Refinance Mega Thread

Non-investing personal finance issues including insurance, credit, real estate, taxes, employment and legal issues such as trusts and wills
NDS
Posts: 61
Joined: Sun Dec 29, 2013 2:09 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by NDS »

What risk in providing all these documents (W-2, paystubs, etc) to brokers??
jimmyrules712
Posts: 592
Joined: Thu Jan 06, 2011 11:36 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by jimmyrules712 »

KeepinItPositive wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 12:52 pm Wow...

Currently just about to close on a 2.75/30/no cost with better and just had lenderfi call me up because we hadn’t chatted in a few weeks offering 2.50/30/no cost.

Just got off the phone, I’m inclined to go ahead and get my current one closed (bird in hand) but wonder how soon I could start another one with LF.

I continue to be just amazed at this low rate environment.
LenderFI is pretty quick on closing and I've seen other people post that LenderFI wouldn't let them refi with them shortly after closing out on a refi with someone else so if I were in your shoes I would probably ask Better to match and if they say no abort the better deal and start over with the 2.5 offer.
KeepinItPositive
Posts: 40
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2017 9:46 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by KeepinItPositive »

jimmyrules712 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 1:16 pm
KeepinItPositive wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 12:52 pm Wow...

Currently just about to close on a 2.75/30/no cost with better and just had lenderfi call me up because we hadn’t chatted in a few weeks offering 2.50/30/no cost.

Just got off the phone, I’m inclined to go ahead and get my current one closed (bird in hand) but wonder how soon I could start another one with LF.

I continue to be just amazed at this low rate environment.
LenderFI is pretty quick on closing and I've seen other people post that LenderFI wouldn't let them refi with them shortly after closing out on a refi with someone else so if I were in your shoes I would probably ask Better to match and if they say no abort the better deal and start over with the 2.5 offer.
Thanks, I’m gonna give better a call this afternoon. I don’t love the idea of terminating this late (especially working with local title co), but I also don’t like the idea of declining a better offer.

Any stories of LF failing to close? I’m also concerned about the canceling out and then something with LF goes sideways and missing out on a great offer going after a super one.

Suggestions on compelling language to try to get better to match this late in the process? I’ve read they do not have a float down option.
skyisgrey
Posts: 3
Joined: Mon Jul 13, 2020 11:12 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by skyisgrey »

We're about to have our second appraisal in two weeks. Each potential lender requires a separate appraisal, it turns out, though one Loan Officer said he once had another lender share an appraisal. It seems wasteful, but is apparently required by Fannie Mae for any home valued over $1 million.

Is this true? I've searched Mortage Doctor and Bogle for a good explanation of the appraisal process and requirements.

The first appraisal cost $725, and this one is going to cost $1,050. :( :(

The lender requiring today's appraisal said he could accept a copy of the two-week-old appraisal, but required:
1. Copy of the PDF of the appraisal;
2. XML of the appraisal data, so it could be submitted directly to Fannie Mae through their automated loan submission portal;
3. Copy of Appraisal Independence Requirements (AIR) Letter "We need to document that the appraisal was ordered in compliance within Appraisal Independence Requirements. There is a letter in each file saying that the appraisal was ordered correctly within the AIR requirements."

He said the extremely high cost was due to the high demand. Apparently, lenders turn to an Appraisal Management Company, or AMC, who puts the desired appraisal out to bid.

What is the Bogle experience? Since lenders must provide a "copy" of the appraisal to us, the borrowers, is there a way to get more than a PDF?
spbos
Posts: 12
Joined: Fri Jul 31, 2020 8:56 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by spbos »

KeepinItPositive wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 12:52 pm Currently just about to close on a 2.75/30/no cost with better and just had lenderfi call me up because we hadn’t chatted in a few weeks offering 2.50/30/no cost.
What is the loan amount? Thanks.
huskerfan1414
Posts: 156
Joined: Wed Mar 11, 2020 7:51 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by huskerfan1414 »

I just cannot get a good deal.

Do you guys think I should just take this?

Better.com beat loandepot by $100.

Current rate is 3.8% and new rate would be 30 year at 2.99%.

$30,000 cash out refinance would bring our total loan up from $106,000 to $136,000.

A+B+C costs are going to be $5,100. This is the bad part. I don't get it--we have 800 credit, both of us. It must just be too low of a loan amount. Home value is $215,000.

The $30,000 would be used to pay off 5-6.5% home improvement and student loans. So the cash out money would help us pay off some of our worse debt.

what do y'all think? Am I doomed to just keep my current mortgage plan? Thanks
The more I learn, the dumber I feel.
MrJedi
Posts: 343
Joined: Wed May 06, 2020 11:42 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by MrJedi »

The loan balance is too low to get a great rate. Also the cash out usually means less credits given.
huskerfan1414
Posts: 156
Joined: Wed Mar 11, 2020 7:51 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by huskerfan1414 »

MrJedi wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 2:16 pm The loan balance is too low to get a great rate. Also the cash out usually means less credits given.
The cash-out became necessary to get a rate lower than our current rate. It made the loan more attractive to the lenders because it's a higher amount.

Gosh dang. Our home acquired $100k in equity in 6 years and we can't use it. :annoyed
The more I learn, the dumber I feel.
NDS
Posts: 61
Joined: Sun Dec 29, 2013 2:09 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by NDS »

Mortgage lenders are "required" to provide you with a Loan Estimate after you provide your name, SSN, etc, right? Are they allowed to quote you additional items like lender credits via email, but not include them on the Loan Estimate, until you provide full docs set e.g. tax returns?
User avatar
anon_investor
Posts: 3750
Joined: Mon Jun 03, 2019 1:43 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by anon_investor »

KeepinItPositive wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 1:59 pm
jimmyrules712 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 1:16 pm
KeepinItPositive wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 12:52 pm Wow...

Currently just about to close on a 2.75/30/no cost with better and just had lenderfi call me up because we hadn’t chatted in a few weeks offering 2.50/30/no cost.

Just got off the phone, I’m inclined to go ahead and get my current one closed (bird in hand) but wonder how soon I could start another one with LF.

I continue to be just amazed at this low rate environment.
LenderFI is pretty quick on closing and I've seen other people post that LenderFI wouldn't let them refi with them shortly after closing out on a refi with someone else so if I were in your shoes I would probably ask Better to match and if they say no abort the better deal and start over with the 2.5 offer.
Thanks, I’m gonna give better a call this afternoon. I don’t love the idea of terminating this late (especially working with local title co), but I also don’t like the idea of declining a better offer.

Any stories of LF failing to close? I’m also concerned about the canceling out and then something with LF goes sideways and missing out on a great offer going after a super one.

Suggestions on compelling language to try to get better to match this late in the process? I’ve read they do not have a float down option.
Just tell better you got a better offer and ask them to match or you walk. Even if they balk, you don't have to walk...
huskerfan1414
Posts: 156
Joined: Wed Mar 11, 2020 7:51 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by huskerfan1414 »

huskerfan1414 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 2:13 pm I just cannot get a good deal.

Do you guys think I should just take this?

Better.com beat loandepot by $100.

Current rate is 3.8% and new rate would be 30 year at 2.99%.

$30,000 cash out refinance would bring our total loan up from $106,000 to $136,000.

A+B+C costs are going to be $5,100. This is the bad part. I don't get it--we have 800 credit, both of us. It must just be too low of a loan amount. Home value is $215,000.

The $30,000 would be used to pay off 5-6.5% home improvement and student loans. So the cash out money would help us pay off some of our worse debt.

what do y'all think? Am I doomed to just keep my current mortgage plan? Thanks
The 15 year option from better.com is 2.875/3.307 but with $2,500 worth of points. Love the rate but I'm still thinking those points are too high.
The more I learn, the dumber I feel.
jimmyrules712
Posts: 592
Joined: Thu Jan 06, 2011 11:36 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by jimmyrules712 »

huskerfan1414 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 2:34 pm
huskerfan1414 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 2:13 pm I just cannot get a good deal.

Do you guys think I should just take this?

Better.com beat loandepot by $100.

Current rate is 3.8% and new rate would be 30 year at 2.99%.

$30,000 cash out refinance would bring our total loan up from $106,000 to $136,000.

A+B+C costs are going to be $5,100. This is the bad part. I don't get it--we have 800 credit, both of us. It must just be too low of a loan amount. Home value is $215,000.

The $30,000 would be used to pay off 5-6.5% home improvement and student loans. So the cash out money would help us pay off some of our worse debt.

what do y'all think? Am I doomed to just keep my current mortgage plan? Thanks
The 15 year option from better.com is 2.875/3.307 but with $2,500 worth of points. Love the rate but I'm still thinking those points are too high.
I never had luck getting good offers from either Better or Loan Depot. Have you applied with Loan Cabin, Watermark, or LenderFi? Those 3 gave me the best offers.
huskerfan1414
Posts: 156
Joined: Wed Mar 11, 2020 7:51 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by huskerfan1414 »

jimmyrules712 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 2:41 pm
huskerfan1414 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 2:34 pm
huskerfan1414 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 2:13 pm I just cannot get a good deal.

Do you guys think I should just take this?

Better.com beat loandepot by $100.

Current rate is 3.8% and new rate would be 30 year at 2.99%.

$30,000 cash out refinance would bring our total loan up from $106,000 to $136,000.

A+B+C costs are going to be $5,100. This is the bad part. I don't get it--we have 800 credit, both of us. It must just be too low of a loan amount. Home value is $215,000.

The $30,000 would be used to pay off 5-6.5% home improvement and student loans. So the cash out money would help us pay off some of our worse debt.

what do y'all think? Am I doomed to just keep my current mortgage plan? Thanks
The 15 year option from better.com is 2.875/3.307 but with $2,500 worth of points. Love the rate but I'm still thinking those points are too high.
I never had luck getting good offers from either Better or Loan Depot. Have you applied with Loan Cabin, Watermark, or LenderFi? Those 3 gave me the best offers.
I cannot apply with LenderFi but I have not checked out the other two so will do that. Thanks for the tip.
The more I learn, the dumber I feel.
gurusw
Posts: 201
Joined: Sun May 11, 2008 9:37 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by gurusw »

gurusw wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 12:07 pm Hi,

What is the best way to comparison shop for mortgage rates? Do I need to get quotes over email/phone from various sources, and then submit application to only one of them?

Please let me know. I have seen people sharing their LE on this forum. Do you actually obtain LE from various lenders before making the final choice?
Hi, can someone please help me with the above questions?

I tried reaching out to agents at 2 banks, but they are not even responding. How wil I compare rates if they end up responding on different days?
bestisfree
Posts: 27
Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2016 1:30 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by bestisfree »

huskerfan1414 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 2:19 pm
MrJedi wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 2:16 pm The loan balance is too low to get a great rate. Also the cash out usually means less credits given.
The cash-out became necessary to get a rate lower than our current rate. It made the loan more attractive to the lenders because it's a higher amount.

Gosh dang. Our home acquired $100k in equity in 6 years and we can't use it. :annoyed
I must be missing something.

If the lender provides enough lender's credit to cover the increased A+B+C due to a higher loan amount (e.g., with cash-out so the loan is more attractive), why can't the borrower just immediately pay extra principal (i..e the cash-out amount) without any out-of-pocket difference had the borrower borrowed the lower amount? There's no prepayment penalty typically.
AlohaT
Posts: 1
Joined: Wed Aug 05, 2020 11:27 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by AlohaT »

HI all, would love some input on 2 mortgage refinance options. I live in Hawaii and there are no national banks here. For various reasons, I'd like to stick to a local bank so that's where I've started.

We own a condo, originally paid $600k in 2014, put 20% down and have a 4% interest rate currently on a 30 year. Our monthly payment of principal and interest is $2,291.59. In original loan we paid no points. Our credit score is close to 800. Current estimated property value is approximately $725-$750k based on comps.

Bank A:
Loan amount: $425k
30 year
Interest Rate: 3.125%
No points
Monthly principal & interest: $1,820.60
Closing costs: $9,071 (none of them are shoppable according to the loan)
Lender credits: $4,250
No closing costs financed into the loan
In 5 years will have paid $46,292 of principal
Estimated cash to close: $6,429 (they offered to estimate it with closing costs rolled in if I want that)
Compared to current mortgage, will save $470.99 per month

Bank B (this is the bank where I currently have the original mortgage):
Loan amount: $432k (they assume $6,463 of closing costs rolled in)
30 year
Interest rate: 2.875%
No points
Monthly principal & interest: $1,792.34
Closing costs: $8,661 (a few of these are shoppable)
No lender credits
In 5 years will have paid $48,806 of principal
Estimated cash to close: $3,654
Compared to current mortgage, will save $499.25 per month

Thoughts? We will likely own this for 5 more years, but don't see it as our forever home. Are the lender credits for Bank A a reason to lean towards that loan? Or is the lower interest rate for Bank B the better choice?

Mahalo in advance for any feedback!
huskerfan1414
Posts: 156
Joined: Wed Mar 11, 2020 7:51 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by huskerfan1414 »

bestisfree wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 2:56 pm
huskerfan1414 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 2:19 pm
MrJedi wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 2:16 pm The loan balance is too low to get a great rate. Also the cash out usually means less credits given.
The cash-out became necessary to get a rate lower than our current rate. It made the loan more attractive to the lenders because it's a higher amount.

Gosh dang. Our home acquired $100k in equity in 6 years and we can't use it. :annoyed
I must be missing something.

If the lender provides enough lender's credit to cover the increased A+B+C due to a higher loan amount (e.g., with cash-out so the loan is more attractive), why can't the borrower just immediately pay extra principal (i..e the cash-out amount) without any out-of-pocket difference had the borrower borrowed the lower amount? There's no prepayment penalty typically.
They actually said that over the phone.
They said "you could theoretically just pay that money on the loan itself right away."

I dunno? We would have actually used it since we had a need for it, as honestly I'd rather get out of those higher loans.
The more I learn, the dumber I feel.
huskerfan1414
Posts: 156
Joined: Wed Mar 11, 2020 7:51 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by huskerfan1414 »

gurusw wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 2:54 pm
gurusw wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 12:07 pm Hi,

What is the best way to comparison shop for mortgage rates? Do I need to get quotes over email/phone from various sources, and then submit application to only one of them?

Please let me know. I have seen people sharing their LE on this forum. Do you actually obtain LE from various lenders before making the final choice?
Hi, can someone please help me with the above questions?

I tried reaching out to agents at 2 banks, but they are not even responding. How wil I compare rates if they end up responding on different days?
I'd like to help you but I'm not sure I understand the question.

When you get estimates from banks, ask for loan estimates to be sent to you via email and then once you have them, compare them. You can also send an estimate to another lender as proof that you have a better deal than what they're offering and see if they will counter it.
The more I learn, the dumber I feel.
MrJedi
Posts: 343
Joined: Wed May 06, 2020 11:42 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by MrJedi »

bestisfree wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 2:56 pm
huskerfan1414 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 2:19 pm
MrJedi wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 2:16 pm The loan balance is too low to get a great rate. Also the cash out usually means less credits given.
The cash-out became necessary to get a rate lower than our current rate. It made the loan more attractive to the lenders because it's a higher amount.

Gosh dang. Our home acquired $100k in equity in 6 years and we can't use it. :annoyed
I must be missing something.

If the lender provides enough lender's credit to cover the increased A+B+C due to a higher loan amount (e.g., with cash-out so the loan is more attractive), why can't the borrower just immediately pay extra principal (i..e the cash-out amount) without any out-of-pocket difference had the borrower borrowed the lower amount? There's no prepayment penalty typically.
The strategy for most of these online lenders is to sell your loan. Cash out refinance loans are considered riskier, so the commission received on selling the loan is less, that I assume means the lender won't pass as much lender credit to you.
NDS
Posts: 61
Joined: Sun Dec 29, 2013 2:09 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by NDS »

huskerfan1414 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 3:04 pm
gurusw wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 2:54 pm
gurusw wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 12:07 pm Hi,

What is the best way to comparison shop for mortgage rates? Do I need to get quotes over email/phone from various sources, and then submit application to only one of them?

Please let me know. I have seen people sharing their LE on this forum. Do you actually obtain LE from various lenders before making the final choice?
Hi, can someone please help me with the above questions?

I tried reaching out to agents at 2 banks, but they are not even responding. How wil I compare rates if they end up responding on different days?
I'd like to help you but I'm not sure I understand the question.

When you get estimates from banks, ask for loan estimates to be sent to you via email and then once you have them, compare them. You can also send an estimate to another lender as proof that you have a better deal than what they're offering and see if they will counter it.
Getting the lenders to actually cough up an official LE seems to be the difficulty. Understandable, if frustrating, as they know you're only asking to go do comparison shopping, it costts them time, and they're probably already having to turn down business from everyone trying to get their refis done. But if there's a trick to reliably getting the LE, please share!
huskerfan1414
Posts: 156
Joined: Wed Mar 11, 2020 7:51 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by huskerfan1414 »

NDS wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 3:07 pm
huskerfan1414 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 3:04 pm
gurusw wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 2:54 pm
gurusw wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 12:07 pm Hi,

What is the best way to comparison shop for mortgage rates? Do I need to get quotes over email/phone from various sources, and then submit application to only one of them?

Please let me know. I have seen people sharing their LE on this forum. Do you actually obtain LE from various lenders before making the final choice?
Hi, can someone please help me with the above questions?

I tried reaching out to agents at 2 banks, but they are not even responding. How wil I compare rates if they end up responding on different days?
I'd like to help you but I'm not sure I understand the question.

When you get estimates from banks, ask for loan estimates to be sent to you via email and then once you have them, compare them. You can also send an estimate to another lender as proof that you have a better deal than what they're offering and see if they will counter it.
Getting the lenders to actually cough up an official LE seems to be the difficulty. Understandable, if frustrating, as they know you're only asking to go do comparison shopping, it costts them time, and they're probably already having to turn down business from everyone trying to get their refis done. But if there's a trick to reliably getting the LE, please share!
You hound them?
The more I learn, the dumber I feel.
gurusw
Posts: 201
Joined: Sun May 11, 2008 9:37 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by gurusw »

NDS wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 3:07 pm
huskerfan1414 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 3:04 pm
gurusw wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 2:54 pm
gurusw wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 12:07 pm Hi,

What is the best way to comparison shop for mortgage rates? Do I need to get quotes over email/phone from various sources, and then submit application to only one of them?

Please let me know. I have seen people sharing their LE on this forum. Do you actually obtain LE from various lenders before making the final choice?
Hi, can someone please help me with the above questions?

I tried reaching out to agents at 2 banks, but they are not even responding. How wil I compare rates if they end up responding on different days?
I'd like to help you but I'm not sure I understand the question.

When you get estimates from banks, ask for loan estimates to be sent to you via email and then once you have them, compare them. You can also send an estimate to another lender as proof that you have a better deal than what they're offering and see if they will counter it.
Getting the lenders to actually cough up an official LE seems to be the difficulty. Understandable, if frustrating, as they know you're only asking to go do comparison shopping, it costts them time, and they're probably already having to turn down business from everyone trying to get their refis done. But if there's a trick to reliably getting the LE, please share!
Totally agree!

Also do I need to submit the application & supporting docs to get LE from them? It's ok if that's the practice, but I just want to be careful sharing all the financial info at various soures.
davehica
Posts: 43
Joined: Sun May 18, 2014 3:07 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by davehica »

Does anyone have names of lenders offering jumbo rates? I’ve checked with better, owning, and many of the others mentioned on the thread and no one is doing jumbos.

Curious if anyone has been successful getting a no-cost jumbo at 2.5 -2.625.

Or maybe I’m chasing unicorns...
Shikoku
Posts: 406
Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2017 11:01 pm
Location: USA

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Shikoku »

KeepinItPositive wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 12:52 pm Wow...

Currently just about to close on a 2.75/30/no cost with better and just had lenderfi call me up because we hadn’t chatted in a few weeks offering 2.50/30/no cost.

Just got off the phone, I’m inclined to go ahead and get my current one closed (bird in hand) but wonder how soon I could start another one with LF.

I continue to be just amazed at this low rate environment.
Please make sure your lender will issue a payoff statement if you try to refinance again immediately a refinance. Under federal law (12 C.F.R. § 1026.36.) lenders are required to provide a payoff statement within seven business days of request with a few exceptions. My lender is refusing!

§ 1026.36 Prohibited acts or practices and certain requirements for credit secured by a dwelling
https://www.consumerfinance.gov/policy- ... 26/36/#c-3
"I don't worry too much about pointing fingers at the past. I operate on the theory that every saint has a past, every sinner has a future." -- Warren Buffett
User avatar
AerialWombat
Posts: 1859
Joined: Tue May 29, 2018 1:07 pm
Location: Cash Canyon / Cashville

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by AerialWombat »

Quick update on my 3-at-once refi with Movement Mortgage. It took two full weeks, but all three loan files finished front-end loan processing this morning and were sent to underwriting. Doing multiple loans, and being self-employed, plus with all my rentals, it makes for long loan processing.

All three cleared for no appraisal, so the 2.75% with about $1500 in fees on each loan still stands.
VCC
Posts: 95
Joined: Thu Nov 21, 2019 4:19 pm

Re: 2.375 VS 2.5, lenderfi vs better.com

Post by VCC »

blablabla0010 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 11:34 am Avid reader, but asking my first question
Thank you for all the experts in the house. [/color]

I have 2.375% from Lenderfi for 20 years on 500k in Maryland no closing costs, no excrow, zero out of pocket cost

Better.com will not match, but will increase lender credits to $-4999 at 2.5%, and then there is the Amex $2500 from better.com (on my loan estimate from them, there is just enough money to pay for A,B,C, D, E and F{prepaid interest and 6 months of property taxes} and 534 out of pocket to cover the rest. F is likely the same what ever lender you use anyways, right?

The difference in lifetime interest from 2.375% to 2.5% is $7000

The difference in monthly payments is $33

I want to go with Lenderfi, but what am I missing?

Also, with no excrow, how can I maximize that lenders credit? Is there a way to add it to one time prepaid for taxes or use it to pay down my principal?
If property taxes are due within 2 months of your closing date, the lender will want you to pay the property tax due before the loan closes. You can use the lender credits to pay the property tax. I personally have done that before.
Katz
Posts: 13
Joined: Mon Jun 08, 2020 10:06 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Katz »

jimmyrules712 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 12:34 pm
Katz wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 12:25 pm
Niceperson77 wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 9:02 pm Hello everyone — here is what I received from Mutual of Omaha....$140k loan @ 2.6% with 1 point. I believe the guy said $440ish/month payment. I currently have a 15 yr $62k HELOC at 5.7% ($550/month) with Suntrust that I'll be using the money to pay off.

I spent all day trying to find rates but the best I could find was Omaha at 2.6% and Amerisave VA loan at 2.5% with $4,000 closing cost.

Should I lock in with Mutual of Omaha tomorrow or check somewhere else? I'm in NC so many of the popular places like Loan Cabin don't work here. LenderFi said they only do refinance with no cash out (think he said $200k+). Box Loans said they are at 500% capacity and not taking new loans.

Where else should I look? This is my first refi. 800 credit score.

NKBC (through Costco) is at 3% with $3k in fees
Owning is CA only
Rate Rabbit - not NC
PenFed 3.7% no fees
Loan Depot - CA only

Still waiting on Better and Watermark to get back
AimLoan.com has been the best option for me so far for a ReFi with $187k principal remaining. On the phone, folks at Better Mortgage said they could try to give me a better offer once I have the official loan summary from AimLoan. People at AimLoan that I've talked to are really nice, while the guy at Better was unprofessional.
What kind of a deal did AImloan give you? You're the first person I've seen say that Aimloan provided the best offer. Did you check with LenderFI, Laon Cabin, or Watermark? I haven't seen Aimloan get anywhere near the deals those 3 have had. Better hasn't been nearly as competitive either for many people.
Well, you have to keep in mind that different lenders are competing for different parts of the market -- some are catering to big loans and others on the lower end. So, it is to be expected that there is not just one company offering the best rates for all sizes of loans. For that reason, you have to shop around to find the company that offers the best rate for your particular situation.

My situation is that I'm looking to refinance $187k on a $300k house. Currently paying 4.25% rate on a 20-year (18 remaining) and looking to refinance into a 15-year. Here's what I've found:

LenderFi is not taking new applications, so no dice
Owning is not licensed in my state
LoanCabin is not licensed in my state
Watermark has not returned my inquiry
AimLoan offers 2.5% rate with 2.612% APR
-----> $2,497 total loan cost ($995 lender fee, $0 points, $594 3rd party fees, $780 title costs, $128 recording)
Better.com offers 2.5% rate with 2.735 APR
-----> $4,195 total loan cost ($0 lender fee, $2,320 points, $614 3rd party fees, $1,261 title costs, $158 recording)
Mutual of Omaha offers 2.5% rate with 2.75% APR
------> $2,983 total loan cost ($650 lender fee, $957 for points, $540 3rd party fees, $836 title, $? recording)

Of course, there were several products available for each of these lenders. I selected 2.5% rate so that I could compare them "apples to apples". I will be waiting to hear back from Watermark. For some of the above lenders, they've mentioned that it may be possible to waive the appraisal fee, which is about $450 to $500 for each. Folks at Better.com said that if I send them an official loan offer from a company that has a better offer that they would work to do better... but, so far, none are beating what AimLoan is offering. I'm open to looking into other companies if someone has a recommendation!
Shikoku
Posts: 406
Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2017 11:01 pm
Location: USA

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Shikoku »

NDS wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 3:07 pm Getting the lenders to actually cough up an official LE seems to be the difficulty. Understandable, if frustrating, as they know you're only asking to go do comparison shopping, it costts them time, and they're probably already having to turn down business from everyone trying to get their refis done. But if there's a trick to reliably getting the LE, please share!
Following worked for me with varying degrees of success. Contact loan officers by e-mail or phone. If someone responds, have time, and is willing to work with you, negotiate a deal by phone or e-mail. If you like the offer, ask them what they need to provide an LE and how long will it take.
"I don't worry too much about pointing fingers at the past. I operate on the theory that every saint has a past, every sinner has a future." -- Warren Buffett
kappat
Posts: 29
Joined: Mon Mar 22, 2010 12:35 pm

Re: 2.375 VS 2.5, lenderfi vs better.com

Post by kappat »

VCC wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 3:48 pm
blablabla0010 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 11:34 am Avid reader, but asking my first question
Thank you for all the experts in the house. [/color]

I have 2.375% from Lenderfi for 20 years on 500k in Maryland no closing costs, no excrow, zero out of pocket cost

Better.com will not match, but will increase lender credits to $-4999 at 2.5%, and then there is the Amex $2500 from better.com (on my loan estimate from them, there is just enough money to pay for A,B,C, D, E and F{prepaid interest and 6 months of property taxes} and 534 out of pocket to cover the rest. F is likely the same what ever lender you use anyways, right?

The difference in lifetime interest from 2.375% to 2.5% is $7000

The difference in monthly payments is $33

I want to go with Lenderfi, but what am I missing?

Also, with no excrow, how can I maximize that lenders credit? Is there a way to add it to one time prepaid for taxes or use it to pay down my principal?
If property taxes are due within 2 months of your closing date, the lender will want you to pay the property tax due before the loan closes. You can use the lender credits to pay the property tax. I personally have done that before.
I have the same question as blablabla0010. Does F change from lender to lender? I have a LE from Better that includes property tax in F and an LE from Lender FI that does not include it. Better told me that they have to include it if it is within 3 months of the due date. In CA the first installment is due 11/1, but the amount is not known until late September when the bill is issued. I don't understand the requirement to pay the property tax before the amount is issued. Is Better or Lender FI correct?
ChiKid24
Posts: 333
Joined: Fri Aug 09, 2019 3:43 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by ChiKid24 »

anon_investor wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 2:20 pm
KeepinItPositive wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 1:59 pm
jimmyrules712 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 1:16 pm
KeepinItPositive wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 12:52 pm Wow...

Currently just about to close on a 2.75/30/no cost with better and just had lenderfi call me up because we hadn’t chatted in a few weeks offering 2.50/30/no cost.

Just got off the phone, I’m inclined to go ahead and get my current one closed (bird in hand) but wonder how soon I could start another one with LF.

I continue to be just amazed at this low rate environment.
LenderFI is pretty quick on closing and I've seen other people post that LenderFI wouldn't let them refi with them shortly after closing out on a refi with someone else so if I were in your shoes I would probably ask Better to match and if they say no abort the better deal and start over with the 2.5 offer.
Thanks, I’m gonna give better a call this afternoon. I don’t love the idea of terminating this late (especially working with local title co), but I also don’t like the idea of declining a better offer.

Any stories of LF failing to close? I’m also concerned about the canceling out and then something with LF goes sideways and missing out on a great offer going after a super one.

Suggestions on compelling language to try to get better to match this late in the process? I’ve read they do not have a float down option.
Just tell better you got a better offer and ask them to match or you walk. Even if they balk, you don't have to walk...
This is essentially what happened to me with the very same lenders, except I was about a month ahead of you so completed a no cost (actually got cash back) refi with Better at 3.0%, then immediately locked with Lenderfi at 2.75% no cost which I just closed today. I thoroughly reviewed Better's loan documents and there is no penalty for refinancing in short order. Only thing I would avoid is having Lenderfi do a hard credit pull before you sign/close your Better refi.

This being the case, I'd recommend just wrapping up the Better refi (after asking if they'll match) and then start it over with Lenderfi. It sounds like you are pretty far along with Better so why not at least guarantee you are done at 2.75%, especially if your close is imminent? I know Lenderfi's offer is better, but it's still just an offer and not guaranteed. A bird in the hand, right? Plus, rates could continue to fall and perhaps you do even better with Lenderfi in a week or two? I'd say there's a better than even chance you get 2.5% or better by waiting. If not, worst case scenario is you're "stuck" at 2.75%, but you could be posting here about locking in at 2.375% in two weeks.
ChiKid24
Posts: 333
Joined: Fri Aug 09, 2019 3:43 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by ChiKid24 »

skyisgrey wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 2:01 pm We're about to have our second appraisal in two weeks. Each potential lender requires a separate appraisal, it turns out, though one Loan Officer said he once had another lender share an appraisal. It seems wasteful, but is apparently required by Fannie Mae for any home valued over $1 million.

Is this true? I've searched Mortage Doctor and Bogle for a good explanation of the appraisal process and requirements.

The first appraisal cost $725, and this one is going to cost $1,050. :( :(

The lender requiring today's appraisal said he could accept a copy of the two-week-old appraisal, but required:
1. Copy of the PDF of the appraisal;
2. XML of the appraisal data, so it could be submitted directly to Fannie Mae through their automated loan submission portal;
3. Copy of Appraisal Independence Requirements (AIR) Letter "We need to document that the appraisal was ordered in compliance within Appraisal Independence Requirements. There is a letter in each file saying that the appraisal was ordered correctly within the AIR requirements."

He said the extremely high cost was due to the high demand. Apparently, lenders turn to an Appraisal Management Company, or AMC, who puts the desired appraisal out to bid.

What is the Bogle experience? Since lenders must provide a "copy" of the appraisal to us, the borrowers, is there a way to get more than a PDF?
Do you need the appraisal to come out above $1M? During my latest refi, the loan officer just set the home value at whatever resulted in 75% LTV. My loan is about $720k, so this resulted in a home value of under $1M. My house is worth more than that, but since the rate wasn't going to be any different at the FMV of the house he said this allowed him to get an appraisal waiver. So if your loan in under $750k, this could be an option worth exploring.
KB8KB24
Posts: 11
Joined: Mon Jul 27, 2020 9:22 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by KB8KB24 »

Appreciate all the info I have gotten in this thread!

Currently in the underwriting process for

30 Year Fix
2.49 % Rate
Escrow
Zero closing costs and appraisal waived
Loan Cabin
Credit Score around 800
TanyTrojan
Posts: 9
Joined: Wed Aug 05, 2020 3:39 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by TanyTrojan »

Most Mortgage Rate Headlines Are Wrong Today - http://www.mortgagenewsdaily.com/consum ... 51469.aspx
VCC
Posts: 95
Joined: Thu Nov 21, 2019 4:19 pm

Re: 2.375 VS 2.5, lenderfi vs better.com

Post by VCC »

I have the same question as blablabla0010. Does F change from lender to lender? I have a LE from Better that includes property tax in F and an LE from Lender FI that does not include it. Better told me that they have to include it if it is within 3 months of the due date. In CA the first installment is due 11/1, but the amount is not known until late September when the bill is issued. I don't understand the requirement to pay the property tax before the amount is issued. Is Better or Lender FI correct?
[/quote]

The requirements are different from lender to lender. My lender deadline was 2 months, Better is 3 months. I also did not know the property tax amount, but the lender was able to find out & paid the property tax directly for me out of the lender credits.
jbell3124
Posts: 46
Joined: Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:53 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by jbell3124 »

Applied with watermark today. Hoping to get LE tomorrow and take to Better to see if they will match or come close to it (2500 Amex could still make them more attractive without match I suppose). I am 130 days since my LenderFi loan funded. So, not within a 45 day lock, but do you think close enough that I could/should go ahead and lock (preliminary verbal offer sounded great)? Worried if I lock tomorrow, loan will close before 180 mark from LenderFi. LF rep said it was 180 from funding of loan, not closing date (?). Don’t want lose credits via clawback or burn bridge with LenderFi. Who knows, may want to refi with them later this year. Haven’t contacted them yet to see what they will offer right now, but maybe I should? Thanks for any suggestions!
Slick8503
Posts: 289
Joined: Tue Nov 16, 2010 10:25 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Slick8503 »

jbell3124 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 6:32 pm Applied with watermark today. Hoping to get LE tomorrow and take to Better to see if they will match or come close to it (2500 Amex could still make them more attractive without match I suppose). I am 130 days since my LenderFi loan funded. So, not within a 45 day lock, but do you think close enough that I could/should go ahead and lock (preliminary verbal offer sounded great)? Worried if I lock tomorrow, loan will close before 180 mark from LenderFi. LF rep said it was 180 from funding of loan, not closing date (?). Don’t want lose credits via clawback or burn bridge with LenderFi. Who knows, may want to refi with them later this year. Haven’t contacted them yet to see what they will offer right now, but maybe I should? Thanks for any suggestions!
Someone correct me if I’m wrong but I thought the Amex deal had expired if not applied by July 25th.
jbell3124
Posts: 46
Joined: Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:53 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by jbell3124 »

Slick8503 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 6:44 pm
jbell3124 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 6:32 pm Applied with watermark today. Hoping to get LE tomorrow and take to Better to see if they will match or come close to it (2500 Amex could still make them more attractive without match I suppose). I am 130 days since my LenderFi loan funded. So, not within a 45 day lock, but do you think close enough that I could/should go ahead and lock (preliminary verbal offer sounded great)? Worried if I lock tomorrow, loan will close before 180 mark from LenderFi. LF rep said it was 180 from funding of loan, not closing date (?). Don’t want lose credits via clawback or burn bridge with LenderFi. Who knows, may want to refi with them later this year. Haven’t contacted them yet to see what they will offer right now, but maybe I should? Thanks for any suggestions!
Someone correct me if I’m wrong but I thought the Amex deal had expired if not applied by July 25th.
I applied by the deadline.
ChiKid24
Posts: 333
Joined: Fri Aug 09, 2019 3:43 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by ChiKid24 »

jbell3124 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 6:32 pm Applied with watermark today. Hoping to get LE tomorrow and take to Better to see if they will match or come close to it (2500 Amex could still make them more attractive without match I suppose). I am 130 days since my LenderFi loan funded. So, not within a 45 day lock, but do you think close enough that I could/should go ahead and lock (preliminary verbal offer sounded great)? Worried if I lock tomorrow, loan will close before 180 mark from LenderFi. LF rep said it was 180 from funding of loan, not closing date (?). Don’t want lose credits via clawback or burn bridge with LenderFi. Who knows, may want to refi with them later this year. Haven’t contacted them yet to see what they will offer right now, but maybe I should? Thanks for any suggestions!
Have you considered calling Lenderfi and discussing this with them? Be honest and tell them you want to honor their 6-month request, but are worried about missing out on the current great rates. Perhaps they'll do something for you. I've found them to be very pragmatic in their dealings.
jbell3124
Posts: 46
Joined: Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:53 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by jbell3124 »

ChiKid24 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 7:16 pm
jbell3124 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 6:32 pm Applied with watermark today. Hoping to get LE tomorrow and take to Better to see if they will match or come close to it (2500 Amex could still make them more attractive without match I suppose). I am 130 days since my LenderFi loan funded. So, not within a 45 day lock, but do you think close enough that I could/should go ahead and lock (preliminary verbal offer sounded great)? Worried if I lock tomorrow, loan will close before 180 mark from LenderFi. LF rep said it was 180 from funding of loan, not closing date (?). Don’t want lose credits via clawback or burn bridge with LenderFi. Who knows, may want to refi with them later this year. Haven’t contacted them yet to see what they will offer right now, but maybe I should? Thanks for any suggestions!
Have you considered calling Lenderfi and discussing this with them? Be honest and tell them you want to honor their 6-month request, but are worried about missing out on the current great rates. Perhaps they'll do something for you. I've found them to be very pragmatic in their dealings.
I’ve thought about that and still may. I’m hoping Better will match so that I can score the 2500. Want to lock tomorrow but will closing at 170 days get LenderFi after me. Hoping to get Better to match, get the 2500, and hope LenderFi can get me under my new rate in a few months. In this environment, the 6 month commitment is hard to make!
Slick8503
Posts: 289
Joined: Tue Nov 16, 2010 10:25 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Slick8503 »

jbell3124 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 7:04 pm
Slick8503 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 6:44 pm
jbell3124 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 6:32 pm Applied with watermark today. Hoping to get LE tomorrow and take to Better to see if they will match or come close to it (2500 Amex could still make them more attractive without match I suppose). I am 130 days since my LenderFi loan funded. So, not within a 45 day lock, but do you think close enough that I could/should go ahead and lock (preliminary verbal offer sounded great)? Worried if I lock tomorrow, loan will close before 180 mark from LenderFi. LF rep said it was 180 from funding of loan, not closing date (?). Don’t want lose credits via clawback or burn bridge with LenderFi. Who knows, may want to refi with them later this year. Haven’t contacted them yet to see what they will offer right now, but maybe I should? Thanks for any suggestions!
Someone correct me if I’m wrong but I thought the Amex deal had expired if not applied by July 25th.
I applied by the deadline.
:sharebeer
bgh11
Posts: 90
Joined: Wed Aug 05, 2020 4:58 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by bgh11 »

AlohaT wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 2:58 pm HI all, would love some input on 2 mortgage refinance options. I live in Hawaii and there are no national banks here. For various reasons, I'd like to stick to a local bank so that's where I've started.

We own a condo, originally paid $600k in 2014, put 20% down and have a 4% interest rate currently on a 30 year. Our monthly payment of principal and interest is $2,291.59. In original loan we paid no points. Our credit score is close to 800. Current estimated property value is approximately $725-$750k based on comps.

Bank A:
Loan amount: $425k
30 year
Interest Rate: 3.125%
No points
Monthly principal & interest: $1,820.60
Closing costs: $9,071 (none of them are shoppable according to the loan)
Lender credits: $4,250
No closing costs financed into the loan
In 5 years will have paid $46,292 of principal
Estimated cash to close: $6,429 (they offered to estimate it with closing costs rolled in if I want that)
Compared to current mortgage, will save $470.99 per month

Bank B (this is the bank where I currently have the original mortgage):
Loan amount: $432k (they assume $6,463 of closing costs rolled in)
30 year
Interest rate: 2.875%
No points
Monthly principal & interest: $1,792.34
Closing costs: $8,661 (a few of these are shoppable)
No lender credits
In 5 years will have paid $48,806 of principal
Estimated cash to close: $3,654
Compared to current mortgage, will save $499.25 per month

Thoughts? We will likely own this for 5 more years, but don't see it as our forever home. Are the lender credits for Bank A a reason to lean towards that loan? Or is the lower interest rate for Bank B the better choice?

Mahalo in advance for any feedback!
Aloha, I am a newbie trying to refi in Honolulu too. I've found local banks and brokers are not very competitive, expect to pay about 0.125% to 0.50% higher.

cash to close Bank A $6429 - cash to close Bank B $3654 = 2775 more for A than B. B saves $28.26/month so 98 months to breakeven.

For fair comparison, i look at both Bank A and Bank B without rolling in the closing cost. Then calculate how much closing you need to pay vs amount saved per month to determine your breakeven point.

Below example from AimLoan which I use as a base line. Title/Escrow/Tax are not included in Lender Fee below, add about $3800 to it for closing cost.
30-Year Fixed Rate
Rate Payment Lender Fees/(Credits) APR
2.500% $1,679.26 $7,612.25 2.653% Details
2.625% $1,707.01 $6,031.25 2.750% Details
2.750% $1,735.03 $5,415.00 2.864% Details
2.875% $1,763.29 $3,120.00 2.947% Details
3.000% $1,791.82 $1,279.75 3.039% Details
3.125% $1,820.60 $77.00 3.159% Details
GT99
Posts: 384
Joined: Wed Jun 20, 2018 5:26 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by GT99 »

Figured I'd chime in with my Better experience since so many people are using them. A few months ago, I applied with Better and they quoted me 3.75% with 1.65 in points for a jumbo loan. This was a higher higher than I already had. I spoke with them and told them I wasn't interested if they couldn't do better (no pun intended). They wouldn't, and when they texted again the next day as if I hadn't already told them this, I asked them to take me off their list. I continued to get daily calls/texts for a week or two.

A few weeks ago, a local credit union told me they could do 2.75% with 0.5% closing if we paid down to a conventional loan. I hadn't had anyone quote that before, so I decided to check around, and checked Better again only because of all the folks singing their praises here. This time, with the conventional loan, they were very close (same rate but half point more expensive than the credit union). I had 4 different people following up with me via phone and email, which was annoying. But when I told one guy they were close, but a bit high, he said they could only try to beat it if I had a loan estimate no more than one day old. When I told him it was a week old, he simply said "do you want me to close your application?" I said yes because I didn't feel like trying to jump through hoops when they didn't seem interested in beating the other rate. This time, thankfully, I didn't hear from them any further.

Anyhow, Better isn't high on my list of companies I want to do business with. I had similar results with my last refi (not with Better but Loan Depot) and went with a different credit union. I assume that's not unusual.

TL;DR - check local credit unions. They may have the added advantage of not having to pay the same taxes as for profit lenders (this is true in Georgia).
User avatar
BrandonBogle
Posts: 3333
Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2013 11:19 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by BrandonBogle »

NDS wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 3:07 pm Getting the lenders to actually cough up an official LE seems to be the difficulty. Understandable, if frustrating, as they know you're only asking to go do comparison shopping, it costts them time, and they're probably already having to turn down business from everyone trying to get their refis done. But if there's a trick to reliably getting the LE, please share!
You submit the legally required minimum info, make sure they pull your report, then wait the maximum legally required time for them to give you one.

Now if you are talking about getting one hours later, with many lenders lately, that won’t happen.
User avatar
BrandonBogle
Posts: 3333
Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2013 11:19 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by BrandonBogle »

Slick8503 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 6:44 pm
jbell3124 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 6:32 pm Applied with watermark today. Hoping to get LE tomorrow and take to Better to see if they will match or come close to it (2500 Amex could still make them more attractive without match I suppose). I am 130 days since my LenderFi loan funded. So, not within a 45 day lock, but do you think close enough that I could/should go ahead and lock (preliminary verbal offer sounded great)? Worried if I lock tomorrow, loan will close before 180 mark from LenderFi. LF rep said it was 180 from funding of loan, not closing date (?). Don’t want lose credits via clawback or burn bridge with LenderFi. Who knows, may want to refi with them later this year. Haven’t contacted them yet to see what they will offer right now, but maybe I should? Thanks for any suggestions!
Someone correct me if I’m wrong but I thought the Amex deal had expired if not applied by July 25th.
Slick is correct. However, jbell could have applied while it was offered and be using that app.

But jbell, bad news. First, you won’t get the LE from Watermark in 24 hours. It will be 48-72, so it could Tuesday before you get it. Also, since you didn’t lock with Watermark, the LE won’t include any lender credits discussed with you. That’s only listed if you locked the loan.
jbell3124
Posts: 46
Joined: Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:53 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by jbell3124 »

BrandonBogle wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 8:44 pm
Slick8503 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 6:44 pm
jbell3124 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 6:32 pm Applied with watermark today. Hoping to get LE tomorrow and take to Better to see if they will match or come close to it (2500 Amex could still make them more attractive without match I suppose). I am 130 days since my LenderFi loan funded. So, not within a 45 day lock, but do you think close enough that I could/should go ahead and lock (preliminary verbal offer sounded great)? Worried if I lock tomorrow, loan will close before 180 mark from LenderFi. LF rep said it was 180 from funding of loan, not closing date (?). Don’t want lose credits via clawback or burn bridge with LenderFi. Who knows, may want to refi with them later this year. Haven’t contacted them yet to see what they will offer right now, but maybe I should? Thanks for any suggestions!
Someone correct me if I’m wrong but I thought the Amex deal had expired if not applied by July 25th.
Slick is correct. However, jbell could have applied while it was offered and be using that app.

But jbell, bad news. First, you won’t get the LE from Watermark in 24 hours. It will be 48-72, so it could Tuesday before you get it. Also, since you didn’t lock with Watermark, the LE won’t include any lender credits discussed with you. That’s only listed if you locked the loan.
BrandonBogle- Yes, I did apply before the deadline, so I am still eligible for the AMEX $2500. Here's hoping Better will match the best offer I can get.
As for the LE from Watermark, I got an "Itemized Fee Worksheet" that has a loan # on it and lender credits. Is this technically not the same thing? Are you guessing it won't suffice for Better to consider ? Thanks for all of your wisdom on this thread.
Soares1234
Posts: 79
Joined: Thu Apr 16, 2020 5:50 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Soares1234 »

skyisgrey wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 2:01 pm We're about to have our second appraisal in two weeks. Each potential lender requires a separate appraisal, it turns out, though one Loan Officer said he once had another lender share an appraisal. It seems wasteful, but is apparently required by Fannie Mae for any home valued over $1 million.

Is this true? I've searched Mortage Doctor and Bogle for a good explanation of the appraisal process and requirements.

The first appraisal cost $725, and this one is going to cost $1,050. :( :(

The lender requiring today's appraisal said he could accept a copy of the two-week-old appraisal, but required:
1. Copy of the PDF of the appraisal;
2. XML of the appraisal data, so it could be submitted directly to Fannie Mae through their automated loan submission portal;
3. Copy of Appraisal Independence Requirements (AIR) Letter "We need to document that the appraisal was ordered in compliance within Appraisal Independence Requirements. There is a letter in each file saying that the appraisal was ordered correctly within the AIR requirements."

He said the extremely high cost was due to the high demand. Apparently, lenders turn to an Appraisal Management Company, or AMC, who puts the desired appraisal out to bid.

What is the Bogle experience? Since lenders must provide a "copy" of the appraisal to us, the borrowers, is there a way to get more than a PDF?
I asked the person who did my appraisal if he was aware whether the appraisal can be transferred he said yes that they just need to reach out to him directly and that he cannot reach out to them. I would ask this lenders again if they can accept the previous appraisal and if they can check with their manager or underwriter. Please keep us posted on any updates.
BHLearner2020
Posts: 9
Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2020 3:25 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by BHLearner2020 »

I have a question what happens if you walk away from a locked loan while it's still under writing because you got a better offer from another lender.

I know if you paid for appraisal then you won't get the money back.
Soares1234
Posts: 79
Joined: Thu Apr 16, 2020 5:50 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by Soares1234 »

I sent an inquiry on watermark and no response. Can someone PM a contact at WM whom I can email?

Thank you!!
ChiKid24
Posts: 333
Joined: Fri Aug 09, 2019 3:43 pm

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by ChiKid24 »

BHLearner2020 wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 9:09 pm I have a question what happens if you walk away from a locked loan while it's still under writing because you got a better offer from another lender.

I know if you paid for appraisal then you won't get the money back.
Nothing happens. You're actually free to walk within three days AFTER signing your closing docs. You would be out any out of pocket expenses you already paid and might burn the bridge with that lender, but it's completely within your rights.
thrillhou
Posts: 28
Joined: Thu Jul 02, 2020 12:55 am

Re: Refinance Mega Thread

Post by thrillhou »

mcdb84 wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 11:55 pm Hey guys,

Just locked in a 2.5% conventional 30 year fixed with Owning.com.

Since I have over 50% equity, they didn't charge me the 0.25% origination charge.

Absolutely no closing costs at all: No origination, No title charges, No recording charges. They gave me lender credit of $1104.00 to cover all costs.

Only costs for me is prepaid interest of 15 days, which total $406.00

I was in shock that this was completely free! I actually am refinancing from a VA 30 year fixed, which I closed back in May 2020, into this conventional loan and opted to not escrow my taxes and insurance.

Total loan amount is $389400.00
I finally pulled the trigger and applied online to a few places (Owning, LC, LenderFi through link here, Better, and WaterMark).

Loan: 316k (318 if they pulled the last month's info), looking for 15 yr
So Cal; LTV ~35%, ~800 credit score, co-applied with DW
Have never had an escrow account for the 7 yr of origin and now current mortgage loans. I prefer not to have it.

LC asked for all sorts of info about employer, etc upfront. Would love to know their offer, but won't hold my breath for a quick response based on what others here have written.

Owning called within minutes of submission.
I called the LO back about 40 min later, and we talked for a while. She said having an escrow account doesn't change their offer. She is planning for a closing by the end of August. Because my loan was less then $350k (which is in their webpage disclosures for their advertised rate of 2.25%), she said I would get a no-cost rate at 2.375%. I asked about cash-out to get to $350k, and she said it's possible, but there is a 1.5% fee on the entire loan amount for a cash-out to then drop to 2.25% (I haven't checked any math there, but I'm 99% sure that $5.2k isn't worth the 1/8th point in rate).

I got the LE tonight. Rate is listed as 2.25%!
Loan amount: $316,000
A: $0
B: $507
C: $788
D (total): $1295
(E&F for reference to folks)
E: $153
F: $119 (6 days at 2.25%)
G: $0
I (total): $272
J: $120; So, Lender Credit listed as $1447.

They have the month older balance, so the cash to close is $2220 instead of $120. I know that the total will wash out in the end in this regard.

It's not clear if they are going to have an appraisal or not. Need to ask about it. I know it's covered, but I'd prefer not to have someone come to the house and take the time to deal with that.

I now need to send the required docs and make sure this is locked. (7.25 yr ago I missed some super-low -- for the time -- 30 yr rates by about a week, so am happy with bird in hand here)

Because the close so fast and no-cost, I'm thinking that the speed of it all is valuable to me - and it's a great rate to boot.

Anything else I need to think about?


(the web offers for LF and better were at about $0 cost at 2.5%. And the website for better went from credit to points for 2.5% in the last 4 hours)
Post Reply