occurring as a result of some stimuli; i.e changes in market data, the risk of losing a top performer, or leverage.

If you don't ask...you're unlikely to receive :moneybag
Texanbybirth
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by Texanbybirth »

I haven't received an in-sequence raise in 3 years. It has been 5 since I got an "out-of-sequence", which was a promotion. :beer
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oldfatguy
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by oldfatguy »

Jack FFR1846 wrote: Wed Sep 04, 2019 12:15 pm Annual raise? That's a good one.
+1 I don't think it is nearly as common as people assume.
mak1277
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by mak1277 »

Jack FFR1846 wrote: Wed Sep 04, 2019 12:15 pm Annual raise? That's a good one. Very baby boomer centric and from what I hear, common in the 60's.

No, Megacorp has annual excuses. Wage freeze (for random reason), stagnant business cancels all raises, executives did something extra stupid, so we get to share the pain. I do remember 2 years ago being pulled aside and told I was one of 2 in our office of 50 getting 3%. The other 48....zero, as usual. Previous job went 10 years with no reviews and no raises. But that was privately owned, so they didn't even bother with excuses. If I married one of the many nieces of the CEO, I'd have received a huge raise.
Why would you work at a place for 10 years without getting a raise? That's crazy.

I've received a raise for 19 out of the last 20 years.
oldfatguy
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by oldfatguy »

mak1277 wrote: Wed Sep 04, 2019 12:53 pm
Why would you work at a place for 10 years without getting a raise? That's crazy.
People stay in jobs for many different reasons, including benefits, age, location, family needs, etc, etc, etc.
MittensMoney
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by MittensMoney »

I've received annual raises (5-7% average, one year was a title bump & 10% increase) for the past 5 years with my current company, which has been fantastic given I also gained a 60% salary increase when I joined the from my previous firm. That being said, I've never received a pay increase outside of the scheduled yearly review.
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by jharkin »

In my 20s and early 30s I got off cycle raises maybe 3 or 4 times. A couple where "market adjustments" where the entire department got an extra raise in a years that attrition to startups was particularly bad and management was attempting to stop the bleed. Once was a director level promotion where my supervisor went to bat for me to give me a larger than usual raise.

In 20+ years, the smallest "on cycle" raise (other than salary freeze recession years) I ever got was 3% and some as high as 5 even without promotions... but I bust my #$)(*%$# and usually get above average/outperform/star performer etc level ratings on my annual reviews.
Thegame14
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by Thegame14 »

Id be happy with an annual raise, three years have gotten one 1% raise.....
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by Jack FFR1846 »

mak1277 wrote: Wed Sep 04, 2019 12:53 pm
Jack FFR1846 wrote: Wed Sep 04, 2019 12:15 pm Annual raise? That's a good one. Very baby boomer centric and from what I hear, common in the 60's.

No, Megacorp has annual excuses. Wage freeze (for random reason), stagnant business cancels all raises, executives did something extra stupid, so we get to share the pain. I do remember 2 years ago being pulled aside and told I was one of 2 in our office of 50 getting 3%. The other 48....zero, as usual. Previous job went 10 years with no reviews and no raises. But that was privately owned, so they didn't even bother with excuses. If I married one of the many nieces of the CEO, I'd have received a huge raise.
Why would you work at a place for 10 years without getting a raise? That's crazy.

I've received a raise for 19 out of the last 20 years.
I was only there 4 years. But when they announced that they were doing reviews and raises, lots of old timers there were talking about the last time it was done, 10 years earlier. I stayed because I was bound by a non-compete agreement (which I would NEVER sign again), so could not take a job with anyone with similar products. They did send lawyers after every single person who dared take a new job with anyone who might compete.....and the company hiring. They also did fun things during the reviews like demoting people who were not limited by being at the top of their range....so they were then unable to get a raise because with their new job title and pay range, they had topped out.
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Quirkz
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by Quirkz »

I'm 44, and I've had either 2 or 3, depending on what you count.

- Once my boss at a state university did a salary analysis of his team and realized that we were being paid less than average for other similar positions within the university. This caused the university to give us all 4% raises mid-year, unrelated to our annual reviews.

- Switching jobs from the university to a similar position at a private firm I got a roughly 40% increase in salary.

- I later got a promotion that came with a ~18% pay bump.

All other increases have been "in-sequence."

Just for balance, I want to note I've also had one case of a layoff leading to being severely under-employed for 2-3 years, and it was maybe 5 full years before I was back to earning my previous salary.
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by TheOscarGuy »

miamivice wrote: Wed Sep 04, 2019 11:38 am For mid-career folks, how often do you receive out of sequence pay bumps? i.e., most of us receive an annual raise, and I am not talking about those because those are loosely based on inflation and allow one to simply maintain their lifestyle. What I'm referring to is an increase in salary that offers an opportunity to bump up one's lifestyle.

When I was youthful, I remember the boss would give me random pay bumps when he saw that I was working hard and pleased with my performance. Then early in my career I switched jobs a couple times, each netting a handsome increase. Once I increased my salary by 90% (going from $37k to $67k) and that was a pretty sweet bump.

Then the bumps dried up, leaving me with annual raises that essentially match inflation.

Wondering how often does a mid-career person see a bump up in salary? Last time I received any sort of out of sequence bump was just about 8 years ago.
As often as I change jobs :)
I have never heard of such out of sequence pay bumps. Either annual increases, which also cover promotions.
stoptothink
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by stoptothink »

Prior to my current job I'd received a grand total of two raises that were not associated with promotions or employer change since joining the professional workforce, and those were both 1.5% end-of-year raises for essentially being "employee of the year" (highest end-of-year evaluation for entire program). Over the last 4yrs I've averaged 15%+ year (all end of year), but that includes a promotion and another title change (with same responsibilities) so that my boss could justify another raise to his partners. Average end of year raise is 0-3% at my employer and most people don't get anything (last year I gave ~1/3 of my direct reports raises). Similarly, at my wife's employer (completely different industry than mine), there are no raises without promotion.

Only time I ever experienced this was when I was 15-16 and working at Baskin Robbins. The owners would give me random $.05-.$.25/hr raises because I was basically running the place.
FootballFan5548
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by FootballFan5548 »

I work in the commercial insurance business. I have a team of 10 people reporting to me. 4 of the 10 this year have come to me with offers from competitors or very serious interest from competitors. Usually those offers were well above what they make right now. In 3 of the 4 cases we either matched or gave a very large increase to keep the people we wanted to keep. In the one other case we were ok to lose that one person so didn't bother matching and simply said good luck.

Our "in sequence' pay bumps are usually ok, and market driven, 2-6% increase annually is the norm. Out of sequence is usually driven by a midterm promotion (rare) or competitive offer to lure you away when we want to keep you.

My advice to OP... be willing to take some calls for other jobs, even if you don't want to go, just to let your company know you're desired.
SouthernFIRE
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by SouthernFIRE »

As a W-2 employee, don't recall ever receiving pay bumps or bonuses outside of annual review process. As partner in small firm paid on K-1, bumps come from distributions of profits during good times as opposed to raise in base pay. These are fairly lumpy but can make up substantial chunk of overall comp.
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by marcopolo »

There are probably as many answers to this as there are employers.

I received numerous of them because I made sure to ask for them. Usually in the form of a promotion. I found that I could get much more total comp increase by separating the bump due to promotion from annual review based raises.
Otherwise it is kind of like the person whose birthday falls on Christmas.
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wandering_aimlessly
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by wandering_aimlessly »

Over the last 25 or so years (3 employers) these happened under two distinct circumstances:

Promotion - Generally smaller if promoted within the same company - they have guidelines that have to be followed. Bigger bumps if promoted between companies. Keep in mind the bump may be in base salary, annual bonus, long term performance (stock derived), or even benefits (I viewed my ability to start deferring salary as a significant pay raise - of course this depends on tax rates and my company staying solvent over the next few years).

Special Projects - these tended to be more one timers. For instance taking a lateral job with 50-75% travel for a little over a year gave me a one time $20k bump.

I am now at the point I will trade pay bumps for less stress - so priorities change...
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by Nicolas »

Never happened to me in 38 years working at MegaCorp.
HornedToad
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by HornedToad »

Every 3-4 years but will slow after next promotion as not much upward mobility after that.

I'm 40s I've been told it's really only job changes as the career trajectory of early career growth flattens. That's why don't buy a house in mid 30s assuming same 2-5x+ salary growth as might have happened in the 10 years since college
boston10
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by boston10 »

FootballFan5548 wrote: Wed Sep 04, 2019 2:22 pmMy advice to OP... be willing to take some calls for other jobs, even if you don't want to go, just to let your company know you're desired.
This is the best advice in this thread. To break it down:
  1. Your employer is there to make money in their field of business
  2. Giving you more money means they make less.
  3. The only reason they will do it is if it's going to hurt them.
  4. The only way it's going to hurt them is if:
    1. Replacing you would cost more than the raise you want, AND
    2. They actually believe you're ready, willing, and able to leave.
You absolutely can get out-of-band raises at the right company, and they can be substantial. But only if you're paid under market, or if you're delivering an enormous amount of value to your employer that a new hire off the street is unlikely to, and you're damn good at making sure the right people in the company are aware of that fact.
oldlongbeard
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by oldlongbeard »

Never. But, my pay is ok, and bonuses help. Hopefully those keep coming. Job security is worth a lot as well. $ isn't everything, although it beats whatever is in second place by a country mile.
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by Bacchus01 »

Our company does mid-year increases for high performers who are low in the pay range. There are also plans you can out people on to give them smaller raises but every six months. I’ve had a couple of these.

I got a promotion last November, a promotion in April, and another mid-year increase in August. 22% in just one year.

Since I joined the professional workforce in 1998, my base pay has increased 13.5% CAGR including lots of promotions.
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by EdNorton »

I worked for a Big 4 accounting firm, the only out of sequence raise I got was when they found out I interviewed with another firm. They asked what would it take to keep me happy, I said how about a 20% raise, they said okay but don't tell anyone. :sharebeer
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by HawkeyePierce »

A number of times at my current employer (big tech co). We went through some bad years where the company was hemorrhaging employees and they started just throwing bonuses and pay raises at anyone who stuck around. There wasn’t any system in place, you’d just suddenly be pulled aside and told you get getting more money.

One time my manager didn’t even know. I got an email saying I’d received a new RSU award that she didn’t know I was getting. Things were a bit hectic back then.

Today there’s a system in place but it’s still worked out. My last raise was in-sequence and before that was a COLA adjustment to bring our office in line with HQ (many of us got 15-20% salary bumps off that one).
MikeZ
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by MikeZ »

I have gotten two out of cycle bumps:

25% and 17%

Both times it was by changing employers.
tim1999
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by tim1999 »

Never, at the megacorps I've worked for. You either get a small annual increase early in the year as part of the annual review process at the same time everyone else gets it, or you get promoted. Even if my current supervisor wanted to give me a raise at a random time in the year, there isn't a process/mechanism in the HR bureaucracy for him to do so.

Nobody I've known who threatened to leave or resigned, whether for real or just a bluff, ever got a counter-offer/raise to stay.
Aku09
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by Aku09 »

Been in my first “real job” since grad school a little over 3 years. Actually took a pay cut about 1.5 years ago as they restructured our package (increased our salary and decreased benefits) with a net loss of several thousand dollars. Have lost several employees this year with not a lot of interest in their positions. Ended up getting a raise to make our package more competitive. Was about 16% raise in base salary which was nice. Hopefully we can get some new employees now (I’m salary and there is the same amount of work to get done, just less bodies to do it).

I doubt I’ll get much in the way of raises beyond this point. We have gotten a small Christmas bonus in 2/3 past years in good financial years. I’m pretty close to the top of my pay range unless I’m willing to go to a very rural area or work 80 hours a week.
LittleMaggieMae
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by LittleMaggieMae »

The only time I've gotten big changes in pay was when I changed jobs OR when I had a promotion (ie changed pay grades/levels) with a current employer. A promotion always involved different responsibilities and often more challenging work.

The only exception to this was with my current employer (I've been with them 20 years). Last year my employer reviewed pay scales/job titles/responsibilities in order to match current norms. I did receive a 6k increase in pay - and a new streamlined title. :)

I've never heard of employers just handing out random large increases in pay. I do know employers hand out bonuses sometimes large ones. But they don't effect one's salary or hourly rate.
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by an_asker »

Jack FFR1846 wrote: Wed Sep 04, 2019 1:53 pm
mak1277 wrote: Wed Sep 04, 2019 12:53 pm
Jack FFR1846 wrote: Wed Sep 04, 2019 12:15 pm Annual raise? That's a good one. Very baby boomer centric and from what I hear, common in the 60's.

No, Megacorp has annual excuses. Wage freeze (for random reason), stagnant business cancels all raises, executives did something extra stupid, so we get to share the pain. I do remember 2 years ago being pulled aside and told I was one of 2 in our office of 50 getting 3%. The other 48....zero, as usual. Previous job went 10 years with no reviews and no raises. But that was privately owned, so they didn't even bother with excuses. If I married one of the many nieces of the CEO, I'd have received a huge raise.
Why would you work at a place for 10 years without getting a raise? That's crazy.

I've received a raise for 19 out of the last 20 years.
I was only there 4 years. But when they announced that they were doing reviews and raises, lots of old timers there were talking about the last time it was done, 10 years earlier. I stayed because I was bound by a non-compete agreement (which I would NEVER sign again), so could not take a job with anyone with similar products. They did send lawyers after every single person who dared take a new job with anyone who might compete.....and the company hiring. They also did fun things during the reviews like demoting people who were not limited by being at the top of their range....so they were then unable to get a raise because with their new job title and pay range, they had topped out.
Gosh! And I thought I had it bad.

One thing I've learned after being in the rat race for over two decades - meritocracy is definitely way over-rated. Maybe it works at <your pet company>, but the ones I've worked at - it's been more about whether the boss likes you and has lunch with you or not. At a privately owned firm I worked for has not just kept pace with other (public or not) firms in the same space, but has arguably gone further ahead. Guess where all the profits go? No, not to the worker employees, but to the ones who married the many sons, daughters, nephews and nieces of the owner (and those of his minions). All of them are in plum positions. "Nepotism beats meritocracy any day" is my new mantra!
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by an_asker »

LittleMaggieMae wrote: Wed Sep 04, 2019 11:22 pm [...]I've never heard of employers just handing out random large increases in pay.[...]
Happens in some firms in the Bay Area for sure. A few years ago, Google made headlines with a 10% pay increase top to bottom.

But what I've also heard is that one needs to toe the official line sometimes in those firms. I've heard that not doing so is treated as not really a good quality.
MathWizard
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by MathWizard »

Never.

Only for a promotion.

I've never been able to do that for my direct reports either.

It's just not done where I work.
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by yangtui »

I received two 10% out-of-sequence pay bumps over a two year period. Once I stop growing professionally and the increases in pay slow down it is time to start looking for a new job. I did that and got a 27% pay increase with more exciting job responsibilities. Probably in another two to five years I will be forced to start looking again.
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by yangtui »

an_asker wrote: Wed Sep 04, 2019 11:29 pm Gosh! And I thought I had it bad.

One thing I've learned after being in the rat race for over two decades - meritocracy is definitely way over-rated. Maybe it works at <your pet company>, but the ones I've worked at - it's been more about whether the boss likes you and has lunch with you or not. At a privately owned firm I worked for has not just kept pace with other (public or not) firms in the same space, but has arguably gone further ahead. Guess where all the profits go? No, not to the worker employees, but to the ones who married the many sons, daughters, nephews and nieces of the owner (and those of his minions). All of them are in plum positions. "Nepotism beats meritocracy any day" is my new mantra!
I have found that once you hit a certain baseline level of performance any additional effort is a waste of time. You are better off networking with the right people and making sure they like you. At the end of the day, perception seems to be all that really matters. You might be technically better and faster than a co-worker but if they appear to be more loyal and mesh better with the powers that be you are probably going to get passed over.
boston10
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by boston10 »

yangtui wrote: Thu Sep 05, 2019 1:13 amI have found that once you hit a certain baseline level of performance any additional effort is a waste of time. You are better off networking with the right people and making sure they like you. At the end of the day, perception seems to be all that really matters. You might be technically better and faster than a co-worker but if they appear to be more loyal and mesh better with the powers that be you are probably going to get passed over.
Have you considered that your definition of "performance" is too limited? Often times the most difficult thing in an organization is keeping everyone swimming in the same direction. This requires you to maintain good relationships with coworkers, always stay in sync with your managers and understand the overall direction of the organization (and adapt to new directions as circumstances change), continually recommend and implement changes to the way things are done, make sure the people that matter are aware of your accomplishments, etc.

All of this requires a high degree of skill, effort, and conscientiousness in interpersonal relationships within your company and industry. It also requires you to constantly hone your communication skills to make sure you know what you want to say, that you're saying precisely what you mean, that the right people are understanding your words at the same level of precision as you're saying them, and that the people hearing them are acting on them appropriately.

This is a lot more complicated and difficult than, and at least equally as important as, technical performance and efficiency. And it's actually much more important than those things if you're looking to rise in an organization, manage people, and make strategic decisions.

My last raise was 37%, and if I had to estimate, I'd say just 15-20% of it was due to technical skill and efficiency.
tea_pirate
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by tea_pirate »

mak1277 wrote: Wed Sep 04, 2019 12:53 pm
Jack FFR1846 wrote: Wed Sep 04, 2019 12:15 pm Annual raise? That's a good one. Very baby boomer centric and from what I hear, common in the 60's.

No, Megacorp has annual excuses. Wage freeze (for random reason), stagnant business cancels all raises, executives did something extra stupid, so we get to share the pain. I do remember 2 years ago being pulled aside and told I was one of 2 in our office of 50 getting 3%. The other 48....zero, as usual. Previous job went 10 years with no reviews and no raises. But that was privately owned, so they didn't even bother with excuses. If I married one of the many nieces of the CEO, I'd have received a huge raise.
Why would you work at a place for 10 years without getting a raise? That's crazy.

I've received a raise for 19 out of the last 20 years.
Imagine being this disconnected from how the majority of the population lives.
Last edited by tea_pirate on Thu Sep 05, 2019 7:16 am, edited 1 time in total.
Bacchus01
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by Bacchus01 »

yangtui wrote: Thu Sep 05, 2019 1:13 am
an_asker wrote: Wed Sep 04, 2019 11:29 pm Gosh! And I thought I had it bad.

One thing I've learned after being in the rat race for over two decades - meritocracy is definitely way over-rated. Maybe it works at <your pet company>, but the ones I've worked at - it's been more about whether the boss likes you and has lunch with you or not. At a privately owned firm I worked for has not just kept pace with other (public or not) firms in the same space, but has arguably gone further ahead. Guess where all the profits go? No, not to the worker employees, but to the ones who married the many sons, daughters, nephews and nieces of the owner (and those of his minions). All of them are in plum positions. "Nepotism beats meritocracy any day" is my new mantra!
I have found that once you hit a certain baseline level of performance any additional effort is a waste of time. You are better off networking with the right people and making sure they like you. At the end of the day, perception seems to be all that really matters. You might be technically better and faster than a co-worker but if they appear to be more loyal and mesh better with the powers that be you are probably going to get passed over.
Ability to work with, support, mentor and lead others is a far more important aspect of performance the higher you go. Being the fastest widget is not all that impressive if you can’t help the other widgets be more productive. What you describe is the typical reason that great individual contributors often fail as leaders.
Bacchus01
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by Bacchus01 »

tea_pirate wrote: Thu Sep 05, 2019 7:15 am
mak1277 wrote: Wed Sep 04, 2019 12:53 pm
Jack FFR1846 wrote: Wed Sep 04, 2019 12:15 pm Annual raise? That's a good one. Very baby boomer centric and from what I hear, common in the 60's.

No, Megacorp has annual excuses. Wage freeze (for random reason), stagnant business cancels all raises, executives did something extra stupid, so we get to share the pain. I do remember 2 years ago being pulled aside and told I was one of 2 in our office of 50 getting 3%. The other 48....zero, as usual. Previous job went 10 years with no reviews and no raises. But that was privately owned, so they didn't even bother with excuses. If I married one of the many nieces of the CEO, I'd have received a huge raise.
Why would you work at a place for 10 years without getting a raise? That's crazy.

I've received a raise for 19 out of the last 20 years.
Imagine being this disconnected from how the majority of the population lives? :confused
Which one do you believe to be disconnected?
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TomatoTomahto
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by TomatoTomahto »

HawkeyePierce wrote: Wed Sep 04, 2019 7:44 pm A number of times at my current employer (big tech co). We went through some bad years where the company was hemorrhaging employees and they started just throwing bonuses and pay raises at anyone who stuck around. There wasn’t any system in place, you’d just suddenly be pulled aside and told you get getting more money.

One time my manager didn’t even know. I got an email saying I’d received a new RSU award that she didn’t know I was getting. Things were a bit hectic back then.
Years ago, my boss’s admin (yeah, long enough ago that people still had admins) told me sternly that Boss wanted to see me at 2:00 PM. It was an informal office, and such a formal meeting was atypical, so I spent the day wondering if I was getting fired. I sat down at 2:00 and Boss explained that I was being granted a bunch of out-of-cycle RSUs for my contribution to a successful project. Phew! :D
Okay, I get it; I won't be political or controversial. The Earth is flat.
finsterfolly
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by finsterfolly »

boston10 wrote: Thu Sep 05, 2019 5:56 am Have you considered that your definition of "performance" is too limited? Often times the most difficult thing in an organization is keeping everyone swimming in the same direction. This requires you to maintain good relationships with coworkers, always stay in sync with your managers and understand the overall direction of the organization (and adapt to new directions as circumstances change), continually recommend and implement changes to the way things are done, make sure the people that matter are aware of your accomplishments, etc.

All of this requires a high degree of skill, effort, and conscientiousness in interpersonal relationships within your company and industry. It also requires you to constantly hone your communication skills to make sure you know what you want to say, that you're saying precisely what you mean, that the right people are understanding your words at the same level of precision as you're saying them, and that the people hearing them are acting on them appropriately.

This is a lot more complicated and difficult than, and at least equally as important as, technical performance and efficiency. And it's actually much more important than those things if you're looking to rise in an organization, manage people, and make strategic decisions.

My last raise was 37%, and if I had to estimate, I'd say just 15-20% of it was due to technical skill and efficiency.
I had an employee that was very competitive with another employee that I brought on at about the same time. This employee was a hard worker and super productive. She thought she was the only one that "sees through" the other employee as a fake. While the other employee was not as efficient as her in production, he is a self directed self-starter and problem solver that is willing to travel anywhere that we need him to be. They were both great employees for me, but in different capacities. They just didn't always see the value in each other.

To this day, she thinks the other co-worker has me in a long con. She eventually left because she felt under-appreciated, and hasn't found a good fit since. He has been promoted to a higher position in the company.

To answer the OP question, I have had two small-mid year bumps and one big role reclassification over 30 years. Outside of that, I had to change jobs to get any significant bump, as yearly increases have probably averaged around 2.5%. I am using the SSA income numbers to refresh my memory. These are slightly skewed as some of the movements happened mid year.

Job Moves: 54% (27), 41% (30), 5% (33), 17% (40)
Role Reclassification: 30% (50)
Mid-Year Bumps: 5% (35), 10% (37)

Note the for the 41% at 30 I was working crazy overtime, so the actual hourly increase was not as significant. Conversely, the 5% at 33 was moving to a salary job with less hours, so it was a bigger increase per hour.
stoptothink
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by stoptothink »

tim1999 wrote: Wed Sep 04, 2019 8:40 pm
Nobody I've known who threatened to leave or resigned, whether for real or just a bluff, ever got a counter-offer/raise to stay.
As a hiring director, I've tried 3 times to get rock star employees who had offers a raise: no dice. There literally is no mechanism to give mid-year raises without a promotion and it is greatly recommended that promotions coincide with the end of the year. Same deal at my wife's employer, she's tried to play the offer game three times last year. Her boss promised her raises each time and each time they never materialized so she stopped playing the game. She's worth way more, and has been offered significantly more, but her boss knows that nowhere else is likely to be so easy-going that she can literally do school work half the day (she's also a full-time student) and still almost double the production of her next best colleague. The day she graduates she is gone, and her boss is well aware.
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yangtui
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by yangtui »

boston10 wrote: Thu Sep 05, 2019 5:56 am
yangtui wrote: Thu Sep 05, 2019 1:13 amI have found that once you hit a certain baseline level of performance any additional effort is a waste of time. You are better off networking with the right people and making sure they like you. At the end of the day, perception seems to be all that really matters. You might be technically better and faster than a co-worker but if they appear to be more loyal and mesh better with the powers that be you are probably going to get passed over.
Have you considered that your definition of "performance" is too limited? Often times the most difficult thing in an organization is keeping everyone swimming in the same direction. This requires you to maintain good relationships with coworkers, always stay in sync with your managers and understand the overall direction of the organization (and adapt to new directions as circumstances change), continually recommend and implement changes to the way things are done, make sure the people that matter are aware of your accomplishments, etc.

All of this requires a high degree of skill, effort, and conscientiousness in interpersonal relationships within your company and industry. It also requires you to constantly hone your communication skills to make sure you know what you want to say, that you're saying precisely what you mean, that the right people are understanding your words at the same level of precision as you're saying them, and that the people hearing them are acting on them appropriately.

This is a lot more complicated and difficult than, and at least equally as important as, technical performance and efficiency. And it's actually much more important than those things if you're looking to rise in an organization, manage people, and make strategic decisions.

My last raise was 37%, and if I had to estimate, I'd say just 15-20% of it was due to technical skill and efficiency.
I agree with this.
Hockey10
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Re: How often do you receive out-of-sequence pay bumps?

Post by Hockey10 »

Twice I received an out of sequence pay bump, and once I received a retention bonus equal to 25% of my salary.

In all cases the economy was strong and it was a difficult time to find new (good) employees. The retention bonus was driven by a direct competitor opening up an office about a mile away. They stole quite a few of my colleagues from Megacorp in a short period of time. The group I worked in had 8 employees. In one week, 2 of the 8 left. Of the remaining 6, I think at least 4 of us were being actively recruited.

My boss called me into his office and said it that today was Christmas in July. He told me that if I signed the paper in front of him, that I would get a 25% bonus one year from today. :moneybag :D
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