Refinance Mega Thread

[presto987]

It's pretty good. Just seems like section C is really high. Maybe shop that around.

[supalong52]

Welp, I'm not nearly as savvy as most folks in this thread. We bought our first house 18 months ago and refi'd once in February before Covid from a 30 year @ 4.5% to a 15 year @ 3.25% (no cost). That was through Owning.com. We are about to close on another refi through AmeriSave on a 15 year @ 2.5% w/ ~$800 in fees, excluding prepaids. This is for a~$600K mortgage with a 60% LTV. Probably not the best deal but I was already on the fence as to whether to refi our 3.25% mortgage.

The sucky thing about AmeriSave was they wanted their $500 fee upfront before locking in a rate. The cost had gone up by $1000 from the time we applied until underwriting approved, but they waived it and gave us our LE rate.

Not a brag, but just figured I'd share. Saves us some money but definitely not the best we could have gotten. (I do wonder what that would be though...)

[presto987]

^ It sounds like you might qualify for Interactive Mortgage's advertised rates. It needs to be single family (not condo). 1.99% at no cost for a 15-year. If you are closing very soon with Amerisave, then maybe you have time to refi again with IM before that deal goes away

If Amerisave allows you to increase your rate in order to get lender credits, that would be a good idea if you think you will refi again.

[Billionaire07]

[quote=Jagger post_id=5528766 time=1601738776 user_id=166032]
Has anyone else had problems with the LenderFi/BSI payment web site, either today or in the past? We're trying to make our first one-time ACH payment and the servicer site seems to be down.
[/quote]

Not yet. I paid last month (one partial mini test payment and subsequently remaining balance) and Didn’t have issue.

Also tried other way round by using my bank checking account bill pay feature.
First one (again small test transaction to gauge time taken to deliver/deposit) was way delayed however think that was due to using lenderfi CA address instead of Dallas one.
Next couple of test transactions to Dallas address (P.O. Box/ supposed to be lockbox), got delivered by my bank as scheduled (bank requires 2-3 business days to deliver too them)

[b]Caution[/b]:
Now I am trying to use my grace period (Due 1st and 15 day grace before late payments are charged), I login to BSI and it shows my account is delinquent by 5 days (really making use of grace period they make account delinquent). I have Been fully utilizing grace period with my old BoA mortgage and never I saw delinquent or credit reporting.
Now, just hoping dont burn my fingers (late charge or credit reporting) for using grace period(I.e my contract does say no late fees in grace period, however don’t want hassle of resolving it, if they make a mistake and charge it). Will have to wait for 3 days, by when my bank gives them their payment, to find out outcome of utilizing grace period.
So mostly I would be sticking to getting it by due date.

Note: also BSI site allows 4-5 days after due date to schedule payment without fees, however if you are late than that, even if in grace period, their FAQ indicates they charge payment processing fees (not late fees which will hit after grace period).

[Monsterflockster]

^ Great to hear! Assuming Better waives your appraisal, you should be able to save another $550. And by having them price-match title costs to Radian, that should be another $200 (they price-match this by increasing the lender credit by the amount of the price difference). Finally, your section "E" costs should go down when you get your initial closing disclosure.

If all goes as planned, hopefully you will make $2700 net credit on this refi!

If you get another better offer before you close, there is still room for them to increase lender credits by another $1000. But if not, you are in a great spot.

Yes, it’s thanks to you all here! I was so confused yesterday and got back on track with your advice.

I emailed Radian this morning. Let’s see if I hear back.

PS: After getting the first estimate from Loan Depot yesterday and getting half a dozen calls and emails from them, I didn’t hear back from them today after asking for the no cost estimate... maybe all these bad reviews are correct...

Here is a quick update with my experience with Better. So far, super smooth, great communication and good progress (I was quick to do all their tasks immediately when I got the notice).

9/29 - Started getting soft estimates, talked to about a dozen lenders (before finding this great thread! Would have saved me hours on the phone...)
9/30 - Got full estimates from various lenders and Better was always able to match. They responded within a couple of hours every time I asked something and checked with me on the phone as well which is great.
10/1 - Got the final match from Better (from $2,705 to $3,799 credit after a couple of matches, at 2.75% for refi with cash out) and started the full process by doing all the tasks on the website to lock the rate somewhere around 6pm.
10/2 - Got a message in the morning at 8am that my rate was locked at the agreed rate and credit. Application was assigned to the processing expert which once again gets back to me in just a few hours. Received the update that I got the appraisal waiver. I had to pay $550 to get the process going but the appraisal will be returned so that'll be a nice $550 back to me.
10/5 - Received conditional approval. Title was ordered. I got the quote from Radian which may save me about $200 if Better can match the cost.

To be continued...

If you got a great deal why don’t you go with that company? Why do you run to better to match? And you would drop all the work you’ve done with better for $200?

[jbrown394]

Hello all the refinance gurus !

I have recently refinanced through owning (15 years @2.25 no cash out). I just got a letter that my loan has been transferred to another company.

- Is it safe to refinance again to get 15 years @2.00 ?
- I have read all the closing documents and there was no mention of 6-month delay before being able to refinance again, does anybody know what that document is called, in case I have missed the terms/conditions ?
- If I do start another refinance, and given the fact that my loan is very new with the current servicer (first payment is due on Nov 1st), will there be any problems with getting the payoff information ?
- Any other things that I should look for and/or be careful about ?

Thanks a lot

[therealhunter]

I'm approaching closing this week as communicated by my new lender. they requested the payoff statement from my current lender and that states the payoff balance as of Oct 26th. Few generic questions I have -

- Does it mean my new lender can't disburse funds before Oct 26h?
- if they do, would the amount be adjusted or would they have to request a new statement from my current lender?
- What's the usual gap between closing and disbursement date?
- Should I tie up the prepaid interest numbers based on closing date or by disbursement date?

[keystone]

I completed my closing with Watermark yesterday. From my experience, they are extremely slow. I locked in late July, so the process took over 2 months. Other than their slowness it was ok for the most part, perhaps a bit disorganized at times with long periods of silence. I know there were others here who had bigger issues with them.

Given that my refinance with Watermark was significantly less costly than my estimates through lenderfi and Better, I am satisfied.

[presto987]

If you got a great deal why don’t you go with that company? Why do you run to better to match? And you would drop all the work you’ve done with better for $200?

I am not pumpkinwaggle, but I'll respond with my thoughts.

There is certainly something to be said for going with the company that gave you the best deal instead of shopping around their offer. They deserve to be rewarded with your business.

However, right now Better offers a much faster and smoother process with superior communication than some of these companies that are offering great deals. In some cases, the process is so poor with these companies that it warrants jumping ship. To give a few examples, I did not get an LE from Loan Cabin until a month and a half after my application, and even that required multiple follow ups (had to email or call at least 9 times at various stages in the process up to that point). Watermark has essentially banned anyone from Bogleheads or Slickdeals. People have been having problems with LoanDepot changing their pricing at the last minute. Etc.

Also, it looks like pumpkinwaggle is going to save $850 by using Better, which is not trivial.

[presto987]

Hello all the refinance gurus !

I have recently refinanced through owning (15 years @2.25 no cash out). I just got a letter that my loan has been transferred to another company.

- Is it safe to refinance again to get 15 years @2.00 ?
- I have read all the closing documents and there was no mention of 6-month delay before being able to refinance again, does anybody know what that document is called, in case I have missed the terms/conditions ?
- If I do start another refinance, and given the fact that my loan is very new with the current servicer (first payment is due on Nov 1st), will there be any problems with getting the payoff information ?
- Any other things that I should look for and/or be careful about ?

Thanks a lot

Should be OK to proceed, though it is possible that Owning will not want to work with you in the future if you refi within 6 months.

To my knowledge the 6-month delay has only been formalized by LenderFi.

If the first payment is due Nov 1, then presumably your account will be set up in advance of that, in which case you should be able to request a payoff this month. Since most lenders are taking at least 30 days to close, seems like this should be enough time.

You will have to upload your mortgage statement when you are asked to upload your docs. If you don't have one from the new servicer, I guess you can use the one from the previous servicer, but you'll want to communicate with your loan processor to make sure they know that there is a new servicer from whom they will have to request the payoff.

I am currently working on a back-to-back refi, but it is my first time, and there are others who have done more of them... so they should feel free to weigh in

[presto987]

I'm approaching closing this week as communicated by my new lender. they requested the payoff statement from my current lender and that states the payoff balance as of Oct 26th. Few generic questions I have -

- Does it mean my new lender can't disburse funds before Oct 26h?
- if they do, would the amount be adjusted or would they have to request a new statement from my current lender?
- What's the usual gap between closing and disbursement date?
- Should I tie up the prepaid interest numbers based on closing date or by disbursement date?

The answer to your first question is no. Oct 26 means that the new lender is expecting to disburse the funds at least a few days before Oct 26. The payoff balance date needs to reflect some cushion beyond the expected funding date in case things get delayed at some point in the process. This way they would only need to request a new payoff statement if the delays are significant.

What should happen is that your loan funds before Oct 26, and then the previous lender reimburses you for any overpaid interest.

Gap between closing and disbursement has to be more than 3 business days. I refi'd recently with Better, and it was a 4 business day gap, which I think is common. There have been reports of some companies like Owning having a much longer gap, because they are closing before underwriting is done or before they have access to the funds.

I believe prepaid interest is based on disbursement date.

[BrandonBogle]

I'm approaching closing this week as communicated by my new lender. they requested the payoff statement from my current lender and that states the payoff balance as of Oct 26th. Few generic questions I have -

- Does it mean my new lender can't disburse funds before Oct 26h?
- if they do, would the amount be adjusted or would they have to request a new statement from my current lender?
- What's the usual gap between closing and disbursement date?
- Should I tie up the prepaid interest numbers based on closing date or by disbursement date?

The answer to your first question is no. Oct 26 means that the new lender is expecting to disburse the funds at least a few days before Oct 26. The payoff balance date needs to reflect some cushion beyond the expected funding date in case things get delayed at some point in the process. This way they would only need to request a new payoff statement if the delays are significant.

What should happen is that your loan funds before Oct 26, and then the previous lender reimburses you for any overpaid interest.

Gap between closing and disbursement has to be more than 3 business days. I refi'd recently with Better, and it was a 4 business day gap, which I think is common. There have been reports of some companies like Owning having a much longer gap, because they are closing before underwriting is done or before they have access to the funds.

I believe prepaid interest is based on disbursement date.

All correct. I would just add that payoff can be much sooner than 10/26. The payoff doc includes not only the total amount, but a daily accrual amount. Just as one can add the daily pay 10/26, it can also be subtracted. So if closing happens this week for funding next week, the new lender MAY calculate for the 16th instead of the 26th. I say may because it is also entirely possible they send the quoted payoff and let the old lender refund any overage.

[AB609]

Just to share info - my better.com mortgage was initially to be serviced by The Money Source, and before the first payment was due, it was transferred to Mr Cooper (which is Nationstar?). Using the search on this site, it appears Mr Cooper is legitimate. The mortgage funded on 9/16 - I think I'll wait until the Amex credit hits before seeing if I can reduce the rate again (2.875% on a 30, high credit, $215K balance on $400K home).

Similar result, and I have my AMEX credit now as well.

How long after closing did it take your AMEX credit to show up?

[Goal33]

If you got a great deal why don’t you go with that company? Why do you run to better to match? And you would drop all the work you’ve done with better for $200?

I am not pumpkinwaggle, but I'll respond with my thoughts.

There is certainly something to be said for going with the company that gave you the best deal instead of shopping around their offer. They deserve to be rewarded with your business.

However, right now Better offers a much faster and smoother process with superior communication than some of these companies that are offering great deals. In some cases, the process is so poor with these companies that it warrants jumping ship. To give a few examples, I did not get an LE from Loan Cabin until a month and a half after my application, and even that required multiple follow ups (had to email or call at least 9 times at various stages in the process up to that point). Watermark has essentially banned anyone from Bogleheads or Slickdeals. People have been having problems with LoanDepot changing their pricing at the last minute. Etc.

Also, it looks like pumpkinwaggle is going to save $850 by using Better, which is not trivial.

$850 aside. I regret not going with better on a match just because LenderFi took forever with my process.

[FrugalProfessor]

Just locked in 2.25%, 15Y, $0 lender fee refi with LenderFI on a $244k mortgage. It was an unbelievably slick process that took less than an hour.

After I got my online quotes, I called to ask about waiving appraisal + escrow. They waived both and took $1k or so off of the closing costs that were generated with my online application.

I ended up getting a 15Y 2.25Y $253k Loan Estimate from Better.com with approximately net zero in closing fees. The way to optimally sequence the negotiation appears to be:
1.) collect estimates from company A
2.) provide estimate from company A to company B and have company B beat it by $100 in closing costs
3-(N-1).) repeat step 2 as many times as you want to bother with
N.) bring best loan to Better.com, who will beat it by $100 while including a $550 appraisal fee in the estimate. With a low enough LTV (mine was about 50%), they'll waive the $550 fee, meaning you'll beat the next-best offer by $650 in closing fees.

This was my first refi experience. It reminded me a lot buying a new car.

I'm now out of the woods yet, but it appears to be the easiest $10k (in interest savings) I've made in my life....

For the curious, I created a spreadsheet that goes through the refi math (breakeven, interest savings, etc) that can be accessed through this blog post: https://frugalprofessor.com/mortgage-re ... fi-review/

My Better.com refi funded yesterday:
* From lock to funded took 21 days
* 2.25%
* 15Y
* 50% LTV
* $243k loan
* Negative $421 in closing costs (A + B + C + E - Lender credits).

I had a great experience with Better. I'd definitely recommend them.

A more detailed review is here for the curious: https://frugalprofessor.com/better-com-refi-review/

[Qw1221wq]

I'm approaching closing this week as communicated by my new lender. they requested the payoff statement from my current lender and that states the payoff balance as of Oct 26th. Few generic questions I have -

- Does it mean my new lender can't disburse funds before Oct 26h?
- if they do, would the amount be adjusted or would they have to request a new statement from my current lender?
- What's the usual gap between closing and disbursement date?
- Should I tie up the prepaid interest numbers based on closing date or by disbursement date?

The answer to your first question is no. Oct 26 means that the new lender is expecting to disburse the funds at least a few days before Oct 26. The payoff balance date needs to reflect some cushion beyond the expected funding date in case things get delayed at some point in the process. This way they would only need to request a new payoff statement if the delays are significant.

What should happen is that your loan funds before Oct 26, and then the previous lender reimburses you for any overpaid interest.

Gap between closing and disbursement has to be more than 3 business days. I refi'd recently with Better, and it was a 4 business day gap, which I think is common. There have been reports of some companies like Owning having a much longer gap, because they are closing before underwriting is done or before they have access to the funds.

I believe prepaid interest is based on disbursement date.

What if disbursement date is 10/26 but payment doesnt post until 10/27 and they charge you interest for 10/26? Would you request for the interest on 10/26 to be refunded? Is this normal practice for everyone? That the disbursement payment doesnt post to your account until the following day?

[jbrown394]

Hello all the refinance gurus !

I have recently refinanced through owning (15 years @2.25 no cash out). I just got a letter that my loan has been transferred to another company.

- Is it safe to refinance again to get 15 years @2.00 ?
- I have read all the closing documents and there was no mention of 6-month delay before being able to refinance again, does anybody know what that document is called, in case I have missed the terms/conditions ?
- If I do start another refinance, and given the fact that my loan is very new with the current servicer (first payment is due on Nov 1st), will there be any problems with getting the payoff information ?
- Any other things that I should look for and/or be careful about ?

Thanks a lot

Should be OK to proceed, though it is possible that Owning will not want to work with you in the future if you refi within 6 months.

To my knowledge the 6-month delay has only been formalized by LenderFi.

If the first payment is due Nov 1, then presumably your account will be set up in advance of that, in which case you should be able to request a payoff this month. Since most lenders are taking at least 30 days to close, seems like this should be enough time.

You will have to upload your mortgage statement when you are asked to upload your docs. If you don't have one from the new servicer, I guess you can use the one from the previous servicer, but you'll want to communicate with your loan processor to make sure they know that there is a new servicer from whom they will have to request the payoff.

I am currently working on a back-to-back refi, but it is my first time, and there are others who have done more of them... so they should feel free to weigh in

Thanks a lot Presto987. I forgot to emphasize, that all in all, I did get around $150 back from the original lender, but I don't think that counts as a cash-out refinance, am I right ?

[BrandonBogle]

Thanks a lot Presto987. I forgot to emphasize, that all in all, I did get around $150 back from the original lender, but I don't think that counts as a cash-out refinance, am I right ?

Not unless you live in Texas (or any other states that may have similar laws). There, even $1 to you at the closing table is a cash-out refi. They are very atypical.

[pumpkinwaggle]

^ Great to hear! Assuming Better waives your appraisal, you should be able to save another $550. And by having them price-match title costs to Radian, that should be another $200 (they price-match this by increasing the lender credit by the amount of the price difference). Finally, your section "E" costs should go down when you get your initial closing disclosure.

If all goes as planned, hopefully you will make $2700 net credit on this refi!

If you get another better offer before you close, there is still room for them to increase lender credits by another $1000. But if not, you are in a great spot.

Yes, it’s thanks to you all here! I was so confused yesterday and got back on track with your advice.

I emailed Radian this morning. Let’s see if I hear back.

PS: After getting the first estimate from Loan Depot yesterday and getting half a dozen calls and emails from them, I didn’t hear back from them today after asking for the no cost estimate... maybe all these bad reviews are correct...

Here is a quick update with my experience with Better. So far, super smooth, great communication and good progress (I was quick to do all their tasks immediately when I got the notice).

9/29 - Started getting soft estimates, talked to about a dozen lenders (before finding this great thread! Would have saved me hours on the phone...)
9/30 - Got full estimates from various lenders and Better was always able to match. They responded within a couple of hours every time I asked something and checked with me on the phone as well which is great.
10/1 - Got the final match from Better (from $2,705 to $3,799 credit after a couple of matches, at 2.75% for refi with cash out) and started the full process by doing all the tasks on the website to lock the rate somewhere around 6pm.
10/2 - Got a message in the morning at 8am that my rate was locked at the agreed rate and credit. Application was assigned to the processing expert which once again gets back to me in just a few hours. Received the update that I got the appraisal waiver. I had to pay $550 to get the process going but the appraisal will be returned so that'll be a nice $550 back to me.
10/5 - Received conditional approval. Title was ordered. I got the quote from Radian which may save me about $200 if Better can match the cost.

To be continued...

If you got a great deal why don’t you go with that company? Why do you run to better to match? And you would drop all the work you’ve done with better for $200?

I talked to almost all these lenders on the phone and Better felt more friendly and taking their time to talk to me and respond to my requests compared to the rest. It was just a feeling but a lot of people here seemed to have a good experience with them so I preferred to go that route. I would not drop the current progress for $200.

[pumpkinwaggle]

FYI, got a note today from Interactive Mortgage telling me that after today, they would only accept applications for loan values above 400k.

[mceagle555]

What is everyone's general feeling on Interactive Mortgage. I actually qualify for the 1.99% 15-yr zero-cost refi, which seems unbelievable. Anyone who has gone with them care to comment on things?

[BrandonBogle]

What is everyone's general feeling on Interactive Mortgage. I actually qualify for the 1.99% 15-yr zero-cost refi, which seems unbelievable. Anyone who has gone with them care to comment on things?

If I was given a 1.99% 15-year no-cost refi, I would have immediately locked the rate before hanging up. Now whether I would proceed with IM is one thing, but I would have “locked in” to be sure I could get the offer if I proceeded.

That said, I don’t see any reason not to go with IM unless you have another preferred lender. But then, after locking in above, your preferred lender may match/beat the deal.

[cyndiego]

Crazy question for you all: When you look at your refi disclosure docs, there's a chart in the back that says "Loan Calculations", then "Total of Payments". But this line never seems to actually match Monthly payment x 12 months x Years of loan. It's been off by $2-5k too high with two lenders now, and no one can explain why. We are getting a small amount of cash back at closing, so that can't explain it. Am I missing something???

[presto987]

Re: Interactive Mortgage

I locked with IM but withdrew my application when I was about to receive the initial closing disclosures. My experience was very good. In 30 minutes over the phone, I got a rate quote (which was consistent with the advertised rates), did the application verbally, and locked my rate. Then I received my disclosures including LE within a couple of hours.

Processing was very smooth as well. For me, they only requested a W2, two paystubs, current mortgage statement, and homeowners insurance declaration page. This was much less than what some other lenders have requested. My loan processor was fantastic, communicated well, and moved me through the process very quickly.

On the other hand, I have heard from a couple of people that their LO was rude, and that they had no communication for a week or two after uploading docs.

As with all lenders, the experience depends on how good your LO and loan processor are. I am happy to refer folks to my LO. He is very efficient, but he will have a big attitude if you cancel after locking. (He did not give me an attitude when I canceled because I was upfront with him about that possibility, plus I referred several co-workers to him). If you tell him I referred you, you might be able to get assigned to a good loan processor as well. I also know the name of a different LO with whom people have had good experiences.

[mceagle555]

Re: Interactive Mortgage

I locked with IM but withdrew my application when I was about to receive the initial closing disclosures. My experience was very good. In 30 minutes over the phone, I got a rate quote (which was consistent with the advertised rates), did the application verbally, and locked my rate. Then I received my disclosures including LE within a couple of hours.

Processing was very smooth as well. For me, they only requested a W2, two paystubs, current mortgage statement, and homeowners insurance declaration page. This was much less than what some other lenders have requested. My loan processor was fantastic, communicated well, and moved me through the process very quickly.

On the other hand, I have heard from a couple of people that their LO was rude, and that they had no communication for a week or two after uploading docs.

As with all lenders, the experience depends on how good your LO and loan processor are. I am happy to refer folks to my LO. He is very efficient, but he will have a big attitude if you cancel after locking. (He did not give me an attitude when I canceled because I was upfront with him about that possibility, plus I referred several co-workers to him). If you tell him I referred you, you might be able to get assigned to a good loan processor as well. I also know the name of a different LO with whom people have had good experiences.

Sent you a message for the name of your IM LO.

Thanks!

[BrandonBogle]

Crazy question for you all: When you look at your refi disclosure docs, there's a chart in the back that says "Loan Calculations", then "Total of Payments". But this line never seems to actually match Monthly payment x 12 months x Years of loan. It's been off by $2-5k too high with two lenders now, and no one can explain why. We are getting a small amount of cash back at closing, so that can't explain it. Am I missing something???

All three of mine in 2020 equal monthly payment * loan term** + A + B + C + prepaid interest (only the prepaid interest in case you have other stuff in F). It does NOT include any lender credits.


** technically, they were off by up to $0.75 using this calculation, but they were perfect if I used an amortization table for total payments + interest. The simple math doesn’t include the last payment being slightly different.

[cyndiego]

All three of mine in 2020 equal monthly payment * loan term** + A + B + C + prepaid interest (only the prepaid interest in case you have other stuff in F). It does NOT include any lender credits.

omg that's it! Thank you!!! It's been driving me mad. I suspected something like that might have been going on, but it was so alarming that multiple people who work with this stuff all day couldn't figure it out (and we giving silly answers). I forgot to mention that we're rolling in the closing costs. So as I suspected, they were counting part of the payment twice. That part of the form must assume that you are paying closing costs out of pocket. Your formula works for my numbers, off by $1.05 and I'm not even going to try to figure out that part... I was paranoid that we were actually agreeing to that higher number, but clearly it's just a crummy algorithm for that chart.

Thank you! Now I can move on with my life, haha.

[goru1]

Is it possible to get LenderFi and LoanDepot loan officer email?

[supalong52]

^ It sounds like you might qualify for Interactive Mortgage's advertised rates. It needs to be single family (not condo). 1.99% at no cost for a 15-year. If you are closing very soon with Amerisave, then maybe you have time to refi again with IM before that deal goes away

If Amerisave allows you to increase your rate in order to get lender credits, that would be a good idea if you think you will refi again.

Dang that's a good offer. Oh well I'm tired of the hassle at this point. We'll be saving $205 a month from our existing mortgage and the IM offer would get us another $135. I'm going to put my head back in the sand now...

[Goal33]

Does anybody know if IM would offer their 2.375 if you're above the 60% ltv. I'm just under 75% but otherwise would be a good candidate. I already closed on a 2.5% no cost refi. Also, does IM require tax escrow?

[therealhunter]

I'm approaching closing this week as communicated by my new lender. they requested the payoff statement from my current lender and that states the payoff balance as of Oct 26th. Few generic questions I have -

- Does it mean my new lender can't disburse funds before Oct 26h?
- if they do, would the amount be adjusted or would they have to request a new statement from my current lender?
- What's the usual gap between closing and disbursement date?
- Should I tie up the prepaid interest numbers based on closing date or by disbursement date?

The answer to your first question is no. Oct 26 means that the new lender is expecting to disburse the funds at least a few days before Oct 26. The payoff balance date needs to reflect some cushion beyond the expected funding date in case things get delayed at some point in the process. This way they would only need to request a new payoff statement if the delays are significant.

What should happen is that your loan funds before Oct 26, and then the previous lender reimburses you for any overpaid interest.

Gap between closing and disbursement has to be more than 3 business days. I refi'd recently with Better, and it was a 4 business day gap, which I think is common. There have been reports of some companies like Owning having a much longer gap, because they are closing before underwriting is done or before they have access to the funds.

I believe prepaid interest is based on disbursement date.

All correct. I would just add that payoff can be much sooner than 10/26. The payoff doc includes not only the total amount, but a daily accrual amount. Just as one can add the daily pay 10/26, it can also be subtracted. So if closing happens this week for funding next week, the new lender MAY calculate for the 16th instead of the 26th. I say may because it is also entirely possible they send the quoted payoff and let the old lender refund any overage.

Thanks both. Very helpful.

[presto987]

Does anybody know if IM would offer their 2.375 if you're above the 60% ltv. I'm just under 75% but otherwise would be a good candidate. I already closed on a 2.5% no cost refi. Also, does IM require tax escrow?

Reports from people with > 60% LTV said that they were not eligible for the advertised rate.

[therealhunter]

I'm approaching closing this week as communicated by my new lender. they requested the payoff statement from my current lender and that states the payoff balance as of Oct 26th. Few generic questions I have -

- Does it mean my new lender can't disburse funds before Oct 26h?
- if they do, would the amount be adjusted or would they have to request a new statement from my current lender?
- What's the usual gap between closing and disbursement date?
- Should I tie up the prepaid interest numbers based on closing date or by disbursement date?

The answer to your first question is no. Oct 26 means that the new lender is expecting to disburse the funds at least a few days before Oct 26. The payoff balance date needs to reflect some cushion beyond the expected funding date in case things get delayed at some point in the process. This way they would only need to request a new payoff statement if the delays are significant.

What should happen is that your loan funds before Oct 26, and then the previous lender reimburses you for any overpaid interest.

Gap between closing and disbursement has to be more than 3 business days. I refi'd recently with Better, and it was a 4 business day gap, which I think is common. There have been reports of some companies like Owning having a much longer gap, because they are closing before underwriting is done or before they have access to the funds.

I believe prepaid interest is based on disbursement date.

What if disbursement date is 10/26 but payment doesnt post until 10/27 and they charge you interest for 10/26? Would you request for the interest on 10/26 to be refunded? Is this normal practice for everyone? That the disbursement payment doesnt post to your account until the following day?

As far as both lenders don't double charge me, I'm ok whichever way they handle such delays I have lots questions around such edge cases - like if weekends fall in between settling disbursement etc. I'm holding onto all my questions till I see the final numbers on CD. I will share my experience if I encounter any such issues.

[Qw1221wq]

Anyone being serviced by TMS that has been able to request biweekly payments instead of monthly? This would cut the amount of time to pay off your mortgage due to 13 months of payments per year instead of 12. If so, did you just email them and request it?

[BrandonBogle]

All three of mine in 2020 equal monthly payment * loan term** + A + B + C + prepaid interest (only the prepaid interest in case you have other stuff in F). It does NOT include any lender credits.

omg that's it! Thank you!!! It's been driving me mad. I suspected something like that might have been going on, but it was so alarming that multiple people who work with this stuff all day couldn't figure it out (and we giving silly answers). I forgot to mention that we're rolling in the closing costs. So as I suspected, they were counting part of the payment twice. That part of the form must assume that you are paying closing costs out of pocket. Your formula works for my numbers, off by $1.05 and I'm not even going to try to figure out that part... I was paranoid that we were actually agreeing to that higher number, but clearly it's just a crummy algorithm for that chart.

Thank you! Now I can move on with my life, haha.

The same deficiencies also exist in using APR to compare loans, regardless of what the “advertised” meaning of APR is. Best to focus on the true costs and ignore the noise the best you can.

[soobaerodude]

Does anybody know if IM would offer their 2.375 if you're above the 60% ltv. I'm just under 75% but otherwise would be a good candidate. I already closed on a 2.5% no cost refi. Also, does IM require tax escrow?

If you're over 60% LTV, the rate bumps up to 2.5%, no escrow required

[Intrepyd]

Has anyone found a decent rate a jumbo refi? I’m hearing banks are not eager to refi jumbo loans.

[jco]

Signed closing papers through Better on Friday 10/2. The loan should fund tomorrow.

Thinking of trying to call Interactive Mortgage to see if I can squeeze in one more refinance before the end of the year, if I can get a better rate for a no-cost refi (I'm skeptical). Should I be calling them today, tomorrow, the day after funding ...

[sudohouse]

Has anyone found a decent rate a jumbo refi? I’m hearing banks are not eager to refi jumbo loans.

I got a decent quote from Watermark, Loan depot, Amerisave and Aimloan for my Jumbos. Depends on your state.

[presto987]

Signed closing papers through Better on Friday 10/2. The loan should fund tomorrow.

Thinking of trying to call Interactive Mortgage to see if I can squeeze in one more refinance before the end of the year, if I can get a better rate for a no-cost refi (I'm skeptical). Should I be calling them today, tomorrow, the day after funding ...

When you lock with IM, they will ask you to upload docs by the next day. One of the required docs is your mortgage statement. You could probably get by with a screenshot of your TMS account showing your principal balance, monthly payment, etc.

So you might want to wait until you can access your TMS account before you call IM. When I refi'd with Better, I got my TMS account info 6 days after my funding date.

I suppose you could ask if IM would accept your closing disclosure in lieu of the TMS account screenshot. If so, that would allow you to get started sooner. But IM moves more quickly than most lenders these days, so before long (maybe a week and a half after locking?) they will need to be able to request a payoff statement from TMS.

[kevdude]

We closed last week on a 3.0%/30 yr loan with Better that was locked on June 29th - so just over 3 months to close. The slow time was not due to Better, but our 2nd with BofA - they took forever to turn around the subordination agreement. The loan included $1105 in lender credits and the Amex $2500 credit. Better had no issues extending our rate lock (I'm sure because rates had ticked down a bit). Because we had a 2nd with BofA a few lenders advised us they would not let us lock rate until they received the subordination and one even refused to issue an LE.

Better could not have been easier to work with as they were very responsive and pretty proactive as far as status updates, including weekly calls from our "Loan Expert" just touching base. He was very friendly, including asking how a vacation had gone during the process. I'm sure they are swamped, so I appreciated he remembered us as customers. I would certainly recommend them.

[zrzhu111]

^ Great to hear! Assuming Better waives your appraisal, you should be able to save another $550. And by having them price-match title costs to Radian, that should be another $200 (they price-match this by increasing the lender credit by the amount of the price difference). Finally, your section "E" costs should go down when you get your initial closing disclosure.

If all goes as planned, hopefully you will make $2700 net credit on this refi!

If you get another better offer before you close, there is still room for them to increase lender credits by another $1000. But if not, you are in a great spot.

Yes, it’s thanks to you all here! I was so confused yesterday and got back on track with your advice.

I emailed Radian this morning. Let’s see if I hear back.

PS: After getting the first estimate from Loan Depot yesterday and getting half a dozen calls and emails from them, I didn’t hear back from them today after asking for the no cost estimate... maybe all these bad reviews are correct...

Here is a quick update with my experience with Better. So far, super smooth, great communication and good progress (I was quick to do all their tasks immediately when I got the notice).

9/29 - Started getting soft estimates, talked to about a dozen lenders (before finding this great thread! Would have saved me hours on the phone...)
9/30 - Got full estimates from various lenders and Better was always able to match. They responded within a couple of hours every time I asked something and checked with me on the phone as well which is great.
10/1 - Got the final match from Better (from $2,705 to $3,799 credit after a couple of matches, at 2.75% for refi with cash out) and started the full process by doing all the tasks on the website to lock the rate somewhere around 6pm.
10/2 - Got a message in the morning at 8am that my rate was locked at the agreed rate and credit. Application was assigned to the processing expert which once again gets back to me in just a few hours. Received the update that I got the appraisal waiver. I had to pay $550 to get the process going but the appraisal will be returned so that'll be a nice $550 back to me.
10/5 - Received conditional approval. Title was ordered. I got the quote from Radian which may save me about $200 if Better can match the cost.

To be continued...

Did you email clientrelations@radian.com for quotes from Radian? I emailed them asking if they work with Network Capital and never heard anything back.

[tommy85]

Does anybody know if Better has 6 month claw back clause?

[presto987]

No. LenderFi is the only lender that people here have reported as asking you to sign a document to agree that you will not refi within 6 months and that they may claw back lender credits if you do.

On a related note, though, it seems that Better is getting more difficult about doing multiple refis with them during a 6 month period. In the past people were able to do back-to-back refis with them with no issue. Now they don't seem to be allowing it.

[1andDone]

On a related note, though, it seems that Better is getting more difficult about doing multiple refis with them during a 6 month period. In the past people were able to do back-to-back refis with them with no issue. Now they don't seem to be allowing it.

Yep, our closing was pushed back from Sept to November because we refi’d with them in July. Unfortunately, they didn’t tell us about the delay until a few days before our scheduled closing. They gave us some additional lender credit for our inconvenience, but still annoying.

[BrandonBogle]

On a related note, though, it seems that Better is getting more difficult about doing multiple refis with them during a 6 month period. In the past people were able to do back-to-back refis with them with no issue. Now they don't seem to be allowing it.

Yep, our closing was pushed back from Sept to November because we refi’d with them in July. Unfortunately, they didn’t tell us about the delay until a few days before our scheduled closing. They gave us some additional lender credit for our inconvenience, but still annoying.

It’s been very YMMV. I wonder if they’ve begun looking at how far folks are from 6 months and if you are far, don’t say anything. I refi’d with Better in May, August, and Sept.

However, in both the second and third refis, I wasn’t given a proper doc at closing and they had me resign a document acknowledging that I’m refi’ing with my existing lender and raising my balance. So perhaps my two refis didn’t get noticed until it was too late?

[anon_investor]

On a related note, though, it seems that Better is getting more difficult about doing multiple refis with them during a 6 month period. In the past people were able to do back-to-back refis with them with no issue. Now they don't seem to be allowing it.

Yep, our closing was pushed back from Sept to November because we refi’d with them in July. Unfortunately, they didn’t tell us about the delay until a few days before our scheduled closing. They gave us some additional lender credit for our inconvenience, but still annoying.

It’s been very YMMV. I wonder if they’ve begun looking at how far folks are from 6 months and if you are far, don’t say anything. I refi’d with Better in May, August, and Sept.

However, in both the second and third refis, I wasn’t given a proper doc at closing and they had me resign a document acknowledging that I’m refi’ing with my existing lender and raising my balance. So perhaps my two refis didn’t get noticed until it was too late?

HAHA, or maybe someone at Better purposely forgot to include that document so the refis would not get flagged until it was too late.

[Jwalker678]

I just locked 1.99 on a 15 yr with loan depot and 6,300 closing cost including 2,400 transfer taxes (Florida). 410,000 no cash out and < 40% Ltv. Now I’m reading that some or getting the same rate at no costs. Should I expect to do better?

[Feijao]

I have these three offers from same lender to refinance remaining $186,000 of $390,000 home purchase. 30 year fixed.

I am retiring in December, i wish to maximize cashflow with the intent of paying this off within 10 years due to inheritance.


a. 2.625 points$ 2136/ lender fees $350 / title 1100/ recording 150- principal and interest $751
b. 2.75 no points fees $ 350 / TILE $1100/ RECODERING $150- Principal and interest payment : $763
c. 2.875 LENDER CREDIT $1300 PAYS FOR TITLE- Lender $350/ recording 150- Principal and interest payment :$ 776

Thanks in advance for your replies.

[therealhunter]

Procedural question: I closed my refi yesterday, on July 8th. Closing disclosure lists "disbursement date" on July 13. Docs show prepayment of interest to new lender from 7/13-8/1, and the payoff amount listed to old lender looks to allow for payoff up until around 7/20.

My July mortgage payment with my old (current) lender is due July 15, with a late fee assessed thereafter. How reliable is the disbursement date on the closing disclosure? Should I plan to make my July payment to my old lender? My main concern is that I don't want to be hit with a late fee for non-payment. I realize that if I pay and the refi payment thus goes over the payoff amount, I'll likely get a refund. But I'd rather not deal with that if I don't have to.

(Note: I'm not concerned with the effects/non-effects of "skipping" payments, extending loan duration, incurring interest on unpayed principal, etc., etc. I just want to know if I can skip my July payment to my present lender without that lender getting upset for late payment.)

Didn't see a reply to this but I might have missed. I have the exact same concern about late fees and impact on credit reporting for default payments. Can anyone share how this gets worked out usually?