Refinance Mega Thread

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Calirefi2020
Posts: 34
Joined: Sat Sep 05, 2020 11:55 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Calirefi2020 »

I’m currently refi process with LF.. locked rate on 9/17.. conditionally approved on 10/17.. any idea how much longer it would be to close the loan per current situation? Thanks
HowDoesThisWork
Posts: 5
Joined: Mon Aug 31, 2020 6:42 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by HowDoesThisWork »

Are either of these options good? I'm trying to look into a refi, 1 year into a 30 year at 3.875% with a $285k balance with estimated value being $395k+. I have a credit score of 740 and I'm in MN and a lot of these loan companies aren't an option and not seeing $0 cost options from LenderFi or such. Could it be that I just don't have high enough score or just lower loan amount?

Loan Option 1:
30 Year Fixed
2.75%
Closing Costs:
Lender Fees: $350
Appraisal: $495
Closing: $2010
Lender Credit: ($145)
Total: $2215

Loan Option 2:
30 Year Fixed
2.625%
Closing Costs:
Lender Fees: $350
Appraisal: $495
Closing: $2010
Lender Credit: $500
Total: $2860
exigent
Posts: 981
Joined: Fri May 07, 2010 8:49 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by exigent »

HowDoesThisWork wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 6:41 pm Are either of these options good? I'm trying to look into a refi, 1 year into a 30 year at 3.875% with a $285k balance with estimated value being $395k+. I have a credit score of 740 and I'm in MN and a lot of these loan companies aren't an option and not seeing $0 cost options from LenderFi or such. Could it be that I just don't have high enough score or just lower loan amount?

Loan Option 1:
30 Year Fixed
2.75%
Closing Costs:
Lender Fees: $350
Appraisal: $495
Closing: $2010
Lender Credit: ($145)
Total: $2215

Loan Option 2:
30 Year Fixed
2.625%
Closing Costs:
Lender Fees: $350
Appraisal: $495
Closing: $2010
Lender Credit: $500
Total: $2860
We are in a remarkably similar situation (but not in MN). Currently in a 30 yr at 3.875% with a balance of ca. $370k. Just locked with Better Mortgage (better.com) at 2.625% with close to no closing costs (~$40 after they waived the appraisal, and no escrow requirement) thanks to the lender credits. We will be around 60% LTV.

We got an initial loan estimate from LenderFi and then shopped it to Better. Probably could have done marginally better by shopping around more, but this is what I had the time/patience for and it’s a huge savings in return for shuffling some paperwork, so it’s all good.
tj
Posts: 3721
Joined: Thu Dec 24, 2009 12:10 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by tj »

exigent wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 7:43 pm
HowDoesThisWork wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 6:41 pm Are either of these options good? I'm trying to look into a refi, 1 year into a 30 year at 3.875% with a $285k balance with estimated value being $395k+. I have a credit score of 740 and I'm in MN and a lot of these loan companies aren't an option and not seeing $0 cost options from LenderFi or such. Could it be that I just don't have high enough score or just lower loan amount?

Loan Option 1:
30 Year Fixed
2.75%
Closing Costs:
Lender Fees: $350
Appraisal: $495
Closing: $2010
Lender Credit: ($145)
Total: $2215

Loan Option 2:
30 Year Fixed
2.625%
Closing Costs:
Lender Fees: $350
Appraisal: $495
Closing: $2010
Lender Credit: $500
Total: $2860
We are in a remarkably similar situation (but not in MN). Currently in a 30 yr at 3.875% with a balance of ca. $370k. Just locked with Better Mortgage (better.com) at 2.625% with close to no closing costs (~$40 after they waived the appraisal, and no escrow requirement) thanks to the lender credits. We will be around 60% LTV.

We got an initial loan estimate from LenderFi and then shopped it to Better. Probably could have done marginally better by shopping around more, but this is what I had the time/patience for and it’s a huge savings in return for shuffling some paperwork, so it’s all good.
Does LenderFI also do a soft pull to generate a loan estimate?
nickpete123
Posts: 8
Joined: Mon Oct 09, 2017 7:19 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by nickpete123 »

HowDoesThisWork wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 6:41 pm Are either of these options good? I'm trying to look into a refi, 1 year into a 30 year at 3.875% with a $285k balance with estimated value being $395k+. I have a credit score of 740 and I'm in MN and a lot of these loan companies aren't an option and not seeing $0 cost options from LenderFi or such. Could it be that I just don't have high enough score or just lower loan amount?

Loan Option 1:
30 Year Fixed
2.75%
Closing Costs:
Lender Fees: $350
Appraisal: $495
Closing: $2010
Lender Credit: ($145)
Total: $2215

Loan Option 2:
30 Year Fixed
2.625%
Closing Costs:
Lender Fees: $350
Appraisal: $495
Closing: $2010
Lender Credit: $500
Total: $2860
I'm in Minnesota as with 261k balance (value 360k) 750 credit score and locked a month ago for a 3% with network capital to cover all closing costs plus 1k of escrow. They've been slower than what they first mentioned but so far no other issues.
HowDoesThisWork
Posts: 5
Joined: Mon Aug 31, 2020 6:42 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by HowDoesThisWork »

exigent wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 7:43 pm
HowDoesThisWork wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 6:41 pm Are either of these options good? I'm trying to look into a refi, 1 year into a 30 year at 3.875% with a $285k balance with estimated value being $395k+. I have a credit score of 740 and I'm in MN and a lot of these loan companies aren't an option and not seeing $0 cost options from LenderFi or such. Could it be that I just don't have high enough score or just lower loan amount?

Loan Option 1:
30 Year Fixed
2.75%
Closing Costs:
Lender Fees: $350
Appraisal: $495
Closing: $2010
Lender Credit: ($145)
Total: $2215

Loan Option 2:
30 Year Fixed
2.625%
Closing Costs:
Lender Fees: $350
Appraisal: $495
Closing: $2010
Lender Credit: $500
Total: $2860
We are in a remarkably similar situation (but not in MN). Currently in a 30 yr at 3.875% with a balance of ca. $370k. Just locked with Better Mortgage (better.com) at 2.625% with close to no closing costs (~$40 after they waived the appraisal, and no escrow requirement) thanks to the lender credits. We will be around 60% LTV.

We got an initial loan estimate from LenderFi and then shopped it to Better. Probably could have done marginally better by shopping around more, but this is what I had the time/patience for and it’s a huge savings in return for shuffling some paperwork, so it’s all good.
Ah unfortunately Better (along with others like Loan Cabin) are not available in MN. Did you do a full application with LenderFi to get the LE or just their initial check?
HowDoesThisWork
Posts: 5
Joined: Mon Aug 31, 2020 6:42 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by HowDoesThisWork »

nickpete123 wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 8:13 pm
HowDoesThisWork wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 6:41 pm Are either of these options good? I'm trying to look into a refi, 1 year into a 30 year at 3.875% with a $285k balance with estimated value being $395k+. I have a credit score of 740 and I'm in MN and a lot of these loan companies aren't an option and not seeing $0 cost options from LenderFi or such. Could it be that I just don't have high enough score or just lower loan amount?

Loan Option 1:
30 Year Fixed
2.75%
Closing Costs:
Lender Fees: $350
Appraisal: $495
Closing: $2010
Lender Credit: ($145)
Total: $2215

Loan Option 2:
30 Year Fixed
2.625%
Closing Costs:
Lender Fees: $350
Appraisal: $495
Closing: $2010
Lender Credit: $500
Total: $2860
I'm in Minnesota as with 261k balance (value 360k) 750 credit score and locked a month ago for a 3% with network capital to cover all closing costs plus 1k of escrow. They've been slower than what they first mentioned but so far no other issues.
Thanks I will look into this and see what I can get from them.
youknowjack
Posts: 1
Joined: Sun Oct 18, 2020 9:07 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by youknowjack »

I locked in a loan on a 15 yr fixed conforming loan ($741,500) in Seattle on 10/15. Rate: 2.25%, with a $1500 net credit (D+E-credits).

This was after three rounds of counters between Better and LoanDepot. Both were still playing ball, but I cut it short and locked with Better, because the countering was moving slowly.

Lenders I talked to:
Better: initial offer not great, but beat every estimate I showed them. I locked because their tech seems better than the competitors, and the folks I spoke with were reasonable and efficient
Loan Depot: initial offer was very good, and they beat every other estimate I showed them
Bank of America: not even close, they told me to take the other deal. Also, talking to these people on the phone was a surreal Kafkaesque experience
Union Bank: my current lender, actually I never spoke to them, they had such long waits on all their lines
LenderFi: best offer was 2.25% at net $0 to close
AmeriSave: they didn't respond to my application online
Reali: Initial estimate was not competitive. After a weird discussion with one of their agents, I didn't solicit any counters
Quicken: good customer service, but didn't match or beat the estimates I showed them
exigent
Posts: 981
Joined: Fri May 07, 2010 8:49 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by exigent »

HowDoesThisWork wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 9:29 pm Ah unfortunately Better (along with others like Loan Cabin) are not available in MN. Did you do a full application with LenderFi to get the LE or just their initial check?
They did an application w/credit check, though I would imagine that you could get an LE with a soft pull if you specified. I had intended to go with LenderFi, so I wasn’t too worried about that, but then decided to shop it around after the fact.
exigent
Posts: 981
Joined: Fri May 07, 2010 8:49 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by exigent »

tj wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 7:59 pm Does LenderFI also do a soft pull to generate a loan estimate?
In our case, they did. I’m not sure that was necessary and we probably could’ve avoided it, but my original intention was to use them so I wasn’t worried about it at that point. First conversation was with AmeriSave but that didn’t get to the point of an LE b/c the guy was a bit evasive about closing costs at various rates and he was a bit pushy about getting to yes on the initial call-back. I wasn’t feeling it, so I excused myself from the call and checked in with LenderFi.

Actually, the main reason I looked elsewhere after getting the LE from LenderFi was because the guy I wound up dealing with on the phone didn’t seem particularly well-informed and he was having trouble on the back end modifying the estimate when I reminded him that we didn’t want to do escrow. He wound up having to get off the phone with me to fix it with a promise to call back...

Long story short, I took that break as an opportunity to dig for other options, got an LE from Better and then shared the LenderFi LE with them (which was better than Better’s initial estimate). It was late in the day, so they weren’t able to generate a counteroffer until the next morning but when they did, they had beat LenderFi pretty easily. Meanwhile, LenderFi never called back... Weird, but whatever.

I could’ve shopped the Better estimate back to LenderFi but it felt like splitting hairs at that point and I was much happier with the experience at Better so we stuck with them.
evoila
Posts: 15
Joined: Fri Jan 20, 2017 2:31 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by evoila »

Taking a little different road here. Doing a floating rate mortgage. 1.375%, index is 1-month LIBOR. First 10 years is interest only as well.
mervinj7
Posts: 1566
Joined: Thu Mar 27, 2014 3:10 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by mervinj7 »

evoila wrote: Mon Oct 19, 2020 9:29 am Taking a little different road here. Doing a floating rate mortgage. 1.375%, index is 1-month LIBOR. First 10 years is interest only as well.
Does the rate reset every month?
tj
Posts: 3721
Joined: Thu Dec 24, 2009 12:10 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by tj »

exigent wrote: Mon Oct 19, 2020 9:09 am
tj wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 7:59 pm Does LenderFI also do a soft pull to generate a loan estimate?
In our case, they did. I’m not sure that was necessary and we probably could’ve avoided it, but my original intention was to use them so I wasn’t worried about it at that point. First conversation was with AmeriSave but that didn’t get to the point of an LE b/c the guy was a bit evasive about closing costs at various rates and he was a bit pushy about getting to yes on the initial call-back. I wasn’t feeling it, so I excused myself from the call and checked in with LenderFi.

Actually, the main reason I looked elsewhere after getting the LE from LenderFi was because the guy I wound up dealing with on the phone didn’t seem particularly well-informed and he was having trouble on the back end modifying the estimate when I reminded him that we didn’t want to do escrow. He wound up having to get off the phone with me to fix it with a promise to call back...

Long story short, I took that break as an opportunity to dig for other options, got an LE from Better and then shared the LenderFi LE with them (which was better than Better’s initial estimate). It was late in the day, so they weren’t able to generate a counteroffer until the next morning but when they did, they had beat LenderFi pretty easily. Meanwhile, LenderFi never called back... Weird, but whatever.

I could’ve shopped the Better estimate back to LenderFi but it felt like splitting hairs at that point and I was much happier with the experience at Better so we stuck with them.
So, you had to talk to someone at LenderFI to get an LE? It's not all automated like Better?
vgc303
Posts: 11
Joined: Mon Sep 21, 2020 1:06 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by vgc303 »

Just closed with Better last week, figured I'd post a data point for reference:

Rate locked date: 10/2
State: Colorado
Loan amount: $350k
Term: 30 year
Rate: 2.75%
A: $151
B: $64 (waived appraisal)
C: $1,500
E: $133
Lender Credits: $0

I didn't do much shopping around or negotiating, so it's likely that this price could be beat with more effort.
turktucker
Posts: 2
Joined: Mon Oct 19, 2020 11:25 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by turktucker »

Hello All. I hope to close a cash-out refinance with Loan Depot next month. I already have plans to refinance for a lower rate/longer term after the cash-out loan closes. Any concrete evidence as to how long I have to wait after the cash-out to refinance to do a no-cash-out refi? :confused
GoodOmens
Posts: 27
Joined: Thu Aug 06, 2020 12:54 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by GoodOmens »

So my refinance lender delayed funding post-closing due to the funder wanting to know if a month old credit pull was me rate shopping (which it was) or something else (which it wasn't). Fair question but unsure why it came up after I closed.

Anyone ever get in that situation? Now my payoff amount will be higher to my original lender than what I paid in closing and I assume my original loan date for the prepaid interest portion will remain unchanged. Seems kinda unfair for something that would have been found had they re-pulled my credit before closing and asked...
wfrobinette
Posts: 1414
Joined: Fri Feb 20, 2015 3:14 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by wfrobinette »

Locked 10/11
State: NC
Loan: 400k
LTV 75%
Rate 2.625 (old rate 3%)
Lender: Sebonic Financial/Cardinal
Costs: $1236 (No appraisal)

Transferring escrow to new loan.
DeaconSig
Posts: 14
Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2014 10:17 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by DeaconSig »

DeaconSig wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 8:20 am Is it normal for pre-paid escrow to increase dramatically from original LE to Pre-Closing Disclosure, particularly on taxes? State: NC, 15% fixed from LenderFi if it matters.

Original section G:
Homeowners $113 x 5 months = $565
Property $326 x 4 months = $1304
Total:$1869

Updated:
Homeowners $113.42 x 7 months = $794
Property $324.82 x 12 months = $3898
Aggregate Adjustment ($794)
Total: $3898

My property taxes are paid in August, so the updated schedule creates a cushion of 9 months. I realize these are pre-paids, however I'm still tying up my cash, with an opportunity cost that partially offsets interest saved in my mind. I've asked my loan processor why they need a cushion this big. I also asked if it's too late to not do escrow, but I suspect that's a no-go.

Thanks in advance for any tips!
Answer: loan processor had wrong date for when taxes are due. Check your LE closely and understand as much as possible. Glad I asked her questions and am not overfunding escrow!
Learningandliving
Posts: 13
Joined: Tue May 29, 2018 10:19 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Learningandliving »

Loan Depot process was super easy- highly recommend the guy I worked with. DM if interested.

Whole process was through disclosure was 20 minutes

California Primary Resident
30 Year Fixed
2.625%
Zero Costs
yogesh
Posts: 504
Joined: Thu Oct 11, 2012 6:20 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by yogesh »

I had received quotes from LenderFi, Better and LoanDepot. Surprisingly LenderFi had waived appraisal however the other two couldn't. How could that be the case?
Emergency: FDIC | Taxable: VTMFX | Retirement: TR2040
User avatar
BrandonBogle
Posts: 3327
Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2013 11:19 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by BrandonBogle »

yogesh wrote: Mon Oct 19, 2020 9:53 pm I had received quotes from LenderFi, Better and LoanDepot. Surprisingly LenderFi had waived appraisal however the other two couldn't. How could that be the case?
Better and LoanDepot ran the desktop appraisal through Fannie Mae or Freddie Mac and LenderFi used the other one, or, you didn’t get far enough along with Better and LoanDepot to do the waiver.
grp2c
Posts: 136
Joined: Sat Mar 08, 2014 5:51 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by grp2c »

yogesh wrote: Mon Oct 19, 2020 9:53 pm I had received quotes from LenderFi, Better and LoanDepot. Surprisingly LenderFi had waived appraisal however the other two couldn't. How could that be the case?
Was the estimated home value the same for each lender? LC LO told me that if you input just less than 1 million for the estimated home value then the appraisal is likely to be waived. She was correct. Better did the same and appraisal was waived. Later, I got a quote from from IM and he had to input the correct home value as 1.3 million to get the best rates at 60% LTV and appraisal was not waived.
dstac
Posts: 85
Joined: Sun Jun 02, 2013 5:12 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by dstac »

turktucker wrote: Mon Oct 19, 2020 11:34 am Hello All. I hope to close a cash-out refinance with Loan Depot next month. I already have plans to refinance for a lower rate/longer term after the cash-out loan closes. Any concrete evidence as to how long I have to wait after the cash-out to refinance to do a no-cash-out refi? :confused
My understanding is that any refi w/in 6mos will be priced as a cash out regardless of whether you take more out or note.

So you can do one whenever, but if you want non-cash out rates, 6mos from close.
dstac
Posts: 85
Joined: Sun Jun 02, 2013 5:12 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by dstac »

Just a quick data point on Better AMEX promo for those still working under it. (& yes, this promo is gone. Search early-mid July if you want details)

Filled out AMEX task on 8/21
Closed on 9/5
AMEX credit posted on 9/29 (first day of new billing period)
CatHerder
Posts: 4
Joined: Thu Feb 14, 2019 7:58 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by CatHerder »

Update on my refi with IM. Applied 10/6, received LE on 10/7, the last day before the advertised rates went back up. 15-year fixed at 1.99%, no-cost refi, on a CA property around 58% LTV at $485k. Just scheduled closing on 10/24, which will be around 18 days elapsed time which seems pretty fast considering the high volumes, although we have a very simple financial situation and perfect credit. No appraisal required with these numbers. Refinancing from a 5-year old 30 year fixed @ 3.75%.

Looking forward to significantly reducing the total cost of the loan and paying down the balance faster, as this aligns better with my 10-year plan toward early retirement at age 55.
mceagle555
Posts: 31
Joined: Mon Aug 31, 2020 12:41 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by mceagle555 »

mceagle555 wrote: Tue Oct 13, 2020 4:57 pm Thanks to everyone's advice in this thread. Just locked with Better today. Details below if it helps everyone:

- 15yr Ref @ 2.125% (Could have gotten 2.0% with no lender credit)
- $460k Loan Amount
- Appraisal waived (57% LTV)
- Shopped for Title Services - $950 w/ Radian
- No escrow

Loan Costs (A+B+C+D+E-Lender Credit) = -$1200

Summary:

- Refinanced from 15-yr @ 2.375% to 15-yr @ 2.125%
- Pocketed $1,200
- Removed escrow allowing that money to grow interest for me
Update re: above refi from Better.com:

10/10: Application
10/10-12: Match competing rates
10/13: Rate Lock
10/13: All "tasks" completed
10/14: Title report ordered
10/19: Title report cleared

No word on final closing date yet, but I have checked my "task list" daily and never let a task sit for more than 12 hours.
InvestDoc
Posts: 43
Joined: Sat Jan 13, 2018 12:54 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by InvestDoc »

I’ve been following these threads daily but am wondering what lenders are offering the quickest closing these days? I’m currently 75 days into a mortgage refinance that is nowhere close to closing. At the time I locked, they were offering competitive rates (2.625% 30 year with ~3000 in fees on A+B+C). The lender said they were typically closing in 60-70 days and now I’ve been in underwriting for 2 weeks and they’re telling me to check back with them in another 2 weeks. There’s been little communication with them other than automated emails as I moved into processing and underwriting, and no requests for additional documents, so I think they are just extremely backlogged with the number of applications.

I know I should be near closing now that I’m finally in underwriting, but I wonder if I could get another lender to close sooner with competitive rates and less fees. I’ve been checking the LenderFi site and their rates have been rising but the fees for a 2.625 loan are about comparable to what I’m getting with my pending loan. Is it worth switching now that I’m in underwriting already? I’ve heard about people having a 2-3 month process or delays at Watermark and Loan Depot so I don’t want to get into this situation again. Are LenderFi and Better the quickest these days? I can’t refi with Owning again since I just did it about 4 months ago but they were super fast.
mceagle555
Posts: 31
Joined: Mon Aug 31, 2020 12:41 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by mceagle555 »

InvestDoc wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 2:42 pm I’ve been following these threads daily but am wondering what lenders are offering the quickest closing these days? I’m currently 75 days into a mortgage refinance that is nowhere close to closing. At the time I locked, they were offering competitive rates (2.625% 30 year with ~3000 in fees on A+B+C). The lender said they were typically closing in 60-70 days and now I’ve been in underwriting for 2 weeks and they’re telling me to check back with them in another 2 weeks. There’s been little communication with them other than automated emails as I moved into processing and underwriting, and no requests for additional documents, so I think they are just extremely backlogged with the number of applications.

I know I should be near closing now that I’m finally in underwriting, but I wonder if I could get another lender to close sooner with competitive rates and less fees. I’ve been checking the LenderFi site and their rates have been rising but the fees for a 2.625 loan are about comparable to what I’m getting with my pending loan. Is it worth switching now that I’m in underwriting already? I’ve heard about people having a 2-3 month process or delays at Watermark and Loan Depot so I don’t want to get into this situation again. Are LenderFi and Better the quickest these days? I can’t refi with Owning again since I just did it about 4 months ago but they were super fast.
My refi with Better.com went through underwriting in 3 days. See my timeline thus far in the post above yours.
presto987
Posts: 217
Joined: Sun Aug 30, 2020 10:58 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by presto987 »

InvestDoc wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 2:42 pm I’ve been following these threads daily but am wondering what lenders are offering the quickest closing these days? I’m currently 75 days into a mortgage refinance that is nowhere close to closing. At the time I locked, they were offering competitive rates (2.625% 30 year with ~3000 in fees on A+B+C). The lender said they were typically closing in 60-70 days and now I’ve been in underwriting for 2 weeks and they’re telling me to check back with them in another 2 weeks. There’s been little communication with them other than automated emails as I moved into processing and underwriting, and no requests for additional documents, so I think they are just extremely backlogged with the number of applications.

I know I should be near closing now that I’m finally in underwriting, but I wonder if I could get another lender to close sooner with competitive rates and less fees. I’ve been checking the LenderFi site and their rates have been rising but the fees for a 2.625 loan are about comparable to what I’m getting with my pending loan. Is it worth switching now that I’m in underwriting already? I’ve heard about people having a 2-3 month process or delays at Watermark and Loan Depot so I don’t want to get into this situation again. Are LenderFi and Better the quickest these days? I can’t refi with Owning again since I just did it about 4 months ago but they were super fast.
Interactive Mortgage: If you satisfy their criteria, they are advertising 2.5% no-cost 30-year. These are the conditions: at least $350,000 rate and term refinance loan on an owner-occupied single family residence in California. Minimum 740 FICO credit score, 60% loan to value with no subordinate debt.

LenderFi: In my experience (and from what I've read on here), their website rates are around 0.25% worse than what you would get offered once you apply. Based on what you're seeing on the site, you might be able to get 2.625% with enough lender credit to offset all the fees.

Better: Their initial rates are usually mediocre at best, but if you can get them to beat another LE, then they are great to work with.

Although there are exceptions, based on what I've read, all 3 of the above can reliably close in around 30 days (and sometimes less). If you can get a better deal with one of these, I would definitely jump ship. $3000 in A+B+C seems like a lot for CA when IM and LF are offering no-cost refis.
z0r
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Joined: Sat Nov 10, 2012 1:50 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by z0r »

any recommendations for a cash-out refinance on a small loan in oregon? current loan is 80k on 300k value and I want a new loan at 140k. better would do it but the fees were too high to make it worth it, and lenderfi isn't doing cash out right now and "not any time soon" (from an email from them)
presto987
Posts: 217
Joined: Sun Aug 30, 2020 10:58 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by presto987 »

z0r wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 4:20 pm any recommendations for a cash-out refinance on a small loan in oregon? current loan is 80k on 300k value and I want a new loan at 140k. better would do it but the fees were too high to make it worth it, and lenderfi isn't doing cash out right now and "not any time soon" (from an email from them)
You should probably talk to a local mortgage broker. Also see if you can find a local bank or credit union that has decent rates. Among the national lenders, maybe try LoanDepot (if you're willing to wait 2-3 months to close)?
invest4
Posts: 241
Joined: Wed Apr 24, 2019 2:19 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by invest4 »

mceagle555 wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 2:20 pm
mceagle555 wrote: Tue Oct 13, 2020 4:57 pm Thanks to everyone's advice in this thread. Just locked with Better today. Details below if it helps everyone:

- 15yr Ref @ 2.125% (Could have gotten 2.0% with no lender credit)
- $460k Loan Amount
- Appraisal waived (57% LTV)
- Shopped for Title Services - $950 w/ Radian
- No escrow

Loan Costs (A+B+C+D+E-Lender Credit) = -$1200

Summary:

- Refinanced from 15-yr @ 2.375% to 15-yr @ 2.125%
- Pocketed $1,200
- Removed escrow allowing that money to grow interest for me
Update re: above refi from Better.com:

10/10: Application
10/10-12: Match competing rates
10/13: Rate Lock
10/13: All "tasks" completed
10/14: Title report ordered
10/19: Title report cleared

No word on final closing date yet, but I have checked my "task list" daily and never let a task sit for more than 12 hours.
Will be closing with Better in a few days, and thought I would piggyback on mceagle555's post for an easier read in one place for those who are interested. I have to say I had a very positive experience with Better and would highly recommend. Both parties very responsive to each other to keep it all moving along at a good pace and online interface easy and fast to provide whatever documentation was requested, etc. Thanks so much to everyone here who provided their advice and support along the way!

- 30yr Ref @ 2.625%
- $370k Loan Amount
- Appraisal waived (74% LTV)
- Shopped for Title Services - $1036 w/ Radian
- No escrow

Loan Costs (A+B+C+D+E-Lender Credit) = -$1009

Summary:

- Refinanced from 30-yr @ 3.25% to 30-yr @ 2.625%
- Pocketed $1009
- No escrow

09/16: Application
09/17: Match competing rates
09/17: Rate Lock
unsure: All "tasks" completed - fast
unsure: Title report ordered - fast
10/19: Title report cleared - this took longer than they expected, but they let me know with several updates along the way
10/23: Final closing scheduled
ZMonet
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by ZMonet »

dfeucht wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 10:47 am
ZMonet wrote: Tue Oct 13, 2020 7:43 pm Anyone else having trouble closing with Watermark? I'm at almost 11 weeks since I initiated the loan (no cost, 2.25%, 15 years) and am way past the lock period. I've always gotten them any document they requested in less than 24 hours, and usually within a couple of hours. The loan is in the "closing" stage but I haven't been sent final documents or been given a hard date.

Anyone else with similar experience? I was given the hard sell, like others, that I shouldn't shop the loan and they were turning away people from Bogleheads/Slickdeals. I'm fine with that if it goes through, but this is the other side of why it is likely best to keep fighting for the best deal in terms of quote and time to closing.
I locked on 8/4 and closed 9/24 (51 days). There definitely was no proactive communication, but I emailed my loan officer every few days to make sure everything was moving and to make sure they had what they needed from me and they always quickly responded. HAd to upload documents a coule of different times through the process. We did have a closing snafu - had it scheduled for 9/22 and the notary didn't show up so I called the notary who was told closing was cancelled, despite the fact that I (and apparently my loan officer) was not told. They did quickly reschedule and we closed 9/24 and funded 9/29. Not the smoothest process and communication was not great, but it was by far the best rate I could find at that time in MN (2.25% 15 year, net cost of $280, no escrow).

I'd probably give them a C/incomplete - rate was great, had to do a lot of reaching out to make sure I felt things were actually moving. Closed and funded. Now just need to get set up with servicing (the incomplete part of my grade)

A lot of the other lenders that seem to drive rates down on this site (Better, Loan Cabin) don't operate in MN and LenderFi and Loan Depot weren't close to start and I admittedly wasn't someone who wanted to do the back and forth and the rate I had was pretty good by standards here, so I didn't work them.

It does seem we locked at a similar time, so not sure why you would be at 11 weeks while I closed a few weeks back. Has your loan officer given you any indication of what the issue is? I hope this finalizes for you soon.
I finally closed with Watermark. I will say the rate quoted (again, 2.25%, 15 years, a net return to me of $500 in fees -- i.e., no cost) was the rate I got but the rest of the process was a mess. Like others, I constantly was contacting my LO to try and move the loan along with no real movement. I think the total time was 13 weeks from application to closing. It took so long that I made two payments on my existing loan and despite that they never modified the payoff amount. They also didn't adjust prepaids for payments already made. The cost to me is I'm going to have to do a lot of tracking to make sure all the various funds make their way back to me. Communication was horrible and besides seeing the documents at the closing table, the last loan numbers I saw ere 7 weeks prior. This was despite repeatedly asking to see the documents before closing. When I said I needed to see them know the amount to bring to closing I was told that I could wire the money after the closing.

In short, I'd use them if I didn't have another choice but otherwise, I'd go with someone else.
yogesh
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by yogesh »

grp2c wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:19 am
yogesh wrote: Mon Oct 19, 2020 9:53 pm I had received quotes from LenderFi, Better and LoanDepot. Surprisingly LenderFi had waived appraisal however the other two couldn't. How could that be the case?
Was the estimated home value the same for each lender? LC LO told me that if you input just less than 1 million for the estimated home value then the appraisal is likely to be waived. She was correct. Better did the same and appraisal was waived. Later, I got a quote from from IM and he had to input the correct home value as 1.3 million to get the best rates at 60% LTV and appraisal was not waived.
In all 3 cases above $1m so not sure why one waived it.
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yogesh
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by yogesh »

BrandonBogle wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 12:42 am
yogesh wrote: Mon Oct 19, 2020 9:53 pm I had received quotes from LenderFi, Better and LoanDepot. Surprisingly LenderFi had waived appraisal however the other two couldn't. How could that be the case?
Better and LoanDepot ran the desktop appraisal through Fannie Mae or Freddie Mac and LenderFi used the other one, or, you didn’t get far enough along with Better and LoanDepot to do the waiver.
That's interesting; all went to providing LE with no lock on paper with only 1 waiving appraisal.
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BrandonBogle
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by BrandonBogle »

yogesh wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 9:03 pm
BrandonBogle wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 12:42 am
yogesh wrote: Mon Oct 19, 2020 9:53 pm I had received quotes from LenderFi, Better and LoanDepot. Surprisingly LenderFi had waived appraisal however the other two couldn't. How could that be the case?
Better and LoanDepot ran the desktop appraisal through Fannie Mae or Freddie Mac and LenderFi used the other one, or, you didn’t get far enough along with Better and LoanDepot to do the waiver.
That's interesting; all went to providing LE with no lock on paper with only 1 waiving appraisal.
You can get an LE and even lock before a lender processes the waiver. However, given what you have posted, on the back-end LenderFi artificially lowered your value amount to under $1MM (even $999,999 is fine). Otherwise, Fannie/Freddie require appraisals for properties valued over $1MM, even if you only are borrowing $100k. Stupid “checkbox rule”, but it’s one nonetheless.
yogesh
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by yogesh »

BrandonBogle wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 9:08 pm
yogesh wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 9:03 pm
BrandonBogle wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 12:42 am
yogesh wrote: Mon Oct 19, 2020 9:53 pm I had received quotes from LenderFi, Better and LoanDepot. Surprisingly LenderFi had waived appraisal however the other two couldn't. How could that be the case?
Better and LoanDepot ran the desktop appraisal through Fannie Mae or Freddie Mac and LenderFi used the other one, or, you didn’t get far enough along with Better and LoanDepot to do the waiver.
That's interesting; all went to providing LE with no lock on paper with only 1 waiving appraisal.
You can get an LE and even lock before a lender processes the waiver. However, given what you have posted, on the back-end LenderFi artificially lowered your value amount to under $1MM (even $999,999 is fine). Otherwise, Fannie/Freddie require appraisals for properties valued over $1MM, even if you only are borrowing $100k. Stupid “checkbox rule”, but it’s one nonetheless.
That's accurate; just verified the value on LE and it shows $1.5 for Better/LD and $999,999 for LF
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presto987
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by presto987 »

^ You could ask Better/LD to use $999,999 for your home value if you want to avoid the appraisal. But that will raise your LTV, so you have to judge whether you are better off with a lower LTV + appraisal or higher LTV + no appraisal. If your LTV is very low to begin with, then it will make sense to go with $999,999.
therealhunter
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by therealhunter »

yogesh wrote: Sat Oct 17, 2020 3:18 pm 2.375 with $1K (A+B+C+E-Credit) for 30-fixed at LD last week.
Any lender giving 2.25 or 2.375 no cost?
Not exactly no cost but got LD to get me an offer with $250 cost(A+B+C+E-Credit) with 2.375 for 30 fixed. They did try for 2.25 but mentioned that all their requests were rejected by senior management. This one was for a condo but I have seen few posts here getting no cost 2.25 for 30 fixed for a single family.
tj
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by tj »

therealhunter wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:21 pm
yogesh wrote: Sat Oct 17, 2020 3:18 pm 2.375 with $1K (A+B+C+E-Credit) for 30-fixed at LD last week.
Any lender giving 2.25 or 2.375 no cost?
Not exactly no cost but got LD to get me an offer with $250 cost(A+B+C+E-Credit) with 2.375 for 30 fixed. They did try for 2.25 but mentioned that all their requests were rejected by senior management. This one was for a condo but I have seen few posts here getting no cost 2.25 for 30 fixed for a single family.
What was LTV?
pumpkinwaggle
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by pumpkinwaggle »

Update on my refinance application with cash out from Better:

9/29 - Started getting soft estimates, talked to about a dozen lenders (before finding this great thread! Would have saved me hours on the phone...)
9/30 - Got full estimates from various lenders and Better was always able to match. They responded within a couple of hours every time I asked something and checked with me on the phone as well which is great.
10/1 - Got the final match from Better (from $2,705 to $3,799 credit after a couple of matches, at 2.75% for refi with cash out) and started the full process by doing all the tasks on the website to lock the rate somewhere around 6pm.
10/2 - Got a message in the morning at 8am that my rate was locked at the agreed rate and credit. Application was assigned to the processing expert which once again gets back to me in just a few hours. Received the update that I got the appraisal waiver. I had to pay $550 to get the process going but the appraisal will be returned so that'll be a nice $550 back to me.
10/5 - Received conditional approval. Title was ordered. I got the quote from Radian which may save me about $200 if Better can match the cost.
10/20 - Received final approval and disclosures. Notary scheduled.
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sunny_socal
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by sunny_socal »

pumpkinwaggle wrote: Wed Oct 21, 2020 12:38 am Update on my refinance application with cash out from Better:

9/29 - Started getting soft estimates, talked to about a dozen lenders (before finding this great thread! Would have saved me hours on the phone...)
9/30 - Got full estimates from various lenders and Better was always able to match. They responded within a couple of hours every time I asked something and checked with me on the phone as well which is great.
10/1 - Got the final match from Better (from $2,705 to $3,799 credit after a couple of matches, at 2.75% for refi with cash out) and started the full process by doing all the tasks on the website to lock the rate somewhere around 6pm.
10/2 - Got a message in the morning at 8am that my rate was locked at the agreed rate and credit. Application was assigned to the processing expert which once again gets back to me in just a few hours. Received the update that I got the appraisal waiver. I had to pay $550 to get the process going but the appraisal will be returned so that'll be a nice $550 back to me.
10/5 - Received conditional approval. Title was ordered. I got the quote from Radian which may save me about $200 if Better can match the cost.
10/20 - Received final approval and disclosures. Notary scheduled.
Wow

My timeline with better: ('worse')
- 9/15 submitted application
- 10/1 finally heard back, chatted with someone, got a crappy quote, started the "process"
- 10/7 sent them an email with a much better quote from a competitor
- Never heard back
- They closed my file due to inactivity
samta09
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by samta09 »

I closed my refi on 8/14 with Better.com and eligible for $2500 AMX credit. I still haven't gotten it and called AMX but they said it will take awhile for them to research. For those who closed their refi with similar date, did you receive the credit yet?
b2bserver
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by b2bserver »

Does anyone know how Better's "concession credits" work if you price match?

I price matched during processing and the processing officer gave me these to match the other lender. I was told they don't appear as a separate lender credit and should be built into the pricing for a given rate. However, I think maybe they didn't apply it correctly. After price matching, my interest rate went down and my points went up but the end result is still the same pricing as what was in my original locked rate table.

Additionally, are these a type of "use it or lose it" deal? Like if points or closing costs are less than the total value of the credits, any difference is lost? So it's my best interest to get points or closing as high as possible so I can use all of the credits?
presto987
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by presto987 »

b2bserver wrote: Wed Oct 21, 2020 7:41 am Does anyone know how Better's "concession credits" work if you price match?

I price matched during processing and the processing officer gave me these to match the other lender. I was told they don't appear as a separate lender credit and should be built into the pricing for a given rate. However, I think maybe they didn't apply it correctly. After price matching, my interest rate went down and my points went up but the end result is still the same pricing as what was in my original locked rate table.

Additionally, are these a type of "use it or lose it" deal? Like if points or closing costs are less than the total value of the credits, any difference is lost? So it's my best interest to get points or closing as high as possible so I can use all of the credits?
I am not sure what they mean by concession credits. Normally when they do a price match, they match the competing rate and apply enough lender credits so that their A+B+C-lender credit is $100 better than the competing offer's A+B+C-lender credit. If you are dealing with a case where there are points, they would first reduce the points in A before adding lender credit. Either way, your pricing should improve compared to what was in your locked rate table.

On your second question, you should be able to use the full amount of the credit. Better's max lender credit is $4999. The credit can be applied to all closing costs, prepaids, etc. Beyond that, they can cut you a check up to $2000 at closing, and they can also reduce your loan amount which is effectively like applying the credit to your principal (I believe they can make the loan amount $2500 below the current principal).

When I closed with Better, I maxed out their lender credit at $4999. My closing costs and prepaids totaled around $1300. I made use of the remaining $3700 by having them write me an $1900 check at closing and reducing the loan amount by $1800.
b2bserver
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by b2bserver »

presto987 wrote: Wed Oct 21, 2020 11:06 am
b2bserver wrote: Wed Oct 21, 2020 7:41 am Does anyone know how Better's "concession credits" work if you price match?

I price matched during processing and the processing officer gave me these to match the other lender. I was told they don't appear as a separate lender credit and should be built into the pricing for a given rate. However, I think maybe they didn't apply it correctly. After price matching, my interest rate went down and my points went up but the end result is still the same pricing as what was in my original locked rate table.

Additionally, are these a type of "use it or lose it" deal? Like if points or closing costs are less than the total value of the credits, any difference is lost? So it's my best interest to get points or closing as high as possible so I can use all of the credits?
I am not sure what they mean by concession credits. Normally when they do a price match, they match the competing rate and apply enough lender credits so that their A+B+C-lender credit is $100 better than the competing offer's A+B+C-lender credit. If you are dealing with a case where there are points, they would first reduce the points in A before adding lender credit. Either way, your pricing should improve compared to what was in your locked rate table.

On your second question, you should be able to use the full amount of the credit. Better's max lender credit is $4999. The credit can be applied to all closing costs, prepaids, etc. Beyond that, they can cut you a check up to $2000 at closing, and they can also reduce your loan amount which is effectively like applying the credit to your principal (I believe they can make the loan amount $2500 below the current principal).

When I closed with Better, I maxed out their lender credit at $4999. My closing costs and prepaids totaled around $1300. I made use of the remaining $3700 by having them write me an $1900 check at closing and reducing the loan amount by $1800.
Got it. That makes way more sense compared to what actually happened. Does it say anywhere that price match will be done with lender credits in case the processing officer pushes back?
presto987
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by presto987 »

https://better.com/faq/better-guarantee ... fine-print

This is what they say:
We'll match a competitor's offer, and credit you an extra $100" refers to the Better Loan Estimate being at least $100 less in closing costs at the same rate and for the same loan terms, excluding property taxes and insurance (the fees listed in Sections E through H on your Loan Estimate), as the closing costs on the Loan Estimate from the other Lender.


When they refer to "closing costs" from this standpoint, they are talking about A+B+C and lender credit. Since the items in B and C are fixed (until you shop around for C), this means that the levers they have are to reduce A or increase lender credit.
b2bserver
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by b2bserver »

presto987 wrote: Wed Oct 21, 2020 1:40 pm https://better.com/faq/better-guarantee ... fine-print

This is what they say:
We'll match a competitor's offer, and credit you an extra $100" refers to the Better Loan Estimate being at least $100 less in closing costs at the same rate and for the same loan terms, excluding property taxes and insurance (the fees listed in Sections E through H on your Loan Estimate), as the closing costs on the Loan Estimate from the other Lender.


When they refer to "closing costs" from this standpoint, they are talking about A+B+C and lender credit. Since the items in B and C are fixed (until you shop around for C), this means that the levers they have are to reduce A or increase lender credit.
Perfect. The processing agent is still insisting that the credits have been applied and although it wouldn't show up as a rate price change or a separate line item, it will still reduce the funds to close. Not exactly sure how that works but am waiting for a pre price match loan estimate to compare. As much as I like Better's website, it's annoying that you can't view past Loan Estimates unless you know ahead of time to download each copy before it changes (pro tip for others who might be reading this).
InvestDoc
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by InvestDoc »

Thanks to presto987 for recommending Interactive Mortgage. It seems that there are several people here working with Interactive Mortgage but I'd love to hear if anyone has gone through the whole process yet or if someone can share their timeline and experience even if you haven't closed?

I locked a 2.5% 30 yr fixed with credits to cover all costs in A+B+C+E, and I'm hoping for a smooth process ahead. Better was unable to match this deal and told me 2.5% isn't even on their rate table for the loan amount (high balance conforming loan with 59% LTV). I'm already almost 3 months into the refi process with another lender for 2.625% with about $3000 in costs and it's likely going to take another 2-4 weeks--I'd love to just cancel with that lender now but wonder if I should wait to make sure Interactive doesn't pull any surprises on me?
b2bserver
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by b2bserver »

presto987 wrote: Wed Oct 21, 2020 1:40 pm https://better.com/faq/better-guarantee ... fine-print

This is what they say:
We'll match a competitor's offer, and credit you an extra $100" refers to the Better Loan Estimate being at least $100 less in closing costs at the same rate and for the same loan terms, excluding property taxes and insurance (the fees listed in Sections E through H on your Loan Estimate), as the closing costs on the Loan Estimate from the other Lender.


When they refer to "closing costs" from this standpoint, they are talking about A+B+C and lender credit. Since the items in B and C are fixed (until you shop around for C), this means that the levers they have are to reduce A or increase lender credit.
After several rounds of emailing, what happened was the processing officer did in fact add "credits" which reduced A. However, a few days before the price match, the loan price unknowingly went up by $3.5k with no change in interest rate or actions by me ($1.5 credit to $2k points)! The processing agent was basing the their changes off this new price so to them, the final cost did go down. However, I didn't know about this increase so to me, it looked like the price match didn't do anything. This increase happened after conditional approval while my loan was in underwriting and I'm waiting to hear back on the explanation.

Another winkle in all this is that I delayed closing due to this issue and my rate lock expires in two days. The market rate has dropped a little so should I just tell them to skip this whole price match shenanigans and relock with market prices instead of extending? Has anyone done this before?
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