Refinance Mega Thread

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Shershaah
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Shershaah » Sat Aug 01, 2020 8:08 pm

I refinance’ed with better.com in June at 15 year @ 2.625% with zero closing cost.i have seen rates in lower 2’s and would like to refinance again. Can someone please confirm if better.com has a waiting periods policy ?

quizzer25
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by quizzer25 » Sat Aug 01, 2020 9:25 pm

spbos wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 5:47 pm
Last month, I refinanced 510 k at 2.875%, 30-year ( from 4.5%). Today I got a 2.5% no points, no closing costs quote. Should I refinance now or wait for the rates to go down further? One approach is to refinance again now and, if needed, do it one more time later (if the rate hits 2%). What is the downside if the closing cost is zero? I am a little concerned about the effect of frequent mortgage inquiry and refinancing on my credit score. My FICO® Score 8 is 807. But the ones I get from the mortgage company reports are around 740. Thanks.
Can you share the lender name?

thrillhou
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Re: ~

Post by thrillhou » Sat Aug 01, 2020 10:33 pm

Ryzen wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 3:22 pm
MrJedi wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 12:28 pm
Ryzen wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 10:41 am

I would do it. I just closed earlier in the week on under $140k at 3.25% (lowered my rate and dropped PMI). I got dinged because the LTV was between 70-80%, so Fannie Mae charges a .5% Loan Level Pricing Adjustment to the lender when the ultimately sell the loan off to FNMA. So for me, small balance with high-ish LTV couldn't get me the insane rates in this thread.
I'm curious to learn more about this.

What are the thresholds that produce favorable rates?

I got a mediocre rate (still a no brainer for me though as I improved my rate and got enough lender credits to cover all extra costs), I assumed it was due to a low balance (122k), but my LTV is only ~60%. Is there a matrix or guidelines out there that show various thresholds?
https://singlefamily.fanniemae.com/media/9391/display

That is the matrix of all the LLPA (Loan Level Pricing Adjustments) that Fannie charges. When it says .5%, that means a .5% fee up front (not a .5% addition to the interest rate). It's pretty interesting, it will show how both credit score as well as LTV affect loan pricing and thus the lenders offers. See how just over 80% LTV has a slower LLPA than just under 80%, as over 80% has PMI which protects the investor more. And these are cumulative, if a loan hits multiple LLPA areas, you pay them all.
I'm surprised there aren't tiers for credit scores above 740. Does anyone know if the mortgage industry itself has tiers for higher credit scores? (Same question about tiers of LTV lower than 60%)

manatee2005
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by manatee2005 » Sat Aug 01, 2020 10:58 pm

Shershaah wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 8:08 pm
I refinance’ed with better.com in June at 15 year @ 2.625% with zero closing cost.i have seen rates in lower 2’s and would like to refinance again. Can someone please confirm if better.com has a waiting periods policy ?
Usually the same company won't refi again within 6 months. But you can always go somewhere else and refinance.

need403bhelp
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by need403bhelp » Sat Aug 01, 2020 11:27 pm

Shershaah wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 8:08 pm
I refinance’ed with better.com in June at 15 year @ 2.625% with zero closing cost.i have seen rates in lower 2’s and would like to refinance again. Can someone please confirm if better.com has a waiting periods policy ?
Email concierge@better.com or hello@better.com or complaints@better.com.

I was told can refinance immediately after funding if not cash-out.

Their better price guarantee does have 6 months language for their loans, but unofficially I was told they would still try to match competitors loan estimates.

dgnative
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by dgnative » Sun Aug 02, 2020 4:50 am

I like to use more then one bank. Refinanced 204k with 50% equity last year from 4.50 to 3.325% 30 years conforming.
Rates are dropping I am investigating with no escrows.

$2285. costs for 30year fixed 2.75% P/I $425. or 20year 2.625% P/I $557.

With points or buy downs to get 2% interest, 30yr 3.25(pts) $3380. for P/I $384. or 20yr 3.125(pts) $3250. for a P/I $526.

In your opinions is $425-$384 = $41 worth $3200 odd dollars ? Yes I plan on looking for other offers to match also. thanks

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anon_investor
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by anon_investor » Sun Aug 02, 2020 7:16 am

dgnative wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 4:50 am
I like to use more then one bank. Refinanced 204k with 50% equity last year from 4.50 to 3.325% 30 years conforming.
Rates are dropping I am investigating with no escrows.

$2285. costs for 30year fixed 2.75% P/I $425. or 20year 2.625% P/I $557.

With points or buy downs to get 2% interest, 30yr 3.25(pts) $3380. for P/I $384. or 20yr 3.125(pts) $3250. for a P/I $526.

In your opinions is $425-$384 = $41 worth $3200 odd dollars ? Yes I plan on looking for other offers to match also. thanks
For 2.75% 30 yr fixed you should look for $0 costs (lender's credits cover all costs except for prepaids/escrow (if any)).

Admiral
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Admiral » Sun Aug 02, 2020 7:32 am

Just want to point out that United Wholesale Mortgage is offering 15 year loans for 1.87% (based on credit of course). They did my loan in 2016. Brokers only so you'll need to use one, and of course factor their fee into your calculations.

https://apple.news/AoWmJp01DMoGpqHuQVZLnUQ

amking
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by amking » Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:39 am

need403bhelp wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 11:27 pm
Shershaah wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 8:08 pm
I refinance’ed with better.com in June at 15 year @ 2.625% with zero closing cost.i have seen rates in lower 2’s and would like to refinance again. Can someone please confirm if better.com has a waiting periods policy ?
Email concierge@better.com or hello@better.com or complaints@better.com.

I was told can refinance immediately after funding if not cash-out.

Their better price guarantee does have 6 months language for their loans, but unofficially I was told they would still try to match competitors loan estimates.
Who typically ends up servicing Better loans once closed and how long does it take?

Is it coincidence that my current mortgage bounced from a couple places before landing at a banking institution I had other products with?

Would be great if my mortgage just showed up for servicing at Ally this time ;)

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anon_investor
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by anon_investor » Sun Aug 02, 2020 9:19 am

amking wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:39 am
need403bhelp wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 11:27 pm
Shershaah wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 8:08 pm
I refinance’ed with better.com in June at 15 year @ 2.625% with zero closing cost.i have seen rates in lower 2’s and would like to refinance again. Can someone please confirm if better.com has a waiting periods policy ?
Email concierge@better.com or hello@better.com or complaints@better.com.

I was told can refinance immediately after funding if not cash-out.

Their better price guarantee does have 6 months language for their loans, but unofficially I was told they would still try to match competitors loan estimates.
Who typically ends up servicing Better loans once closed and how long does it take?

Is it coincidence that my current mortgage bounced from a couple places before landing at a banking institution I had other products with?

Would be great if my mortgage just showed up for servicing at Ally this time ;)
I think Ally uses Better to service their mortgages, who in turn uses The Money Source. I did a refi with Ally in May and Better was listed as the servicer. The loan was sold to Fannie Mae a week after closing with Better remaining the servicer and Better continued to outsource servicing to The Money Source. The statements say The Money Source / Better.com on them.

Berean
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Berean » Sun Aug 02, 2020 12:16 pm

sergio wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 7:31 pm
Am I the only one that's having trouble finding these amazing low rates? Ally closed off apps in my state, LenderFI isn't take applications, I called QuickenLoans and the rate they gave me was really bad w/high closing costs...
I had the same issue when I first started the refi process one month ago. I had trouble getting low interest rates because the amount I owe on my current mortgage is only $150K. Loan officers from several lenders told me that was too little to merit their best rates. I finally had success. Northpointe Bank gave me the most favorable offer. It took several days, but I finally coaxed Northpointe to give me an official LE. I then emailed that LE to Better and they kept their word to beat it by $100.

thrillhou
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by thrillhou » Sun Aug 02, 2020 12:29 pm

I want to be clear on an aspect of the refi application process.

When the refi company asks for expenses, should the applicant include the current mortgage amount? I ask, because for a first-time mortgage, a person doesn't have that. Also, the process of refinancing necessarily replaces the current mortgage with the new amount that the lender themselves control.

For expenses is it essentially: Current mortgage + real estate taxes + home insurance + all credit card purchases + written checks + other transfers?
I can guess this is over-simplified, but A) is it correct? B) is there anything to think about in the 'expenses' regard?

If "other transfers" are included, would optional things like 529 funding count? In that vein, it seems odd that things like a 401k would count too.

Soares1234
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Soares1234 » Sun Aug 02, 2020 12:53 pm

spbos wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 5:47 pm
Last month, I refinanced 510 k at 2.875%, 30-year ( from 4.5%). Today I got a 2.5% no points, no closing costs quote. Should I refinance now or wait for the rates to go down further? One approach is to refinance again now and, if needed, do it one more time later (if the rate hits 2%). What is the downside if the closing cost is zero? I am a little concerned about the effect of frequent mortgage inquiry and refinancing on my credit score. My FICO® Score 8 is 807. But the ones I get from the mortgage company reports are around 740. Thanks.
Can you share lender?

Berean
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Berean » Sun Aug 02, 2020 12:56 pm

Some of us are apprehensive that Better's $2,500 credit with AmEx might not come through. Is there any basis for that apprehension? Has anyone closed a refi with Better, met all the criteria for the AmEx credit such as applying by the deadline of July 28 or whenever it was, but still not received the AmEx credit as promised 6 to 8 weeks later?

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BrandonBogle
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by BrandonBogle » Sun Aug 02, 2020 1:04 pm

Berean wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 12:56 pm
Some of us are apprehensive that Better's $2,500 credit with AmEx might not come through. Is there any basis for that apprehension? Has anyone closed a refi with Better, met all the criteria for the AmEx credit such as applying by the deadline of July 28 or whenever it was, but still not received the AmEx credit as promised 6 to 8 weeks later?
Just note that it is 8-12 weeks per the T&C, though most get it in 6-8. On my first refi, I didn’t get it and at week 9 called Amex about it and they investigated. I got it a few days later. Apparently there was a typo in the name matching and they corrected it and sent it over within 3 - 5 days. Btw, I was not targeted by Amex for this offer and just applied for it through the link.

Meanwhile, my concierge for both my 2nd and 3rd refi have confirmed I would get it. I have no doubt about it, but I did feel anxiety waiting for it to credit to my account.

chet96
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by chet96 » Sun Aug 02, 2020 1:19 pm

Anyone had luck with Loan Cabin lately?

I submitted an app about a week ago (27 August) - received a confirming email, but no other contact.

My only concern is that they also have not pulled credit - I'm trying to shop around, and as I understand it, there is a 2 week window. (My credit union pulled credit, but has not contacted me either).

Berean
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Berean » Sun Aug 02, 2020 2:39 pm

BrandonBogle wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 1:04 pm
Berean wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 12:56 pm
Some of us are apprehensive that Better's $2,500 credit with AmEx might not come through. Is there any basis for that apprehension? Has anyone closed a refi with Better, met all the criteria for the AmEx credit such as applying by the deadline of July 28 or whenever it was, but still not received the AmEx credit as promised 6 to 8 weeks later?
Just note that it is 8-12 weeks per the T&C, though most get it in 6-8. On my first refi, I didn’t get it and at week 9 called Amex about it and they investigated. I got it a few days later. Apparently there was a typo in the name matching and they corrected it and sent it over within 3 - 5 days. Btw, I was not targeted by Amex for this offer and just applied for it through the link.

Meanwhile, my concierge for both my 2nd and 3rd refi have confirmed I would get it. I have no doubt about it, but I did feel anxiety waiting for it to credit to my account.
I don't have a concierge, as far as I know. Is the concierge an employee of AmEx or Better?

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BrandonBogle
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by BrandonBogle » Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:29 pm

Berean wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 2:39 pm
I don't have a concierge, as far as I know. Is the concierge an employee of AmEx or Better?
Better. It is their fancy term for a loan officer.

looking
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by looking » Sun Aug 02, 2020 4:52 pm

zeal4thil wrote:
Tue Feb 25, 2020 6:51 pm
Here is my Refinance history so far .
Started with 330K mortgage @ 4.5% (July 2018) - 30 year (Provident ) (paid 300/month extra in Principle )
Refinanced 322K @ 3.75% No Cost Mortgage (Feb 2019) -30 year (Caliber Homes then sold to Flagstar Bank) (Paid 500/Month extra in Principle )
Now about to close 312k @ 2.875% No Cost Mortgage ( Potentially March 2020) - 15 Year (With Caliber again but in the application itself they mentioned they intend to sell the loan as soon as its closed ).

So far it seem unbelievable as within 20 months i was able to reduce >1.5% in the interest rate without spending anything on closing cost . I am still thinking whether i should have kept it 30 Year @ 3.25% and paid extra every month ?.
so who is the best for refi and new mortgage

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BrandonBogle
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by BrandonBogle » Sun Aug 02, 2020 5:33 pm

looking wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 4:52 pm
so who is the best for refi and new mortgage
The one that gives you the best overall pricing - i.e., not just rate, but also costs.

Kind of like index investing. All will be about index rate - fees, so those who have less fees are generally better providers. :)

manatee2005
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by manatee2005 » Sun Aug 02, 2020 5:39 pm

Does anyone know how mortgage loan agents get paid?

My understanding is they don't get paid salary, they get $1-2k commission out of every loan amount they do. But who pays that commission to them?

Also, if the loan is refinanced within 6 month, I understand that the commission gets clawed back. How do they know the loan is refinanced if it's sold twice within a couple of months?

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anon_investor
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by anon_investor » Sun Aug 02, 2020 5:43 pm

BrandonBogle wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 5:33 pm
looking wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 4:52 pm
so who is the best for refi and new mortgage
The one that gives you the best overall pricing - i.e., not just rate, but also costs.

Kind of like index investing. All will be about index rate - fees, so those who have less fees are generally better providers. :)
HAHA, that is a great way to put it!

PhinTron
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by PhinTron » Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:01 pm

Below is my Current situation in trying to get my mortgage rate down.

1. My Current mortgage with Lender A is at 3.5% for 350K.

2. I am in talk with multiple lenders for financing & in advanced stage with Lender B, where underwriting in progress & very likely the closing is expected in 1 week or so. The offer is
30 Years at 3% ( I can go for lower rate, but I will not make any money or will need to pay closing cost) . I will be making about $3000 on this refinance with current rapid decreases in the loan rates.

3. Yesterday I just locked a rate with Lender C for no cost 2.625%, 30 Yr, which may take 5-6 weeks more to close. I will probably make better.com match this & will make about 2500 on this transactions using AMEX offer (I already have my application with Better.com).

Considering above I am thinking as below.

A: Can I go ahead with Lender B first in 1 week time & get the refinance closed, make 3K on transaction.

B: I continue my refinance process with Lender C & refinance again in 4-5 week more which will close my loan with lender B in about months’ time.

Can experts here comment, if it is possible to achieve above, considering 2 refinances happening within period of 3-5 weeks duration.

If I need to achieve the above, what precautions should I take & any things that I should be careful of? Any problems that I may face in my transaction with Lender C considering my refinancing with Lender B, in last 4-5 week only.
Thanks

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BrandonBogle
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by BrandonBogle » Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:10 pm

PhinTron wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:01 pm
A: Can I go ahead with Lender B first in 1 week time & get the refinance closed, make 3K on transaction.

B: I continue my refinance process with Lender C & refinance again in 4-5 week more which will close my loan with lender B in about months’ time.

Can experts here comment, if it is possible to achieve above, considering 2 refinances happening within period of 3-5 weeks duration.

If I need to achieve the above, what precautions should I take & any things that I should be careful of? Any problems that I may face in my transaction with Lender C considering my refinancing with Lender B, in last 4-5 week only.
That is indeed possible. However, you may need to stretch the timing a little bit. Lender C will want a statement of the loan they are to pay off and it will take a few weeks before you can have a statement to provide them. So do as you are doing, but try to drag it out before you go into conditional approval so you'll have a statement by the time you close.

One thing to consider is switching to a higher rate with Lender B to get even more money for that refi.

quizzer25
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by quizzer25 » Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:50 pm

Admiral wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 7:32 am
Just want to point out that United Wholesale Mortgage is offering 15 year loans for 1.87% (based on credit of course). They did my loan in 2016. Brokers only so you'll need to use one, and of course factor their fee into your calculations.

https://apple.news/AoWmJp01DMoGpqHuQVZLnUQ
Can you point me to the lender who did your United Wholesale mortgage?

jbell3124
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by jbell3124 » Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:51 pm

PhinTron wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:01 pm
Below is my Current situation in trying to get my mortgage rate down.

1. My Current mortgage with Lender A is at 3.5% for 350K.

2. I am in talk with multiple lenders for financing & in advanced stage with Lender B, where underwriting in progress & very likely the closing is expected in 1 week or so. The offer is
30 Years at 3% ( I can go for lower rate, but I will not make any money or will need to pay closing cost) . I will be making about $3000 on this refinance with current rapid decreases in the loan rates.

3. Yesterday I just locked a rate with Lender C for no cost 2.625%, 30 Yr, which may take 5-6 weeks more to close. I will probably make better.com match this & will make about 2500 on this transactions using AMEX offer (I already have my application with Better.com).

Considering above I am thinking as below.

A: Can I go ahead with Lender B first in 1 week time & get the refinance closed, make 3K on transaction.

B: I continue my refinance process with Lender C & refinance again in 4-5 week more which will close my loan with lender B in about months’ time.

Can experts here comment, if it is possible to achieve above, considering 2 refinances happening within period of 3-5 weeks duration.

If I need to achieve the above, what precautions should I take & any things that I should be careful of? Any problems that I may face in my transaction with Lender C considering my refinancing with Lender B, in last 4-5 week only.
Thanks

Do you mind sharing who Lender C is. I'm hoping to find an offer to send to Better to match as well to get the AMEX? Tricky timing, need to close after Sept 24th if I want to avoid potential Lenderfi clawback issues. Thanks.

ChiKid24
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by ChiKid24 » Sun Aug 02, 2020 9:41 pm

PhinTron wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:01 pm
Below is my Current situation in trying to get my mortgage rate down.

1. My Current mortgage with Lender A is at 3.5% for 350K.

2. I am in talk with multiple lenders for financing & in advanced stage with Lender B, where underwriting in progress & very likely the closing is expected in 1 week or so. The offer is
30 Years at 3% ( I can go for lower rate, but I will not make any money or will need to pay closing cost) . I will be making about $3000 on this refinance with current rapid decreases in the loan rates.

3. Yesterday I just locked a rate with Lender C for no cost 2.625%, 30 Yr, which may take 5-6 weeks more to close. I will probably make better.com match this & will make about 2500 on this transactions using AMEX offer (I already have my application with Better.com).

Considering above I am thinking as below.

A: Can I go ahead with Lender B first in 1 week time & get the refinance closed, make 3K on transaction.

B: I continue my refinance process with Lender C & refinance again in 4-5 week more which will close my loan with lender B in about months’ time.

Can experts here comment, if it is possible to achieve above, considering 2 refinances happening within period of 3-5 weeks duration.

If I need to achieve the above, what precautions should I take & any things that I should be careful of? Any problems that I may face in my transaction with Lender C considering my refinancing with Lender B, in last 4-5 week only.
Thanks
Not as tight a timeframe, but I did something similar. Closed with Better a month ago getting 3% but netting $2.5k from lender credit that exceeded costs. The day after I signed (before loan funded), I locked with Lenderfi at 2.75% with credit to cover costs.

I wouldn't worry about not having a loan statement from Lender B to give to Lender C. For me, I was just up front with Lenderfi and told them I had just signed closing docs with Better and loan hadn't funded. The loan officer said to send my closing cost disclosure so he would have the loan balance. Then they were able to request a payoff quote from Better/TMS ( loan servicer), prior to me even having a loan statement. I'm scheduled to close Thursday so will have this new loan done before even making a payment to Better/TMS.

Agree with the other suggestion to see if you can extract more profit from Lender B. Move it up to 3.125 or 3.25% for a larger lender credit since you know you'll be able to get a lower rate done with Lender C shortly.

Good luck!

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BrandonBogle
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by BrandonBogle » Sun Aug 02, 2020 9:56 pm

ChiKid24 wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 9:41 pm
I wouldn't worry about not having a loan statement from Lender B to give to Lender C. For me, I was just up front with Lenderfi and told them I had just signed closing docs with Better and loan hadn't funded. The loan officer said to send my closing cost disclosure so he would have the loan balance. Then they were able to request a payoff quote from Better/TMS ( loan servicer), prior to me even having a loan statement. I'm scheduled to close Thursday so will have this new loan done before even making a payment to Better/TMS.
Interesting. Good to know. I wonder if it makes a difference that for me, Lender A, B, and C are all Better and I haven't even scheduled closing with B yet!

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anon_investor
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by anon_investor » Sun Aug 02, 2020 10:09 pm

BrandonBogle wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 9:56 pm
ChiKid24 wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 9:41 pm
I wouldn't worry about not having a loan statement from Lender B to give to Lender C. For me, I was just up front with Lenderfi and told them I had just signed closing docs with Better and loan hadn't funded. The loan officer said to send my closing cost disclosure so he would have the loan balance. Then they were able to request a payoff quote from Better/TMS ( loan servicer), prior to me even having a loan statement. I'm scheduled to close Thursday so will have this new loan done before even making a payment to Better/TMS.
Interesting. Good to know. I wonder if it makes a difference that for me, Lender A, B, and C are all Better and I haven't even scheduled closing with B yet!
Are you going to be able to get the Amex credit for C???

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BrandonBogle
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by BrandonBogle » Sun Aug 02, 2020 10:28 pm

anon_investor wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 10:09 pm
BrandonBogle wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 9:56 pm
ChiKid24 wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 9:41 pm
I wouldn't worry about not having a loan statement from Lender B to give to Lender C. For me, I was just up front with Lenderfi and told them I had just signed closing docs with Better and loan hadn't funded. The loan officer said to send my closing cost disclosure so he would have the loan balance. Then they were able to request a payoff quote from Better/TMS ( loan servicer), prior to me even having a loan statement. I'm scheduled to close Thursday so will have this new loan done before even making a payment to Better/TMS.
Interesting. Good to know. I wonder if it makes a difference that for me, Lender A, B, and C are all Better and I haven't even scheduled closing with B yet!
Are you going to be able to get the Amex credit for C???
Yup. Confirmed that via phone on Thursday.

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anon_investor
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by anon_investor » Sun Aug 02, 2020 10:33 pm

BrandonBogle wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 10:28 pm
anon_investor wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 10:09 pm
BrandonBogle wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 9:56 pm
ChiKid24 wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 9:41 pm
I wouldn't worry about not having a loan statement from Lender B to give to Lender C. For me, I was just up front with Lenderfi and told them I had just signed closing docs with Better and loan hadn't funded. The loan officer said to send my closing cost disclosure so he would have the loan balance. Then they were able to request a payoff quote from Better/TMS ( loan servicer), prior to me even having a loan statement. I'm scheduled to close Thursday so will have this new loan done before even making a payment to Better/TMS.
Interesting. Good to know. I wonder if it makes a difference that for me, Lender A, B, and C are all Better and I haven't even scheduled closing with B yet!
Are you going to be able to get the Amex credit for C???
Yup. Confirmed that via phone on Thursday.
Wow, good luck! Hope you land one of those sub 2% loans!

Monsterflockster
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Monsterflockster » Sun Aug 02, 2020 11:37 pm

PhinTron wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:01 pm
Below is my Current situation in trying to get my mortgage rate down.

1. My Current mortgage with Lender A is at 3.5% for 350K.

2. I am in talk with multiple lenders for financing & in advanced stage with Lender B, where underwriting in progress & very likely the closing is expected in 1 week or so. The offer is
30 Years at 3% ( I can go for lower rate, but I will not make any money or will need to pay closing cost) . I will be making about $3000 on this refinance with current rapid decreases in the loan rates.

3. Yesterday I just locked a rate with Lender C for no cost 2.625%, 30 Yr, which may take 5-6 weeks more to close. I will probably make better.com match this & will make about 2500 on this transactions using AMEX offer (I already have my application with Better.com).

Considering above I am thinking as below.

A: Can I go ahead with Lender B first in 1 week time & get the refinance closed, make 3K on transaction.

B: I continue my refinance process with Lender C & refinance again in 4-5 week more which will close my loan with lender B in about months’ time.

Can experts here comment, if it is possible to achieve above, considering 2 refinances happening within period of 3-5 weeks duration.

If I need to achieve the above, what precautions should I take & any things that I should be careful of? Any problems that I may face in my transaction with Lender C considering my refinancing with Lender B, in last 4-5 week only.
Thanks
“Don’t hate the playa, hate the game” am I right? 🤷🏻‍♂️

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camillus
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by camillus » Mon Aug 03, 2020 5:24 am

Hi all, thanks in advance for your help & input. I am about to get serious about refi applications. I wonder if I should apply for an Amex blue cash preferred card to see if I’m eligible for the $2500 Amex credit for better.com. My credit score is 800+.

The 2500 would be nice, but wondering about the credit inquiry’s effect on the big picture. Thanks!

K-knows
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by K-knows » Mon Aug 03, 2020 6:14 am

BrandonBogle wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 2:05 pm
K-knows wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 1:32 pm
I'm interested in comparing the equivalent total out of pocket costs of sticking with my current loan vs a refi. Here are two possible methods for an apples to apples comparison where my out of pocket costs going forward under both a refi and existing loan scenarios are the same. Which method is correct (if either)?

...

Under both calculation methods the refi is only marginally compelling. But I want to get the apples to apples comparison method correct should rates drop further.
IMO, neither. This is what I do.
  1. Build an amortization table of your current mortgage
  2. Build an amortization table of the expected refi. Easiest to do this as a duplicated tab in the same spreadsheet.
  3. Whichever has a lower payment, put in additional principal (monthly) on the spreadsheet to make it equal the payment of the other mortgage
  4. On the current mortgage, take note of the Cumulative Interest for 9/1/2020. Keep in mind that interest in earned in arrears, so that number is for interest up to 8/30/2020.
  5. Calculate the refi's A + B + C + E - credits in J (plus any outside credits, like Better/Rocket's Amex promo when it was around)
  6. Add in a calculation that does old mortgage Cumulative Interest - refi Cumulative Interest
  7. Note which month that this savings of interest between the two mortgages becomes larger that the closing costs calculated above
  8. This is your breakeven point. If you plan to have this loan past this date, get the refi. If you don't plan on having this loan that far, keep your current loan.
The above assumes you are making a decision on cost. If you are making a decision on liquidity or something else, that would be a different calculation.
I am indeed making a decision on costs. I agree, calculating the break even point is an important consideration. I will modify the spreadsheet to include a running total of cumulative interest and the difference calculation.

I've only refinanced a few times and went with zero/minimum closing costs in the past. So this helps. Thank you.

Berean
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Berean » Mon Aug 03, 2020 6:41 am

Admiral wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 7:32 am
Just want to point out that United Wholesale Mortgage is offering 15 year loans for 1.87% (based on credit of course). They did my loan in 2016. Brokers only so you'll need to use one, and of course factor their fee into your calculations.

https://apple.news/AoWmJp01DMoGpqHuQVZLnUQ
I looked into those low UWM rates three days ago. The 1.87% rate will cost you two points; 1.99% costs 1.5 points. Too expensive for me.

Berean
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Berean » Mon Aug 03, 2020 6:50 am

quizzer25 wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:50 pm
Admiral wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 7:32 am
Just want to point out that United Wholesale Mortgage is offering 15 year loans for 1.87% (based on credit of course). They did my loan in 2016. Brokers only so you'll need to use one, and of course factor their fee into your calculations.

https://apple.news/AoWmJp01DMoGpqHuQVZLnUQ
Can you point me to the lender who did your United Wholesale mortgage?
To get a loan from UWM, you have to go through a broker. You can obtain a list of approved brokers in your geographic area at www.findamortgagebroker.com.

desertdoc
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by desertdoc » Mon Aug 03, 2020 6:51 am

On 7/29 got the following LE from LenderFi. (Also similar experience to others on this thread about them being minimally responsive. I used the backdoor url from this forum and best I got was an email and a single reply to a message sent via my account on their website. No reply to phone, email.)

$675k loan. 2.5% 30 year. Approx 85% LTV. FICO 785. State Maryland.

A: $5528
B: $201
C: $1035
E: $60
NO LENDER CREDITS

So saying the F and G sections are just a matter of accounting and how escrow is handled around closing this is >$6k in closing costs. HOW ARE OTHERS GETTING SUCH GREAT LENDER CREDITS? Am I in too high of a LTV bracket to qualify for these?

I'm currently in a 10 year ARM at 3.75% so this offer is still a big win for me. Also Better said they would match this deal and I feel like they have been more responsive and therefore I am more comfortable moving forward with them. I have cash on hand to pay down principal or cover a big closing cost. My goal in this refi is lowering costs, not anything to do with cash flows. But the math at <3% rates says to take the biggest loan possible and hang on to your cash to invest it elsewhere so I'm try to get closer to a no cost refi.

Thoughts on strategy for how to get more lender credits? And thanks so much to all who posted to this thread. Have learned so much from reading this.

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simplesimon
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by simplesimon » Mon Aug 03, 2020 7:16 am

desertdoc wrote:
Mon Aug 03, 2020 6:51 am
On 7/29 got the following LE from LenderFi. (Also similar experience to others on this thread about them being minimally responsive. I used the backdoor url from this forum and best I got was an email and a single reply to a message sent via my account on their website. No reply to phone, email.)

$675k loan. 2.5% 30 year. Approx 85% LTV. FICO 785. State Maryland.

A: $5528
B: $201
C: $1035
E: $60
NO LENDER CREDITS

So saying the F and G sections are just a matter of accounting and how escrow is handled around closing this is >$6k in closing costs. HOW ARE OTHERS GETTING SUCH GREAT LENDER CREDITS? Am I in too high of a LTV bracket to qualify for these?

I'm currently in a 10 year ARM at 3.75% so this offer is still a big win for me. Also Better said they would match this deal and I feel like they have been more responsive and therefore I am more comfortable moving forward with them. I have cash on hand to pay down principal or cover a big closing cost. My goal in this refi is lowering costs, not anything to do with cash flows. But the math at <3% rates says to take the biggest loan possible and hang on to your cash to invest it elsewhere so I'm try to get closer to a no cost refi.

Thoughts on strategy for how to get more lender credits? And thanks so much to all who posted to this thread. Have learned so much from reading this.
I got the same rate with no credits. I asked what the rate would be for a no-cost refi and they responded with 2.625%. My LTV is ~75% though.

ZMonet
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by ZMonet » Mon Aug 03, 2020 8:03 am

simplesimon wrote:
Mon Aug 03, 2020 7:16 am
desertdoc wrote:
Mon Aug 03, 2020 6:51 am
On 7/29 got the following LE from LenderFi. (Also similar experience to others on this thread about them being minimally responsive. I used the backdoor url from this forum and best I got was an email and a single reply to a message sent via my account on their website. No reply to phone, email.)

$675k loan. 2.5% 30 year. Approx 85% LTV. FICO 785. State Maryland.
I got the same rate with no credits. I asked what the rate would be for a no-cost refi and they responded with 2.625%. My LTV is ~75% though.
Is this somehow related to Maryland? I can't seem to find the ultralow rates with minimal/no closing costs that people are quoting here either. Anyone in Maryland finding low rates on a 15 or 30 with no cost?

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BrandonBogle
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by BrandonBogle » Mon Aug 03, 2020 8:06 am

camillus wrote:
Mon Aug 03, 2020 5:24 am
Hi all, thanks in advance for your help & input. I am about to get serious about refi applications. I wonder if I should apply for an Amex blue cash preferred card to see if I’m eligible for the $2500 Amex credit for better.com. My credit score is 800+.

The 2500 would be nice, but wondering about the credit inquiry’s effect on the big picture. Thanks!
Sadly, not an option anymore.
BrandonBogle wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 6:49 pm
xerxes101 wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 6:08 pm
I think you are in a good position. I may have to switch from LenderFi to Better.com if they do not accept my counter-offer...but I have to apply for AMEX...boy, I hope all these hard credit pulls don't ding my credit score :oops:
The Better Amex promo has ended. Unless you started an app via the promo already and just didn’t have the card, you won’t be able to get the promo.

mbasherp
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by mbasherp » Mon Aug 03, 2020 8:31 am

Lenderfi just got back to me for my second refi with them this year. With loan of $196k and 58% LTV, he says the best he can do is 3% no cost. He claims the lower rates are for >$400k balances.

Is this true across other lenders? I can’t get Loan Cabin or Watermark to respond. It still makes sense to refi, but I really wanted a sub 3% rate.

FiscallyResponsible
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by FiscallyResponsible » Mon Aug 03, 2020 8:52 am

mbasherp wrote:
Mon Aug 03, 2020 8:31 am
Lenderfi just got back to me for my second refi with them this year. With loan of $196k and 58% LTV, he says the best he can do is 3% no cost. He claims the lower rates are for >$400k balances.

Is this true across other lenders? I can’t get Loan Cabin or Watermark to respond. It still makes sense to refi, but I really wanted a sub 3% rate.
Yes, this is widely the case from my experience. You could probably do a cash out and be well under 3%.

mbasherp
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by mbasherp » Mon Aug 03, 2020 9:00 am

FiscallyResponsible wrote:
Mon Aug 03, 2020 8:52 am
mbasherp wrote:
Mon Aug 03, 2020 8:31 am
Lenderfi just got back to me for my second refi with them this year. With loan of $196k and 58% LTV, he says the best he can do is 3% no cost. He claims the lower rates are for >$400k balances.

Is this true across other lenders? I can’t get Loan Cabin or Watermark to respond. It still makes sense to refi, but I really wanted a sub 3% rate.
Yes, this is widely the case from my experience. You could probably do a cash out and be well under 3%.
But with a $335k property, the cash out still won’t get me in the $400k, 2.625% loan range. I wish these other lenders were responsive!!

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XtremeSki2001
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by XtremeSki2001 » Mon Aug 03, 2020 9:04 am

LenderFi site is saying they're not taking any other applications. Next best bet is better.com? Any others that should be considered?
A box of rain will ease the pain and love will see you through

FiscallyResponsible
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by FiscallyResponsible » Mon Aug 03, 2020 9:08 am

mbasherp wrote:
Mon Aug 03, 2020 9:00 am
FiscallyResponsible wrote:
Mon Aug 03, 2020 8:52 am
mbasherp wrote:
Mon Aug 03, 2020 8:31 am
Lenderfi just got back to me for my second refi with them this year. With loan of $196k and 58% LTV, he says the best he can do is 3% no cost. He claims the lower rates are for >$400k balances.

Is this true across other lenders? I can’t get Loan Cabin or Watermark to respond. It still makes sense to refi, but I really wanted a sub 3% rate.
Yes, this is widely the case from my experience. You could probably do a cash out and be well under 3%.
But with a $335k property, the cash out still won’t get me in the $400k, 2.625% loan range. I wish these other lenders were responsive!!
400k would probably be more optimal, but you should still see better rates if looking in the 300k range as well. If you play around on the Costco site, you can probably find where the sweet spot is.

WhyRWeHere
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by WhyRWeHere » Mon Aug 03, 2020 9:31 am

FiscallyResponsible wrote:
Mon Aug 03, 2020 8:52 am
mbasherp wrote:
Mon Aug 03, 2020 8:31 am
Lenderfi just got back to me for my second refi with them this year. With loan of $196k and 58% LTV, he says the best he can do is 3% no cost. He claims the lower rates are for >$400k balances.

Is this true across other lenders? I can’t get Loan Cabin or Watermark to respond. It still makes sense to refi, but I really wanted a sub 3% rate.
Yes, this is widely the case from my experience. You could probably do a cash out and be well under 3%.
You will pay a higher rate for a cash out. That may negate the lower rate you could get for a higher loan amount.

EFF_fan81
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by EFF_fan81 » Mon Aug 03, 2020 9:57 am

I locked back in June on a 15 year at 2.625 with $3,000 in closing costs for a refi (no cash out) for $470k on an $800k property with FICO scores in the 800s.

It seems to me this rate is uncompetitive now. Can I negotiate something lower with the current lender? Do I need to just cut bait and go with a new lender? Should I wait until the lock period expires and then "re-lock" at lower rates and then close?

BlackSails
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by BlackSails » Mon Aug 03, 2020 10:07 am

I'll chime in here as well. As a HCOL resident my refi choices don't look so good as most here. Im in NY and here's what i see with better today:

495K Property and 800s FICO
340K left on 30YR @ 3.625 currently

30YR
Rate/APR
2.750/2.862

Points $2,953

LE looks like:
A+B+C = $7,175
E+F+G+H = $10,612 (4500 is escrow so im assuming most is a wash with my current escrow acct)

Closing costs= $17,787

Also a local credit union had a similar rate with no points a few days back so i could possibly try to get the same rate at zero points.

Is it worth it with such high closing costs? Convince me :)

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BrandonBogle
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by BrandonBogle » Mon Aug 03, 2020 10:11 am

EFF_fan81 wrote:
Mon Aug 03, 2020 9:57 am
I locked back in June on a 15 year at 2.625 with $3,000 in closing costs for a refi (no cash out) for $470k on an $800k property with FICO scores in the 800s.

It seems to me this rate is uncompetitive now. Can I negotiate something lower with the current lender? Do I need to just cut bait and go with a new lender? Should I wait until the lock period expires and then "re-lock" at lower rates and then close?
I would shop another lender and then either cut and switch or give the new LE to your existing refi lender asking them to compete with this offer.

I would not wait for the lock period to simply expire and try to “re-lock”. Many lenders have a policy that you cannot have a new lock on an app if you have had a lock on the same property within XYZ days. Or they may allow it, but you are subject to “worst case pricing” for a period of time. Those are designed to discourage this very behavior.

Alternatively, you can ask the lender if they have a float-down option on your refi and what the terms for that are. They may offer you a reasonably lower rate without any trouble.

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BrandonBogle
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Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by BrandonBogle » Mon Aug 03, 2020 10:14 am

BlackSails wrote:
Mon Aug 03, 2020 10:07 am
I'll chime in here as well. As a HCOL resident my refi choices don't look so good as most here. Im in NY and here's what i see with better today:

495K Property and 800s FICO
340K left on 30YR @ 3.625 currently

30YR
Rate/APR
2.750/2.862

Points $2,953

LE looks like:
A+B+C = $7,175
E+F+G+H = $10,612 (4500 is escrow so im assuming most is a wash with my current escrow acct)

Closing costs= $17,787

Also a local credit union had a similar rate with no points a few days back so i could possibly try to get the same rate at zero points.

Is it worth it with such high closing costs? Convince me :)
Have you checked with your existing lender? Does the CU offer to do CEMAs? Better does, so if they can match/beat the CU it would be worthwhile. A CEMA would likely (depends on the details though) take thousands out of Section E by avoiding some of the NY mortgage tax. However, Section C will grow a bit to pay for the extra legal work.

Assuming a CEMA can be done, what would 2.875% cost? Perhaps enough credits there to offset Sections B and C.

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